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tv   Consider This  Al Jazeera  September 20, 2013 10:00pm-11:01pm EDT

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>> welcome to al jazeera. i'm john siegenthaler. here are tonight's top stories. a three-year-old boy was shot in the face in chicago, expected to survive. the boy was one of a number of victims that were shot after a basketball game in chicago. the fund the government through the middle of december but it would mean the end of obamacare. senate is likely to strip the health care provision from the bill. then the house and the senate would have until september to reach some sort of deal. disaster teams in flood ravaged
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colorado continue their search for 82 people still unaccounted for. rescued a week and a half after the rain began. property loss is estimated at over $2 billion. more than 1800 houses have been destroyed. rescuers are search for dozens of people, in mexico, death toll expected to rise. i'll see you at 8 easter easter. you can continue to get your news at aljazeera.com. >> howt republicans wage a --
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house republicans wage a war, the president says he will veto any bill aimed to kill the affordable care act law. consider this, before the affordable care act becomes reality what are the real challenges outside congress? iran's new are president, hassan rouhani, a case of meet the new boss same as the old boss? plus can coca-cola really dissolve nails? we'll about go inside the make of urban legends. hello i'm antonio mora. the date in which the government could shut down if congress and the white house don't reach a deal. also it's the first day of
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enrollment of the affordable care act, better known as obamacare. courtney keely reports, defunding obamacare. the bill faces certain defeat in the senate has republicans swinging at each other and leaves little compromise for raising the debt ceiling. >> we have victory for today, for the american people. >> that was house speaker joan boehner, shortly after the vote to keep america afloat but defund being obamacare. house leader eric cantor has been fighting to to be the affordable care act from the start. >> this resolution will also protect the working middle class from the devastating effects of obamacare. >> but the celebratory mood belies the are problem between the tea party and hard line
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republican party. moderates and conservatives are slamming tea party favorites. don't agree on execution. late friday, president obama called be boehner and reiterated that there would be no negotiation on debt limit. boehner's office responded that while he is disappointed, congress will chart the path ahead. top are congress people like harry reed: >> the speaker has to do everything he can to try to mold a piece of legislation that will meet the needs of the tea party. the anarchists. >> meanwhile serious concerns remain on obamacare including how many healthy people will enroll if the software enrollment will be ready and what the impact on businesses and workers will be.
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president obama has already announced a one year postponement and the requirement for businesses to provide coverage to their employees. but open enrollment gidges in less than two weeks. courtney keely new york. >> joining me are jonathan cohn and at our an arbor michigan studio and thank you both for joining us tonight. president obama responded to today's vot in the house accusing consciousal republicans of trying to mess with me and threatening a shut down of the government come october 1st. >> unfortunately, right now the debate that's going on in congress is not meeting the test of helping middle class families. it's just, they're not focused on you. they're focused on politics.
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they're focused on trying to mess with me. they're not focused on you. >> house republicans of course jennifer say they are focused on americans because they think powmg wilobamacare will be a tr. is this just about mollifying the republican base? >> the president said republicans are trying to mess with him but they're really messing with each other. we'll see this next week whether they take a volt on the continuing resolution. it pits the republicans ted cruise against the more hard line republicans who don't want to fight the battle on this issue. yes we're going to see where that line is drawn and how they respond in their vote on the continuing resolution next week. >> we'll see how it works out politically. but i really want to focus on things outside washington
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because the fight against obamacare is really going on around the country just as obamacare enrollment gets closer. we're seeing tv ads like this one. >> swing on over scoot on down and try to make yourself comfortable. okay let's have a look. this has gone viral, this creepy uncle sam. they also have a male version of it. it is aimed directly as young, healthy americans like that poor young woman. and jonathan they are essential to the second of obamacare. what do you think of this as a strategy and how much of an
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impact will it have? >> there is an understanding, that for an insurance are system to work you need healthy people and sick people, that is nature of insurance. the opponents of obamacare figured out if they could persuade young people not to sign up, then that's going to cause a problem because the markets would disproportionately attract sick people. i'll be honest, i don't think ads like this do enough to discourage people. they are kind of creepy. at the end of the day, what is going to drive enrollment in the system is not going to -- be what people see on television. it's when they sign up is it good insurance, does it cost a lot or does it cost a little? do i want insurance? those are factors that are going to determine that.
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i think these ads probably are more of a side show. >> let's go to hermella aregawi. >> thank you antonio. my rates will increase, why is that happening? weren't they supposed to decrease? >> this is a good question. the first thing i would say to this viewer is, you should actually check the rates and make sure that they are going to increase. you know there's a lot of information out there about whose rates are going up and whose rates are going down. and a lot of it is misinformation. in general what is going to happen is that we're trying to set up a system where sick people don't have to pay more. but that means that some healthy people will have to pay less. but that's only one part of the story. in addition to that there's a system of tax credits or subsidies that basically act like a discount for almost everybody who's making less than four times poverty line which is about $45,000 a year for an individual.
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so i don't know whether in fact this viewer is going to be paying high rates. he might. it's possible if he's paying very little right now. but i would say two things to keep in mind if you are paying very low rates right now, you have benefited from the same system that penalizes the sick. you basically are not going to get that benefit anymore. but the flip side is you're going to have a guarantee of insurance you never have to worry you can't get it because you're sick. insurance will probably be more comprehensive and the price of the insurance won't be outrageous. it will basically be comparable to what the cost of the insurance policy from a large employer. and like i said if your income is lower than four times poverty line you're probably going to be eligible for a discount. the discounts could be really big. i mean there are going to be people paying less than $100 a year. >> there is going to be a lot of variation between one state and the other and some people with the same income are going to be paying much more in one state than another. going back to those viral ads
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that everybody is seeing now because not only do they see them on the internet they're seeing them on tv on news reports. it's likely that at some point more people will have seen those ads that understand that the enrollment options in obamacare what those enrollment options are. a kaiser poll found that 45% of americans didn't know that obamacare was a law. all this confusion jennifer is it going to be a big deal in the next couple of weeks? >> absolutely. this law is very complicated, a lot of people don't understand what's in it or how it's going to impact them personally. there's a reason why this creepy ad is getting all this attention. you guys played it on your air. i'm sure the people who wrote it are very grateful to that. people are able to get their message out in very water coolery way, even if it creeps
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people out. it cuts to the core of what the messaging problem is with the white house. they do need young people to support it. we aren't playing ads in support of the law, because nobody has created a catchy easy way to encourage people to sign up. maybe the white house has tricks up their sleeve come october 1st but so far we haven't seen anything that's nearly as effective. >> jonathan there are problems with the software to varying degrees in different states and there are some glitches. this is kind of spoapped t suppe like going on expedia or orbitz. you might be able to click on various plans and this may not be in effect on october 1st. >> we have known for a while
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people work on the affordable care act, in some states the federal government is going to be running the market. in some states like california, maryland, the state government is running it. we have known for a while people have talked about the fact that this is a really complicated system to build. we want to make sure people can choose their insurance, we have to figure out how much financial assistance is available. people have been using the phrase, a soft launch, i think jennifer had a story about a week ago on this. i think what you'll see on october 1st is most of the websites will be on, you will be able to go see them. they may not be ready for people to enroll but that's not such a big deal, there is six months for people the enroll. >> you didn't think it would be much of a deal as long as the glitches and the problems didn't last too long. again, that leads us to at least the first day, the enrollment period begins on october 1st. does it end on march 31st,
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2014, but if you want coverage before march 31st you need to get going before the end of the year. what do we need to know jennifer? >> if you want coverage january 1st you have to sign up probably mid december. there isn't an actual cutoff date but that's about it. like jonathan sced we know there's going to be glitches on october 1st and maybe for the first few weeks there's going to be problems but the white house there's so much at stake for them they're going to make sure this is up and running effectively within a couple of weeks after october 1st. so then consumers can start their coverage on january 1 or they can wait until the end of march. that's the cutoff date for open enrollment. but if most americans don't have coverage in 2014 they will face a fine on their taxes next year. that's that individual mandate, the requirement that everybody gets in the pool.
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>> jonathan, what about these bigger issues with obamacare, that may -- and how serious will they be? we've got the unions last week coming out and upset about the multiemployer plans and lack of subsidies and really had some pretty hamp words -- harsh words about obamacare but then they said we've got to talk about this behind closed doors. but then we've got the cleveland clinic announcing millions of dollars of cutbacks, home depose, walgreen's, other companies, trader joe's all these companies making major changes many of whom are saying they're not going ohave the employees work the 30 hours in order to be given health insurance. there is this sort of growing are problems i guess around the country, aren't there? good so there are certainly a
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lot of stories about these problems. and i riemed people to keep a few things in -- remind people to keep a few things in mind. a lot of these are exaggerated. you hear it across the board and it actually affects about 20 or 30 workers. you heard where it might have been ibm moving their employees or retirees to a retirement exchange, had to do with obamacare, but it turned out to be something they were doing privately. a lot of the stories don't have to do with the health care law or they are exaggerated. this is a complicated law, if you are trying to fix the most complicated health care system in the world -- >> some might argue i.t. the
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best health care system in the world. >> but some people would actually dispute that, put that aside, the architecture is so complicated. if you are going to try ofix it, if you are going to try fix the problems i think everybody agrees there is going to be disruption, and you are getting 20 to 30 million peoples who are going to have health insurance. you have people who don't have health insurance new consumer protections, you are going to start to change the health care system so it becomes more efficient and less costly. we are starting to see signs that that is maybe in effect already. make sure the story is real and think about the tradeoffs. if it is a bad news story what's the good news you're getting from it and which is more important? >> let's hope if the good news is more than if bad.
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we'll stay with this story and have elements of obamacare alt the way to october 1st. jonathan and jennifer thank you for coming and hope to have you back. what do you think? join the conversation on twitter at ajconsiderthis and our facebook and google plus pages.
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o. >> all of a sudden we're in the middle of a charm offensive from iran. it started earlier this week from a new year's tweet from iran president hassan rowe ha r.
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a washington post editorial written by rouhani, where rouhani tried to ease fears of iran's nuclear program. >> we have time and again said that under no circumstances would we seek any weapons of mass destruction, including nuclear weapons nor will we ever. >> despite that comment and many past denials the u.s. and many allies especially the gulf states an israel suspect the iranian program is all about building nuclear materials. mr. obama behinded that a new round of diplomacy is possible. >> there are indications that rouhani, the new president, is somebody who is looking to open being dialogue with the west and with the united states in a way that we haven't seen in the past. and so we should test it.
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>> iran's charm offensive may have been triggered by a letter from president obama to rouhani reportedly delivered three weeks ago that is said to have offered relief from economic sanctions in return for relief and cooperation on iran's nuclear program. guy ziv, founder of the israel national security project. thank you both for being with us tonight. david, want to start with you. president rouhani, a cleric, a follower of the ayatolla houmeni, part of the implement, is this latest approach part of the same? >> no one really knows at this point. there's a huge difference
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between the way american officials are seeing the signals from iran and israeli officials are saying this. there are statements from israelis today saying don't believe this. some estimates that iran is within six months of creating a nuclear wea weapon and u.s. sayg no. >> guy, the government in israel is not are charmed by the offensive. the iranian president used a lot of sugar coated words but did so dliptly in order to deceive. we don't need words from the iranians but we need action he. is this what iran is doing hoping to string united states along to get more time to develop the program? >> i suspect a charm offensive
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that you said earlier. we do have an obligation to negotiate with them and find out whether the iranians are serious. >> on the other hand david, the question here is have the sanctions now they have been in place over three decades, have they finally gotten to the point has the straw broken the camel's back that the u.s. really has leverage to do serious negotiating? >> it could be. rouhani won the election, the iranian economy is in shambles and the force he are sort of in retreat. if rouhani is what he says, i agree that starting talks makes sense. i think you leave the sanction he in place but you bring him the possibility to succeed. he has made his conciliatory statements and if nothing comes
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of it kim i can guarantee that the force he are going to start to are attack rouhani. >> there is not that much political faction supporting outreach to the united states. >> that's what's been set, this is a nationalist issue, years of tension between the countries. in a sense he's taking a very large political risk by making this effort. so i definitely think it's worth talking but there's got to be a serious agreement and the sanction he have to be used as leverage. >> guy, in the past some iranian presidents have sort of gone out on a limb and then the supreme leader ends up pulling the rug from under them. ayatollah houmeni told revolutionary guard, i agree in this move and this in some circumstances is positive and necessary. do you think that is also a different signal coming from the
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man who actually really makes the decisions beyond the president? >> i mean, my best guess is more a difference in style rather than substance. we are going to know relative soon, assuming negotiations do take place, because iran will have an opportunity to demonstrate, and that means adhering to the demands of the u.n. security council. >> iran has always insisted that it's nuclear program was entirely peaceful but i certainly bit it up covertly. -- built it up covertly. they are disguised enriched uranium. >> we have never pursued or sought a nuclear bomb and we are not going to do so. we are solely seeking peaceful
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nuclear technology. >> if that was the case guy why would they have not accommodated the west and their concerns about nuclear problem a long time ago? what's the feeling inside israel? >> well, i agree with that and certainly the israeli government agrees with that as well. the fact is that iran has for a very long time for many years engaged in a policy of concealment, of deception, and rouhani the president was part of that. he was a very senior member of the iranian national security team. he was the lead negotiator for iranian nuclear program for a couple of years. so he was part of that process, and he was part of the problem. at the same time, this ask the biggest pr offensive that we've seen coming from iran since the 1979 revolution. so i think that we have an obligation to see whether or not they're serious about it and enter into direct biological
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negotiations. >> we have some social media. let's go to hermella on that. >> besides necessary policy changes what would you say signals are solidarity? >> who is that for? >> this is for david. >> a freeze in all, that the u.n. security council has asked for, opening their facilities to iaea inspections, that would be something that would lead the u.s. to consider, the bank transfers and the swift transfers is what hurt the iranian economy. >> this next week is going to be important because of all the big u.n. speeches and president obama and president rouhani will be at the u.n. at the same time. what is the chance that they
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will meet? there is concern that whatever bilateral talks should not go on at a high level. >> could part of these negotiations be iranian help in easing out president assad in syria, somehow, defusing the conflict there? and that's a big part i think of the american thinking about what could potentially come out of this there dialogue. >> and again, the think it shouldn't be at president obama and are president rouhani because president obama should be at the level of are ho you aremeni.
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>> what does are netanyahu have to say? >> if what is true of iran or what is true of syria, is true of iran. and by the way, vice versa. >> so guy, what happens here? if negotiations are going to move forward, if we fold president netanyahu's advice, do you think they would move forward quickly? it seems to knee the threat of force would probably not be a great way to start negotiations. >> probably not. but at the same time, i would think that president obama hadn't removed the threat of force either. it is part of his diplomatic tool kit if you will, the threat of use of force that is, but i think president obama is willing to test the iranians to see if they're serious.
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we'll know rather soon if the iranians are serious, if they are able to meet the demands of the u.n. security council, by suspending their nuclear activities, by suspending the activities pertaining to the technology related to plutonium production, if they do all that, then i think that that's a serious sign that we can then negotiate in good faith with the iranians. >> if this time we see some serious negotiations, great to see you tonight. >> after the break we will explore some of the most common urban legends and why people feel the need to fill your in-box with them, next.
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>> quality journalists once again on the air is a beautiful thing to behold. >> al jazeera america, there's more to it.
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interdid we tell you that kenya put up a sign welcoming people to the birth place of barack obama. all fake, pure urban legend but a lot of people believed them. many of these urban legends and
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conspiracy theories too get started online but they also get deburchgdebunked there. with sites like snopes.com. joining us is michael she sherm, and from burbank california, from robert thompson he joins us from burbank and robertson, director of sir queues university, michael want to start with you, thank you for joining us. most people here, a woman giving birth to an octopus or a lizard or a frog, most of us think no
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way. that has been making its way around since 1930 and people have to debunk it. why do people believe stories that are so absurd? >> that comes with believing things, certain of our beliefs, religious beliefs or political beliefs, or other things, biological, like giving birth to an octopus, or who's sleeping with who and those basic evolved human needs that we have. and we get titillated by a normal thing, woman gives birth, to woman gives birth to something unusual or woman gives birth to something not even possible. in our evolved psychology, in the small bands of hunter gatherers, the passing on of knowledge orally through stories is how we maintained knowledge,
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how we learned information. and so the media is particularly of the internet just feeds off that normal tradition that we have. the way the brain works, the moment you comprehend something especially verbally you believe it. our job as skeptics is much harder. it's like you are trying to pry away from somebody's brain what they committed to the moment they grasp it. it's very difficult. >> it's so much information or misinformation -- professor thompson -- >> one thing -- sorry. >> the moon landing was staged in california, maybe it was in the studio behind michael but despite the ample evidence that we went to the moon more than once, why do people believe these things that are so clearly wrong? >> well, i mean i think the moon landing thing is a big
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conspiracy issue. i think that's different from the -- the urban legend situation, i mean there are urban legends, i grew up in the 1970s and i remember when the first books about urban legends started coming out. every single one of these things it seemed like was things i had heard and completely believed as true, i could almost check them off. but once that's debunked you kind of let it go. they told me when i went to the college that there were contraction in the library because they shouldn't figured on the weight of the books and the library was sinking. then subsequently i heard the story was told in virtually every college and university across the country so i let it go. the moon landing is a different kind of thing. it is not just one of those bits of stories that turns out not to be true. it's when people collect information and decide to believe that there is a big conspiracy and they believe that. i think there's three major reasons for that.
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number 1 is some of these arguments are pretty compelling. every single time i look at one of those documentaries about how the shadows on the moon aren't right and the backgrowngd blac blackness isn't right, people who are not around to explain the kennedy assassination, they have some compelling conspiracy arguments. number 2, i think the fact that we are generally distrustful of a lot of people in charge. we have watched things like the watergate story which turns out to be a conspiracy theory that turned out to be true. those things really happened. thirdly i think we latch onto the stuff because in some way we want them to be true. they either confirm a belief that we've already got or for example, the big conspiracy theory that aliens, bodies of
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aliens are found and hidden in area 51 or big foot or the loch ness monster. the world is a more interesting place if aliens landed here or big foot is waning around the pacific -- wandering around the pacific northwest. we want it to be true. robert your book is focusing on this, when you look the conspiracy theories, watergate being the exception because the information came out pretty quibltion after it happened. but something like the kennedy assassination or is aliens out in new mexico, my general thought is why do people believe this when the government usually can't keep anything secret, who is going okeep this secret for
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decades? >> exactly. we consider this our conspiracy detection kit. the lest likely it is to be true one of the reasons you just said, three people can keep secrets if two of them are dead. the lincoln assassination, kennedy, we have no other shooters after 50 years, the less likely it is to be true, watergate was a very specific thing, break into a hotel room and get some files. that is entirely possible and that kind of thing does go on. world dom inflation, the enslavement of the american people who owned guns by obama, tens of thousands of people -- not likely to be true. >> people end up believing them so often. let's talk about the internet. my mother at age of 82 started using e-mail.
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and now those urban legends of 50 years, she's sending them out to me all the time and i can't get through to her that she shouldn't trust these things. robert has the internet made things worse? >> the internet giveth and the internet taketh away, it can spread to more people than it could before the internet but the internet is a place where this thing gets talked about and debunked. somenopes being one of them i had a recipe that played a part in one of the older urban legends on a piece of xerox paper. the internet makes it possible for the life cycle of these
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things to be a lot quicker from birth to belief to debunking. >> we'll get to debunking in a minute. hermella. >> explain why rumors and lies travel at the speed of light but the truth stops with one person. i see this happening over and over again in the media and in the workplace. >> indeed, right. that's what we do. in a way skeptic magazine is devoted to finding out what's true. it is a up harder job. our why viewer list is much smaller than the national enquirer. we have the information up fairly quickly after the 9/11 truthers, became somewhat of a media hit, fairly quickly the top 10 arguments they make and the top 10 rebuttals to those
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arguments. we just have to have bad speech, countered by good speech so to speak. >> robert, we -- michael just mentioned snopes.com, skeptics.com, there are debunking sites, my question is why do people just not go there before they hit send? do you think with the misinformation that came out in the boston bombing after the sandy hook shooting there was so much misinformation, do you think that will help people get a little more savvy and a little more carefully? >> well--carefully? >> -- carefully? >> with this whole breaking news culture that we're in stuff is going to get wrong. the reporters are gathering to it us and therefore it's not going through any -- we're seeing the mistakes that get made along the way. so i think people skeptical.
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and in terms of big conspiracy theories, there are places one can go to sort of look at the various arguments genetics it. but a lot of these other urban legends, the things like the gift cards and everything you were mentioned, sometimes you don't even know you're hearing an urban legend to get it debunked. someone told me these motorcyclists were hassling a lady in the diner. and the truck driver ran over their motorcycles. i heard it wasn't true, it had never happened, but even if the internet had been around it wouldn't have occurred to me to think that that was not true. it sounded loifnlgal and that's
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how a lot of these urban legends occurred. details, where they happened, dollar amounts of lawsuits and that kind of stuff. you don't know you're hearing one. >> the lesson is if a story is too good to be true, it probably is, you should go to a fact-checking side and check it out. thank you for being with us tonight. coming up next, the new iphone was introduced today, that brings up a dangerous phenomenon, texting while walking. we'll have the media dive next. are
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>> the iphones 5c and 5s wepton. today's data dive piles up the painful cost of smartphones and we're not talking about money. remember this woman who fell into a fountain for walking while texting. there is something more painful on the phone than a breakup call. every year, countless distracted wexters, people who walk while texting, smash into traffic
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walking into manholes, or falling often of train tracks. a man in california nearly walked into a bear. is the call or the texting really that important? a recent survey from ohio state university, said the number of people who went to the emergency room for injuries sustained while talking or texting on their phones have nearly doubled every year since 2005. fort lee new jersey began issuing $85 fines for walk while texting, some of those people died. washington university sent a un unicycle driving clown through the crowd.
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drivers using cell phones and texting that's one every 30 section. but to finish up with wexting, you heard of brit annal calling? city began a small test of padding the post about five years ago. common sense prevailed and it didn't seem to have lasted. so we know you might love your new iphone 5 s or 5c you might want to put it away once in a while especially while you are in motion. coming up, a new film talks about climate change. next.
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>> every sunday night
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>> the environmental protection agency, just seen a polar sea ice caps have improved since last year but according to our next guests documentary, we still face a very big problem. the documentary do the math, which airs here on al jazeera sunday 9:00 p.m. eastern, raises
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questions about climate change. >> we are building the kind of movement that will change things. >> as of tonight we are taking on the fossil fuel industry directly. these companies are a rogue force. we are no longer at the point of trying stop global warming. too late for that. we're trying to keep it from becoming a complete and utter calamity. >> joining us here in the studio are the directors and the producers of the documentary, do the math, jarrod scott and kelly mix. you filed environmentalist bill mckibbon. watch. >> august was the beginning of the veto of this whole proposal. we will never go up until the very idea of keystone xl is dead and buried. >> with these new epa
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regulations it seems like the government is listening. but is that giving some of the starting numbers in your documentary a drop in the bucket? >> it is certainly a step in the right direction. there is no silver bullet, it's going to take silver buckshot. that the president has come out and mentioned some pretty strong words about the keystone exxon pipeline, then it's going to have to be rethought and the idea that this is going to be a forgone conclusion almost two years ago, and it now looks like it might be rejected, it's a big step. as bill mentions in the film we need to wage this war against fossil fuel industry. this is a war against coal. this is what bill is advocating in the film. we need to come out and see who the real enemy is.
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>> your focus ask on fossil fuels. i want to get to this, another piece of news this week that has sort of exacerbated the debate. arctic ice apparently has expanded by 60% from last year to this year. what do you say to skeptics who say that shows that we really can't see consistent climate change? >> well i think it's to put that in context. 2012 was the record in terms of the greatest amount of ice that was melting. and then if you look at 2013 you are always going ohave when you look at data you are going to have some sort of regression towards the mean where you're not going osee two record years in a row. in the past 30 years we've seen huge regression up to 30% of arctic ice. if you look at the large data set then you see movement in
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that -- >> look at the other poll and large data set going back to 1970, the numbers are that antarctic ice has actually grown since then. >> the important thing is when we talk about climate change and climate disruption you're not going osee just warming but strong trends, superstorms obviously hurricane sandy and these storms becoming stronger, the underlying science what the conversation should be about is we do not deny the science of greenhouse gases increasing the temperature of the earth. and i think that's what the fundamental principles are scientifically and that is without doubt. >> one of the fundamentals of documentary is that the planet cannot raise its temperature more than 2 degrees celsius. >> some of you might remember the climate summit in k
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copenhagen. one number in it, two degrees. >> two degrees. the average temperature has only gone up .8 of a degree celsius since 1880. what is the chance that we're going osee a 2 degree increase any time in the future? >> what bill breaks down in the film, why the film is called do the math, he breaks it down in a summer way, the 2° number that was decided in coa copenhagen, g that number as a guide, he was able to look at data and there was a report called the car born tracker initiative, 565 which is
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bill's second number, gigatons, a big aton of carbon dioxide if we burn that much we will get to that number -- >> is it a cumulative thing? you're talking about we're going to burn 565 gigatons in a matter of a few years. >> where 15 years we'll be at that 565 number that's going to hit that first number. >> that 2 degree rise in temperatures. if that were to happen, it does seem rather extreme, given the amount of fossil fuels we've been dumping into the atmosphere for so many years. >> to remember, this is such a complex system, the atmosphere of the either and all these different --ers and all those factors, you don't say this is directly attributable othis, we
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would like to say the steroid aral 80 in baseball, that particular shot of steroids added to that juiced home run. when we see the underlying science of greenhouse gases works this way, that's mechanical, there are soful factors that play into this, it's not immediately direct, today or tomorrow, but you look at the longer term. >> what about the cutbacks and environmental efforts going on, electric cars and all these things wouldn't that have an impact? >> that all adds up but it's grim. as bill says, he's a professional bummer-outer. this isn't good news most of the time. everything counts, every small battle helps. it's the next electric car, tesla happened to have the best ratings for any car and it just happens to be --
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>> one of the things the movie suggests is people divest from fossil fuel companies. >> one of the things you say where movements take charges where they work on the same level as what it is they are taking on. obviously when the fossil fuel industry, taking that on are financially which is what this movie tries do. the model was apartheid and apartheid was effective, the model was the idea that you could replicate that. >> unfortunately we are right at the end of the row, we thank you for joining us kelly, jarrod. the show may be over but the conversation continues, aljazeera.com/consider this. or twitter or facebook. have a great weekend, we'll see
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you next time. >> good evening everyone, welcome to al jazeera. i'm john siegenthaler in new york. >> and now they've gone beyond just holding congress hospital contaminating. they're holding the whole country hospital contaminating. >> lark out against republicans, a resolution that keeps the government running but defunds obamacare. the man behind the call for action. and taking aim at taiwan. a powerful typhoon has millions on the run now millions are under threat

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