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tv   America Tonight  Al Jazeera  December 6, 2013 12:00am-1:01am EST

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> hello, you are watching al jazeera's special coverage of the death of nelson mandela. people all over the world mourning the death of the man they called madiba. these are the feeds coming live from johannesburg, outside the home of the south african antiapartheid hero. this is where he decide last night surrounded by his family. crowds of we'll wishers have
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been gathering, dancing, swimming, praising his life. they are there to celebrate his achievements and mourn his passing. nelson mandela, south africa's first black president was 95, dying in the company of his family after a long battle against lung infections. let's listen to what some of these people had to say gathered outside his home. >> i'm very sad. i met him when i was young. i grew up with him. i was very sad. i'm not happy that he gets to rest in piece. what he did for the country. i was telling my friend now, that if i was him i wouldn't be friends with him. i wouldn't be together. . >> obviously i'm shocked and sadden. it's hurtful.
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i was born in 1994. he fought for everything. i wouldn't be able to be here around my family. i hope he rests in piece and everything goes well. >> south africa lost his greatest son, they are the words that president zoouma used to break his news to the world that nelson mandela decide. >> fellow south africans, our e beloved nelson mandela, the founding president of a democratic nation has departed. he passed on peacefully in the company of his family around 2050 on the 5th of december, 2013. he is now resting.
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he is now at peace. our nation has lost its greatest son. our people have lost a father. >> well, we go live to sowetto, where nelson mandela's story began. you are outside the house where he used to live. tell us what is going on there. >> well, mixed emotion, we saw a child crying because she was shocked to here that nelson mandela passed away. people were celebrating. it's early morning. people have woken up. they are on their way to work. some are passing by. we have mixed emotions. one person we are speaking to now, he came here, and see the wall. he wrote a message for nelson
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mandela. what did you write? >> i said, "we love you and we're going to miss you." >> where were you when you heard the news? how did you react. >> i woke up. my brother woke me at 5am and told me the news. it was a shock. hearing that we lost tour tata. >> what did he mean to the nation? >> everything. he's the glue that holds us together he brought everybody into one element. >> as a white south african, you know that issues of race are a big issue in south africa. progress has been made, but it's an issue. as a white south african, what d he mean to you? >> as much as he meant to other south africans, i would hope to assume. the fact he was a strong person, liberating this country, making it a democratic country, so i
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had the ability to grow up. he meant the worth to me. >> how do you see south africa today. what is it like now? >> there's deep problems. in the race issue, there's deep problems, hopefully event like this, where we feel like we are united under one banner and we realise we are together, i hope we can all see that we come together and work together. >> and a lot of people will be meeting - most celebrating, some crying. why are people in a happy mood. >> in a happy mood. it's a celebration of his lix. a remembrance of his achievements and what he has done for us. i would say that's why people are jovial about the situation. what needs to be done to make
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sure that his legacy, his dream leads on. >> we need to remember his message, what he has taught us, values that he installed. if we can go forward with the values he's installed in our country and everybody. i believe that we'll go through it together very well. >> what we see is people are coming with their cars and parking them on the road and playing loud music, songs sung and played during the years when nelson mandela is in prison. remember what he went through and achieved. people have been crying. generally the mood is one of celebration. the mood is emotional for south africans and everyone in the world. he is not someone easily replaced. >> what a lovely sentiment from
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the young man you have been interviewing. he was the glue that holds us together. you hear that so much from both white and black south africans. tell us what is going to happen in the coming days with nelson mandela's funeral? >> well, it's going to be a busy few days. there was a program put out initially that that could change. the main thing is that the body would lie in state. it's been moved to pretoria, a military hospital. at some point it will lie in state and talks that he'll tour some parts of the country and difficulty his rural village where he grew up and spent his childhood. that's where he wants to be buried. it will be emotional coming home for his family when that day
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happens. his estates flying in important to people all over the world from africa and asia. he's a man people love to be with, and love to be seen with. people want to be at his funeral to say farewell. south africans will hope there's a way to watch the funeral. they can't fit in the venue. they can be part of the big send off, but the key thing, the clue. and the young man said a lot of work had to be done. no one can deny they have. there are problems. i admit black south africans who don't speak kindly or well of white south africans, and i met white south africans that did the same thing. there are big issues. one major problem is they need to work harder to see themselves as one people. nelson mandela seemingly managed
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to do that. in the next few days you'll see people rallying together, saying they are proudly south african. the outpouring of love will be amazing. it's an speptional time. this is history. few people will be able to wake up and say, "i was there. i saw the emotions, joy, celebrations. it's a lot of work that needs to be done. people here are trying to unit as one country. >> a man who made death in his death and lift. thank you for that harry matarsa in sue wetto. people throughout south africa marking the death of nelson mandela, also get responses coming from from all over the world. the dalai lama calling him a great leader, the world lost a
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great leader and bank ban ki moon, all the reactions from around the world. here in south africa the country where he was recorded as the father of the nation, a deep abiding sadness at his passing and joy at what he achieved during his lifetime. >> nelson mandela made historiy becoming the first democratically elected president in 1974. he did it after spending 27 years in prison. mike hanna looks back at the life of a man who became a global symbol of resistance. >> death does not diminish the memory of the smile or the twin
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twinkle in the eyes. outside the hospital they are content on celebrating a life as much as mourning his death. it was a life richly lived, one in which nelson mandela was prepared to give you everything, including his freedom, for what he believed. >> a lot of people feel it is futile for us to take peace and nonviolence, against a government whose apply is fighting unarmed people. >> they spent 10,053 days in prist. a some time that only made his cause stronger. nelson mandela was a place on the poster, his laws outlawed and found in books and footage that few in south africa saw.
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that changed in 1990 when he walked out of prison. among those the battle to wage apartheid. >> i have spoken about freedom in my lifetime. your struggle and your commitment has released me to stand before you today. >> nelson mandela led the negotiations with a government that kept him in prison for so long. finding f.w. de klerk a man with whom he could do business. it was a process threatened by violence and the smile disappeared as the anc leader berated those he held responsible, including f.w. de klerk. for nelson mandela the process
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was never personal. >> we are not dealing with a man, with an individual. we are dealing with a government with a system. >> as a country was pushed and pulled towards democracy. nelson mandela and f.w. de klerk were awarded the "the new york observer." then on the 27th of april 1, '94. south africans of all political persuasions and colours went to the polls. among them nelson mandela voting for the first time. he became the president of a country in which he had been an outlaw. one in which he said the people now governed. >> on this day, you the people took your destiny into your own hands. you decided that nothing would prevent you from exercises your
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hard-won right to elect a government of your choice. >> after one term as president, nelson mandela did what few leaders in the contain anti did before, stepping down with humour and grace. >> the time has come to hand over. >> at the age of 78 nelson mandela tirelessly worked to raise money for charities, and issuingest rating in a number of conflicts no matter who was involved. >> a sign of loneliness from a man since he divorced his second wife winnie. at the age of 80 he married graca machel, a famous figure in her own right. a yunion
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celebrated by all. >> my wife and eye... [ cheering ] [ cheering and applause ] >> a union that lasted for the rest of nelson mandela's life. >> my wife and i say thank you very much. >> but before he died there was a chance for the world to thank him. on a chilly winter's night nelson mandela made his last major public appearance, acknowledging the roars of the crowd and stirring hearts around the globe as a world cup final was held for the first time in africa, the staging a couple of miles away from the modest sowetto home where nelson mandela began his struggle.
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>> as nelson mandela's health failed he was in and out of hospital spending his 95th birthday. the principal cause of illness a lung infection while works as a prison in the stone quarry of robin island. he spent 87 days, they be the government announced he'd return to his johannesburg home. until the last breath nelson mandela fought the odds as he had done all his life. >> nelson mandela's legacy were emblazoned in the sky all those years ago. above all the legacy is found in the minds of ordinary south africans, black and whid, the people he led to freedom.
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>> jessie duarte was nelson mandela's special assistant. she told us what it was like working with him. >> we had a good working relationship. madiba was a strict employee, but strict in the sense of much more strict on himself. he was punk tul -- punk tulle. he had great ideas about meeting people. he needed to meet the people of south africa and talk to them about the future and where we needed to go. he spent a great deal of time talking to the people at home and engaging as he did with many african leaders to talk about un
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iteming the countryman. madiba's greatest wish was to reunite the african continent and believes we should un item the people of south africa. in many ways he was a symbol of freedom in progress. on a personal note, you know that he's gone, but will live on in the hearts of many people. i was at his home tonight, and certain outside of the house people are singing and celebrating a life that had given them hope and courage. i think madiba was thinking that we needed at the time when our country was in transition, and
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still as we developed further, he was there there as long as h was not ill, for consultation. it is a gap in our lives. >> nelson mandela struggled to liberate south africa. some used as an example to become leaders, and have been paying tribute to a man known in south africa as madiba. patty culhane has more from washington d.c. >> who else in the world could make this happen? within hours of his death a moment of silence at the united nations security council. it seems across the globe there is universal work. >> president obama left a hanukah session to send this message of gratitude. >> the day he was released from prison gave me a sense of what
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human being can do when guided by hope. i can't think of my own lift without the example nelson mandela set. so long as a live i will do what i can to learn from him. >> world leaders say he was the face of forgiveness. and a human inspiration. many around the world were admiring of his struggle for human dignity, equality and freedom. >> one of the wribrightest lighf our world has gone out. nelson mandela was not just a hero of our time, but a hero of all time. >> a legend for the powerful and people on the streets of times square. >> it's a big loss for all of us that he died. >> god bless him and his family,
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and all the beam he fought for. i hope the legacy lies on. >> remembering how he thought and lived, a legacy unlikely to be forgotten. >> other messages of condolences have been coming in from around the world. >> it's sad and emotional day for the people of south africa. nelson mandela will be remembered for being incredibly inspirationle leader a beacon of hope for south africa. people believe in reconciliation, someone leaders looked to. for the people of new zealand, someone we had great admiration for. >> >> translation: he was a great leader, fighting with strong will to eliminate apartheid.
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i sincerely pray for his spirit to rest in piece. >> joining us now from new york is the former deputy president of south africa. welcome to the program. it's good to have you with us. i know you were close to nelson mandela, can you describe what the loss of him means to you. >> well, a great leader who enabled us to come from being a movement that was antiapartheid to a government, and he was a great example because he worked so hard that when you worked under him you had no choice but to emulate his example. >> you were the first woman to hold position as deputy president of south africa. nelson mandela made your first political nomination. how much were you influenced and guided by him?
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>> well, working for him meant that he took the cue. he was the president that worked around the clock which meant that as a younger person you this no choice but to make sure that you dedicated as much time as possible to your work. but also, highly principled person, a highly accessible media, a lot of humility and a lot of humour, and that made is easier for us to be in his presence but at the same time to respect him for the leader he was. >> he didn't just bring been apartheid. he had to bring people together, bring a nation together. and achieve reconciliation. that was the theme of his
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presidency. >> no, absolutely, and not only did he have to achieve rechon silliati silliation, he had to talk to those on the importance of forgiveness, and building the nation, and not trying to look back and settle the score. that needed a great leader to achieve that. because he led from the front, by example. it was easy for us to take a cue from him, and to follow his example. >> when you look at south africa now, do you think there are lessons to be learnt from what nelson mandela taught us? >> every day we can learn a lot from madiba about the whole notion of service and selflessness. we can learn a lot from madiba
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about honesty and dedication to the people. we can learn a lot from madiba about serving people without serving ourselves first. >> you are working with the united nations now, i understand. when you look at the conflicts that are going on around the world. do you think world leaders can learn from him? >> everybody can learn from him, and especially world leaders. it's important that you put the leaders first. every step you make is about making the lives of your leaders better. when leaders have situations where people are killed, women raped, this is foreign for madiba who fight hard to protect women and children. >> thank you for sharing your
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thoughts and memories of nelson mandela. speaking to us live from new york there. >> nelson mandela's daughters were in london. they were attending the u.k. premier of "nelson mandela: long walk to freedom", they were told their fathero.
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he always has been from when i was a child and my parents were involved in the anti-apard item struggle in victoria. he was always the person that pushed me on and made me think if he sacrificed his freedom, the best years of his life in dark isolated prison, the rest of us must make sure we don't spare a minute to free him and the people of south africa. he set high standards. he was no stant.
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he set high standard, and his common humanity. he was a people's person, never forgot his commitment to people. >> a little earlier on we spoke to the former u.s. grate colin powell who saw nelson mandela very much as a source of inspiration. >> i was able to rise in my own land because we had changed. when i grew up in new york city it would be unthinkable for a black kid, the son of emgrant parents to become secretary of state, chairman of the joint chief of staffs, but it happened. the latter part of my life, watching the changes as a national security advisor, in south africa, i think i was very inspired by the example given by nelson mandela. colour does not matter. the only thing that matters is
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what you are able to do. he tells us that the day of the big man, the day of dictators and others who can tell people how they will think and behave is over. the way to do is it representative government of the time brought to south africa. when you look at the arab spring, i am sure men people got their inspiration from nelson mandela, and how he threw off the yoecks of apartheid.
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..members of congress. still we cannot forget there's
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another part of that history that just cannot be whitewashed and ignored. it took a lot for the american government to really change, for american policy makers to see and appreciate nelson mandela was essentially a humanitarian, a human rights fighter and he was not a communist, terrorist and threat to u.s. interests. >> it's astanding that the anc was accused of being backed by the cubans, imposing a communist threat and nelson mandela was not removed from the terrorist watch list until 2008. he needed a special waiver to visit the white house in 2005. >> yes, and you know again, we talk about - i mentioned before the regan administration. that policy towards nelson mandela. the freeze out of nelson mandela, not only physically from the united states, but
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politically seeing him as the icon was in place, so it is true that terrorists watch lifts of nelson mandela, not just him, but other members of the national congress, so essentially we have seen a profound shift and change in terms of u.s. policy towards south africa, but overall u.s. policy makers added to nelson mandela. i would still think that we have to do - we take all of history. we can't pick and choose like a smorg us bored. there was a part of history where nelson mandela was a pariah. he overcame that because of his example, leadership and personae. and also the legacy of struggle, perseverance, and the image that he projected, the humanitarian image to the world. it was hard for any, even the
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hardest-nosed conservatives, anti-nelson mandela from that period on to ignore the monumental accomplishments of this man. >> he is a huge inspiration. people talk about his capacity for forgiveness and his goal of reconciliation. how much of that influenced other civil rights movements - in the u.s., for example. >> well, one of the things that is always interesting is it goes like this - that when you look at the civil rights movement, that it influenced other movements, particularly in south africa, and nelson mandela gave a tremendous amount of encouragement and credit to dr king, and the civil rights struggle. he paid whommage to that. what many don't see, it worked both way, there was an influence of reconciliation. the struggle weighed against
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apartheid, how he overcame that, but the spirit that nelson mandela governed in south africa and continued to energy us the still rights movement. when it came to los angeles in 1990, i was there and remember the energy from all the civil rights leaders in this city and other parts of the country. they saw nelson mandela not just as a foreign icon. but they saw him as one of them. so really the inspiration from nelson mandela, his leadership had a profound influence on the civil rights movement. >> i was going to ask you how it was perceived. i know in iconic places around the u.s. where the civil rights movement has significance. there are wreaths laid and tributes paid to nelson mandela. i wanted to ask you how much of them saw him as one of them, not just as a south african leader but one of them struggling for
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equality? >> that's important when we are trying to position nelson mandela in terms of his historic legacy. when you talk about civil rights organizations and movement in this country. nelson mandela talls -- always, you had a picture. they were the big three, the trinity for civil rights leaders and organizations for literally 30 years. nelson mandela sat by, in terms of heroes, icons, someone to look up to. there was a direct connect between the civil rights movements of this country and the civil rights movement in south africa. you could not get around the organic interconnection between the two. today you have seen an outpouring of every city in the country. the wrooeths the tributes, the candle lights.
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he was not someone that was thousands of miles away. he was sane and is sane and will always be sane as really in the spirit of civil rights movement in this country, an infinite part of that. >> on a more personal note i remember talking about the goals of civil equalitiry, "i have a dream" speech of martin luther king's speech. they say are problems, discrimination exists, south africa has race issues. how do we see this going forward. >> let's compare dr king and nelson mandela. after the height of the civil rights movement in the 1960s, dr king had two or three other goals. adjust foreign policy, antiwar, peace movement in the war and political oppression. not only in this country but
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globally. also dr king had another goal. the poor people's march, poverty, number inequality. conversely nelson mandela south africa got rid of apartheid, they have black rule, but there are millions lacking in housing, jobs, high unemployment, health care disparities. in other words we see a parallel between dr king and nelson mandela - same issues, same problems, even after the end of apartheid. even after the end of legal segregation in this country. so important between looking at nelson mandela, and their legacies to under one thing. the problems that they - and their vision saw as being
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endemic and impacting poor african-americans, poor black south africans still had to be struggled against, fought against. in other words both of them saw that this was a battle that was not finished. the goals had not been attained. that's why when you talk about nelson mandela, and dr king, you join the two toot because you have a great vision in terms of economic justice, political economy across the board. and i think until the end of their lives they continued to push, to prod, to energise, to be the conscience of many people, to understand we still have an unfinished job. >> it's good to speak with you. thank you for sharing your thoughts with us. >> well, among the many tributes was this one from former u.s. president jimmy carter. he said the people from south africa and human right advocates
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lost a great reader. the passion for freedom and justice created new hope. because of him south africa is a leading democracy. the american civil rights act visit jessie jackson said nelson mandela's dignity would be missed. >> i was in south africa in cape town on the day his body was released. his passing is sadness. he took us though great heights and depths. he used his mind and body as a living sacrifice and suffered to bring down the barriers of that system, and chose to build a new non-racist south africa, chose reconciliation over rhett pri bugs, it may be the critical judgment he made to have a south africa that would not put whites
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in the margin. >> south africans in the united states gathered outside a restaurant called madiba, a clan made he's known by. they released lanterns into the sky. >> i think nobody thought of him dying or anything like that. it is a shock. i think a lot of people, myself includ included, i have not taken it in. >> he's the face of south africa, and he's taken us so far. even as a continent. >> white, black, indian, he's a unifying figure. people say we'll never have another nelson mandela. we won't. in the context of being south
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africa. unbelievable unifying force between so moan many people. for me it's a mourning with purpose. i have to carry on the legacy. the way i feel like it is by gaving other fellow human being hope in the sense we can be equal human being. >> for him going through that and having forgiveness than revenge, that sh something big. >> some thoughts on nelson mandela's life. >> australian politician gareth evans was australasia's politician in 1990 and joins us on the line from canberra. i know you were the first foreign official to speak to nelson mandela when he was released. how did that come about? >> well, he went immediately to mosaca to meet his anc
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colleagues in exile. i was in the country at the time, to thank australia for the role that we played leading the charges internationally, which i think finally contributed to the white south africans realising they had to move into negotiation mode. i had been a long-standing student campaigner. i'd never met a more impressive human being. a great big lumen esent smile. above all the absence of gaolers, he communicated to me and the world and in particular where it happened, the white south african minority, and it was, more than anything else, enabled the transition to
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proceed, not the bloodshed. >> you got know him very well during that appeared. did he speak of the huge task ahead of him after suffering years of this oppressive discriminatory business? >> the housing welfare for the black majority, treated terribly. he knew that the critical thing to get the process uttered was to have a united country, not to have a fear for an alarmed community. he knew he had to manage that reconciliation process. that's what he did. whatever the shortcomings in the south african of today, or the
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presidency in delivering and meeting the expectations, it's impossible to imagine in terms of the hate red and the price to the past. that's the measure of his achievement. >> tell us about australia's political influence during that time in getting the apartheid system lifted. we were speaking to a lot of u.s. analysts who point out that the relationship between u.s. leaders and the anc and their attitude towards nelson mandela was very, very different at that time. i mean, he was painted as a terrorist. put on the terrorist watch list. what was the australian attitude. >> it was the position in politics. john howard was prime minister and recanted. but it was a strong feeling on the conservative side that nelson mandela was a terrorist. it had to be overcome. a role played by the australian government in 1973.
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it wasn't the sports boycotts, cricket sanctions or cultural or trade sanctions in place for so long. they weren't making that much difference, what made the difference were the financial investment sanctions which the whole world plied. australia is in the forefront. and, you know, people like jim wilkinson, in persuading the banks and governments in terms of the basic capital flow, the lifeblood of the economy. we did have a bit to be proud of in the role that we played. it was very consistent with the left of politics, but it hadn't been consistent with the other side. one of the great virtuous of nelson mandela is that he accomplished a sense of reconciliation along the lines, not only within south africa,
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but across the world. we came to appreciate a magical contribution he was making. >> he's held up as an iconic figure not just within south africa, but leaders everywhere. south africa today, of course, has its problems. you are alluding to those poverty shortages, anc corruption scandals. but the lose of nelson mandela will be a huge void, won't it, which is bringing people together right now as they remember his achievements. i just give you an example of a void he crossed. it was the 1999 world cup, the final match between south africa and new zealand when nelson mandela took to the field in the rugby jersey. i was there at the first match when south africa played australia. there was a stadium full of
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65,000 white bull necked afrikaanas, frankly. no black face, very few indian. rugby was a white man's sport. i was sitting with nelson mandela. he went on to the ground to toss the coin. almost immediately there was a chant, "nelson mandela, nelson mandela" and i realised who was going on. i realised it was a huge outpouring of affection and genuine respect of this man, who they had previously totally vilified. i realised then, this was a spine-tingling moment what the measure of this man's achievement had been. i think it's the legacy for all the difficulties. they are not going to go back to those days, they are long gone. >> the 1995 world cup, that was lump in throat time when you realised the enormity. figure and what he'd achieved.
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>> did you speak to him in recent times. he hadn't been seen in public for a long time before coming ill. had you had contact with him. >> not really for the last 10 years any more than anyone else had. i had been out of the public office, and i hadn't maintained that contract. the legacy through the "90s. there was many contexts. during that period of his presidency, it was a hands-on relationship, and, you know, it's something that i will always remember. the first impression that i described was sustained. this was not something turned on to the cameras. this was a personality that he projected, a decency, a humanity that he projected through his entire public career. it's that which we are celebrating, not just mourning,
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we are celebrating that life today. on that basis i'll have to liu. >> you and the people of south africa celebrating his life. thank you very much indeed for joining us. we appreciate your time. gareth evans in canberra. >> nelson mandela spent 27 years in prison, 18 of them on a small island off the coast of cape town, there he was subjected to daily humiliation. in a show of forgiveness he invited the same men to his first state dinner as a president. before we revisit robin island, let's go to london and listen to archbishop desmond tutu, giving his tribute to nelson mandela. >> let us give him the gift of a
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south africa. which is one. thank you for the gift of my giver. >> for what is help us to become that kind of nation. please stand.
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lisp to the word of our saviour jesus christ. i give you a new commandment. love one another as i have loved you, so are you to love one another. this love among you, then all will know that you are my disciples. a piece of the lord be always with you. >> archbishop desmond tutu speaking in cape up to, paying
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tribute to nelson mandela. social rights activist at the first black south african archbishop of cape town. new nelson mandela very well indeed. >> as we said before we came to this. nelson mandela spending 18 years in prison. andrew simmonds visited robin island and met some of the men gaoled with him. >> cut off another the most southern tip of the african continent. an island chosen for one reason - it's isolation. nelson mandela described it has a prison within a prison, a harsh regime where racism moved. this man was to become a confidante of nelson mandela. they were political prisons
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under the system of apartheid where white cards use repress. >> the only time we were allowed out is where an armed warder is on the catwalk training his gun on us. because they had been indoctrinated to believe that we were irresponsible trorists that wouldn't come with a gun near us in case we took their gun. it took some time for them to get used to the idea that we were just like them. >> the leaders of the struggle were hold here, and block b. one cell was marked n nelson mandela 466, followed by 64, the year he arrived. >> most of nelson mandela's sol attitude was spent inside this tiny cell. the first thing that strikes you is how tiny it is.
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>> this all there was for sanitation, a bucket. >> imagine trying to use this as a bed in temperatures of cold and heat, and blankets and a mat. and the few from here - it's bleak. a blang wall and a courtyard. for 18 of his 27 years nelson mandela lived in this cell. >> it is difficult to imagine that we spent 18 years here. >> did you see a change in nelson mandela? >> i have read somewhere that he became softer and the concept of forgiveness, reconciliation was burn in prison. that is not true.
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the policy of forgiveness was always policy. it didn't take prison to do that. the regime tried to play down how badly it was treating anc prisoners. this was a staged event. you didn't know it was taken. >> no. >> the government was trying to make the world think nelson mandela was doing light work. the prisoners wondered why for one day the labouring was easy. it was to get tougher later. it used to an open lime quarry, 13 years of hard toil, breaking rock. when they weren't labouring they were sometimes allowed visits in this gloomy building. nelson mandela's second wife winnie came under a travel ban. at one stage nelson mandela waited two years between her visits. by regulation there was a
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minimum of 6 months, and by regulation there was no contact. a screen between husband if life. winnie on this side. a communication between a speaker. a maximum of a conversation, not a second more. every word bugged. >> obviously they didn't record all the prisoners, just nelson mandela without favour. it's difficult. if not impossible to guess what is going on inside. very, very difficult. naturally he must have felt he had only been like - he doesn't show it. >> outside the violence was increasing. nothing was known of the soweto uprising for three months when new arrivals at the prison
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brought the news and anger. >> they were impatient, brave, courageous. they wanted to fight physically against the wardens. we had to talk to them and dissuade them. and it took a bit of time, but we succeeded. >> was nelson mandela forceful in that record? >> very much so. he and mr sulu were great leaders. sosulo was a father-figure. they were a different type of figures. >> if sosulo was the father, what would nelson mandela be? >> the elder brother. >> the elder brother, in captivity, relevant but fine. challenging procedure. qualities that helped him become the president of south africa. how will his fellow prisoner
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remember him? >> i'd say courageous, selfless with tremendous political foresight. prepared to sacrifices everything for the cause of the people, all the oppressed people in this country. he had tremendous forsite not only because of south africa. a caring and compassionate person. he would put his personal confirms in the backburner, when he sees his fellow prisoner. there would be tensions, bankings -- bannings and all that. he never that that interfere with his responsibilities towards us. he went through everything.
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one characteristic of many that matured while he suffered the years of hardship on the island. they set out to break him. what happened was quite the reverse. one important stage in the making of a remarkable man. >> over a quarter of a decade behind bars, when he came out nelson mandela was preaching not hatred and revenge. these are the scenes. let's hear from nelson mandela in his own words.
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