tv Inside Story Al Jazeera February 12, 2015 11:30pm-12:01am EST
minorities are facing growing legal and social discrimination. i'm antonio mora thanks for joining us. for the latest news any time from al jazeera, head over to aljazeera.com. "inside story" is next. have a great night. hello, i'm ray suarez. jordan was deeply involved in the war against the islamic state of iraq and the levant. in the past week the country rallied to the cause. after i.s.i.l. posted video of a captured jordanian fighter pilot burned alive in a cage. >> it's one more indication of the viciousness and barbarity of this organization. >> when that news broke king
abdullah was here in washington. the king vowed revenge and left with stronger support. jordanian fighter jets are pounding targets in syria and iraq. we'll talk to a retired 3-star jordanian air force general about the mission, the risks and the state of the u.s.-led coalition. does the latest i.s.i.l. horror and jordan's reaction both military and political change the fight against i.s.i.l.? it's "inside story". . >> aircraft from the royal jordanian air force are making regular sortees with the help of u.s. coalition. the king rallied, executed
prisoners i.s.i.l. wanted released and pledged his country to wipe out the so-called islamic state. did i.s.i.l. killing the pilot accomplish something jordan had trouble with national unity around going after the islamic state. earlier this week the air force announced it's carried out 56 air strikes in iraq and syria, targetting training camps and weapons houses. >> in three days the air force killed around 7,000 fighters. u.s. central command says 24 targets hit were in syria, and a large number were in i.s.i.l.'s assumed headquarters. raqqa. it comes after some of jordan's top military men called for an earth-shattering response to moaz al-kasasbeh's execution by i.s.i.l. in september moaz al-kasasbeh's plane suffered a mechanical failure and he was captured.
jordan was involved in negotiation for the pilot's release for months. king abdullah was angered by the gruesome killing of moaz al-kasasbeh: jordan's military is part of a larger coalition. according to the military its fighter jets participated in under a fifth of the coalition's bombing runs and make up 17% of air power. u.s. central command has been intelligence gathering. >> a week after the news of the pilot's execution. the coalition faced a setback. 26-year-old kayla mueller is dead. she was an aide worker from arizona, held hostage since the
summer of 2013. president obama said tuesday: >> kayla mueller touched the heart of the world. the world grieved with us. the world mourns with us. the world wants to be more like kayla. and if that is her legacy and the footprint she leaves on the world. that is a wonderful thing. >> the emotion is visible in the u.s. where mourners gathered in support of the kayla mueller's family and in jordan whose residents take to the streets. is the effort symbolic.
is jordan in a particularly good position for providing significant aid in the fight. we'll begin in amman, the jordanian capital with a former jordanian air force officer would works as a military analyst. >> welcome to the programme. let's talk about how things have changed in jordan in recent days has there been an obvious challenge in public opinion since the death of moaz al-kasasbeh. >> jordan is all united. they believe in what the air force is doing, and as a punishment for the monsters and take the revenge of the pilot. but jordan is contributing to the coalition a lot nowadays. these an essential for the air attacks on the theatre itself. big theatre. so will start to double up
assets and intelligence and have this psychology. any air campaign does not have a psychological effect. it failed. they hit them hard and i think it's what they were looking for. >> before your lieutenant was killed, there were a lot of reports from jordan saying that people were not so sure that jordan would be alive with the united states in this fight. there was a twitter hash dag - not our fight. have those people changed their minds or have they quieted down. >> i think it did change. people like - there were sympathizers of i.s.i.l. with a very small number, diminishing away. jordan it's war, because we cannot afford to get the fight close to the border and have a missed situation there.
jordan is presenting the area as a whole. if they penn trit. they will protect saudi arabia egypt, israel. jordan is doing its mission. it's our war and everybody's war. >> geography has given you this assignment. what can jordan offer the coalition. what role must it play in the coalition? >> she's sharing intelligence which we are stillful in that. it's well-known we have a good relation with tribal am. and people in syria and iraq. that's a roll. the other roll is giving the bases over there. you know people instead of flying from emirates or so any other place in the gulf. they take 6-7 hours to do the mission. now they will do the mission in one hour, 2.5 hours. the demands of the theatre can
respond quickly, any tart of opportunity, they can do that. they are achieving the mission in a way. >> when you watch it on television it's easy to see what is happening when a plane takes off. anyone that follows air forces nose to have the plane take off you need a lot of support, other things going on on the ground. how is jordan helping out. is it getting aid in the united states in supporting the air mission against i.s.i.s. >> we are looking forward to having logistic capabilities you know supplies. we need spare parts, smart bombs, all kind of thing to support our mission. especially these past airplane rpv, like predator we need it. it can play a great role in jordan or the theatre. like strike against the group or a leadership.
it doesn't have the drama on the theatre whenever it was. we need all kind of things. the supply is not enough now to sustain the mission. we need a billion support for jordan to carry on the mission. jordan is under pressure we have 1.5 refugees, quarter of a million iraqis and they are affecting our infrastructure we need support. >> reporter: -- jordan is not a big or populous country. to have so many refugees must be arrangement -- apparent to the people. you are conscious of the foreigners with you now because of the crisis in the region. >> be welcome them. there is a security concern. especially if - there is a start, and trouble will start. we have to do something about
it. and the whole world should help to do it. i'm a guy that asks to have a safe haven for these people outside our border but no-fly zone or something like that. a military operation. i think jordan should ask for that to make sure things is balanced within the resources. >> i'm wondering - you mentioned earlier the other air forces using jordanian bases. whether this can create new links in the region even in the midst of this terrible conflict whether government to government and military to military relationships are forged - new ones. >> well i believe that you know the region as whole, the country as a whole. they should make an n.a.t.o. arab n.a.t.o. things to also - l if they need to participate in land campaign because air power alone will not defeat i.s.i.s.
it might degrade the capability it will not defeat it. the strategy of pushing them from iraq to syria, it's a wrong strategy. we have to - in syria, this is you know their haven. also, in iraq at the same time. iraqi army is not ready to go for landcampaign now. i don't think it will achieve the result required to defeat daesh or push them out of iraq. it will take a long time. there are two issues to remember about that - their political reform they should do and in actual fact the arab world should put conditional matters on iraqi to say you do the political reform. this is a game changer. turkey should step in and put a no-go zone from the area. using air power, special
operations then we see things go fast. otherwise it will take a long time. it's a long mission. >> we are joined from imam the jordanian capital. we'll be back with more "inside story" after a short break. when we return the splits inside jordanian society that might leave you to conclude that even now there are deep divisions about making security policy in a complicated and dangerous part of the world. stay with us, it's "inside story". i'm me... >> surviving a chaotic childhood >> i'm like dad... they're hookers in this house... >> ...and breaking free and following her own path >> when you come to a show of mine... someone in that audience didn't like what i just said... >> every sunday, join us for exclusive... revealing... and surprising talks with the most interesting people of our time... talk to al jazeera part of our special black history month coverage
welcome back to "inside story" on al jazeera america. i'm ray suarez. we are lacking at jordan and the war against i.s.i.l. jordanian forces have received significant aid, not surprising in light of strong relationships forged by king abdullah, and his father king hussain. jordan supported the mission in afghanistan with military field hospitals and provided support for military training in iraq and training for anti-i.s.i.l. forces. joining us for the rest of the programme, christopher a professor of security studies at georgetown university and director. center for middle east and public policy at the rand corporation. let me start with you, you heard
general about the break. basically say that jordanian society is united top to bottom. are the pictures that we are seeing on television coming from imran khan and people that support the king and the counter order in jordan. is there more to the story than meets the eye? >> i think that there was. right now it's understandable. there's a ground as well of support for the king and unity in jordan. i think in the near term we are going to see growing sentiment opposed to i.s.i.s. as we saw in 2005, in jordan when there were attacks by al qaeda. the question is where will this lead, because there's hostility to i.s.i.s. doesn't mean there's increased support for the policies in the region. >> what do you think, did that
public sentiment that was not sure that jordan should be supporting the american coalition in iraq and syria, did it evaporate with the killing of the pilot. >> you have an evaporation. ambivalence that we saw among the popular u.s.-led coalition in iraq and syria. the evaporation of the ambivalence was a gruesome murder of a lion or a representative of the jordanian air force, and that touched people. the ambivalence is about what i.s.i.s. did to that particular individual. it's not necessarily a change in the level of ambilicence to u.s. -- ambivalence to u.s. policy or a change in concerns that some have with society, or jordan's alignment with u.s. policy, what we see among the elite commentary coming out of
imam the capital, is not reflective of what we see amongst some of the world tribes in the south. >> jordan is always portrayed as being on the knife edge. engaged in a permanent balancing act, vouched by bigger and sometimes maligned forces on all its borders. well saddam hussein is dead and gone. hava el-assad is dead and gone and his son has his hands full with a collapsing syria. what is the balance p balancing act now? >> if you look at the king's father the challenges he had was state-based. you had the problem of a hostile regime in iraq and syria. now the difficulty is the break down of states collapse of borders, and i.s.i.s.'s attempts to erase borders between
countries. the transnational and non-state threats are of a different kind than jordan faced in the past and you see the consequences with the refugee populations that jordan had to absorb and the difficulty making peace with neighbours because they are torn apart from within. >> do you agree, is it a tougher assignment being the king of the kingdom of jordan in the 21st century century. >> yes. it's never been easy it has always been a balancing act. it may be an existential crisis than the leadership faced. you have a non-governmental group, but one that is threatening the legitimacy and stability of the regime itself. they are not shy to suggest ut
calafat should include jordan. they are trying to stir up matters. the way the hostage situation played out was a testament to that. i think it's a real struggle. on top of that you have a variety of grievances that are pervasive within jordanian's society, a majority sunni country, frustrated by the killing of sunnis on a massive level in syria, and the marginalisation of sunnis in iraq. lots of concerns. there'll be a lot of ambivalence about jordan going full force ahead in the anxieties coalition. when the people are concerned with what ramifications it will have. is the king really thinking about his own people. will he deliver to his own people when there's a time of tremendous economic stress from refugees high unemployment and so forth. so i think that this is one of the most difficult times the
king has probably faced. >> a sunni majority state. one with a large palestinian minority that has not seen eye to eye with the royal family or the governing powers in that country. when i say palestinian, native born and a large permanent refugee population. >> that's correct. >> do they feel themselves to be part of the same project as jordan in this part of the world now? >> well some do and some don't. to the xe tent that many don't, it creates a source of ongoing internal - i wouldn't say instability, but we'll say political concern. jordan like every other society, country in the middle east has internal and external dynamics the tendency from washington to london is to look at the external dynamics and say they are the things that matter. >> when the king is making a decision about whether he's going to go to war, how, the way
he'll frame the discussion about the war, he's looking at not only executing an external strategy but trying to consolidate a power base and consolidate a consensus in his own community. part of what you see about the strong language about i.s.i.s. not being islamic is part of a theme that the regime had about focussing on a moderate form of sunni islam, and emphasising a modernist approach to dealing with the rest of world. we have a short break and be back with more of "inside story". when we return what the united states' government wants to see as the outcome, and what others are looking for. do the different issues share different goals? in iraq syria and the ongoing struggle with the complains, that's ahead on "inside story".
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welcome back to "inside story" on al jazeera america. i'm ray suarez. we are looking at the war against i.s.i.l. and jordan adds role in it. in the days after the islamic state of iraq and levant released a video of the killing of a jordinnian pilot -- jordanian pilot moaz al-kasasbeh. jordan worked hard that the country is united and aggressively moving against i.s.i.l. the winds of conflict have been blowing through jordan. there's large numbers that have had ranks swirled by desperate people fleeing the fighting in syria. according to the high commission for refugees in 2014 there were more than 23,000 refugees
from iraq in jordan 1.4 million from syria, and from other places. >> professor christopher swift are with me. does everyone want to see the same thing when the smoke clears. you have all the countries in the region joined in the notion that i.s.i.l. has to go but are they locking at the same thing when the war is over. >> that's a good question. that is one of the biggest dilemmas with the sustainability of the coalition, all the parties have different interests. the only thing uniting them is the dislike and determination to get rid of i.s.i.l. the united states brought the coalition together and needed the sunni arab partners for the political cover to show and it is true that it's not just america's war. this is a universal threat to everyone in the region with
spillover effects affecting the neighbourhood. that said that's where things fall apart and syria is the weakest link in the strategy. what you find is for a lot of coalition partners getting rid of asaad is the highest priority. for the states at the moment getting rid of i.s.i.l. and al qaeda linked groups posing a threat to u.s. center. interest. it's our top priority and not that we don't want bashar al-assad to go but we are concerned with the overthrow, with no plan b in place. quickly, very quickly, when the war is over what does jordan need in terms of regional security? >> jordan foremost really needs stability. jordan needs i.s.i.s. contained, preferable
preferably it would pref it goes, but like the united states it's concerned with i.s.i.s. and instability. it needs the cop nilent to end, and turn the refugees in jordan. i think it's the second-largest in the world. enormous stress. jordan needs the conflict to end so refugees can return. they can reduce the threat of i.s.i.s. that's ultimately the end game. for others turkey saudis getting rid of assad is where you see the strains of united states interest. we heard from the jordanian interest he was looking at iraq and a need for the permanent solution to the unrest there. >> he was.
and you understand why. look prior to the start of the syrian civil war, there was an assumption that syria would remain a unity undifferentiated state. and the bashar al-assad regime as distasteful as it was, could control things inside. after the united states left iraq. similar assumptions were made. we have seen both prove untrue. we see fragmentation politically, ethnically within the societies tear them apart. as the fragment cakes within the society occurs. it is also starting to occur. my colleague correctly noted an influence in southern and eastern jordan. that's the economic dislocation from indigenous tribes. and the population that competes for jobs resources, water and services. all of these things - you lay
them on top of one another, and you get a level of complexity that we have not seen in the region in decades. add on top of that the break down of institutions and assumptions that used to govern that part of the world over the space of 50 or 60 years, and you have a dynamic and unsettling situation. jordan could be next and i.s.i.s.'s desire is that jordan be next. >> thank you both. that's all for this edition of "inside story". we want you to talk back to your television visit our facebook page and give us feedback. we invite you to follow us on twitter. or follow me and get in touch. see you next time in washington. i'm ray suarez.
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