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tv   Rokhaya Diallo  Al Jazeera  February 18, 2018 10:32pm-11:01pm +03

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iran's leader ayatollah ali harman i has launched an investigation after an awesome on our lines flight crashed killing all sixty five people on board the owners of yet another was appeared from radar after leaving the capital to iran. syrian kodesh try to say they reached an agreement with the damascus government for the syrian army to enter the are free region to help repel the turkish offensive turkey launched operation all of branch last month to clear our freeing of kurdish y p g fighters who they regard as terrorists linked to the p.k. k. and u.s. president donald trump has criticized the f.b.i. for failing to investigate the suspect in wednesday's school shooting seventeen people died when a gunman opened fire on a high school in florida the f.b.i. admitted on friday that agents failed to investigate a tip off about nicholas cruz. who had bought the gun used in the shooting illegally president trump said the f.b.i. was spending too much time investigating allegations of collusion with russia during the twenty sixteen election campaign as the headlines talked to our next
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i'll see you after that in about half an hour's time. michael. you can. see. is a french activist feminist filmmaker and writer a long time anti racism campaigner she has found herself at the center of a debate about racism and free speech in fraud's last year she was forced to step down from the government's digital council an incident that only served to
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reinforce hope belief that france has a problem with state sponsored racism today on talk to al-jazeera we discuss the social issues she's fighting to push toward france's agenda and whether she's hopeful the country can bring its people together. a cardiologist thank you for talking to al-jazeera and now first i want to start off with the fact that you were one of the two people appointed to this french digital council it is a committee that advises the government on digital affairs but you were all asked to step down why actually the government was asked by people who disagree with my views to evict me from from the council. and i was not even asked by the government to step out of the government issued a statement to say that he asked the head of the digital to make me go away from it the fact that i was talking stage races on state sponsored racism and i was
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supporting muslim women who wanted to wear the hijab if they wanted to and. many it was basically was that yes those views the way i phrased my views on the receiving of an image is an inference inference. so i want to talk to you about that because as you say one of the main complaints that people had against those who actually austria to be force of this council was the fact that you've talked about state racism what is state races and few are you saying that the french stated institutions of racist i'm saying that the french institutions produce racism in france if you are perceived as an arab or as a black person you are twenty times more likely to be checked if you are a man than any any other category of the populations meaning that the police is overcontrolling a category of the population and the police is an institution of a different from rick and you have several examples of institutions being or having
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different ways of tweeting treat treating some people or because of their race i can also mention the fact that in france was to have overseas territories that used to be colonies and and now our friends. in those departments you can use search and account of the sites and you can spread them over those territories which is bound in the french mainland so to me given the fact that those. islands and territories are most people created by people of color is mean that you have a difference of treatment between a need of them from people who live in the mainland who are mostly white and french people who live in those territories. just to pick up the point about the police i mean it could be that there are certain people within the police force who are racist perhaps our racism and in the police force but does that necessarily mean
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that the state is supporting them i mean you saying that the state is actively promoting and supporting racism the fact is that the supreme court in france sentenced to stage four. for racial profiling. to defend itself the state say that those profiling that were focused mainly on black blacks and arabs were just defied so the state doesn't even deny the fact that the police is overcontrolling black people and arab people or mostly men so to me that means that there is nothing that is done to prevent that and france has been also sent in several times by the european court of human rights because of that and many institutions after i call that do you. know rights watch international saying that france isn't doing anything to protect. its citizens of
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color from police brutality and from pretties for fighting so what about the french people i mean to make a difference between institutionalized state racism and the french public all the french public places because i'm part of the french public as a friend first and so when i say that there is reason from different institution i'm not saying that all the french people i received i get i'm just saying that the state should implement measures to stop that how about you in your personal experience because you are the daughter of african parents you are woman you are muslim but you are often in mainstream media you often contribute to television to radio you are a french personality what is your experience been i mean have you managed to navigate this system in france how the. dunnit i feel like i'm an exception because issue what's different should be you don't see that many faces looking like mine
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and today i really consider that i have a privilege and i try to use that privilege to tackle racism because i know that many of my fil a french citizen one that's white doesn't have i'm not as a maccie as i am and they don't have the means to be vocal and to make public statements the kind of this meant that they used to make public and i have a feeling that being a black woman and the black muslim woman i don't have the right to say as much as. as other people who are there because well because when whenever i start to speak about racism in the way i do i have much backlash so let's talk a bit now about france's new president a man womack or do you think in some way things might change because from the outside at least it seems as if he might have a more inclusive vision of france. i think that he does have
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a more inclusive vision of france because he belongs to a different generations compared to the former president so the way he sees friends is actually very different from the people from the former generations because he's used to see friends with you know a diverse face but the other thing is that he was part of the previous government so what is implementing now is not that different from what was started before as he was the minister of finance. the other thing is that we used to be under a state of emergency for two years from two thousand and fifteen and two thousand and seventeen and. pushed a new load to replace the state of emergency but to me it was just. many zation of the state of emergency because the state of emergency elos. the police to have powers that it doesn't have out of that state of emergency and it's really reduces
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the power of the judges to me that doesn't work just create the feeling among a lot of deliberation that they don't belong so if the state of emergency perhaps isn't the signal that you would have liked to have seen if it wasn't cancelled could you not say they're going back to man or mark or the whether you agree them or not he has instituted the sort of change that you've actually been talking about in some ways because you have the national assembly which now has made up of many health women people from civil society people from diverse backgrounds people very much like yourself is not known changes that move in the right direction it's a very very good move so there are thirty nine percent of women. as well as a rally which is not how often but quite much as. it was before you have many. who are people have. who are from who i mentioned earlier than the former engineer ation so that's a very average age as drop down and it's
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a very very good move but if you are the government to move in that as good as it was before the only doubt only two people of color in the government one is the minister of course and the other one was the one who asked me to resign from the. and he's not he's not the most important member of the government that's would have been very important to have someone holding a very important and. but still it's it's a new generation who is who has the power and that's something i can definitely be happy about so let's move on to that very very french concept of secularism it's called like you see in france and to is it's so it's a way of life in a way for the french state it's all about trying to make sure that religion has no influence in government and schools and institutions in hospitals france has very
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strict secular laws what do you think about. i think it's a very very good principle that say that there is a separation between religion and state and that different republican public is supporting the freedom of religion and freedom of consciousness meaning that you can believe or not believe you will be supported in your freedom by the government so that that's a very very good thing on the paper so one of france's best known secular laws forbids people to wear any visible very visible religious symbols so such as keep this fails crosses in state institutions so they can't wear them in schools they can't wear them in hospitals what you think about that i know you've been quite vocal on this point yes the thing is to me that will ease an exemption to the principle of place to do it so the law of two thousand and four. the religious signs in schools for students the principal of race day says that if you are public
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servant you don't you cannot show in the end display in the religious symbol which makes sense but if you are a user of a pulitzer you're not supposed to be neutral so it was a case for all the public services until two thousand and four which made which made an exception with school so now as a user of school you have to be neutral as if you were if you were a public servant when i was not the principal i place it in the more it's so low but we had to go to a new low to be added to the law that started the principle of placing it in one thousand or five because just that law didn't illo that you know to me school is a place where you can learn about diversity and it's important that the teacher. show neutrality display neutrality but the students don't have to be to be bound by such measures because they're not actually done they're not in contract with the
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state i mean the french state would say that all of those children should be seen as equal they should be nothing visible the might mock one child out from another so do you think that in principle is a good idea or not it is beautiful but the reality is quite different and it. wasn't the head of schools in a very very strange. place because they have to guess the religion of searching students because if a black student wears a headscarf is it religious is its cultural have been controversy. because of some students who were there he job out of school they put it out when they go to school but they have long. skirts and some head of schools and of high
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schools especially said that it was a religious skirt so you would interpret discouraged as being religious because you know that this year it is muslim but if another one has not missed me wear the same skirt is not a problem anymore and to me that doesn't francies is just a way for this you just to learn to live through to live together. the whole conversation in fronts around the veil has also become very much. linked to women's rights you hear government ministers people in the public often talk about the violence say that it is an erosion of women's rights and therefore facts is reason to ban it in school what do you think about that and i think that the first ride that the women have is to do whatever she wants to do with her body so if you want to cover your body you should be free to do so and inch you don't want to cover to cover your body you shouldn't be forced to do so and you should be supported in
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having the right of removing it's you know the head scarf or whatever covers it. it's really it's a very posh revising way of seeing women saying that ok we have a way. we see freedom means being dressed in that way and we would have to muslim women to understand that freedom is uncovering and we will even force you to uncover to make you understand that all feminism is right that it's very ethnocentric and very patronising often isn't to me because we are cruel you said that i was muslim i don't cover myself but i don't want everybody to look like me i can totally understand that some women in my family would like to cover and we are belonging to the same time media who are still missing and i don't want to. criticize them because they are they have their own we are as women all right so let's talk about feminism now because you have written extensively and you talk
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a lot about women's rights you campaign a lot for women's rights we have seen recently a huge global movement against sexual harassment the women's movement the need to campaign on social media what have you thought about that is that is that progress yes to me it's a major progress it's even according to. turning point. because women used to try to say and to be vocal about the harassment that they are exposed to every day the fact that they have. rounded by. men who think that they can. they can. access to their body in the way they want they can pressure them to use the way the fact that there are women to gain some favors. and it was not something that was very public it was something that women used to
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speak about together in a behind closed door but it was not in the door sorry but it was not public in front there was a letter written i'm sure you're familiar with a. newspaper one of the main newspapers here in france it was signed by a hundred prominent french women including the movie actress catherine deneuve and this letter basically said to me to campaign and this this women's movement against sexual harassment was in a way puritanical and men should be allowed to make sexual sexual advances on women why not for them they said women on victims we are strong is that not another brand of feminism i'm not sure about the fact that even claim feminism because that tax was pertaining the right for the men to bugger women i don't know have you come how you can say that and at the same time say that you defend women so i remember that the text mentioned men who molested women in the in the in the in the
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ways it's been something very commonly in friends who have men they're using the fact that they can have to do with women to just with their body close to them and they said that to some women it was not even an event. the first thing is that i don't. the in the french material so i don't think that she knows what she speaks about and the other thing is that how can you say that it's not an event having a mind that you've never seen in your life putting his body on you and not being not being able to scream because you're afraid because there are too many people because you shocked you in shock so to me it's a very conservative backlash and it would even if you have a look on the list of the women you will see that they are mostly from or another generation i've just got a few more things to ask you in there about some of the things that you've spoken about in the past you wrote in the huffington post in twenty fifteen it was an
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article about immigration exotic about refugees it was the height of the refugee crisis in europe and you said i'm ashamed to live on a continent where the immigration policy consists of building walls where money spent on barricades instead of investing in human destiny that was back in twenty fifteen are you still ashamed to live in europe and why i am because. i have seen what happened in thailand i have seen. immigrants living in the streets even in my neighborhood in paris police officers coming destroying terence stopping preventing n.g.o.s from giving water to young people. it's it's unacceptable it's unacceptable to know that the e.u. is spending much more money on barricades. and supporting people from other countries. just to make a living i have seen
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a woman delivering her baby in the streets in paris a young woman from africa france has never been as well coming as germany when i compare france or germany i can see that there is a problem because we do we have never consider. opening the borders to people from syria or from countries out there are at war and where people really need to get asylum from you talked about germany germany sweden there are countries that of done a lot to help refugees so in a sense when you say you are ashamed to live on this continent i mean those are european countries i think that there are several different policies in europe and some countries are much more when coming in and friends even in threat even if science has been for a long time a country of immigration i want to ask you one one last thing about something that you have said before i mean it's quite complex there was this this outcry here in
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paris the afro feminists collective it's an organization it had a festival in paris they organized some workshops some of them were prohibited to north african women others were open and there was a big outcry at the time because it was seen that white french people were being banned from these workshops i read the you said the north african women asian women were also not so loud. but whoever was most into loud isn't it still some form of segregation you know because segregation is something that comes from the state and that really instore account of the hierarchy so saying that there are people who have moved more value that other people those workshops where men for black women just to meet and to speak about their issues for a couple of harris that doesn't threaten anything regarding the low it's just a space where black women can speak about the issue that can be discrimination that
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they are facing the very specific discrimination that they're fifteen as black women you have some other activities that would be open to all women of color because as a woman of color you don't experience the same kind of racism as men of color and as white people definitely so it's led to me is not a threat and i was kind of surprised by the attention that's more offensive or gained because in paris for example there is a place that is called. club which is a very wealthy place where rich men can. gather and meet together and it's not a load for women to go there so if me as a woman i want to use their pool i wouldn't be i would be banned but there is a difference between excluding people and prohibiting them from going to an organization a club or a meeting and holding
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a meeting and assuming that people might come along i mean there is a difference between saying you are not welcome. in the same way that the automobile club that you mention. it's obviously something i imagine that you don't admire the fact that women are excluded the fact that they reserve band on a certain type of person or gender whatever it might be is something that you would normally support so why is it different in this case because it's made you made. people who don't have many spaces to express themselves to have for once one space to express themselves without being interrupted without having people doubt tim of the time that there are exposed to discriminations to choose mockeries even if even sometimes it's something that is temporary it's just having a couple of hours to speak about you know how it how it is to be a black woman in france and it's something that you can do with someone who is not a black woman but is not a project of geisha in for the for the french
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a society something that they were they would live to be in store for ever. i understand that but why ban the why prohibit people from coming you can have that meeting there's no reason for a group of african women not to meet together and talk i mean most people probably wouldn't want to go to that meeting unless they had an interest to go to that meeting so why say to some people who aren't african who want women you are not welcome if you are a woman you have been exposed to sexual harassment to even two rapes you know that the conversation between women who have been explored exposed to sexual assault or we've not been the same if there is a man in man in the room is not excluding the man is a lowing the women to express themself themselves freely because there are some topics that you cannot speak comfortably about if there are some people who are not affected by the issue. you your brain sing ok so just find the requirement
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looking for it i mean how do you feel about the state of france because there is a lot of concern i'm hearing a lot of concern what about the future is there any hope yes i really think that there is hope if i had i was not hopeful i wouldn't be an activist and i wouldn't try to work on those issues so i'm sure that there is much hope there is a new generation that is coming who are starting to be vocal to to raise awareness on issues that didn't used to be mainstream before so the fact that we are speaking this who have as hear about friends and race me as a black human being in the black square back in the issues even if it's not easy every day to me it's a sign of change and i'm really hopeful about the future. all right thank you very much thanks for talking to her resume as a patient. in the. bar
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was always telling me how famous he was going to make that's how he presented hello my name and body without consciousness it is northwest representatives kind of. put it for. us in georgia member that we had the special meeting about the nail and he said you know i'm sure that's not the topic and you immediately this is a cover you have used only one man city yet al-jazeera investigations football's world of silence this time.
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in the foreign ministry. paint the scene for us whether online what is a parent sending young men to peace is always possible but it never happens not because the situation is complicated but because no one cares or if you join us on sat there people the choosing between buying another cliche and eating this is a dialogue i want to get in one more comment because this is someone who's an
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activist and has posted a story join the global conversation at this time on al-jazeera on counting the cost will talk to i.m.f. chief christine lagarde about how the economic model is changing here in the middle east can iran break regs it find out how the emerald isle is caught in the middle of a big round between the u.k. and the e.u. plus the year of the dog in china counting the cost at this time. hello i'm in london here's a quick look at the top stories on al-jazeera as prime minister is delivered a theatrical flourish and weathering attack on iran at the end of a major security conference in munich in return iran's foreign minister for back accusing benjamin netanyahu of delusional thinking they have a traitor reports from you nick.


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