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tv   Up Front 2019 Ep 14  Al Jazeera  November 18, 2019 11:32am-12:01pm +03

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mr bombings bolivians are facing food and fuel shortages supporters of the former president evo morales continue to block roads the new interim government says it's created a so-called air bridge to the main city the pas that is military planes delivering supplies morales resigned and fled to mexico after winning an election many believe was actually rigged and haiti's president of an illinois says he is holding talks to form a unity government moyes says his country needs international support after 2 months of anti-government protests made haiti's dire humanitarian situation even worse there is widespread anger of a high inflation crime and allegations of corruption haiti's been without a functioning government since march you're up to date with the headlines on al-jazeera up front with what the house sun is coming up next. the minister. should do to the british on the 31st of october
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and leave this country the greatest place on earth pretty much it is still a long haul who would drama the brick sit on al-jazeera has the world forgotten the people of kashmir i'll ask a spokesman for india's b j p government why millions there are still under lockdown ily. ily. ily. ily. i made the house an bolivia's president evo morales was forced to resign from office and fled to mexico after a disputed election and pressure from the military was a coup that's our debate but 1st the b j p government in india is no stranger to controversy this week it welcomed the supreme court decision authorizing the construction of a hindu temple on the site of a demolished mosque what prime minister narendra modi's brutal lockdown of kashmir
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is now more than 100 days old so what happened to human rights and the rule of law in the world's biggest democracy this week's headline from new delhi b j p national spokesperson. the e.u. . governor of battier welcome to up front you are the national spokes person for the ruling b j p party in india the party you speak for has been in power now for more than 5 years it governs what many call the largest democracy on earth would you say that india today is still a liberal secular democracy one that respects the rule of law and guarantees rights dignity equality to all of its citizens. absolutely i'm sure that even you wouldn't . want to buy their own. that is a constitution and this document a strong leadership role i don't but maybe in a book and then also a supreme court which is one of the must read institution with the country right
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and show us that fundamental rights for peace it doesn't. you know. you can do this it doesn't and it does and that's good to hear so how then do you explain that in august of this year your government suspended the freedom of movement of more than 8000000 of its own citizens cut off the internet and telephone access for more than 2 months arbitrary detained thousands of them from elected politicians to school kids i'm talking of course about the lockdown in indian administered kashmir since august the 5th which other democracy on earth treats its own citizens in this way. so i do tell you even thought of a mission. to stephen taken by name but i'm with. article 27 and it wasn't about of the consequent assembly that give us the question you should have ended up when i was. in fact it starts with. a lot and
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i started to seem has taken. you i thought in stride be serious. and. do it so. that you have. never got. under the constitution and getting the statutes that demand them out i'll just you know what i mean when you're talking about some connections connections and once. you are let's see i've been to step up. i'm going to. just in the i'm going in the station with him about how do. you argue the rights and wrongs of article $370.00 which gave jammu and kashmir the special status under the indian constitution but what we're talking about is what the united nations'
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own human rights experts have called collective punishment un human rights experts from the us from front from canada from togo they said in august and i quote the blackout is a form of collective punishment of the people of jammu and kashmir without even a pretext of a precipitating offense and multiple human rights groups agree with them i was there under the supreme. just a minute i think they're worse than anybody even i bet if you're honest about it and if you should. be if you're not the man i let you go with this season but not that well at the on going supreme court i just wish that well is that you know that and it sounds better in st louis the cast about being. a human life is just i had the biggest sponsor that not that i can do you know that
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at least one thing on your program but not a single meet i just lost his life don't go to. the i mean i'll be released and get went. because i'm such a beast that some of the biggest mediums i've lost you know a lot because they have been dogged by the exchange missed being played by the i didn't i was not in the movie and the united nation well i'm sorry but this time is something that i have a good pastor you're not against it ok governor of budget in a democracy nobody should be above the law i think you and i can both agree on that and yet india has called the laws which allow security forces to kill with what united nations investigators have called impunity they say there are virtually impunity against prosecution for any human rights violation 2 in the nearly 28 years that your laws have been in force this is what the u.n. says there's not been a single prosecution of armed forces personnel for alleged extra judicial killings
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rape in false disappearances why haven't you prosecuted any soldiers who are accused of these crimes so that if i start you know that our army is the most disciplined i mean hard i just. wish him well how does. that feel to you what i would like you wouldn't question. ok so now 0. since i'm not so much you know i. can go look at supreme. court and. i and investigation was ordered on it so i got you know in my eyes this is. when i just used excessive force. and people are being secured an investigation was done so i think. ok we're running out of time i do want to move
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on to other bigger issues one last question on kashmir you say that it's a matter of national security you talk about terrorism you talk about protecting people's lives but you're not just arresting people there who are violent are you you have detained without trial without charge 3 former indian chief ministers of what you once called the indian state of jammu and kashmir one of them is mehbooba mufti who is in coalition with your party the b j p until just last year but now suddenly she's locked up as well. so by the interest of time i think you'll agree that. i mean this you know i do care not. because i don't but i want to do shit even though i think the freedom of speech and expression comes through that i got got to be against the jurisdiction going. to stop a surrender i'm going to. tell the chief minister.
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of the constitution that human. constitutional began its history. she said i don't even. i think. that's i'm not sure i think it is highly inflammatory yet is a lot of that come and go of you could have come on going you and i both know indian politicians including yourself say lots of inflammatory statements she's being detained without charge why not try to then put on trial you have detained without charge you have detained 3 former chief ministers democracies are not supposed to detain people without charge or without a trial. let me extend your. arm and then. i really just told. you. i don't.
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understand i didn't prove a 100 on the charge and asked you without charge but without charges to clarify for our viewers without charge yes or no. i didn't push it but if you don't charge right you can hold someone without charge. you're a lawyer you know the importance of that statement no you said i'm wrong what am i wrong about is she being held without charge it's a very simple question i wish you the columns i don't. think. i've understood. and now do you believe. that i could. show that. it should be true. and. so i ask you right isn't. that the last 3 months and. any are. reasons
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even as early as this that. you are not bothered about. are you holding 3 former chief ministers without charge or trial yes or no. was. anybody wrong. that's pretty. good you did not see my question are they being held without charge or trial yes or no if your word you don't need one sentence yes or no. i'm saying i'm saying. which child has been charged so they have been charged it's hard to understand and yes it's a very controversial because it allows you to detain people without charge or trial that's why it's. stuck stuck on sanchez. and. he was that.
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ok i can remember that ok this week india's supreme court ruled that the location in the holy city of iowa idea where a centuries old mosque was torn down by mobs in 1902 could now be replaced with a hindu temple and local muslims could be given land elsewhere to build a mosque it's also believed to be the birthplace of the hindu god rama of course do you agree with that verdict from the supreme court did you welcome it yes absolutely welcomed. so do you agree with the supremes court that the destruction of the barbary mosque in iowa the a by hindu nationalist mobs in 1902 was quote an egregious violation of the rule of law you agree with your. judgment and. isn't and you know quick just. judgement.
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yes so do you have agree with the supreme court verdict that the mob which tore down the mosque in 1900 many of them members of the v h p and other hindu nationalist groups they committed quote any greediness violation of the rule of law you agree with the honorable supreme court which you've been praising throughout this interview says that you agree with the. supreme court because the. cost him dearly great the mosque demolition was an egregious violation of the rule of law you keep telling me the supremes court is amazing in your country do you agree with the supreme court yes or no i think the supreme court judgment. you are. asked. i don't want this list i know. you're not a mask and gore of i'm asking a simple question the court also said that the demolition of the mosque by mobs in 1902 was an egregious violation of the rule of law do you welcome that or are you
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cherry picking from the verdict. i believe. i did. ok. i'll. let. justice ok that's good to hear i'm glad to hear you say you welcome it because the bump that tore down the mosque in 1 december 1902 was was was at a rally just for all of us to know it was a rally organized according to a government commission by the right wing hindu nationalist group the v.h.d. leaders of the b j p spoke at that rally so people allies of yours members of your party were involved according to the supreme court verdict in an egregious crime is not the case according to the supreme court. you know you. just asked me about rather yes i do i want to ask you about one of the findings and you want on some me which i think the viewers can make up their mind why as to why you don't want to answer me one last question i'll ask you on this subject is there
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a danger that the supreme court ruling sets a worrying precedent for india that mobs can now ted down other mosques and say that was a temple there and the supreme court will back us up one of your m.p.'s last year said that the knowledge of the hollow should be converted into a temple also is the taj mahal next as well. and show us. what should be changed there is an island you. mentioned. i think it was a street justice was also good for the members of the muslim community. and. diversity. ok. and do you condemn then you'll be g.o.p. colleagues who said last year that the whole will also be converted into the monday or soon do you condemn him for saying that. well the i mean we could get exactly
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you. like that again but i want and your c.b.s. oxman i agree with you which is why i've invited you on the show and i'm saying why not condemn this member of your party who was a former vice president of your party who said that dodgeball will be converted into theater when there soon. so. just show you that it is like i said and i was looking. a lot that. i didn't bow to static and very very light shows which garavaglia thank you for joining me on front thank you. eve overall is was once one of latin america's most popular presidents an indigenous union leader who introduced sweeping social reforms 'd and economic growth to bolivia but after a controversial round of elections last month followed by violent protests and
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pressure from his own military where all this was forced to resign and flee to mexico so is his resignation a triumph for democracy and people power were the product of a military coup joining me to debate this a mark weisbrot co-director of the center for economic and policy research who's been writing of bolivia for more than a decade and invesco is director of the center for global liberty and prosperity at the cato institute and also an expert on latin america thank you both for joining me in the arena thanks mate i think it let's start with you is it fair to describe the resignation of as a coup no not by any stretch of the imagination let's remember how he got here this election was illegal to begin with the constitution bolivia does not a allow a 2nd reelection for the president and so in 2016 the president actually had a referendum to change the constitution and the population voted no he decided to neglect. paying attention to that and went ahead and had his compliant
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constitutional tribunals issue decree. judgment that allowed him to run against his own very constitution and so that made people in bolivia very upset obviously because it's undemocratic and so when he ran here he was losing and as the vote. we're being tallied he was behind and this meant that we had to go the 2nd round he was about he was leading but he wasn't needed by the 10 percent you needed that's right but there was a boy to run it was divided it avoiding a runoff and so. without any explanation they stopped reporting the results and then 24 hours later he had just about half of a percentage point he reversed the tendencies at the last minute and this is something that international observers including the organization of american states viewed as fraudulent in a very in a very detailed review of what happened there mark. well i think that's
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a very simple question when the military tells a sitting democratically elected president that he has to resign and i think in made a little bit of a mistake because he was trying to say that because. he doesn't agree with evil running for a 4th term that you know he's not it he's not a legitimate president even if you agree with that even if i were to agree with that position which i don't because i think the highest court is the law of the land just like in the united states. the fact is nobody disputes that he is right now a democratically elected president until his term ends in january so just deal with the point that in raised about the sudden change in the vote people have told the oas the organization american states published what many believe to be a damning report questioning the integrity of the october 20th election they said
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there was quote clear manipulation and quote serious security flaws you reject that report why it's very simple actually the o.e.s. expressed surprise and doubts about that process that you described where the election was interrupted and he came back with a higher margin at 95 percent of the vote counted then he had at 83 percent of the. of the results reported ok and there actually was nothing suspicious about that at all because if you look at the data you can see that there was not a jump in his margin it was a steady trend from almost the beginning of the reporting of the results and it was for a very simple reason the reason is that the later reporting areas the ones that reported their vote results later were much more able than the earlier
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ones i think the oas misrepresented it deliberately because they said it 3 times they never offered any evidence of that story even in the final even in their preliminary audit report which is the one you referred to. offer any evidence for that is their argument let him respond to a report is a very detailed 13 page single spaced report where they find a lot of problems with manipulation including breaches of security so much that they can't even be confident of the results that were reported. problems with tampering with the tally sheets forge city. here's tallies that that have more people voting than were actually registered there and they do a good detailed statistical analysis that shows that after they stopped the reporting the voting which is very untransparent they had other people apparently an unnamed person. go into that a base and start putting in some of those new tallies and all of a sudden the spike that reversed the tendencies in the last for that if all sort of
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sense are you can end it all and that and you look at the reform of that vote does talk about and where not just for example by the way the data issue is to just i think that's true in every election there's something there are regulars the only us is not neutral here and they've done this before in haiti in 2011 in haiti in 2000 they put their finger on the scale of these reports and the some small bits not just the is it for example the companies in bolivia that were charged with counting the votes the manager of the company neo-tech says they were invited actions they say that they got a phone call from the electoral tribunal on the night of the 20th telling them to suspend the publication themselves because i don't like none of so there's a lot of the chairs are that ok this very important is a boat is not a pretty dodgy 1st of all you will not find in the hundreds of articles and you will not find one expert saying that story was true that they somehow manipulated the vote count between the 84 percent report as i saw in the 5 and then
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went on the so i wasn't i'm asking was there are you saying there was a phone call from a member of the electoral tribunal no idea and that will turn any of the allegations pretty fun but they're pretty damning allegations that were only together true good for you a lot of a lot of any allegation that it's ok but i'm saying that you have a story here that's been repeated every day in the media and mobile i'm going to be yours julian away yes what i'm saying is not just the oh yeah but that you know anybody can say anything but where's the evidence ok let me ask you this question by the way the electoral council also hired in the senate are they came to the same conclusions that's the government let me ask you this question how do you explain the fact that if it's all about you know the election being tainted the 1st round not being properly counted even more all this. a bit of the days after the election but did sit down and say you know what we'll allow in the u.n. to check this will rerun the 1st round we will try and come to an agreement that avoids violence and for the protests and that is your position who walked away and said no we don't want to do it why if they go if they think they're winning why not
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allow the u.n. to come in and manage a rather rerun because they didn't consider him to be legitimately running to begin with they consider one of the least of that they really want to elect because that that you can't have it both ways we're going to run against you the moment actually that happens all the time president say it happens all the time to the bigger regimes maybe not i'm not in control of what they do but that happens all the time remember this happens in the context of a regime that has become increasingly authoritarian denounced by international human rights groups like human human rights watch international press groups that denounce the the kind of actions that against journalists that are arbitrarily jailed people are fed up with the violations of democracy hit turned into and talk or see and the military will not repress the population response by any means this is. a very the way they're not involved in the in the new government doesn't have enough of it that's a very good point you made the military 1st of all the military was involved
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because they told them to step down but the point you made was i think was very important that this whole question of the latest election has become moot because of all me the excepted the recommendations of the oas for a new election and a new electoral council but the opposition wanted a coup and so that's what they've got a lot of people are worried about the far right in places like bolivia you have a new senate you have senator sorry who just declared herself the president of the country on what grounds is she the president the country she also turned up at the palace with a bible saying i'm bringing the bible back to the presidential palace which many people see as a dig at indigenous communities all of the top people in government the previous government resigned and created a vacuum she has stepped up because she's the one that was it wise i heard to say that god has allowed the body. to come back into the presidential no i don't think so but for the other opposition me the last time i should just say i don't stand in front of an image of the virgin mary with a rosary in his right i don't think so but but you know on sunday nights in the country is no i don't think so i don't think we should be focusing i think they said they need to be focusing on setting up the next elections and getting
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a consensus about setting up a new legitimate democratic government is in mexico he says he will return do you think he will yeah i think he will i mean look there's been violent attempts to overthrow this government by the right for quite some time they tried in 2008 and the reason they don't have. believe he doesn't have ambassadorial relations with the united states is because the u.s. supported those violent movements and so they broke their ambassadorial relations so this is a very classic i mean it's not that different from the united states intervening in many other countries in latin america not just in the 21st century this is the story of an authoritarian regime that people in bolivia got sick of and they did what they could to get their democracy back the military didn't decided not to repress them and now they're having an interim government to restore democracy finally after many years i have to leave it there. thank you both for joining me up front that's our show up front will be back next week.
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capturing a moment in time. snapshots of all the lives. of the stories. providing the clips into someone else's what. they. do day or. inspiring documentaries from impassioned filmmakers. witness on al-jazeera the british iraqi journalist who's visualizing complex statistics and a simple. i think as a summary sites of opportunities to break apart from those systems of power and she collects in a way that made so represents a different community challenging mainstream misconceptions and hope that by
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creating 100 instructions it doesn't alienate people it doesn't make people feel like i'm not smart enough to understand this truth is it anyway on al-jazeera. constitutional a hong kong court rules against a ban on face masks amid a violent standoff between police and protesters at the university. of utah harbor when i'm come on santa maria this is the world news from al jazeera iran's president condemns protests over the rise of petrol prices but says poor families will start to see some benefits also protests outside of a court in barcelona as the regional leader goes on trial.


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