tv Up Front 2019 Ep 18 Al Jazeera December 16, 2019 11:32am-12:01pm +03
in the southern philippines rescue is a searching for survivors after the magnitude 6.9 quake hit the island of mindanao the region still recovering from earth quakes back in october amnesty international says iran's government is carrying out a vicious crackdown in response to nationwide protests on november 15th it says in a report at least 304 people have been killed and thousands more injured and it is supreme court is due to hear petitions on wednesday which challenge the controversial new citizenship. anger over the legislation has now spread to college campuses the new measure office citizenship to persecuted minorities from some neighboring countries but excludes muslims up to date with the headlines on al-jazeera up front with my son is up next tool to al-jazeera we were told. to ration has been addressed by we listen what.
we meet with global news makers and talk about the stories that matter. he's the nobel peace prize winner who's also accused of covering up war crimes i'll challenge former colombian president juan manuel santos and we'll also discuss his fellow nobel peace laureate aung sang suu kyi who's been defending her government against accusations of genocide this week at the hague. one manuel santos former president of colombia thank you for joining me on up front your country is the latest in latin america to be the scene of anti-government protests we're now 3 weeks into these demonstrations where hundreds of thousands of
people have taken to the streets the president has declared the 1st curfew in bogota in nearly 4 decades he's put the military on the streets at least one protester has been killed dozens injured given you recently suggested that the chilean government has overreacted to the protests there do you think your country's government you think colombia has overreacted as well. yes declaring a curfew over reacted. on the street. in my opinion. over reaction when people are going out to protest in colombia they're protesting mainly because of corruption issues because of income inequality those are not overnight developments are they you left the presidency just 16 months ago after 8 years in power a period in which colombia remained one of the most corrupt and unequal countries in the world so a lot of this discontent is all new is it not. known we made
tremendous advance. fight against corruption. measures that we. took. day after day month after month year after year you can see that we advanced tremendously in the fight against corruption i even presumably co-chaired the world summit the 1st world summit that was held in london against corruption and on the multilateral at the end reduced. our knowledge tried to we have had a good you say that. but transparency international to recognise transparency international says your country fell in spots from 78 to 99 on your watch between 2012820 ranks in the transparency international corruption league about blue there is
a very very clear explanation about that because we took measures like for example every single contract that the government signed must be made public and so we were able to take corruption out of the secrecy it had been for many many decades and people started to see the corruption that was there for a long time so the perception yes the perception of corruption increased but precisely because of the measures that we took of course globally you are best known for securing the peace agreement with the marxist fock rebels that ended 50 years of civil war in your country in which you were awarded the nobel peace prize 3 years ago but today the current colombian president even decay is dismantling parts of that agreement while a prominent thought commander who helped negotiate it with you even marquez now says it's time for a new struggle so is your deal dead and did you get the peace prize too soon.
no it's not dead on the contrary as the commander of the farkas said 95 percent or more of the people who be mobilized are with the agreement there comply with the agreement the agreement. was very successful after less than a year what he called the d.d.r. demobilization disarmament and reintegration had already been finished. the challenge here is that dissent agreement has been the most comprehensive and the most ambitious agreement ever negotiated anywhere in any country and we are struggling and doing the best to fulfill it what we agreed to go don't worry when you hear even marc has a fox say in august in a video that it's time for a new phase of the armed struggle that of them are you. you know it doesn't worry me because he has no people that are behind him he went to for reasons that
everybody knows he was accused of beating of committing crimes after the signature of the rayment and it doesn't worry me no and since the far left that territories in the south under the terms of your deal hundreds of indigenous and left activists and civilians have been killed by paramilitary forces by other rebel groups that's not what peace is supposed to look like is that hundreds of people dead nobody promised that colombia would be a paradise after the signature that peace there is always in every peace process it backlash and we are suffering that backlash the drug trafficking which is not colombia's fault the fault of the world the demand in the united states in europe the drug trafficking continues and the drug traffickers were very worried precisely because one of the points of the agreement was to stimulate the voluntary situation
of coca plantations for legal plantation and they would run out of raw material and so they have been killing some of the promoters of these. running terry substitution also we have been we were very aggressive in giving the land back to the peasants that was taken away because of the violence and maybe some of the landowners apparent terese and drug traffickers who took illegally this nad were very worried that the process room eventually get to them and take their land away so there are various sources of these murders and the government has a big responsibility here on stopping them because any government must stop any kind of assassination with the benefit of hindsight. do you regret the way you tried to formalize the peace deal with the fog 1st pushing it in
a referendum that you narrowly lost in 2016 and then pushing it through the legislature without public approval in a referendum some would say you open the door to the current colombian president's anti peace deal platform by doing it in that way i followed our question to should and our constitutional court said if you lose the referendum don't go back to the people the traditional and established procedure in the cross to do should that was a ruling over the course of your record and that it is exacted you have to do a referendum in the 1st place that you then lost undermining your deal and you i promised the equipment people at the beginning of the process that it was that i would do a referendum and i wanted to fulfill my promise yes but hold on that sounds very instrumentalist you wanted to do a referendum presumably because you wanted the approval of the people the people didn't give it to you but you rammed it through anyways but
a new agreement and that's what the constitution quarter said you must renegotiate an agreement i asked the leaders of good no vote to come to. the table let's renegotiate this agreement they. put on the table to 59 changes 59 points we accepted 56 so we had a new agreement and of course we shouldn't chord and establish very clearly that if you have a new agreement you can go ahead but not through a referendum but through the normal channels which is the congress and yet the current president mr du k was elected to office running on a pledge to dismantle parts of that agreement so obviously you didn't do that great job of getting the colombian public on board so soon after the deal they're voting in a guy who's going to dismantle the deal. but you are you are not. taking into account then in the last elections 3 weeks ago all the candidates that were
for the agreement for the us rode with us one in the mayors of the cities 'd and the governors of the states so that was a ratification that people are with the peace process they want to accept how the president has implemented except for the current president quite a big figure i would argue in colombia where the president is now he realized that he has to implement the peace process. but it because many start just one of them is because it's in the constitution and of course as you know of course said that for the next 3 presidential 'd periods or 3 the next 3 governments they must implement the peace process this peace process was very very big issue as we. report we established. some points said we will take about 15 years to do. so we didn't we were dancing and we were dancing with the normal problems that
any peace process especially so complex as this one but i am quite satisfied that many many thousands of lives have been saved but fark is no longer the biggest oldest strongest guerrilla group in the americas it is now a political party and that's what a peace process is not about the nobel committee gave you the peace prize in 2016 for you'll struggle for peace in colombia but the year before you won it in 2015 human rights watch put out a report covering your tenure as defense minister between 20062009 in which thousands of civilians were killed by colombian security forces who then dressed up their corpses as guerrillas in order to boost the fog bodycount and get themselves promoted that so-called false positive scandal happened on your want to didn't it why. manuel santos you are not distorting exactly what happened because you know
where you were that i was a war and stop that i changed the military doctrine and everybody here and not just that but you started something that happened on your watch it also happened in during your period as defense minister it happened at the beginning of my watch and i stopped it and it went down to 0 i stopped the trial so don't bring here it's false information you're saying that human rights watch called these false positives one of the worst episodes of mass atrocity in the western hemisphere in recent decades you say you stopped and yet no one senior was ever held to account just a few 100 low level soldiers no generals no military commanders no politicians have ever been held to account for thousands of deaths in your country thousands that's not true generals are now in the transitional court and they're being judged because of the cross posters you say is not true but when you were president you made one of the commanders of the 4th brigade who is accused of being
behind some of these killings you made in the country's top military officer how is that now impunity. who are you talking about general one public rodriguez when he was the commander of the armed forces he had nobody had any accusation against that would happen afterwards and nobody has made him responsible before and that's not true you said nobody had true human rights watch says at least $28.00 alleged extrajudicial killings by 4th brigade troops when general juan pablo rodrigo's barragan commanded it in 2014 would have made the country's top military official by you. you know he was the commander of the armed forces and when he was a commander of the armed forces nobody accused him of any. being wrong it was afterwards what did you do when you saw the human rights watch report in 2015 what action did you take against any of the generals they named. when i discovered
that. i brought. brought down the commander of the the the army and many more generals and i tell you i don't know why you don't want to accept this i was the one responsible for tradition. why do you insist on denying that i'm not denying i'm just not at the time you did remove the heads of army air force navy but you said it was a routine change you didn't say it was punishment for the fall it was no sir that's what the telegraph member quotes he was saying i went to 15 that is not true so you have to move them punish you remove them as punishment for being unless. they removed against against this after which they are now in the present. they're now being the hatches of an army navy an air force and you know what joe may be an air force no head of the army is now being prosecuted as a result of your decision made as. a result of the process yes just look at hell
part of the world it seems beset by political chaos these days on the left you have a home or a less out in bolivia and what some call a coup pressure on madeira to step down on venezuela on the right you have conservative former president mccree of argentina beaten last month in the election you have protested ecuador in chile and colombia as a former national leader looking at your region what do you think the political future holds for south america. well it's not only in south america and in that america you go 'd into trance you go to lebanon you go to iraq you go to hong kong there's protest all around in the case of latin america there are some common denominators which is inequality corruption and something that we are seen very clearly the success of the region in fighting poverty have brought many many people out of poverty into the middle class and their expectations have increased
geometrically and the governments have not been able to keep up with these expectations and so whether people are going to the streets and protesting in the case of colombia the peace process has also in a way liberated many people that before were afraid of going to streets because they would be. singled out or accused of mean terrorist or being with the guerrillas and now they feel free and if you go to france you see other reasons and you go to hong kong you see other reasons i don't columbus specifically given the protests give it a president trying to dismantle the whole deal given the violence we discussed are you an optimist about colombia's future i still am an optimist i think the president do now understanding that he has to change many of the things he's doing among them he has to. $200.00 to fulfill the promises that were
made it would be structured to implement a peace process yes to be much more aggressive on his social policy and that's what they're now discussing but i am optimist because colombia has always been a country where going back to be institutions. strong situation is that having been able to cope with these type of crisis juan manuel santos thank you so much for joining me on outfront. this week at the hague the nobel peace laureate and defacto president of myanmar. defended a country's military against allegations of genocide as the international court of justice began its hearing into the abuses against the rohingya muslims it's one of the only times the national media has ever personally addressed the tribunals and with hundreds of thousands of people displaced suchi is facing massive pressure and condemnation from the international community but can the un's top court really
bring justice for the right kind of put an end to the violence and me adam are one of the 1st people to accuse the country of genocide was monks arni the burman scholar and activist who's lived in exile for more than 20 years and who knows suchi personally he joins me now from london. thank you for joining me on upfront for year is we've seen extensive evidence of killings crimes against humanity forcible displacement and now this week on saying suchi myanmar state counselor goes to the hague to defend her country's military against this very serious charge of genocide you were there this week as well how does the rohingya crisis finally reached a turning point as a result of this historic case do you think. i believe this is the milestone in the struggle by if they were injured themselves to get the crimes that they have
been subjected to for the last 40 years. recognition that you know the crime duly deserve that they are hopeful that some semblance of justice and accountability will follow maybe this is not the only. trial that is happening right now as you know the i.c.c. the international criminal court that tries individual criminals and puppet traitors of atrocity crimes has also embarked upon full investigation there's also independent ringback mechanism that has been authorized by the general assembly set of to record memorialize and. any evidence of that war crimes crimes against humanity and genocide against all hinge or as well as other ethnic minorities the gambia with the support of 57
members of the organization of islamic cooperation the oh i see fall this case against me on the i.c.j. citing violations of the genocide convention both countries are parties to the genocide convention but why did the gonna be able countries do this what was the what's the a what's the strategy of the allies see in the gambia with this case what do they want to achieve from this case well there are 2 things that need to be emphasized you know gambia cumbia may have received that political moral and material support from oh i see also that i care that navid not just oh i see because that genocide is not simply about a muslim so this is not a muslim issue this is a human kind of a shoot back and that's why the netherlands and canada are have officially issued a joint states. say they support case and secondly the gambier team has asked for you know stopping any form of genocide 5 of policies and practices law wing the
role he enters in the modern day concentration camps call in or the internally displaced camp they're brought 120000 raw injures that have been kept in these camps since 2012 using this banner or that the rhetoric of protective custody but protective custody was 1st used by the german asses in the 940 said thirty's is the problem though that the court could rule against international opinion is against me but inside of me. in the generals have a lot of support thousands of people rallied in support of her before she left the country there was even a religious ceremony held in order before she set off for the hague what's your reaction as someone living in exile looking at your country and what is happening on the streets of your country people cheering her on even though the rest of the world disgusted by what's going on well of course as a purchase as a burmese and
a put this race in that country lived there for a quarter of a century i am makes trimly sad in and that the same type of outrage by what i see as a emergence of burma in society you know similar to what we saw in the 1930s nazi germany our son suchi is no simply defending the burmese military which is the only and all the can of the state our son suchi is there defending myanmar as a member state and racist society so so are not known among all not know ishi there at the hague defending the military and country and the government and the state is she doing that as a puppet of the military as some people believe she's in a tough position or if she does not because she. wants to do it she's there enthusiastically of our own free will happily defending what is going on in rakhine state from where the rohingya have been displaced what the fact our son suchi had
the result of to stand in captivity for 15 years on and all of the pushing for our own agenda which we now know that is not to be human rights or protection of minorities or democratization it's our own personal you know of personal ambition to be the head of state legally now she is head of state the fact 2 she is not a puppet she is pro actively defending passionately and of the fatherland li defending the indefensible she is fully culpable she is criminally responsible on a par with the burmese generals here's a thing about last time you were on the show back in 2017 you weren't quite ready then to demand that aung sang suu kyi whom you once a supporter of you were ready to call for her to step down i believe you should change your mind and you've now called for to resign what made you change your mind and how can you be sure that her departure won't lead to full military rule
returning to me. no i'm not calling for our resign i i want to see our son suchi and the burma is military leaders and religious leader alive we route through and lead a coup in the defendant's dock at the i.c.c. international criminal court because i.c.j. does not try criminal matters and here's a question for you me and mother refuses to acknowledge wrongdoing. she has gone to the hague and called the allegations of genocide incomplete misleading the burmans government said they will not cooperate with the un's independent investigative mechanism so what in your view is the best possible outcome of all of this given that even a court ruling in a few years' time won't be able to change facts on the ground in terms of what's happening to the road in places like iraq and stay. well what we're seeing is said you know the i.c.j.
tribunals has exposed the the full collaboration among major institutions in the country you know the other monks of the civil society actors a majority of them including job ermes journalists from arrow or d. and other of lead so yes you are absolutely right facts on the grounds are not likely to change however this is one of the very very few venues for pressure accountability and justice in a international order that is completely broken on you know when it comes to the wretched of the earth the oppressed not just the premise that the palestinians. you know the syrians yes so i think in the end that scenario we are looking at. rather rather this small picture and there but still as activists and advocates for
humanoids and the rights of common human beings we cannot give up hope that this is something that we must hold onto and built on to build the law a bigger move that we call for boycott of nima because nima has turned in to get the equivalent of germany in the 1930 s. today under our sun to cheese vote and active leadership monks and he will have to leave it there thank you for coming on up front and that's our show up from where we're back next week. capturing a moment in time. snapshots of other lives. providing a glimpse into someone else's world. but i witness on al-jazeera.
culture a down's thrives here every day generations of tibetans continue to embrace and they'd take their cultural heritage it's a reminder of who they are or whether. this is a suburb of the capital new delhi so be refugees here since $964.00. have been defined as migrants are not refugees because india hasn't signed up to the 1951 un convention on refugees so tibetans here have been able to access the indian welfare system so they become self-sufficient such a better business says and looking for work independently but for some it's not enough. the fact. the smallest place on the planet money could soon be lost. it's an international team of scientists is determined not to let that happen without intervention. i would say here to a vast now it's a race against time to try and save a species take
a crisis that's in the majesty plan. extinction techno on al-jazeera. the search for a new prime minister in lebanon is postponed as protests continue their overhaul of the political system. of from doha everyone i'm come all santa maria with the world news from i'll just see. i. see students across india come out on to the streets to voice their anger against a controversial citizenship law rescuers hope for survivors is that these people are killed in an earth.