tv Inside Story 2020 Ep 184 Al Jazeera July 3, 2020 10:32am-11:01am +03
stepped up their response as they also deal with outbreaks of cholera diptheria and other diseases last month the un held an aids conference but donors only offered harf of what's needed. north korea's leader says his country needs to be on maximum alert against coronavirus north korea has yet to report a single case of the virus health experts say a major outbreak there would have severe consequences because of a lack of proper health facilities and antigovernment protests has been held in mali's capital bamako marking 100 days as the opposition leader was kidnapped so many say disappeared days before the parliamentary election in march she says family has accused the government of not moving quickly enough to rescue him. now with all the headlines we're back with more news here on al-jazeera that's after inside story stay with us. as protests rage over police brutality and corona virus grips the nation campaigning on the election trail has been forced to take
a back seat will the presidential candidates ever hit the road and so their brand of politics to americans before the fall follow the u.s. election on a just. once a cathedral then a mosque now a museum i also fear that the cost of a legal battle to convert is stumbles emblematic monument back into a mosque but why now what purpose would it and how political is the decision this is inside story. i. know that and welcome to the program i'm laura kyle it's an ancient monument revered by different ideologies the centuries i also fear in turkey one of the world's most contested buildings is creating controversy once again it was the
largest christian cathedral in the east and roman empire for a 1000 years is now one of the busiest tourist attractions in istanbul is a museum but not for much longer if techies government gets the go ahead to convert it back into the mosque it was during the ottoman empire there was also opposed by some secular groups as well as the heads of the eastern orthodox church the greek government and the u.s. takis highest consultative body met on thursday and says it will announce its ruling within 15 days some new house will. one such church later a mosque and now a museum i also feel has always been precious and sacred for both christians and muslims. built as a church in the 6th century the i.s.o. fear was converted into a mosque after the concurring of what was constantinople in 1453 then turned into a museum by mustapha camera ataturk following the foundation of the turkish
republic in 1923 now the turkish government wants to alter its status from the assumed to mosque reopening goal for yourself your fortune means. and look it's really the most traditional for respect on our site for the world which establishes in dominance at the same time it's a token of gratitude and loyalty to the spiritual person irish of. the conquerors. i also feel i support of the u.s. school world heritage which forms the stumbles famous skyline it's been a museum since 1935. there are many in church and turkey stays by a sufi as should be open to worship for both christians and muslims and your thoughts christian church is concerned that the transformation from birth or over your soul we drove was really bizarre paul mediums of researchers
around the world and the us will feel relieved you reads this is a vital is the word used is raised the worst really thrive to these 2. prison trajectory fire don say as i also feel i can function like the nearby blue mosque open today the prayers and tourists at the same time we came to put in turkey a muslim country we are free to worship anywhere we want no one has any say on it petitions were signed by turks to support the conversion but their opponents you do a lot of work you don't this is sad a blow to our tourism i believe is not good for turkey marginal why is sophia to a mosque is a popular discussion in turkey and has support from the public along with the nationalist and conservative parties until last year president add on state out of the debate have ever he is very vocal about it now many believe it's
a political move especially given the rising tension between turkey and greece in the is certain mediterranean after part of the court on. about congress was resigned to deny a sophia last month the greek foreign minister said it insulted the religious feelings of christians the turkish government sais i asked sophia is a domestic issue not to be interfered with al-jazeera a stumble thank you well let's bring in our guests now and with us today from turkey you take his capsule and grow we have use of political writer and professor at the university of hallett's in istanbul from the great capsule athens yanis kut su mysis managing editor at capital news an expert on european affairs and from istanbul agenda's tomorrow president of achmet yes our university in catholics on and professor of history of high wall welcome to
all of you know just before we opened up our discussion today we can actually speak to delegates young mothers he is the deputy chairman of the act party in charge of foreign affairs need joins us now from ankara very good to have you joining us here on inside story let's get an idea from you why president wants to reconvert the iris of fear now. this is not a personal issue of presidents have to have it is of course turkey is the issue right now there is a court decision about this whole issue this. state in tookie has made a decision but they have stopped yet a north to decision they are preparing to try to get off their decision not based on this decision it will be clarified what the 1925 government decision is will it or not legally dissolute but of course there's the political part the assessment
and that is not related to president of the new rock party that is about turkish nation has a hook actually to it when you look at stories when you look at the public opinion there is a general expectation that. should be open to prayers it is that. expectation of protest and that does not exclude the of course of. as a. heritage of humanity if you believe that right just like any other mostly turkey like blue most you can of course benefit from such buildings full preterists as well as if for touristic attractions letter or other i mean you say that it said nothing about it says it said internal issue but let's look at the eyes of fair it's got huge historical and cultural significance for billions of people around the world not least $300000000.00 orthodox christians the
greeks are getting very upset about this the u.s. is getting upset about this the greek orthodox church is getting upset about this why whisk all that upset but but let me let me emphasize that this is not an issue concerning this is an issue concerning internal affairs of turkey and it just shows the riots but it was a dissident blasting a to say that that in effect all these other people. well as. i understand and naturally everyone is free to express their opinions i respect all of the abuse but nobody has the right to impose such. preferences upon turkey it is decision of turkish people and turkish society but why are there 90 years of it being a museum and satisfying both the size and the place that all people can go to is it being discussed now many people would say that it's for political gain that one has only brought up this issue twice in his leadership the last time was a year ago just before going to support
a lexus when he was worried about losing istanbul seats and indeed steadily and all now when the honey is on its knees knobby don't have any elections track no that is not need for popular discussions in turkey of you have made a very successful fight against but lastly facing them hell official vital research members has passed on home and our own tassels. no no no that we don't have any internal i mean election time but anyway and it didn't like populist moment in turkey that is not correct assessment this tradition is the legal basis of this issue and also social expectations across trust i mean it is not related to one party it is crossed party. and the there are many people from opposition parties and other parties that shared the same expectations this is not a party if you it is beyond party issues and you have been very much respectful for all religions in turkey when you look at our 18 years of performance as government
president after one himself he joined i mean the construction of the churches in turkey we have taken many legal descent decisions to give back as a sort of christian community and back and they needed evolutionary steps let me just put one more question i will tell you that a lot of fire away because this is not going to do with. the other religious or let go it was not ok we just are getting reports that iran has instructed his advisory council to hold 1st present a fair on the 15th of july that of course is the 4th anniversary of the failed coup attempt is this true not did there is not such an offer i mean did there are lots of things discussed on this issue some people may have raised their expectations on this issues but short there is no official announcements more
direct interpretation on this issues from president ever done on the contrary he just underlined that we have to wait for the court decision and then leave and make our assessment that is what the president has announced that young as we appreciate you taking the time to join us here on inside story thank you very much thank you thank you so much. ok well let's bring in the other guests now and again if i could turn to you 1st we heard there from the chairman of the act party that this is a national issue it's a turkish issue that most of turkey wants this what's your response to that well 1st of all. universal monument it's being protected by unesco it's been for more than 90 years and museum and a symbol of coexistence and a symbol of secular turkey and what we see now is another step another attack 'd by mr irwin on the secular heritage of turkey he's been attacking the laws on treat
the sins 3 or 4 years now he's been taking every major heritage that the most effort to model has given to his country as a founding father of the turkish republic and now another symbol of. the fight to mars heritage your sophia is about to be turned convert that into a mosque this is all in line with your logical struggle by mr odo on an arc of party to turn turkey into a muslim islamist country that's clear it turned out this is such a controversial issue what's your view is it a secular attack or is it simply answering the call of the turkish people. it is actually the certainly a legal issue if you look at the history because this is a stumble conquered by swart and 14 if you have to tree and it became.
most some other churches as well 567 years it was a church now in our took time they have changed into a museum because of design of the time and also to show the ocean of a movement through to the restaurant ization and and you think it is i will give you some examples like the citation of asm in turkish in attitude than they change into arabic in democratic but democrat party in mendus time you would think that like that this is that guys is now totally different from that time and according to the law and dormant law like a fool all eat by fatah still time i met the conqueror at church change. converted to mosque and i think is turkey now return
back its legacy and also it is according to islamic law also see wicklow it is ok for that the why because it was a disease shown by the cabinet now we have another couple that and can change this one i think most of turkish people. want to see this mosque as as more i have so far as most and you can find a lot of examples in the world such as cut at raw in karnataka in spain and such as mosques now they can you in greece as some exit polls and other things and most of them you know read on. i mean there it's the. same a lot of examples do i just this is. rick ok i'm just as in this figure as this poll that said that 73 percent of turks are happy to see it turning into
a mosque as of alluding to in your answer what i'm wondering is your in istanbul if that poll was taken there in that city what would be the result i think is it is really to the source religion of turkey in you'll look at the position of government look at the position of parliament and you can see that 77 to 5 percent of. we can say religious or. you know turkish people in general a nation is under religious people and i think so and to say one to 5 percent. says that yes for a conversion maybe 20 percent says nor i think this is this is related to general social issues of turkey right now ok guys. time interesting so you said what purpose do you think i.s.o. fare would serve now as a mask. or beat up knowing the background of fire sophia and the pope
historian of turkey if ill be impossible to explain what is the street asian mr agendas very well. in turkey between 1000 tertius and between 1950 s. that happen that as sam has been transformed from origin a lot of big top turkish and the optimum power 1st has been turned to the cousin os for playing gamble inside and reciting koran teaching core on has been also forbidden indoors you're sort of 30 years again changing all those issues to the origin of i mean other than started to be written from the minarets in $1050.00 s. and also the highest offer is one of the discussion point about that issue which has been discussed for more than 80 years inside turkey it is not something that mr add on woke up and started to say that i will turn our safiya from museum to the
mosque it has been discussed already inside turkey for more than 80 years and also when you take a look at to the historial fire safiya it is also a discussion point and to our fore for vandeleur this is very important i should say it also in 2 earth 04 van latinos conquered it they looted all the parts and a gate in dostoevsky even the rock that. sorta should be the symbol of the russian orthodoxy and know that also or there are still rumors that are still lots of discussions that should be transformed into the orthodoxy during t. is cease fire arms this one grows in night in night this isn't better knowing this historical background become not at all at the station i only had underlining address the fact that there is a country of this history which we must it's a hugely historical site is what we're saying today what we're talking about not
just a natural conclusion to where we are arts and the state that turkey is in today. well what my turkish friends do not to realize is that the use of fear is a symbol for many christians millions of christians around the world we have been fighting together christians and muslims who have been fighting jihadism for the last 10 years or so and now there is this example that will create a rift between muslim and christian communities and create new tensions it will feed the the narrative of the extremists on both sides i should remind you that the the video had a goal to conquer constantinople and make a yes afia a mosque so this is a glimmer exactly of the jihad this narrative and also we have the truth is voices
in the west as well that want want to expend oh it's lamb from the west so what this move will create it will be the perfect narrative for the extremists on both sides to say look this is a clash of civilizations the 2 the jury live just cannot live together one is occupying the other monuments and we cannot live in peace together so this is creating it will create a rift more than larger than inside turkey and what these handling right now has a solid point isn't it because this is a building that really does symbolize turkey struggling to different worlds different faiths it's been a mosque it's been a cathedral now it's a museum it's open to everybody why upset that balance. i think actually i don't think so that this is related to the radical it seems that this is not related to that dilution is. totally different issue and other
fractions in the rest some are old radical things that it's not related to do that in you'll if you look at the history of turkey if you look at the history of autumn as on you can see that all religions live together and jews and christianity and muslims still lack that and the 2 to 3 years ago we have opened up where the big jewish. church or in. juneau paul and also a turkey try to you know. to some of the churches and other. things in related to christianity and jews in turkey and you can see in turkey still some more school. churches all together next to each other includes going to look in other areas and when you go to mosque you can see
that's a people are praying dad and also to come and to do you know to visit the mosque i think is not related to radicalism so i wouldn't use totally totally different as you're 3030 years just 10 times to fix secular country is that this is my this is this is this is a socialist utopia and it is a value to a secular if i could just stress that point that you're making that is a secular country that has most that has senegal that has chechens everyone living side by side so why upset the balance. being a secular does not mean that you should forget the part about your values and the symbol of the. stumble let me remind you that i have lived more than 2 years inside greece and inside greece if you are talking the breach between the cultures and the core existence of the religions with each other you cannot go more inside our dance
inside cell unequal and if you are the citizen of the greece they do not even provide you a graveyard if you are dying in sight there are tents you should carry your graveyard even to do. something is just 500 kilometers north of the greece source than we are talking about be should talk about comparative the i do not think that turning higher so far from museum to the mosque again will not change the balance will not change the dynamic of the balance bit in the society because that me give you one example at 14 night or 2 than the spanish inquisition started inside spain the autumn marshall plan to greet them and brought all of the jewish people to the optimum lantz while people are praying inside the churches inside the mosques inside the hower us in synagogues freely for this isn't my right of my right of praying inside. shouldn't harm the people who
lives inside turkey as a christian because the core existence in istanbul and in the many other parts of the turkey since from 1000 years are all together to beat each other but when you're go to europe who can tell me that all the sister. morphew says if i was going to when i say running out of time i don't want to jump in with one very quick almost a yes or no question you say that the session be opened up to muslims praying could it be opened up to both muslims and christians praying in it. i do not think that muslims and christians can pray in them off at the same time ok all right yanis just last point to you this is a unesco world heritage site we've heard from the greek cultural minister saying that no change can be made without the approval of the un's own intergovernmental committee i mean this is quite an interesting point can turkey unilaterally change
the status of the eyes of fair well or legally gone but would sooner mr the one. disprove spoked full of all international law regarding the riveters in this the middle is there anyone in syria or in libya everywhere shore will be surprised if mr. through turkey is not the blood to preserve you know school. of the international law ok thanks so much for a very lively discussion today as a dentist quite soon it says and to mom. and thank you 2 very much for watching you can see the program again any time by visiting our website that's al-jazeera dot com and for further discussion do go to our facebook page that's facebook dot com for slash a.j. inside story you can also join the conversation on twitter our handle is at a.j. inside story from a laura kyle and the whole team him as by for now thank
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