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tv   BBC News  BBC News  August 15, 2021 8:00pm-9:01pm BST

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this is bbc news, the headlines. the taliban are back in the capital of afghanistan for the first time in 20 years. this picture is believed to be of the taliban inside the presidential palace in kabul. the rush to leave kabul as taliban fighters enter the city. nato says commercial flights are suspended. president ashraf ghani has also fled the country, saying he did it to avoid bloodshed. the taliban say they want to prevent looting in kabul. there are reports of shooting in several parts of the city. the militants have rolled through the entire country in a matter of weeks. in a bbc interview, a spokesman says women will be safe if they wear the hijab.
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the policy is that women can have access to education and to work and of course they will observe the hijab, that is it. helicopters ferry us diplomats from their embassy but the us secretary of state says the two—decade—long us military operation in afghanistan was a success. and ultimately it is up to the afghans themselves, it is up to the afghan government, the taliban, to decide the way forward for the country, including kabul. hello and welcome. taliban forces have entered the afghan capital, making their takeover of the country 20 years after being ousted
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from power all but complete. president ashraf ghani has fled, reportedly to tajikistan. in a statement on facebook ashraf ghani has said he left the country in order to avoid bloodshed. it's his first comments since leaving. meanwhile, this picture has emerged and it's believed to be of the taliban inside the presidential palace in kabul. the remaining staff of the us embassy have been operating from kabul airport but even there the security situation is said to have been deteriorating. it's being reported that the american flag has been taken down at the us embassy and nato says all commercial flights at kabul airport have been suspended as evacuations take place. the latest developments come after the taliban's rapid advance in recent days through provinces across afghanistan. here's our diplomatic correspondent, paul adams. as the taliban moves in, the west moves out. american helicopters busy over
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kabul all day today, ferrying diplomats from the us embassy to the airport. this disorderly end was not the plan. and nor was this, a city in panic, people desperate to leave, taking what they can, fearing a bloody assault. but so far it's happening without a fight. in a conference call with security officials, the president, ashraf ghani, says rioters and looters would be dealt with. but this is a man whose grip on power has vanished. his face may still gaze down on the city centre but this afternoon it emerged he had left the country. the government's senior negotiator pointedly suggesting he was no longer in charge. translation: the former president has left afghanistan, leaving - the people to this situation. god will hold him accountable and the people will have their judgment about him. i wish you patience and strength.
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may god help you. more signs of panic at the banks. people lining up to take out their savings. with thousands of police officers and security officials abandoning their positions, the taliban seemingly reversed an earlier pledge not to enter the city. "the islamic emirate," they said, "has ordered its forces to enter the areas of kabul left by the enemy and where there is a risk of theft and robbery. the citizens of kabul should not feel any fear." we wanted to avoid bloodshed and destruction to the properties of the people and not to give a chance to plunderers, looters, who are waiting for such moments to loot or plunder the properties of the people. but the streets are full of dread. tens of thousands of civilians displaced by fighting elsewhere living out in the open, telling stories of abuses at the hands of the taliban. translation: the taliban came
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into our village in the night. - after a few days we managed to escape as they were murdering the men and boys. they accused them of being in the army or the police. they were taken out of their homes and murdered because they worked for the government. away from the capital, more success for the taliban, taking over the eastern city ofjalalabad, giving them control of the vital road connecting afghanistan with pakistan. the saddest part is that i didn't expect this. but now i might face consequences that i never even dreamed of and i guess that's the price that we pay for trying to make this world a little better. tonight, the ministry of defence has released these pictures. hundreds of british troops arriving in kabul. with the evacuation of british nationals and eligible afghans under way, they will not be on the ground for long. at the border with pakistan,
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afghans are leaving. with or without fighting, the taliban's takeover looks set to trigger yet another wave of refugees. paul adams, bbc news. let's just show you more of that statement from afghan president, his first statement since he left the country today. posting on facebook, mr ghani said, "today, ifaced a hard choice; should i stand and face the armed taliban who wanted to enter the palace or leave the dear country that i dedicated my life to protecting for the past twenty years?"(ani) he he said he left the country in order to avoid bloodshed, as the taliban entered the presidential palace. mr ghani also added the taliban are now responsible for protecting the country's honour, wealth and self—esteem. he did not disclose details
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on his new, current location. let's just show you these pictures. these are the latest scenes from the airport in kabul. you can see crowds outside a plane on the tarmac waiting to leave. those are the pictures, you can see them again, if you can make them out, people standing around outside the aircraft, trying to see if they can get on. we were told a little bit earlier by nato that all commercial flights were suspended about an hour ago. it is only military flights to allow the evacuation of foreign nationals that are now being allowed. in the us, the secretary of state anthony blinken was speaking to nbc�*s meet the press programme earlier today. he gave the latest on his government's position. we can do right by the people
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who stood with us in afghanistan all these years, including afghans who worked for the embassy, worked for our military. we have a massive effort under way to bring afghans at risk out of the country, if that's what they so desire. and ultimately it is up to the afghans themselves, it is up to the afghan government, the taliban, to decide the way forward for the country, including kabul. shkula is a student and women's rights activist in kabul. she is happy for her face to be shown. hello to you, thank you so much for speaking to us. it has been a very turbulent day in kabul, so many things happening so fast. describe for us how you are feeling now about how things stand.— how things stand. thank you very much, how things stand. thank you very much. thank _ how things stand. thank you very much, thank you _ how things stand. thank you very much, thank you for _ how things stand. thank you very much, thank you for having - how things stand. thank you very much, thank you for having me. | how things stand. thank you very i much, thank you for having me. as you said, it has been a very tough
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week and specifically today. i can describe it as one of the very dark and sad days of my life. i witnessed the collapsing of two decades of efforts and struggles of my generation. i witnessed the collapse of a republic. i witnessed that a nation can be sold out very easily, specifically when it comes to afghan women. they have always been the main victims of bloodshed and armed conflict. unfortunately, in the past few months, there have been a large number of afghan women and children
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being displaced. right now they are at risk. i believe that this was a very huge mistake done by the international community, our so—called strategy partners have abandoned us and left us alone. but since it has happened i am still hopeful and i believe that they need to come and stand by our sides. they need to take care of afghanistan, they need to take care of afghan women specifically, otherwise afghanistan will change into a hotbed of terrorism and we will witness further more horrible incidents such as 9/11. i believe that the international community have this responsibility to monitor
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the situation, to observe the situation, and to pressurise the taliban to be committed to their responsibilities and to be committed to human rights, to be committed to women's rights and to be committed to our values and our interests and they need to assure the afghan people that they are serving this country, not...— people that they are serving this country, not... yes. i 'ust wanted to interrupt * country, not... yes. i 'ust wanted to interrupt you h country, not... yes. ijust wanted to interrupt you because - country, not... yes. ijust wanted to interrupt you because you - country, not... yes. ijust wanted to interrupt you because you are l to interrupt you because you are clearly full of fear about the uncertainty of what lies ahead for the future of your country, for the women of the country. i wanted to ask you about yourself, your own personal circumstances. what do you think the future holds for you? this is ve sad think the future holds for you? this is very sad to _ think the future holds for you? this is very sad to say — think the future holds for you? ti 3 is very sad to say that i have no idea about my future. this is very disappointing to say that a young
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afghan lady, who is a student of international relations, who has been a representative to the united nations, is at this point in time very disappointed and saying that i have no idea what my future is. i have no idea what my future is. i have no idea about my friends' futures and about my people. so this is a very unclear time and we need time to go through all these things, to finally find answers for the questions that are going through our minds. why have these things happened? why has no one decided to come and stand by the afghans. also, what can happen to ensure a better future for this generation? you
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what can happen to ensure a better future for this generation?- future for this generation? you are a student — future for this generation? you are a student do _ future for this generation? you are a student. do you _ future for this generation? you are a student. do you even _ future for this generation? you are a student. do you even know - future for this generation? you are a student. do you even know if - future for this generation? you arej a student. do you even know if you will be able to continue going to university?— will be able to continue going to universi ? ., ., �* ~ university? no, i don't think so. i am a student. — university? no, i don't think so. i am a student, i _ university? no, i don't think so. i am a student, i am _ university? no, i don't think so. i am a student, i am an _ university? no, i don't think so. i am a student, i am an outspokenj am a student, i am an outspoken woman, i have been a political opponent to the taliban. i don't think i will be able to go back to the university and pursue my studies. but let's hope, let's hope that these people, now that they have the control of afghanistan, let's hope that they will change their behaviours, the mindset, the narratives. so all we can do is just hope, be hopeful. d0 narratives. so all we can do is 'ust hope, be hopefui hope, be hopeful. do you have worries about _ hope, be hopeful. do you have worries about your _ hope, be hopeful. do you have worries about your own - hope, be hopeful. do you have| worries about your own safety? hope, be hopeful. do you have - worries about your own safety? of course i do, of course i do. but,
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you know, iam not course i do, of course i do. but, you know, i am not alone in this circumstance. everyone is stockier, everyone is worried, like there are thousands and thousands of active and outspoken youth and especially the women in afghanistan, living in afghanistan. i am the women in afghanistan, living in afghanistan. iam no the women in afghanistan, living in afghanistan. i am no less than them, we share the common experience, like we share the common experience, like we are going through the same situation. so i am worried, but thinking that i am not alone and thinking that i am not alone and thinking that i am not alone and thinking that i am powerful enough to overcome this situation. i am trying to be strong, but still anything can happen, anything is possible. we are living in afghanistan, a country full of
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surprises and shocks, and the collapse of the republic was one of the horrible surprises that we got. you are a student, you are young, i am guessing you are in your 20s, you will not remember the taliban regime of the 1990s, all you will have no will have been the afghanistan that has just fallen, a will have been the afghanistan that hasjust fallen, a democratic will have been the afghanistan that has just fallen, a democratic one, one that was working with western forces. just try and describe how that feels. ., forces. just try and describe how that feels-— that feels. you know, i feel betrayed- _ that feels. you know, i feel betrayed- i _ that feels. you know, i feel betrayed. ifeel— that feels. you know, i feel betrayed. i feel that - that feels. you know, i feel betrayed. i feel that the - betrayed. i feel that the international community and our partners, ourallies, international community and our partners, our allies, abandoned us, they left us alone. they have thrown us to the wolves and they have made a very huge mistake. as you mentioned, i was very young when i
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lived in afghanistan during the taliban regime. i went through a very hard life. when we came back to afghanistan there were hopes and desires. i grew up here, i completed my education here, i made a career here, and now within a few days everything has gone and we are waiting and looking at a very uncertain destiny. we don't know what is going to happen to us and to ourfamilies and what is going to happen to us and to our families and friends. this is very, very sad. but still i pray and i hope that things will get better. all i want is the safety and protection of the afghan people. all i want is a progressive and developed afghanistan. our country and our nation comes first. so let's
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hope. and our nation comes first. so let's ho te. ., ~ and our nation comes first. so let's hoe. ., ~' ,, and our nation comes first. so let's hoe. ., " r, and our nation comes first. so let's hoe. ., ~ . ., and our nation comes first. so let's hoe. . ~ . ., hope. thank you so much for your time. a student _ hope. thank you so much for your time. a student and _ hope. thank you so much for your time. a student and women's - hope. thank you so much for your l time. a student and women's rights activist in cabo. thank you very much indeed. well, the us government has been defending its decision to withdraw from the country. we spoke to our north america editor jon sopel, who's in washington, for reaction of the us secretary of state antony blinken�*s comments on the situation. well, i think he was trying to put a brave face on a situation that has turned chaotic, because, look, you can debate the policy about the wisdom or otherwise of pulling american forces out of afghanistan and there are many people, republican and democrat, who think you can'tjust sign a blank cheque forever that american forces will keep, prop up a government in afghanistan that doesn't command the huge support of the people and if the taliban come knocking, maybe that is the result. but the way it has unfolded, joe biden seems to have ignored
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all the warnings he was given by allies, by military top brass, they have drastically overestimated the fighting power of the afghan armed forces, they have underestimated the speed with which the taliban would advance and that leaves you with a situation today of helicopters ferrying diplomats to the airport, the ambassador being ferried to the airport, the flag being lowered over the kabul embassy, diplomats being told to shred documents. not quite the fall of saigon, but not far short. the bbc�*sjon sopel. let's get more now on the international perspective and speak tojim townsend. he was president obama's deputy assistant secretary of defense for europe and nato. now he's now at the center for new american security. hello, thank you forjoining us. kabul has fallen to the taliban,
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what should the international community now be trying to prepare itself for? we community now be trying to prepare itself for? ~ ., community now be trying to prepare itself for? . ., ., , itself for? we have to begin preparing — itself for? we have to begin preparing ourselves - itself for? we have to begin preparing ourselves for - itself for? we have to begin preparing ourselves for a i preparing ourselves for a humanitarian operation there of some type. we are looking at evacuations now, you mentioned british troops going in, us troops are going in. we have aircraft are beginning to ferry people out, but it can't stop there. we can'tjust people out, but it can't stop there. we can't just walk away after we have taken care of our own people there, ortaken have taken care of our own people there, or taken care ofjust a narrow segment of the afghans who have helped us. there is a lot more we are going to have to do and we are going to pressure the taliban to stay away and let us do this. this is going to be very hard in the next few days and we can'tjust go in there and ask for permission for the taliban to leave us alone as we go about this operation. it has got to be more thanjust about this operation. it has got to be more than just the uk and the about this operation. it has got to be more thanjust the uk and the us. nato has got to be involved in this,
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other aspects of the international community as well as the united nations. this can't be something that will last two days and we walk away. ifelt that will last two days and we walk away. i felt that your interview just a few minutes ago of the afghan student, i agree with her. the abandonment cannot include as walking away after a few days once we have taken care of the us embassy and translators. there has got to be more. �* , ., and translators. there has got to be more. �* ,, and translators. there has got to be more. �* �* more. and when you say we can't abandon them, _ more. and when you say we can't abandon them, we _ more. and when you say we can't abandon them, we have - more. and when you say we can't abandon them, we have got - more. and when you say we can't abandon them, we have got to i more. and when you say we can't i abandon them, we have got to help, what should be done? should people who want to leave be enabled to leave or should there be humanitarian assistance on the ground? humanitarian assistance on the tround? ~ ., humanitarian assistance on the tround? . . , ., humanitarian assistance on the tround? . , ., , ground? what should it be? it has tot to be ground? what should it be? it has got to be a — ground? what should it be? it has got to be a number— ground? what should it be? it has got to be a number of— ground? what should it be? it has got to be a number of those - ground? what should it be? it has. got to be a number of those things. there has got to be a land opening, a land corridor to try to allow refugees to go to neighbouring countries. if we can work that out, we can't obviously evacuate the
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entire country, but we have got to find a way to figure out how do we take care of people on the ground who are living in the open? how do we somehow deal in a broader way with the evacuation? again it is not just the us. it will have to be the international community. the un is going to have to play a role in this. right now you can imagine with the taliban this was a surprise to them as well, in terms of how quickly they were able to move across a very large country. i am certain there is not enough taliban to go into kabul and handle the problems there. if they ever wanted to! it has got to be the international community going in there and holding them at bay while we try to take care of the kabul population and the refugees going in there and we take care of them as best we can. the taliban willjust have to cooperate with this and we have to cooperate with this and we have to cooperate with this and we have to have forces in there to make
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sure that they do.— sure that they do. interesting you sa the sure that they do. interesting you say the taliban _ sure that they do. interesting you say the taliban will— sure that they do. interesting you say the taliban will have - sure that they do. interesting you say the taliban will have to - say the taliban will have to cooperate. that is not in the international community's hands, is it? it international community's hands, is it? , a, u, international community's hands, is it? , ., it? it is, if you have got british troo ts it? it is, if you have got british hearts in _ it? it is, if you have got british troops in there _ it? it is, if you have got british troops in there and _ it? it is, if you have got british troops in there and there - it? it is, if you have got british troops in there and there will l it? it is, if you have got british l troops in there and there will be thousands of us forces in there, and they have got a role in this as well. and there is more where they came from. we have to toughen up our approach here and go to them and say, listen, you are going to have to play ball here. we have got enough forces in kabul right now to make sure that happens. serra; enough forces in kabul right now to make sure that happens.— enough forces in kabul right now to make sure that happens. sorry to cut in, mr townsend, _ make sure that happens. sorry to cut in, mr townsend, you _ make sure that happens. sorry to cut in, mr townsend, you know- make sure that happens. sorry to cut in, mr townsend, you know perfectlyj in, mr townsend, you know perfectly well those troops are there in order to evacuate us citizens, british citizens, they are not there to do anything else. citizens, they are not there to do anything else-— citizens, they are not there to do anything else. right now they are not, but perhaps _ anything else. right now they are not, but perhaps that _ anything else. right now they are not, but perhaps that is - anything else. right now they are not, but perhaps that is an - anything else. right now they arej not, but perhaps that is an option for us. what we can't see is chaos breaking out in kabul, the likes of which we saw in saigon. people rushing to aeroplanes, horrible
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signs with the taliban who seem to have been doing this in the smaller capitals that they have been taken, coming in theirand having capitals that they have been taken, coming in their and having a massacre, having a humanitarian catastrophe there. we have got forces on the ground now to make sure that kind of thing does not happen as we sort out the stability of kabul and try to figure out how to handle the humanitarian needs. you are right about the forces going in there right now, their mission statement and the rules of engagement do not include combat with the taliban, but that could change. if we see the taliban coming in there and doing things against women and doing things against afghan government officials, and we see that we can turn that around in terms of what those forces are there to do. we have also got combat aircraft, we have been using those in the last few weeks, so we know we have that reach. so right now, yes, they are in there to just do the
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evacuation. but the taliban are beginning to penetrate into kabul and if we start seeing catastrophic scenes on the streets, those forces are going to have to change their rules of engagement. we have to, we can't abandon the afghans. but rules of engagement. we have to, we can't abandon the afghans.— can't abandon the afghans. but the iron can't can't abandon the afghans. but the irony can't be _ can't abandon the afghans. but the irony can't be lost _ can't abandon the afghans. but the irony can't be lost on _ can't abandon the afghans. but the irony can't be lost on you _ can't abandon the afghans. but the irony can't be lost on you that - can't abandon the afghans. but the irony can't be lost on you that the l irony can't be lost on you that the situation has been created by the withdrawal of the us led coalition presence. and you are saying if things get too bad, we havejust got to return? things get too bad, we have 'ust got to return? ~ ., ., things get too bad, we have 'ust got to return? . . ., things get too bad, we have 'ust got to return? . . . , to return? what i am saying is we have tot to return? what i am saying is we have got to _ to return? what i am saying is we have got to take _ to return? what i am saying is we have got to take responsibility - to return? what i am saying is we have got to take responsibility for what has happened there. i am not saying that we return and go back to the way we were occupying the country and working with the afghans. what i am talking about is we have got to take responsibility for what has happened and we have got forces on the ground, a lot, and the brits and other allies as well in some aspects. so we have to make sure that we take responsibility for
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this collapse that has happened and the ramifications of that collapse. we have to make sure that we do the right thing as best we can in this particular situation. we can pontificate and we can debate one another about what happened and there are lots of fingers that will be pointing in a lot of different directions over the past 20 years, but today and tomorrow and the day after tomorrow, we have got to make sure that we are doing the right thing as best we can in kabul to take care of the humanitarian situation there. we have got the forces on the ground to do it. we just cannot walk away and say, over to you. we have got to deal with it and it is going to be very hard, the logistics are going to be hard, dealing with the taliban is going to be hard. it will be hard dealing with people on the streets who are panicked, but we have to do that because it is the right thing to do and we have got to come and deal with the responsibility, the ramifications of the pull—out that
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was undertaken just a few weeks ago. there are ramifications to that and responsibilities that comes with that and the us and the international community needs everyone's help to get in there and try and deal with what has happened in kabul. i try and deal with what has happened in kabul. ., ., , ., _, in kabul. i want to put it to you briefly that _ in kabul. i want to put it to you briefly that you _ in kabul. i want to put it to you briefly that you are _ in kabul. i want to put it to you briefly that you are very - in kabul. i want to put it to you . briefly that you are very emotional about what is happening. weill. briefly that you are very emotional about what is happening.— about what is happening. well, i would say i _ about what is happening. well, i would say i am _ about what is happening. well, i would say i am as _ about what is happening. well, i would say i am as emotional - about what is happening. well, i would say i am as emotional asl about what is happening. well, i i would say i am as emotional as the student that you had on before me. i am as emotional as so many, whether it is in the uk or other parts of the alliance or in the united states. all of us have spent 20 years trying to do the best we can to help afghanistan recover from the first taliban government, trying to help them stand up as a nation, very tall task. we had successes in some areas and failures in other areas. we have got by in to this. we cannot have this collapse happen and dust are hands off and say, we did the
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best we could, you didn't have the will to fight, so this is on you and we are going to walk away. yes, the afghan government, whether it is the political side or the military side, they didn't do what we were hoping they didn't do what we were hoping they would be able to do with the training and the equipment we gave them. that helped lead to this collapse. but that is not a reason that we can just grab onto and say, we are out of here. we have forces on the ground right now and there are more coming in, that we can use to try to at least do the right thing in terms of stabilising the situation in kabul and doing the best we can to stop a humanitarian crisis from immediately breaking out. i don't want to say that is going to be easy, it will be one of the hardest things we have ever done, but we have got to give it a try, we cannotjust walk done, but we have got to give it a try, we cannot just walk away at this point in the catastrophe that is unfolding in kabul. we
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this point in the catastrophe that is unfolding in kabul.— this point in the catastrophe that is unfolding in kabul. we have to leave it there, _ is unfolding in kabul. we have to leave it there, thank _ is unfolding in kabul. we have to leave it there, thank you - is unfolding in kabul. we have to leave it there, thank you very - is unfolding in kabul. we have to - leave it there, thank you very much. jim townsend from the centre for a new american security.— let's just show you more of that statement from afghan president ashraf ghani, his first statement since he left the country today. posting on facebook, mr ghani said... he said he left the country in order to avoid bloodshed, as the taliban entered the presidential palace. mr ghani also added the taliban are now responsible for protecting the country's honour, wealth and self—esteem. he did not disclose details on his new, current location. fawaz gerges is professor of international relations at the london school of economics. hejoins me now from london.
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hello, thank you forjoining us. just give us your assessment really of how this has happened at such speed. of how this has happened at such seed. ~ .,, of how this has happened at such seed. ~ u,, ., of how this has happened at such seed. ~ ., , , ., , speed. well, most of us seem to be sur-rised, speed. well, most of us seem to be surprised. with _ speed. well, most of us seem to be surprised, with what _ speed. well, most of us seem to be surprised, with what we _ speed. well, most of us seem to be surprised, with what we are - speed. well, most of us seem to be surprised, with what we are seeing. surprised, with what we are seeing today. the afghan war had been lost a long time ago. what we are seeing is the combination of the most catastrophic disaster in america's modern history. we are talking about afghanistan without talking about the us war on terror. in four weeks we will have the 20th anniversary of the war on terror, america's invading off afghanistan and iraq. let's not separate afghanistan from iraq. the us is abandoning
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afghanistan and the us will abandon iraq, i have no doubt in my mind. despite whatever american officials say. the afghan people are on their own, even though the us government promised security and freedom, they realise now they are basically at the mercy of the taliban. the country is basically on the brink ultimately of further collapse and civil war. just to give you context of this catastrophic decision, the us since 2001 has spent almost $1 trillion in afghanistan, the us has spent $89 billion on training the afghan army, and the entire ask any
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security forces have collapsed. —— entire afghan. you have read the statement i president ghani. president ghani ran away... he did not defend his people. what you have come what the americans put in place in afghanistan, is basically a crony government. it lacked credibility, elect legitimacy, did not succeed in establishing a national identity, corruption was endemic. imagine the taliban, they had been fighting for 20 years, they had been fighting americans, fighting us, the united kingdom, the data organisation, for 20 years, and the american security establishment made it all clear that all was lost —— the data organisation. what we are seeing now is the full abandonment of the
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afghan people, and make no mistake about it... i’m afghan people, and make no mistake about it... �* ., ., , about it... i'm going to “ump in here, because * about it... i'm going to “ump in here, because clearly _ about it... i'm going tojump in here, because clearly things i about it... i'm going to jump in i here, because clearly things have collapsed with extraordinary speed, and yet we have spoken to young people in the last few days, young people in the last few days, young people who have grown up in a different sort of afghanistan, with freedoms that their parents and particularly their mothers would not have had. now that was an achievement that would have been worth preserving. first achievement that would have been worth preserving.— worth preserving. first of all, is to be contrarian, _ worth preserving. first of all, is to be contrarian, the _ worth preserving. first of all, is to be contrarian, the us - worth preserving. first of all, is to be contrarian, the us backedj to be contrarian, the us backed government was not a democratic government was not a democratic government for w hat in afghanistan was a corrupt government, from the top down. the reason why the security forces have collapsed, the reason why the afghan army did not fight, they did not really have a stake in the existing war, because the infighting among the elites,
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and, yes, afghanistan in the past 20 years had a limited space of political participation, women in particularfor political participation, women in particular for the tragedy in afghanistan, if you talk about what the taliban have done, imagine, and just to reread your point, women in particular have made major progress, 30% of women now are in the workforce, but the taliban will do most likely is basically prevent women participating in the public sphere. that means 30% of the public force will basically disappear for so i fear also girls will not be allowed to go to school, even though the rhetoric coming out from the taliban basically says otherwise, but most importantly, what the taliban will establish in afghanistan is a theocracy, a theocracy based on a harsh interpretation of islam, and at the end, the afghan people will suffer
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as a whole but particularly women and minorities in afghanistan. what i'm trained to say is that we should not neglect and ignore the responsibility of the united states that promise the afghan people security and freedom and prosperity and basically abandoned them to the mercy of the taliban stop what can —— of the taliban stop what can i ask you about some of the other big regional big players?— regional big players? pakistan, china, regional big players? pakistan, china. how _ regional big players? pakistan, china, how they _ regional big players? pakistan, china, how they might - regional big players? pakistan, china, how they might be i regional big players? pakistan, i china, how they might be looking at the present situation? the china, how they might be looking at the present situation?— the present situation? the biggest winner is pakistan, _ the present situation? the biggest winner is pakistan, of _ the present situation? the biggest winner is pakistan, of course, i winner is pakistan, of course, because remember when the united states invaded afghanistan in 2001, the taliban basically left pakistan, and pakistan... what i see really in afghanistan now, the extent of weapons, advanced weapons, and training and my take on it is that it is provided by pakistan. pakistan basically is part of the... the
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reality is, without pakistani support for the taliban, the taliban would not have been able to do what they have done for the past 20 years, and the americans know the americans have failed to really convince the pakistanis or motivate the pakistanis to cut the umbilical cord with the taliban, so pakistan is the big winter so far, but at the end of the day we do not believe no what is going to transpire in afghanistan and the taliban rule, and what is happening in the past few months... i mean, think about it, the taliban have been on a charm offensive, they are talking to the russians, remember, the soviet union invaded afghanistan and for almost ten years, is one the most bloodiest wars, the taliban are talking to the previous enemies, the taliban are talking to the iranians again, even though the taliban massacred many
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shi'ites in afghanistan. there talking to the indians, they are timed to everyone, the chinese, but the reality, at the end of the day, we have to wait and see whether the taliban will behave differently than the way they did in the 1990s. my take on it, and i probably have very wishful thinking, take on it, and i probably have very wishfulthinking, is take on it, and i probably have very wishful thinking, is the taliban have learned a lesson or two of the 19905. have learned a lesson or two of the 1990s. the big lessons? i doubt it very much whether afghanistan will become a breeding ground for international terrorism. after all, by allowing osama bin laden to establish a base in the late 1990s, the taliban lost their rule, their regime of. i also think the taliban are desperate for international recognition and the digit missy. they're going to moderate their behaviour, and that's why at the end of the day it is not like the americans have to go and save the afghan ease now. the americans have left. this is all wishful thinking for stubby question facing the international community, what are basically the carrots, what are the
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sticks the international community can provide to the taliban in order for the taliban to moderate behaviour at home, in particular at home, their treatment of women, 11 girls to go to school, the human rights record? and this has to be done by really difficult diplomacy, because we know what american intervention in afghanistan has done intervention in afghanistan has done in the past 20 years. $1 trillion has been wasted, blood as well, think of the tens of of casualties... think of how many british soldiers have died fighting in afghanistan to prevent the taliban from returning to power in kabul. taliban from returning to power in kabul ., ,,. taliban from returning to power in kabul. ., , ., ~ i. , kabul. professor, thank you very much. kabul. professor, thank you very much- that _ kabul. professor, thank you very much. that is _ kabul. professor, thank you very much. that is professor - kabul. professor, thank you very much. that is professor fawaz i kabul. professor, thank you very i much. that is professor fawaz gerges from the london school of economics. thank you. we are getting reports depending on has authorised an additional 1000 troops to help with the evacuation
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of kabul. that would bring the total number of trips to 6000. —— the united states has. kabul university lecturer obaidullah baheer gave his reaction to us secretary of state antony blinken's comment that the international presence in afghanistan is a success. you stare at that statement and smile. it is quite ironic. a lot of what happened in afghanistan appeared to be as part of a deal struck between the taliban and the united states, and the idea here is that they gave up on the afghans will stubby left them stranded, everything that we saw, that we could have negotiated a transitional government, we could've done a transfer of power, but none of that happened because they did not allow us time, they did not let us plan for its in advance. 50
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us time, they did not let us plan for its in advance.— for its in advance. so it was 'ust done to hastily? i for its in advance. so it was 'ust done to hastily? yes, i for its in advance. so it was 'ust done to hastily? yes, it i for its in advance. so it wasjust done to hastily? yes, it was. i for its in advance. so it was just. done to hastily? yes, it was. you are kindly — done to hastily? yes, it was. you are kindly speaking _ done to hastily? yes, it was. you are kindly speaking to _ done to hastily? yes, it was. you are kindly speaking to us - done to hastily? yes, it was. you are kindly speaking to us for i are kindly speaking to us for a second time here on bbc news. we spoke to you a little bit earlier, when you talk about your fears of what was going on, yourfear, you didn't want to leave the house. that was a few hours ago. tell us how the last few hours have been. have things changed?— last few hours have been. have things changed? actually, things have been changing _ things changed? actually, things have been changing quite - things changed? actually, things l have been changing quite rapidly. things changed? actually, things i have been changing quite rapidly. it happened in the morning was that panic struck. you could see cars stranded on the roads, people stuck in traffic for hours and hours, because, again, it was the beginning of the end, the police, the armed forces, they all gave up. police precincts were left empty and it was complete lawlessness, so people took the light in their own hands. they went and started looting under the name of the taliban. there were
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people that look like the taliban within the city, but officially as a policy from the taliban, they were not allowed to enter the city, and then by the end of the day, we saw then by the end of the day, we saw the taliban announcing that the vacuum of power, the vacuum of security created a necessity for them to actually move into the city. he announced a curfew starting at 9pm. i was try to get out a few hours ago, to grab a few things, and i saw four orfive hours ago, to grab a few things, and i saw four or five armoured vehicles, one of them that actually tried to ram into my car, and they did not look like they were government, they did not look like they were taliban, theyjust looked like people who had grabbed and looted such equipment, so it is quite shocking. one does not understand what we could or could not do, so it is a lot of unknowns,
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and we will wait for tomorrow morning to find out what happens politically. the president left afghanistan in the worst possible scenario, he did not even allow time for afghan elite to travel to doha... is like it was swept under the feet... something president ghani kept... he abandoned the nation for sub he ran away. == ghani kept... he abandoned the nation for sub he ran away. -- he abandoned _ nation for sub he ran away. -- he abandoned the _ nation for sub he ran away. -- he abandoned the nation. _ that was obaidullah. bbcjournalist zarghuna kargar is from afghanistan and has been speaking to residents in both kabul and jalalabad. she described the situation there as "total chaos". people are worried, people are scared. i have been speaking mostly with women. they are terrified of what is coming next for them. i was just speaking to one of my friends who lives in kabul, and this morning
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she went to the bank to get some money. she has been trying to leave the city for a while and unfortunately she was able to leave today. she went to the bank and the bank said, you can go home, there is no money in the bank, and she said, when i came out of the bank, the streets were empty and people were getting off, running back home. she said she went home and she feels so hopeless. it is heartbreaking to speak to my friends, my friends who have worked so hard in the last 20 years to progress, to get education, to learn, to help the society, to help the community. the morale is so low and it is just so sad, and help the community. the morale is so low and it isjust so sad, and i have also in speaking to mothers of... one mother told me her son who was guarding the jalalabad airport,
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she cannot make contact with him for she cannot make contact with him for she has not been able to phone him, he is not answering. they are telling her it he might be safe, but it is heartbreaking not to know where your child is and how your child is doing, and she says that since this morning, she is hearing planes coming over kabul — they live very close to the airport — she thought that everyone is leaving and they are left behind. abandoned. terrible scenes and terrible stories. , ., ~ ., , terrible scenes and terrible stories. ~ ., , ., stories. do you think that this fear in this time _ stories. do you think that this fear in this time of— stories. do you think that this fear in this time of tremendous - in this time of tremendous uncertainty, do you think this fear is strongest among women? trier? uncertainty, do you think this fear is strongest among women? very much, ve much. is strongest among women? very much, very much- women _ is strongest among women? very much, very much. women were _ is strongest among women? very much, very much. women were the _ is strongest among women? very much, very much. women were the main i very much. women were the main victims of the taliban regime, women were the main victims of the larger —— regime. there are so many widows in kabul. it is hard to build a
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community of educated women, so many girls in school. they do not know what this means for them. are they able to go to school tomorrow? they don't know. are they able to be allowed to go to university? they don't know, as we hear from some provinces, some women were told to go back from university, by the taliban, where they have taken over, so there is fear. and when you see everyone leaving, it is just heartbreaking, and it is like really scary. i have been there myself when, in the 90s, i was a kid, and my father... he said it is going to be fine, we will be fine. there will be fine, we will be fine. there will be a job and life for us, and we saw his friends leaving, some of them went to russia, some of them went to india. we were left behind. and sometimes my mother still blames my father for all the suffering we went
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through. we became displaced two times in afghanistan, then we went to pakistan as refugees, until finally we made it to england, where we were lucky, but we were a bit late. i speak to somebody at my friends, they are exactly in the same position that i was in the 90s as a child, it was just so heartbreaking not to be able to go back to your home, not to be able to sleep in your own bed, as a child, and i have been there, and it is just so hard to keep hopes high to —— orto —— or to keep the momentum of feeling is going to be fine. the events of today _ feeling is going to be fine. the events of today and this past week have clearly stirred up a lot of memories and emotions for you. among the people that you've been talking to, zarghuna, is there any sense,
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any realistic sense, that the taliban night perhaps i changed from the regime in the 90s or people highly sceptical?— the regime in the 90s or people highly sceptical? highly sceptical, es-eciall highly sceptical? highly sceptical, especially women. _ highly sceptical? highly sceptical, especially women. it's _ highly sceptical? highly sceptical, especially women. it's just - highly sceptical? highly sceptical, especially women. it'sjust like i especially women. it's just like seeing the reality, we are hearing from women in provinces. just a few weeks ago i spoke to a woman artist in kabul, and she was telling me that in her province where the taliban had entered, midwives were essential workforce for looking after mothers, and they were not allowed to work, so how can we trust allowed to work, so how can we trust a force like this that they... we see examples, we hear women being forced to marry and sold. the bbc�*s zarghuna kargar there. colonel chris kolenda led the us troops as commander to fight against the taliban in 2007 and also engaged them in peace talks later. he says he is worried for the afghan citizens who helped the us
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through the years. i have got a personal reaction, and a policy reaction. my personal reaction is it is very upsetting, it is very disappointing. i've got afghan friends who i am messaging back and forth who are very concerned about their safety, their personal safety, they tell me about the unfolding unitarian crisis, the uncertainty about the future, and all of that is very upsetting —— unitarian crisis. it is also very upsetting to see 20 years of work with the afghan government come crashing down like this. from a policy standpoint, i think it is important right now to focus on cause and not blame them and i think there are three causes for what we're right now. the first cause is that the afghan soldiers and people no longer believed, lost faith, in their leadership and voted with
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their leadership and voted with their feet to accept the taliban. second, the last 18 months, the taliban used it very wisely in negotiating all of the surrenders, whereas the afghan government squandered the past 17 to 18 months, and third the united states created and third the united states created a built in afghan security force that was way too dependent on america, and that is quite frankly strategic malpractice. hour america, and that is quite frankly strategic malpractice.— america, and that is quite frankly strategic malpractice. how much of this should have _ strategic malpractice. how much of this should have played _ strategic malpractice. how much of this should have played a _ strategic malpractice. how much of this should have played a part i strategic malpractice. how much of this should have played a part in i this should have played a part in the american decision to withdraw its troops? how much of this is with the benefit of hindsight, although all this has happened so quickly, but how much should this have been taken into account? i but how much should this have been taken into account?— taken into account? i think what hat-ened taken into account? i think what happened was — taken into account? i think what happened was the _ taken into account? i think what happened was the taliban i taken into account? i think what happened was the taliban were | taken into account? i think what i happened was the taliban were very savvy in using the last 17 months to negotiate the surrenders of these various commanders and district and
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provincial governors, and what we have seen with the last week or so them coming to collect the surrenders, and it was a very, very effective campaign. and it does not seem that the united states had any inkling of what was going on, and it did not seem like the afghan government had much inkling of what was going on either. it sort of buried his head in the sand and instead of reinforcing and preparing its defences, itjust continue to hope the united states would keep combat troops in country, and when president biden made it quite clear, and president trump before him, that i was not going to be the case. you have sat in — i was not going to be the case. you have sat in on _ i was not going to be the case. you have sat in on negotiations, negotiated with the taliban in the past. from their present public pronouncements, do you think they have changed?— pronouncements, do you think they have chanted? . . ., ., ., have changed? what i am hearing from them, and have changed? what i am hearing from them. and you — have changed? what i am hearing from
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them. and you just _ have changed? what i am hearing from them, and you just played _ have changed? what i am hearing from them, and you just played the - them, and you just played the interview with their spokesman, is what they have been saying for several years. and so now the question is, are the taliban going to follow what they have said in terms of respecting human rights now that they've essentially taken... and are they going... they have talked about not wanting in monopoly of power. are they going to follow through on that or are they going to overreach and invite resistance of the afghan population against them? i think time is going to tell. colonel chris kolenda there. here in the uk, an emergency meeting has been held to discuss the situation in afghanistan. britain's prime minister, borisjohnson, has said he wanted to make sure that other like—minded nations did not "prematurely"
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recognise the taliban. britain is among a number of countries who've called a meeting of the un security council to discuss afghanistan. lewis vaughanjones has more. the prime minister speaking afterwards, giving it admission, saying that surely there is go to be a new government in kabul. if you just take a moment to think about that, imagine a british minister saying that a couple of weeks ago, a couple of days ago, even perhaps this morning, talking about now the priority being to stop the country becoming once again a breeding ground for terror. let's take a quick listen. it ground for terror. let's take a quick listen.— ground for terror. let's take a tuick listen. , . ., ., quick listen. it is clear that there is ttoin quick listen. it is clear that there is going to _ quick listen. it is clear that there is going to be. — quick listen. it is clear that there is going to be, or— quick listen. it is clear that there is going to be, or there - quick listen. it is clear that there is going to be, or there is - quick listen. it is clear that there is going to be, or there is good l quick listen. it is clear that there | is going to be, or there is good to be very— is going to be, or there is good to be very shortly, a new government in kabul— be very shortly, a new government in kabul or— be very shortly, a new government in kabul or a _ be very shortly, a new government in kabul or a new political dispensation —— going to be very shortly — dispensation —— going to be very shortly. howeveryou dispensation —— going to be very shortly. however you want to put it. and i_ shortly. however you want to put it. and i think— shortly. however you want to put it. and i think it— shortly. however you want to put it. and i think it is very important that— and i think it is very important that the — and i think it is very important that the west collectively should work together, to get over, to that
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new government, be at the taliban or anybody— new government, be at the taliban or anybody else, that nobody wants afghanistan once again to be a breeding — afghanistan once again to be a breeding ground for terror. and the prime minister _ breeding ground for terror. and the prime minister also _ breeding ground for terror. and the prime minister also giving - breeding ground for terror. and the prime minister also giving an i breeding ground for terror. and the | prime minister also giving an update on the situation on the ground there, and actually it is best to illustrate it, if we take a look at some pictures. this is british troops arriving in kabul. this is i think the 16th assault brigade, and the prime minister talking about two priorities in a very difficult situation, a duty to fulfil obligations to uk nationals there, firstly, and secondly to fulfil obligations to those who helped the british effort, so filling other locations to those who helped the british effort there in afghanistan, the prime minister... let's take a look at the rest of the world, then, actually the increasing focus of the
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world's attention is kabul airport itself. and nato is there, fears for security around the airport, for obvious reasons. and actually in the last hour or so, hearing from reuters that all commercial flights have been suspended now. that is allowed the priority for clearly the military operations, the military operations going on, and you may have seen earlier on in the day commercialflights have seen earlier on in the day commercial flights ranchland and turnaround, but they have now been suspended, and let's take a look at what the nato secretary—general tweeted earlier on, saying that... and we can to can get france as an example. we've got a bit of footage. the french ambassador, and the not any words here, but it is worth pausing for a beat to taking what is happening. —— they are not any words
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here. this is from inside the helicopter, been taken out of the green zone, from the embassy to the airport. france said it is moving its afghan embassy close to the airport and it will keep operational there, to help the evacuation of all french citizens there, and actually they're going to do that via the uae, and actually that is going to help quite a few countries with this evacuation we are going to see now in the coming hours, situation with germany very similar, saying they are doing everything they can to enable germans and local afghan support staff to leave. just the core embassy staffer meaning there. couple of quick comments from other countries. qatar coming for a quick dell mac peaceful transition of power. turkey saying it will continue its embassy operation —— qatar calling for a peaceful. i want to focus on the people of guinness tan, but this is talk about international evacuations, but a tweet from...
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she was shot by gunmen in pakistan. her words are quite powerful... a big job for the international community, and to that and, un security council are due to meet on monday morning. that security council are due to meet on monday morning-— monday morning. that update by lewis. before we go, there's just time to update you on some of the other stories we're following this hour. haiti's civil protection service has said that at least 724 died in saturday's massive earthquake. the powerful 7.2 magnitude quake flattened homes, churches and schools. hospitals have left overwhelmed and in need of supplies. the disaster compounds the problems facing haiti, which is already dealing with a political crisis following the assassination of its president last month.
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and anti—government demonstrators in thailand have staged a protest involving thousands of cars, to demand the resignation of the prime minister over the government's handling of the coronavirus pandemic. you're watching bbc news. now it's time for a look at the weather with alina jenkins. hello. warmth and sunshine is in fairly short supply in the week ahead, but whilst there was some rain in the forecast, most will be mainly dry, but with a north—westerly wind, it'll feed in cloud. and with the wind, it'll feel cooler, particularly for the first half of the week. this is the bigger picture at the moment. through sunday, slow moving fronts pushing across the uk, bringing cloud, outbreaks of rain into parts of northern england, wales, south—west england and very heavy showers for northern scotland and we keep those going through this evening.
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for others, a glorious sunday with blue skies and sunshine, so very much mixed fortunes. this evening, we see those showers continue to slide their way across scotland, but much of the rain across england and wales tending to ease away, with some of those showers moving into north—east england through the early hours. some clearer skies across eastern sides of scotland with temperatures down to 6—7. elsewhere, with the cloud, more like 12—14. here is how we start the new week. our area of low pressure pushing across scandinavia, high—pressure building from the west, a squeeze in the isobars and a north—westerly wind, so feeling cooler for all of us through monday. quite a lot cloud as well with some showers, most will be dry. the best chance of sunshine will be across the eastern counties of scotland. the temperatures, we have seen 23—24 in places on sunday, more like 18—20 on monday, and some rain arriving into the west
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of scotland, and that will slowly slide across scotland, clipping northern ireland, into parts of england and down across the east coast as we head through the early hours of tuesday. it is a similar pressure set—up on tuesday, this area of low pressure to the east of us, high pressure to the west maintaining that north—westerly air flow. fairly damp start to the day across parts of east anglia and south—east england with outbreaks of rain. that will pull away, but in the wake, we are left with cloud with one or two showers. and once the morning rain has gone from the east and south—east, mainly dry if rather cloudy, with highs of 16—20. it is a cloudy picture in the week ahead, most will be dry, some small amounts of rain, fairly cool start to the week, turning warmer later but with a chance of showers at the weekend. goodbye.
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ultimately of further collapse and
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civil war. this is bbc news with the latest headlines for viewers in the uk and around the world. this picture is believed to be of the taliban inside the presidential palace in kabul. the rush to leave kabul as taliban fighters enter the city. nato says commercial flights are suspended. meanwhile, the taliban say they want to prevent looting in kabul. there are reports of shooting in several parts of the city. the militants have rolled through the entire country in a matter of weeks. the policy is women can have access to education and to work and of
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course they observe the hijab, that is it.

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