tv Bloomberg Technology Bloomberg November 30, 2021 11:00pm-12:00am EST
coming up, it is brett taylor's weekend we are living in it. he is salesforce's new co-ceo, the news coming today after taylor was named chair of twitter's board. david marcus is out at meta. the cocreator of the yet to be launched currency steps down, adding uncertainty to facebook's digital payment aspirations. that is a wrap on black friday and cyber monday. we are speaking with the president of shopify about what trends he saw. for the fifth day, the embattled theranos founder elizabeth holmes takes the stand. the latest twist in her testimony, holmes claims she was raped at stanford. we ask a common law professor what he makes of her defense. first, let's get a look at the markets. comments from jerome powell weighed heavily on the major benchmarks.
bloomberg's kriti gupta has details. kriti: a double whammy when it comes to the stock market, especially when it comes to tech stocks, which were not able to lift the market higher. futures lower off the bat. a lot of this has to do with the covid uncertainty. is the omicron variant actually as dangerous as some countries are willing to bet that it is? uncertainty you are seeing on the markets. s&p 500 down 1.9%. mastec slightly better, still down 1.5%. the vix up to a 27 handle. equity volatility is catching up to bond volatility. the other part of the equation is chairman powell coming out and saying we might start to pick up taper and address the supply issues, which is essentially inflation. you started to see 30-year yields dropped to the lowest since january. this has a lot to do with tact. there are seeing long-duration
assets, which is why we like to sew together the tech world and the bond world. the idea here is that the treasury curve is flattening. there is no longer a premium, an extra bonus you get for taking on risk. if you start to see that sentiment in tech, you see tech lead the decline rather than outperform. let's hit the micro. salesforce down after hours, down almost 6% after they did beat earnings. they also gave a disappointing sales and profit forecast as well. they are talking about promoting brett taylor to become chief coexecutive officer. right now, it is that forecast that is weighing on the stock. emily: big news at salesforce. i want to continue with salesforce, stock falling on the disappointing profit and sales
forecast. in a separate announcement, brett taylor has been promoted to co-ceo with marc benioff will remain board chair. taylor has been president and chief operating officer since 2019. for more, liz herbert, forrester research. this has been speculated about for quite some time. what do you make of this announcement? liz: i think it is no surprise. bret has been there. he came in through a collaboration oriented position that is clearly a direction they continue to invest in, most recently with the phenomenal slack acquisition. no real surprises from most that he is being elevated again. emily: i actually asked bret taylor this question six months ago, whether there was any truth to the rumors. take a listen. emily: it has been speculated you are the heir apparent to potentially the ceo job at salesforce. is there truth to that?
bret: i can't comment on that but i will say, we talked just a couple of weeks after i sold my company to salesforce and i can't say i would imagine sitting in this chair as c.o.o. it has been by far the most fun time of my career. my relationship with mark, which is amazing, as a mentor and friend, but also being at this company. to be able to provide digital technology to so many companies who absolutely needed right now is the most privileged position i can be in as both a designer and as someone who has for great relationships with so many customers. i am happy. i cannot comment on the situation right now. emily: bret taylor handled the slack acquisition almost entirely, which was incredibly large. marc benioff told me that. how do you think they are going to divide responsibilities? how will this co-ceo rule work? let's remember, this happened
before with keith black and that did not last too long. liz: in general, most companies do not have a co-ceo. you saw that at sap, then they reverted back to a single ceo. likely marc will move on to other things. his passion is greater than this successful computing company. there are other causes he lives for and promotes. likely i would see overtime a gradual increase of bret's responsibilities so that marc can go into the things he has been interested and successful in. he really is changing the world with the 111 model, what he had his wife to for health care at hospitals. emily: what do you make about the forecast? this is a company that is competing in a world of software giants, commanding a premium price. liz: salesforce are very aligned with what we see today. companies are reinventing themselves. cloud increased during the
pandemic. they are right there. they are the original poster child and they are very much thought up as a platform to accommodate visual transformation. they are also in customer, which we have seen investment in. all areas of growth and investment. salesforce has had ups and downs with profitability. this is normal. they spend a lot on sales and marketing. some of that has become they are paving the way. they have had unprofitable quarters, and have had great profitability at times. i do not see that as overly concerning. they invest a lot and they spend more than other tech companies do in different areas. i think longer term, we see them broadening their portfolio, appealing to more companies. they are catching the next wave of the trend which will be industry cloud through velocity and their own investments. they are expanding geographically. there's a lot of room for them to continue growing and they do tend to have these cycles in terms of profits they are able to report.
emily: speaking of a big enterprise, you are joining us from las vegas where aws reinvented is happening. aws also has a new ceo who we spoke with a couple of weeks ago. this was his first time giving the big keynote, filling andy jassy's shoes. take a quick listen to what he had to say. >> the cloud has become not just another tech revolution, but an enabler of a fundamental shift in the way that businesses actually function. there is no industry that has not been touched and no businesses that can't be disrupted. emily: under new leadership, can amazon maintain that lead in the $64 billion cloud market that is getting bigger with microsoft and google at their heels? liz: there are so many parallels between the amazon story and salesforce. they both pioneered the markets they are in. they are great partners. the culture, the commitment to innovation.
amazon takes its start with the press release approach. thing about the end result, then work backwards. they have been very famous for that. they do that with their partners. they are the king of innovation. they continue to breathe that. they have a customer centric culture which is a winning strategy these days. we don't know a lot about how they will perform under new leadership but here at the conference -- yet again, and so many announcements with all their different capabilities for developers. they continue to impress with their pace of innovation and creativity. all the properties we think about when we think about a successful company in any sector. emily: liz herbert, forrester research vice president and principal analyst. thank you. coming up, more on jack dorsey's decision to step down.
emily: jack dorsey's decision to step down at twitter comes as stock broadly underperformed. tesla, netflix, for more we have tom giles. yesterday initially the stock went up on news that jack dorsey would be leaving. when we found out who it was, the stock went down. why aren't investors liking what they see?
tom: the new ceo represents kind of the status quo in many ways. the important distinction is that he is not running another company, like jack dorsey was, and has been the subject of criticism. agrawal definitely represents a -- contrasts, but another way is he is a continuation. he has been around for a decade, he has been in charge of big projects. he has dorsey's confidence but at the same time he does not represent -- we are not expecting some radical shift in one direction or another. he has still got a lot of legacy problems at twitter that jack dorsey had, including speeding
up product development, bringing out new services and things that are going to increase engagement and get users excited, and advertisers excited about reaching those users on the platform. something that really makes it stand out more from snap, meta, and all the other social media platforms we have so much access to. emily: i want to bring in our research analyst, brent thill, as well. you have said that jack dorsey leaving is good for investors. do you think jack dorsey leaving is good for investors all stop, or do you think parag agrawal
becoming ceo is good for investors? brent: the stock has done nothing. from an investor perspective, you just need change. if it is not working, throw some level of change. the thing with twitter is that ultimately advertisers have not seen the roi they have seen in snap and facebook. you got to improve roi to get advertisers to spend. from a user perspective, they are not going after u.s. usage the way they should. they have set lofty goals. i ultimately think this is good. you never want to totally leave. i think jack is an incredible visionary and he is important but it is time for change. we have seen this at other companies where really talented execs run out of runway and need to bring in someone new. i think this is a good thing. many are asking why he would be appointed given he has been there for a decade running technology. there have been technology issues at twitter, so i think there has been confusion around why bringing technologists in. that may be part of the problem, i am not saying he was part of the problem, but that is the criticism. stock has done poorly in the
last two days, on this announcement. i think many felt like there would be more of a seasoned exec that has done this. he has largely spent his career at twitter, ultimately a distinguish engineer. super smart. no one is going to disagree he is capable. it is just, is he a right fit for this next chapter for twitter? emily: the question is also, what should that next chapter be? parag is someone who has been leading blockchain efforts. we know how much jack dorsey cares about bitcoin and cryptocurrency. do you think that should be the future of twitter? brent: no. social platforms are talking about the next version being the metaverse. how do you make a more immersive experience. what i have found is twitter has not captured me. i go on, that i leave. when you go on instagram, you are captured. it is targeted, it is relevant.
same thing for my kids on snap with younger audiences. the audiences on facebook and instagram. they have just failed to capture. u.s. numbers have not been great. it has been tough. they've got to get a more interactive, immersive experience for the user. one of the key takes from this is perhaps he brought these ideas to the board, he brought this to jack and jack said no. obviously, bret taylor, when you think about salesforce.com and bret now as ceo, bret is a great visionary and i think the combination of both of these individuals, they have upgraded the perception that they are on this and they can do the right thing. emily: it has certainly been a big week for bret taylor.
tom, over at meta, we are seeing david marcus leaving. david marcus ran paypal, then went over to facebook, tried to launch facebook's cryptocurrency project to much criticism and controversy. interestingly, david kirkpatrick said yesterday he thinks jack dorsey leaving twitter is kind of a rebuke of mark zuckerberg doubling down on meta in the midst of controversy. what can you tell us about david marcus' departure and what that means? tom: as you mentioned, dm really never got off the ground. right from the start, they announced this thing in 2019 with fanfare. this was going to be this new currency that would be backed by
a basket of currencies, including the dollar and the euro. the thing about that, i really think it was ahead of its time but very badly executed. they did not foresee the amount of pushback they were going to get. having facebook be part of it immediately raised questions about the credibility of it and questions about user privacy, which facebook has shown it is not the most important thing on their list of priorities. second of all, there is a question about how destabilizing this might be to global currencies. i think it is visionary and eventually you are going to see cryptocurrencies play a very disruptive role in mobile financial markets, transactions, payments, all of that stuff it is supposed to be. i believe there is potential for that. this was ahead of its time and badly executed. when you launch a project like that and it does not take off, what is there left for you to
do? i think facebook or meta wants there to be a role for cryptocurrencies for these systems, especially in the metaverse. we think about this new vision about the way we interact online, there is a role for it there. facebook and meta sees it as playing a role, but we are so early in the process and clearly what marcus was trying to do was not happening. emily: do you make of these moves at meta in the context of what we are seeing in facebook? and to be fair, even though dm has not gotten off the ground, facebook stock has soared at the same time jack dorsey has been ceo of twitter, and twitter's stock has lagged. what do you see in the comparison here? brent: i see facebook having a great job targeting advertisers and getting advertisers to spend, regardless of the noise in the news about facebook and instagram as platforms, the roi
is still there. we have a couple quarters to get through that. even the vision of what zuckerberg is putting together with the metaverse, this immersive experience we are going to get into and ultimately all of the things you can layer into that, it is exciting. we do not want it all to go digital. certainly, the excitement of what this could look like has so many different ramifications for business models and transactions and i think there is a lot of excitement. no one wants the world to lock down because of this virus, but if we are going to be locked down, we might as well have an interactive internet, a digital world to hang out in from our home. i think facebook has done a better job targeting what is on the next three to five years out.
i think it is a combination of factors but it goes back to usage. keeping users on the platform, keep advertisers spending. that is the most important thing. that is all that matters right now and they are doing a better job than twitter at this point. emily: facebook is not giving up on crypto. tom, go ahead. tom: i would add on top of what brent said, don't forget the role that instagram has played in helping facebook reach the next generation. in some ways, they need to go further. instagram is losing it just a little bit. whatsapp is such an important service. there are all these ways that meta has been more effective at keeping people engaged and adding products. whether it is products they have built or products they have acquired.
emily: stephan castreal will be replacing david marcus and will continue to lead those payment projects there. tom giles, bloomberg technology. and brent. thank you both. coming up, big tech dealt another blow from regulators. we find out who made moves against meta. let's take a look at hpe, also out with earnings after the bell.
britain's watch dog has ordered a company to sell giphy. the competition market has down three to $50 million high up with the search engine will reduce competition between social media platforms. it is the first time a global regulator has forced a big tech firm to unwind a completed deal. relators in china have dealt another blow to dd, the giant ride-hailing company. they issued a formal package of rules that protects the rights of millions of drivers that underpin the industry's growth. beijing has already ordered them to delist from the u.s. after going ahead with an epo despite objections. a warning from spacex ceo, elon musk, according to the website space explorer, musk says his company faces a genuine risk of bankruptcy if it cannot launch one of its starship vehicles at the rate of one every two weeks next year. the website quoted an internal email. musk indicated that production issues with the engine or worse
emily: welcome back to "bloomberg technology." i am emily chang. let's get an update on the markets with kriti gupta. you have been looking at retail, what do you see? kriti: the e-commerce boom keeps going. look at this chart that compares e-commerce companies to retail sales. you can see the method, even after we reopen the economy, the
method people choose to shop is still undeniably e-commerce. you can see the shift in beating retail sales that happened during the pandemic, that has not changed. i want to look at some of those major global e-commerce retailers. that's kick it off with amazon. you can look at the divergence. shopify out performing in a big way. alibaba receptive, vulnerable to the regulatory scrutiny. that is why you have seen the drop by 45%. amazon as well. at the whim of the logistics of supply chain concerns. shopify is doing something right, they are up 34%. it is not just their global peers, they are also beating the canadian benchmark. shopify is a canadian company and it is a heavy hitter. you can see not only has it been helping the index rally but it has been outperforming by a huge amount. the question, is that going to be the trend in 2022? emily: thanks so much. let's get more on those shopping
trends with shopify president harley finkelstein. harley, great to have you back after a busy few days. what are the big takeaways from black friday and cyber monday? how does it all stacked up? -- stack up? harley: at the end of friday, i tweeted that my prediction for this black friday is going to be that direct to consumer brands and small businesses would be the winners and that this season would be a barometer for consumer interests. so, black friday set the stage for the weekend. we saw total global sales of $2.9 billion friday alone. interestingly enough, in 2019 we crossed $2.9 billing for the entire weekend and this year we did it in one day. now we have the entire weekend. we saw a $6.3 billion shopify
increase on friday, a 23% increase year on year. 47 million consumers made a purchase over the weekend. average cart price was up to $100. people spend more. when you compare that to industrywide results, what you are seeing is that shopify merchants outpaced the industry at astonishing rates. it indicates that independent brands were the winners. emily: i have seen a lot of shopify over the past few days, trying to get my own shopping done. on the other hand, you have adobe coming out saying spending on cyber monday fell for the first time ever this year, clocking in at $10.7 billion or so. how do you square that? harley: it is a tale of two retail worlds. consumers are voting with their wallets to buy independent brands. when you look at the brands doing well, whether it is albert's, or skims, those are all shopify stores.
-- which recently went public, told us they had record sales this season. we are seeing these brands doing very well. also. we are seeing more of the legacy of traditional brands like lego and doctors, also coming to shopify. it is quite clear the future of retail looks like independent brands and not legacy big-box retailers. emily: why do you think they are coming to shopify versus other options like amazon or walmart? harley: when you sell in a marketplace, you are effectively renting customers. more and more brands want to have a direct relationship with their end consumer. that is the first thing. the second thing is when you sell on shopify, you are doing two things. you are selling across every surface area. i was on the show a couple weeks back talking about our integration with tiktok and instagram. when you sell on shopify, you
can sell across every area. when you hit the launch button on your shopify store you are essentially default global. this idea you can get started on shopify, but then go public, that makes us unique. emily: there is a lot of fear right now about supply chain shortages. will you get your stuff on time? will you get the stuff you want? my mom started shopping in october. harley: mine too. emily: how is this impacting consumer decisions and how bad is the shortage? harley: merchants on shopify have been resilient. they have gone from one obstacle to the next. we keep seeing this read -- great resilience. shipping delays have accelerated consumer shopping earlier like
your mom and my mom and we are encouraging that and letting merchants know it is better. the supply chain reality looks different for large retailers and independent businesses. what people assume is that these big-box retailers mayfair better versus independents because they have more scale but that is not the case. what we have seen is direct to consumer brands have stronger margins and can better leverage technology. we are seeing merchants fare better than the biggest retailers because of the razor thin margins. emily: what are your expectations? is everybody done? there are still procrastinators out there. harley: there are still procrastinators out there. i think you will see shopping continue. with black friday, the fact we saw over $6 billion happen in four days is still very important. i think consumers can be shopping for their favorite brands well into christmas.
a lot of that happens on shop five. -- shopify. emily: we are still feeling the pandemic. how will this year compared to next year? what does that mean for shopify? as people go back to brick and mortar, as we saw them do, what does that mean for shopify? harley: shopify is unique because we were a pandemic story where so much digitalization happened and so many people entered entrepreneurship's in rates we had never seen. we are also an amazing recovery story because we have seen our channels. we have a massive business doing brick and mortar stores. for us to be the entrepreneurship company, it means we have to give merchants the ability to sell anywhere and everywhere. we are bullish for a great 2022. emily: harley finkelstein, president of shopify. thank you for joining us. coming up, the latest from the trial of elizabeth holmes and
at the trial continues today, i want to bring in david scott lansky for more. is a professor of law at stanford, codirector of the criminal justice center. david, this case has captured the fixation and fascination of the world. i am curious, what is your reaction to elizabeth holmes' testifying that she was raped at stanford and that motivated her? david: she didn't just testify about being raped at stanford, she also testified that sonny --, who has also been charged in the case, repeatedly abused her in the course of their long-term romantic relationship. that is not the typical defense you see in a fraud case. emily: what is the typical defense you see in a fraud case? what makes this unusual?
david: the typical defense is the rest of what elizabeth holmes has testified to during her time on the stand. she believed in the company, she relied on others, she delegated authority, she wasn't intentionally trying to deceive anyone. that is ultimately what the prosecutors have to prove, not just that she deceived people, but that she intended to lie to people and deceive them. so, her state of mind is critical. it is quite common in fraud cases for defendants to say they were not trying to deceive anyone and they were themselves deceived. what is not common is to hear testimony about the kind of sexual abuse and rape that elizabeth holmes discussed on the stand.
emily: her attorneys lined up a psychologist to specializes in domestic violence trauma as a potential witness. how difficult do you imagine this defense will be to pull off? what does that signal to you about what is coming next? david: it is hard to say how difficult it will be. i am not in the courtroom. the jurors are hearing more evidence than any of us who are learning about it secondhand. it is an unconventional defense in a high-level fraud case. part of the reason for that is that most high-level executives are men. it is unusual to begin with to have a high level executive charged in a fraud case who is a woman. for her to argue that the jury needs to understand the intimate partner abuse she was suffering,
it is not something we have precedent for in fraud cases so it is hard to know how it will play. emily: that is the big question. what other evidence, what else is the jury going to need to hear to make their final call? david: they will want to hear more evidence. they are going to hear more evidence about exactly who was making decisions and what elizabeth holmes new when she made the representations she made to investors and patients. i think the way that they assess this other -- having to deal with intimate partner abuse and violence will depend in part on what the defense argues is the significance, what effect they say this pattern of abuse had on elizabeth holmes. also, what the jury winds up believing about the effect the
pattern of abuse had on elizabeth holmes' mental state. emily: how often do you hear the defendant testify in a case like this? we didn't know whether holmes would testify at all, here she is on her fifth day. david: in criminal cases, generally, it is unusual for defendants to testify. i think it is more common in high-level fraud cases. partly because these are not the -- prior criminal convictions. one thing that keeps a lot of defendants off the stand are rules of evidence that say when you testify, your prior criminal record can be introduced against you. elizabeth holmes does not have to worry about a prior criminal record, and that is fairly common for defendants in high-level fraud cases. the other thing that is true is
that these cases often involve defendants who are articulate and self-confident. they have gotten themselves to where they are in life in part by their ability to talk convincingly to people. they tend to put a lot of faith in their ability to talk to people and often they have good reason to do so. it is not as unusual in these cases to see a defendant take the stand and testify. to hear a defendant by impersonal terms about the kinds of things that elizabeth holmes has testified about is unusual. emily: last question, does the case -- is it more likely to go in the defendants favor if they testify? david: it depends on the circumstances. it depends on what the evidence suggests, how convincing the defendant is on the stand and
how convincing the prosecutors are. emily: lots to digest as elizabeth holmes continues to testify. david sklansky, stanley morrison professor of law, stanford criminal justice center. we appreciate your perspective. well, electric cars will account for about half of all auto sales in the world's major markets by 2030. this, according to a new survey of car executives by kpmg. ev's make up less than 10% of global sales now, but execs predict that will increase as battery powered vehicles reached the cost of combustion engine vehicles. ev's are not just for mainstream
consumers, we are seeing them in the world of racing. there is a new motor sport that is racing to save the planet. >> going fast. this is literally a race for the planet. ♪ >> it is a brand-new motor sport. fully electric, off-road vehicles traveling to remote parts of the planet but do not normally see motorsport or any kind of racing of any kind. the areas we are traveling to, we are able to bring a spotlight to climate change. unlike other international -- that travel the globe -- [indiscernible]
they are not seeing the learning part of it. i think we are all excited. >> the scientists onboard will get an opportunity to collect data from each location, even from the oceanic journey from one location to the next, and establish a status quo of where we are at to teach the rest of the world. >> a lot of people think electric cars are slow. that is obviously not true. this helps people understand that you can have an electric car, you can go fast. >> that is a great point. it is an exciting new form of motorsport. it is not trying to reinvent any other motorsport, it has not been done before. on these remote tracks that have never been raced or seen these kinds of vehicles. ♪ >> motorsport from the beginning i think, works and has worked for more than 100 years by pushing the envelope of technology with cars. whether it was coming up with a
nine bearing system back in 1911 that was more reliable or whatever, it has always pushed the envelope on what is reliable and safe. also, with performance. with electric, ev, motorsports can behave the same way. it comes at a pivotal time. we are able to prove in an exciting way that you can take cars and race them, expand their technology, innovate their safety and performance and reliability in a way that is even a positive impact in the end on the environment and sheds light on issues that are out there. simple things individuals can do to affect change on a huge scale. this opens the door for manufacturers to stay involved in motorsport, as they have through the decades. you can see the halls of these racecars, they have all pushed the envelope of technology. now the era is ev, and pushing that is critical.
we don't demonstrate through series like extreme e that motorsport can be done in a responsible way and positively impact global issues, then you may not be a world where motorsport survives much longer. i think this is a critical time for motorsport. the future of motorsport depends on us finding compelling ways to race these cars against each other to prove their safety, reliability and performance to consumers in order to have motorsport survive. >> it is a simple way of alternatively thinking and reusing the spaces we once consumed. emily: matthew long, there. all right. dealing with major labor pains. we talk about it all, next.
emily: amazon facing not one but two labor issues in alabama. the nlrb is granting warehouse workers a second union vote. another labor union is calling on the department of labor to investigate the company on its reporting of covid cases. we are in the middle -- just finishing black friday-cyber monday shopping spree. amazon is dealing with these issues. what did the nlrb find so objectionable?
spencer: if we remember, this went down during the pandemic. ordinarily these votes would take place on premise, at the worksite with nlrb officials there conducting the election. because of the pandemic, they did this one via mail. amazon objected to that, did not want a male in election, but the board said we are going to have a mailing election. the more workers who voted, the -- amazon was concerned about it, they figured the more workers who voted, the better chance they had. they installed a mailbox, appealed to the united states postal service to get a mailbox installed on the facility come out in the parking lot. that really angered the labor relations board. they said amazon has put itself too much in the middle of this process by putting a mailbox out there that was in view of surveillance cameras, encouraging employees to use the mailbox. it was really doing a lot of things that the labor board should be doing in terms of overseeing the election and encouraging people to participate. emily: meantime, you've got a labor group saying amazon's underreporting cases of covid-19. what can you tell us?
spencer: this is a report that just hit today. a labor group calling on osha, the federal workplace regulators, to investigate amazon and how it reported covid-19 instances that were work related. last year, osha required employers to report any work-related covid-19 cases as respiratory problems. what this labor group did was pull all of amazon's disclosures to osha and found that amazon reported only 27 potential work-related covid cases. out of its entire u.s. operation. that's out of 20,000 employee cases. emily: ok. lots to digest there, especially as the holiday shopping season continues. spencer soper, thanks for that update.
>> the following is a paid program. the opinions and views expressed do not reflect those of bloomberg lp, its affiliates, or its employees. >> this is a paid advertisement for csn. >> many times i have been out here with a new corn release, and i have asked for a drumroll. in all honesty, it has been nothing but hyperbole. but this time, i would really like a drumroll. i don't think i will get one, but i think i should have it. i think this is the singular most