those numbers became vacillated. they never broke through. they always gave us trouble in there. >> thanks, terry. we're going out with what looks like a minus sign, but you never know. we could get some late buying here with the dow down about four points. stay tuned. the ceo of dupont coming up on the second hour of the "closing bell" with maria bartiromo. i'll see you tomorrow. >> and it is 4:00 on wall street. do you know where your money is? hi, everybody, welcome back to the "closing bell." i'm maria bartiromo on the stock of the new york stock exchange. closing in the red after the dow closed at an all-time high. dow industrial average down just about nine points at 15,966. we're about -- closer to 16,000 there. the nasdaq gave up 17 points. technology rolling over and the s&p 500 down about a quarter of a percent at a level of 1787. dow missing a chance to close

above that 16,000 mark for the first time. we did have pretty good volatility in the final hour of trading. bob pisani has been tracking today's actions. >> dow industrials, fairly narrow trading range. 60 points in the dow. i heard a lot of jaw boning over markets being oversold but i don't see a lot of people acting on their displeasure with the markets. we're staying with status quo. housing releeltd stocks had a great day. home depot, raised their guidance, a new high for them. vulcan and masco come out with their numbers tomorrow. retail stocks, tjx raised their full-year guidance as well. the one weak group we're seeing continues to be high beta names particularly in the internet space. you see netflix, yelp, zillow, groupon, not a lot of news but lift.

3-d printers, no news i saw that was out today but that's a significant drop. they have had a great run throughout the year. the only characteristic, high beta as well. would he get the fmoc minutes tomorrow and a couple of fed officials were out trying to jaw bone down interest rates, trying to keep the bond vigilantes at bay. charles evans not bountiful accommodation is needed. fed chair nominee janet yellen said monetary policy is likely to remain highly accommodative. seems to be working. ten-year note, 2.71%. slowly moved to the upside but not dramatically. they have to keep those numbers low. they get to 3%, i think the stock market is going to have a very, very difficult time. back to you. >> thank you so much. to talk more about this investing is meg green, ceo of meg green associates, tim leech, david kudla from mainstay, and jonathan murray from ubs. good to see everybody.

thank you for joining us. appreciate that. jonathan, let me kick this off with you and let me ask you about putting money to work in this market here. would you put new money given the market is at close to record highs? >> definitely, maria. i think investors have been seeing the same thing since you started at cnbc and i started at peabody mg years ago, which seems like now seems like the most difficult time to invest. right now. today we have any number of reasons for that, whether it's the fed ort side of the balance sheet or what bob pisani was talking about, worry about rise of inflation rate but market is sitting around 15 times earnings rate so it's not bad. >> tim, your clientele is really an upper end clientele, right? >> that's right. >> what are they doing right now? what are you advising them to do? are they risk adverse or looking at valuations and wanting in in this market? >> most of our clients, maria, are long-term oriented. so, they're looking through most of the shorter term volatility

than typically happens in the marketplace. their emotions make them feel more shorter term oriented so our guidance is to get them through that volatility and keep them focused on longer term. >> how do you do that? >> we do that by talking about the difficulty of trying to actually ferret through why the market has volatility in the short term about how difficult it is to try to really predict short-term movements in the marketplace and keep their eye on the ball given the fundamentals. >> so, i'm trying to zero in on the fundamentals. what is the answer? do i put new money to work in this market? do you think the fundamentals are strong? are you worried here? . >> the fundamentals are very strong. we're seeing that come through. as we look out over the longer term, having exposure to growing

earning streams is a very good thing. >> david kudla, jump in here. is that how you see it? what do you think about this market? >> we're instructive on the stock market through year end. we heard a lot of talk about bubbles. we think we're in a market meltup. that's just hedge fund managers, playing catch-up, retail investors wanting to be in this market. as a previous guest said, fundamentals are still sound for this market as we continue into the end of the year and into next year. we have the central banks around the world. bank of japan, bank of england, ecb, the fed, they're all easy. monetary policy is very conducive to continuing bull market. those economies are all growing in unison. for the first time in a long time. when we look at robust auto sales, housing recovery, data today on suppliers, we're not headed toward recession. we're headed toward 3% gdp growth next year. and that is certainly -- bodes

well for stocks. >> and what would it take to make you a little more cautious? what are the red flags if you look out six months to a year? >> if rates were to spike, if interest rates were to start to move up very aggressively, you know, we saw -- we get a taste for that, a shot across the bow with a concern for tapering and rates went up significantly. if there were a reason that rates were to climb aggressively, that could be bad for the market. if rates ascend a slow assent and that's in combination with improving economy and improving fund mebl fundamentalings, that's not bad for stocks. but sharp raise in rates. >> meg green, i know you still like this market. >> i do like the market. if the rates go up, it's because we're doing well. corporate america's become very lean and mean. they've gotten rid of a lot of fat, a lot of employees,

unfortunately, are not yet finding their way back to work. but the companies are rich with cash and they're doing great. you have to be worldwide. this is a worldwide reflation, in my book. if you look at the real estate book, i'm in florida, south florida the real estate is booming. look at london, new york, los angeles. so, when you have all this money chasing after real estate, it's not sitting in the bank earning nothing. it's not heading to bonds. it has to go to equities and worldwide up. find your pockets where maybe things have dragged a little bit. maybe you don't jump into momentum stocks although i'm still a tesla lover. if you think about the world and how world economies are working today, all this easing or quantitative easing is simply printing. where is all that money going to go? it's going into the markets and to real estate. gold is down, so gold is no longer an inflation hedge, as they called it. i like to wear my gold. but i think that we don't have

to be afraid of this. i think it's a good time to be invested. >> maria, one cautionary note on that. i would be concerned about some of the high-fliers this year like tesla and netflix. if we do get a pullback, say, in the first quarter, we get through year end, you know, those are the stocks that are really susceptible to a pullback. >> have to focus on dividends, growth of dif densd. that will sustain baby boomers. they'll be in retirement for as long as they've been in the workforce. they need a stable and growing dividend stream. i would have investors focus on that. >> final word, tim. >> agree. but have you to put growth in the portfolio. >> tim leach, you're up. >> all the fundamentals, we're in agreement on fundamentals but i think the market has gone very far, very fast this year. i think last week, for example, the market kind of to a certain extent got complacent with the idea that with yellen now likely to be in place, that the taper is going to be pushed off into

the sdants future. we think that will likely be a surprise. when the tapering happens sooner than many think, that could be a pullback to reality in this marketplace. that could be -- >> that's going to be good news. >> longer term, i agree with you. >> that's good news. >> longer term. >> thanks, everybody. really appreciate it. >> bye. >> see you soon. microsoft holding annual shareholder meeting today. big talk, who will replace outgoing ceo steve ballmer. josh lipton live in bellevue, washington. >> reporter: it was an historic day at microsoft shareholder meeting. the last meeting with steve ballmer as ceo. ballmer's record at microsoft is mixed. revenue jumped but critics say he mixed big tech trends like mobile and social. stock is up sharply this year but down 25% under his watch. bill gates at the shareholder meeting today gave no guidance

for when a new yi would be picked. he did seem to get choked up when talking about his friend, steve ballmer. >> we've got a commitment to make sure the next ceo is the right person for the right time for the company we both love. and we share a commitment that microsoft will succeed as a company that makes the world a better place. >> top picks to replace ballmer mentioned, ford ceo allen mulally and former nokia ceo elop, as well as kevin turner, coo and nadella of cloud and shared enterprise. microsoft made a point of emphasizing their cloud products. whoever replace ballmer and strategis, the new ceo will face new challenges as microsoft

repositions itself for this post-pc era. back to you. >> josh, thank you so much. josh lipton. still to come on "closing bell," do you believe that jpmorgan is safe enough to buy in the wake of its $13 billion settlement with the federal government? that is ahead. industrial giant dupont splitting its company in two. ceo ellen kullman joins me exclusively next to tell me what it means for the company and your portfolio and if a certain activist investor was behind the move. you're watching "closing bell" on cnbc.

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take a look at the chart. stock is up but the company has been under pressure from activist investor nelson peltz one month ago dupont announced spinoff of chemical unit. joining me is dupont chairman and ceo ellen kullman. nice to have you back on the program. dupont has been buying back stock.

i know you've been talking to investors while in town. what are you telling them in terms of what you would like this company to look like three years down the road? >> when you think about -- strengthening our materials portfolio, rebuilding out -- like an animal nutrition or personal care, but also will help create new offering in advanced materials in ag and nutrition. we focus on those three priorities for our company. >> have you said other spinoffs are on the horizon? >> we've gone through the sale of performance coding. we're spinning off the chemicals division. our presidents are selling lines on acquisitions. that i expect them to do on an

ongoing basis. major portfolio transformation, we have done a great job and focused on those three areas. >> your business is such a good vantage point in terms of what's going on in the economy? what can you tell us about what that tells us about the world today? >> it's interesting. each sector looks really different. it still depends on what region of the world you're in. one thing that's consistent around the world is agriculture. even with commodity prices coming down, agriculture is still strong. value science and what it can do to increase yield. things like insecticides to reduce pest pressure. very important part of the ag economy. very local market. tastes are different around the world. we've localized our science in china, in india, in brazil and to build out differentiated portfolios. protect people in the environment, really important you're seeing that not only in

the developed world but in the developing world as well. >> activist investor nelson peltz has acquired a substantial stake in the company. have you met with mr. peltz or his partners recently? >> we meet with all of our investors, including them. we've always listened to our investors. we have 930 million shares and thousands of investors. we take time to understand how they view the company. we take time to explain the company strategy to them. and i think that's important part of the process, to continue to have our shareholders understand where we're going, how we're creating a higher value, higher growth, less cyclical company, that's really going to perform very, very well. >> are you qconsidering some of peltz's ideas for spin-outs? >> we consider all of the ideas. some we help them understand why the facts of the company are different than some of the assumptions they're making. >> i guess what i'm asking you, do his ideas make sense? are you going to do any of them? >> you know, we -- when i take a

look at the ideas investors bring us, some make imminent sense. how do we return cash to sha shareholde shareholders? we're tries the proxy peers or s&p. we've returned more cash to shareholders through dividends and buybacks than our peers have as well. we have a strong shareholder record of delivering value. with the changes we're making in the portfolio, we're going to continue to deliver that value to them. >> you're still talking about a tremendous return this year and over the years. you bought back $1 billion in stock this year. what's the priority? and how do you arrive at that being the priorities? >> when you think of uses of the cache cash of the company. there's buybacks and dividends, there's r&d, capital expenditures. we believe dividend is important. we think it has to grow in line with earnings. then when you have events that

occur, like sale of performance codings or things like that, it always gives you an opportunity to take a look and see whether a buyback, a one-time distribution basically as opposed to dividend as an ongoing distribution makes more sense. >> you said that things are going well in the businesses, but when you look around the world for us, europe feels like it's bottomed. emerging markets continue to see outflows. where's the weakness and growth based on your business globally? >> the weakness comes from uncertainty. you know, europe and japan, are we seeing positive growth? a tiny bit. we think that's positive verse the negatives we've seen. but we still see people holding back. china is getting better. china is improving. there's a little stability on the industrial side, in automotive and food ingredients. we're seeing a big difference this year versus last year. >> a lot of people saying that about china. >> and i think they've said they want to grow at 7. i think they will. take a look at the united states, housing is strong. automotive is strong.

other sectors, i think, are holding back. we still have the uncertainty of what's going to happen next year with the debt and the ceiling. and i think that's creating some hesitancy. >> is that why increasingly we hear ceos are sitting on cash, unwilling to allocate too much capital in any one area because of this uncertainty of what's around the corner? >> i think between what's the tax policy in the united states is going to be -- what is the economic climate going to be, people are -- want to make sure that if they invest it, that that return is pretty assured, it's almost guaranteed. >> the other thing is ceos across the board, across the world, certainly across america r making decisions on dealing with the affordable care act. how has that impacted dupont? >> we take a look at health care and realize change has to be on the horizon. we as consumers of health care have to approach it the same way we do other activities where we're spending money. we have to be consumers of health care. so, we're working on wellness programs. we're working on, you know, high deductible plans where even i

need to be a much more informed consumer of health care. is that will help the entire industry create the efficiencies we need to keep health care inflation where it is. it's not just us. i think it's across industry. >> the onus is on the individual. so, have you changed any plans in terms of individual plans given the new cost of health care? >> you know, we've moved and are moving our people born to high deductible plans. i just did it. we just did our benefits enrollment this past week where we have a savings account for our employees, health care savings account. and there's a higher deductible but then a resource they can utilize to understand how much will it cost to have this done one doctor versus another, or in one clinic or hospital versus another. and how can they best use their health care dollars to get the maximum for them? coupling that with wellness. how should we be exercising, nutrition, you know, focused on making sure we don't get long-term issues associated

with, you know, poor health. >> and it's a great point. and it's -- that's actually one of the positives that have come out of this, this more awareness on wellness. what kind of a 2014 are you expecting? >> as we approach 2014, we're approaching it with caution. you know, we see stability in terms of china and where that's moving. we i think the u.s. is still a wild card. and the fear is, will europe and japan, both of which have made progress forward, are they going to step back or step forward? so, i think we're still continuing to have a cautious outlook toward 2014. >> you know, the new abeconomics in japan, his policies have been heralded as a new era for japan after two decades of really a tough place to invest. do you believe in those policies? do you think this is going to work? >> so, we think -- we think we've soon improvement. the question is, can it last? how sustainable is it? >> europe is very bifurcated. germany has been doing better

than everybody else. is that still the case? >> northern europe has always had much more strength than southern europe. we're seeing southern europe bottom. you know, eastern europe, places like in eastern europe have still shown great growth, so it's actually not bifurcated. it's trifurcated if you include eastern europe. >> good point. we see another big fight going into the debt ceiling debate. is that going to hamper business that much more? >> i hope we don't see it. i hope we figure out a way to get there. i don't think there will be a grand deal but i think there's a way to make it such that it creates a little more certainty going forward. i think that will help the u.s. economy. i think it will help industrial production. i think it's held back industrial production in the united states in 2013. and i think we really need it to create a good forward momentum in 2014. >> great to have you on the program. >> great to see. >> you you, too. >> ellen kullman, chairman and ceo of dupont. $13 billion should be a lot -- be able to buy a lot, but is it enough to protect jpmorgan

from future federal lawsuits and investigations? the answer could be if jpmorgan is a buy or not and give you the latest on the settlement announced today. clients are always learning more

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any splices of what we learned today? >> reporter: you know, maria, it was mostly as planned. although it is interesting to note this criminal investigation of the mortgage-backed securities is ongoing, something jpmorgan acknowledged and the doj highlighted in its press release. i want to point people's attention to the fact that jpmorgan is hosting an investor call momentarily. it starts around 4:30. we'll be hearing from dimon and cfo mary ann lake. my guess is they'll seek to reassure investors by saying, we fully reserved for this $13 billion. they'll break down other issues ahead of them and walk people through them. there's no down about the fact there is still a significant legal overhang right here. not only is there potential criminal faces of the mortgage-backed securities probe, and i think we'll get more detail from that from the u.s. attorney in sacramento imminently. he's holding a press event as we speak as well and is leading that investigation. but there's also a wide array of other legal issues going on.

now, on the good side, new york attorney general eric schneiderman praised jpmorgan for taking the lead on these issues, and the fact they're doing so much for customer relief and they finally put an end to at least this phase of it, maria, i think is probably an encouraging sign for investors and possibly also for some of their peers. >> kate, thank you so much. kate kelly. after laying out $13 billion, is jpmorgan finally in the clear signaling a time to buy the stock or stay away? chris wahalen, down on all the banks. todd hagan managing investor from stern ag. he says the time may be right to buy jpmorgan. you're down on all the banks? >> i'm not down on the bacnks. they're guiding down. press attention on settlements and litigation has object cured the operating guidance we've

been getting from the bank, ms. lake, cfo of jpmorgan, second quarter she told everybody mortgage would be down 40% in the sending half of the year. in fact, all of the banks have now guided lower. that's one of their most important businesses. so i think for investors, what i would tell them is, it's significant keep to keep up what's going on with these settlements, the numbers are big, but pay attention to what's going on on the pralgt side. >> it's a game-changer. >> it's a combination of dodd/frank, basel, lit gailgt ga litigation, affecting operation. it's limiting the way banks can make money. if they can't depend on mortgages, one of the significant revenue generators, they have to change their business models. the volcker rule. all of these things have contributed to hurting visibility on revenues and earnings doesn't exist. if you do have visibility, it's down. >> that's a good point. todd, you're on the other side of that trade. you say it is time to buy jpmorgan. >> i like jpmorgan a lot.

in fact, as i heard the earlier comments from the standpoint in terms-h terms of the significant overhang from a legal standpoint, don't know if i would go that far. i think it's very clear, as you look at reactions among jpmorgan's peers today, it's very clear investors are saying, hey, look, it's a tough pill to swallow from an investor standpoint. from a management standpoint. but clearly we're in the later innings here from a legal standpoint. without a doubt, there are mo more -- there's more legal and liabilities out there, but this is a pretty sweeping settlement we've seen today. it's going to accompany -- reflecting a company that has the earnings power to support something like this. if you go back to the earnings and the $93 billion charge they took for the legal liability, it was -- you barely saw a blink of an eye with respect to the stock on that day. since then, it's only outperformed to this point. >> what about that? >> but, maria, book value you

would say jpmorgan is fairly valued, given their growth prospects. you know, wells fargo, almost 1 1/2 times book. that's very fully valued in my view. really citi, b of a would be more interesting plays but most of the banks today are dividend plays. these are becoming utilities. >> what about that, when you look at the operating story, does that shift the expectation at all? >> it really doesn't. again, if you look at jpmorgan, you look at the core businesses and put aside for the moment the significant legal liability that we're dealing with today, this is a company that, on average, has return on capital between 14%, 17% over the last 12 months or so. unquestionably among the top in its class. and to suggest it should trade at tangible book value given the capital generation it has, the growth, the leading market share in each of its businesses, i

think is really misguided, quite frankly. i think it's a great opportunity right here. >> what about when the economy recovers. does the company have earnings potential growth once the economy starts showing sustained growth? >> yeah. i mean, what you're seeing right now, definitely a rotation back into the large money center banks. they're the cheapest within the large money sector. as you point out, they're probably the most levered to an improving economy. given the revenue diversity they have, given the low cost of funding, these things are very inexpensive. the most levered to any incremental improvement in the economy and we're seeing that rotation back into these names right now, in part, because of that. >> well, look, i think you always see people rotating back into the large cap banks. they have nowhere else to go, maria. once you get below u.s. bank corp they're very liquid. having said that, where are we going to find the revenue? we have no more principal activities and losing half of

mortgage revenue? same with wells, if you look at earnings releases from the third quarter, they're pretty grim. they're forthright. folks at mother goon have been saying that. i'm a banker and i look at these from fundamentals. you know that. i think at the end of the day, i think the banks are becoming utilities. ironically, it's the nonbanks that do have basel 3 that will have the growth. >> we'll leave it there. great insight on both sides of the story. i guess that's what makes the market. >> thank you. good luck. >> chris, thank you very much. the affordable care act of late, recent headlines about health care have been anything but encouraging. i'll have interview revolutionizing care. potential headache for president obama. a report today the census bureau made up data in an important jobs survey leading up to the 2012 presidential election. details on this controversy coming up. stay with us. ♪ norfolk southern what's your function? ♪

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not a big move for the overall market. dow down eight point. certain stocks were on the move big time. dominic chu with the highlights. >> let's kick things off with

la-z-boy stock. same store sales for furniture galleries rose nearly 10%. those shares on the rise. devon energy, planning a deal with geoenergy for $6 billion. we called devon energy and they say they do not comment on rumors and speculation. one of the largest oil and gas companies in the u.s. pandora singing the blues, falling 3 % after getting smacked with a downgrade to albert freed. remember, pandora does report its earnings on thursday. and then jacobs engineering. shares sank about 6% today. the technical protection and mining services company reported earnings that fell short marks rhea, of analyst estimates. back over to you. >> thank you so much. billionaire carl berg is an

amazing story of self-made success. a vending machine repairman who paid his own way through college. he turned his real estate investment into a highly coveted poer portfolio he sold for more than $1 billion. j joining me now in a cnbc exclusive is carl berg. good to have you on the program. >> thank you. >> almost a year ago you sold your real estate portfolio for $1.3 billion. now you run berg & berg and backing a number of interesting technology companies. why did you put your exposure to real estate as much as you did? >> well, i'd been in the business for 45 years. just felt it was a good time to get out. during that entire time i've been in venture capital. my first real estate deal was actually a venture capital deal where we invested in the company that leased our building. so, i've been doing that for 45 years. >> where are you seeing the

opportunity in venture capital right now? i know you're in life sciences. how big is the opportunity? what are you seeing? >> i think it's absolutely huge. the company that we have, berg, basically has the opportunity to revolutionize health care. >> i love this idea. i've been looking at the idea of sensors very closely, inserting a sensor into your bloodstream and it will alert you to when you're going to have a heart attack and tell you when to go to the doctor. or taking pictures of a skin disease in india and having the best doctors all around the world look at it because of the technology. what specific areas do you find most exciting in terms of where the growth is right now in life sciences? >> well, the approach we're taking on this is we're using biology to determine the differences between a healthy person and a person that has a disease.

then we're taking all of that data and we exclude no data whatsoever. and we're taking all of that data and running it through super computers. and with that process and the patented process we use, we're able to come up with biomarkers and drug targets. and if we're successful, and all indications are, we will be, we'll be able to revolutionize the drug industry. the other thing we do, we work only with proteins that exist in the body. so, this eliminates most f not all of the side effects and toxicity. >> i see. >> so f what we're doing works, it just changes everything. >> well, i mean, it sounds like a similar opportunity as 23 and me. of course, started by ann

wojiski where you spit in a tube and they tell you various diseases you're susceptible to. is that similar to what you're talking about? >> not really. it's a slightly different approach. we're primarily looking for drug targets and biomarkers that can determine the disease. for example, our first -- our first drug is a cancer drug that's now being tested at m.d. anderson and cornell in new york city. and we're going to start later this week in palo alto medical foundation. >> that's terrific. it sounds so innovative. let me ask you. you were one of the first investors in sunmicro. that was a big hit for you. integrated device technologies, another one of our companies. what is your take on the evolvement of technology space, in terms of cloud computing, the boom in some of these retail areas like smartphones and tablets, social media.

do you think there's a bigger growth potential in life sciences as it relates to technology as opposed to some of these other areas of tech that we're zeroing in on so much, like the cloud? >> well, i think the life sciences are going to take advantage of all these new things that are happening. the technology market is going to radically change over the next two or three years. we're going to see a whole new generation of technology in the technology market also. but fundamentally, biotech is going to take advantage of this. and that's what our company does. we do 41 trillion transactions on a super computer. and then we get results. one of the things that's really amazing that we're able to do, we get a result that looks like a pc board. and then we're able to overlay cancer, diabetes, heart disease, and obesity on top of each other

and understand the connections between each one of these diseases. >> yeah, which is why we see watson working so closely with folks like cleveland clinic and watson working alongside health care companies. super computer really is able to digest information and data so much faster than humans. >> with some of the technology coming out in the next year or two, when we first started using our platform, it was taking us up to a month or so to get all of the data back from the -- from the computer operator. >> right. >> now we're doing that in a day or two. and in the near future, we'll be able to do that in hours. >> great stuff. carl, good have you on the program. thanks very much. >> thank you. >> we'll see you soon. we appreciate your time tonight. a washington scandal or a misleading headline? the new york post reporting that the census bureau faked data that went into the unemployment figures just weebs before the

last presidential election. steve liesman clearing it up for us. chicago and other towns facing critical decisions. opportunities aren't always obvious. sometimes they just drop in. cme group can help you navigate risks and capture opportunities. we enable you to reach global markets and drive forward with broader possibilities. cme group: how the world advances.

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there was speculation in some circles a month before the presidential election in 20 12 that somehow the unemployment numbers were skewed to be more positive than they should have been. it was widely discounted. today an exclusive story in the

new york post claims bogus data made it into the jobs report leading up to the presidential election. steve liesman with more on the story. >> cnbc has learned the person named in that new york post report, who is alleged to have fabricated data, has not worked at census since august 2011. this would appear to eliminate him as source of the fabricated data leading up to the 2012 presidential election. census told me, quote, we have no reason to believe this is anything more than an isolated incident by an employee who was willfully ignores census procedures and the law. we have uncovered fabricated data from time to time but they were always referred to the inspector general's office and they were monitoring systems in place to check this. the new york post quotes an unnamed source saying, quote, he's not the only one, speaking of julius buckman. they say this escalated ahead of the 2012 election. cnbc cannot confirm these

allegations and president obama's spokesman, jay carney, denied these allegations today. >> that story is misleading. i think a lot of people shed a lot of credibility in engaging in conspiracy theories about rigged jobs number. month after month after month the jobs numbers came in and later revised upward, sure didn't feel like they were helping us. >> the unemployment rate did decline sharply in september 2012 ahead of that november elections. dropping from 8.1% to 7.8%. that tied it for the third biggest monthly decline since 1990. the data showed there was a huge spike in the number of employed household survey. it remains unclear from "the post" story if numbers were fake, were they fake for political gain or was the employee just trying short-circuit his work? why unemployment has declined and stayed down over this time

period. the separate payroll survey, jobs have remained strong there. did all the allegedly fake data lower the unemployment rate? or could it have raised unemployment? several people contacted by cnbc today said it would take a large number of people involved in faking data to move the unemployment rate. each government worker who gathers survey data contributes only a small amount to each report. >> so, steve, what do you think is the answer then here? >> i think there was almost certainly some incident with a specific employee. i think they're gathering an enormous amount of data, 60,000 interviews every month, maria, just for the unemployment report, just to determine the unemployment rate. i think there were problems from time to time. i don't see any evidence of a conspiracy ahead of the election but i think it's a matter that requires investigation. because the sanctity of this data is important, not just for markets, but the federal reserve makes policy on, this the unemployment rate and what happens to unemployment rate is used to figure out policy. it's important for the general

public that this data is good. >> steve liesman, thank you so much. chicago known as second city is ranking number one on a list it wishes it was not on. in part two of our series if the city put all of its revenue towards pensions for the next zseven years it would barey make them whole. detroit, only about 1.5 times. even in some cities where everything seems to be good, there is is a question as to whether everything is as it

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>> welcome back. 30 seconds on the clock for our next guest to tell us what we should be watching for wednesday's session that will move your money. is a close of 16,000 in the cards? joining me now is oliver, ross, and beth, men, good to see you. 30 seconds on the clock. what are you watching for tomorrow? >> it's really simple. it's all about the fed. i will be listening to ben

bernanke's speech tonight to get his insight. tomorrow morning you will have the consumer price index. i am going to be listening for any kind of hints as to whether or not committee members have lowered their threshold for unemployment. >> all right. >> all right. oon the cloud for you. >> usually, i just watch the market action when the market opens. what i'm really looking for is many of the stocks we like right now have pulled back. we're looking for the stock to continue to decline. markets move higher. this is is a very bullish sign. so what we're really looking for is what we're going to see the market tell us to do. that's what i'm looking for tomorrow. >> all right. we will watch that as well.

will we see 16,000? >> i think there is a reasonable and i will be watching. in a loan inflation environment, this really becomes a revenue gain. there is nothing on the top line of globally diversified revenue. look for that again. >> all right. we will look now. >> i put new money to work every day. i would say. >> the three of you -- you're all in. >> i'm always in. >> we appreciate your time tonight. up next, another check on the market. back in a moment. stay with us. [ imitating engine revving ]

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technology continued to roll over and that is really what happened yesterday as well. s&p 500 gave up three and two-thirds report. that will do it for us tonight. thank you so much for joining me. stay with cnbc. fast money begins right now. >> this is "fast money," america's post market show. we are digging deeper. and a ray of light here to explain why he is bullish on one area in the market and why he sees a massive bublg in another. we've got the