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tv   Anderson Cooper 360  CNN  November 23, 2011 11:00pm-12:00am PST

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and some shoppers will go to tremes to get bargain on black friday, the day after thanksgiving. already first in line outside a best buy store, and to keep warm, well, he's wearing a tigger costume. that does it for this edition of 360. thank you for watching. have a happy thanksgiving. a market in turmoil, the dow taking a dive on the debt crisis. and president obama's approval rating way down with white blue collar democrats. can he hope to be re-elected without their support? and the latest from egypt. three american college students jailed in cairo. the mother of one joins us with new details tonight. let's go "outfront." i'm erin burnett outfront tonight, chaos in cairo. amidst it all, three american college students are detained. one of their mothers comes out front tonight. we're going to talk to her in a
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few minutes. but first, we want to show you what it looks like right now in tahrir square. that is a live picture and it's relatively calm, it's 2:00 a.m. local time. the image is in stark contrast, though, what we saw throughout the day and into the evening tonight. rocks and tear gas flew through the air. riot police clashing with protesters who want the nation's military rulers to step down immediately. officials say 35 people are dead. 3,000 injured after five days of protests. now, tahrir square is the same spot where egyptian protesters forced the removal of their long time leader hosni mubarak back in february. i was there during those protests, they were mostly peaceful, it was a rather uplifting experience despite a couple of very bad episodes of violence. but very different than what we see right now. ben wedeman has been there through thick and thin through the very beginning and he's in cairo with the latest. ben, what happened today? what's happening now?
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>> well, today there was a brief respite in the clashes that have been going on around the clock since saturday afternoon. for three hours, the army intervened, put themselves between the protesters and the hated security forces of the interior ministry and managed to calm things down. but as we were right in the middle of it, suddenly i saw a stick fly through the air, then rocks started to come in at the security forces who responded with tear gas, and it was back where we were earlier in the day, and we saw ambulances rushing from that place near the interior ministry to tahrir to these -- basically makeshift field hospitals that have been set up. so it appears that this hope of some sort of respite from the violence has simply gone away and the standoff continues, erin? >> here behind you, there's still people walking, i know and on the streets behind you and
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chanting as it goes through the night. but let me ask you, i'm just curious, we keep seeing these images, it's gotten worse ahead of these elections. but is it cairo in any way starting to return to normal? or has it become a situation of people when they get frustrated they protest and you're not having people go to work and live their normal lives? >> reporter: well, you have to realize that this is just one part of a city of 18 million people. if you go just a couple blocks from here, shops are open, people are trying to go about their business. but, of course, this is the heart of the city through which many of the main roads pass. and so it does sort of change the way people have to go about their business. but you know, i think the nature of television and the media you're seeing these pictures of clashes. but the clashes are in a very small area. and, of course, yes, there's the elections coming up on monday.
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it's not even clear if they're going to take place. there are reports that some in the government are considering postponing them simply because this is sort of occupying the heart of the country. and it does have sort of a paralyzing effect on politics and everybody focuses on this relatively small piece of land behind me. erin? >> all right. well, ben wedeman, thank you very much. reporting from cairo. as i remember even in the heart of the revolution, a block or two away from tahrir square, there were shopkeepers frustrated by the inability to try to make a living. president barack obama is
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stuck in the 40s, we're not talking about the decade, his overall approval numbers. they've lingered there since mid june. and a new cnn poll out today shows that's where he's staying, at least for now. 44% say he's doing a good job and approve of him. when it comes to white collar blue democrats, the president has taken a big hit. let's show you this. cnn poll numbers show 50% don't want to see him on the ticket next year. that is a 24 percentage point drop since the question was asked back in october. what does it mean for the president as election season heats up? it's a stunning number. and fresh off the debate last night. well, who is he going to be running against? there's been big changes on that that today. david gergen joins us. our senior political analyst. jamal, let me start with you and ask you about that precipitous drop among white blue collar democrats. how -- why do you think that has happened so dramatically and so quickly among a group of voters he traditionally has owned? >> well, it's a problem, let's start there. this is not good news for the president. but it is also -- we have to distinguish between white blue collared democrats and white blue collar independents and
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republicans. most democratic -- white democratic swing voters, those reagan democrats everyone talks about, they've left the democratic party. most of them identify themselves as independents, so we're talking about white democratic voters. this was true in the primaries in 2008. they typically end up voting for the democratic nominee or else they probably would've already left. they're satisfied, the president's got to try to figure out why that is and get them energized for the election. that's different than the population of the general election blue collar voter. >> they may be satisfied with him, but i mean, is there any alternative out there? if you look at the republican side where you could see a white blue collar democrat saying all right, we're going to go vote for this candidate. >> white non-college voters are the most depressed, anxious, fearful demographic in the whole country. in fact, they are the group -- only group more likely to say that the future will be worse for them, worse for their children than more than will say it will be worse than it will be better. you don't find anything like that degree of pessimism among blacks and latinos even though those two groups have suffered
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more in this recession. so white democrats don't look very different from white blue collar non-democrats. they are in economic pain. this is going to be the fourth consecutive thanksgiving of economic hardship. and really since the recession started in december of 2007. it's very nearly the fifth consecutive thanksgiving of severe economic hardship for millions and millions of people. and they see a political class, a political system that is just apparently indifferent to them. has nothing to offer them. and the president, of course, takes the blame. >> david gergen, what can he do about it? i would imagine that's a poll number -- very disturbing for his strategists. >> the answer very clear, create jobs. this is a group that barack obama has had trouble with since the beginning. this is a group that hillary
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clinton did very well with in the primaries. and john mccain did pretty well with. i'm in the state of pennsylvania, and i can tell you one of the top democratic pros in the state told me today that if the election were held today mitt romney has a very good chance of beating barack obama in a pivotal often considered safe democratic state. now, what's happening here is that, of course, is that the manufacturing base of the country is falling out from under. and that's where a lot of these folks were employed. and very, very importantly for political purposes, they're often employed in the swing industrial states, whether it's pennsylvania or across ohio and, you know the states. and that's why this is -- that's why this number is so critical for him and why tonight as you look at what's happening in europe, as you started the show, you know, the -- the momentum is growing and you're up for a economic crisis there, which will reverberate here. when the germans have a hard time selling bonds, you know, as they did today, a turn out for the bond sale, that's news that president obama has to be paying attention to in the white house. >> erin, i want to pick up on david's important point there. one of the things that has happened this fall that makes the numbers different is we've had this tremendous rally in the dollar. the dollar has been rising in the fall because of the problems of europe.
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the dollar's back at its purchasing power of 1997, the external purchasing power. so if you're in industrial employment, looking to export markets, you are feeling pressure as compared to say five, six, seven months ago. >> that's right. >> we may be picking up here some early warning, there are layoffs, hours being cut or pay being cut in these industries, it's another warning that the economy may be on a downward trend. >> quickly before we go, david gergen. a pew poll on mormonism came out, something mitt romney's going to be paying close attention. numbers haven't changed since the last election. americans still the same percentage of people, 52% know nothing about mormonism by their own admission. you've got republicans, conservative republicans in iowa now trying to ally against mitt romney. is the mormon issue going to hurt him again? >> well, you know, we've wondered why mitt romney has had a hard time breaking out as a front runner, which typically republican front runners do. and this poll suggests that in the mix -- i don't think the
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driving force, but in the mix, there is a question of mormonism, in addition to the other issues that are swirling around him. >> thanks very much to all three. appreciate it and happy thanksgiving. >> happy thanksgiving. >> thank you. thank you. all right. still outfront, we are going to continue to talk about the story in egypt as we told you. one of the mothers of the boys who has been arrested for throwing cocktails at police there supposedly is in jail. his mother is going to be with us. and we're going to tell you about a very bizarre story. amish men charged with several hate crimes after cutting the beards and hair of other amish women. we have a look at that story and a world shrouded by secrecy where corruption reigns in the world of illegal arms trade. all seem to say throw care away from gas and bloating. with three strains of good bacteria to help balance your colon. you had me at "probiotic." [ female announcer ] phillips' colon health.
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okay... uhh. the bad news, it's probably totaled. the good news is, you don't have to pay your deductible. with vanishing deductible from nationwide insurance, you got $100 off for every year of safe driving, so now your deductible is zero. the other good news ? i held on to your coffee. wow. ♪ nationwide is on your side ( laughing ) it's actually a pretty good day when you consider. that's great. the number tonight is 24. that is how many minutes you can expect to wait to talk to a representative at virgin america airlines. interesting to talk about this on the night before thanksgiving when people are flying all over, virgin america telling people the wait is longer than normal because the company's switching to a new reservation system. the study conducted by cell service found u.s. airs, united, and continental had wait times of over 5 minutes. shortest wait times for hawaiian and alaska. that's under two minutes.
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maybe people going to those places are excited to go. all right. big financial news tonight. the market sinks on fear of debt. a crisis in europe and at home, stocks have fallen, the dow today down 236 points, the s&p down 7% since it started the losing streak, which is now six days. all grim numbers as the nation gets ready for thanksgiving and the biggest spending day of the year. "wall street journal" saying 152 million americans are going to be shopping on friday. that's a lot. half the country. how do we turn the fear into optimism? it can begin in washington with a deal. we know we didn't get one with the super committee and you know how we felt about that, pretty passionately and pretty upset. there's another chance coming up, the extension of the payroll tax cuts which saves americans $1,000 in taxes per year. other things on the table as well. can congress get it done? let's ask congressman, michael grimm, republican from new york. and hopefully not with a grim forecast here as we're talking about the markets. >> absolutely not. >> let me ask you, what happened this week? it was atrocious, it was offensive, it upset americans of
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both political parties. >> sure. >> you were a member of a republican who signed on to a letter saying everything should be on the table. revenues and cuts. >> that's correct. >> there were 140 of you guys, right? >> little bit more, over 150. >> the 12 guys on the super committee couldn't do a deal, why? >> well, in all sincerity i think it's because when the country is this polarized and you're trying to tackle as big of a job as they are. this is big, tax reform and things like this, these are not small issues. you need true leadership at the top, and that's why we needed the president to come in and lead a little bit, and that hasn't happened. and you've seen other presidents do it. president clinton did it, president reagan did it. >> he said he was asked to stay out. he was doing what he was asked. that's his side of it. >> true, true -- because he started from the very beginning saying, well, if there's certain things in it, i'll veto it. so he started a bad precedent. and that's why they said, you know, leave it to us. they kind of pushed him away, but if he would've started with leadership from the beginning, i think we would've had a
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different outcome. but what i really want to say is let's not panic yet. that's the worst thing we can do. this bipartisan issue, house, democrats, working on a deal. i think we can put a lot of pressure on the leadership to bring that to the floor and hopefully go bigger than what the super committee was going to do. >> you think there's still a way -- and by the way $4 trillion for people out there, that is a grand bargain, that is a number that would prevent more downgrades and last for a long time. >> you just hit on something that's extremely important. you're right. it's about preventing further downgrades and how do we really do that? by instilling confidence, not only in the people in the united states but throughout the world that says we understand we're in a debt crisis, but we do have a long-term plan, we're serious and going to start implementing it now. that's what the world is looking for, true leadership. >> when we look at the $4 trillion, we throw up this simple math. everyone wants fundamental tax reform, it'd be great if we could get it. but in lieu of that, bush tax cuts go away with $2.8 trillion, you match it with $2.8 trillion in cuts. >> that would be horrendous.
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>> but it gets you $5 trillion -- >> at a time where there's a constriction in the economy, we're trying to motivate those that create jobs. if we start job-killing taxes to help stimulate the economy, we take a step backwards. it's very delicate, very difficult, can we increase revenue? certainly, but through closing loopholes, through getting some of the 51% of americans who don't pay any taxes now, having them get in the game -- federal taxes having some skin in the game. yeah, there's ways we can increase revenue, but we don't want to start, you know, tax increases, tax hikes that would be job killing across the board. that would be a mistake. >> i think people understand that and get that, but when they look at people over $1 million, and i go to $250,000 line, which is is a different line. having your income be taxed at 39% now going up to 39.6%, it's not that much. >> i understand -- just keep in mind one thing, these are also the people that spend a lot of
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money out there at restaurants. they're the ones buying, you know, new cars, buying, you know, even -- i know it was under attack, the yacht boating industry was under attack. guess what? >> recently, it was. >> there's a lot of people that make $50,000, $60,000, $70,000 a year making those yachts. we don't want to put those industries under either. and i believe when the levels rise, all boats rise -- >> you think that a $4 trillion deal with the position you have on taxes is possible? that congress could surprise us? >> and like i said from the beginning, i'm willing for the purpose of the discussions to put everything on the table. i don't want any preconditions. i don't want to say well, i won't even discuss taxes -- everything is open for discussion. but let's start where we have common ground and work our way out. where i think the country's been going in the wrong direction as far as the congress is that we're working where we have problems. where we disagree and trying to work our way in. let's start with the common ground. i think that would be the best for america and instill some confidence. and also, it's very important that the people believe that our
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elected can get the job done. and we can work together. but that is going to take leadership at the top. >> it is. we get that confidence in congress and wall street and banks, it would make a huge difference. >> there are many of us believe that the economy is so bad that president obama doesn't want us to come to a consensus so this way he has somebody to blame for his failed policies. that is something that republicans think a lot about. and it certainly does appear that way. >> well, thank you very much, representative grim, appreciate your time being with us. >> thank you. it's a busy day at airports around the nation. hopefully you're not waiting in line or for a delayed flight. millions of people traveling. and for some, the weather has been bad. let's check in with our meteorologist chad myers. chad, trouble spots tonight. where are they? >> boston, new york, san francisco. erin, we have 5,500 airplanes in the sky right now.
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luckily they're not that big. but there are still a lot of people in the air or trying to get in the air. the problem was the low cloud cover across new york and into boston. a bunch of planes didn't go from new york to boston. i know there are people sitting in new york waiting for a flight to boston. there's no room on the next flight, no room on the next flight and vice versa. another trouble spot driving is philadelphia, getting out of philadelphia going west on the turnpike or northeast on the northeast extension, an hour delay both ways. think about that if you're leaving philadelphia at this point. now two hours delay for you. it's a tough night for people, even if you're going to hawaii. if you have to sit there for four hours and wait for it, that's still not fun, even though you have a great destination in mind. >> except for, again, you're going to hawaii, and we just said your wait time is less than two minutes. i'm sorry, chad. >> i get it. >> thanks. three american students jailed in cairo, and the mother of one of them coming outfront tonight. and the case that captivated the country, former district attorney who prosecuted casey
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it wouldn't be hump day without the camel report. it's kind of the friday of the week, but still. when you think of dubai, you probably think of maybe the tallest building in the world, rich people. one thing you probably don't
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think of, though, is probably ice hockey because it's usually 110 degrees. but with the founding of the emirates ice hockey league, it is becoming more and more popular. yeah, they play inside. this week, the league's top two teams, the abu dhabi storms and the camels play for the capital cup. that's the logo at the abu dhabi sports club. they got off to a quick start, scoring quickly, they were up 2-1, but the storm fought back and by the end of the second, the camels were down 3-2. the mighty camels were in a tough spot. they had a huge hump to get over, but in the third period, camel magic. scored four times. took a 6-3 lead if they could have just held on, the championship would be theirs. but then the storm scored once, twice, and all of a sudden it was 6-5. it looked like the camels would let the game slip through their fingers or toes. last few moments felt like an eternity, but as the final
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seconds ticked away and storms were unable to score and, yes, the dubai mighty camels won the game and the championship. congratulations mighty camels, you made this hump day one to remember. hey, i want to be a sportscaster. still "outfront," the outfront five, billion dollar back door deals. >> even the government-to-government trade, the so-called clean or formal trade is interdependent with the black trade, the completely illegal trade. >> the prosecutor. >> she was the best liar i've ever seen. harvey's week with marilyn. >> when we stick to movies and entertainment, the company succeeds. >> reporter: all this out front in our second half. just unroll, beauty, huh? it's dependable.
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we start the second half of our show with stories we care about. we focus on our reporting, do the work, find the up front five. up first, seven amish men charged with federal hate crimes for beard and haircutting attacks against other amish men and women. now the clan's leader samuel mullet sr., shown in this youtube video, is among the seven arrested in ohio. he was called evil and said the amish community across ohio and pennsylvania lived in fear of the mullet. >> all these crimes that he's been involved in or have people commit crimes for him, it's not the amish way and it's not religion. it's not religion to have your
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own daughters beat their wife, beat their mother, that's not religious, that's not amish religion. >> former new york city prosecutor paul cowan told outfront it's clearly a hate crime since cutting hair to an amish man has religious symbolism. five of the men have been charged with similar charges last month, those have been dropped in favor of the federal charges. number two, two new claims of sex abuse made against former football coach jerry sandusky, one of the alleged victims is a family member. he says jerry sandusky vehemently denies the allegations and, " allegations appear to be the result of a very nasty divorce and custody battle." the new claims of abuse could cost jerry sandusky his freedom if the courts zoid to revoke his bail. he's still out as you may recall on bail. disney joining youtube's online movie rental service. there's just a few titles available right now, but
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hundreds more could be hitting the stores soon. bad news for netflix which lost thousands of disney titles after failing to renew with starz. number four, initial jobless claims out early this week, up. now it's not great news, but the thing to emphasize is that it is below 400,000, that is the key level that economists continue to tell us, says that the economy is creating jobs rather than losing them. well, not quickly enough. to get tax revenue up because it has been 110 days since we lost our top credit rating, what are we doing to get it back? not getting any help out of europe. that's for sure. germany was hoping to raise $1.8 billion in a bund auction, was only able to pull in $5.2 million. that is scary. caused a sharp selloff in stocks here at home. >> solitary confinement, some
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could consider five months as a form of torture. mental torture. it's perfect torture, because i show up physically fit to the consular visits, but 14 days in week, i'm pacing in my room. >> he came outfront about two weeks ago to tell me his story. the 28-year-old israeli-american was suspected of spying in egypt. authorities arrested him in june, he wasn't allowed to come home until late last month. now another american family is worried about their son who has also been arrested in europe. sweeney was accused of throwing cocktails during the protest. he was called in for questioning on monday with two of his american friends, gregory porter and luke gates. they've been in custody ever since. sweeney went to egypt in august to study at the university in cairo. he's in his junior year at georgetown university. joining us now is his mother. thank you for being with us.
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we appreciate it. i know your son and his friends wrapped up questioning about midnight in cairo just a couple of hours ago. do you know if they've been charged with anything? >> as of this point in time, no. they have not. >> so -- >> i'm sure of that. >> do you -- are you aware of where things go from here at all if not charged? do you know do they still stay in jail? what happens next according to your understanding? >> well, we've been getting different information. the last conversation we had with the embassy in cairo said that we may not have anything going until tuesday, but then my husband received a call from the state department here in the united states about within the last hour saying that there was going to be a hearing tomorrow morning at 10:30. not necessarily to charge them, but it could be either to charge them or release them or to determine the additional investigation needs to transpire. >> obviously it's going to be a long night for you waiting. but let me ask you this, i know you talked to your son before
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questioning had started today. what did he tell you? i don't know if you just heard about the 28-year-old man jailed for six months in cairo in solitary confinement. what are the conditions under which your son is being held? >> well, according to my son, they were fed. and the three boys are all being kept in the same housing. actually, the embassy said -- the representative from the embassy, mr. powers said they were being held in the same cell together. so they could actually speak to each other, which is kind of comforting to know that at least he had somebody there that he could talk to. so that is much better than solitary confinement for sure. >> no, it certainly is. let me ask you about what happened here. i know your husband has spoken about your son, he volunteered for president obama's campaign, subsequently switched -- has become a republican.
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obviously he's a young man. but do you think he could've done this? been swept up in the moment and actually thrown a malitov cocktail. >> oh, my goodness, i didn't know that my husband had spoken all those things. i missed those conversations. no, i definitely do not believe derrick could have done it. and when i spoke to him this morning, i asked him point blank, did you do this? and he said no, they didn't do anything wrong. so -- >> yeah. >> he didn't do anything wrong nor did his friends. >> and i knew that in my heart, but i wanted to reassure myself and hear him say it point blank to me. he's a very, very bright kid with a good heart who, you know, believes in all the people in the world and the betterment of the world, and really he's majoring in arabic and psychology and wanted to learn more about the egyptian culture. that's why he went there. >> and do you have any -- i know
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it's hard to tell, but do you feel any regrets about having him going to american university of cairo? i was there in february when the kids that were there at the time like him who were being shipped out of the country because of worries about the revolution. and obviously it's interesting, it shows he cares a lot that he would want to go this fall. >> right. and, you know, we did. we contemplated it last spring. you know, and i'm sure that many people have throughout my parenting challenged some of my decisions, but i have a son in afghanistan, a daughter in paris, and a son in cairo, and it's their life. and they need to experience life not just sit by on the sidelines and watch other people live it. we talked about it, we discussed it in great detail that -- the potential for danger. and he assured me that he was willing to take the risk, wanted
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to learn about the egyptian culture, and felt that it was -- when georgetown university said they were going to continue and move forward with this semester abroad, i also believed that they would -- the university would not endorse the semester without it being a safe thing for him to do. >> well, thank you so much for joining us, and good luck tonight. i hope that you get your good news tomorrow. >> well, you and me both. thank you very much for having me, erin. >> all right. her son derrick in jail in cairo tonight. the global arms trade has been shrouded in secrecy, there are a lot of back room deals, and that's not the movies. that is real life. and some of it now coming to light. andrew feinstein just wrote a book called "the shadow world: inside the global arms trade." what really goes on. you may not be surprised, there's a lot of hypocrisy and corruption, but he names names, and hey, there's americans in there. you may not know how bad it is. i spoke to him earlier and asked him how big of a player america
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is in the global arms trade. >> the u.s. spends almost as much as the rest of the world combined on weapons and trades as almost the rest of the world combined in weaponry. this is where it happens, this is the big player. >> and now i would imagine one of the places you're seeing a whole lot of build-up, aided, abetted by the united states would be the middle east. >> absolutely. the u.s. is about to sell $60 billion worth of weapons to saudi arabia. the saudis having been involved in the biggest ever arms deal where 48 billion british pounds in which 6 billion pounds of commissions were paid. including just over 1 billion pounds to the then saudi ambassador to the u.s., whose father happened to be the saudi defense minister at the time. >> and now it's beyond saudi arabia, but all of this in the name of the threat of iran.
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>> absolutely. >> do you think from what you look at we are seeing a modern days arms race? all the way through the gulf? >> i think we're seeing a modern day arms race everywhere now. the reality is, what i try to put across in the book is that even the government-to-government trade is interdependent with the black trade, the completely illegal trade. >> the guy who just -- >> just was convicted in new york. >> for selling weapons to terrorists who wanted to kill americans. >> and between 2003 and 2005, he was transporting equipment, weapons, and ammunition into baghdad for the department of defense. and what he has done, there are hundreds if not thousands of others who are working for the u.s. for major defense contractors continue to play a role in the illegal trade in weapons. >> why does this still happen? is this just that the industrial military complex is still so intertwined with big government?
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we can't break that? >> if one looks at the fact that in 2010 84% of retiring senior officials at the pentagon went to work for the major defense contractors in senior executive positions. the people they'd been giving contracts to throughout the years, lawmakers want to approve these massive weapons projects because they get promised jobs in their districts and get very nice campaign contributions. >> what is your view on the rise of china's military? >> well, the reality is that by comparison to the united states, china is still spending very small amounts of money on its military. if it increases its expenditure as it has been doing, spend about $114 billion. so the gulf is massive. >> and i know we were talking about how the pentagon saying that the pentagon spends about $300 billion to $400 billion. they have a vested interest in
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inflating those numbers to keep the spending at home. >> one thing that struck me while researching the book was that in every generation there's a group of people very closely linked to defense contractors to certain people in congress who constantly say that the united states is falling behind some other power. >> all right. andrew, thank you very much. so great to see you. >> thank you so much for the time. still "outfront," the assistant district attorney who worked on the case against casey anthony comes out front to discuss the trial and the verdict. and my interview with harvey weinstein. ♪ medicine that can't wait legal briefs there by eight, ♪ ♪ that's logistics. ♪ ♪ freight for you, box for me box that keeps you healthy, ♪ ♪ that's logistics. ♪
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of the alcoholism & addiction cure. to get yours, go to we do this at the same time every night, our outer circle. we reach out to our sources around the world and we begin tonight in bahrain where a new report requested by the king found that security used excessive force and tortured civilians during protests earlier this year. it is an effort in reconciliation. mohammed, are protests still ongoing there? >> reporter: the situation remains intense here in bahrain, and there are still sporadic protests happening. bahrain is a very complex country. sunni-led government, but a shiite majority population. the key right now is going to be even though the king has pledged reform and accountability for those who were proven to be involved in these abuses is that this happens. the commissions report that their recommendations be
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implemented as quickly as possible, that's how volatility here will decrease and will be decreased as expeditiously as possible. erin? >> thank you. and now to libya where the international chief prosecutor announced libya could prosecute saif gadhafi. that is, of course, moammar qaddafi's son. they reversed course to try him. why did the icc back down on this demand? >> erin, icc chief prosecutor campo says they are not in competition with libyan authorities. their goals, he says, is to see saif gadhafi face justice. it would be good for the libyans who have the rights to take over the case. but first, they have to prove they have a genuine case against him and that their proceedings would meet icc standards, then the court would grant them the right to hold this trial on libyan soil. erin?
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she was the best liar i've ever seen. >> was it imperfect justice? or was there reasonable doubt? that's what we're left with after casey anthony was found not guilty. of the 2008 murder of her 2 year-old daughter, caylee. former assistant attorney jeff ashton was part of a team that prosecuted anthony this summer. revealing new details about the case in his new book "imperfect justice." jeff ashton is outfront with us tonight. thank you very much for coming on the program. you give a lot of details in the book. and i want to get straight to the bottom line that so many people have because so many people in this country were riveted by the case. what do you think is the most important reason that you lost? >> well, i think as i discuss in the book, i think one of the most important reasons the case
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came out the way it did was the jury that was selected. and i think that was largely affected by the level of pretrial publicity. i believe from having been through jury selection that there were so many people out there that we would've loved to have had on the jury, the kind of people who, you know, were willing to do the kind of analysis that we wanted and look at things sort of the way we would, they'd already seen all the evidence. and because they'd seen it, they pretty much already made up their minds, and of course, you can't have a juror who has made up their minds. so what you're left with is basically people who either haven't seen it or didn't draw the kind of conclusions that we were going to be arguing. so to me, that's the biggest factor that affected the outcome of the case. >> and an interesting take given that so many people watching it did seem to feel, you know, viewers, people that were watching it on headline news, for example, did seem to feel differently in terms of her guilt. let me ask you something about one of the jurors said.
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he said, he spoke out to the state and said that you never explained exactly how caylee died and that was a big reason why they couldn't go ahead with the conviction. why did you not do that, or could you have focussed more in retrospect or is there more you can tell us now about what happened? >> well, we told them how caylee died. we argued in no uncertain terms how the pieces of the puzzle came together to show precisely how caylee died. i think what he's referring to is we didn't have a witness who could come in court and say this is exactly how she died, and while i respect his opinion on that and, again, jurors are allowed to demand whatever they like, how she died was less important than the fact she died by result of a homicide, and we felt that the circumstantial evidence that we provided amply eliminated the possibility of an accident, you know, that the duct tape, the way the body was
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disposed of, just the idea of somebody, you know, responding to an accidental death of a child by throwing them in a swamp, we felt, was compelling evidence that excluded the reasonable possibility that it was an accident. the jury focussed on the one issue, the issue of exact cause of death, and he's right, we couldn't tell them exactly how she died, whether it was the duct tape, the chloroform, being put in a bag. any one of those could have done it. to us, the duct tape was the smoking gun. it was the only reason we could think of for the duct tape to be there. >> do you regret going for the death penalty? a lot of people believe that was the reason you didn't get a conviction. >> i don't. i know a lot of people have said that, trying to find, you know, something that the state may have done wrong. as i indicate in the book, you know, there's an analysis that goes into that. ultimately it was the state
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attorney's decision, and i indicated, again, in the book that i thought it was unlikely they'd actually get it. this jury, though, was given a lot of options that would allow them to punish casey anthony, but not with a death penalty. they were given lesser offenses, a lesser prison sentence, so i can't imagine that was a key factor for them. thank you very much, jeff, for coming out tonight. >> you're welcome, thank you very much for having me. the movie my week with marilyn opens tonight. one of the men behind the film comes ut next. it's different. first, it's been re-engineered with micro-particles. second, it enters the bloodstream fast, and rushes relief to the site of your tough pain. the best part? it's proven to relieve pain twice as fast as before. bayer advanced aspirin. test how fast it works for you. love it, or get your money back.
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the weinstien company has received 261 oscar nominations, winning 62 academy awards. his latest film, "my week with marlin," opens today. harvey weinstein comes out front tonight. good to see you. >> nice to see you, erin. >> let's talk about this movie. i've seen some of the trailers and ads, and obviously michelle williams, sort of a dead ringer. >> she's amazing. i mean, she's -- the reviews -- like one reviewer in san francisco who is tough on my movies said michelle williams lights up the sky. i never read that in a review.
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she was amazing. from "the new yorker" "vanity fair". what a year for her. i'm so happy for her. >> that's good for her, but what made you decide to do this, to say we're going to find something new out about marilyn monroe, but what new do we find out? >> i've always liked moments in time or the creative process. "finding neverland" was about how did peter pan get written. and james barry had this disaster failure. i never do like bios, from cradle to the grave. so i read this book, called "the prince and the showgirl." and then in 2002, the author wrote about a missing week, which is -- which when he was 23 and marilyn was 30, he said he spent a romantic week with marilyn monroe and i found that concept irresistible. and it's fun and entertaining. but through the snapshot, you really learn a lot about her. >> well, she was on her
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honeymoon with arthur miller when this weekend happened with this other man. >> yes. she had a fight with arthur miller, which you see in the movie. she's there at the house, and he writes in his notebook how difficult it is to be with her. and she wants to be a good wife. but he leaves in a bad way and he does something terrible to her, and, you know, she becomes vulnerable to this charming young man. >> so this secret week he saved for so many years and now we find this -- what kind of side of her? what do we learn about her that's unexpected? >> i think that you learn that norma jean, who she was, invented marilyn monroe. there's a scene michelle does to perfection. she is at windsor castel and goes down the stairs from the library and all of a sudden a crowd gathers in the queen's castle. and she turns to the boy and she says, "should i be her?" her being marilyn. and then she just turns it on for the crowd.
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she wiggles and dances and then she just runs away. >> so the artist is another movie you have that's coming out on friday. and "the iron lady" with -- >> meryl streep. >> with margaret thatcher. what's the fascination with historical movies right now? is it just sort of that's the way it is, they all happen to be coming out now or do you think there is something audiences want about history now? >> i don't know. i just go in -- you know -- i'll make a movie like "chicago" because i'm interested in a musical. i'll make a movie about margaret thatcher because i'm interested in her. >> when you look at your company now, would you describe your business as a multimedia company? >> when we stick to movies and everything to do with movies or television or entertainment, the company succeeds. i think when we didn't and it went off base with film companies, clothing companies and internet companies, i'll gladly take my place along the worst ceos. but i'm good at making movies. and we're really expanding into television. and we're also expanng