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tv   CNN Newsroom  CNN  January 10, 2015 2:00pm-3:01pm PST

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you are in the cnn newsroom. i'm brianna keilar in new york. >> and i'm jim sciutto in paris. welcome to our coverage of events in paris, in france including a new terror warning tonight. a fresh wave of fear rising in paris. a french police source tells cnn terror sleeper cells were activated just over the last 24 hours inside france. police officers have been told to erase their social media accounts and to carry their guns now at all times. up next i'll talk to a cnn analyst who spoke with french police about those terror cells. meanwhile, the hunt is on for a woman personally connected to all three terrorists who launched attacks in and around paris this week. hayat boumediene is the only person suspected to the terrorists in paris that is still alive. a source tells cnn that
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boumediene entered france from turkey. meanwhile, hezbollah's leader is condemning the terrorists who slaughtered 12 people at "charlie hedbo," a satirical magazine. listen to what he had to say -- >> translator: and those through their actions, words and shameful heinous, violent, inhuman and brutal practices, offended the messenger of god. the religion of god, prophets of god, the book of allah and the muslim nation more than his enemies did. even those who have attacked the messenger of god through books, depicting the prophet or making films depicting the prophet or drawing cartoons of the prophet. >> in paris today crowds gathered outside "charlie hedbo's" offices to honor the victims. the magazine plans to issue a million copies of its next issue.
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one terror suspect remains on the loose today from the terrifying and deadly events in and around the city this week. this is that suspect, a woman, one of few pictures we have of her that shows her face during a police hostage standoff friday. french officials believed at the time she was with another suspect holding hostages inside that kosher grocery store. today there are new reports that she was not there. in fact, not in the country. frederik pleitgen is in the eastern part of paris where that store standoff happened. fred who is this woman and where is she believed to be right now? >> reporter: well she's 26 years old and she has been living with amedi coulibaly apparently for the past five years. in a suburb in the south of paris. we actually had a crew one of our crews, go down to the apartment where she and him were staying before all of this happened. and they said that it was still all full of police. that obviously the police there. was also questioning people that she might have known. people that she also might have
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associated with. but, of course the news that perhaps she wasn't even in the country when all of this happened is something that is going to be very significant to this investigation as it moves forward, of course. the police was hoping to confirm a lot of details with her. also confirm possibly the motivations of not just coulibaly but the kouachi brothers because apparently there was quite a bit of back and forth between herself and the wife of one of the kouachi brothers which seems to indicate that possibly there was a higher level of coordination between all of them than previously thought. but, remember that one of the things that coulibaly said when he was on the phone to a journalist is that he said that had been synchronized with the kouachi brothers. so certainly it would have been very interesting for french authorities to speak to her. nevertheless that is something they would still like to do. of course, the big question is now would she still be in a place where authorities could get to her. as you've just said the police and turkish authorities as well believe that she left this country on january 2nd went to turkey and that her final
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destination most probable would be an attempt to get to syria and it's unclear whether or not she might already be there. certainly if she is it would be almost impossible to get to her. if she's not, however, there are efforts the french could make to try to extradite her back to this country if, in fact, the turkish authorities manage to get their hands on her. the big question would be could she shed some light other possible networks that are operating here that might have had contact with any of these three people and especially in light of what we're reporting now that apparently some sleeper cells have been activated, maybe she could say what she knows about all of that jim. >> that's right. if she's essential not just the investigation looking backward but looking ahead. tied to this terror cell. it is this terror cell that is believed involved in this current threat because it was the hostage taker at that kosher grocery where you're standing that made those calls to other contacts encouraging them to carry out attacks on police. really essential to keeping this
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city this country safe going forward. i wonder, fred, if you could talk about what's going to happen tomorrow. a unity rally here in paris. a number of people from around the country taking part but also around the world. world leaders as well. >> reporter: yeah. this is really gained global traction if you will. i mean if you think about the fact that right after these horrifying attacks happened, how the je suis charlie hash tag has taken global root if you will. that's something that's also fueled this unity march that's going to happen tomorrow and so certainly the people who are organizing it believe that tens of thousands, if not well over 100,000 people are going to participate in that march that starts on place de republic in the after hours and foreign dignitaries will be attending on very short notice. you have the prime minister of israel benjamin netanyahu, and
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you have the king and queen of jordan who are going to come here, angela merkel of germany will be coming as well as the british prime minister david cameron. so this is going to be a gigantic event and show of unity if you will and also a show of how tragic world leaders hold these events to be and how important they believe and how essential the time is now to try to heal these wounds that have been so badly cut into this nation. >> and as you say, fred eyes a truly diverse group. it is not just european leaders, europeans standing up to this it is other muslims, the leaders of other muslim countries, the jordanian king the prime minister of turkey coming to join to show that same defiance in the face of extremism. i want to bring in our terrorism analyst paul cruikshank in washington. so many new developments today. first i want to ask your view help put into context for our viewers this latest threat warning to police around the
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country about the possibility of new terror cells, activated or other terrorists activated, encouraged to attack police. how serious a threat do you believe this to be? >> well jim, the french are clearly very worried. after all we've had this terrible attacks in france this week. the fear i think is twofold. one there could be more accomplices of this terror cell they took down in paris this week and, two, there could be lone wolf attacks against french police and other targets in the days and weeks to come. and we've seen in previous attacks that others have been inspired to take action. for example, in new york in october, zale thompson a radical eck stream extremist cached out a hatchet attack on the nypd police officers after he saw the gun attack outside of the canadian
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parliament by an islamic extremist over there. a lot of concern in france and that's why some of these warnings are now coming out. a lot of concern that police and soldiers will be targeted. either by people who have sympathies with aqap and also isis and isis have called for attack on soldiers and police in france. >> just such a diverse threat. you get it there. there's a whole range of possible assailants in this case. there could be lone wolves radicalized on their own. no contacts with groups in the middle east or they could be in the category like the kouachi brothers who had some contact, some training there, perhaps planned this on their own. that's one new development today. sleeper cells activated. another new development from an interview we did a short time ago with eric pelletier with "le express" magazine he said the kouachi brothers were under surveillance for some three
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years in france but taken off surveillance just six months ago. really a remarkable development. how much of an intelligence failure is that paul? or do you think it's just a measure of how many potential terrorists there are to track and how difficult it is to make those judgments? >> well my understanding is that there was significant surveillance on these brothers including surveillance of their phones and that ended in june of 2014. and when they sort of were reserving these brothers they didn't seem to be that radical anymore, so they decided that they weren't a big priority. this was even after they learned that they probably went over to yemen at least one of them to get terrorist training with al qaeda in yemen. but the reality is the french have to look at about 5,000 people at any one time that they're concerned could be a
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threat in france so they have to prioritize. and clearly for whatever combination of reasons, this past summer they decided that these brothers were no longer a top order threat in france. and that raises the question of whether these brothers were deliberately pretending not to be radical so they wouldn't get any more attention from french security services, jim. >> yeah. absolutely. that's a good point. i spoke to the former head of the french counterterror police a short time ago who made the point that with some 5,000 suspected terrorists in france it takes three to ten people to keep just one of them under surveillance. imagine those numbers, just impossible numbers, calls for judgment calls, sometimes clearly intelligence services sadly, get those calls wrong. thanks very much to paul cruikshank our cnn terrorism analyst in washington. well it has been a time of chaos and mourning certainly here in france but this nation
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is far from the only one suffering right now. we've seen bloody attacks in several countries showing that france is certainly not the only target for extremists. we'll have more on this broader threat right after this break.
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recent developments in paris. he's, of course, been staying abreast of the situation there and he did receive a new briefing with the latest developments. i want to go live to paris now where our jim sciutto is there with a guest who is going to explain some of the challenges certainly that is facing -- that french authorities are facing. jim? >> thanks very much brianna keilar in new york. the news we have tonight is of a new threat. the activation of terror cells around the country french police believe with the intention of targeting police officers. i'm joined now by cnn terrorism analyst samuel laurent. so, this warning resulted from a briefing among security services here tonight, correct? >> exactly. security briefing this afternoon in anti-terrorist basically explaining that some cell has been activated and those cells specifically targeting police officers in france. >> and how do they believe these
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cells were activated exactly? >> well actually amedi coulibaly the hostage taker at the kosher shop has played a main role in that according to the latest hours of his life the last hours of his life he's been passing some phone calls. and basically activating some guys in his network that were specifically ready to act in this purpose. >> so they believe that when he was holed up in that kosher market which ended, of course in that police raid last night, i was there as the raid took place, he was making calls, not to random people friends, contacts but to other members, trained members of a terror network? >> definitely. what we can say is that all these people were organized. they were trained. and they all originated from one cell that had about 10 15 people in 2008. and that had probably grown exponentially with the syrian and iraq war with the flow of jihadi, going to syria, getting
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back battled hardened and being able to basically train and keep on living there. going below the radar and the surveillance of the french intelligence. >> let's remind our viewers in the u.s. it is estimated that france has some 1,000 people who either went to fight in syria and iraq or attempted to and just by comparison in the u.s. the number much closer to 100, so an order of magnitude larger the problem here. >> yeah yeah. and on top, if i may complete this number it's growing nowadays. but day by day roughly. if you took it, like one week ago, one week ago the french government was talking about 400 and that was grossly underestimated. even 1,000 is still grossly underestimated. some research has been conducted by a man in the south of france and this man, which is a researcher on the problem, has concluded that we were closer to 2,000. >> incredible. >> and actually those people coming back to france are posing a huge threat.
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as i said battle hardened and motivated and ready to act. >> we saw the training on the way the attacks on the charlie hedbo offices were carried out. you saw the videos calmly handling their weapons. one question for you, if these calls have gone out to other terror cells, the french police were clearly aware of this terror cell before because they had for a time the kouachi brothers under surveillance. they had had some run-in with amedi coulibaly who took the kosher market before. should we assume can we expect can we hope that they have tabs on other members of that network that right now they can be seeking out to either arrest or prevent carrying out more attacks? >> well the positive thing is that obviously they have tabs and they have indications about who belongs to this network. on more pessimistic side we can also notice that they had tabs and they had all the indications
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regarding those people and this is probably among the biggest ever intelligence and security failure in the west. those people were the easier and the most obvious to trace. those three terrorists has been identified were on the no-fly zone -- no-fly list. >> had been to yemen and had contacts with known terror groups before. that's a key point. while i understand and grant that intelligence services have a tremendously difficult job making judgments about who is a real threat and who is not, when you look at the rap sheet as we would say in the u.s. about these particular suspects the kouachi brothers and amedi coulibaly who took the kosher market if you were going to keep anyone under surveillance it would seem they would be -- they would be the ones? >> exactly. and, you know, on top of that i think there is a problem to french intelligence nowadays because let's not forget they were monitored still and forbidden entry in the u.s. and
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possibly it's now confirmed in the uk and actually posed a problem of knowing whether u.s. is more able u.s. intelligence is more able to track, to monitor, the french jihadi on the french territory and that is very disturbing pattern actually. because i think after mohammed mira that had been followed and known to travel in afghanistan a few years ago and then after the jewish killing in brussels all those were denoting large and very serious security failures. these people have been traced back coming back to europe. maybe he came back and was signaled to the french and stayed three months without being caught and being monitored and ended up with killing those people in brussels. >> right. it's incredible to watch. but to be fair no one gets it right all the time. the americans had some -- american intelligence had some information on the boston bombers, some warnings before that attack and there was criticism after the fact for not
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keeping them under more surveillance. but i'm sure that in france there's going to be a postmortem on this to see why these decisions were made. >> i totally agree with you. the point is that we had early warning even this time. we had three attacks in france that were clearly terror attacks. and there is a bit of cowardice in this government that is not willing to expose the problem of radical islam. because the situation is very different from in the u.s. it's clearly an electoral and a political i would say, you know, issue for french. and so therefore, you know, we had those attacks in november in december. and the media has been explaining that that was mentally ill people while it was very clear that these were terrorist attacks. those signals were ignored and this is -- this is probably explaining also that they are thinking that france is i would say, an open lens for them.
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>> samuel laurent, thanks very much. a great vision of the real challenges france is facing right now and a reminder as well to our viewers that there's a new terror alert under way tonight for the possibility of new attacks on french police. thanks very much toam is wale laurent. >> thank you. while france mourns the rest of the world waits and wonders. could the u.s. be next? what's to stop a terrorist from making our country his next target? shrimp? who are you calling a shrimp? that, my friend, is a big shrimp. it's red lobster's big shrimp festival. i get to pick my perfect pair from six creations for just $15.99. so open wide for crispy jumbo tempura shrimp with soy ginger sauce, and make room for creamy shrimp scampi linguini. yeah, we're gonna need a bigger fork. unless i eat those spicy sriracha grilled shrimp right off the skewer. don't judge me. join me. but hurry, because the big shrimp festival ends soon.
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french law enforcement officers have been ordered to carry their weapons with them at all times. this is a mandate that's in response to the terror sleeper cells reportedly activated over the last 24 hours, which brings us to one of the biggest concerns for the federal government how to protect so-called soft targets from terrorists. these are places that you and i go every day, malls, offices, restaurants. cnn national security commentator mike rogers explains. ♪ >> we know that in places like syria in iraq with isis members that they're encouraged to either stay home in a place like france or go back home to a place like france to conduct the terrorist activity. it's very very difficult. there are thousands of individuals we believe from all
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over europe and the united states by the way, canada and australia, who have traveled to syria and come out. it's hard to say that it's a failure if they don't get everything exactly right. what it was that we just didn't catch up in time to this individual plot. i've been concerned when i was chairman i'm still concerned today, that the sheer volume of those possibilities are just one plane ticket away. they fight in syria for some period of time and they become more radicalized. they have combat experience. they go back to their home country somewhere in europe. they decide they want to conduct an attack in the united states they buy an airplane ticket and come here. and if the intelligence services don't catch them coming in or out of a theater of battle like syria or iraq then they'll be allowed to come back to the united states. that's very very concerning and candidly it is a matter of time before something like that happens in the united states. >> and our panel of experts
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includes former nypd detectives harold thomas. we have harry houck and cnn security analyst bob baer and tom funle tessentes. and that's really the question harry, you were nodding when we heard this this is only a matter of time before we see this in the united states. >> exactly. >> you feel it is. >> without a doubt. the fact that here in this country the police departments and the homeland security are doing a good job. they can't watch everybody all the time. so i'm really quite surprised. we haven't had an attack like this lately at all, because they're so easy -- >> we haven't had an attack around the world or that we the u.s. have not had an attack? >> that we in the united states haven't had an attack like this because it's so easy to do in this country and it hasn't happened. so basically homeland security is doing a hell of a job. >> i'm surprised in the way that you are surprised.
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when are looking at what happened in australia, people trained by islamic extremists and they carry it. is it a way of life bl it's in france whether it's canada or the u.s.? do you think, harold? >> it's always going to be in the back of everyone's mind. i retired from the joint terrorist task force and i can say in the past couple of years they've thwarted -- they've stopped, like, 16 plots that have been thwarted. and it's, like harry says it's inevitable unfortunately. those are the times we live in. >> is that the reality, tom, that you just -- you can't score 100% on preventing things like this that there's always going to be something that falls through the cracks? >> no i agree, brianna, that it's impossible. it's not just difficult, it's impossible. you know, we have 1.1 million people on our terror watch list. you have, you know almost 50,000 on the no-fly list.
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the idea that our resources both at the federal level or at the city level, state level, can fight that every time, you know what you have to do is if we develop mind reading capabilities so that you know when somebody like this is going to launch and become operational, maybe you could prevent them all. but i don't think -- i think it's a matter of time also. >> bob, talk about that a little bit. and if there are -- there also while you can't get everything right, there has to be ways to improve intelligence in such a way that more of these can be prevented, or do you think they can't? >> well i agree with the other panelists. i think it's frankly a miracle that we haven't been hit at this point. it is so easy to get a gun in this country. so easy to get in french german danish new passports. people traveling out of syria. it really scares me that they're combat trained. they know how to conduct an
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offensive attack which our police are not prepared to take on. we just don't do that kind of training so why they haven't, i can't explain why. i go to law enforcement. i ask them, you know what's their opinion. i trust them. they said it's inevitable. we can't stop them all. metadata is not enough to get into somebody's mind as tom said and, you know, we are an open society. and the other choice is simply to turn these people away at the port of entry, anybody we suspect, put them in jail which obviously we can't do so this is just a new way of life we're going to have to adjust to. >> how do people adjust to this new way of life? if this is inevitable what do people do? >> well the israelis have done it. they live under the threat of an attack almost every day over there so we're going to have to learn to live with this. our law enforcement is going to have to -- our government is going to have to put more money into law enforcement to make sure that they have the things that are required to be able to take on the terrorists in the
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event they attack like new york city is prepared for an attack like this. >> all right, address that. and also there are recent concerns about the mill tarrization of police. we're seeing that when it comes to dealing with civilian issues. how do you balance that harold? >> just like the nypd has a saying if you see something, say something. everybody as a whole has to be alert and contribute to helping to stop this. every day the gentlemen and women that i work with in the drug -- in the joint terrorist task force, they follow leads every day. they work 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. but you'll never hear about the cases and the work that they do because in order to be there, you have to have top secret clearance and you can't talk about the cases. and the main thing we're going to have to worry about nowadays is the lone wolf who sits at home and he's on a computer and he's -- he's -- you know, he's just soaking all of this up and
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he's, you know believing, you know all of the rhetoric that he's reading on the computer and he decides to get up and get a gun and do something hisself. until we get a machine where you can read people's minds we're not going to know until this guy acts unfortunately. >> tom, what is it? there is no mind reading. i expect that's not going to happen. but, tom, what can people do? and do they have to change how they live? be more vigilant? what can they do? >> i don't know how you can be that much more vigilant. in all the places described in the warning. you can't go shopping. you can't go to church. can't go to the synagogue. can't ride a train. can't ride a ferryboat. can't get on an airplane. i mean what do people do? and i think sometimes these warnings become useless because they overthreaten us with all the things that are dangerous and it's pretty much things you do every day unless you're a hermit so i think it's a very
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difficult problem to address. and the reality is after a while if there isn't another attack for a while, even if people are on alert and i'm talking about, you know the public they'll go back to normal and things will stay normal. or maybe they stay normal now. for law enforcement, for the intel community, as everybody on this panel knows, there's no rest. they're going to be at this full bore all the way through. they don't need additional alerts to tell them to work harder or be more vigilant. >> yeah just keep fighting the fight, law enforcement will and people will i guess continue living their lives knowing that this is a threat. gentlemen, thank you so much for talking with me bob, tom, harold and harry. thanks to all of you. >> thank you. and as france reacts to these events many are asking were the attacks an act of revenge for the american-born cleric anwar al awlaki go inside the story of the double agent that worked to take down one of the world's most wanted
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terrorists "double agent: inside al qaeda for the cia." that's tonight at 9:00 p.m. on cnn.
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welcome back to our coverage of the terror attacks in paris and a new terror alert tonight. here's the latest. a french police source tells cnn that terror sleeper cells were activated over the last 24 hours inside france. police officers have been told to erase their social media accounts and to carry their guns at all times. meanwhile, the hunt is on for a woman personally connected to all three terrorists who launched attacks in and around paris this week. hayat boumediene is the only person suspected of connections to that terror spree who is still alive. and in paris today crowds gathered outside charlie hedbo offices again to honor victims there. the magazine plans to issue a
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new copy, a million issues a million copies of its new issue this week. so, how do we grade how france has done so far and do we have confidence in them going forward? preventing new attacks. our panel of experts includes harold thomas and harry houck as well as cnn security analyst bob baer and tom fuentes. so i want to begin, if i can, with our -- with tom fuentes, former assistant director of the fbi. when we look at this new terror alert, tom fuentes, based on what we know how well can france track other members of these terrorist cells to prevent new attacks? >> jim, that's a good question. i don't know, you know how many other cells they have on the radar right now and how closely they're watching him. something that's not been mentioned that i fear al qaeda in the arabian peninsula has been mainly famous in the last few years for their bomb making capability. the school of al asiri who makes
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bombs out of petn the underwear bomber in 2009 the printer cartridge bombs in 2010 and what i fear most for the large crowd tomorrow in paris is what's now to stop them switching tactics, dress like everybody else in the public wearing big, thick winter overcoats, and have petn in a suicide vest underneath the coat? you know right now we saw them with assault rifles dressed in black looking like ninjas but if they switch to look like one of the crowd and we don't know how many million are going to be out there tomorrow that could really be dangerous for the public tomorrow. >> well you make a good point, tom, because this has been something different from aqap al qaeda on the arabian peninsula, assuming that the connections that police here are talking about, as you said aqap the principal threat concealing explosives particularly on airplanes bound for the u.s. this would be a different m.o.
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for them expanding the threat. i wonder if i can go to harold thomas and harry houck both with experience in the nypd and the nypd as our viewers may not know has its own counterterrorism unit following the attacks of 9/11 tremendous resources there. harold if i could ask you first, how would the nypd be reacting tonight if they had similar information to what the french police have tonight? what would they do to prevent sleeper cells from carrying out attacks? >> well they would be having their officers contact all of their informants. and they would be trying to gather as much as intelligence as they possibly could. and decipher that intelligence and act accordingly. >> all right. harry, i'll ask you to pipe in as well. i think you make a good point, harold that intelligence is never perfect. it's not exactly scientific. you have to arrange and collect
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the best information you have and make the best judgments you can. harry houck, i'd like to ask your thoughts as well. what is the process at this point based on limited information to minimize the threat as opposed to eliminate it? because that's the best they can do. >> well we know we're not going to be able to eliminate the threat. it's almost impossible to do unless we have some specific intelligence telling us exactly when and where an attack is going to occur. the fact that they're having this large gathering tomorrow and i don't even see how police can be prepared for that tomorrow. where they'll have hundreds of thousands of people in france including, you know, many dignitaries coming in from other countries when they only have 24 hours to prepare for something like this. >> bob, i wonder if i can ask you how the u.s. responds to this additional warnings going out. the department of homeland security the fbi putting out warnings in the last 24 hours around the country warning in
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effect of similar attacks without any specific and credible threats. how does the u.s. respond now? and would you say that the threat of lone wolf attacks, copycat attacks, has increased in the wake of these attacks here in paris? >> well exactly. it's the copycat attacks that they are worried about. it worries the fbi. i talk to them regularly. and they can't predict when someone is going to go from simply reading websites which a lot of people do jihadi websites and then flim over to violence. it's impossible to do. as we were talking about with acetone and peroxide, both were the detonator and explosive. they know how to make this stuff. it can be made in the kitchen, whether it's in paris or new york and there's no way for the nypd to do anything about this. i mean in crowd control if they go to suicide bombings. and in paris, the attacks could come from anywhere because the
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airports are a lot of north african workers working them how many of them have been turned. are planes in danger. so they have to be looking at threats coming from everywhere. and to get 100% successful if these people are really determined to attack i just don't see how they can do it. >> just not possible. the old saying always is the terrorists only have to be successful once. counterterror services security services have to try to be successful all the time. that's just not possible bob baer tom fuentes, harold thomas harry houck, thank you very much for joining us. we'll have more on the latest developments including a new warning in france tonight about potential attacks on french police.
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>> translator: i express myself to the french people this is our best weapon unity, that we must
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demonstrate our determination to fight against anything that can divide us. the #je suischarlie resonated with many people after the attack on charlie hedbo magazine in farris. others are turning to #jesuis of an officer who was killed in the attack. the officer's brother says do not confuse muslims with extremists. the brother said the officer embraced the responsibility of being a police officer and taking care of his family. my panel now back with me. and i want to bring in samuel to talk a little bit about the situation there in france and how some people assimilate to new cultures. others struggle to do so.
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and you're seeing that more so in france than other nations. with immigrants. why is that? >> well actually there is obviously a problem in france about not only about immigration but i would be more tempted to speak about integration. france has tried very bravely to cut communism with its history with colony and according to its urban policy that basically puts some -- some blocks some rings, all around the main cities of france we have created some suburbs that basically belong to some communities, whether it be moroccan moroccan, tunisian therefore, i would say that the community management of immigration in france unfortunately seems to be quite a failure. and we are experiencing now
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basically the next step which is those people who cannot really fit in and who cannot really find their identity into the french model, i would say, and that are now turning to i would say other options and especially radical islam, for people with muslim background. >> and, harry, you've written about this. there's a lack of integration. you've got areas where you have high poverty. you have high unemployment. it's not a life that people really want to live, and it foments anger and anger turns to violence. so talk about really how this is playing out. >> well these people become susceptible to al qaeda and that ideology. what happens is if you're a young man and you don't have a job, you have nowhere to go, nothing to do, right? one of the big problems to me is that how does somebody like these two brothers, all right,
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leave a poor area and fly overseas to be trained and somebody -- a flag doesn't go up saying how do these guys get the money to go fly to another country for a couple years. to me that should be a flag that these brothers were doing something like that. >> well they were under surveillance for a few years. >> yeah but still, you figure they are coming from an area like that where they're unemployed and they virtually have no money, so how are they getting the financing? >> they should have been more subject -- they should have been more suspicious of them. >> exactly. more suspicious of that and then when they come back to the country, you know, look what happens. of course, it's two years later. >> are you seeing harold do you see examples of this happening in the u.s. or happening in other countries? >> well i can see it happening because, you know, like harry said you know, you'll get some poor person and they're looking for a cause. and they get -- they get on the computer and they get
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radicalized. it's almost like how young men were getting into the gangs out in the streets out in the streets. >> they don't have any options, right? >> we'll be your family we'll take care of you. and all of you think the way we think. and the young men embrace the gangs and they feel they're the ones who really care about me. and it's almost the same way with the -- with these radicals. >> some of the same formula going on. all right. harry, harold thank you so much. thanks to tom and samuel as well. and i want to turn right now to some other news and this is a huge development in the search for missing airasia flight 8501. the tail has been recovered. can the black boxes be far behind? we'll be talking about that, next. sir, we're loaded and getting ready to go... ...we're going to need you on the runway. (vo) don't let a severe cold hold you back. sir? (vo) theraflu starts to get to work in your body in just 5 minutes. (vo) theraflu breaks
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welcome back. right now a french police source telling cnn, terror sleeper cells were activated over the last 24 hours inside of france. a dramatic development in the terror attacks, and we'll have more on that next hour. but first, the other big story that we're following today.
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significant development in the airasia flight 8501 crash that killed 162 people last month. the chief investigator tells cnn, the flight data recorders will likely be found in quote, a few days. he says small boats picked up several pings emanating about 500 meters from where the jet's tail was found. and joining me now to talk about this is cnn aviation analyst, jeff wise author of "extreme fear" a fascinating book why some people do better under scary situations and why some people just come undone. and that's really what we're trying to get at here when we find the black boxes, right, to find out whether this was pilot error, perhaps or whether this was purely a mechanical error, maybe caused by weather. >> right, exactly. and all of that will come out when the black boxes are found. when not if hopefully. i mean these things should be located within a tight radius of where the tail was find. as you know the black boxes are
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located in this tail section. but unfortunately, this tail section was not complete. it was only about the top half and really one side. and so that part that actual structural member that -- to which this is attached wasn't there. >> it sort of may have come apart or broken at a very key point. because you look at it and you see it and here we have it as it's being pulled out of the water here. and you can see it sort of that tip of the tail and then the area where you would expect the box to be lodged. >> right. >> but certainly this is good news if they're getting pings very close. i mean we're talking 500 -- was it 500 meters from where the jet's tail was found, right? >> yeah it's a little hard to parse that. >> why is that? >> the black boxes should emit continuous ultra sonic tone. >> not just several pings. >> not just several once in a while. you remember back oh -- >> this was like a metronome. >> yeah and they thought they located a few intermittent pings
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and turned out that was not the case it was bad data. here -- i have to assume -- i think the most likely explanation the pingers aren't working. >> they are not? >> they are not working. because you can hear them for about a mile maybe a half mile. and so you would have expected given that this debris should be in a fairly tight area they would be able to hear it pretty easily. i have to assume they're actually broken. that shouldn't be too big of a problem. they should be able to scan -- >> they're in the right area. they have the tail piece. >> which is why even in the absence of the black boxes themselves being found and that's the holy grail. even in the absence of that this is a very significant development. >> finding the tail? >> now we know where it really hit on the surface. because it had to be within a pretty -- stuff hits the surface and it sinks more or less straight down. this is heavy metal stuff and goes straight down. >> are you pretty sure we'll find the black boxes, that they'll be discovered?
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>> i hesitate to be certain about anything, but i think this is a fairly conventional air crash. i think nothing truly weird is going to happen. i think we will find it soon. >> so key to find those, to find out exactly what happened the voice and the flight data recorder. jeff wise, thank you so much for being with us. and we have breaking news out of france today. police are on high alert and already looking for a key suspect in the terror attacks. while world leaders, dozens of them are heading to france to mourn victims and also some surprising names on that list. we have that ahead, next hour. in my world, wall isn't a street... return on investment isn't the only return i'm looking forward to. for some every dollar is earned with sweat, sacrifice, courage. which is why usaa is honored to help our members with everything from investing for retirement to saving for college. our commitment to current and former military members and their families is without equal. start investing with as little as fifty dollars.
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you are in the "cnn newsroom," i'm brianna keilar in new york. >> and i'm jim sciutto in paris. welcome to our coverage of events in paris. the followup to the attacks here this week. but also many developments tonight. right now, terror sleeper cells may be on the move here inside france. a french police source telling cnn, sleeper cells were activated inside france just over the last 24 hours.