tv Cuomo Prime Time CNN June 23, 2020 6:00pm-7:00pm PDT
3-year-old daughter and a stepson. the news continues and i'm going to hand things over to chris for "cuomo prime time." >> thank you and thank you for helping us remembering things in the right way. i am chris cuomo. welcome to "priel timetime." we have to be on the same page of reality. every place that ignores that reality and the recommended masks and measures will suffer. we see it time and again. we have to hear and accept this and act on it because you and i, we are the key. you have to take care of yourself and by doing that, thank you because it helps protect me and my family. forget trump. he does not want what the rest of us must want right now with this pandemic. believe who he has shown you he
is for the umpteenth time. of course he lies about testing and invites people to gather at their own peril. he values praise over your protection. even in arizona where cases are popping. he didn't even talk about it. look, of course trump continues to call covid-19 the kung flu. he is a demagogue who plays to bigotry. he wants you to blame the chinese and see them as an other. that's what and who he is. take it from someone who has known him most of my adult life. that's who he's always been. if any of you want this country to come close to its promise, forget about me needing to call out the obvious. you must reject the bigotry.
you must demand that a president get this poison of us versus them out of his mendacity-ridden maw. there is no debate. he is a demagogue. that's not an argument. it is a fact, deny, lie, defy. this is what he does. once and always his plan is simple. divide us and conquer a second term. if you do not like him or that, don't vote for him. that's your choice. but know this, if you do support him, you own all of what he says and does. he put more effort into a wall that was grossly oversold as a fix for immigration and refused to do the things he could have early on and said all the worst
things he could to expose more of us to this virus. you own that. there is no question he could have done more and better and chose not to and we are all paying the price. period. it is not an opinion. and if you need the reality of who he is proven to you once again that he is all about the me and forget about the we, here. >> when you do testing to that extent, you're going to find more people, you're going to find more cases so i said to my people slow the testing down please. >> no one who gives a rat's ass about anyone else asks for less testing in a pandemic. okay? the only reason to do something as stupid as that is to minimize
what you and i know about the spread. and then miss i'll never lie to you said this -- >> it's a comment that he made in jest, it was a comment me made in passing. he was joking about the media and their failure to understand that when you test more, you also find more cases. >> if this were abbott and costello, one of them would do this -- what is she even saying? mcenany and crew can lie about me but i told mcenany on this show, if you refuse to accept that the president lies, you will never have credibility with the media or the masses and that's exactly where she finds herself today. but trump did what he does bus, threw her right under the bus.
listen. >> i don't kid. let me just tell you, testing is a double-edged sword. in one way it tells you you have cases. in another way you find out where the cases are. >> that doesn't even make sense either. what he meant to say was it tells you how many cases there are, that's good, right? tells you where they are, that's good, right? so what's the other edge? it's that it's bad for him because it shows there are more cases and he wants you to believe that covid's no big thing. so who's lying? both of them. he never said that to anyone about reducing the testing, but he wasn't joking. he wasn't sarcastic. he was being cynical. he believes that he can win by making you angry and by being an agent for your outrage. look, he is the president of the united states. his words and actions demand exposure, if only out of respect for the office.
but he is not about getting us to a better place on this pandemic. you have to know that by now. thank god some on his team are. that's why he wants the glow of fauci to illuminate his lackluster efforts and toxic talk. you saw his tweet. it's been all over the place, right? first he wasn't sure about fauci. put up the tweet. first he wasn't sure about fauci. remember that? there was a little bit of trash talk about tony faufci. maybe he's on the outs. what did the trumpers do? they responded by threatening the man, going after his family. that's what the trumpers want to do when stoked by trump. but now tony fauci, who has been straight with you, honest, has been cautious, has high ratings. the president says, well, then i should, too. be nice to me. no, you don't get what tony
tau fauci gets. why? because you don't say what tony fauci says. you make things up. you say stupid things about what you should drink and what can end this and the magic. and you put them on the spot and you embarrass them and then you hide them because you don't like what they say. seen tony taufauci on this showy time recently? you think it's a coincidence you don't see dr. birx, that you don't see the heads of the agencies? that this is the only time in recent history when the people who deals with something that affects all of us are kept from all of us? the cdc director says this virus has brought our nation to its knees. have you heard trump say that? that's why you don't see so of the cdc director. so now that we know the reality, now that there can be no hiding from it, what do we do about it? that's the right question for us to start on. and we have a great person to
help answer it. dr. thomas freeden. he was the head of the cdc. he understands this. thank you very much for being on the show, doc, as always. the idea, i'm not going to burden you with the -- "are you sure it's bad? are people really still getting sick?" we don't play stupid here. people know that we have a problem. the question is are we able to put this behind us any time soon as a country? yes or no and if yes, how so? >> well, chris, the virus is still out there. we may be sick and tired of staying home, but the virus is not tired of making us sick. you really have to compare the u.s. with other countries around the world. in my organization we work all around the world and the u.s. response is just lagging.
we we're to the doing what we need to do to keep physically distant. we not keeping cases from exploding into clusters and outbraeou outbreaks. i'll give you a couple of numbers to think about. 30. 30 cases in seoul, south korea yesterday. and that made them really concerned. they're focusing on it, they're going to stop them so they can keep economic growth going and society going. 30,000, that's the number of cases we had in the u.s. and some people are trying to say not a big deal. >> that's not what trump's saying, doc. he saying kung flu, baby. they designed this in a lab, that's why they're not getting as much. i know you said south korea and i said north korea. same thing, same thing.
>> facts don't lie. there are 270 people who died from it in south korea. if you had moved to south korea on january 20th whenny each ofr countries had its first case, you would have been 70 times less likely to be killed by this virus. >> but he blames that for us. he says that the asians -- that's why he calls it kung flu, right? they may have some other answer, but this was done to us, blame them, not him. >> what we need in this country is an organized response, led federally. you see states doing a good job, new york, new jersey, new mexico, really making progress, driving down infections so you can go out again. on the other hand you see texas, arizona, florida, cases exploding, and they're going to continue to increase there. as a doctor, as an epidemiologist and scientist, i want to be very clear, the
increasing cases we're seeing in those states is not from more testing. it's from more disease. it because the disease is spreadi spreading. >> this is an important point. in the next block was going to get into some of the politics of this. it's like sneezing on the virus. let me hold you over the break. let keep talking about why some of these states are struggling, whether it's just -- what are the two options? the one is this was always going to happen, it was always going to cascade through the country versus, no, we're not seeing the same kind of measures in different places. i want you to take us through it but right after this break. can you stay? >> sure. >> doctor, thank you very. stay with us. at t-mobile, we know that connection is more important than ever. for customers 55 and up, we want you to get the value
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sorry. switch to progressive and you can save hundreds -- you know, like the sign says. all right. we're joined by dr. tom frieden. he used to run the cdc. we're seeing cases start to move around the country. there are two possibilities at play, one is it was inevitable versus, no, the reason new york and new jersey and connecticut are backing off is because of what they did, not just time. and the measures we're seeing are not the same in other parts of the country as you're referring to, texas, arizona,
for example. explain. >> well, first off, with positivity rates increasing, you know that that increase is real. what you need here is an adaptive response. you need to track the virus and like a dimmer dial move it up or down in terms of the physical distancing. remember the three ws, wear a mask, wash your hands, watch your distance. you do those three things, we can keep the virus at bay. and communities around the country and around the world do a better job with testing, isolation, contact tracing, quarantine, do better. less death, less disease and less economic devastation. >> why better? >> better because you can keep the virus at bay. >> but why are they better than us? >> first off, they're testing strategically. that means you test people when they're admitted to hospitals, test people in nursing homes so you don't have big explosive outbreaks, you test the contacts of patients with active disease,
you trace those webs and stop them. you prevent cases from becomes clusters and clusters from becoming outbreaks and outbreaks from sending them into our homes. when you do that, you protect health and livelihood. >> what do we do? >> here there is a lot of mask wearing in some places and very little in other places. when you really worry is when you have a lot of people indoors, then you can have explosive spread. may take a while, a few weeks or a few months to see it if you don't have a lot of cases but it will spread. if you keep doing what you've done, you'll keep getting the results you're getting. that means more spread and more hospitalizations and more deaths. >> the first w you put out there, wear a mask, a lot of people want to turn it upsidedown and say an "m", maybe, maybe it's an option. >> rather than saying yes or no on masks, it's really wear or when. any time you're within six feet
of someones, y else, you need t wear a mask, particularly if you're indoors. if all of us wear a mask, all of us you are safer. this is us against them. but human beings against microbe. there was a great nobel prize winner, josh letterberg. he used to say the microbes against us, they outnumber us. the more we wear masks, the safer we are. that's one twhiehing we can do get our economy back and save lives. >> when you look at it as compared to a seat belt or a helmet, if you're going to be on a motorcycle, do you see it as a similar level of effectiveness? >> little different.
because when i wear a mask, i'm protecting you. when you wear a mask, you're protecting me. and when all of us wear a mask, all of us are safer. so this is about getting together to block the virus. this is about protecting our community. even if you're young and healthy, you think you'll do fine with this virus, you could get it, not know you have it, spread it to someone who dies from it, a little girl with fyodor lukyanluk leukem leukemia, your sister-in-law with breast cancer. for us as a society, it can be devastating. >> dr. frieden, thank you very much for taking us through the alts of wh realities of can happen if we don't do it. >> rayshard brooks was laid to rest today. his situation is about him, his family but also about a pattern
of his behavior that so many in this country have had enough of. is that enough? this case and how it's handled is going to be watched by this country and by the world. now, the officers are talking about the cases against him, against them, and saying politics are involved. politicians are saying that this prosecution is about politics, not proof. what does the top prosecutor who made the call say? we are lucky to have him tonight next. ♪ our bargain detergent couldn't keep up. with us... turns out it's mostly water. so, we switched back to tide. one wash, stains are gone. daughter: slurping don't pay for water. pay for clean. it's got to be tide.
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uma, arizona. again, no masks in sight. you just heard the former head of the cdc, you've heard the current head of the cdc, you've heard the most credible person in this country, dr. fauci, on this issue all saying the same thing. you have to wear a mask if you want to make things better. so what's happened with masks? it's become a political issue. no coronavirus cases, hospitalizations are surging in arizona, but the politics overwhelm it. the mayor of uma, arizona is douglas nichols. he was at the roundtable with the president today and joins us now on "primetime." thanks for being with us. >> thanks for having me. >> we have the cases for people. arizona has been hit hard, more in the the bigger population centers, uma is starting to feel it a little more acutely. 185 cases up from 152 cases
yesterday. four new people have lost their lives over the past few days. how great is your concern? >> our concern is great and we just did pass a mandate to wear masks and at the meeting you were talking about, we did wear a mask until we were all socially distant and then when we were sitting, when people stop moving around is when my mask came off. >> i didn't see it in the footage, but i appreciate the clarification. you were against the measure to not mandate masks, were you not? >> i did vote against it but i do fully support wearing of masks. my support wasn't wearing the masks, it was mandating it by government. people need to take ownership of the issue. government shunting telling us absolutely everything we need to do. we need to understand what the experts are telling us and take that personal responsibility to make that happen. >> are you against the arizona
helmet law? >> no. >> are you against the seat belt law? >> no, sir. >> so why would you be against masks if not for naked political play? >> it's not naked political play because i'm not doing anything on a national scale. i was voting in a local action and if i was against it, i do not need my council to vote. i could have put the document out that we didn't need to mandate masks but instead i went through the democratic process. we had our council convene. we voted on it and right after that meeting i crafted the language and issued that document to make masks mandated in the city of uma, per the direction of our elected counsel. >> why am i wrong to suggest you're trying to have it both ways, that you did the right thing by the community, which is make sure that masks are mandatory so you can save some lives and at the same time as a republican check the box that
you say what trump wants you to say by voting against it. >> well, i don't know what the president wanted me to say today -- or i'm sorry, last friday, i'm not sure what he wanted me to say. these are things as the mayor and in a proclamation of emergency status that we've been in the last few months, i'm very concerned about overreeach. i'm very concerned about the president having to be the end all be all for everything. we're a nation of people, not a nation of a government. so the people need to own this action, not the government. so as the person that had to enact this and has that responsibility, i wanted to be clear that it's not something i'm looking to lord over people, that this comes down to the individual not to -- >> but mr. mayor, that's exactly what it is, is something that you have to lord over them because it's like a seat belt, it's like a helmet, except by doing this you not only help keep yourself safe but other relatives and family and
vulnerable loved ones. they can come after you for how long you close the schools and keep businesses closed but what you do with state services and functions, that's the government, making decisions about when it's going to provide and not provide services. but when you know that the only thing that we have going for us that you can control is what you do with distance and what you do in terms of controlling your own face space, why would you see that as a liberty issue and not a necessary emergency measure? >> well, i see it as it is a necessary measure and it's the necessary measure that each one of us has to take. we all have to eat. we all have to do those things that keep us healthy. we all have to take the medicine. there are no laws that make those happen. those just happen -- >> but you can't make me sick by how you decide to eat. you're not three big macs for making me fat. this is something different. you know this, mr. mayor, because you made sure that the
council was allowed to vote and did the right thing. why would you vote against something that you engineered to happen in the first place? doesn't make any sense. >> i did not engineer it. it is something that i put before the will of the people. we opened up the outreach to the people the day before so we could get as much input as we could get into that decision. and up until just right before the vote, i was debating either way to go on this issue. so it wasn't a preengineered, predefined vote. >> except you said you didn't need to do this. you said you could have done it yourself. you did it in the democratic process because you wanted the council to vote. you knew they were going to vote in favor of it. they voted in favor of it, you voted against it. all i'm saying is, mr. mayor, did you the right thing. you're keeping people safe in your community. i just don't understand why you'd want to send a mixed message. last word to you. >> i did not know how the council was going to vote. that was debated right there in
the meeting. arizona has very strict open meeting laws. i'm not allowed to poll my council beforehand. it happened there live realtime in front of the people of uma. so this idea i'm trying to play both sides just isn't true. >> i take your argument. i'm just saying that you're happy that it happened but you voted against it. that's why i say it's a suggestion of a hedge. what was the vote on the council. >> it was 5-2. >> mr. mayor, thank you very much for joining us, for making the case and for expressing the concern in your community. god bless you and i hope things get better soon. >> thank you. appreciate it. stay safe. >> thank you, sir. the prosecutor whose case will decide if the former officer who killed rayshard brooks will spend life in prison is here. people are coming after him for how he's handling this case. what is his response to the critics next. cause the tempur-b° transfers heat away from your body.
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here's what we want teveryone to do.ital. count all the hugs you haven't given. all the hands you haven't held. all the dinners you didn't share with friends. the trips you haven't taken. keep track of them. each one means one less person vulnerable, one less person exposed, and one step closer to a healthier community. so for now, keep your distance. but don't lose count. we'll have some catching up to do. rayshard brooks' death matters period. to his family, to his community, that state, the country and beyond. and you got to see a little bit
of that today with the people whose pain filled ebenezer baptist church in atlanta. that was the funeral, but this cast appall all over the country. the criminal case has to be done right, which is fairness under law so it's going to be scrutinized heavily and it's going to be looked at also through the lens of politics. that's just the reality in this country. that scrutiny puts attention on the district attorney handling the murder prosecution, who is an elected official and is now in a truicky runoff and that is d.a. paul howard. thank you for joining us. i will respect the parameter of staying away from too many arguments in the case because i know you have a case to make in court. thank you for joining us, sir. >> thank you for having us on, chris. >> one, sir, is the politics, doug collins, a congressman from
georgia, republican, had this to say about your and your handling of the case. >> you cannot prosecute cases until the investigation is over. you don't do it for politics. your job is to find justice for everyone, not race, not class, not anything else. >> so that's collins. plus the gbi saying, gee, we were surprised charges came down here, we weren't even done investigating. the suggestion from that becomes howard is in a tough campaign, he's playing politics with his prosecution. your response, sir. >> well, first of all, chris, as you know doug collins is the ninth congressional representative, not the representative from fulton county. i think you're also aware that his opponents have spent a lot of time talking about his weak
law and order record. i guess what congressman collins believes is by coming to atlanta and attacking me and showing his support for the atlanta police union, i think he believes it wipes out his record as a criminal defense attorney representing child molesters and defendants involved with domestic violence cases. i think his remarks were just way off the bean and i think that they were clearly political because, as you know, congressman collins is running for the u.s. senate. >> but does your campaign have anything to do in your mind or in your heart with how you're doing your job? >> no. i think if you look at the record, you'll see that is absolutely erroneous. this will mark the 40th case that we have prosecuted involving police officers. this is the ninth case that
involves a homicide. also, chris, this is the fourth case that we have asked for an arrest warrant prior to the time of an indictment. so it doesn't have anything to do with politics. what it has to do with is doing my job and achieving justice for rayshard brooks. >> will you answer just one question, i don't think it violates your ethical parameter in terms of keeping it for the actual case. people are going to be watching this. there's going to be two critical moments for the lay people who are watching this. one is going to be whether or not the taser in a court of law is considered a deadly weapon. now, you have been theoretically applying a civil law standard to what they call a taser. the officers' counsel say under criminal law as soon as he took the taser, which was a felony,
and he pointed it as an untrained person at the police officer, now it's a deadly weapon. is that an argument and how compelling do you think it will be? >> i think it's nonsense. it's a diversion from the facts. this case has very little to do with a taser, chris. i think some of the earlier presentations brought a taser into the whole equation and i don't think the taser fits in. when mr. brooks was shot, he was running away. his back was turned. in fact, mr. brooks was some 18 feet three inches away from the police officers at the time the shot was fired. he did not file the shot at the time that mr. brooks used the taser. i think this whole argument about the tasers is way off the
track and i'm hoping that people will really get to the substance of this case and really what i think people should be talking about is why is it in this country that african-americans continue to get killed by police officers? >> understood. one other question and i'll let you go. i appreciate the indulgence. the most painful thing i've heard you put forward about this case is that you believe that you can prove that officer rolfe kicked rayshard brooks on the ground. defense counsel for the other officer involved, brosnan, says he's reviewed the tapes, there is no such visible action. if anything, there might have been a gesture of checking to see if brooks was down. what do you make of that and can you prove otherwise? >> well, if people can watch a videotape and see it, then we can prove it. i think that it will become
obvious for all the grand jurors and hopefully for all the pettitpetite jurors who will see it and for the people in this country who will examine this case. not only did the kicking involve officer rolfe, but with respect to the other officer, it is clear that on two occasions he stood on mr. brooks' shoulder and then after that he stood on his arm and i think those acts were truly despicable to stand on this man and kick him after he had been shot twice, laying on the pavement, struggling for life. >> horrible allegations. mr. prosecutor, thank you very much, paul howard, for joining us. you have a difficult case in front of you. the whole world will be
watching. we will as well a. >> thank you for having us, chris. >> you're always welcome to make the case for the people. you always have an invitation. >> be well. >> thank you. >> why luck? if he's got the better case, he should win. if it's not strong enough for the petite jury, that's just a regular jury, a legal term, then he should lose. that's fairness under law. that's what we should demand. to eradicate racism, however, that's very different. that becomes about language, about symbols, specifically of a confederate past. now, should confederate statues go down? is the movement going too far? let's ask a true expert on history, ken burns, iconic documentary filmmaker next.
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>> question, are confederate statues coming down enough? in washington, d.c., boston, activists are calling for the removal of the emancipation memorials depicting abraham lincoln standing over a black man. in recent days statues of the george washington and thomas jefferson were toppled in ore n oregon. in san francisco, they toppled a statute of ulysses s. grant. how far is enough? is there a too far? is this all more helpful than hurtful in building a more perfect union? tough questions, great guest. legendary documentarian ken burns is here. it's good to see you. >> good to see you, chris. >> do you have answers? >> i think we're in the middle of an enormous reckoning right
now in which the anxieties and the pains and the torments of injustice are bubbling up to the surface. it's very important for people like me, of my complexion, to it be as quiet as possible and to listen. what i know from my reading of history is that the confederate monuments have to go. they were put up in the 1880s and 1890s when white supremacy was being brutally reimposed over the confederacy, when clku klux klan. we see they're an attempt to rewrite history and to essentially celebrate a false narrative about what happened during the civil war and to send
the wink winks, the dog whistles, as we're fond of saying today, across the generations of what the civil war was about. it's so interesting we're having this hargme mentargument because that we people who responsible for the deaths of -- yes. these are people responsible for the deaths of the loyal american citizens. >> play to heritage. that i think is a losing argument. when you extend it to the founding fathers. lincoln. at least not in a memorial seen as above a black man. thomas jefferson, washington, grant, is there a danger in going too far? in your opinion. >> of course there's a danger in
going too far. it's the passions of the moment. and let's think about it. for a second. let's hold off and reserve judgment. for one second and consider that more than quarter of the president's of the united states of america founded on the idea that all men are created equal, the guy who wrote that owned 300 human beings in his lifetime. by the way. more than a quarter of the united states presidents owned other human beings. this is a huge thing that we cannot just dismiss. but i would say that confederate monument for me is an easy decision. we have to get rid of them. they're not about heritage. this is about the reimposition of white supremacy in the south at various periods. there's nothing ability that names of the bases and forts should be changed. we taken down the statues.
it's a good thing to do. and we now need to continue this reckoning by looking as carefully as we can, monuments are hugely important. they're acts of fact but also acts of mythology. they are acts of symbols. your father told me in the film on the sa statue of liberty. symbols are important. it works both ways in this regard. we have to look at each individual case beyond the confederate monuments and look. listen the deses dents of roosevelt want the statue take an away. roosevelt was actually good in many respects. invited booker t. washington to the white house took grief and never invited another black person there again. has a statue lower by a native
american. >> we know the statue well. >> it looks like white supremacy. i'm happy to see we are on a case by case judgment moving through the questions. the most important thing is the reckoning. the most important thing is for us to not get to distracted by the arguments because the arts of too far are being happened on both sides. the issue is that for far too long in ou our country, citizens of after can decent did not enjoy equal justice under the law. >> still don't. >> they were slaves for centuries and sdoinlt have that. this is why in the most extraordinary of american times the covid-19 puts itself as one of the fore great crisis in american history the with civil war. depression and world war ii. we are in the middle of this
extraordinary reckoning about our racial past. and we have to stop first and listen to those people who have born the brunt. you and i don't have the facilities to actually receive this information and to be able to transmit it to everyone else. we have to do a lot of listening and we have to permit mistakes to be made and people to overshoot the mark and rhetoric to be too inflammatory. for too long, people have had a knee at their neck. and these statues -- robert e. lee himself said in 1869 after the civil war, make no monument tos the confederate. it will only keep open the sores the wounds of this thing. >> there's an aspect of this about when the moment of when things were done also.
that will be part of the retro spective design. you mention my pop earlier. i remember watching an earlier effort on the civil war. people have looked at that and said that series was a little too nice about the confederate. glorifying of them. should have said more about slavery. and a harsh indictment. when you look at the work do you think about that differently now? >> yeah. i do. in many ways, we would probably be making a different kind of film now. but let us remember that the very first chapter was a chapter called all night forever about the reality of slavery. one of the last moments of the film the african-american historian said that the civil war is still going on. it's still being fought. and regrettably can be lost. this is an interview in 1988. >> true today. >> and it is just as true today.
and this is the great lesson of history. it gives u the perspective to make all the stories evergreen. we have to listen and learn. we can't throw everybody out. because if we erase the history we don't know where we have been. if we don't know where we've been we can't know where we are and where we're going. this requires study and reckoning. >> let's keep the dialogue going. you'll be invited back early and often to talk about what moments matter in the present and going forward and how we draw on the past. thank you, always a pleasure. we'll be right back. because the tempur-breeze° transfers heat away from your body. so you feel cool... night after night. during the tempur-pedic summer of sleep, save $500 on all tempur-breeze mattresses. and sometimes, you can find yourself heading in a new direction.
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