tv CNN Newsroom With Poppy Harlow and Jim Sciutto CNN October 18, 2021 7:00am-8:00am PDT
looking at the date on that. it's 13 years ago tomorrow he gave that speech. he could have give an similar speech. today or tomorrow. because of the way that this country is. and as i talk back, the thing he was most concerned about with the rech republican party, john mccain's choice at the time of the running mate was sarah palin. he didn't think she was ready for the job and he was worried about what her candidacy meant for the party. and, again, things got even more entrenched on that line. >> that's for sure. you're right. he could have said everything we just heard from 13 years ago could be said today and perhaps even more important that we hear it once again. dana bash, always appreciate it. thank you. >> thanks, erica. >> joining us now on the phone is former abc news anchor as well as a longtime personal friend of general powell and someone who covered him for a number of years, sam donaldson.
good to have you on this morning. your relationship with the late secretary powell goes back decades. you met him when he came to work at the white house under president reagan. developed a friendship over the years, professional and personal. i wonder, tell us how you're feeling today about this and what you remember most about him. >> well, i'm sad. i think all americans are sad and people around the world. he was such a major figure. you know, a program i once did with diane sawyer called primetime live, i was interviewing him and i challenged him. i said, you know, you were born in harlem, you were ralzed in the south bronx, you went to city college new york where you made cs and ds, went in rotc, didn't have a regular commission, you're black, and you're chairman of the joint
chee chiefs of staff. powell smiled and said it's great country, sam, it's a great country. he symbolized the best in america. >> would you say to some degree sadly he's a man from a different time, someone who was able to garner the respect and friendship of people on the left and right but also who commented, who lamented the country's drift into deep partisanship and his own party's drift to the deep right? is there his equal really today? >> well, i don't know. there are a lot of great americans today i think still. colin powell, i want him to run, jim, i wanted him to run in 1996 for president. he decided not to, as you know. he gave me a ride back to his house and i was keenly disappointed. and i said all sad words of tongue or pen, the saddest are
these, its might have been. i don't think he wanted to hear that, necessarily. turns out there were good reasons, and he and alma did not want him to run. so i'm not faulting him for that. but had he been the first black president, it would have been in the late '90s into the century. i think he probably would have been reelected a different country in a different time. you mentioned earlier, i think dana was talking about it and erica, the business of his speech before the u.n. security council. he had great misgives and warned president bush, that's number two, number 43, in the famous phrase, remember, if you braefk i -- break it, you own it, in iraq. and being a soldier, a good soldier, meant military people followed the chain of command. if they can't in good conscience follow the things that their superiors want them to do, then
they have to resign. powell said much later in later years of course he didn't have his own cia, he didn't have any hard evidence that what our cia and many other countries' national security organizations contended, that saddam hussein did have dangerous weapons of mass destruction, but he didn't, as it turned out, he didn't have the evidence that was wrong, so he gives the speech because the administration, even vice president cheney, who was deadly against many of powell's positions, knew that he was the person that everyone was going to believe to make the case that the u.s. should invade iraq. and he had misgives about it but he said he's do it. and he had behind him -- if you look at the video of that speech, the man sit beg hind is george tenet, then the cia director. ten net didn't want to do it but
powell insisted because it was a visual message as to where his information was coming from. but he took it -- he did it and he wasn't making excuses, and it was all set upon. he was a man. >> yeah. yeah. he took responsibility. let's take some of the good with the bad if we can because he was -- he had a career of firsts, the first black national security adviser under reagan, first black chairman of the joint chiefs as you mentioned in the 90s, and then the first black secretary of state to the point where almost it's not news, right, to have people of color in those senior position, and that was something that the late secretary powell took great pride and satisfaction in, is it not? >> absolutely. and i think he hemmed along with so many others move us forward, not there yet, forward towards full acceptance and equality for all americans regardless of the color of their skin.
martin luther king was so right. our content and character, judge us by that. one time i was out in the field with him and he was going down the lineup of african-american soldiers and a poor kid was so much in awe, stumbling, he said don't pay attention to him, he doesn't count, and he punt his handle over my lips and the kid just looked up in graeat admiration and awe. he was the kind of person -- i never met a person who said i don't like him. i met people who disagreed with him and that's america too. but i never met anyone who said i don't like him. he told me once that when he was a late teenager, one of his first summer jobs was in a
factory sweeping out the floor of the factory every evening. he said i swept so well that the next summer they offered me a job running one of the machines. i think that points out first his at today and second why he became so successful. he had a pleasing personality, but he had an ethic of fitting in to the work projects of this country and fitting into the society of this country. i never heard him say anything bitter and so many people who have the right to be builter about their treatment as african-americans or mus llims you heard the last clip. but his attitude was optimistic, and the attitude was it's a great country, sam, it's a great country. >> and a man who took responsibility at the age of a lack of accountability today. sam donaldson, thanks for sharing your personal reflections of him.
it makings a real difference. >> good day, jim. >> great to have that perspective. also joining us now, cnn medical analyst dr. jonathan reiner. what we learned from colin powell's family in their statement that he was fully vaccinated but had died from complications of covid-19. we've now learned that he had multiple myeloma according to a source familiar with the matter. this is a cancer of the plasma cells. it can suppress your immune system. it's important to put this in context. >> right. multiple myeloma is a disease that itself suppresses the immune system but it's also important to understand that the treatment for multiple myeloma, which patients often take every day, itself can suppress the immune system. so general powell respected our most vulnerable population in this country. he was over the age of 80. he had cancer, and a treatment
for his cancer made him vulnerable. when we try to convince young people why they need to be vaccinated, it's to protect our treasuries, our people like general powell, our grandparents, because while, you know, a 25-year-old may do quite well with the infection, if they spread it to someone like general powell, they will not. that is the imperative for vaccination in this country. >> my fathered that same condition, and the thing is of course it makes you more vulnerable and you end up dying from the infection, sadly. the sad fact is it is already being used yet again as disinformation, right, against the vaccine. i won't repeat it, but it is already being used, so for folk who is hear this, what do you say to those people who say, well, wait a second, why should i get vaccinated? >> well, because vaccines do work. >> yeah. >> and in fact for our most
vulnerable a boost dramatically lowers the risk of such a terrible outcome. what the israelis found this summer was that as the vaccine's efficacies waned, the risk was greatest for reinfection and severe illness in exactly general powell's demographic and that by boosting that demographic they could reduce the risk of serious illness or death by 90% with the boost. so what i would say to the people that would use this as disinformation is that they're simply wrong and need to get their facts straight. >> and the numbers, too, jim pointed out, but important to put it in context, 1 out of every 26,000 fully vaccinated people have died of covid-19. thanks to jim's math, we can tell you that's 0.004%. dr. rhinehart, always appreciate it. thank you. >> my pleasure. thank you. new this morning, a
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either misleading congress or lying to lawmakers about amazon's business practices. now they are warning that the committee could refer the case to the department of justice. it follows a reuters investigation last week allegedly showing amazon has conducted a systemic campaign of copying products and rigging search results in its app in india to boost sales of its own brand, it own version of those products. here's bezos in july of 2020 testifying before the committee. >> mr. bezos, does amazon ever access and use third-party seller data when making business decisions? and just a yes or no will suffice, sir. >> i can't answer that question yes or no. what i can tell you is we have a policy against using seller-specific data to aid our private label business, but i can't guarantee you that that policy has never been violated.
>> amazon has denied the statement saying we did not mislead the committee. we have an internal policy which goes beyond is that of any other retailer's policy that we're aware of. that prohibits the use of individual seller data to develop amazon private-label products. joining me now to discuss what they found, democratic congressman david cicilline and republican congressman ken bot. both signed the letter sent to amazon. congressmen, thanks for taking the time this morning. >> my pleasure. >> congressman, so folks at home understand, this is remarkable if true that if amazon copied sellers' products, made their own and prioritized those products in the search on their app, is that basically how this worked? >> it is. and since they have a monopoly in terms of the e-commerce platform, they have this huge advantage. also there are reports that they
have even gone to their customers and suggested that they would invest in the product if they got more information, they got more information about how the product was made, and then made the decision to compete against those very products. part of what they do when someone wants to put a product on their platform is they ask them how a product is made and they ask them for proprietary information. then they go and compete against them. so it's really a situation where this monopoly is using every advantage to crush its competition. >> remarkable. i spent a lot of time in china. that's how china works with the technology transfer deal, get you to share your technology and basically steal it. congressman cicilline, you see amazon denying they misled. we saw their statements when they appear bfrd the committee saying we don't do this. how do you square that circle with what they're saying and the
evidence you say you found? >> it's important that the reporting from reuters and also the mark-up shows that amazon favored its own products and services and collected individual seller data to compete with their private label products, compete directly with those selling in their marketplace, is completely consistent with what we found in our investigation. congressman buck and i led, along with members of the antitrust subcommittee, a 16-month investigation of the digital platforms. we found they had monopoly power. we're seeing that in evidence reporting today. it's consistent with the findings of our report. and we sent a letter to the amazon executives to give them a final opportunity to correct the record and acknowledge these business practices. is good news is we have a solution to this problem. we passed the american innovation and choice online act to prohibit both behaviors, but it's important. we haven't seen the actual documents so we sent the letter seeking production of those and giving them an opportunity to give us any exculpatory
information but in the event this reporting is true and they don't correct the record, then the a referral to the department of justice is appropriate. this is a congressional investigation. it's important people be honest and truthful, and it appears they have not been. >> congressman buck, in effect you're saying prove to us you weren't lying or misleading when you came before the committee. what do you need to see so that you don't refer to the justice department possible criminal charges for misleading the committee? >> honest answer would be a good starting place, frankly. the reality is that our job is to try to create and foster competition in the marketplace. and in order to do that, we need to know whether a company is acting as a monopoly and whether they are acting in ways that suppress competition. and so we've been -- as chairman cicilline says, and he's done a great job of leading this investigation and leading it in
a bipartisan way, there's very little credit given to congress for acting in a bipartisan way sn nowadays. chairman cicilline has led the way in that. we're looking for answers to develop the best legislation to deal with this type of monopoly. >> anothering to before we go, because we have a republican and a democrat here, we have a major budget proposal before the house and congress. first to you, congressman cicilline, are moderates and progressives among house members in the same room, are they talking? do they have a path forward to reach a compromise agreement that can get both votes in the house and the senate? >> yes. i think you will see us pass both the bipartisan infrastructure bill and the president's build back better agenda. the negotiations are under way to determine what of the president's proposal should not be included. there are many of us in the caucus who believe all of the president's plans should move
forward -- child care, paid family leave, low prescription drugs prices, the list goes on and on. others argue for less of an investment, but this is about reducing costs, about creating good-paying jobs, dealing with the climate crisis, and most importantly it's all paid for by making sure the wealthiest americans and the biggest corporations pay their fair share. those negotiations are going on. i'm confident we'll get both things done. one final thing if i may, ken buck has been a terrific parter in as a ranking member of the antitrust subcommittee and i salute him as well. >> i love having you guys on together, right, to discuss. here's a shared priority here. the fact is on the budget, as you know, congressman buck, not shared in terms of passing this republican opposition as unified. as you know, there are elements of this that have broad bipartisan support, among them expanded medicare benefits, going to dental, hearing,
et cetera, even universal pre-k. i wonder are there elements of that broader bill that you as a republican, if it was sort of taken out, support? >> well, the problem i've always had with the budget bill is under republican administrations and democratic administrations is spending. we've had approximately $30 trillion of debt that the point and we can't keep going forward. so i absolutely am in favor of some of the proposals. but we've got to find areas to cut in order to pay for those proposals. we can't just keep adding debt onto our national debt. >> okay. we'll see if you find a way. congressmen, thanks for joining the program this morning. >> thank you. >> thank you. still ahead, we are following developing news out of haiti. 17 missionaries, including 5 children, kid named over the weekend. what we know this morning about the gang who took them and what they want.
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kidnapped in haiti. >> i want to bring in the founder and editor in chief of "the haitian times." good to have you on, sir, this morning. my first question is what is the danger right now that these missionaries including five children, are in based on how these dpangsgangs operate? are these in general ransom operations or should we be genuinely concerned about their lives? >> well, of course, jim, we should be concerned about their lives. but if we are worried about whether or not they will be killed, i don't think so. being in captivity is nothing to be cheerful about obviously. so the main goal here is ransom. they want money and they probably are looking for millions of dollars for their freedom. this is the kind of money that they've asked in the past when haitian americans have been kidnapped or people have families overseas so they ask for a large amount of money.
>> so this is about the money. but, you know, i think it's important to point out, too, that the kidnappings are not new in haiti. in fact, up nearly 300% sense july. often, until recently, mostly haitian citizens. this shift now maybe going after foreigners, what does that signify to you? is it that these groups are after something more now? is it more notoriety? do they want more control? >> well, basically all of the above. but above all, they want control and they have control. the government is very weak. it cannot -- it's not a match for them. the police inept at trying to uproot these gangs. many attempts at going into their stronghold and ending up in abject failure. right now yesterday we had a very, very meaningful incident that happened. the prime minister was traditionally going to the tomb
of the country's father. it's something that prime ministers and presidents have done routinely. and it even paid the gangs to allow safe passage. but when the prime minister didn't go, one of the gang members dressed in white, of the g-9 gang, went instead and laid that wreath. this is a very disturbing development where the gangs are actually in control of the country. they're performing governmental duties right now. and this is disturbing to me. >> it is alarming and disturbing to put it mildly. gary pierre-pierre, we'll continue to follow this. we appreciate your insight. thank you. >> thanks for having me. these are live pictures now out of brunswick, georgia, where jury selection begins today in the murder trial of three white men accused of killing ahmaud
when you're on the lanes, they're right behind you. reunite with your team. go bowling. three men are sit for trial after killing ahmaud arbery last year. his mother is concerned about who could end up on the jury. >> i have my concerns, being that the jurors will be picked from this community. there has been lots of miscommunications in the
beginning on what happened on that day. but i'm hopeful we'll get the right people in the right place to make the right decision. >> joining us now, criminal defense attorney cnn legal analyst joey jackson. a thousand people have received a jury summons for this case, about ten times what it would normally be for this courthouse. we have to factor that in as we talk about the difficulty of seating a jury here. what's also interesting is prosecutors are pulled in from atlanta because there were concerns, you know, in this small county. should those concerns be in place for the jury? how do you get through all of that? you heard the concerns from ahmaud arbery's mother. >> yes. good morning, erica. you'll get through it with some difficulty, but you will get through it. you noted that a thousand jurors have been called in, at least to be evaluated by the defense and the procuges.
that's important. we all have opinions about everything. can you base what you find at the end of the day on what you hear in the courtroom, the facts, the circumstances, the evidence, and nothing else? if you can, it's not a jury for you. if you can, you're impaneled. i'm confident with 1,000 members called you'll be able to cull out those who legitimately and properly can serve in judgment on the case. this is a system of justice we use in this country and we worked it and, you know, sometimes it works more effectively than others. but i think they will get there. it may take some time. >>s there understandably a lot of focus on what will and will not be brought in as evidence in this case. i want to focus on the license plate specifically on this truck. so the defense has asked the judge to keep the prosecution from using a photograph of that license plate which has images of a confederate flag on it, the old georgia flag. the judge hasn't ruled on that. how do you think he'll decide in that matter? >> so i think trials are always
about really setting the ground rules. and any defense attorney is going to make motions to preclude evidence that's harmful for the client. ulti ultimately, the judge has to really weigh whether or not this is so prejudicial and so really inflammatory to the jury as to exclude it. he may very well do that. i think in the event he does that, remember they're also going to be as prosecutors pointing to his social media, that is mr. mcmichael the elder, his social media imprint, which allegedly has some not-so-nice racial slurs on them, in addition to a racial slur he allegedly made at the time of the incident. i think judges need to be careful in making the case about what it's about, and i think based upon that you could see the exclusion of that, but you could see the inclusion of other evidence that's relevant, germane and proper to what happened that day. >> video will be key here. it was key when it came to the
death of george floyd, derek chauvin ultimately convicted in his death. the video here as i said important, but it's a little different. we don't have all the angles we had in that trial for derek chauvin. how integral is it to this case? >> yeah, it really is important, erica. absolutely to your point, we don't have everything. in the george floyd we had everything from beginning to end. i'm sure both sides will seize upon those aspects of the video that are essential and important to them. so, yes, while a picture might be worth 100, 1,000 words, videos are worth everything. it's how that video was translated. i think the prosecution will use it to demonstrate that it didn't need to happen. he was kidnapped, detained, confined and murdered. that will be the prosecution's narrative. the defense will argue he was a person going about the neighborhood they believe was, you know, meant something improper. whatever way you interpret it, i believe it will be a very important aspect of this case. >> joey jackson, always
appreciate it. thank you. >> thank you, erica. still ahead, this may sound familiar, democrats return to capitol hill and to go face-to-face with senators sinema and manchin, both roadblocks to president biden's larger economic agenda. leaders pleading with president biden to take bigger role in negotiations. your car insurance,e so you only pay for what you need. oh, yeah. that's the spot. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty ♪ at fidelity, your dedicated advisor will help you create a comprehensive wealth plan for your full financial picture. with the right balance of risk and reward. so you can enjoy more of...this. this is the planning effect.
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democrats are calling for president biden to take a more forceful public role in outlining what he wants to see in the final plan. cnn chief congressional correspondent manu raju joining us on capitol hill. here we are again. i now e don't need to tell you that, manu. what are we expecting as senators return to the hill
today? >> we know that nancy pelosi, the house speaker, along with joe biden had discussions last tuesday. they both made very clear they want these negotiations to end. the question is how? and can they get their whole party in line? we still have the same divisions that have been playing out for months, happening publicly and privately. liberals like bernie sanders want to move as progressively as possible on a whole range of issues, offer all the benefits in their proposal but pair back the number of years potentially to reduce that price tag. moderates like kyrsten sinema and allison chinchar want to reduce it all together and allison chinchar is pushing back on the major climate initiatives proposed in this proposal. how they get together, unclear. democrats are telling us they want joe biden to make clear what he will ultimately accept and force this deal through to get both sides of his party together. but publicly the divisions are playing out. bernie sanders, allison chinchar going at it last week.
bernie sanders going after allisonchin joe manchin why this is needed. poll after poll shows overwhelming support for legislation, yet the political problem he faces in a 50/50 senate, we need every democratic senator to vote yes. we have 48. two democratic senators remain in opposition, including joe manchin, and manchin putting out a blistering statement going after bernie sanders saying it isn't the first time he's tried to telewest virginians what is best for them. no op-ed from a self-declared independent socialist is going to change that, he says. guys? >> wow. friendly fire there within the democratic party. manu raju, thanks very much. thanks for joining us today on quite a news day. i'm jim sciutto. >> i'm erica hill. "at this hour" with kate bolduan starts after the quick break.
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good morning, everyone. i'm kate bolduan. we do begin with the breaking news, the death of an american hero. general colin powell died this morning at the age of 84 due to complications from coronavirus. he was fully vaccinated, his family said in its statement, but a source also tells cnn that general powell was battling multiple myeloma, a type o