tv CNN Newsroom With Alisyn Camerota and Victor Blackwell CNN November 4, 2021 12:00pm-1:00pm PDT
top of a brand new hour. good to be with you. i'm victor blackwell. >> and i'm alisyn camerota. as of now there is 72,057 people killed by coronavirus. the president is asking for new vaccine mandates. as of december 4, federal contract workers, employee businesses and health care workers must be fully vaccinated. >> they are talking about controlling the spread of the virus. >> what we're really talking about is control, and control has a wide bracket. you could have it under control where you have enough infections in the community where it isn't a pandemic phase but it still is interfering with what we would
like to get back to what we used to know as normal. what we hope to get as it's at such a low level, it doesn't have an impact on the wait we live our lives. >> the president's new man date, we -- mandate, we know, is facing opposition. kaitlan collins has more for us now. kaitlan, first, the decision to enact this in january, is the white house explaining why? >> reporter: basically there is a timeline that happened here. we know it was back in september that president biden announced this. this is part of that rule when he had essentially been against vaccine mandates but changed his mind given the level of resistance from so many tens of millions of americans who did not want to get vaccinated. and of course the concerns happening in september with the delta variant led to this. what you have seen behind the scenes since then is the labor
department getting red ady to craft this rule and have rules for businesses to go to. now there are 104 employees that by the january 4 deadline will need to be vaccinated or undergo weekly testing. the company will not be on the hook to pay for that testing. the labor department said that is something each of these businesses will have to work out on their own, but that is a january 4 deadline. we will see a deadline go into effect before then, and that's in early december when those unvaccinated employees that go into the office at these private companies with more than 104 employees will have to wear a mask or undergo testing. it doesn't go into effect until january. that's so workers will have time to get those two shots. there is a few weeks between the period of the first shot and the second shot. there are also rules for medical employees, and that is 17
million people who work at health care facilities that get funding for medicare or medicaid, they are going to have to be required to vaccinate their employees. they are not going to have any option to undergo this potential testing if they don't want to get vaccinated. they actually have to get vaccinated. one other thing we should note that comes from these deadlines that we are seeing from the labor department today is one for federal contractors. initially it was going to go into effect in a few weeks. by december 8 they were going to have to be tested or be vaccinated to do work with the federal government. that has now been changed to january 4 as well. that changed as businesses said it would affect the holiday season if it went into effect in december. the white house just said they wanted all of these timelines to be lined up together. >> kaitlan collins, thank you. a recent kaiser poll found that 37% of unvaccinated would leave the job if vaccine or
tested were mandated. thank you so much for being with us, evan. let's talk about this. first, your group was one of the groups that asked the white house to push back this deadline until after the holiday season. it's now right after the new year. how does that change the equation for the companies you represent? >> thank you for the opportunity to be here today. yes, we strongly advocated to the administration, to the white house, that the implementation timeline push us past the holiday season. obviously the holiday season is vital to the retail industry. we are already very busy, and we thought the implementation of this new testing protocol mandate and the vaccine mandate, we needed to push that beyond the holiday season. so we were more successful in its implementation. specifically we did ask for 90 days to push us well past january 1st, and unfortunately the 60-day implementation period to get us to january 4 is likely
to get us to what we're worried about, which is our members will have to implement this during the holiday season which, again, is going to create additional obstacles for us. >> tell us what this means. we know this could impact up to 86 million workers across the country, phil mattingly, the white house, reported for us. osha doesn't require companies to pay for or provide the test, but how do you get this done? >> right. and we appreciate that the white house and the administration did listen to rela and other business stakeholders on a few issues, including testing costs. they also strongly wrote in language to ensure this was a uniform standard across the country and did not conflict with certain state mandates or anti-mandates. but ultimately the implementation of this is going to have to occur during the holiday season. and as you already mentioned, the first requirements are due
in 30 days, on december 4th. where the mask mandate will go into effect. essentially that means our members will have to begin immediately understanding who exactly is our unvaccinated population, because we have to know who is going to be required to wear those masks. in effect, these are going into effect now, and we simply have to be in compliance on 1kwjanua 4, which we plan to be. >> plet me ask you about vaccins in general. the white house cites studies to support this that vaccine mandates are good for the economy, they're good for the businesses you represent, that they could get some 5 million people that were out of the work force or on the sidelines since the start of the pandemic back to the work force. is it the deadline you oppose, or is it the vaccine mandate in general?
>> the retail association leaders and our members have long been for mandates. we have centre ward programs for our employees throughout this year. what our main concern is to have enough time past the holiday season to be successful in the implementation of this policy. we are concerned that some of these requirements like vaccinations are going to create a talent strain, potentially creating resignations, and again, that's a risk we are worried about taking during the holiday season where, again, it's the most crucial season for retail and we are already trying to fulfill a high consumer demand, which we know we will, but this is just an added obstacle for us during the season. >> evan armstrong, thank you so much for being with us, retail industry leaders association. thank you for your perspective. let's gate different perspective now. david michael served as assistant secretary of labor for
osha from 2009 to 2017. he wrote the book "triumph of doubt: dark money and the science of deception." he served on the president's advisory board as well. one poll cited at the top that 30% said they would resign if they had to get vaccinated or take the test every week. let's say that's just a third of the people who actually follow through with that. is this not the wrong time for that, considering that there aren't enough workers to fill the jobs that the companies need filled? >> first of all, the previous guest talked only about the retail industry. that's only one piece of the whole economy. this covers 84 million workers in thousands, millions of work sites. but the key is that the polling
data doesn't reflect reality. united airlines announced everybody would have to be vaccinated and they heard that everybody is going to resign. well, you saw the headlines. slightly under 600 people finally didn't get vaccinated. it sounds like a lot of people, but united has 6,000 employees. 1% actually refused to get vaccinated. people don't want to get vaccinated but now they understand they have to do it. speaking of employees, yes, we all have to do it. we had 1700 deaths yesterday. this has been going on for a year and a half. this is a way to step in now and really make a change. we can't wait three months before we implement these things. i think this is the right time to do it. i think the white house has been very accommodating to employees who wanted them to wait some, and we will see. some of the surveys have shown
there are millions of people who left the work force because they're afraid of being dead from covid or spreading it. really, this could help the economy. >> so among these 4 million workers, how does osha enforce something like that? first, the 84 million workers who are in private sector jobs won't be the same 84 million next week or next month. what's the bureaucracy that's required to make sure it's verified that these are the tests and the vaccinations on a schedule that's regular enough it has some effect? >> i'm glad you asked that question. so many people don't understand how osha works. this rule will be primarily self-enforcing. when i speak to employers, and i speak to hundreds of employers, they don't ask how will osha enforce the rule, they ask, how can we comply? employers aren't resisting, they're adapting. that's because most employers want to do the right thing, they want to follow the law, they
want their workers to be safe, and they want guidance to make sure they're following the rules and they want a level playing field so they're not disadvantaged by doing the right thing, and that's what the rule gets you. >> of course, the rule is for those who don't follow that. there would be a rule for a governor mandate if the private sector decided on their own they would enact these mandates. for those not following this, how do you then enforce it? >> i think primarily it will be enforced by following up on worker complaints. osha will go out and do some inspections, but for the most part, workers will see what's going on. the rule says employers have to explain to workers what their program is. i think osha will follow up a lot of times by phone. when the complaints are made, they will e-mail records to osha, which has to be done pretty quickly according to the rule. for the most part, most employers are going to do the right thing and figure out exactly how to follow the rule and it's going to have a big
impact. >> all right, david michaels, thanks so much for your perspective, sir. >> thank you, victor. okay, this is just in to cnn, another sentencing in the january 6 capitol riot. a texas real estate who had previously tweeted that she was definitely not going to jail is now going to jail. >> jennifer ryan has been sentenced to 60 days behind bars, marking the harshest punishment to anyone who pleaded guilty to a misdemeanor offense. let's go to brittany ryder. did she have anything to say when she left the courthouse? >> she had a little to say. she said the judge punished her to try to teach other people. ryan pleaded guilty in august to illegally demonstrating inside the capitol building that day. prosecutors said ryan pushed a self-serving narrative that day and she said she did nothing wrong.
she said she did not know the protest was violent. the judge said, even if your own conduct was peaceful, you still bear at least some degree of responsibility. judge christopher cooper said that ryan was a cheerleader and noted that she celebrated the riot. the judge also said, quote, i don't think you could have missed the fact that this was no peaceful protest. here is what jen ryan told reporters after that hearing. >> i think that that is a travesty. i think everybody should be able to tweet without being persecuted and go to jail. if you tweet, watch what you tweet. it's a free country, free speech. >> what she told reporters after that hearing indicates she really believes it was the tweet that landed her in jail,
although she does say she's remorseful, she says she's regretful. she also says she's cooperating with the government. the attorney said she met with the house select committee, victor and alisyn. be sure to join jake tapper for "trumping democracy." it's tomorrow night at 9:00 on cnn. a judge will decide the fate of three men who killed ahmad ar arbery. why the judge said that's okay. arbery. why the judge said that's okay. ♪ ♪ ♪
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opening statements begin tomorrow in the murder trial of three georgia men accused of killing ahmaud arbery. they were all white. >> arbery's parents say they're devastated by these choices. >> they are racial and now you have a jury like 1955 trying to pick the same cycle. that's why we're fighting. we ain't going for this. we're not going for this. >> i was very shocked that we only had one black african-american man. that was devastating. >> cnn's amra walker.
there appears to be some bias, but what did the judge say after that? >> reporter: the judge indicated he had to act within the bounds of georgia law, and because the defense provided non-discriminatory reasons why they were striking these jurors, and of course, many of them were black potential jurors, they would still be allowed to be seated. despite his ruling, it was remarkable to listen to this judge, because as you said, it seemed like the judgestid i -- siding with the prosecutors when he said it appeared there was discrimination in this jury process, which ended in 11 jurors who were white and only one who were black. during this exchange for about more than two hours in court yesterday, the state was arguing that these potential jurors who were black were disqualified
because of race. the defense denied that and maintained this was about their already formed opinions about ahmaud arbery and their concerns they would not be able to remain impartial during the trial. look, at the end of the day, victor and alisysin, the jury w white. three were accused of gunning down a black man in a neighborhood when he was shot and killed by a shotgun. there has been a lot of criticism regarding this jury selection and that the jury should reflect the community, right? if you just look at these numbers, 26% of glen county while you compare 80% of this jury being black. a march is underway in downtown brunswick. they are demanding judgment for
ahmaud arbery. the president of this civil rights group, barbara arnwine, said this process and even the line of questioning by potential jurors was discriminatory. listen. >> there is so much wrong with what has happened in this trial. it has been racialized from the beginning, and that was done purposefully by the defense. they lied to us, tried to remove our presence from this courthouse grounds. >> we ain't going nowhere! >> we aren't going anywhere until this verdict, and we want people to understand that in this moment there has to be some serious work done in our country. >> reporter: so the jurors were told to report to court at 9:00 tomorrow morning. of course, that could change as there is a session going on right now and several motions being considered, so we're listening to what would be
allowed to be included or excluded when the trial is expected to begin tomorrow, alisyn and victor. >> amora walker, thank you so much for the preview. mr. pate is a law attorney. mr. paleontote, thank you for b here. explain why there would only be one black juror, because when i pull up the demographics of where this happened, 50% black, 40% white, hispanic 8%, asian 2.2%. you're able to identify as more than one thing which is why this added up to more than 100. the point is, it's 50% black so why only one black juror? >> alisyn, that is a great point, but let's look at where they are polls, to the entire glenn county area. you're watering it down to
probably 30%. but that's still much higher than what we ended up with on this jury. and even the number of african-american potential jurors that made through the lengthy two-and-a-half-week jury process, many of them were struck down by the defense. >> it's interesting, because one of the attorneys for one of these accused, this is a mr. goff who represented earlier in the deposition, speaking of white men over 40 born in the south without a college education. they know the value of the racial makeup of the jury, but i wonder if you are making this case to this jury of 11 whites, one black member, does that influence the case you make and how you make it if you believe
race was in play in this killing? >> victor, i don't think there's any doubt that race was at play here in some form or fashion. that has been on the minds not just of the lawyers, not just of the people in this community, but obviously of the potential jurors. as we went through the jury selection process, everybody was being asked questions. what did you think about the case? is race a factor? what are your views on race relation. so i think it is critically important. to get from stage 1 a couple weeks ago to yesterday. they were questioned on a lot more scrutiny given the social leaderships and what view they may have. i can understand the criticism of the process. >> so why did the judge let that happen? >> interesting question. under georgia law, basically
it's a two-part process. the state, or whoever is causing the strike, there has to be some basis that the case was made by race. the defense can come up with other reasons, and that is so easy to do under georgia law. if you can't come up with a race reason for only one black juror, then you shouldn't be practicing law. the judge is only going to list ton what they said, and in georgia that's enough. >> will they say the racial economy means something critical. >> there's not a single thing the state can do. if they're not guilty, they're not guilty.
t there is a record. an appellate court is not going to look into the legitimacy of the reasons given for this st strike than anyone else would. this is the ones hearing the case. food prices are rising, gas prices are rising. families across the country are facing an uncertain future because of inflation. we look at that, next.
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we know the pandemic is wreaking halfvoc on the economy but families across the country are trying to make ends meet as the prices are driven up on everything. >> here's how one texas family is coping. >> reporter: what does inflation mean for american families? this is the story of the statlers' shop. >> we have two biological kids, and we have a heart for adopting, so we adopted three, then two, then one, and we have a kid living with us right now who is in a foster situation. >> reporter: it feels like money isn't going as far as it used to. >> let's see what we can do. i think probably in june, it was about a dollar's worth a dollar, and now that dollar is worth about 75 cents. now we're moving on to dairy, which is right there. >> we started seeing everything going up.
grocery prices were going up. a gallon of milk was $1.99, now it's $2.79, that's a lot of money. >> reporter: this is what they buy every week. >> if you want to get any of these for $1.79, you can pick five boxes' worth. >> we're not buying healthy stuff because prices have gone way up. i feel guilty because we can't afford the really good things that would be healthier also. >> p.f. chang's is like the el elite. >> elite in price or taste? >> both. where are the family-sized meals? >> th >> reporter: the statlers keep a close eye on their budget and they shop deals. >> 24 ounces, get that one. >> reporter: she lovlz a coupon. but these days the family grocery list and the money they carefully plan to spend
sometimes don't match. we're at $90 already and we've got a basket and a half left. but god is good and always provides, so let's see where we go. >> reporter: the math at the grocery store worked out. >> we don't need this and then we'll add these items. awesome, guys, you all did great. >> reporter: then they had to add in the rest of the week's shopping. that gets delivered. >> oh, look, the walmart stuff came. >> reporter: grand total? $310. how much back in march would you have spent to do the same thing? >> we probably would have only spent 1$150, $200 back then. >> reporter: this family may be larger than many. >> let's go in line by birthdays. whoever has an october birthday gets to go first. >> reporter: the squeeze is
getting tighter and that means that middle class life could be changing. if the prices keep rising the way they've been rising through the next six months, what's going to happen to life in this house? >> if it continues, we're just going to have to get more creative and maybe pick up an extra job if we have to, you know, doing food delivery or something like that to help make up the difference. >> you can go down to beans and rice and still sustain pretty economically. we don't want to have to do that. you enjoy what you're purchasing, but there is another level you can get to just to make sure you make it through. >> evan mcmorris santoro, cnn, canondale, texas. >> thank you, evan, that really drives it home. after being in a state of the emergency over tainted water, federal workers are
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and that's just part of the bargain. ♪ in response to the desperate pleas to the people in benton harbor, michigan, the city wants them to improve the water systems. they claim lead pipes have been leaking into the system for years. that prompted the city to declare a state of emergency, but residents say the process is not moving fast enough. let's bring in edward pinkney. he's the president of the benton harbor water quality and he's
here. three years the pipes have been shedding lead. how is that allowed to go on so long? >> governor upton, the state senator, the state representative, they've all been missing in action. it's supposed to take three whole years for you to do anything if there's a problem. if we had not filed that petition, you and i would not be talking today. there would be no action at all. it would be another three years of the residents living in benton harbor drinking this contaminated water. >> that is true. yes, we would not have known about it, i totally agree. we talked about flint a lot. we did not know what was going on in benton harbor. but you've been working on this on the ground. you've been trying to get the attention of, i know, the epa,
your state officials. you called out someone specifically. who is at fault here most in your mind? >> i think mate or of benton harbor should have done more. this is my belief because people have been hollering and screaming that the water is contaminated to protect the residents of benton harbor, and i believe that there would have been some kind of action behind this. but one of the things that i do know, there would be no action unless we didn't get national attention, and what we have now is national attention, and that's the only reason something is being done. let me say this real quick. can you imagine if a white lady was standing in front of you today with her baby and her two children, and she's telling you that this lead is killing her baby? joe biden would be here right now. he would take a helicopter here to explain to the people that he's going to resolve this matter in six months or less.
>> it's hard to imagine the scenario that you just laid out. i agree. and so are you saying that because boenton harbor is primarily black, that's why the residents have suffered through this? >> absolutely. there's no doubt in my mind. racism is here and we have to do something about it. >> why hasn't the mayor done anything? >> maybe his lack of knowledge. sometimes people -- when you think about water, you don't ever think about water being bad. that's why people even today continue to drink the water. but when we first completed the first testing, he should have tried to correct the problem immediately. this problem has lingered for three years and that's three years too long. we don't know how many people have died from this water. we don't know how many people
suffered liver disease, kidney disease, heart disease. we don't even know the effects of it when it happened that people are missing in action rather than standing up and tackling this problem. i really put the problem on him. he should have blew the whistle a long time ago and he failed to do so. >> explain what the situation is on the ground in benton harbor. are people drinking the water? are you getting enough bottled water? what's it like today? >> here's the thing. the governor brought in 90,000 cases of water, which is good. which is good. but my thing is that when we go door to door. i make sure residents of benton harbor receive this water. that's my goal. it's a lot more work but it's got to be done. my team, we make sure only the residents of benton harbor receive this water. because the benton harbor
resident askis the one with the major problem. the only way to get out there is to go door to door and make sure they have clean water. >> it sounds like the lead levels may have gone up. i heard lead levels may be higher in recent samples than in 2018. it's unthinkable that it's going the wrong direction. have officials of the epa been responsive when you've tried to reach out to them? >> they're getting better. the only reason they're getting better is because of the petition. that petition has set the stage now where they almost have to do something, you see. one of the things the ep have done, they strictly put the blame on the city of benton harbor. there is enough blame to go around. you have the city of benton harbor, they should be blamed. you have eagle, and you have the
epa, they should be blamed. all three of these individuals, they all should be blamed and all held accountable. you can't let one of them off the hook. >> now that you have national attention, what can we do for you? what well do you want erv ef. we must keep it into the fore r frint. flight we do. you must keep it in the fore are the -- to make sure they do what they're supposed to do. that is crucial at this time. >> there are no ifs, ands and butts about it. when the camera man goes away, they'll go away. >> mr. edward pinkney, we will contact you every week.
we'll find out what's going on on the ground and we'll stay in touch. >> thanks so much. >> there was so much with flint and now benton harbor. >> for years. we knew nothing about it. baaron rodgers broke covid protocols by telling people he was immunized. at the amazon ware when my brother passed away. and a couple of years later, my mother passed away. after taking care of them, i knew that i really wanted to become a nurse. amazon helped me with training and tuition. today, i'm a medical assistant and i'm studying to become a registered nurse. in filipino: you'll always be in my heart.
at deep discount prices. -feel so tall right now! -i know, right? could you just. while you're up there? -♪ grocery outlet bargain market ♪ [announcer] our amazing 20 percent off wine sale is going on now through november 9th at your local grocery outlet. the green bay packers will take the field against the chiefs without a star player, quarterback aaron rodgers will miss sunday's game against kansas city because of covid-19 protocols. several outlets are reporting
rodgers has tested positive for covid and that he is unvaccinated. >> cnn has been unable to confirm his vaccination status but in august rodgers was asked about it. >> are you vaccinated and what is your stance on the vaccination? >> yeah, i'm immunized. you know, there's a lot of conversation around it, around the league. a lot of guys who have made statements and not made statements. owners who made statements. you know, there are guys on the team that haven't been vaccinated. i think it's a personal decision. i'm not going to judge those guys. >> here to discuss with us columnist for "usa today" sports. he clearly misled people. if he is unvaccinated that response is clearly, he is misleading. he said yeah when they asked have you been vaccinated he said yeah i've been immunized. how else can we interpret it?
>> absolutely. looking back now it is very obvious he was trying to obfuscate or lie, whatever word you want to use. at the time he was so as a matter of fact people figured he was using the words interchangeably but clearly he was not. >> this is the guy who hosts "jeopardy" in the off-season. so the selection of words, he is probably a wordsmith. it seems like he knows what he is doing as he says i'm not going to judge those guys who have chosen not to get vaccinated separating himself. what are the implications for rodgers and for the packers now that we have this reporting? >> a couple different things. first on the field the packers have one of their biggest games of the season sunday in kansas city and will be starting jordan love. it'll be his very first nfl start in a stadium that is one of the loudest in the league so
that is a challenge and given the way the playoff seedings are done now every game is important. so a loss here could mean the packers are -- you know, don't get a first-round bye. if you look in terms of the league response, you know, both rodgers and the packers will be waiting to see what the nfl decides. in previous cases when they've found teams and players not adhering to protocols they have fined them. six figures for the new orleans saints, seattle seahawks, las vegas raiders. there have clearly been instances of rodgers not following protocols. it is going to, you know, would they suspend him? would they fine him? these are all things we're waiting to hear from the nfl. >> he clearly misled the public there and the press. do we know if he misled his
teammates? what protocol wasn't he following? >> it seems as if the rest of the team knew about it. there didn't seem to be a whole lot of surprise when the news came out. the coach of the packers has been very careful to draw a line, saying that rodgers adhered to protocols in the football space. that was the term that he used today, which means in the locker rooms he apparently was wearing masks. in the hallways he was wearing masks. lefore also made it clear that press conferences where rodgers has not been wearing a mask was not his domain so it means the protocols were flouted in some way. there was also a halloween party this weekend that several packers players attended including rodgers. the nfl has a very long list of things that unvaccinated players are not allowed to koo and that halloween party would probably be among them. so the nfl has a lot to look at. we don't know when we'll get a decision or word from them but i
can't see them letting this slide whether it is rodgers himself or the packers as a team. >> nancy armour columnist with "usa today" sports. it will be pretty crucial how this new rookie quarterback performs this weekend to determine if that is influential on what they do with aaron rodgers because if he is problematic but love performs well, maybe that gives them some options as they continue the season. >> maybe it does. our thanks to nancy there. and "the lead" with jake tapper starts after a very quick break.
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groundhog day on biden's agenda. are we going to see joe manchin's shadow? "the lead" starts right now. speaker pelosi tells the democratic caucus she wants a vote on the two major pieces of biden's legislative goals before they all hit happy hour tomorrow. once again we have to ask. is this actually going to happen? quote, don't mess with moms. the anger so many parents have been feeling about shut down schools burst open this week as voters went to the polls in two states where classrooms remained empty for longer than most. plus, just one
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