tv CNN Newsroom With Poppy Harlow and Jim Sciutto CNN November 9, 2021 7:00am-8:00am PST
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good morning. top of the hour on a tuesday. i'm erica hill. >> i'm chute shoot. t new details show there was no plan to deal with a surging crowd at the deadly astroworld concert in houston. investigators are still working to determine all possible causes of deaths and injuries to concertgoers. at least 18 lawsuits have been filed so far. all of this as the houston fire chief says that travis scott had a shared responsibility for the safety of the crowd at that festival. also this morning, we're waiting to see how six former trump associates respond after being subpoenaed by the january 6th committee investigating the insurrection. many of these people helped to spread the big lie, which of course fueled the capitol insurrection. now a renewed focus on attorney general merritt garland to see if and how the doj will enforce
the request and how to deal with steve bannon at this point. in houston, rosa flores is following all the developments there. rosa, tell us where the investigation stands this morning because it seems we're learning so much about security failures. even the video we watched of the people rushing the gates early on, it just looked like a mess. >> reporter: you know, jim, it was a mess. i think that's one of the big questions is what went so wrong here that eight people are dead? now, we haven't gotten an update from the houston police department about the investigation since saturday. we continue to push for answers to see if there is any new development in this investigation. what we have been learning about the investigation is actually from the people around it from the organizers who have issued statements saying that they're cooperating with authorities, that they are providing video, for example. that was the last statement we
received from live nation. it includes that information. here's what they said. "throughout the weekend, we have been working to provide local authorities with everything they need from us in order to complete their investigation. we have also provided them with all the footage from our cctv cameras. we are working on ways to support attendees, the families of victims, from providing mental health counseling to setting up a health fund to help with costs for medical expenses." when you talk about the mental health here, you're not just talk about the concertgoers, and i talked to many, who say they're traumatized by this event. it's also the family members of those victims and of course the individuals who died. we have all of their names. here they are. 23-year-old, 21-year-old franco patino, 20-year-old jacob jurinek, 16-year-old brianna
rodriguez, 14-year-old john hill ge hilgert, 27-year-old baig, goes by danish. 23-year-old madison dubinsky. 21-year-old costa avila. some people are still fighting fir their lives, the houston fire chief telling me this morning that three individuals are still in the hospital, two of them in critical condition. one of those individuals is a 9-year-old boy who is fighting for his life. his grandfather telling cnn that this concert was supposed to be a moment for a dad and a son to have a good time together. at this concert, according to his grandfather, the little boy was on his father's shoulders. well, i've heard it from so many concertgoers that at points in this concert it was difficult for people to control their bodies, to even breathe. erica and jim, according to this grandfather, the dad passed out and the little boy was on his shoulders, fell onto the crowd,
was transported to the hospital as a john doe, later identified by his family. now he's fighting for his life. >> it is just awful. it is heartbreaking. rosa, thank you. joining us now to talk more, roy lozano, the assistant fire chief for the houston fire department. good to have you with us this morning. i know there are a lot of questions about how this happened. the fire chief told my colleague jake tapper yesterday that why there was this, you know, 30 minutes that passed between when a mass casualty event was declared and when travis scott stopped performing was is $64,000 question. hope us understand, what is the protocol in a moment like this? you have a major event. there's a mass casualty event that's declared. what happens next? is there someone backstage who is in direct communication with the manager, the artist, someone who says now it's time to stop?
>> erica, can you hear me? i just lost the last two words you said. >> i can hear you. what's the protocol? what happens as soon as a mass casualty event is declared? what should happen? what's the communication both backstage and with those performers on stage at that moment? >> so, first, before we get into those details, there's obviously an investigation. i want to echo the fire chief's sentiments about thoughts and prayers for the family. we have confirmed that eight have died. three in the hospital, two in extremely critical condition. now, the houston fire department in this particular case was not involved in the inside perimeter of that event. we had some foresight and staged as edmontons outside the perimeter. we were monitoring closely. it was not a 911 call but our own leadership e that recognized that resources were getting overwhelmed, deployed a task force, later escalating to a mass casualty incident and getting an additional 11
ambulances to that location. at the highest point we had over 62 assets at that location. when a ms. casualty situation is declared, it's important we notify as many people as possible and try to control the crowd. unfortunately, you have to kaltder to your audience. this is a very young crowd. it's been covid. people are finally getting out, trying to enjoy the presence of other people. it's very difficult to control. many people want to shed blame, but it's really too early. it's important to let the investigative process take its toll, but for the fire department, what's important is that when we come in, we come in in force. so when we showed up and had over 20 units, we had a complete escort of hpd gaining access. we were the ones that transported 12 very critical and in many cases cpr in progress. so what's important for us is that when we show up and that declaration is known that the word spread across all agencies involved. >> right.
>> including our third-party partners. >> so to that point, right, you showed up, but there must have been somewhere a drop in the communication that would normally happen. even if you're not in charge of that, you must be aware of what the protocol is and who is supposed to be talking to whom when that declaration happened. the chief says he feels if travis scott had stopped performing sooner, this could have had at least a slightly different outcome. i'm curious, based on what you just said about the crowd, is there something that you feel, because he has such sway over his fans, that travis scott could have said, should have said in that moment to perhaps further limit the chaos, the injuries, and even the deaths that we saw? >> well, i agree with the fire chief. letting the artist know the situation and saying that he has the largest microphone in the venue, it may have helped. could we definitely say it would have changed outcomes? i'm not prepared to make that
statement, but i agree with the fire chief wholeheartedly. having the artist involved in that process, notifying those -- because the concert venue was huge, it was well within industry standards of holding 50,000 occupants. it was designed to hold close to 100,000 if not more. but because the concentration was up against the stage, having that large microphone, explaining to the crowd and hopefully -- and that is hope -- that the crowd would listen, i'm not going to say that circumstances could have changed, but it certainly would have -- >> based on -- let me get your thoughts on this before we let you go. anybody who's attended a concert that has, you know, this kind of open space where you can buy a ga ticket, they understand crowds can get tight. the fact it was able to become this dense and that resulted in this chaos without there being a plan, so as we've listearned, te
was no contingency plan for any sort of crowd surge, and that comes on the heels of we know three people being trampled and hospitalized at the same festival in 2019. was that a concern for the fire department that there was no contingency plan for a crowd surge? >> the fire department always wants to be involved in the early planning phases of any target hazard where there's going to be a concentration of lives, because part of our mission is lifesaving. that's what we do. the challenge is just because the venue is large enough doesn't mean you're going to be able to control the crowd where they concentrate. i spoke to many of our partners from the fire marshals office and just to get an idea what could we do different. and one of the things is when you know you're going to have this type of crowd that is large that can easily converge onto a stage, it's better to hold it in a traditional brick-and-mortar venue with compartmentallization
going on, no ability for someone who has a ticket in the back of the venue that would be able to make their way to the front of the venue. those are luxuries you don't have in an open-air performance. you know, this venue was large, well within industry standards. the concentration was the unpredictable -- the known unknown at that point. >> certainly a lot of people talking about, though, how that could have perhaps been split up a little bit more. thanks for joining us today. thank you. >> thank you. the january 6th committee accelerating its probe into who plotted and organized the effort to overturn the 2020 election. the panel issuing six new subpoenas targeting top trump campaign associates. >> joining us, cnn justice correspondent jessica schneider. tell us who's being targeted in the latest batch and what happens next in terms of enforcing them. >> reporter: that's the question.
will they comply with this. we know steve bannon hasn't. what will become of these six subpoenaed? the committee says they all were involved in promoting the big lie that the election was stolen. first to john'sman, a conservative lawyer with trump's legal team, and we had previously reported he drafted that two-page memo outlining a scheme to try to persuade then vice president mike pence to throw out the 2020 election results on january 6th. we've heard from congressman jamie raskin on the committee. he says learning more about'sman's role is key. eastman's deposition is set for december 8th. we'll see if that actually happens. then bill stepien. he was the manager of the trump election campaign, and the committee says that makes him a key witness to trump's efforts to overturn the election. the committee also says that a witness has hold them that stepien was deeply involved in the messaging campaign around the stop the steal message. then jason miller. he's long been with trump, a
longtime adviser, senior adviser for the 2020 re-election campaign. he was present at the willard hotel in that meeting to try to overturn the election january 5th. and the committee claims that miller used his platform as senior adviser to peddle lies about election fraud. he coordinated news conferences with trump and rudy giuliani to claim the election was rigged. then angela mccallum, she was the national executive assistant for the re-election campaign, and she allegedly left this voice mail pressuring a michigan state lawmaker to support overturning the results in that state. now we get to michael flynn. of course, the short-lived national security adviser left just a few months into trump's term. the committee says he attended a june 18th meeting -- sorry, december 18th meeting inside oval office where people were talking about ways to push election fraud. and finally among the subpoenas
we have bernie karic. he was the former new york city police commissioner, now a close trump ally. the committee says he was also in that willard hotel war room on january 5th. he also allegedly worked with rudy giuliani to promote baseless allegations of voter fraud. karic is the first one we're hearing about issuing a public statement about these subpoenas. he is saying this to cnn -- "i will not be threatened, intimidated, force into bankruptcy or silenced at the hands of this committee who are not looking for the truth but targeting patriots and members of the president's legal team that wanted nothing more than to investigate and expose those irregularities." so he's already airing his defiance. but as you talked about at the top, the question remains here, will any of these latest six subpoenaed trump allies comply or will they follow steve bannon's lead and defy these subpoenas, especially given the fact the justice department, 2 1/2 weeks in now, still has
not decided to prosecute bannon for that criminal contempt referral. interestingly, none of these six, just like steve bannon, none were government employees, and that could make any claims they might make about executive privilege a step like we've seen with steve bannon. guys? >> we'll see how enforceable the subpoenas are. jessica, thanks so much for following. still to come this hour, what would happen if you or i tweeted a video depicting yourself or myself violently attacking a co-worker? one republican congressman is about to find out. that post is causing a stir understandably. and in georgia, the prosecution calls another police officer who responded to ahmaud arbery's being shot and killed. a warning in vermont after a spike in covid-19 cases. why one college is blaming halloween parties for an increase in the spread. hat righ.
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is not showing it. >> it's still up on twitter, the whole video. according to "the washington post," gosar's staff responded by saying "everyone needs to relax." jackie and john avlon join us. jackie, you know this well, look back to representative steve king, right. he was pushed out of his committee positions by republican leadership for racist comments. i mean, i wonder what the red line is now. the bottom seems to have fallen so far. is there a comment, including a violent one, that gets a punishment within the party at this point? >> well, clearly not. it's pretty clear that kevin mccarthy is fine letting his caucus become feral. there's no punishment in this republican leadership structure. and i'll tell you what, based on when republicans took the
majority or any party takes the majority, it doesn't get easier to control some of these members once they are in the majority. but hi's clearly made the calculation that it's not worth punishing these people, maybe because of backlash from the followers, maybe backlash from the president. i don't know. i haven't talked to him about it. however, it's clear that he's not policing some of these members perhaps like he should, because that's what leadership is. >> yeah. >> i mean, i would say there's zero policing. there hasn't been much of a reaction as we know either. it's not just democrats who were targeted. the 13 republicans who voted for the infrastructure bill. we should point out this really disturbing voice mail which was shared with cnn. so if we don't play it, the caller says, "i hope you die. i hope everybody in your bleeping family dies." he did respond. i just want to play what he had
to say. >> it's a real step back. thank goodness it wasn't a constituent, but i have a colleague as you know that put out the phone numbers of the 13 of us who voted that way. glad to defend that vote. >> now, he did point out -- referring to marjorie taylor green, who shared the phone numbers of all 13 republican who is voted for the infrastructure bill. john, as we look at this, i think it's clear there's no real acknowledgment of the danger. we've seen this growing for some time. the fact that this has become in some circles acceptable, and we keep looking at it and -- as jim says, we keep wondering where is the bottom, it's gotten so low. what is it going to take? i mean, is it going to take someone acting on these horrific threats? >> yeah, this is all happening ten months after the attack on our capitol by a violent mob trying to overturn the election on the back of the big lie. that wasn't enough.
an attack on our capitol to overturn our election was not enough to serve as a wake-up call about the dangers of these kind of incitement politics that are becoming mainstream within the gop. gosar and green are outliers, but that rhetoric being accepted changes the temperature. if threatening one of your co-workers with killing isn't worthy of a censure, what the hell is? this is just a symptom of the sickness in our politics and it's growing louder by the day because republicans have failed to stand up and confront and clearly condemn donald trump and his big lie. instead, they've tried to incubate it because they believe it will help them regain power. it will do the exact opposite while undermining our republican process. you make the point, we know these kinds of statements, this sort of rhetoric leads to violence. we saw it on january 6th. >> yeah. >> remember the images of the policemen -- i think of the one with his head in the door being
crushed by those folks. jackie, law enforcement says that. law enforcement, the fbi, policing domestic extremism says this kind of rhetoric is dangerous and can be deadly. is there no one within republican leadership right now who is aware of that and doing something about it? >> well, no one that they're listening to. listen, you had rules change that members can pay for private security out of their membership funds now. so that has changed. you have several members who have capitol police protection. leadership knows about this. the fact they're letting it happen, again there seems to be this hands-off way of handling it at this point. it defies logic. but there's more outrage about
liz cheney and kindkinzinger jog the january 6th committee rather than putting phone numbers out. >> jackie make askey point there. there's more moral outrage at kinz inger and cheney than ther is for members of their own caucus threatening other members of congress. that says everything. it's about fear of the mob. it's about fear of ex-president donald trump, fear of confronting the big lie. that's the most cowardly thing you can imagine. >> it's about power, retaking the majority. >> that's the deal. >> it's the fear of losing a vote because you put that above all else, not the safety of other members, not what, you know, the good is, certainly not example setting. it's fear of the extremists
leading that charge. jackie kucinich, john avlon, thank you both. >> to that point, it has been one full week since election day in new jersey, and the republican candidate for governor has still not conceded the race. the democrat incumbent phil murphy is ahead by 67,555 votes, or about 2.6%, and there are fewer than 100,000 provisional ballots yet to be counted. in new jersey, candidates have a right to request a recount if they believe an error was made. but the number of outstanding votes makings it a virtual mathematical impocket to change the outcome. ciattarelli's own legal counsel said in a statement last night, "we do not expect the provisional vote count to end with jack ciattarelli in the lead, but it may reduce the margin." they've seen no credible evidence of fraud.
ciattarelli said he does not want people to fall victim to wild conspiracies. however, listen closely to the language he uses in that same video. >> no one should be bickering or that we're conceding the election until every legal vote is counted. >> that insin waits some of the counts are not legitimate, some republican phraseology used after the 2020 election and feeding the big lie that former president donald trump started and is still alive. the race in virginia is a very different story. democrat terry mcauliffe lost to youngkin by 64,594 votes, or 2%, a smaller man gin percentage-wise than that in new jersey. yet the next day he conceded that race. note the pattern here. despite losing by a smaller margin, democrats in virginia accepted the results, conceded,
and began cooperating with the transition all within days. one week later, republicans in new jersey have not done any of those things just as trump has not done one year after 2020. >> just the facts. still ahead, prosecutors questioning what is expected to be their last witness in the trial of kyle rittenhouse. live to kenosha next. [sigh] ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ [typing] ♪ ♪ [typing] ♪ ♪ [typing] ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ music swells ♪
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prosecutors are expectsed to wrap up their case in the trial of kyle rittenhouse. >> he's akud ccused of killing people and injuring five. he has pled not guilty. pork shimon prokupecz joins us. >> reporter: it was very, very helpful for the defense, who feels putting on essentially their own case even while the prosecution is still putting on their own case. this is a self-defense case so the defense team has to prove that kyle rittenhouse acted in self-defense. when you look at the testimony from yesterday, that survivor of the shooting yesterday, when he told prosecutors, when he told
the defense team under examine nation that my hands were up while kyle rittenhouse was pointing at me, my hand came down and was pointing, the gun was pointing at kyle rittenhouse. here's how he explained it in cross-examination. >> when you were standing three to five feet from him with your arms up in the air, he never fired. right? >> correct. >> it wasn't until you pointed your gun at him, advanced on him with your gun with your hands down pointed at him, then he fired. right? >> correct. >> and then even after that, the prosecutors got up and they were trying to ask him questions about those moments. then he admitted in those moments his hands were up. but then they had him demonstrate how he was holding his gun, and he said he was holding it this way, sideways.
he of course, while on the stand, saying he did not intentionally do that. we'll see obviously how all of that plays out. today the prosecution is expected to wrap the case, but i was just inside the courtroom. you can see the defense team. they're eager to get going. they expect to put on a vigorous, vigorous case of their own, and perhaps in the coming days we will hear from kyle rittenhouse himself. >> shimon prokupecz with the latest for us from kenosha. thank you. also in session the trial of three men charged in the death of ahmaud arbery. right now prosecutors are questioning the officer who interviewed one of the defendants, greg mcmichael, on the day of the shooting. >> in the last hour, county police officer jake brandonberry testified his interview with mcmichael was continually interrupted by his supervisors, even by bystanders. >> at any point in time was greg mcmichael isolated from speaking
with any of the other parties there? >> no. >> was he told to sit on the curb and don't move? >> no. >> was he put in the back of a patrol car? >> no. >> you have unknown people coming up and interrupting and you're trying to get a statement from this person. >> yes, ma'am. >> let's speak to attorney elchrist stewart. how do you think the prosecution has handled the case? >> effectively so far. you know, we were disappointed with the jury with only one african-american, but, you know, despite that, your color doesn't mean you can't see justice. >> hmm. >> based on what we just heard and some of the testimony we saw this morning, the fact that there were these other people sort of jumping in, talking, supervisors, as the officer is trying to question one of the defendants on the scene, what does that lay out for you? >> it goes into the disaster
that you've already seen from, you know, the d.a. getting removed and getting preferential treatment at the scene. he should have been in a police car, should have been in handcuffs like any other individual. >> when we talk about this case, one thing that come understand frequently of course is this citizens arrest law which dates back to the mid-19th century and has since been largely repealed, but it was the law at the time of this. does it provide any, in your view, legal protection or at least rollouteasonable doubt fo defendants here? >> absolutely not. this case is really are you allowed to hunt a human being, black or white, it doesn't matter, can you hunt a human being who committed no crime? in this country, you cannot, plain and simple. >> one of things that's really struck me so far is the strength of ahmaud arbery's mother, who is in that courtroom, who has sat through disturbing video,
sat through some of the photographs the jury was shown yesterday, her son's body, just after he was shot. her presence, her strength in that courtroom, that is also going to have an impact on the jury. >> she's one of the strongest women i've ever known. it was an honor to help get these individuals charged and bring this case to light along with lee merritt. i talk to her daily. i check in every day after court just to make sure she's okay, but she's the strongest woman i have ever met and someone i look at as another mother now. >> before we go, looking back to the george floyd case, so influential in that trial, just the video of the moments as this happened. as erica is saying, jurors have been seeing, including the aftermath, pictures, as graphic as they are, of the gunshot wounds that he suffered. in your experience dealing with juries, how impactful can that kind of evidence be?
>> it's critical because people actually see another human being deceased. though it's graphic and hurts our soul, you have to understand a soul was taken and the only way to do that is with the pictures, so you can humanize ahmaud and see he was just like your son or your daughter, and now he's been taken because he was hunltded. >> l. chris stuart, thanks for helping to waulk us through it all. >> anytime. a new poll believe most americans believe some type of misinformation about vaccines and covid-19. what can be done about it? lives are at stake. we'll speak to dr. sanjay gupta next. shop walmart's black friday deals for days. ♪ ♪ with clean, fresh ingredients, panera's new chicken sausage and pepperoni flatbread is a mouthwatering explosion of yes. craft? yes!
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in just the first week since the pfizer vaccine for kids ages 5 to 11 received emergency use authorization, more than 300,000 in that age group have gotten their first shot. proud my 11-year-old was within of those yesterday. cases in kids had fall nl br eight weeks, we are starring to see them tick up again. >> our chief medical correspondent dr. sanjay gupta joins us now. sanjay, overall cases, infections seem to be holding steady across the country, what do you take from these numbers as they relate to children? >> we can look at what's been going won with the numbers overall, the news has been mostly good in terms of numbers coming down. the trajectory recently, there is this sort of flattening
overall. this is the seven-day average of new coronavirus cases. the demographic that has increased in numbers has been kids. you know, they're making a larger percentage of overall new cases closer to a quarter of new cases now, which is why the fact that, erica, you got your 11-year-old vaccinated is just -- that's part of actually bringing this under control. let me show you quickly just what the pandemic has looked like since the beginning, because i think it's important to look at now as we go into colder, drier months, versus a year ago. you see that in the middle of the screen a year ago. at that point, the numbers were all heading up, right? and so the entire immersion trajectory was different. they've been plateauing now, still coming down a little bit overall. we'll see. but the momentum is in the right direction. >> we'll take what we can get at this point. hopefully we continue to stay in the right direction. there's so much as you know all too well, sanjay, so much
misinformation. a lot of focus on the aaron rodgers spreading false information about covid vaccines. if you look at this new poll, there is a really alarming number of people who either believe vaccine misinformation, you know, don't know if it's true or false. i know you're working on this every day, but as we see every day, people are really siloed, and they don't want facts, they want confirmation that this idea that they saw somewhere is true. a perfect example is the backlash we're seeing to excellent information given on a saturday morning about vaccines for children. how do you fight that? >> it's challenging. i mean, you know, i feel like in some ways you're talking about my life's work, right? this is why i got into this business was to try and improve science literacy and health literacy. it's challenging. i think it's as bad as i've probably seen it, although it didn't start with this pandemic. i remember having conversations with peter hotez years ago about this, and at that point the general approach was don't fuel
these misinformation thing base giving it more attention. i think those days have passed. we have to address this misinformation. there's lot of people out there who, as you say, are just unsure. there are people out there who are cleary trying to create chaos and sow doubt. i think it does take a few different things, but reaching into different audiences, which we try to do, that's important because not everyone is watching or reading the news, but also i think social media, the democratization of information is so important, but as i go on this and try and put myself in the point of view of some people who are -- haven't been watching the story unfold over the last 20 months, it's hard to separate what is good and bad information. it's really hard. i think that's as big a problem in some ways as the virus itself. it spreads quickly. it can be as dangerous as the virus itself. it's something we'll have to do something about as world, because a lot of people who may have good-faith intentions but can't separate good from bad. >> if only there was a vaccine
for disinformation. >> wouldn't that be great. dr. sanjay gupta, good to see you. thanks. still to come, a man accused in the january 6th insurrection thinks he will be able to seek asylum in belarus. as a dj, i know all about customization. that's why i love liberty mutual. they customize my car insurance, so i only pay for what i need. how about a throwback? ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty ♪ only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty ♪ when did you see the signs?
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wanted by the fbi for allegedly assaulting police officers during the capitol insurrection says he is now considering seeking political asylum in belarus. that is according to an interview he gave with belarus state television. >> evan newman has been charged with six crimes related to the january 6th riot at the capitol including an assault on law enforcement officers. joining us whitney wild. so, this is quite an idea, heading to belarus. >> reporter: just one strange story in a list of many strange stories we've covered over the last ten months. he apparently got there on foot to add even more color and context to this story. evan newman was charged earlier this year as you mentioned, erica, six crimes related to his alleged participation in the january 6th capitol riot. one of those includes assault on law enforcement. newman allegedly punched two officers at the capitol as he and other rioters rustled with
officers over a barricade. prosecutors say after officers lost that barricade newman and others used it as a battering ram. he told belarus 1 after the fbi began searching for him he started hiding, traveling across america, going from one place to another. he made his way to europe. then in august he arrived to belarus by foot where he was detained by the country's border guards. he told belarus 1 in his interview that he is the subject of political persecution, erica and jim. >> belarus, to be clear, not a free country. whitney wild, thanks for following. thanks to all of you for joining us today. i'm jim sciutto. >> i'm erica hill. stay tuned. "at this hour" with kate bolduan start as after a quick break.
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hello, everyone. i'm kate bolduan. blame and sorrow. houston's fire chief says rapper travis scott bears some responsibility. the family of one victim speaks to cnn about their grief and loss. pain at the pump. americans are paying more for gas just as new estimates are released of how many people are getting ready to travel for thanksgiving. and the biden problem. the president's sinking poll numbers and their very real impact far beyond the white house. are republicans taking note? thanks for being here. let's start with new developments out of houston where eight people were killed and hundreds more hurt as a massive crowd rushed and surged towards the stage at travis