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tv   At This Hour With Kate Bolduan  CNN  December 3, 2021 8:00am-9:00am PST

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fully paid for but will general mate more than $100 billion in deficit reduction this decade. it fully covers the cost of its investments by making the largest corporations and the richest americans pay a little more in taxes. i think that's a tradeoff worth making. by the way, those very businesses will do better having a better educated and more available workforce. having done well paying their fair share is the right thing to do. throughout our history, we've emerged from crisis by investing in ourselves, and so we're going to keep at this. we're going to keep making progress for our families and for our nation. i promise you that's what's going to happen. god bless you all and may god keep everyone safe. >> mr. president -- >> mr. president -- >> mr. president --
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>> are you going to be -- >> first of all, mr. president, your voice sounds a little different. are you okay? >> i'm okay. i'm tested every day, a covid test. what i have is a 1 1/2-year-old grandson who had a cold who likes to kiss his pop. anyway, it's just a cold. >> on covid policy, it seems like the administration is starting to soften some of the language. there's this new op-ed where you talk about covid and we're going to beat it back. are you no longer going to shut it down? >> we have to beat it back before we shut it down. look, it's going to take time. in order to beat covid, we have to shut it down worldwide. in the united states of america, we're doing everything that needs to be done to take care of the american people within our borders. but look what's happened. we start to make real progress and we find out there's another strain. the idea that you can build a
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wall around america to keep any covid from around the world out is not there. and besides, that's one of the reasons why. i now we get criticized, i get criticized for not doing more for the world. we've done more for the world in providing vaccines available and help than any -- every other nation in the world combined. in addition to that, in addition to that, we've also with regard to other countries and working around the clock, remember, i suggested we suspend the pat ebbs so everybody can have access to this to make the vaccine in their own countries. thirdly, in southern africa, for example, south africans, all the vaccines they need. they don't want any more vaccines now. one thing i'm considering is how can we help them deal with the issue of the -- as i said to you before, the biggest challenge we
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had at the pe beginning of this administration in my view was not getting the vaccines produced, although that was not easy, and i've got to give, you know, president trump erl -- early on went out and did the research to try to get the right vaccines. logis logistically, logistically, getting a vaccine from a container that gets delivered to you, to a hospital, a state, and getting it in someone's arms, that's a very, very difficult thing. we did it better than anybody in the world, but we have to try to help other people. >> given that there are now multiple cases of omicron here in the u.s., are you considering requiring vaccines for domestic travel or any other new measures for domestic travel? >> the measures announced yesterday we believe are sufficient to deal with the
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proper medical precautions, to deal with the spread of this new variant. we are doing, as you know, at nih as well as among the manufacturers, a lot of research to see the extent of how quickly it spreads, how deadly it is, et cetera, et cetera. but we do require for travel, we'll continue to require that people have masks on and in public places, in federal buildings. i don't at this point -- let me -- i think i know a fair amount about this issue. but i'm not a scientist. so i continue to rely on scientists and asking them whether or not we have to move beyond what he did yesterday. right now they're saying no. >> what is happening in ukraine?
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what are you going to do about it? >> ifb in constant contact with our allies in europe, with ukrainians, my secretary of state, nurtds have been engaged extensively. and what i am doing is putting together what i believe to be -- will be the most comprehensive and meaningful set of initiatives to make it very, very difficult for mr. putin to go ahead and do what people are worried he may do. but that's in play right now.
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>> did you tuque to him this morning, mr. president? >> no. >> i'm kate bolduan. you heard president biden speaking about several topics -- the pandemic, russian aggression and ukraine, and the november jobs report, a jobs report showing hiring hit a speed bump, falling well short of expectations last month. just 210,000 jobs added, well below expectations. let's get over the john harwood live at the white house for us. john, what stood out to you from what we just heard from the president? >> reporter: well, first of all, he's got a cold, which he acknowledged. everybody could hear that in his voice. he got a question at the end of the news conference in which he said he's tested for covid all the time, this is simply a cold he got from -- he thinks he got from his grandson. setting that aside, on the economy, he unsurprisingly skipped over the most disappointing part of this very uneven jobs report, which was just 210,000 jobs added, much
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below forecast. he noted the previous months have been revised upwards, which is true. the measurement has gotten very uneven in the last several months during the pandemic. but he focused on the large drop in the unemployment rate down to 4.2% and how far it's come down since he took office. after taking credit for some of the steps that he's taken that have -- he argues has produced that unemployment drop, he pivoted to the current things that he is doing including pushing the efforts to control the coronavirus, a multipart plan which he outlined yesterday. he said he did not think he needed to go beyond that. he got a question about whether domestic air travel, a required proof of vaccination, should be part of domestic air travel. that's something that some public health experts have urged on him. he said the people he's listening to say that's not necessary at this moment. then he talked about efforts to
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smooth the supply chains and get inflation under control, talked about the recent decline in gas prices and targeted gas companies. he wants to look into whether there's been gas price manipulation. then he argued for his build back better plan, saying that would boost the economy, raise taxes on corporations, and try to help americans with costs in their day-to-day lives. finally, he talked about the russian menacing of ukraine, said he's putting together a plan that seeks to raise the cost of potential invasion on russia but didn't outline what the components of that plan would be. >> at the moment keeping that close to the vest. thanks, john. let's dig deeper into the jobs report and what we heard from the president. our global economic analyst is here to join us. as part of the president's remarks, he said simply put, america is back to work. it is not as as i remember as
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that when you look at this report. >> it's not. it's a very complicated report. it reflects the sort of creative destruction we're seeing in the economy right now and have seen for the past couple years. even before the omicron variant became an issue, you were seeing issues with rising cases with delta variants in the midwest and the northeast. that was weighing on jobs numbers. you know, understandably, travel and tourism jobs were down. but in other ways, you saw a lot of strengthening, logistics, transport, these are just booming. in fact, there are shortages, as we all know in jobs for truck drivers, ports, et cetera. it's a mixed report. also it depends on which surveys you're looking at. a lot of the traditional corporate hiring is down, but when households are surveyed, they say they're working more, so there could be interesting mixes of the gig economy there, people mixings up different jobs. it's hard to tell where we are and that's typical in pandemics. >> i was going to ask you, because this report is
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confusing. but why is this so confusing? >> honestly, when you look back in history, big events, pandemics, financial crises, wars, these are when economies and societies shift dramatically. one thing we can all see around us happening is the geography of work changing, right? a lot of companies aren't bringing people back five days a week. it will be two or three days. folks have moved two or three hours outside city centers. indiana and texas are booming as opposed to coastal areas. all this will take months if not years to settle out. it will make a difference on when and where the hiring gets done. we have in a period of massive creative destruction in our labor force right now. >> the participation rate increased for the month, 61.8%. what i've seen is that's the highest level that it's hit since march of 2020, since this crisis and pandemic began. so people are looking for jobs.
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>> they are. when people can't find work or go out and look, they're typically citing covid concerns or child care concerns. it's interesting in this infrastructure bill just passed there is quite a lot of money for child care, early childhood education, so i think you'll see some of those things abate, but it takes time. the president was rightfully pointing out the progress that's been made around ports and infrastructure, but things like child care and working out, you know, how families are able to get to job, that takes time. i think we'll be months away from really seeing things shake out fully. >> yeah. and the pandemic is, well, basically, driving and in the background, driving all of this. the omicron variant, what becomes of it, how serious of a concern it is, we've seen that amongst investors as we've followed that wild ride. since the summer -- speaking of wild rides -- every month's numbers have been revised up.
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was going on here with these revisions? what what story does this tell? >> i think it tells a story of the way we look at the labor force being kind of outdated. this is something i talked to the white house about, the labor department. folks in washington are working very hard to come up with new and better metrics of how we measure who's working. think of all the shifts we've gone through. i'm talking to you from my own office on a broadband connection. lots of people are working in different ways. we don't always measure those things correctly. i think that's why when you're given more time, you see those revisions upwards. there's an entirely new ecosystem of work right now, and we don't understand it as well as we should. >> and we don't understand what omicron means in all of this. when do you think, when we're talking about the economy, if and how much -- i think a healthy dose of "if" omicron variant impacts the economy?
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>> it's a great question. you know, part of that is going to be about the science, and i think that's going to play out over a few months, particularly as we see whether the vaccines are as effective as they have been with delta and whether we come up with new vaccines. but part of it is about what the fed is going to do. one of the reasons i think that, yeah, we've seen volatility in the markets, but, you know, stock prices are still pretty high compared to what's been going on at the ground level in the economy. that was in part because the fed had a bond-buying program, rates were very low. we've heard powell saying that may change in the new year. and that's something i'm going to be watching very carefully. you might start to see some big corrections once the market realizes that that tail wind from central bankers really keeping the markets up is starting to go away. >> great to see you, rana. thanks so much. >> thank you. coming up for us, alec baldwin speaks out about the film set shooting that killed cinematographer halyna hutchins.
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baldwin insists he is not responsible for her death. >> you felt shock. you felt anger. you felt sadness. do you feel guilt? >> no. no. i feel that there is -- i feel that someone is responsible for what happened, and i can't say who that is, but i know it's not me. of information. because the nfl is connected. and at any moment, the fate of the season can come down to this. billions of secure connections, per second. when the game is on the line and the game is always on the line touchdown! the nfl relies on cisco. we've been waiting all year to come together. ♪ happy holidays from lexus. get $1500 lease cash toward a 2022 rx 350.
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alec baldwin peeki gspeakin for the first time about the tragedy on his movie is the. he was emotional throughout the sitdown, especially as he remembered the filmmaker. here's a look at his conversation with george stephanopoulos. >> she was someone who was loved by everyone who worked with her, liked by everyone, and admired . i'm sorry. admired by everybody who -- who worked with her.
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the trigger wasn't pulled. i never pulled the trigger. >> you never pulled the trigger. >> no, no, no. i would never point a gun at someone and pug a trigger. that avs thtraining i had. >> you're holding onto the hammer. >> how does that work? do you see that? do you see that? i'm not pulling the hammer. bang, the gun goes off. everyone is horrified. they're shocked. it's loud. they don't have their earplugs in. the gun was supposed to be empty. i was told i was handed an empty gun. nothing with a charge at all, a flash round, nothing. she goes down. i thought to myself, did she faint? the notion that there was a live round in that gun did not dawn on me till probably 45 minutes to an hour later. at the end of -- she was laying
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there, and she was there for a while. i was amazed at how long they didn't get her in a car and -- but they waited and a helicopter came. by the time the helicopter took off with her and literally lifted off, we were all glued to that process outside. when she finally left, i don't know how long it was, 30 minutes, 40 minutes. it seemed like a very long time. they kept saying was she stable. just as you disbelieved there was a live round in the gun you disbelieved this was going to be a fatal accident. >> you didn't know exactly how serious it was. >> at the end of my interview with the sheriff's department, they said we regret to tell you she didn't make it. that's when i went in the parking lot and called my wife. >> joining me right now is dutch marek, prop master and armorer, and cnn senior legal analyst
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elie honig. what do you think of how alec baldwin describes what he was doing with the gun, what he says in that moment when it fired? he says he didn't pull the trigger, pulling the hammer back only as far as he could without cocking the gun. what does that mean to you? >> well, the way those guns are set up, there should be half-cock position, which is where you'll spin the cylinder to load it or unload it. if he pulled it past that point almost to the point of engaging the hammer all the way back, it should have dropped into the halfway position. if it didn't do that and went past that, was there a malfunction in the gun? did he not pull the hammer past the half cock where it would have stopped? there's safety mechanism in there. either way, when he did release the hammer, as he says, it was pointed at halyna. >> so there is still even with
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more explanation, if you will, there is still a lot more questions to be investigated, to be looked into, dutch. >> well, what really came to my attention during that interview was he described the physical positioning, the relationship of the people in the room. and it sound as though halyna, the director of photography, was to the right of the camera, what we call camera right, as alec was looking she would appear left of the camera. and she was focused at the little monitor on the side of the camera. and i imagine this typically as a case for director of photography or camera operator, they're laser focused on just what's in that box and not paying attention to what's here, because that's their job. she could have been giving him guidance saying move the gun this way, that way, okay, that's the spot, which means alex was then pointing at her, which is odd in the sense that what was alex's focus on that he didn't know he was pointing at her or he was just following orders, and there was no armorer there to say that's an unsafe move,
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don't point it there, or she cannot stand there at that moment. >> let me play one of the moments when stephanopoulos asked what we've heard from a lot of people, which is that -- since this happened, which is never pointing a gun at someone on set. let me play this. >> you're never supposed to point a gun at anyone on a set, some say, no matter what. >> unless the person is the cinematographer who's directing me where to point the gun for her camera angle. that's exactly what happened. >> dutch, with your experience, what do you think of what he said? >> well, the rule is true. you're never supposed to point at a person unless it's pointed at the cinematographer doesn't make a lot of sense. of course, had the armorer been in the room to on receiver that process and guide that blocking of the camera, they would have immediately said, no, you can't point the gun where that person
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is, or let's have her step away and put the monitor on the other side of the camera, where it is safe. so those are very common practices if we do a scene like that. very common. you move the monitor to the other side and have the people stand where it's safe and there's no risk at all. >> interesting. elie, what do you think of that? >> so that canned like it was a very heartfelt interview and the statements he said were genuine, but he said things that were really important legally, including the point we just made. he said one of the big issues of exposure legally he may have been is this yld you never point a firearm at somebody, even if you think it's unloaded, as dutch just said. alex explained in his accounting the way that happened was ms. hutchens was directing me and had me manipulate it to the point it was pointing at her. everything he said in that interview is fair game for a
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civil suit or criminal, although that likely won't happen. >> elie, as you noticed, he was very emotional throughout the interview, but when he was asked directly, he says, he does not feel guilt. let me play that moment. >> you felt shock. you felt anger. you felt sadness. do you feel guilt? >> no. no. i feel that there is -- i feel that someone is responsible for what happened, and i can't say who that is, but i know it's not me. honest to god, if i felt that i was responsible, i might have killed myself if i thought i was responsible. and i don't say that lightly. >> elie, what do you think of that moment? which also leads to what do you think of him doing this interview at all before the investigation is complete? >> anytime a person speaks in public while there's a pending investigation, pending lawsuit, it's a risk to that person.
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there are two particularly loaded words legally here that you could tell alex baldwin was on the lookout for -- guilt and responsibility. and what i read into that clip is what alec baldwin was told is, look, you cannot acknowledge guilt or responsibility, because those two things could come back to haunt you in court. you can talk about your emotion and reaction, but watch out for those words. you could see him steering very clear of giltd and responsibility and focusing more on his emotional reaction, which is a safer place to be. >> dutch, i wanted to ask you, because baldwin says it very clearly, like, to him, the only question to be resolved is where did that live round come from, where did that bullet come from. someone brought those live rounds in on the set and how they ended up in the gun. from your experience, whose ultimate responsibility is it to make sure any weapon is safe on set? >> well, firstly, i would say that's not the only question.
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there are several questions. maybe the biggest question is why and how there was a live round, one or more, on the set. but there's the entire chain of custody of the gun and how did it get loaded and how did it get to the first a.d. and went to the actor without the normal processes? it's really jarring to think that somehow a real round got onto a film set. it's number one on the firearms safety bulletin for motion pictures and television, is no live ammunition anywhere on a studio lot. under the extremely rare situation where someone would need to shoot live rounds for a scene, they would go to a shooting range and be under very carefully controlled circumstances. so is it something that migrated into a box of dummy rounds? somebody made them home made or made them of poor quality? were rounds mixed up on a range on a previous day and brought on to set?
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a number of combinations could happen. the rumor about the plinking has yet to be verified. the sheriff reiterated that day or earlier they'd taken the prop heerp row gun and done some live shooting with it, but that has not been verified. i highly doubt that was the case. >> thank you. coming up for us, new rules going into effect in just days. stricter testing requirements for all travelers coming into the united states. what you need to know next. if you just hold it like this. yeah. ♪ i love finding out things that other people don't want me to know. mm-hmm. [beep] i just wanted to say... ♪ find yourself in these situations and see who you are. and that's just part of the bargain. ♪ [energetic music throughout]
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- san francisco can have criminal justice reform and public safety. but district attorney chesa boudin is failing on both. - the safety of san francisco is dependent upon chesa being recalled as soon as possible. - i didn't support the newsom recall but this is different. - chesa takes a very radical perspective and approach to criminal justice reform, which is having a negative impact on communities of color. - i never in a million years thought that my son, let alone any six-year-old, would be gunned down in the streets of san francisco and not get any justice. - chesa's failure has resulted in increase in crime against asian americans. - the da's office is in complete turmoil at this point. - for chesa boudin to intervene
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in so many cases is both bad management and dangerous for the city of san francisco. - we are for criminal justice reform. chesa's not it. recall chesa boudin now. strict new testing rules for travelers coming into the united states take effect monday. all travelers coming into the country will be required to test negative for coronavirus one day before their departure. this change includes american citizens, and it's regardless of vaccination status. joining me for more on this is the dean of the brown university school of public health. doctor, requiring all travelers to test negative one day versus three days, which it's been, before entering the united states, how well do you think
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this is going to work? is there any downside? >> kate thanks for having me on. i think this is a great move. lit help. it's not obviously a panacea, but it will help. the downside is it's going to get harder for travelers to always be able to find a high-quality pcr they can get a result from within a day. i think making sure that test is as close to travel date as possible will help catch more infections before they come into the u.s. >> another change that the white house announced to battle the potential winter surge is making at-home testing more affordable and acceptable. they say rapid testing will be free of reimbursement through insurance now. i mean, you and i have been talking about the need for more testing since the beginning of this pandemic. is this the fix? >> this is -- again, it's going to help. the issue is we need a lot more rapid tests widely available. we need to get into a situation where people can easily get
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them. one of the problems right now is they're still way too expensive, so i appreciate the administration trying to make it more affordable to people. one of the best ways of making it affordable is we should have a lot more available, more supply will drive down prices. there's lot more we can be doing. this is i would say a step forward in the right direction. >> why is testing still such a challenge in the united states? can you put your finger on it? >> in some ways we haven't understood how powerful a tool it is for controlling the virus. we think it's a diagnostic thing, if someone gets sick, they should get a test. if we had it widely available, it would bring infection numbers down. i think neither administration has put enough emphasis, the trump administration totally undermined testing, the biden administration has done a better job, but i don't think they've done enough to make these tests as widely available as they should be. >> where we are right now with the virus, some of -- i'm now mostly focusing when i'm trying to look at it on hospitalizations, and
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hospitalizations are up 22% in the past month. the seven-day average is near 60,000 people in the hospital with covid. is this a warning sign that people should be paying attention to now? >> it is. and we are unfortunately going through a winter surge. we are seeing large increases in infections. this is, by the way, not the new variant. this is the delta variant that's been with us for many months. it is filling up hospitals. more than a thousand americans are dying every day. the sad part is this is not last winter. we have so many more tools now. we know how to get out of this. people need vaccinated and boosted. if more americans did that, we would not be in the position we're in. >> that's why it's so frustrating. we're not talking about december of 2020. in a new cnn analysis, it puts a finer point on it, it finds that since vaccines have become widely available, the average risk of dying from covid is 50% higher in states that voted for
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donald trump in 2020 than statements that voted for joe biden. what does that say to you? >> yeah, look, vaccinations and the public health crisis is not a political issue, certainly should not be. but there are people who have politicized it. i think that's unhelpful. what we know is that vaccines work. if you're a democrat or republican or anything in between. and we should be getting more people vaccinated and we should see all political leaders advocating for vaccinations. i wish we were able to do that. >> absolutely. even that the point. good to see you. thank you so much. >> thank you, kate. it another been just a week since a south african scientist discovered the omicron variant and reported it to the world health organization. the w.h.o. scientist says it's very transmissible. joining me is the w.h.o. spokesperson, dr. margaret harris, back with us. thanks for being here. hearing that from your chief
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scientist today, we obviously listen very closely with a lot of interest in hearing it's very transmissible. it had me thinking, it's been one week since this was labelled a variant of concern by the world health organization. what else do you think you have learned i guess concretely about this variant in the past week? >> well, we've certainly seen that it's effectively spreading itself in south africa. so we see -- and this is one of the reasons why we characterize it as a variant of concern so quickly and early because it was already associated with a very big rise in cases. south africa had a flat curve, then it went straight up. the other thing that's becoming clearer is that people who were infected with other versions of the sars 2 virus can be reinfected with this one. we're seeing that previous natural infection isn't pro protecting people against being reinfected with this one. we've also seen of course that
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it has now spread to more than 38 countries. so we are certainly seeing that it has moved within the human movements very effectively. >> yeah. it also reinforces an important thing i've been wanting to talk to you about, which is no one is safe unless everyone is safe, which has become the mantra and the global effort with vaccines. world health organization has been very clear that wealthier nations need to do more to get the rest of the world vaccinated. and the biden administration just announced it's shipping 9 million vaccine doses to africa today, 2 million to other countries. i'm curious, what is the real impact of that amount of vaccines compared to the need right now? >> well, it's certainly a big help. i think it's also symbolic that countries like the u.s. and others are now seeing and acting on the need. we did hear a lot of talk earlier, but now we're actually seeing action being taken. and that is great because i'm sorry that it took omicron to
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make people understand how serious this is, because we have been saying and you've been saying that we need to vaccinate the whole world so that we don't give the virus a chance to turn itself into a more effective version. >> the president of the united states also just said that, i think the way he put it is that south africa has all the vaccines that they need. the ceo of moderna actually told the "financial times" that they have a sur pplus of doses earmarked for south africa sitting in warehouses because those taxed with distribution haven't taken delivery. moderna's ceo says we're running out of space. is this customs? is this fridge space? is this hesitancy? what is holding this up when we know the need to get people vaccinated in poorer countries is so great? >> so we've been hearing this
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kind of narrative, this kind of story. i would say it's a bit of a convenient myth. what we've struggled with, and it's with the various developers and is being provided with clear visibility on what's available, i mean, what type of vaccine is available, what's the expiration date on those vaccines, what volumes are coming through and when they're coming through, because any country, countries as advanced as the united states or a country with a weaker health system needs to know what kind of vaccine they have, does it need an ultra cold chain, for example, how much you'll get, when, so you can plan exactly how you deliver it. but what we are seeing in countries is not any difficulty actually with getting people to be vaccinated. the struggle is making sure that
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it's available in the right place at the right time so that people can get to it and so it can get into people's arms. >> this seems like something that has to be fixable when you've got the smartest minds in the world on this. thank you so much, dr. harris. appreciate your time. coming up, will the parents face charges? that is a real question right now about the parents of a 15-year-old suspect in the michigan school shooting. what the lead prosecutor revealed to cnn is next. your h history.s a wah do you remember who o this is? it's a gift ththat surprises y, moves you, and b bonds you. ...papa? i can sesee the nose and everything. she was the original strong woman. i know. this holiday, give the gift of family. give the gift of ancestry®. ♪ >> man: what's my safelite story? i spend a lot of time in my truck. it's my livelihood.
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15-year-old suspect in the moments from now, prosecutors are expected to announce whether or not there will be charges brought against the parents of the 15-year-old suspect in the michigan school shooting. four students were killed, seven others injured. let's go are there right now. cnn's shimon prokupecz is standing by for this press conference to begin. what are you expecting to hear? >> reporter: well, certainly a significant announcement and new information the prosecutor is hinting at. she suggested so much last night when she spoke with anderson cooper. take a listen to what she said. >> the information that will be announced tomorrow will also
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disclose that it probably could have been prevented, and that is unconscionable. we're going to hold him accountable, but we're also going to make sure that the person or the individuals that gave him access to that weapon and did so, and not just a negligible way, far beyond negligence, are held accountable. i spoke to these parents the day after this happened. >> reporter: and, kate, one of the things we have learned, obviously, from the investigators here is that the weapon that was used by the alleged shooter was bought by his parents, that 9-millimeter weapon, something the sheriff revealed early on after the shooting occurred. and that is something that prosecutors have been focusing on, the fact that the family provided this weapon to this 15-year-old. the other thing, of course, is
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the school and their responsibility after teachers came forward saying they suspected something suspicious was going on. the big question is why didn't the school do more? perhaps we'll learn more of that today as well from the prosecutor.. >> shimon prokupecz, thank you so much. coming up for us, exclusive cnn reporting on how facebook is profiting off ads promoting clear disinformation and anti-vaccine rhetoric. ads. that exclusive report is next. first, we all have bad habits, of course, and they can be hard to break. dr. sanjay gupta explores how to break the cycle in today's "chasing life." >> i'm dr. sanjay gupta host of cnn's "chasing life" podcast. let's face it we all have bad habits, and the holidays or even a pandemic can make it easier to give in to them. understanding how to break them requires knowing how a bad habit is even formed. it starts with a trigger.
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earn about covid-19, the more questions we have. the biggest question now, what's next? what will covid bring in six months, a year? if you're feeling anxious about the future, you're not alone. calhope offers free covid-19 emotional support. call 833-317-4673, or live chat at today. this is cnn breaking news. >> and we are following breaking news right now. cnn has confirmed a michigan prosecutor overseeing the
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investigation into that shooting at oxford high school this week, the prosecutor has just filed charges against the parents of the 15-year-old suspect. the shooterer here. let me bring in right now eli honing for more. i'm looking at the paperwork, and it says both parents charged with four counts each of homicide, involuntary manslaughter. tell me what this means? >> yeah, kate, so involuntary manslaughter means the defendants, the two parents does not mean necessarily they intended to kill anybody, it means that they engaged in what we call criminal negligence, meaning they had a duty of care, and they created a situation or helped create a situation so dangerous, that it caused a risk of death or great bodily injure to others. knowing what we know about the facts of the case i would imagine that relates to the way they obtained this firearm, the way they gave their son, who was a teenager, access to it, and what did they know about their
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son's state of mind. he was reportedly in trouble with the school, they were having interventions. if they provided a firearm to perform who they knew was being eratic or behaving in an unpredictable way, that could go to that charge. >> we don't see this happen. we don't often see this happen, that parents are charged in this way. talk to me about how unusual this is and what this means. >> yeah. it's very unusual, kate. it may be unprecedented. i can't think of a case off the top of my head -- unfortunately we've seen too many of these mass shooter school shooter scenarios and a question people ask naturally is, what about the parents? where are the parents in all this? i think there could be an interesting precedent set here. it you're talking about parents who behaved in a way that was criminally negligent. i don't think it's enough for parents to just say that wasn't me, that was my child. i think what the prosecutor is saying with these charges is, let's look at the parents'
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responsibility, in getting that gun, letting their child have that gun or what they knew about the child who would know better than the parents. this is a new frontier in terms of imposing responsibility on people for these kind of mass shootings. >> what kind of challenge is it proving these charges? i mean, this is -- we've got a lot more to learn here now. >> yeah. it's difficult for prosecutors. you have to prove your case beyond a reasonable doubt. important to keep in mind the prosecutor does not have to prove that parents knew or intended, okay, he's going to go out and kill people or harm people. it's a lower bar than that. you have to prove what the parents did was inexcusebly rkless, criminal negligence, they created or contributed to a situation they should have foreseen could have been dangerous to somebody's life or someone's great bodily harm. that's a lower bar than what you think of as your traditional intentional murder, but yes, prosecutors will have to prove this case beyond a reasonable doubt.
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>> the prosecutor said last night to anderson cooper, she believes she's seen from the story so far from the parents -- what the parents did was beyond negligence is how the prosecutor said it on cnn. thank you very much. as you can see in the side of your screen we're waiting to hear from the prosecutor in this case. an update on this and formal announcement of this breaking news, involuntary manslaughter charges against the parents of the boy charged in the shooting death of four students, injuring several more at his high school this week. much more with "inside politics" right now. . welcome to inside politics. we begin with breaking news and we will get the details. the oakland county prosecutor decided to file involuntary manslaughter charges, four counts each, against the parents of the alleged shooter who killed four stud


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