tv CNN Newsroom With Pamela Brown CNN April 3, 2022 5:00pm-6:01pm PDT
this is the most outrageous atrocity of the 21st century. >> we can't become numb to this. we can't normalize this. >> indeed, this is genocide. >> the elimination of the whole nation and the people. >> just before sunrise multiple air strikes struck a fuel storage facility here in the city of odesa. >> seeing clearly the threat he poses not just to ukraine, to
europe, to democracy and global stability. >> indeed to completely destroy. we're going through bucha accompanied by the ukrainian national police and they took us to a church on the compound of that church we walked around to the back and that's where we saw this mass grave. ♪ ♪ i'm pamela brown in washington. you are live in the cnn newsroom on this sunday. the horrors of war in ukraine as russian troops pull back from the kyiv region, the barbaric and grotesque sight. the images from bucha are graphic and tough to see but vitally important in capturing the cold-blooded brutality of the russian occupation. a cnn team came upon this mass grave. at least a dozen bodies can be seen.
they are not alone. residents say that about 150 people are buried there. the satellite images show mass graves being dug on the grounds of a church. the burials are cold and efficient. and many victims are not even afforded that. again, a warning of graphic images ahead here. these are the bodies of about 20 civilians left scattered across one street there. they were apparently shot execution style. some had hands restrained behind their backs. their bodies discarded in a final cruel indignity. russia is dismissing this evidence of a massacre as quote staged. ukraine's president calls it quote genocide. >> translator: some things they have done when we find people with, with hands tied behind
their back and decapitated, such things i don't understand. i don't comprehend. the kids who were killed and tortured so it wasn't enough just to kill for those criminals. maybe they wanted to take gold or washing machines and they were killing but they were also torturing them as they did this. indeed, this is genocide. >> our fred pleitgen was part of the cnn team that captured the images of the mass grave. he's in kyiv with the latest. >> reporter: hi, there, pamela, as the russians continue to withdrawal from areas around kyiv and towards the border with belarus and ukrainians move into the territories, two things are increasingly clear. on one hand, a lot more russian military hardware was taken than anybody would have thought and on the other hand, a lot more
civilians came to harm as well. we witnessed that firsthand. here is what we saw. as russian forces retreat from the area north of kyiv in their wake, scenes of utter destruction. whole blocks of houses flattened, ukrainian authorities saying they believe dead bodies are still lying underneath. but here the dead also lay in the open. ukrainian national police showed us this mass grave in bucha saying they believe 150 civilians might be buried here but nobody knows the exact number. people killed while the russian army occupied this town. this is what it looks like when the hope is crushed. vladimir has been serging for his younger brother dimitri and now he's convinced he lies here even though he can't be 100% sure. the neighbor accompanying him with strong words for the russians. why do you hate us so much she asks?
since the 1930s you've been abusing ukraine. you just want to destroy us. you want us gone. but we will be, everything will be okay. i believe it. video from bucha shows bodies in the streets after russian forces left the area. some images show bodies with hands tied behind their back. the russian defense ministry denies killing civilians and claims images of dead civilians are quote fake but we met a family just returning to their house which they say was occupied by russian soldiers. they show us the body of a dead man in civilian clothes they found in the backyard. his hands and feet tied with severe bruises and a shell casing still laying nearby. russia's military appears to have suffered heavy losses before being driven out around kyiv. this column of armored vehicles in bucha completely destroyed.
they say the russians were trying to go towards kyiv and intercepted by ukrainian drones, artillery and also the javelin anti tank weapons. it's not clear how many russians were killed but many were and others fled the scene. a national police officer said the russian troops were simply too arrogant. they thought they could drive on the streets and just go through, he says, that they would be greeted as though it's all right. maybe they think it normal to drive around looting, destroying buildings and mocking people. it appears autorussians have with withdrawn. they say they're in full control of the region in kyiv but only now the full ex end the of the civilian suffering is truly coming to light. and, you know, pamela, what we saw there in bucha was obviously awful but unfortunately, it's not something necessarily unique just to that one small town
around the capital of kyiv. in fact, just today, we were in various other places, various other small towns and satellite towns around the ukrainian capital and every single one of them we saw the same scene. we saw utter destruction, destroyed buildings where the local authority said there is still dead people underneath, dead bodies in the street, dead bodies in backyards and as the time progresses, as the ukrainians make more and more in roads and access a lot more areas, unfortunately, they're probably going to find more of the same, pamela? >> so disturbing, thank you. the u.s. state department will help document any russian atrocities committed against civilians. cnn's arlette saenz is at the white house for us tonight. what are you hearing from the biden administration? >> reporter: pamela, the biden had minute sta administration is expressing shock with the scenes out of bucha and antony blinken calling it a punch to the gut. blinken said the u.s. and state
department will document any possible war crimes and atrocities that are occurring in ukraine at this moment. of course, the u.s. has officially accused russia of committing war crimes but there are still official inves investigations going forward both today secretary of state antony blinken and the secretary general said that russia must be held accountable for their pattern of brutality in ukraine. >> you can't help but see these images as a punch to the gut. there needs to be accountability for it but the most important thing is we can't become numb to this. we can't normalize this. >> it is a brutality against civilians so we haven't seen in europe for decades and it's horrific and it's absolutely unacceptable. >> now, even as they issued those condemnations, they didn't
go as far as ukrainian president zelenskyy that describes the scenes playing out as genocide. now, the next questions are whether the u.s. and allies might take additional steps to punish russia for actions. the u.s. consistently said that sanctions the option of additional sanctions remain on the table and the u.s. has been sending more military equipment into ukraine. sources telling us that the u.s. is going to help facilitate the transfer of soviet air tanks from allied countries into ukraine as the u.s. and allies are further trying to help the ukrainians defend themselves against this assault from russia. pamela? >> arlette saenz from the white house tonight. thank you. joining me now, retired army general paul eaten served as the commanding general of operations to iraqi troops during operation iraq freedom. general, as a career military office, what is your reaction to what we have seen? wide spread bombardment of
civilian areas and the apparent execution style killing of civilians. >> pamela, it only gets worse. what we've seen are thousands upon thousands of russian mothers sons doing this who have committed atrocities. they have pulled triggers. they pulled lanyards. they pushed buttons. they've done worse. and we need to reassess the entire russian culture and the entire world needs to move with us to isolate russia and to hold them accountable. in the courts of law that we have established to deal with such things. i was the deputy commander for u.s. forces in bosnia. i've seen this before. and it is a testimony to how evil an approach to life can be.
>> do you think we'll see more evidence of war crimes, similar to this and worse as russian forces pull out of more areas? >> this can also bring us back to world war ii when we would see atrocities committed in and around germany. we thought that we had seen the worst and then we would uncover even more appalling scenes of inhumanity. so the russian culture is on trial here and will be for many, many years to come. >> so what more could be done in your view to isolate russia and hold putin accountable for these horrendous grotesque crimes, these war crimes against innocent civilians? >> the entire world needs to
repudiate all things russian. their ships must not land in foreign ports. their aircraft must not land on foreign airports. their people must be bottled up in russia. they must be held accountable and an absolute economic diplomatic cyber isolation of russia is what we need to do. >> i do want to ask you, though, what would you say to the argument that the russian people in large part there, you know, being brainwashed by the propaganda there and so forth and that they shouldn't be punished, that putin is the one where the focus should be. what do you say to that argument? >> we have lived this before during world war ii and we have held accountable the entire german population, the entire
japanese population for their deprivation during world war ii. we allowed those countries to recover. we allowed those countries to rejoin the league of civilized nations but it was a long path for them. there was a tonement by them and that's what we're looking at right now to see happen to the russian people. >> all right. general paul eaten, thank you for your time tonight. >> thank you very much, pamela. what should ukraine's next steps be after russian atrocities near the capital? i'll talk to the deputy prime minister of ukraine just ahead. he's met face-to-face with putin so you'll want to stick around for that discussion. plus, a mass shooting in california's capital city. six people killed and 12 wounded. tonight, police ask for the public's help to find the shooter. and chicago wants to make it
as gas prices around the country remain sky high, some cities are coming up with creative ways to bring relief to drivers. in chicago the average cost is $5 a gallon. mayor lauori lightfoot is unveiling a plan to give thousands of residents prepaid g gasoline cards. they would be worth 1$150 each. to be eligible, you have to live in chicago and earn less than 140% of the city's median income. mayor light foot joins us now. thanks fo ss for coming on the >> my pleasure.
>> chicago's 8 cents per gallon gas tax, why is this a better approach? >> our percentage of the gas tax is actually just 3 cents, we believe that this is going to have real impact and success in spring and summer months. you know that traditionally gas prices go up in the summer as more people drive. we're going to be able to reach about 150,000 people, 50,000 with the gas card and then we'll provide some discounts on public transportation, as well. >> would you look at also ending the gas tax? >> well, that's something that's going to be done at the state level. but we think that this is a way to immediately impact people. look, i'm old enough to remember when regular gallon of gas was under a buck, and now we see prices that are $5, $6.
we knew we had to get immediate relief to our residents. not wait for anything but put money in the pockets of drivers right away. >> so the average cost as of right now at last check, chicago is $4.80. to fill up two or three times with one of these cards, additionally 50,000 gas cards covers 5% of chicago households. so is this really meaningful relief? >> i think it will be meaningful for relief for the people that we're able to help we obviously can't reach every single driver but for those who really are struggling to fill up their tanks, to get to work, to get to school and just ordinarieryii
ordinary errands. >> yeah, it's coming out of our dollars and we found the money will cost us about $12.5 million in total and we think this is well worth the investment in our residents who really struggle with these very high gas prices. >> yeah, i mean, people across the country are struggling for sure. i want to talk about something else and that is crime data. you know, after seeing the most violent years since the 1990s new crime data from chicago shows shootings and homicides are down significantly in the city and analysis from the chicago sun times found the drop in shootings is the greatest in 15 of the city's most violent areas targeted by your administration. if this trend holds, what is your take away from the success? what do you think is behind this? >> well, look, we're grateful that our first quarter ended. shootings are down. we're not doing a victory lap. the year is young.
we got more work to do. i think that it's attributable to the number of different things, not the least of which is a real focus on gangs and guns and intervening their partnership with the federal government. we just announced with the attorney general of the u.s. march merritt garland on friday prosecuting dangerous guns that were being sold and then ended up on the streets of chicago. so we are relentless in our focus on driving down the number of shootings and homicides and carjackings but we're also relentless in making sure that we're making necessary investments for the long term. we know after many decades of just throwing law enforcement at a problem, we've got to deal with the violent dangerous people for sure and just invest in the problem, we got to also invest youth, people, places and
ways that will be meaningful for a long time. >> you've been clear you don't want to take a victory lap by any means. we're heading into the summer when crime tends to rise. do you think this trend will hold? >> we'll certainly do everything we can. we looked hard after 2021 where we ended up in a place that nobody wanted to be in and so we implemented new strategies, we put more resources into our patrol division and h.r. detectives and homicide resolution. we saw more homicides in 2021 than we had in the previous 19 years but we also have done more to be in partnership with the community because they have got a stake in bringing peace to their box and neighborhoods and more that we're doing this year, so we're cautiously optimistic
but we've got a long way to go. >> i want to ask you about refugees. ukrainian refugees before we let you go. the u.s. will take in up to 100,000 of them. you said you'd welcome many of them to chicago. how is the city preparing and what have you seen so far? >> we've got an incredibly strong group of folks who are involved in refugee resettlement. we -- a number of organizations with the city's assistance settle afghan refugees who are here. we started to see a trickle of ukrainians start to come. ukrainians have been living in chicago since the 1880s so we've got a big vibrant ukrainian community. a lot of other polls in particular have been fantastic. so we are ready to make sure that we provide the support once we see what the administration is trying to relocate people constantly welcoming them and
supporting them and making sure we transition to the united states as soon as possible and we have plenty of people on the ground that are themselves of ukrainian heritage or ukrainian immigrants that already live here in the city of chicago so we're ready. >> all right. i got to ask you before we let you go we're less than a year away from the chicago's mayoral election. will you run again in 2023? >> look, i've not made an announcement. i want to make sure we keep the progress going. we've made a tremendous amount of work in the city and great progress bringing equity and inclusion in the neighborhoods. the economy is absolutely booming and like any good gardener, we planted the seeds and i want to be around to reap the harvest with the many people across the city that have done the work in the last three years. >> that sounds like a yes to me. is that a yes? >> stay tuned.
>> all right. mayor lori lightfoot. thank you. >> pleasure. >> people around the world are expressing shock and outrage over images of dead civilians in a mass grave right outside of kyiv. up next, a former ukrainian prime minister will be here to weigh in. we'll be right back. allergies don't have to be scy. spraying flonase daily stops your body from overreacting to allergens all season long. psst! psst! flase all good. (driver 1) it's all you.
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the russian defense ministry called the footage fake. my guest here is the former deputy prime minister of ukraine and co-founder of the center for united action. thanks for joining us again. you were here a few weeks ago and since then, obviously, there has been a lot of just horrible atrocities that have happened including what we're seeing in bucha, these images coming in. what was your reaction when you first saw the images of ci civilians seemingly killed execution style? >> there are no distant words to describe. you are filled with rage. it incomprehensible. what i thought of because there is certain symbolism, bucha, you remember president biden called buchin, it sounds almost the same because it has different
meaning but it just proved to what extent president biden was correct, to what extent those who were calling putin just a senseless maniac killer. they have been right. the worst thing here is that this is just beginning of the story. one of your experts just said that when more towns and cities will be liberated, we'll be witnessing much bigger scale of atrocities. so my question mark is how somebody can remain neutral in this? i'm referring to elections in hungry for example. i am referring to europe response. is this enough to understand that this madness must be stopped? it can be stopped only by sheer force. >> yeah, because on going attacks on these civilians will
continue to add pressure, right, on the u.s. and get more involved do more, you heard from the secretary of state hillary clinton about what else needs to be done and here is what she said. >> now is the time to double down on the pressure. i think we are really looking at this with our eyes and seeing as we can watch on the news. to europe to democracy the global stability upholding in the last 20 years. >> so what does doubling down on pressure on putin look like? i mean, again, for our viewers, you have actually sat face-to-face with putin. what do you think that looks li
like? >> even that time he was not complete mad, he was pretending himself as normal person that spent life in germany. he was trying to convince people that he is liking to serve his term and retire and enjoy life with other acts, leaders of european union. that was the message i was getting from his close friends. he was at that meeting he was relaxed. we chatted like we're chatting with you. quite easily. and until i raise the issue of origin of revolution, when i only tried to explain to him why because i was right there in the middle, he has frozen. his face, his frozen his eyes were ready to kill me and said immediately, he cracked me short. the change was amazing. you see a relaxed person who is
talking about business cracking jokes and then right as soon as you touch the nature of orange revolution, i was believing i wanted to explain to him the reaction was unbelievable. he cracked me short and said come on, you're a smart guy. let's cut the bull. you're a smart guy. how trained what americans did, what sorrows did this is a special operation and after that the atmosphere was ruined. i feel that. after that he lived through 2014 when he was again humiliated. this is confirmed by people who
saw him more than me because there is a rise that says three years ago putin was very different person. >> yeah, there is a lot of speculation, right, about his mind set. i've heard different theories from different people. some say, you know, he's very different now. he's acting irrational. others say no, what he's doing now is right out of putin's playbook. you had the face-to-face interaction with him. i'm wondering given what you know from your interaction with him and what we know now, whether you think there could actually be diplomatic talks between zelenskyy and putin. there are talks about that as you well know. >> you are touching right -- you're a dentist touching the nerve of my tooth because this is something i don't understand. honestly. i don't understand the sense of seeing putin now specifically after bucha. let's imagine i'm zelenskyy. what do i do when i meet putin?
shake his hand. i sign something? it's uncomprehensible and what is the purpose? how you can trust a single word, a single vowel of that person who is lying every minute as you talk to him, who was meeting president biden, who was meeting chancellor and macron dozens of time telling the whole world he's not going to attack. what's the point? the logic should be that this madness must be stopped. zelenskyy saying yes, without getting putin involved, we cannot do that but putin must be forced, he must be forced not diplomatically talked into the deal because this is -- this will not be sustainable seize fire if putin sees that he can get away from this situation, after all those atrocities, the danger is imminent.
therefore, all the talks with zelenskyy raises about guarantees of practical importance now that means zelenskyy cannot sit alone across with putin without reaching prior understanding of democratic countries emphasized because i don't know how to call hungary if hungary elects or won again because that is close aide to putin in everything and his member of the e.u. and member of nato and i mean, it's not only about them. about german position. french position. maniery european countries are sending confused signals so they cannot be taking it but the u.s. can. the only country which can really prove that they are with us 100% with us. that may happen only when u.s. will very clearly say that in case of another aggression of russia, u.s. is prepared to
defend ukraine with all its force. this is up to american politicians, up to senate. i think that american voters will understand that but we will see it. without u.s. leadership, we'll get nowhere. the putin get a break and then he would attack with more vigor and go into other countries, not only ukraine. >> dennis hitting the nerve on a tooth. quite the e afallnaanalogy. great to have you u back. we'll be right back. "i wish i'i'd bought an even thinner tv, found a lighter lighght beer, or had an even smarter smartphone." do you think any of us will look back on our lives and regret the things we didn't buy? or the places we didn't go? ♪ i'd go the whole wide world ♪ ♪ i'd go the whole wide world ♪
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the parental rights and education bill last week. critics call it the don't say gay law and claim it will damage lgbtq students, teachers and parents. cnn layla talked to some families facing the challenge. >> oh my gosh. i haven't seen it in a long time. wow, this is my marriage certificate. i'm married. >> reporter: this piece of paper marks a moment in history. it'd and jeff were among the first same sex couples to marry in florida when it became legal seven years ago. they had to fight for marriage equality and had to fight to adopt their son blake. >> there have been times in history when we have fought for a new right and fought for something and there was a joy in expanding rights and access and here we are fighting something where they're trying to take it away.
>> reporter: the fight today a law in florida parental rights and education the new law limits how schools can talk about gender. they fear their son may not be able to talk about his two dads in the classroom. >> there is some anxiety about it. blake asked me, maybe yesterday, what does that mean? >> at the dinner table of the home, they've been having many of the same conversations. >> i feel like it's well, yeah, you can adopt these children but keep your business at home. >> have you guys had that conversation as a family? >> yeah. >> what's that like? >> kind of like sad. >> come for me and him, don't come for my son. don't make my son feel uncomfortable at school. >> it feels like someone is really trying to again push you
aside, push you back slowly back into a closet, slowly back into a corner because quote unquote parental rights. >> we insist that parents have a right to be involved. >> surrounded by supporters advocating parents' rights, governor ron desantis signed it into law at a florida charter school on monday. >> they are using children as a prop to say we need to stop something that in most cases isn't happening. >> but for one mom who spoke at the governor's press conference. >> we learned a middle school created a transgender gender non-conforming support plan with our 13-year-old daughter without our knowledge or consent. >> and while the governor supporters consider this a win lgbtq advocates say it's not over yet and are now taking this to court. >> you had to fight to get married. you had to fight to adopt your son. you're fighting this now. do you think you'll ever stop fighting? >> i hope so. i hope so. i hope we get to a point we feel
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>> reporter: she was on a business trip last month in lviv ukraine near the polish border when russia started bombing her country. her husband and their three children were hundreds of miles away at the family's home outside kyiv. >> i just asked my husband to bring the kids to me. >> reporter: she and her husband alexander def vvised a plan. he would drive them through the night seven hours one way to meet her in lviv. as your husband drove towards lviv you were able to track him on the phone? >> in what's app, there is one option to share location and i can online check where he is because it was like the hardest hours when you realize that all your family, your husband and your kids driving and it can bomb and it can be anything. >> reporter: when the family reunited, she thought her husband wasn't able to cross the border since men of a certain age were being told to stay and help defend ukraine. so she and her kids ages 3, 7
and 9 boarded a train to poland and at the same time half a world away, this man phillip bradford was watching the russian seeiege at his home in florida. his wife was crow asian and his mother from ukraine so he felt the urge to help. >> i heard my wife and mother and my stepmother in law, my mother-in-law telling me get off of my dupa, which is rear end and go do something. >> reporter: just a few minutes away from fphillip's home is st nicholas ukrainian orthodox church. >> i went to the church and i gave them a couple of hundred dollars thinking i've done my good deed like a boy scout, and i said if i can help more, let me know. >> reporter: turns out there was more, a lot more. she made her way to miami with her kids. she visited that same ukrainian
church last year so when she went back and shared her struggle, a church volunteer called on phillip to help. >> i was told about this mother with three children from ukraine. >> he said yes, i want to help. i have big house. i want to give you the place to stay for your kids. you will have the separate room for all of them. >> phillip's wife has been in a nursing home for the last four years so he's been living alone so irina and her kids moved right in. >> i'm almost 80 so it's like having grandkids running around again. >> reporter: how do you feel about a stranger opening his home to your family? >> you know, i was shocked and now we're like one family all toge together. >> reporter: phillip insisted irina take the kids to disneyworld, his treat. you sent them to disney. >> she told you about that? [ laughter ] >> reporter: we know all your secrets. >> that's what grandfathers do,
i guess. [ laughter ] >> reporter: meanwhile, soon after irina left ukraine, she found out men with three or were children were allowed to leave the country so a few days ago, this happened. upon his arrival as a gesture of thanks, irina's husband who will also live with phillip brought him this bracelet in the same colors as the ukrainian flag. what does that bracelet mean to you? >> well, it kind of makes me one of them in a sense. you know. >> reporter: bonded? >> yeah. right. >> reporter: randi kaye, cnn, cooper city, florida. a cnn crew in ukraine today saw the firsthand of aftermath of russian occupation, a mass grave right outside kyiv and this comes just one day after photos show the bodies of
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yes!! and once in a lifetime moments. two tickets to nascar! yes! find rewards like these and so many more in the xfinity app. i'm pamela brown in washington live in the cnn newsroom this sunday. we're continuing to follow disturbing developments in the ukraine town of bucha where retreating russian troops have