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tv   CNN Newsroom With Pamela Brown  CNN  April 17, 2022 3:00pm-4:00pm PDT

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you are live in the cnn "newsroom." i'm paula reid in washington in for jim acosta. new insight into vladimir putin's state of mind as russia prepares for a major ground assault in eastern ukraine. the russian president is, quote, in his own world and believes he is winning this war. that's according to the austrian chancellor who met with putin face-to-face. and new images show what putin's troops are doing to eastern ukraine ahead of a planned ground offensive, and you may find them disturbing.
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intense shelling in kharkiv has killed five people. an official there saying russian attacks cannot break the will of the ukrainian people. he witnessed a medic shielding a wounded woman during the shelling. and today is, of course, a holy day in ukraine, palm sunday. russian shelling hit this church, but this brutal war could not stop ukrainians from practicing their faith. children, civilians, soldiers across the country pausing to worship. including in bucha where residents survived a russian occupation that displayed the worst of humanity. so it should come as no surprise the ukrainian troops who remain in mariupol are not giving up. soldiers in the decimated city refusing russia's demand to surrender in order to save their lives. in an exclusive interview with cnn's jake tapper ukraine's president gives an alarming update on mariupol's civilians who were not able to escape.
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>> translator: the situation is very difficult in mariupol. it's clear that things won't get better. with each passing day it's growing more unstable. unfortunately, it is difficult for different reasons. i will not talk about the rult with which the russian authorities have treated mariupol, the russian military. there are two components no one nopes how many people died among the civilian population. if anyone gives you a figure it would be a total lie. hundreds of thousands were evacuated, several thousand, tens of thousands were forced to evacuate in the direction of the russian federation and we do not know where they are. they've left no document trail and among them are several thousand children. we want to know what happened to them, whether they're in good health.
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unfortunately, there just isn't any information on this. and regarding what population has remained there, we also don't have a definitive answer. one day they say there are 50,000 or 60,000 left there. and then another day someone says 100,000. and now we have information that perhaps 10,000 people have died there, all civilians who stayed. we're talking civilian deaths, not military. >> about 5,000 people because they didn't allow them to go to the ukrainian controlled side. we don't know where the children are. nobody knows. and that's why i said the question is more than difficult and more than complicated so there's a lot of information which we have to check and we don't know exactly.
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>> i want to go back to cnn's phil black who is in kyiv. phil, after a brief pause russian forces have stepped up attacks in the capital and the surrounding areas. what is your latest reporting there on the ground? >> reporter: paula, for the third day in a row an air strike has targeted the outskirts of kyiv. the latest hit the eastern side of the city impacting what officials describe as civilian infrastructure and interrupting possibly electricity and water supplies. the russian military says it will continue to target kyiv if it believes that ukraine is preparing military attacks on russian territory. in the east of the country an escalation in bombardment in key areas, notably in kharkiv where officials say shelling in the central and residential parts of the city injured 20 people and
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killed five more. in villages and towns in the luhansk region. these are areas that continue to be bombarded and shelled almost daily and that happened again over the last 24 hours or so. this is seen as a buildup to russia's planned new operations in the east, operations it is thought will drive through ukraine's defensive lines and establish more control over the eastern area known as the do donbas. and in the area of mykolaiv and kherson officials say ground forces there, russian ground forces, are still behachg more aggressively. they recently attributed this to the sinking of the moskva that went down in the black sae because, says ukraine, russia still hasn't acknowledged that sinking was the result of the ukrainian military only blamed a
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fire onboard. >> phil black, thank you for that report. joining me is william cohen. mr. secretary, as we're seeing kyiv is still very much in russia's cross hairs even though the ground advance has ended. does it appear to you putin still is focused on trying to take the capital? >> i think that is the goal to be sure and putin can't quite get the lies straight. first the sinking of the ship was caused by a couple of sailors smoking and got into the ammunition calfty and then, well, they're firing on the ukrainians because of the ship going down. so they can't get their story quite straight because they're lying all the time. i think, obviously, this is still a major target, kyiv is, for putin.
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and he's just reminding you and all of us that they're still capable of hitting the city as the focus shifts to the east and the south. >> austria's chancellor recently met with putin and today he said putin had, quote, his own war logic. how difficult is it for the u.s., for nato to deal with someone when so much of the conflict depends on this one incredible unpredictable person? >> well, what we have seen is putin is one person who has disrupted the world economy, the world order as such, and he remains solely, i guess, confined to his own quarters at his own choosing and separated from most of his key advisors apparently. he must know what's going on. the generals have to tell him -- i hope, the truth so he'll know what to do in terms of
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reordering his priorities and where he's going but nonetheless i don't think we can try to game this in a way to appeal to the rationty of putin. he is who he is. we know what his goal is. what his methods are on that's attack civilians. kill as many as possible to break the speared of the ukrainians and to lay siege to their cities. i hope everybody gets a chance to watch the interview you referred to earlier jake tapper did with president zelenskyy, one of the -- the courage obviously but the humanity of president zelenskyy that talks about the courage to keep going is almost churchillian as he's trying to rouse his people to stay the course even though the russians are plundering innocent people, plundering the cities and slaughtering innocent people. he still managed to raise up his
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honor in saying we have to fight this to the death. i think he deserves so much credit, so much admiration and so much support from us, whatever he needs, we should be giving it to him. >> i agree with you. jake did a great job on that interview. and president zelenskyy has called again on president biden to visit ukraine. the white house keeps ruling that out. obviously a presidential advice sit a security challenge even for a fully functioning country, not one that is under an invasion. so what is the analysis here? are there pros and cons, or is it just never worth it to make a trip like that? >> yeah, moving the president is a very large challenge. unless they're willing to put some kind of a covert mission under way which he could show up and join hands with president zelenskyy to show his support. i think it's unlikely. rather than having the president come, i would think president
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zelenskyy would want more weapons. send me weapons. i'd love to have the president, but give me what i need to fight this battle. i would also suggest that perhaps either the secretary of defense or secretary of state might travel not only to meet with president zelenskyy but go pay a visit to finland and sweden, see how things are going there. they are now at least contemplating the possibility. joining nato. that might be an important signal to send to the russians as well. >> a great point. zelenskyy says he's not going to make any land concessions to russia in the east. this is obviously a very tricky issue. some say zelenskyy should consider making concessions to save lives in the short term. others say that would appea appeasement. how do you see this? what's your take? >> president zelenskyy indicated almost from the very beginning that he was willing to talk
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about remaining neutral, to find some way to accommodate the security needs of russia. putin said, no, i'm through talking. i'm just going to kill you. now he's saying surrender in mariupol. it reminded me of what happens during the second world war when the nazi soldiers had members surrounded and the general, i believe mcauliffe, was running out of food, out of ammunition, running out of everything and the nazis said you have a chance to surrender honorably and he had one word for the nazis, and this is what president zelenskyy is saying to putin. no, i'm not surrendering. i could have done that before, before you killed these thousands of people. i'm not going to surrender now. i'm willing to talk about how we can resolve this peacefully taking into account what you
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need but i'm not going to surrender and i'm telling you the same thing our people told the moscow ship when they said surrender and they gave a pretty provocative response. nicer perhaps than the word -- not as nice, i should say, as the word nuts. same thing. we're not going to surrender. we've fought too hard, too long, and we're not surrendering. we're going to take the battle to you as you come in from the east and south. >> secretary cohen, thank you so much. >> my pleasure to be with you, paula. and coming up, after meeting with vladimir putin, the austrian chancellor says the russian leader believes he is winning the war. so is putin misinformed or playing three dimensional chess? we'll ask the grandmaster. gary kasparov next. you're live in the cnn "n"newsroom." ...add finish jet dry 3 in 1. to dry, prevent spots, and protect glassess against cloudiness. the dishes aren't done without finish jet dry 3 in 1.
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chancellor who met with putin in moscow last week. >> i think he is now in his own war logic. he thinks the war is necessary for security guarantees for the russian federation. he doesn't trust the international community. he blames ukrainians for genocide in the donbas region. i think he believes he is winning the war. >> here to discuss legendary chess grandmaster and fierce putin critic gary kasparov, the chairman of the human rights foundation and renewed democracy initiative and the author of "winter is coming: why vladimir putin and enemies of the free world must be stopped." all right, garry, there's debate whether his advisers are giving him an honest accounting.
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by what metric would putin be so confident that he and russia are winning here? >> i think putin knows that losing this war is not an option for him. for dictator for life losing the war, it's devastating. it's a matter of political survival and, in many cases, probably in this case, it's a matter of physical survival. so that's why he has to pretend he's winning the war. he knows he has to claim victory and he's desperately trying now to gain some ground in eastern ukraine and see what comes next. accepting defeat is impossible for him because a dictator looks weak. he's no longer carrying the aura of invincibility and soon he
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will become a scapegoat, both for his disillusioned henchmen and angry population, angry mob, that would blame putin for economic hardship. for what? you promised us an easy victory. instead there's suffering and we lost the war. >> we've all seen this carnage in ukraine and we know that there are concerns about what will happen if putin feels he's backed into a corner including concerns about the nuclear options. so what's more dangerous, putin thinking he's winning or putin being desperate and feeling defeated? >> i'm puzzled by this question. for people in bucha, kramatorsk and dozens and dozens of ukrainian villages and towns, this question is irrelevant. many are dead or about to be dead. i think at the end of the war we'll have hundreds of thousands of civilian casualties.
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what else could be worse than that? i heard this logic when americans and europeans contemplated against the assad regime f. we would interfere and stop assad, things would be worse. millions and millions of refugees. i don't think we should think anymore about what putin likes or dislikes. the whole world owes ukraine full support. give them the weapons to fight. nato is not obliged to act on article 5, but nothing prevents nato from offering full help to the country that is against russian invasion and putin's way to destroy european security infrastructure. so that's why i think right now we owe ukrainian as clear statement that the goal of this war is for ukraine to win and
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whatever happens to putin is not about consideration. >> many people would not deny the atrocities in ukraine but concerns about escalation, the nuclear option. almost seven years ago you warned the world, right there in the title of your book, putin must be stopped. he obviously wasn't stopped. now much of the world is united against him. how does sanctions and the efforts to punish him, have they gone far enough or too little too late? >> look, it's definitely not too late. the same kind of sanctions, even 50% of the sanctions eight years ago, eight months ago, maybe even eight weeks ago could have a different effect, maybe could have saved from this horrible war. we're in a situation where the free world is united. the sanctions are tightening but, again, it's all about our response but we still act in a strategic goal. the united states and nato
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allies and europe have to come up with the joint statement the goal of the war is to make sure ukraine recovers its territories. we're not in a position to tell ukraine what to do. that's their right to fight for every inch of their territory. as for escalation putin doesn't need any reason to escalate. his army is stuck in ukraine. i don't think he has any chance. ukrainians old-fashioned missiles hit russian flagship. i don't think the admirals are willing to commit suicide for putin. >> what about inside russia? do you expect to see more anti-kremlin sentiment? do you think it will build as the losses continue to mount? >> eventually, yes. this is the order of moves that cannot be reversed.
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first, the russian public and russian elite have to recognize the war is lost. the bad news coming from ukraine will inspire more people to rise. so then you will have conditions. the right conditions for a palace coup. many of putin's inner circle will be looking for a scapegoat and it's always a dictator who should be blamed. >> garry kasparov, thank you for joining us. >> thank you for inviting me. a quick programming note, the unbelievable true story of the man who took on putin and lived to expose the truth. the sundance award winning cnn film navalny airs next sunday at 9:00 p.m. here on cnn. still to come, a plea from wildlife officials after this stranded dolphin dies on a texas beach. live in the cnn "newsroom."
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a sick dolphin stranded on a texas beach died after being harassed by a crowd of beachgoers, a nonprofit called in to rescue the dolphin says people pushed the animal back in the water and then tried to swim with it or ride on it. the dolphin did not survive the harassment and died before rescuers could get it to the beach. i'm joined by the ex becutive director. heidi, what did rescuers find when they arrived at the scene? >> well, we actually received a
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call on our hotline from a well-meaning individual on the beach that had stated members of the public had pushed the dolphin back into the water and they had also been crowding it, riding the animal and even pushing the dolphin under water. so, unfortunately, the dolphin died a very short time later and was already dead by the time rescuers arrived. >> so what do you recommend people do if they're walking along the beach and they come across an animal like a dolphin or stranded whale alive? what should they do with that animal? >> the very first thing they should do is call their local stranding network responders so trained professionals can assess the health and give proper care and proper first aid inst instruction. they need to realize they're causing undue harm and further injury by pushing it into the water. these are air breathing mammals and they're often too weak to swim or surface to breathe and
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that's what brings them to the beach. so it's really important that they get the care that they need and they remain on the beach. even though that may seem counter intuitive you want to get an aquatic mammal back into the water, it is going to cause undue harm and could lead to the animal's death. >> and you make a good point. look, maybe not everybody knows you're not supposed to help usher the animal back into the water but certainly people should know better than to try to ride a distressed animal, and many people are rightly outraged by this. have you been able to identify any of the individuals who took part in this harassment? and will they face any charges? >> you're right, the harassment side of it is appalling behavior and not only is it appalling but illegal and against the marine mammal act that they are federally protected under so what happens is we collect all the information we can at the site as rescuers including
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photos and videos and we turn that over to the federal entity that protects marine mammals. >> what kind of penalties are there for people who harass stranded sea animals like this? >> violations can be prosecuted civilly and are punishable fines up to $100,000 and jail time. it's definitely something that is a serious offense. >> do you have any idea at this point why this dolphin was stranded on the beach? >> we do believe that this dolphin was sick and that is what brought it to the beach. we were able to perform an animal autopsy and we have been able to collect samples and have been sending the samples out for pathology and other analysis and
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so once weep get those analyses back we'll be able to report that to the federal institutes and determine how this harassment may have played into the eventual death of the animal. >> we appreciate it. >> thank you for having us. and coming up, four states move to restrict abortion access this week. gloria allred joins me live next. you're live in the cnn "newsroom." let's go on the open road with a safe stay! now get double best western rewards points on every stay.
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the number of states making it harder to get an abortion grew by four this week. florida being one of them. on thursday florida's republican governor ron desantis signed a bill into law that bans abortions after 15 weeks of pregnancy. cnn's nadia romero is following the latest developments. >> reporter: using their voices and risking their freedoms -- >> no justice, no piece. >> reporter: they lead women's voices of southwest florida, a nonprofit organized to defend reproductive freedoms. the group helped raise awareness when the board of commissioners discussed the possibility of introducing an abortion ban. >> i had to sit down and i tried. we put so many hours and so much time in that. and we won something. >> reporter: but their message was not loud enough. >> it makes me angry and sad and
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it makes me worried. it feels like we're going backwards. >> reporter: governor ron desantis signing a 15-week abortion ban into law. >> there we go. >> reporter: without exemptions. >> this will represent the most significant protections for life enacted in this state in a generation. >> reporter: two days before desantis, a bill that makes it a felony except in the case of a medical emergency. >> we want oklahoma to be the most pro-life state in the country. we want to outlaw abortion in oklahoma. >> reporter: also kentucky overrode the bill that bans most abortions after 15 weeks of pregnancy. 18 states have banned or limited access to most abortions. 14 states have passed their restrictive legislation.
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kentucky, florida and arizona following a 2018 mississippi law prohibiting abortions after 15 weeks of pregnancy. >> now let's go and sign these bills. >> reporter: now some legislatures aim to protect the rights with new bills of their own. maryland lawmakers expanding access to abortion. >> we are preparing for some of the most restrictive abortion legislation we've seen. >> reporter: challenging the state's almost 100-year-old abortion ban though it's not enforceable due to roe v. wade. >> we have to take this assault seriously and use every tool we have to fight back. this is not just a theoretical risk. this is a real and present danger. >> reporter: with many states rewriting their abortion laws all eyes point to the supreme court. legal experts argue a decision could be handed down in june right before summer break with
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pro-abortion activists continuing their fight to the highest court in the land. >> maybe they will come back and stand behind roe v. wade. i home they do. >> reporter: nadia romero, cnn, atlanta. as nadia mentioned there's growing concern the supreme court and its current conservative super majority, 6-3, could overturn roe v. wade, the landmark supreme court decision in 1973 that made a woman's right to end a pregnancy legal. i want to bring in victims rights attorney gloria allred who has a personal one. you have talked openly about getting an illegal abortion after being raped. so tell us what happened and why you have described yourself as, quote, living evidence of what happens when abortion is criminalized. >> reporter: thank you, paula and, yes, i was one of the many
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women who, before roe v. wade became the law of the land in 1973, because the supreme court of the united states decided that a woman has a constitutional right to a safe and legal abortion, at least at certain stages of her pregnancy, before that time many states were making it a crime as some are now to have an abortion. so women like me, and i was in my 20s, we had to try to figure out how are we going to have an abortion when it would be a crime not for a woman to have one but for a licensed health care provider like a doctor or a nurse to provide one. so we had to have back alley abortions. i had one. i was left hemorrhaging, 106-degree fever, and the abortionist said don't call me. i can't do anything for you afterwards. and so then i went to the hospital, and in those days they only took women in the hospital not to have abortions but to try
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to save their lives if they were hemorrhaging and about to die from one. i don't want anyone else to ever be in that position. but that's the position, dangerous to women's lives, that they're in today. and, paula, you know, in the same way that putin calls it a military -- special military operation in ukraine and we all know it's a war on ukraine this is not just a ban or restrictions on abortion. this is a war on women. let's call it what it is. this is a race among many anti-choice states to try to control women to see who can control women the most, who can control and end their choices about their bodies the most, and who can endanger women and place their lives at risk. who are the women whose lives are most atries nk these anti-choice states, poor women, young women, women of color,
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women who can't travel to another safe haven state where abortion is legal. let's talk about oklahoma. let's talk about florida. in oklahoma women from texas where the governor made abortion illegal and actually allowed for bounty hunters for citizens to sue anyone who aided or abetted anyone to get an abortion in texas, to sue them and possibly win $10,000 in a lawsuit in attorneys fees, some were going to oklahoma where they could still get an abortion. now texas women can't even do that. the same with florida. many women from southern states went to florida for an abortion. now there's no safe haven in florida. this is about women's lives, about women's health, and we are in danger today and those women that i named often they are young, they have no voice. they have no money. this is absolutely the worst
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risk to women's lives we've seen in a long time and some states are even trying to outlaw medication abortion where a woman can get a pill in the mail and self-induce an abortion. they're trying to make it a crime in some states to even take a pill to self-indupes an abortion. we are at risk. we are at a turning point and concerned about june where the u.s. supreme court decides that mississippi case and decides whether or not women will have a legal right to a safe abortion. >> speaking of the supreme court, as you know, currently 6-3 in favor of conservatives. the gop controls the majority of state legislatures as well as holding the majority gubernatorial seats. republicans on track to also have a very strong showing in the november congressional midterms. so are you surprised that steps to repeal abortion rights have not done more to galvanize
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support from your side at the ballot box? >> i do think if there is a rollback, a reversal or a significant erosion of roe v. wade in june when the united states supreme court decides this mississippi case, it will be galvanizing for pro-choice supporters to go and vote as it is, for example, in texas. we're seeing in the race for texas, the next race for texas governor, we're seeing the democratic hopeful, o'rourke, getting higher and higher in the polls. i think that's because many in texas are getting galvanized and vote for someone who is pro choice like o'rourke is over the texas governor who is outlawing abortion in the state.
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i've never been as concerned since 1973 and all the attempts to challenge roe v. wade, as concerned as i am right now because our lives are at risk and, by the way, not only are we looking at the four states banned and restricted abortion rights, we're also looking at many other states who are in line, have also tried to do it and then what we call trigger laws, many states passing rollback of the right to choose abortion in their states, and that doesn't become effective until july 1st. in other words they're hoping if u.s. supreme court reverses roe v. wade that then they have their laws ready on the books, will go into effect to outlaw abortion in their states and deny access to women who want to get abortions in those states. going to have about half the
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state's pro-choice and hatch the st states not trusting women. it will have a big impact on minors as well, teenagers, who desperately need abortions and won't be able to get them even in some states, even if they have parental consent. >> all eyes on the supreme court in june. arguably one of the biggest cases they'll be deciding in recent memory. thank you so much. >> thank you. and tomorrow philadelphia becomes the first city to require indoor masks again. how officials are defending that decision amid significant pushback. you're live in the cnn "newsroom." own your strength, anand see how far it takes you. tonal. be your strongest. ♪ if you find yourself on your feet all day, why not put a little spring in your step? it's time to try weathertech's new anti-fatigue comfortmat, for home or w.
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tomorrow, philadelphia will become the first major u.s. city to resurrect indoor mask mandate, reason for the move, covid cases in philadelphia county jumped 81% in the past two weeks and they're not alone. more than half of states seeing a rise in cases as all the orange and red on that map, sparking concern, philadelphia could be a preview of what's ahead for other cities. cnn's paulo sandoval on the scene, people in philadelphia known to speak their minds so what's going on there in the city of brotherly love? >> reporter: and some of them certainly are too, paula, we've seen some of that signage already up requiring masking, so some of those signs may have been there since the start of the pandemic, while could wait until tomorrow for the city to
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require masking in indoor public spaces, talking schools, restaurants, museums and the list goes on. here's something important to point out, according to the city of philadelphia, businesses and institutions have a way around it to stay mask free and that's if they can ensure all the occupants in their spaces are basically vaccinated so we'll have to see tomorrow, many businesses in philly if they decide to go that direction, important reminder to how we got here in the first place, city recognized a nearly 60% increase in covid cases in the last two weeks basically escalated their covid measures here into the second phase which is why the masks are required tomorrow. also important context tomorrow when you look at the numbers and where they stand, still just a fraction of what they were in the previous surge, about 142 daily cases an average of daily cases as of the last update last week which is well below the 225 that would be required to basically escalate to third
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stage. when it comes to hospitalizations as of monday, 34, well below the 100 that would be required for them to escalate there so in the meantime, paula, streets certainly busy and people getting ready as the city gave folks basically a week to prepare, again, starting monday you'll start to see the masks back on already a third time we've seen this here in philly. >> wow, interesting to see how that goes over and good luck to the people enforcing that. thank you so much. coming up, we'll go back to ukraine and the continued fight in mariupol as russian forces announce they will close down the besieged city for entry and exit on monday .
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live in cnn news room, i'm paula reid in washington, with disturbing information from mariupol, ukraine, russian forces in the decimated city announcing a city closure and a pass system and warning that many remaining in the city will be, quote, filtered out, according to an adviser from the city's mayor, cnn not been able to independently confirm this, but it comes as ukraine is rejecting russia's demand to surrender the city, despite russia's threat to eliminate all
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re resistance. you may find the next video disturbing but shows how russia is launching relentless attacks in eastern ukraine ahead of a ground offensive, five people died in renewed russian rocket and artillery attacks in the city of kharkiv, russia also shelling a church on this holy day in ukraine. these attacks coming amid warnings that russian president vladimir putin is, quote, living in his own world, and thinks he is winning the war. that's according to the austrian chancellor who met with putin face to face and in an exclusive interview with cnn's jake tapper, ukraine's president says the entire world should be concerned about what putin may be capable of. >> the director of the cia warned that he's worried putin might use a tactical nuclear weapon in this fight. are you worried? >> not only me. i think all over the world, all the countries have to be


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