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tv   New Day With John Berman and Brianna Keilar  CNN  July 22, 2022 4:00am-5:00am PDT

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>> sorry about that. >> the yankees are the losingest team in baseball in the second half so far. no one has lost more in the second half than the new york yankees. coy wire, thank you so much. >> you've got it, brother. we have fantastic news, we want to welcome the newest addition to the cnn family. meet luka ellison clark he arrived thursday to lauren fox and father kellen clark. weighing in at 6 pounds 14 ounces. lauren says everyone is doing great and the family is taking the time to treasure their new little one. just a huge congratulations. >> i bet lauren is already teaching him the legislative process. he's going to be the smartest baby who can do whip counts by preschool. >> that's right. the kid is reserving the balance of his time already. "new day" continues right now. can a president who is willing to make the choices
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donald trump made during the violence of january 6th ever be trusted with any position of authority in our great nation again? >> that was congresswoman liz cheney with a question, an extraordinary question, closing this round of hearings from the january 6th committee. it was a question, but it also seems to be the main argument from the committee as they presented new evidence of what they called donald trump's dereliction of duty during the insurrection. i'm john berman, brianna is off, chief white house correspondent kaitlan collins is here. >> and what a remarkable night that was. i mean, going through that hearing, all of these have had a little bit of new information, but last night i think they really tried to get behind the scenes, which is what we have been trying to do as reporters since that day of what was going on. >> the confirmations of things that had been reported by terrific reporters like you, but also new elements, new audio, new video that in some cases i don't think we knew even existed. >> and i think it hits home
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differently when it's reporting that we have which we know is true because we know the sources that we're speaking to and then when you actually see people like pat cipollone, the top lawyer in the white house confirming it in testimony to the committee. >> cipollone among others testifying that president trump never called law enforcement or the pentagon during the insurrection. that we heard this audio of the vice president's security detail, we heard testimony that they were calling loved ones to say good-bye. >> and that quote that was so remarkable, mike pence let me down. those were the last five words that an aide heard trump say that day before he left the west wing to go to the residence for the night. nothing about the attack according to the committee, just his grievances with his vice president. and one of the most revealing moments of the hearing, the committee showed outtakes, remarkable outtakes, from the speech that trump delivered the day after january 6th. refusing to acknowledge his own defeat. >> and to those who broke the law, you will pay. you do not represent our
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movement. you do not represent our country. and if you broke the law -- i can't say that. i'm not -- i already said you will pay. but this election is now over. congress has certified the results. i don't want to say the election is over. >> also in that video you can hear ivanka trump helping out her dad edit that statement in the background. cnn has told it actually took about an hour to record that video that ended up being just three minutes, john. >> all right. joining us now to lay out some of the biggest takeaways from this hearing, cnn's senior legal analyst ellie honig, a former state and federal prosecutor. ellie, the committee billed this as their case that donald trump was in dereliction of duty during the 187 minutes between his speech and the video. dereliction of duty you say and then some. >> yeah. well, let's take a look at this clip because i think this shows the best example where it went beyond dereliction of duty.
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>> i can generically say that i said, you know, people need to be told, there needs to be a public announcement, fast, that they need to leave the capitol. >> and i've seen the impact that his words have on his supporters. they truly latch on to every word and every tweet that he says and so i think that in that moment for him to tweet out the message about mike pence, it was him pouring gasoline on the fire and making it much worse. >> so the theme was dereliction of duty but i actually think the committee proved a bit more than that. there's plenty of evidence about things that donald trump did not do, refused to call for military and law enforcement help, refused to issue a clear statement calling off the rioters, essentially all he did was sit in the private dining room and watch the riot unfold on cable news. he sent that 2:24 p.m. tweet verbally attacking mike pence and that is so important because we know what happened next. two minutes later mike pence
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gets evacuated, the rioters come within 40 feet of mike pence and his detail causing members of the secret service to fear for their lives. and if i'm looking at this from a prosecutorial angle, the dereliction of duty, the failure to act is important. that 2:24 tweet that jumps out at me because that's an affirmative act. >> you also say we saw last night corroboration from testimony we had seen before from cassidy hutchinson. let's see that. >> when you say he did, is that your word or is that the word that was described by the agent? >> word described by the ts agent, meaning that the president was upset and he was saying there was a heated argument or discussion about going to the capitol. >> well, this is more corroboration, more support for cassidy hutchinson on a critical point. it often happens in investigations where a witness
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will tell you something important and another witness will deny it but you just don't throw up your hands, you dig into the evidence, you use your common sense. if we do that here, cassidy hutchinson testifies under oath that she was told by this guy tony ornato, used to be a secret service agent, became a trump white house official that donald trump wanted badly to go to the capitol. the secret service prevented him and he lunged at the steering wheel and at a secret service agent. ornato comes along not under oath and says, no, it didn't happen. let's do the math here. donald trump has already publicly admitted that he did want to go to the capitol, he said that in an interview back in april, that corroborates a key part of hutchinson's testimony. this police officer backs up cassidy hutchinson's testimony again. ornato has still not testified, now he has a lawyer. when you do the balance in my mind it's not even a close contest. cassidy hutchinson wins that credibility contest. >> the committee also laid out holes in the trump timeline and the absence of some records.
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let's watch. >> there's no official record of president trump receiving or placing a call between 1:1:06 ad 6:54 p.m. as to what the president with as doing that afternoon, the presidential daily diary is also silent. it contains no information from the period between 1:21 p.m. and 4:03 p.m. the chief white house photographer wanted to take pictures because, in her words, very important for his archives and for history, but she was told, quote, no photographs. >> how the heck are there no records, no phone records during the crucial time, the daily diary is missing during the crucial time and not even any photographs? that to me is remarkably telling. let's remember here if you can dig into this, if you can prove that somebody took efforts to make sure there are no efforts to this day that goes to
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consciousness of guilt. if people either destroyed records, we don't have evidence of that but let's make sure we don't put anything on the record here that can be used to show intent. you usually don't cover up unless you have a good reason. >> testimony that the president didn't call any security in to help in the capitol but did call rudy giuliani or talked to him more than once. okay. ellie, you look at all of this and also say you heard some evidence of an acknowledgment of responsibility. let's listen. >> i asked him personally today does he hold responsibility for what happened. does he feel bad about what happened? he told me he does have some responsibility for what happened. and we needs to acknowledge that. >> so we've heard this recording before but in all the evidence we've seen this is the one and only piece of evidence where donald trump himself acknowledges some responsibility for that capitol attack. the only person who can testify about that directly is kevin
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mccarthy, he was subpoenaed, he has gone awol, no consequences. you know who can subpoena kevin mccarthy and probably make him testify is prosecutors. >> ellie honing, thank you very much for that. joining us now to break all of this down is maggie haberman, cnn political analyst and senior political correspondent for "the new york times." danielle goldman, former federal prosecutor and the house's lead impeachment counsel. and norm eisen. norm, the purpose that the committee wanted to get done last night was to establish that there was a dereliction of duty on trump's behalf. do you think they effectively did so? >> i do think they showed a dereliction of duty. it wasn't only the mountain of evidence that they poured in, contrasting the violence on the capitol and everyone in the white house wanting trump to do something, pence reaching out to the pentagon, others making efforts, trump totally failed.
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it was also, kaitlan, the stage craft. dan and i know about that from our experience together in impeachment. they contrasted trump's inaction with the action of others. not just pence, but people like their two live witnesses, pottinger and matthews, and the people who were following their duty to former service members luria and kinzinger who were conducting the hearing. i thought it was a very effective presentation. >> dan? >> i agree with norm. and the other thing that you have to think about is all of the requests, all of the pressure, everybody trying so desperately to get donald trump to do something, his family, his white house counsel, his chief of staff, kevin mccarthy, the list goes on. everybody was trying to get him to call off the mob because everybody knew that only he could and he sat there and he
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refused. and the reason why, this was his last desperate gasp to hold on to power. pence was his last hope on january 6th to say no. he put inordinate pressure on him, even causing him real threat to his life, and then when that didn't work, he was just going to sit there and delay and delay and delay to try to just make sure that this never happens. it is unconscionable and sociopathic that the president of the united states, the commander in chief, sat in his dining room watching a riot, a violent insurrection at the capitol, and he did nothing to stop it. >> and meadows, one of the texts that they had read that he had sent to someone said that potus is very emotional and in a bad place that night. maggie, i just wonder obviously you covered this in realtime but i wonder when you watched this hearing last night what stood out to you the most? >> kaitlan, it's hard to narrow
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it down. i mean, i think as you and john talked about earlier a lot of this affirmed realtime reporting by you, by me, by a lunch of other reporters, but the fact that you were hearing all of these white house aides just describing what they were going through, basically trying to grab a sitting president by the lapels and telling him you need to do something here, and it wasn't doing anything. again, it's not that it changed the arc what have we know, it really didn't, it affirmed the arc of what we know in enormous detail and the level of disgust in the words of people like sarah matthews as she testified live yesterday about what she was experiencing, the piece i was really struck by, kaitlan, were those outtakes of former president trump in that video that was filmed on january 7th where he says i don't want to say the election was stolen, he sounds defiant, he sounds angry that he is doing this. the outtakes with donald trump when he pre records something
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are always more important and i thought that was a fascinating and revealing piece of video. >> what about the outtakes, norm? you had said coming into this hearing you thought they would be some of the most important evidence. what now? >> well, we are turning now that we've reached the end of this series, initial series of eight hearings, to the outcomes. what are the concrete actions going to be coming out of these hearings? one of them is going to be the very serious consideration of prosecution with a state prosecutor in atlanta looking very hard at charges, target letters have gone out warning of prosecutions and, of course, the doj. these outtakes go to donald trump's intent because they show -- it was so striking to me. i don't want to say the election is stolen. that's his motive. that's the state of mind. and when you contrast that with what we heard in the beginning of these hearings, witness after witness, the insiders, bill barr, pat cipollone, jason miller and bill stepien from his
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campaign telling him you lost. the lawyers telling him you have no legal claims left. but this is his motive. it goes to intent. very important for consequences. >> go ahead. >> i was just going to say the other thing that i would add on is, yes, there will be a lot of focus on the doj now and there should be and fani willis down in atlanta, but it's not as if donald trump says, oh, do you know what, i was wrong. let's get back to normal. he is still pushing the big lie, he is still gearing up to steal the 2024 election, he has placed his acolytes in positions of power in the state elections who -- and they have changed the laws to allow states to overturn the will of the people, to allow partisan elected officials to do so based merely on allegations of fraud. that's all donald trump ever had, that's all rudy giuliani ever had. we've seen ample evidence that they had no evidence, but now they've changed the law so that
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you don't need evidence to actually overturn the will of the people. so one of the points that liz cheney, i think, has made so well is this is not over. donald trump has not gone off into the goodnight. he is still the leader of the party. he is still trying to steal -- gear up to take back his position, not through an election, but through power and installment as a dictator and the threat continues. >> maggie, that was really the point that liz cheney did make there at the end, as noted, she really distilled that, that he is not someone who has gone away from political life. he is the front runner for the republican party for 2024. >> that's exactly right. look, kaitlan, i reported last year that donald trump was telling people that he expected to be reinstated in august. this was a theory with absolutely no basis in reality that was being pushed by an ally, mike lindell, and trump was trying to encourage people to echo it.
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this was the first warning sign this was not going away in addition to his public statements. he has continued. he has continued trying to pressure officials in wisconsin to decertify the election. he has continued to spread baseless lies about the saingtity of the vote and whether there was widespread fraud and he will i expect continue to do that. i think you saw cheney trying to draw ties saying this is not just the past, this is the moment we live in in the present. whether this gets through to anyone and changes their minds i think is an open question but that hearing was pretty astonishing in terms of the case it laid out. >> and, again, that request he she asked at the very end can a president willing to make the choices that donald trump made during the violence of january 6th ever be trusted with a position of authority to our great nation again. she asked it a question, you can also read it as a statement. i'm curious who it was being posed to. was she posing that to a justice department? is that for merrick garland? is that for voters?
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is that for members of congress to somehow get involved and do something? to whom was she addressing that, maggie? >> i think she's addressing it to all of the above, john. i think there's certainly been frustration on the part of the committee that they believe doj has not always moved the way they would like. a lot of this is targeted for their consumption. there certainly is the piece with voters, you have seen cheney make that case to her own voters in her race in wyoming where she is the underdog in a primary fight now in part because she has spoken out so aggressively against trump since january 6. i think she is making this case broadly because it is going to take i think in her mind multiple avenues for people to address what she sees as an existential threat posed by donald trump. >> and trump wasn't the only 2024 candidate that was kind of alluded to last night. josh hawley is also someone who is rumored to potentially run and the committee went out of their way -- >> no pun intended. sorry. >> yeah, running in two different ways. the committee went out of their way to show this video of hawley
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who earlier in the day had pumped a fist at the rioters running through the halls of the senate, you can see him there on the right as he comes down the stairs, running as all of these lawmakers were escaping the rioters that were descending on the capitol. what did you make of that? >> well, there's also video from within the room of the hearing room where when he is shown running across the senate floor everyone bursts into laughter. it was completely gratuitous. josh hawley had really nothing to do with this but the committee wanted to make the point that if you are going to be on the side of evil in this, you're going to be exposed. and so maybe it's for 2024 or maybe it's just because he was riling up the crowd beforehand and then as soon as the crowd came in he started running like a baby away. but it was -- it was pretty comical. the other thing that really jumps out now is what happens with mike pence? the evidence is so strong that
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donald trump was trying to put mike pence in jeopardy and mike pence has had his lawyer testify, his chief of staff testify, but he has thus far, we understand, resisted testifying. i think these eight hearings ratchet up the pressure on mike pence to come in and to explain what his perspective that day. >> pence was a hero of january 6th and we saw more of that today when you had that -- they put together the mosaic of evidence yesterday about how close the crowd came to him and the alarm and the danger, the radio transmissions, the danger. but he and the republican party -- and this is what kinzinger when he said it's still out there and what cheney was talking about at the end of the hearing -- he and the republican party have not really come to grips with what is still out there and they're doing this
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triangulation. cipollone did it, too. he didn't have to stand behind executive privilege. he wanted to do enough to avoid criminal contempt, but not so much as to piss off donald trump. that is a test of courage that mike pence is now -- >> and by the way, i think very quickly executive privilege goes away when doj gets to cipollone. >> if. >> well, i think they will. >> well, i think. >> why? >> there is no executive privilege for misconduct. there is no executive privilege to conceal wrongdoing and there is no question that trump's dereliction of duty and his refusal to do anything is wrongdoing. this goes back to the nixon case. so i think the doj will be able to pierce that privilege veil and tell get from cipollone all the testimony. >> it wouldn't be a dan and norm get together if we didn't have at least one disagreement. we're friends but we debate. if you look at what doj did,
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dan, with meadows, with scavino where they failed to charge, i think that there is a serve tichl within the department. i fought with them when i was at the white house, at the office of legal counsel, they are so protective, too protective of the prerogatives of the presidency. i think that they may tread a little more lightly looking ahead to a new congress that is going to target joe biden and his administration where they're going to want to use executive privilege as a shield. so i think it may be a slightly more complicated calculus. >> that's the practical view, mine is the legal view. >> we will be waiting to see. daniel, norm, maggie, thank you so much for joining us this morning. so we are going to hear from a former secret service agent as we learn that mike pence's security detail feared for their lives. plus, president trump's refusal to acknowledge the death of capitol police officer brian
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sicknick, members of his family are going to join us live with their reaction. and, meanwhile, president biden is now isolating at the white house with mild symptoms after he tested positive for covid-19. we have an update from the white house coronavirus response coordinator, dr. ashish jha.
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this morning president biden is isolating at the white house after he tested positive for covid-19 for the first time. an unmasked biden quickly on twitter to assure the country he's just experiencing mild symptoms. he's been vaccinated twice, he's gotten two booster shots his most recent one in march and he sent out a tweet saying that he is doing fine and continuing to work in isolation at the white house until at least next tuesday. his wife, first lady dr. jill biden, is considered a close contact, but she tested knowing testify and will be spending the weekend in delaware. >> joining us now white house covid response coordinator dr. ashish jha. thank you for being with us. when was the last time you got an update on president biden's condition? >> i got an update last night at 10:00 p.m. and he was doing just
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fine. i'm going to touch base with his medical team, i'm going to speak to him again myself directly this morning, but as of 10:00 p.m. last night, which is my last update, he was doing great. >> just fine. elab elaborate. better or worse than he was in the morning when we first heard about this? >> the symptoms were basically the same. again, he's got a little runny nose, he's got a bit of a dry cough, he was feeling -- you know, he worked all day yesterday, he was on phone calls, he was on zoom calls, worked through the evening and as of 10:00 p.m., as i said, when i talked to his medical team who had last seen him right around 10:00 p.m. or last talked to him right around 10:00 p.m. he said he was feeling just fine. >> any sign, though -- any symptoms that are getting worse? >> no, again, as of 10:00 p.m. last night, no, it was the same symptoms, about the same level of mildness, but i will check in with them this morning, i will check in with him this morning and i will be happy to report back. >> it's wonderful to hear from
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you, dr. jha as always on this. why can't we check in with the president's doctors? the white house president's doctor office briefs the press when there is an issue with the president's health. >> i think you have heard from him. dr. o'connor you have heard from dr. on o'connor in the letter. you're going to hear every day from dr. o'connor through written communication, he was going to put out his own statement with his assessment of how the president is doing. the second part is we are all in pretty constant contact, speaking to each other, i will be speaking to the president every day, that combination means that the american people will have a very full, complete picture of how the president is doing. >> but no plans to make him available to the press or the public as of now? >> you know, dr. o'connor is going to be sharing his information, i will be out there, i think you're going to hear from a variety of administration officials about the president, but obviously the clinical physicians, me, dr. fauci you will hear from who has
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also been in touch with the white house, so i think you're going to hear from a variety of us. >> we understand the president is taking paxlovid. we do know there have been cases, not just a few, of a recurrence of symptoms after patients stop taking paxlovid. what are the specific concerns there? >> let's talk about what we know. there is this thing called rebound, the best clinical data we have suggests it happens about 5%, 7% of the time. it's pretty infrequent. and the good news is even when that happens people end up doing just fine. remember, the goal of paxlovid is to keep people out of the hospital, to prevent serious illness. one of the reasons we have been so vocal that americans, anybody above the age of 50, anybody with chronic diseases should seriously consider getting paxlovid, the reason is that it works remarkably well at keeping people from getting seriously ill. the president eligible, getting it. rebounds should not be a reason for someone not to get it.
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the goal of paxlovid is to prevent serious illness, it's doing a great job of that. >> as of this morning what do you know about where president biden caught this? >> we don't know much about it. obviously he could have gotten it anytime in the preceding days. there's obviously an incubation period but there's a lot of variation in all of that. so we don't know. right now what we're focused on number one we're focused on making sure president biden continues to do well as he was through last night, second is that we have contact tracing happening to make sure that anybody who might have been a close contact is identified and notified so they can take appropriate action. those are the two major focus areas. >> any new cases amongst those people who have been in contact with president biden? >> not that i'm aware of. the white house medical unit is running this along with embedded cdc contact tracers. that process is ongoing. i'm not aware that there's anybody else who has tested positive. >> should the president be masking more indoors when he's
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meeting with people? should all of us given the prevalence right now and the rising number of cases be masking more indoors in your mind? >> i think this is where i turn to the cdc and the cdc guidance which i think is quite clear. cdc's community levels lays out depending on what community, what covid level you are at you should make decisions about wearing masks indoors based on that and, you know, we follow that here at the white house. and i recommend that people follow that across the country. >> will we see another video of president biden today? >> that's a good question. i don't know. i mean, again, i will check in with his -- with his medical team this morning and -- but honestly i don't know exactly what the plans are for making more information available in terms of a video or photos, et cetera. >> and any plans to have the first lady isolate at this point? >> you know, i think what i know is that the first lady is following cdc guidelines. obviously if she has other questions she's talking to her
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physician about this. i know she's going to be in delaware this weekend. but beyond that, i think -- you know, the cdc guidelines on this are have i, very clear. the first lady obviously also vaccinated and boosted and she is going to be following cdc guidelines. >> again, i should say quarantined because she hasn't tested positive yet. isolated is if you have it. dr. jha, keep us posted. >> i will. thank you. so we are going to speak by the family of capitol police officer brian sicknick who died one day after responding to the capitol riot. their response to the former president's refusal to acknowledge his death. the market and want to make the right moves fast... get decision tech fromom fidelity. [ cellphone vibrates ] you'll get proactive alerts for market events before they happen... and insights on every buy and sell decision. with zero-commission online u.s. stock and etf trades.
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president trump's top campaign officials texted each other about the president's glaring silence on the tragic death of capitol police officer brian sicknick who succumb to his injuries the night of january 7th. murtaugh said also [ bleep ] not
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to have acknowledged the death of the capitol police officer. it was responded, that's en enraging to me. everything he said about supporting law enforcement was a lie. >> new texts revealed by the january 6th committee last night revealed how trump's own campaign aides were shocked and upset by his refusal to acknowledge the death of capitol police officer brian sicknick. campaign manager -- or campaign spokesman told a colleague he believed trump wasn't mentioning sicknick because he did, quote, he would be implicitly faulting the mob. they took a moment to thank officer sicknick and the other first responders from that day. >> we're honored to be joined tonight by police and first responders who bravely protected us on january 6th. your character and courage give us hope that democracy can and should prevail, even in the face
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of a violent insurrection. >> joining us now are the family members of officer sicknick, his brothers ken and craig, sicknick and his brother gladys. thank you all for getting up with us this morning to talk about this. i imagine hearing those text messages of what they were saying in realtime behind the scenes is pretty frustrating. >> it was. it was -- i thought it would get easier after almost two years of this, but it's getting harder and harder, especially after you learn new things that are coming out. >> it's extraordinarily frustrating. the president is supposed to represent the country and we're so far been overall a pretty good world example of how to run things and with the last administration that went right out the window. >> and you've listened to those -- the lawmakers last night talk -- and his own staff testify that he had opportunity
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after opportunity to call off the violence, but he didn't want to do so. >> well, do you know what, i was thinking about this a little bit that we're -- we are focusing in on the fact that he just didn't act at all for three hours, which is just absolutely ridiculous. for the first time in a long time i'm angry from seeing it again and just realizing that he did nothing, but overall we should be focusing on the fact that he started this whole thing to begin with. so, yeah, he is at fault for not stopping t but he is really at fault for riling up the crowds and getting his -- i mean, sycophants following whatever word he said, they were on their phones, we saw video of them looking at their text messages for their next command to, you know, call off -- to do whatever they needed to do.
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so, you know, i would like to focus on the fact that he's responsible it happening in the first place. >> and, ken, what did you make of the testimony from sarah matthews who was a deputy press secretary, talking about the internal struggle to get him to say something, but saying he did not want to use the word "peace" or "peaceful" in his message? >> i don't understand. it's obvious to me that his existence in the white house had nothing to do with helping the country, had nothing to do with, you know, looking out for the best interest of the country, it was looking out for him. it was looking out for -- to make sure he is in power, to make sure he can control everything and -- and the silence of the three hours, it could have been him stuck deciding, you know, whether to say something, but ultimately it was -- it was him covering his rear end and him making sure
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that he was in power and that he could not admit to anything happening. and i just -- i can't comprehend him not doing a thing to stop that. he knew what was going on, we saw in the testimony minutes after -- after his little rally. >> and, craig and gladys, there was this moment that really stood out to me last night where you saw eric herschmann who was this attorney inside the white house at the time, he talked about what that day was like, the chaos inside the west wing and he talked about how drained they were by the time trump did finally put out that statement from the rose garden, but the attorney from the committee who was interviewing them noted that when they were kind of calling it a day, talking about how drained they were, that was still in the middle of the afternoon when rioters were still there at the capitol and these officers, including brian and these people were still in the middle of dealing with responding to this. >> yeah, that really bothered me
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a lot. you know, they went home to their families, they had dinner. i don't know what their little kids -- what did they tell their little kids? and what really bothers me about this whole thing is that all the people around trump, they -- they stayed with him for four years and let this happen. so they're culpable, too, big time, in my eyes anyway. >> it's astonishing he decided he had a rough time and it was time to go to bed, meanwhile, people were still being injured, some of them quite severely, many of them were just trying to do their job and support the country and the oath that they swore, which apparently trump ignored. you know, it was just unbelievable that this can happen in the united states. >> it is unbelievable. it's unbelievable to watch them lay out, too, just each crucial moment of what happened and really what didn't happen. ken, craig, gladys, you guys have been through a lot and
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we're very grateful that you came on to talk about this because i do think it's important. i'm glad the committee went out of their way to note the contributions from brian and everything and to honor him. and we're very sorry for your loss, but we do thank you for joining us this morning. >> thank you. >> thank you for having us. >> thank you. up next, we are going to speak with a member of the january 6th committee about what happened last night. jamie raskin, on the new revelations and where the committee is headed next. the committee did also release some very remarkable new audio that reveals the fear that the members of vice president pence's security detail -- you can see them there evacuating down a back hallway as they scrambled to put the president -- the vice president in safety as rioters were breaching the capitol.
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in 1995 while he was an undercover officer michael cox was mistaken for a suspect and beaten by his own colleagues, today he is boston's new police commissioner and he sat down with cnn's brynn gingras to discuss what is different about his approach to policing beyond the call. >> you have had a lot of roles in bpd. how does commissioner sound? >> it sounds different, there is no doubt about that, but i am excited. >> reporter: boston's new police commissioner michael cox has a past that brings a unique perspective on policing today. >> i also, you know h a pretty bad experience in the police department early on, understanding that, you know, the worst in policing if it's not, you know, addressed, if it's not checked, if the culture is not monitored, bad things can happen. >> reporter: in 1995 cox was an undercover officer, while responding to a call one night
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he was beaten by fellow officers w who mistook him as a suspect. he left him bloody and bruised after discovering his identity. he was out of the job for six months before returning to the department where he would stay for 30 years. >> why did you stay? >> you know, and it wasn't an easy decision at the time, but, you know, one, i had served the public and i loved the job. i know all the good people that do this job and, yeah, there are knuckleheads and people out there that are out there sometimes in these places but the reality back then i was saying that's not what police something and if i leave how am i helping it to get better. >> reporter: cox never fully told his story publicly until two years ago. motivated by the protests following george floyd's killing. >> i just felt like what is happening? what is happening with the world around policing? like this is a profession that's needed everywhere, we can do it
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better, absolutely, but the people that do this job are doing it for the right reasons, by telling my story and, you know, try to explain to people there are people in law enforcement that care and i'm one of them. >> i do consider this a homecoming. >> reporter: now the native boston yan is poised to lead one what do you say on day one to your rank and file? >> they need to know their supported. it is not just the morale of the officers, it is the morale of the public, the expectations of the public, public trust, we need to build that up again and sometimes that means, you know, taking criticism, revisiting some of our history, just to acknowledge it, and then move on and say, you know what, we're here. >> we now have a commissioner who understands deeply what it means when our systems don't see everyone. >> reporter: a lesson cox didn't expect to learn while serving his city, but now carries with him as he leads. brynn gingras, cnn, boston. >> talk about unique
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perspective, for a new police commissioner. >> it is pretty extraordinary. i love when there is an article like that, but it is cool, he could have left and he stuck around and he stayed and now he's in this position and it is always remarkable to seeing some like that happen. >> great story. a criminal investigation under way into the secret service, the deleted text messages from january 5th and 6th, they could now be even more crucial as we hear testimony that agents feared for their lives that day.
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a lot of -- a lot of very personal calls over the radio. so it was disturbing. i don't like talking about it, but there were calls to say good-bye to family members, so on and so forth. it was getting -- for whatever the reason was on the ground, the vp detail's office thought this was about to get very ugly. >> disturbing new audio last night, showing how much danger pence's secret service was in on, at least thought they were in on, on january 6th. joining us now is former secret service adviser at dhs charles marino. what is your reaction to hearing not just that, but also the radio chatter from pence's detail that day, as they were scrambling to get him out of there, warning about how they were losing time to do so? >> yeah, thanks, kaitlan. look, for your viewers, i think it reinforces the commitment and
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professionalism of the secret service in protecting the top political leaders in this country, and ensuring the continuity of government. and they do all this regardless of those that they protect, their political affiliation. you know, i'm sure there was a recognition by the agents at the capitol of just how bad the security situation had become. let's remember, we had a complete collapse of the physical security presence on the outer perimeter, and people were moving in, large numbers of people. they were not going to move the vice president until it was absolutely safe to do so. and let's remember, it wasn't just the vice president, it was also his wife, and his daughter. so you had the whole package there that was not going to be moved until the secret service agents were absolutely sure it was safe to do so. as far as the reported calls to family, and the fear, i'm just not hearing that from my
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sources. we don't know who the unnamed security official was on those tapes last night, describing the events, likely secondhand, but the agents, as i'm told, were doing what they needed to do to keep the vice president and his family alive. there was no time for phone calls to family, no fear, but you had a group of agents that were rightfully prepared to make the ultimate sacrifice to ensure that they remain safe. >> charles, separate from this, or maybe not, the text messages that are now not there, deleted from january 5th and january 6th. we have now learned that there is a criminal investigation involving them. what questions do you have? how unusual is it to have a criminal investigation into something involving the secret service like this? >> yeah, well, it is very unusual. look, i think this -- this goes back to early 2021, where the --
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where the inspector general was notified by the secret service that these messages were accidentally purged for lack of a better word during the data migration process. so i think as this kind of moves over to a criminal investigation, by the ig, i think there is a big conflict of interest right now on the part of the ig. i think the secret service is prepared to make that case, based on the on and off requests from the ig about wanting this information, then saying that they didn't, and then turning it back on, and also the very late nature of the letter from the ig going to congress to say that the secret service wasn't being cooperative. i just don't know if that narrative is 100% accurate, and so i think as a result there is a conflict, if there is going to be a criminal investigation into the matter, i think it should move outside the realm of the
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ig. >> that's a big question about where that investigation goes next. we will be watching closely, charles. thank you for breaking it all down for us this morning. >> okay, thank you, both. and "new day" continues right now. >> all right. shocked. shocked. that was the word used inside trump world in reaction to some of the testimony that the january 6th committee hearing overnight, shocked. i'm john berman, brianna is off. chief white house correspondent kaitlan collins is here and it just happens to be your reporting from inside trump world, hearing that they were shocked. >> i think it was that chatter from the secret service radio, for pence's detail, that really shocked people. this is actually surprising because a lot of people who remained in trump world have downplayed these hearings, said they are overtly political, nothing new. but i think that day kind of took people back to how shaken they were that


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