tv Anderson Cooper 360 CNN November 24, 2011 1:00am-2:00am EST
commend everyone to go read this. gabrielle giffords and mark kelly, a story of hope. and it is. thank very much. thank you, piers. >> that's all for us tonight, a heart-warming interview on the eve of thanksgiving. "ac 360" starts now. we begin with keeping them honest on some of the claims made during last night's gop presidential debate right here on cnn. all eight republican candidates took the stage in washington. just steps from the white house. some of them straight from the truth. let's start with michele bachmann's claim the cia doesn't have the power to interrogate terrorists because, she says of the aclu's influence. listen. >> this is one thing we know about barack obama. he has essentially handed over our interrogation of terrorists to the aclu. he has outsourced it to them. our cia has no ability to have any form of interrogation for terrorists. >> the truth is, congresswoman bachmann, who is a member of the house intelligence committee is wrong. the cia still interrogates
terror suspects in the field. in fact, president obama created the high value detainee interrogation group which includes the cia of the fbi and defense department. they deploy in teams to question terror suspects here in the united states and overseas. whether that policy is strong enough or not is a matter for debate. but what's clear is that bachmann's comments are not accurate. let's turn now to herman cain and border insecurity. >> an insecure border is a national security threat for the following reasons. number one, we know that terrorists have come into this country by way of mexico. >> keeping them honest. the "houston chronicle" reports there is no evidence of terrorists entering the united states through mexico. back in march, the newspaper reported on an independent analysis at vanderbilt university. it found a 67% increase in the number of arrests on the border from suspect nation. that was up from 2000 to 2009, yet a senior law enforcement official told "the chronicle" not one of the suspects faced terror charges.
sticking with border issues, a lot of people are talking about what former house speaker newt gingrich said about illegal immigrantses. he broke with his fellow candidates of the he said he would support lighter restrictions for those who lived in the united states for many years, saying he wouldn't deport them. mitt romney took issue with that. yet, when pressed on how he would handle the estimated 11 million to 12 million illegal immigrants here in the united states, romney really didn't have an answer. watch this exchange he had with our own wolf blitzer. >> certainly, we have to secure the border. and we talk about people who have been here 25 years. that is the extreme exception. >> you would let them stay? >> not the rule. >> you would let them stay? >> i'm not going to start drawing lines here about who gets to stay and who gets to go. the principle is, we're not going to have an amnesty system that says that people who come here illegally get to stay for the rest of their life in this country legally. this answer is we're going to have a system that allows those people who come legally a card that identifies them as coming here legally, employers are going to be expected to inspect that card. see if they're here legally. on that basis, we'll be able to
bring into this country the number of people that we need to power our industries, whether that's agriculture or high-tech. we welcome people in here with visa programs. we have a whole series of legal programs. but the idea of focusing a republican debate on amnesty and who we're going to give it to is a huge mistake. secure our border, protect legal immigration, and return to a system that follows the law. >> romney had a lot to say. but keeping them honest, you might notice he never answered if he would deport illegal immigrants. and on a lighter note, there is also this snafu from romney. >> i'm mitt romney, and wolf, yes, that's also my first name. >> actually, his first name is willard. mitt is his middle name. slight snafu. let's get into raw politics now. david gergen, cnn contributor. erik erickson and sherry jacobs, columnist for "the hill." david, on immigration, if you listen to speaker gingrich's
answer there, he's taking a gamble. he's looking past the primary and past tea party voters, and we expect mitt romney to focus on the general election and barack obama, a risk for speaker gingrich, no? >> certainly sounded like it. and erik will have a much better sense of how much damage he may have done for himself by going soft, so to speak, on immigration. how much damage he may have done among conservatives, the conservative base, especially in places like iowa. but i think as a general proposition, john, that newt gingrich is trying to reintroduce himself to the american people. he's been out of the limelight for a long time. he was seen as a bomb thrower in his earlier days. effective, yes, but a bomb thrower. and i think he's trying to introduce himself as a person who has grown, become more mature. and perhaps more empathic. with those who have had problems in the past. after all, this is a man asking voters to forgive him for his own past failings. and you know, it's not totally unnatural that he might be more forgiving of others who have had past failings of their own, such
as people who are here illegally for 25 years. >> erick i'll get your view in a moment. sherry, we heard from the iowa congressman, steve king today, an important conservative voice. in his state, he said gingrich's immigration comments last night raised concerns for him. he says if you listen to the speaker, what he describes is amnesty. is that a problem in the state that votes first and votes in less than six weeks? >> i think what newt gingrich is trying to do is eliminate that as somewhat of a problem. and i think by him coming out and addressing it and being out front on it, not being on the defensive, being on the offensive, he was able to put it in his own words rather than wait for those secret robocalls that will come during the -- in iowa. that he can't defend himself against. i think that was a strategy on his part that was smart, quite frankly. i don't think it was risky, and i don't think it was a mistake. it's best it comes from him so he can have this debate, put it in his own words rather than have one of the other candidates try and get in there and represent his or misrepresent his position.
>> erick, do you think it's smart? >> you know, i think it's a risk, particularly in a place like iowa. but i think it's very smart. lock, newt's taking a gamble right now. there are only two people who can really take him on on this issue are you right now in iowa. michele bachmann and romney. michele bachmann doesn't have the money and romney says they're going to take him on, except mitt romney was saying virtually the same thing in 2007. and the gingrich campaign was already circulating the press clip from "meet the press" back in 2007. >> back in 2007, erick is referring to governor romney back then saying he would support a program that not only included legal status, but potentially support citizenship. so there will be a question for governor romney on this one. there will be a question for romney on this one. let's stay on point for a second, our viewers haven't seen romney's new tv ad. he's the front runner, he has been the front runner all along, being challenged by speaker gingrich. he launched his first tv ad this week and raised a lot of eyebrows. listen here.
>> i am confident that we can steer ourselves out of this crisis. we need a rescue plan for the middle class. we need to provide relief for homeowners. it's going take a new direction. if we keep talking about the economy, we're going to lose. lose. lose. >> you hear that voice in the end. that's then senator obama, 2008. if we keep talking about the economy, we're going to lose. as we've reported, he's actually reporting a mccain aide and there's part of the sentence they lopped off there. and here's how governor romney defended this ad today. here's how romney defends it in iowa. >> the ad, before it went out, was sent out with press releases describing that what the president had said about john mccain was now going to be used to be said about him. so there was no hidden effort on the part of our campaign. it was instead to point out that what is sauce for the goose is now sauce for the gander. >> sauce for the gander. david gergen, they did in the press release say they were using that quote. but if you're just somebody watching in your living room, you have no idea they are taking
then senator obama now president obama out of context. risky for a guy who can find plenty of other obama tape talking about the economy? >> absolutely. and the idea that people are going to read the press release is ridiculous. look, mitt romney is clearly trying to prove his campaign, trying to show he's going to take the fight to obama. something republicans have been a little worried about. one of the reasons newt gingrich is doing well against romney, seems to be more of a brawler. someone who will take the fight. i think the romney people are trying to disprove that but having said that, as you point out, they have so much material to work with on the economy, why in the world would they want to resort to something that is at best misleading? and for a man like mitt romney, who, yes, he has been back and forth on some issues, but generally seen as a man of integrity. why would he allow his campaign -- why would he himself come out and endorse it? i think he ought to clear the air and restart and go after the material honestly. he's got a lot to work with. >> erick, if you watched the debate last night and watched
this fascinating week, we've seen newt gingrich now catching up to mitt romney, even passing him in some national polls. ahead in a new iowa poll. if you're mitt romney, looking around the stage last night, you have to be hoping that you don't end up in a two-way or three-way. you want perry, you want bachmann, herman cain, rick santorum. you want them to survive iowa and have a crowded field moving on, don't you? >> you do. in fact, mitt romney's campaign has thrown several lifelines to candidates. in one of the debates, the bloomberg debate, he asked a softball to michele bachmann on what great things she would do for america. he has said nice things about herman cain and defended cain from attacks. he's trying to keep people in. there's a real problem, though, just from the cnn poll and other polls are starting to show this, as newt gingrich has now gone up beyond mitt romney, we're seeing something we haven't seen with other candidates. mitt romney is starting to go back down. he has been very, very steady in the polling with other candidates, bouncing around him. he's never gone down as someone else has risen. with gingrich's rise, he is starting to go down in the polls. and that's got to worry the
romney campaign, that gingrich is now ahead in iowa and new polls have him vastly ahead in south carolina and even places like pennsylvania. the race looks like it may be starting to find it's non-romney candidate. and if so, i don't think mitt romney is going to be the nominee. >> and if so, sherry, can gingrich take advantage of his surge, or has it come at a point where maybe he doesn't have the resources and infrastructure. we do know as he went up in the polls this week, he won't be on the ballot for the missouri primary, because his team missed a filing deadline. that's campaign 101. there are caucuses, the campaign says it will play in those. but they missed some opportunities, because of their -- the bad stretch, if you will. >> well, the opportunities weren't there, because he had the bad stretch. he lost all that staff last summer, and people wrote him off for dead. we saw that with john mccain, by the way, in 2008. but his strengths are the debates. that's why he is where he is. these debates matter. last night's debate, i think, mattered more than the others. so i think that he's ahead now, i think romney is probably going
to recover his numbers, because he does have a better ground game. he does have the resources. he is organized. so it's going to -- i think you're going to see these two as top tier for a while. but i don't think you're going to see romney keep going down. i think he's got a chance to come back up, because as you said, he has the resources. he's got the organization, the ground game. where gingrich doesn't. >> if you look at the history books, david gergen, and you know the history, newt gingrich, often, when he is at a peak, does something to hurt himself. do you see a different newt gingrich this time around? >> that to me is a fascinating question, john. you know, we all knew him when he was in the limelight back in the '90s as speaker. and no one other than gingrich could have engineered that republican takeover of the house. and much of what he achieved as speaker. but at the same time, as you recall, he made a lot of mistakes. and while he was strong, he also had a reputation for being a bomb-thrower, often erratic. and i think the big question
now, is this the old newt gingrich we haven't quite seen come out yet or is there a new, more mature, newt gingrich. if there is a new newt and people are convinced of that, i think he'll give romney a run for his money. on the other hand, if it people conclude he's a right wing sort of erratic, bully kind of person, who is -- you know, who says really -- and can hurt himself, then i think his chances of getting there are quite slim. >> david ger again, erik erickson, thank you so much for joining us. let us know what you think at home. we're on facebook and google plus. add us to your circles. up next -- new violent clashes in egypt. military police battling protests, tear gas and anger in the streets. a truce lasting just three hours today. the military says it wants peace. we're keeping them honest. also tonight, the latest on the penn state sex abuse scandal. jerry sandusky's lawyer responds to new allegations reportedly coming from members of sandusky's own family.
first, let's check in with isha sesay. >> john, amazing video from new zealand where a helicopter crashed, who was helping set up a christmas tree. the pilot survived the crash. how did i get here? dumb luck? or good decisions? ones i've made. ones we've all made. about marriage. children. money. about tomorrow. here's to good decisions. who matters most to you says the most about you. massmutual is owned by our policyholders so they matter most to us. massmutual. we'll help you get there. -why? -why? -why? [ female announcer ] we all age differently. roc® multi-correxion 4 zone moisturizer with roc®retinol and antioxidants.
lines, wrinkles, and sun damage will fade. roc multi-correxion. correct what ages you. so i used my citi thank you card to pick up some accessories. a new belt. some nylons. and what girl wouldn't need new shoes? we talked about getting a diamond. but with all the thank you points i've been earning... ♪ ...i flew us to the rock i really had in mind. ♪
[ male announcer ] the citi thank you card. earn points you can use for travel on any airline, with no blackout dates. congratulations. congratulations. today, the city of charlotte can use verizon technology to inspire businesses to conserve energy and monitor costs. making communities greener... congratulations. ... and buildings as valuable to the bottom line... whoa ! ... as the people inside them. congratulations. because when you add verizon to your company, you don't just add, you multiply. ♪ discover something new... verizon. okay... uhh. the bad news, it's probably totaled. the good news is, you don't have to pay your deductible. with vanishing deductible from nationwide insurance, you got $100 off for every year of safe driving, so now your deductible is zero. the other good news ? i held on to your coffee. wow. ♪ nationwide is on your side
( laughing ) it's actually a pretty good day when you consider. that's great. another keeping them honest report. more violence in egypt, raids spreading in the streets of cairo despite claims by the ruling military to speed up the power to a new government. the good news, there was a three-hour cease fire today. the bad news, it didn't last. here is cnn's ivan watson in egypt's capital. >> this is where the fighting has been raging now. into the fifth day. this one road here with police not very far away, and these kids choking, puking. but refusing to give their ground amid the constant tear
gas that's coming over here. eye-witnesses show that they're actually breaking the cease fire sometimes that are arranged here, and just venting their fury. and there's another round of tear gas. >> now, ivan talked with one of the protesters who says their anger all boils down to one thing. watch. >> what do you want? >> well, what we need is to be from the people. the freedom! we don't need any military control for these people. >> we don't need any military control, the gentleman said. but the military isn't giving up its grip just yet. and people are dying. the death toll from these latest clashes has risen to 35, according to state-run tv. a spokesman for egypt's health ministry says more than 3,000 others have been injured. no doubt, some of those injuries happened today. look at what cnn's ben wedeman witnessed earlier in cairo. >> reporter: as you can see, right in front of me, there's this one soldier who has put on his gas mask and it looks like an antiquated model there.
they've all put on -- many of them have put on their gas masks, because the gas that was fired by the interior ministry. this -- this really indicates that there is a stark division between the army, on the one hand, and the interior ministry on the other. the army today put out a statement that they have not fired any tear gas at protesters. which basically -- what they're saying is, we are not interior ministry. so what you're seeing now, these are army. these are soldiers of the egyptian army in front of me, and they've formed a line, yet another line, another basically two lines separating them. separating them from the protesters on one side and the interior ministry forces on the other. more rocks -- more rocks coming in. and you can see the soldiers themselves who don't have gas
masks are starting to suffer from this gas, as i am, as well. >> courageous reporting from ben wedeman in cairo today. ben will join us live in a moment. here's another look at the line ben talked about, separating protesters and security forces. a state-run tv the government said religious clerics were going to form a human shield between the two sides. well, cnn saw no sign of that. but the religious scholars were talking to protesters, trying to negotiate. the violence started over the weekend and continues raising concerns and questions about egypt's future, ahead of monday's important parliamentary elections. many people thought these days were over in egypt, after the fall of mubarak the regime back in february. but here we are again. once again, protesters are being beaten. this man was hit with batons on monday, not just one, but several batons. you can see it there in the hands of security forces. and then there's this. [ gunfire ] >> gunshots ringing out earlier this week as military and police forces go after protesters who are fighting back with rocks.
joining us now live from cairo, cnn international correspondent ben wedeman. in chicago, ann marie slaughter. ben, the collapse of the truth. what does it say about the uneasy relationship between the egyptian army and the police? >> the egyptian army is really sort of trying to distance itself from the police. and this is because despite all of the unhappiness with the supreme council of the armed forces that runs egypt, the soldiers, the ordinary soldiers in the street, still get respect. they're not attacked by the protesters, whereas the ministry of the interior and its forces are profoundly hated by egyptians. i've driven by the interior ministry, and the old days of hosni mubarak the, egyptians would say, you go in that building, you may never come out again. and what we're seeing is that -- a realization that this is a
painted ministry. so, for instance, we heard from the grand of the republic of egypt, hamad ahmed tiab. actually calling on the interior ministry to stop shooting egyptians. and that sort of statement from the most senior religious authority in the country, at a -- what was a pillar of the mubarak regime represents -- just indicates how much has changed. in the old days, he was considered a puppet of the regime. now he is openly criticizing it. john? >> ben, as evidence, the army comes out with a statement saying it fired no tear gas at the protesters. is that true? >> reporter: well, technically, it may be. we can't say with absolute certainty. but certainly most of the tear gas has been fired by the security forces, by the interior
ministry forces. and not the military. the military, as we saw today, is trying to separate the two forces. it's almost as if the interior ministry is beyond the control of the military who have come in and pushed them apart. i mean, that's sort of odd, given that in theory, the military and the police are working together for the security of the country. the military actually has to intercede between the people and the police. it's unheard of, in a sense. >> and marie, what, if anything, should the united states or the broader international community be doing right now? >> the united states needs to be pushing for a national unity government, essentially, for the military to cede power to a unity government that would bring lots of parties together and stop the violence. right now, the principle sign of the united states that these protesters are seeing is that the tear gas cannisters say
"made in the united states." that is not what we want in terms of our support for protesters who are demanding their rights and demanding what they fought for back in february, but haven't been given what they were promised. >> and as this plays out, we have learned the american students who have been detained in egypt will be held for four more days. that's according to the prosecutor's office in egypt. i know you're out of government now, not briefed on the specifics. but in general on the situation, you have americans detained, which would be of concern anyway. when it happens in the middle of unrest, does it make it that more serious, more worrisome a situation? >> well, john, if i were the parents of these students, i obviously would be worried. but i think we have to recognize that our consulate has seen these students. we know who is holding them. they are being subject to legal process. so it is certainly worrisome, given the overall chaos. but the standard procedures are being followed. i think they'll be home pretty soon.
>> ben wedeman, the parliamentary election scheduled for monday. explain to some in the united states who might not be following the tick tock of this every day how much is at stake. >> reporter: well, this is really going to determine the future course of egypt. apart from what we're seeing in tahrir, it is an intensely watched campaign here in egypt, because this may determine, for instance, if the muslim brotherhood will be able to gain a large share of the votes. it was expected before these disturbances that the brotherhood would get as much as 30% to 40%, which would really put them ahead of everybody else. now, however, they've been roundly criticized for not actually supporting the demonstrators in tahrir. so many people believe they may take something of a beating if the elections take place on monday, as was expected. john?
>> anne marie, when you hear them calling in saying, stop the violence, reports of religious scholars trying to negotiate some kind of a truce or cease-fire, how important is this religious community in egypt at this fragile moment? >> what's really striking is that the religious community is essentially siding with the protesters. they are saying, stop shooting egyptians in the streets. so their role actually is legitimating the protesters and again in some contrast to the fact that the muslim brotherhood is sitting out this protest. even though many younger members of the muslim brotherhood are in the streets. so it's a very unusual role that, as -- they were seen as the puppets of the regime, they are now effectively condemning legitimating the protests and condemning the violence. >> thank you. very important perspective tonight. still ahead, a story we told you about several weeks ago, amish men attacked, humiliated, their beards shaved. tonight, seven men charged with hate crimes. why they did it.
and remember this horrific scene? the stage collapses before a sugarland concert? at the indiana state fair. seven people were killed. we'll tell you who some of the survivors say should be held responsible when "360" returns. 0 let's talk about the personal attention tdd# 1-800-345-2550 you and your money deserve. tdd# 1-800-345-2550 at charles schwab, that means taking a close look at you tdd# 1-800-345-2550 as well as your portfolio. tdd# 1-800-345-2550 we ask the right questions, tdd# 1-800-345-2550 then we actually listen to the answers tdd# 1-800-345-2550 before giving you practical ideas you can act on. tdd# 1-800-345-2550 so talk to chuck online, on the phone, tdd# 1-800-345-2550 or come in and pull up a chair. see? he's taking his vitamins. new one a day vitacraves plus omega-3 dha is a complete multivitamin for adults. plus an excellent source of omega-3 dha in a great tasting gummy. one a day, gummies for grown-ups.
ahead on "360," the penn state child sex abuse scandal keeps growing. we'll have the latest. first, a look at other stories making news tonight. isha sesay has a 360 bulletin. >> john, after ten months of deadly uprising, yemen's president has signed a deal to give up his power. abdullah sala will be allowed to keep the title for three months but has to hand over the executive power to his vice president until elections are
held. he ruled yemen for 33 years. moammar gadhafi's son may be tried in tripoli, rather than the international criminal court in the hague. saif was indicted on charges of crimes against humanity. after being captured last weekend. but international prosecutors say if the libyans can prove they are able to try him there, they should have the right to do so. now, you remember we brought you these terrible pictures back in august. the stage collapsing at the indiana state fair before sugarland was about to perform. now, 44 survivors of that collapse and the families of four people who died are suing the band, concert producers and stage riggers. the suit says the band had the final say on whether or not to go on in the bad weather. >> and take a look at this video from new zealand. a helicopter being used to set up a big christmas tree appears
to clip a cable and it plummets to the ground. the chopper was badly damaged. but the pilot, greg gribold was treated and released from the hospital. the cause of the crash, that's under investigation. and getting ready for the big day. this is a live look at a true new york city tradition. crowds gather late into the night on the city's upper west side to watch the blowing up of big balloons for tomorrow's macy's thanksgiving day parade. great scene there. are you ready for thanksgiving, john? >> looks like spiderman is taking a nap before the parade. i'm not sure how that works. i'll be ready. how about that? i'm not ready at the moment. but i'll be ready. how about you? >> i'm not cooking, so it's going to be a tremendous thanksgiving. i'll be ready. >> oh, cooking is the best part. >> i'll be ready to eat! >> all right. that's a good thing to do. stand by, isha. let's go, our beat 360 winners. has a thanksgiving connection. our challenge to viewers, a chance to show up our staffers by coming up with a better caption for the photo we post on the blog every day.
tonight's photo, here you go, a prethanksgiving tradition at casablanca. president obama pardoning a turkey named liberty today. our staff winner tonight is sam. his caption? dad, can we over to occupy later? yeah -- can we run that again? our viewer winner. our viewer winner is bridget. her caption? liberty may get the pardon, but those other turkeys on the super committee should get the axe. bridget, you get a drum roll. your "beat 360" t-shirt is on the way. still ahead here on "360," the new allegations in the child sex abuse scandal at penn state. one of the most recent allegations comes from former coach jerry sandusky's own family. we'll have the latest. an seven men arrested on hate crime charges. who investigators say was behind humiliating alleged attacks on amish men in ohio. let's go to vegas. alright, let's do it.
let's do it, let's go to vegas. vegas baby! maybe we should head back to the dealership first? vegas! no, this is a test drive. vegas! [ male announcer ] it's practically yours. but we still need your signature. volkswagen sign then drive is back. and it's never been easier to get a jetta. that's the power of german engineering. get zero first month's payment, zero down, zero security deposit and zero due at signing on any new volkswagen. visit vwdealer.com. -why? -why? -why? [ female announcer ] we all age differently. roc® multi-correxion 4 zone moisturizer with roc®retinol and antioxidants. lines, wrinkles, and sun damage will fade. roc multi-correxion. correct what ages you.
it's a great hd tv. shh. don't speak. i'll just leave you two alone. [ male announcer ] black friday's here. deals start thursday 10 pm. more electronics start at midnight. and we're open all day and night so you don't have to wait outside. walmart. the sleep number bed. with the sleep number bed, it's not about soft or firm. it's about support where you find it most comfortable. the magic of this bed is that you're sleeping on something that conforms to your individual shape. on a traditional mattress, there is no adjustment. you get what you're buying that day. with our bed, you change the setting to something you like. this way, if you change your mind once you get home you can adjust it. and now, queen sleep number mattresses start at just $599. and for four days only, save an incredible 50% on our innovative limited edition bed. wow! that feels really good. it's hugging my body. you can adjust it to whatever your needs are. if i'm in pain one day, in less than a minute i can get more support. your body changes over time. the bed can adapt with you. not only does it work for you today, but it's going
"crime and punishment" tonight, the child sex abuse scandal at penn state university seems to get more shocking with every new report. today, one of the two latest alleged victims to come forward involves allegations from a member of sandusky's own family. his lawyer denies his client had any inappropriate contact with any family members and that
there's more to this story. and national correspondent jason carroll joins me now with the latest. jason, you've been in contact with jerry sandusky's lawyer. what is he saying about the latest allegations? >> reporter: john, he says they're completely untrue. that's his point of view. again, let me review what we're talking about. these are two new alleged victims, both of them are minors. at least one of them is a member of jerry sandusky's own family. they're allegations of abuse reported to children in the youth services, reported after the attorney general released its 23-page grand jury report, which you know at this point has charged jerry sandusky with 40 counts of abuse. his attorney says these are not victims. he says this is all about in-fighting going on in jerry sandusky's own family. he released a statement to me earlier this evening saying, quote, the allegations are ridiculous and unfounded. jerry has absolutely denied any inappropriate contact with his family members. it's important to keep in mind,
these allegations were made after the attorney general filed charges against jerry, even though the alleged incidents took place before the charges were filed by the a.g. his attorney also, john, telling me earlier he had always feared that because of all the publicity generated around this case that all sorts of allegations would come forward, allegations like we're seeing now. john? >> and help with some important context, jason. are these new allegations different from the previous allegations? >> well, they are. they are different in that you're now seeing these allegations, very disturbing ones, coming from within sandusky's own family. what we have seen up until this point, all of the allegations we have seen from alleged victims, have come from people who were not related to jerry sandusky. so that's first. the other thing that we're seeing is these two new alleged victims, john, are much younger than the victims that we have seen so far, those outlined in the grand jury report. having said that, jerry sandusky's attorney responded to that, as well, saying even if you buy into the attorney
general's allegations against jerry, which we vehemently dispute, and which we intend to vigorously defend against, these new allegations don't fit the profile presented by the a.g. these new allegations appear to be the result of a very nasty divorce and custody battle. now, another thing we should point out, john, with all of these new allegations that we're seeing, we should note that they have to be validated by investigators before we can say that they are, in fact, victims. they are alleged victims until they are thoroughly investigated. and that investigation is complete. john? >> important reporting and important context. jason carol, thanks. digging deeper into this already complex case with more allegations coming in, more alleged incidents being reported, this is shaping up to be a long and complicated prosecution. joining us live from san francisco, long-time prosecutor, paul henderson. paul, news of two new allegations of child abuse raise the question of whether he should have been arrested
sooner. there were people who came forward. there was the campus investigation that was botched. why did it take police so long to arrest jerry sandusky? >> well, it's an interesting legal issue in terms of what the criminal justice process is in pennsylvania. it's very similar in most states. there is actually only two states that have this unusual permutation of their grand jury process. so in pennsylvania and the other state is connecticut, what a grand jury does is not an actual indictment. the grand jury does a full investigation, and then it makes a presentment when the prosecutors then look at that information and then make a decision about how to move forward. and that's the case that took place in this instance, as well. so it took a little bit of time and now the defense attorney is actually saying that that's one of the factors that would indicate that his client is not guilty, because it took so much time in order for them to get an actual case being filed against him.
i think right now we're looking at just a whole watershed. there are going to be more and more cases coming out of this incident. there are more alleged victims coming out, left and right, to testify and move forward that want to tell their part of the story. i think it's not looking very good right now, and this is, i think, turning out to be one of the worst incidents in college football that is going to be a big stain for quite a long time. >> if that's the case, and it continues to grow, there are a lot of people a week ago saying how is this guy out on bail. how you hear of victims who are young, alleged victims, i should make clear, who are younger. could jerry sandusky -- should he not -- should they not go to court and say this is a potential danger to the community? >> well, he's already been released from a judge. and you know, one of the things you have to keep in mind is, this is a community where this school and this organization has such a big imprint on the local prosecutors that are there, and
the whole local society there. everyone is not necessarily deferential to the school and the people associated with the school. but this is a well-known figure. and so there are these issues and these questions that keep being raised by people, saying, is he getting preferential treatment. is something different happening for him? i think, though, if you break it down. there's going to be three different approaches in terms of what's going to happen. there's going to be criminal liability, civil liability and then there's moral liability or implication. and at every level with this case so far, it just seems to keep on growing. in terms of the criminal cases and the criminal charges, even though he has been released on bond, as new alleged victims come forward, you can bring and add that case back on to a calendar and bring it in front of a judge again, in order to put someone back into custody. so the fact that he is out right now and there are new charges, potentially, and there are new victims potentially, does not mean that he will stay out of custody, or that he should stay out of custody, as more charges
unfold and as we learn more and more information about what was happening in the past, and what the violations that are being alleged grow in that community. >> paul henderson, thanks. appreciate your insight. still ahead, a texas judge who was caught on videotape beating his daughter is suspended. the daughter described that beating to anderson, you'll remember, just days after it went viral. >> the bruises were the worst i had ever had. i had had other lashings like that, but this one produced the most bruising. and the next day was all up and down my legs. and he had also hit my arms when he couldn't get to my legs. also ahead, a new development in another story we have been following. police say they caught the men behind a string of amish beard cuttings. we'll have the very latest.
look, it's ok to take the occasional gamble - as long as it's something like switching from boxers to briefs. but you never roll the dice on your truck. so go with the sure thing, ford f-150. jd power and associates just gave f-150 their highest award for initial quality. add to that the best mix of torque and fuel economy you get with its ecoboost engine, and you're money, baby. this is the future. this is the ford f-150.
[ zapping ] there goes dwayne's car. oh, man. there goes dwayne's house. whoa! whoa! and there goes dwayne. man, that thing does not like dwayne. [ male announcer ] state farm's got you covered. nice landing. it was. [ male announcer ] get to a better state. [ knock on door ] cool. you found it. wow. nice place. yeah. [ chuckles ] the family thinks i'm out shipping these. smooth move. you used priority mail flat rate boxes. if it fits, it ships for a low, flat rate. paid for postage online and arranged a free pickup. and i'm gonna track them online, too. nice. between those boxes and this place, i'm totally staying sane this year. do i smell snickerdoodles? maybe. [ timer dings ] got to go. priority mail flat rate shipping at usps.com. a simpler way to ship.
will be giving away passafree copies of the alcoholism & addiction cure. to get yours, go to ssagesmalibubook.com. up close tonight, the feds close in on a case that has shaken an amish community to its core. we first told you about this story earlier this month. several amish men in ohio have been the victims of an unusual form of violence. they have had their beards forcibly shaven and their hair cut off. in the amish religion, men stop shaving once they marry, and their beards are considered sacred. so when members of a breakaway secretary allegedly carried out a series of beard attacks, the victims and their families became afraid as well as ashamed. this morning, several men were arrested on federal hate crime charges, among them samuel mud and three sons. here's what the u.s. attorney
said today. >> religiously motivated violent attacks. and we would implore people who are thinking about or considering doing anything like this to understand not only that it is wrong, not only that it is contrary to our most fundamental beliefs as americans, but that the consequences for engaging in that kind of contact can be quite serious. >> gary tuchman has been reporting this story from the beginning and has more on just what led to today's arrests. >> reporter: in rural eastern ohio, the amish have lived for generations in piece and solitude. but recently in the middle of the night, an amish woman in this house, arline miller, called 911. >> 911. >> we had terrorists here, somebody terrorizing us. >> reporter: and then her husband myron took the phone. >> i opened my door and asked what they want. the one guy who reached in grabbed me by my beard and pulled me out. >> reporter: grabbed him by his beard and cut it off. myron miller is one of at least five amish men in ohio who have
been victims of bizarre beard-cutting attacks. that's right. beard-cutting attacks. fred abdallah is the sheriff in jefferson county, ohio. >> this is very degrading to an amish man. one amish man said he'd rather die than have his beard cut off. that's how bad it is. >> reporter: myron miller was attacked by five men. he escaped before his entire beard was cut. he talked, but like many amish who do not like publicity, did not want to face the camera. >> it doesn't make sense to us, either. why somebody would just want to start cutting beards, you know, terrorize people. >> reporter: myron miller's wife did not want her face on camera at all. >> there we go. okay. this is my first time putting a horse on a buggy. >> reporter: but she did offer to take me on a horse and buggy ride to talk about the fear in the community. >> amish people aren't used to being scared, such a peaceful lifestyle, right? >> we never locked our doors before this happened.
but now that this has happened, we have -- we are locking our doors. >> reporter: and this is who they say they're trying to keep out. these amish men, arrested in the case of myron miller. this is a court hearing for three of the five men arrested. but the sheriff says the men were ordered to do the beard cuttings by one particular man. >> i have dealt with a lot of amish. they're just beautiful people. but i can't compare sam mullet to the ones that i've met. >> sam mullet is the bishop of a breakaway amish secretary that's in a deep rest with the amish who is dangerously manipulative over his flock. but why the beard cutting? it's a profound insult, and followers have allegedly used it as a weapon to punish those who might have insulted them. three arrested are sons of sam mullet. >> he is a domineering individual. nothing moves in that community without him saying it's okay. he calls all of the shots. they're literally scared to death of him. and i said that he is a cult leader over the years, because they will do anything he tells
them to do. the one said they will die for their father. that's how severely he has them brainwashed. >> reporter: so we went to the tiny town of bergholtz, ohio in search of sam mull et, and we found him. he wasn't very pleased to see us. if the sheriff says you're a cult, what's your response? >> we're not a cult. >> reporter: have you ordered men to cut beards off? >> i did not order anything. >> reporter: but sam mullet does not deny that his sons or other men committed the beard attacks. >> they do what they think is right. yeah, i could have probably said you're not going to do this. and maybe they wouldn't right then. but sooner or later, it would have happened. >> reporter: but why do you think these people had their beards cut off? >> we're getting in too deep. it's too long a story. it goes way back. >> reporter: do you think those people did something wrong? >> i'm telling you i'm not interested. can you hear me?
>> reporter: to it myron miller's wife arline, she said she would appear on camera. there is no doubt who is behind the attacks. >> who do you believe is responsible for all this? >> sam. sam mullet. >> reporter: the amish don't believe it's a commandment from god to drive a horse and buggy and not drive a car. it's a way to keep them separated from the outside world. for most mainstream amish, when they need to go far from where they live, they hire a non-amish driver, but most of the time, it's a horse and buggy. >> reporter: the beard-cutting attacks, authorities say the amish perpetrators did indeed hire a man to drive a get-away car but say the man was not aware of the crimes. >> the fbi is now investigating the situation. what's your feeling about that? >> we're not guilty, so i have nothing to hide. if they want to come and check us out, we would be glad to see them here. >> reporter: we're not sure how glad mullet is now, though. it was the feds who placed him under arrest. back then, he told us he was the righteous one. >> the people that are spreading lies around about us, and the way they're treating us by getting the sheriff, getting the
law and everything, are asking for a big punishment from the man up above. >> gary tuchman joins me now from atlanta. they allege, the authorities do, that sam mullet did some terrible things. what else do they say? >> the fbi is saying it's not just the beard-cutting. what the fbi says, he was vicious and violent, at times, when people crossed him, he would force them to stay in a chicken coop for days at a time, and they also say in these legal papers that he had sexual relations with married women to, quote, cleanse them of the devil. that sounds a lot like warren jeffs, the polygamist leader who is now in jail in texas. either way, mullet, six other people arrested, including three of his sons, are in jail right now without bond. they face the possibility of up to ten years in prison on these hate crime charges. but prosecutors reserve the right to increase charges possibly to federal kidnapping, which could mean the possibility of life in prison. >> did you get the chance -- did you get the impression when you talked to him, even though he said he was innocent, that he was concerned about being arrested? >> he talked a tough game but he
was very concerned when i got there. i think he thought i was a cop. he backed away from me. he realized i wasn't a cop, he talked to me, but today the cops came. more than 40 came in the raid this morning. >> gary tuchman, fascinating reporting. appreciate you being here tonight. coming up, an update of the texas judge seen on video brutally beating his daughter. the public outrage has been enormous. now the judge has been suspended. the very latest next. also, a man convicted in the connecticut home invasion that left a doctor injured and his wife and two daughters dead speaks for the first time at his sentencing. we'll tell you what he had to say. ♪ ♪ ♪
i'm isha sesay with a 360 news and business bulletin. breaking news from arizona, a plane has crashed 35 miles east of phoenix and burst into flames. sources say it is not a commercial airplane. search and rescue crews found a 24-inch tire on the mountain, which makes them think it's a twin-engine aircraft, but they can't get closer due to the fire. one of the two men convicted of murder in the connecticut home invasion case spoke today for the first time in his trial. a jury is deciding whether he should be executed for murder, rape, and arson in the deaths of
jennifer hawk-petit and her two daughters. dr. william petit was the sole survivor of the 2007 attack. today he objected to his lawyer's plan to try and spare his life by showing his 9-year-old daughter's videotaped testimony to the jury. the texas supreme court has suspended the judge who made headlines after the recent release of a 2004 video of him beating his then-teenaged daughter. now a warning, the video you're about to see is disturbing. the judge is seen whipping his daughter with a belt. he agreed to the paid suspension but didn't admit any wrong doing. two of the three major racing agencies will not cut the united states credit rating despite the super committee's failure to cut budgets. moody's will keep its rating at a perfect aaa. and some shoppers will go to extremes to get a bargain on black friday, the day after thanksgiving. already first in line outside a