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tv   Today in Washington  CSPAN  March 4, 2010 2:00am-6:00am EST

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focused on three priority areas, securing critical fund -- not front-line states, meeting urgent global challenges and enhancing aid effectiveness and accountability. allow me to summarize each briefly. first and critical front-line states we propose spending $7.7 billion in state in usaid assistance in support of development efforts in afghanistan, pakistan and iraq. we have made some progress in each of these countries but we realize the significant challenges remain. over the past several years or focus in afghanistan has been achieving greater stability and security. we are beginning to see major improvements in health care, education and agriculture as well as in some cases the foundation of a more representative and democratic government. did miss races funding jason's funding request is part of the president afghanistan strategy and design to encourage stability and opportunity in that nation. g efforts to combat
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extremism, promote economic opportunity, strengthen space institutions and build a long-term relationship with pakistani people. here to our programs are helping to achieve significant improvements in education and health itself. the increase in fy 2011 for pakistan will help usaid reach 60,000 more children with nutrition programs increased inlet in paris at secondary schools by over it support 500 households to eckert cultural production. am i brac we have transitioned to a new phase in the sebelius systems relationship shifting away from the reconstruction toward the provision of assistance to bolster local capacity in line with iraqi priorities. usaid is promoting economic of about strengthening the eckert cultural sector which is the largest employer of the iraqis after the government of iraq and
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increase capacity of local and national governments to provide essential services. our second budget priorities focused on meeting the urgent global challenges. $14.6 billion in state assistance to support local land global solutions to the core transnational problems including health extreme poverty, natural and man-made semesters and threats of further instability from climate change population growth. we are requesting $8.5 billion in state aid assistance. the request supports the president's global health initiative. with this additional funding we will build on our strong record of success on the hiv/aids treatment, tuberculosis and malaria control and seek to achieve improved results in areas where progress has led such as obstetrics terkel the newborn care and basic nutrition. and food security we are proposing to invest $1.2 billion
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for state to secure the agricultural programs in addition to the $200 million set aside for nutrition. with these additional funds we will work in countries in africa, central america and asia to combat poverty and hunger to be in climate change we propose to invest $646 million for state programs. part of the administration's overall $1.4 billion request to support climate change assistance. the linscott investment as listed on the big low carbon to the limit strategies for critical countries market-based approaches to sustainable energy sector reform and capacity building technology development to enhance adaptation resilience strategies to meet its humanitarian assistance a.i.d. and state proposed to invest $4.2 billion. this allows us to insist internally displaced persons, refugees and victims of conflict and natural disasters worldwide
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such as >> translator: earthquakes in haiti and chile. with these adjustments we will save lives and help make people less vulnerable to with poverty and threat of instability that extreme poverty breeds. our third major budget priority focuses on enhancing usaid's effectiveness and the accountability by investing 1.7 billion in the ongoing rebuilding effort for the personal infrastructure. all of the peoria site allied require strong capacities and evaluation, planning, a strategic resource management and research to ensure we are incorporating the best practices, innovation and technologies from the field. we also must be able to recruit hire and retain it class developed professions cash by reducing reliance on contractors to design and evaluate programs we will not only save taxpayer dollars but also should enable greater oversight and more effective program implementation. through these critical
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investments we can achieve the development goals we sit around the world and restore usaid standing as the world's premier development agency. i know this is a time of great economic straight for so many americans for every dollar we invest we must show results. that is why the budget supports programs vital to the national security and ability to account for outcomes. the united states must be able to exercise global leadership to help countries as they develop stable in sustainable foundations for security, stability and well-being. this requires the effective use of fenster redds of the national security including development. and this requires relentless focus on results and accountability, focus the embrace with enthusiasm. thank you and i look forward to your questions, your guidance and ongoing consultations. blblblblblblblblblblblblblblblbl
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conversations and brainstorming related to five core working group topic areas related to how the united states projects its power and its marra power in diplomatic and development capacity is around a world. as we transition we are in the process of transitioning to a series of more operationally oriented task forces that will
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be addressing specific topics like how we improve our ability to do policy planning, how we develop systems for accountability in budgeting, how we help our country missions and our country chief of missions develop long-term investment strategy is for development and diplomacy and have the flexibility to partner more effectively with the private sector with sources of innovation and with country governments themselves. the results of those more specific operational efforts should be available in the april -- may timeframe and we at this time hope to have a deep an ongoing conversation at both about the contents of the qddr as well as learning from the committees and the congress around the range of views on some of these core issues and that is an ongoing process but one that has shifted the from a larger strategic conversation to a more focused said of
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operational discussions. a presidential study directive a similarly making the same transition after having completed a series of phases of work that brought together 16 -- 18 different agencies throughout the federal government to discuss ideas and concepts in a more open space related to the future of development, that is transitioning into also m.r. operational focus to come up with specific constructs that will define development strategy that this administration is going forward. if they come together in a number of different ways not least of which our deputies committees we participated in but also the key individuals part of the process is often the same individuals. >> and the psd, when you think that process -- you mentioned april. a notion of idea for the qddr, what about the pst? >> i don't think this qddr will be completed in april but we
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will have enough specifics to begin a serious consultation on the set of ideas in that timeframe. on this before i would expect the same thing although i shouldn't speak on behalf of the national security council and they can identify more specific time line and we come back with a specific answer. >> i would appreciate that. in a foreign the funding, can you borrow from the programs across the globe until the supplemental funding arrives? everyone understands in the overall needs in haiti, but the fact is these top-rated hardships and delays on the ground in other countries such as sudan and condo. what is being done to ensure that other humanitarian emergencies on to being neglected in order to address the tragedy in haiti? >> well, i appreciate that question and i believe the u.s. government has committed more than $600 million to the effort
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in haiti and as you point out a large percentage of that has come from the idea -- the account that provides the flexible and rapid funding. we will seek a supplemental to reconstitute the account as fully as possible in this context. we've been in close contact with are implementing partners and other complex crises around the world and have asked them not to delay or slow down program implementation working and the assumption those additional resources will arrive prior to the june timeframe. which was when we would have to sire to make in the trade-offs we hope not to make so i am aware that a number of partners felt they might have to do that and we try to be in touch with everyone who has reached out to indicate they should not slow down programs and other areas and we expect the supplemental to reconstituted in a manner -- >> assumption of my question is wrong, there hasn't been
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depravation and other programs as a result of the transfer of. >> that is correct, sir,. i believe -- i know partners have reached out asking if they should and when we did we try to this correct -- barack at. >> my time is expired, the ranking member is the. >> thank you. i am concerned that with the arrests and the presidents of u.s. citizens alan groce that's a id programs in cuba may have come to a standstill and, if we get a commitment from you and dr. shah that usaid is going to continue to carry out u.s. democracy programs in cuba. i would appreciate that. on haiti following up on the chairman's questions how should the costs of the recovery response and long-term development in haiti be shared among donor countries and what
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portion of the overall aid efforts for haiti over the covering years should the u.s. expected to provide have a 10%, 20%, 30%, whichever figures you think? lastly on the west bank and gaza, the administration has requested another $400 million in economic support funds for west bank and gaza, but as we have seen there's been a lot and a stealing of those funds that's not been managed well. what kind of getting to we have a place to ensure that the funding does not benefit to violent extremists, corrupt officials, and instead richest its intended targets? what kind of metrics are we using to ensure that we can actually accomplish what we seek to do with the finding? thank you, sir. >> thank you. i appreciate those questions. on cuba in particular i think we can strongly affirm our
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commitment to execute our priorities, we've taken a number of steps working with the states the power and to try to address the needs of mr. groce. i've been in direct contact with the partner for whom he was contacted to work with and we work directly with the rangers to ensure that they and then challenging travel situation that they come up with alternative solutions to execute and implement these programs and we're giving them the flexibility so we are fully committed to seeing to the program there. on haiti i appreciate your points in your earlier comments there as well. we have been at approximately half of the overall early relief efforts. a large part is the department of defense, the costs related to to the assets including the marines, the comfort hospital, the effort to rebuild the port and airport -- those were mission critical early activities required for other assistance to come in. as we transition three
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construction of expect that percentage to go down significantly and we're working with the range of major bilateral partners but also the world bank as part of the post disaster assessment to make sure a strong plan is going ford unveiled at the donor's conference in march this month, and that u.s. assistance is targeted and a far more modest percentage of the overall aspiration -- needs. it will be a small percentage better of leadership will be critical and our technical support and deeper engagement in this process will be continued and unwavering. on a world bank and gaza i appreciate the question as well. in as you know, we have a systems for both attracting partners and betting partners. the partner vetting system involves specific identification of names of partners involving our database tracking systems and we have that carefully, the system in place for more than two years. on the cash tracking we also
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have a very specific system in place for more than four years where we are supporting and we offer a specific disbursements from the palestinian authority, the resources transferred quite closely from that a bank in israel to a special treasury@@@& acking how we work with
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partners and how we track the flow pash. >> thank you so much of the imposition of the wispy to make sure that it's a transparent accountable system of aid that is not corrupted the by the corrupt officials in the west bank and gaza. thank you dr. shah, thank you mr. chairman. >> i yield to five minutes to the gentleman from new jersey, chairman of the african subcommittee, mr. payne and. >> thank you dr. shah and let me commend you for the outstanding job you've done in haiti. also i wish we didn't have a dead but we have to remember we have a balanced budget when president clinton left however, a war in the rack which was unnecessary and a big tax cuts put this in a position we're in today unfortunately. let me just say about the global fund, i see that you have cut 50 million from the global fund
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and i wonder if you look at that because as you know the u.n. formula is a one-third u.s., 150 million will be cut over all when the other nations participate. secondly on the neglected tropical diseases, although you are dealing with them, some of them most neglected such as fatal distiller, sleeping cessna -- sleeping sickness, charges, and disease, and some of these other disfiguring all service are not covered and i wonder if they could be included in that. just quickly on three governance groups, somalia with a transitional federal government. i wonder will there be a significant increase in development aid because we have to support those governments or we're going to be in my opinion is very serious problems.
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if they fall all of these africa as you know somaliland will go. secondly are we concentrating enough on south sudan? in 2011 they decide to secede, how will we support the new government with the additional funds? and finally liberia and needs to have a some consideration of where we have a strong institutions. we see elections work like south africa and other places where we don't they fail us so if you've been book and liberia, the historical relationship between the u.s. and library it is important and finally i'd like to know how you are making out with africa, and the coordination with that. i will just also you can answer the questions. thank you. >> thank you mr. chairman. we have on the global fund in
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particular and that's in the context of the larger global health initiative, we're committed to the financial increases against global health. and even more than that using the resources in the way that will be effective against those lagging indicators like maternal mortality in newborn and obstetric care. we are working with the global fund for vaccines and immunizations and other programs to accelerate the partnerships between them and get more value out of the overall investment. the overall administration would press as a billion dollars because it includes the treasury components and will be very committed to helping the global fund succeed. on neglected tropical diseases that will take your comments as a heisman and look specifically into those cases. that's a unique area where i do believe we can and have been in discussions to sell republic private partnerships and me to the overall needs that they have been delayed by the world health
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organization and others and as a very much a priority of the global health initiative. on somalia we will in terms of increases in development assistance most of our assistance is humanitarian, going to the normal, we continue to be in close conversation with the world food program to explore what can be done and when in other parts of somalia and we look to use our development assistance in a strategic manner. i will follow-up more specifically on what we can do to be more expansive in that context. with southern sudan we had $95 million for the referendum and for support for the referendum and we're doing a series of activities with respect to capacity building and serving the people of southern sudan. i will go to our mission is in that region there and unlike other partners even multi lateral partners that are trying to serve the region from farther away, we feel we are well-positioned should the needs
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arise as you have identified so we are in contingency planning around that. also identify what kind of budget flexibility and indians but we think we would have an important role in leading that and think we have important role in bringing other multilateral institutions to that mission should that be the outcome of the early 2011 referendum. i will take your comments on liberia as guidance and on that effort -- africom we are in discussion with them and you hope to have a solid coordinated effort in africa. have visited them this summer and hope to continue that conversation. >> the time has expired, the gentleman from texas is recognized for five minutes. >> thank you mr. chairman. dr. shah, thank you for being here. i am over here. the far right to you. first of all, i want to commend the workers in the field and usaid. i have travelled like everybody
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in this committee all over. there are the greatest ambassadors for the united states and freedom and that we have, those people in the field. i know that usaid is developing all kinds of things most recently the former's -- the former said texas a&m have had some soybean that yields nine times what they used to yield four afghanistan and so that's the farmers in afghanistan don't have to raise poppies, they can raise soybeans that were invented at texas a&m. that's all good thing. i'm concerned about those being good stewards of money. last week we had before us this special inspector general for iraq reconstruction and he said in a reconstruction of iraq there was and there is a
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$4 billion and accounted for a. and i asked him which of all the agencies that are in direct from the united states has i guess the worst record of accountability and he said the state department. of course, the example he used was the $2.5 billion that went to dime corporation for training police officers and there's no records about a prayer that $2.5 billion went. and so i'm concerned about the unaccountability of money we sent and i also ask about could some of that money have turned up in the hands of our enemies like al qaeda? he mentioned that there were 14,000 bloc weapons that disappeared from our possessions to summer else. that troubles me when we have our men and women in uniform overseas trying to protect us and downs that we ship over there and up in their hands
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because our federal agencies aren't good stewards of the money. so you want an increase in the budget, we have 50 million americans unemployed, it seems like to mean when some country is in trouble, of course, they call 1-800-usaid to come over and help them out. that's what we kind of do in this country, the government and the people of this country are the most giving of any nation in history. but i would like for you to specifically address this problem of accountability and how do we know that this money is going to be accounted for, that these are going to steal it, crooked contractors aren't going to steal it and the bad guys aren't going to end up with some of the aid that we send to ford countries. similar to some of the questions the ranking member addressed and other parts of the world.
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so how about that dr. shah? >> thank you, sir,. i want to thank you for your comments about our staff and also with knowledge that our foreign service nationals in that context to make us awfully proud. i also want to address your comments about texas a&m. for proposing in this budget increase in our agricultural research and development as relates to meeting the needs and some of these prior countries and food security. with respect. >> reconstruction, the contract you referred to, i wouldn't point out for usaid we have a shifting strategy where we are moving toward supporting the elections that are upcoming and providing a real support to the government and the health system. and other community basic means and the needs of population. if we are more aggressively pursuing matching fund requirements to make sure that our resources are being matched by the government of iraq and we
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have a strong financial accountability and procurements systems in place that are tracked closely in that context. in general -- >> excuse me dr. shah, are these accountability -- procedures new? were the same ones? >> many of them are new over the course of the last. some are based on learning, there are four basic strategies we used to track ensure accountability. i agree they could be more transparent and that's my party to make them more transparent. we have rigorous systems for making sure we work with those partners especially in pakistan where we can track the resources and have confidence in effectiveness of spending in the second is capacity building particularly its procurements systems both reform and tracking here a third is on monitoring and a fourth is on auditing which we do in a multiple of manner system in those places. >> thank you dr. shah. >> the time has expired, the
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gentleman from new york is recognized for five minutes. >> thank you mr. chairman. good morning dr. shah. it's great having you here and i think q4 your efforts especially in helping haiti with the aftermath that devastating earthquake. you talked about how complex it is in dealing with haiti. i would like first to ask the question, can you describe for us the international aspect of the effort to help haiti's? specifically the causation of funds, who is leading the effort, word we go from here and what role can the haitian government play and had we support that government until it has the capacity to take on more on most of the responsibility? i know there is a number of the international community is calling for a he the marshall plan and i myself have put in a resolution calling for a he t.
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marshall plans live like to know what your thoughts are on whether or not we need to do that clearing call and whether he needs a marshall plan? and then i just want to ask also in the short time that we have about african latinos, you know that the obama administration has finalized a signing of the u.s. columbia joint action plan on racial and ethnic equality and we had one on brazil which i passed your report on that so we can continue to follow that. i know we're still making progress, but over the years i've requested appropriations from the usaid that we specifically help rationalize communities inland america and more often than not a those are disproportionately africa latinos and indigenous populations so i'd like to know can you tell me about your plans to address the plight of african latinos and indigenous populations and have you prior
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to rice of plans from the budget perspective it? finally in a real briefly, and also concerned about training capacity dollars so can you tell me if there are any plans for more consequence of we training capacity across the departments that have these funds? i propose to that we create an office for trade capacity coordination and add my tanagra thoughts of this kind of function. >> thank you for those comments and questions. i will start with haiti. the international aspect is being led by the government of haiti working with internationally recognized system of un's clusters establish sector by sector. we play a key role in each of the clusters and directly with the government and we also in some cases like rubble removal for the establishment as safe place in advancing where the budget is coming in or in food distribution and water distribution at times when
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frankly we felt the clusters needed more support we stepped in and offer more capacity and director of leadership from our military civilian partnership in haiti. so that is how it is chlorinated on the international aspect. the haitian government has had a pl@@@@@@@ ",b build a packing more vibrant and more effective economy, government system and ability to meet human needs in port-au-prince and perhaps more
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portly the majority of the population outside of port-au-prince. in terms of your comments about african latinos in the western hemisphere it's absolutely true company recognized by our agency that those marginalized communities are disproportionately suffering on health and human indicators as welfare and well-being and throughout the hemisphere and that's a clear and statistically history for a point. i will come back to more specifically on how our budget addresses that by and our efforts to dress whose attorney, global health and meeting space -- meeting human needs which are disproportionately targeting those marshall as populations, how that plays out in terms of budget numbers i will come back to more specifically. finally entrée capacity building in coordination, i do believe that we need a more effective coronation in that context. we've been in a conversation as part of the directive and in efforts like aref and security initiative to explore how we can
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improve the integration of our trade policy, trade capacity investment and our investment in agriculture and high-value ever closer to get more bang for our buck. >> the time has expired and the gentleman from new jersey and mr. smith is recognized. >> thank you for your testimony. about 12 years ago dr. shah your initiative and effort on the issue of autism and a time when very few people paid attention to it and it led to the creation of centers of excellence -- i wrote the provision for the centers of disease control and we quickly found that we may have an epidemic of about one add of every 100 of our children have autism or part of the best burgers spectrum. i have since been focusing on the national elements of autism and to my not shocking but certainly to and many others this way, have realized that we have a global epidemic of
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autism. i'm working with a number of ngos in kenya, indonesia, poland and ireland trying to combat autism and all of these organizations have a is a deficiency in funding. lots of thoughts, a lot of good expertise, but lack of funding. i've introduce legislation h.r. 1878 about a year ago that would have a small grant program and also a teachers program and am asking if he would take a good long hard look at these ngos. am sure you have the authority, absent the legislation to assist these ngos and i will give you one on autism in nigeria. i know some involved with ngo there, they suggest there may be as many as a million nigerians who have autism. i would ask you to take a good hard look at this and provide some assistance there. secondly on your three priority areas to talk about instability
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from rapid population growth and i would respectfully request you take a second look at the issue of the population. and places all all over europe, russia, the u.n. estimates by the year 205025% of our population than that which currently exists in russia, sam way with the eastern european countries, we're seeing a depopulation trend and the reason why the aggregate continues to grow is we're living longer. not about birth, it's about the other side of the spectrum. south korea there are so far below replacement japan has the same problem that they're looking at a serious this proportionality when it comes to workers and those who are on the other end of the spectrum receiving benefits so i think your underlying assumption has been surpassed in many ways by a depopulation trend that is very injurious to individual countries and in china where the sex selection abortions has led
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to gender sided with 100 million missing girls, in whole unique set of problems has developed near as many as 40 million men will not able to find wives by 2020 because they are gone and dead as a result of sex selection abortion. ..
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i would be happy to look at the ngo's you are proposing and we can do that in a systematic manner. i do believe the principles of the global health initiative which is to broaden the scope of how we think about supporting health systems in setting priorities based on medical need and based on what are the biggest lagging indicators against development goals will help guide our work in the health sector overall going forward and i appreciate your comments on that issue. on instability from population growth, i do believe the 2050 population projections are significant. they do show over 9 billion as a global population and they i think consistent with your comments they show those increases will happen in certain parts of the world in certain parts of the world will stay flat and in some cases decrease, so i appreciate that and we will take a nuanced look at that very
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specifically. some of your comments related to gender and girls in that context which is an immediate priority for our team and for the secretary and abstract eric fistula i believe for global health of skilled attendance at birth than focusing on the needs of women and girls will create a strong strategic priority in that space. thank you. 's be the time of the gentleman has expired. the gentleman from georgia, \mr.{~}{-|}\mister scott is recognized for five minutes. >> thank you \mr.{~}{-|}\mister chairman. dr. shah let me first of all commend you and the obama administration for the very quick response to the situation in haiti. i would like to ask you a few questions about that if i may. first of all, as of today, how much money has usaid spent in the disaster relief in haiti? >> i believe the overall federal
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commitment has been just over $600 million, maybe just over 600 and 30 million. of that amount, i think usaid has been approximately 350 million with the majority of the alternative part of that being department of defense spending. >> and which leads to my next question, where has that money been spent by category? >> i would have to provide you more specific rate down but the more areas have been a disaster relief account which immediately supported priorities for urban search-and-rescue. we sent our to train international search-and-rescue teams but also for five other teams that were stood up by fema so that we had at any one time more than 500 american search-and-rescue professionals with heavy equipment and specialized training at work for an extended period of time. we made significant investments in the health space spending resources to take disaster assistance team from the department of health and human services and put them in place,
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supporting the treatment of more than 30,000 haitians in that context and then food and water were immediate priorities that accounted for a large bulk of that spending. we successfully supported the discretion of food to more than 3 million people who are at risk and had some have some immediate and aggressive procurements to make sure people had as much access to water in the camps as possible. we think we successfully met the needs around water and that was a big concern in the early moments of those up in the big areas of disaster assistance spending and in addition to that the department of defense with its personnel and its other resources and the comfort hospital ship also cost items we are tracking. >> going forward dr. shah, where do you feel the priority should be now? where is where's the greatest need now for the people of haiti? >> the immediate needs are into areas. one is in the collective effort to remove rubble from and other
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waste from critical sites, whether they are elevated sites where people could live or whether they are drainage systems that will be critical when it rains, and link to that of shelter and sanitation. we are aggressively pursuing those three priorities with the common goal of reaching every haitian was shelter materials first by march 8 and then an expanded set of materials by april 8. that is a top priority in the second priority is public health. we have vaccinated more than 150,000, trying to reach 150,000 and have reached 80,000 so far in advance of the rainy season. >> there have been some reports coming to us from haiti that in our efforts to really move forward and help them particularly in our food export area and particularly in the area of rice which is a major farming product of the farmers in haiti, and there has been some concern that maybe our
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efforts to do that have undermined the basic farmers in haiti because we have oversupplied the market and thereby putting disincentives in for the haitian people themselves and farming to produce their own food. can you give us an assessment of that situation and what are we doing to make sure we correct that? >> it is an incredibly important.. what we did is initially upon sending food we also sent some experts who could track market prices of different food commodities including rice, vegetable oils beans and track the flow of charcoal and cooking supplies and markets to make sure markers to make sure we are pursuing and assistance strategy that did not impede local market systems and resilience. we have been tracking that closely. we do think we have had an aggressive response. the data on the rise and beans and vegetable oil is that we have not had a significant price effect and complementary to this effort we have accelerated our
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major program to support the agriculture sector including trying to get fertilizer support and cedes another agricultural support out to farmers in this farming season and we will continue to track the price of rice closely to make sure we are not distorting incentives for local production and you are right to point that out as a critical issue. >> we do have effective monitoring and evaluation and measurement systems in place to measure what we are doing? >> as best we can in an emergency environment. we were getting wildly different price estimates from different markets which would not take place in the normal setting so we are doing our best. >> thank you and i commend you for your excellent work. see the time of the gentleman is expired and the gentleman is recognized. >> secretary clinton studied that we hope to put ourselves out of the ad business because due to our success countries will no longer need this kind of help. can you give us some examples of
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how a need in initiatives have been successful and permanently breaking the cycle of the pendants by impoverished countries, and also maybe in your answer, microfinance is something i have a lot of interest in. >> certainly, thank you. i think that is the long-term goal for anyone in the assistance business, which is to put ourselves out of assistance because countries effectively graduate. the most commonly cited examples are not always the most generalizable ones like western europe after the world war and after the marshall plan for south korea and some other east asian and east asian economies that were usaid beneficiaries and now are becoming donor countries. so, that is an important example and we are trying to learn lessons from there to apply elsewhere. the guidance and dispense commission report offers a lot of interesting parallels of how we can pursue work differently
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in other parts of the world to achieve those outcomes. in terms of more specifically, areas like global health initiative or are feared security initiative that where we are trying to use that principle in a more sector specific matter so in global health in the country repaired ties we will look at our full fort-- portfolio and partner deeper with countries and in and develop a financial sustainability plan and do our best to identify an exit strategy for our partners in their own financing. at maybe a long exit strategy but an exit strategy so we are not, so we are aiming against the common goal on a more sector specific basis. i appreciate your raising microfinance. this is an important area and the ranking member made reference to the credit authority. we recently completed a transaction that provided credit authority support to microfinance institutions through the grinning bank and its global network. that will leverage more than $160 million and provide
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institutional support to institutions around the world to put resources in the pockets of women and vulnerable populations around the world that have a surprisingly high repayment rate and in the financial system that even though it is banking to the poorest it is an incredibly safe bet to make@@@@@@@)'rr") and this is certainly not true of all areas, but it does seem like there is a duplication of services. you get into turf battles where usaid is doing a certain
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function and you see duplicative activities by perhaps another branch of the state department. do you see that is a problem? is that something you have experienced and if so how do we solve that problem and how do we get people to sidetrack it right now all of us being so aware of the finances, the limited finances that we have god. again i would appreciate your comments on how we tackle that problem. >> i appreciate that. there clearly are in certain parts of the world significant duplication of services and what is a clear priority for us is trying to get to a place where we are predatory sink outcome and using resources as effectively as possible. i think you do that they really three things. the first is you set clear to set clear and specific development goals and develop
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hierarchies, and we are expanding our efforts to do that both in our hiring of expertise that usaid ended developing better policy planning and evaluation systems. the second is, we aspire to serve as a whole of government platform two-point resources against those goals and an efficient and not non-duplicative manner. the learnings from haiti accelerate the need to do that. the health sector in haiti is a good example where we have unique capabilities at the department of health and human services that were brought into the field and we have been able to transition those capabilities to local ngo partners to expand their ability to provide more services to patients. we need more examples of that kind of partnership for effectiveness and outcome. the third is really to focus on scale as we implement our programs, so we have restructured our policy planning to do that on a program by program basis. >> thank you mr. chairman. >> the time of the gentleman has expired and the gentlelady from california is recognized for
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five minutes. >> thank you mr. chairman and dr. shah, welcome. i have really admired your stewardship of usaid. i've been in several i have been in several informational hearings with you, and you give us inspiration that this program is working well. i want to relate now to the lantos hyde act and if you remember it mandated a five-year strategy to treat 4.5 million cases of tuberculosis under the ots and 90,000 multi-drug-resistant tb kate-- tb cases. the global health initiative on the other hand proposes to treat only 2.6 million tb patients and only 57,000 mtr tb cases. moreover tv will soon need new drugs to combat the rise in
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highly resistant tb. so, what specific initiatives are planned to strengthen country responses to reemerge in infectious diseases such as tb and how will tb treatment be incorporated into a health system, strengthening approach. >> thank you. i very much appreciate that. i got my first experience in tuberculosis working on a program and burr south india and number of years ago and recognize how critical and important this issue is and the importance of the legislative targets. i would say the distinction between the targets in terms of the 4.5, 2.6, 90 and 57,000 with respect to npr is primarily i believe the distinction between what we think we can achieve in our bilateral programs with current technology and implementation protocols and what we would hope to achieve by getting more efficiencies out of the global health initiative,
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and we can get those efficiencies in two ways. one is as we repackage our complete programs to be more systems oriented i fully expect especially given the relationship between tb and hiv that will actually have more resources that are currently not counting going towards the joint treatment of tb and hiv and getting those numbers up. the second is i think we will partner better with the global fund and do more shared strengthening investments that would strengthen their capacity and hours to reach tb patients. i believe those numbers, the 2.6 and 57,000 our floors upon which we can build his begets more efficient and as we partner more effectively. the second one i would make is we will increase their research and development investments. i am particularly enthusiastic about new diagnostic technologies that i think will detect tb earlier allowing more cases to be treated in the general platform as opposed to mtr requirements of that would
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lower dramatically the cost of each treatment episode. i also believe with new drugs and treatment protocols over time the length of time needed to treat an mtr patient will come down significantly potentially to as low as nine months and if that happens that would significantly expand our capacities to offer treatment more broadly so we will track these things very closely and try to learn from some of the more innovative efforts taking place around the world with tb. >> are you seeing tb and haiti? >> we have had all kinds of reports. we had a 51 surveillance site system that the centers for disease control has set up with our support tracking diseases. we have not had a big outbreak or any specific reporting in that area but they are out there looking forward and i did see some earlier episodes they thought were tb but then i didn't get the follow-up that indicated it had been confirmed. >> thank you for that. the administration has stressed
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country ownership of the aids projects, aids projects, and that your meaning of this concept is really unclear to us. words such as country based and country led are also in the mix and in addition, aid is coming from me for i.d. of sectors. ghi, pat farr, and the global fund and so forth. can you tell us what country ownership and its many dairy nations means to you in the administration and how will this be reflected in your policies, and can you expand on how health initiatives will be coordinated within countries already receiving other forms of aid in and keeping in mind the country ownership concept? >> thank you. the global health initiative will include all the investments to achieve that goal. quickly the four components of
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ownership to us our country plan, specific guidance from countries that informs her own strategic investment and restructuring our contracts and programs to abide by those guidances and sharing data information and personnel against a common strategy and learning platform. i am enthusiastic about my ability to work with tom frieden at the cdc and erica goos be in order to do that more effectively going forward. >> we are out of time. thank you so much. >> the time of the gentlelady has expired and we recognize the gentleman from california, mr. sherman for five minutes. >> i believe in foreign aid development because it is the right thing to do but we are told to go to our districts and sell it as a necessary component in the war on terrorism, something we do for national security not just out of generosity. frankly, if the american people were convinced that it was only all true a stick, i think we would have an even more
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difficult time selling foreign aid. now, the proponents of foreign aid put forward the idea that any alleviation of poverty in the world reduces terrorism. this fits a western orality view of the world. we all desperately want to live in a reasonable world. so something like terrorism must be that just and reasonable response of desperate people who are desperately poor. unfortunately we live in an unreasonable world. poverty does not correlate with international terrorism. both be christmas day bomber and bin laden come from some of the richest and most powerful families in the world and a majority of those who struck us on 9/11 come from a country that has received far more infusions of cash then usaid has ever dreamed of putting into one country or all countries.
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namely saudi arabia. they were middle and upper-middle-class kids from a country that gets an awful lot of american cash. somalia is kind of a separate case, but looking at the world as a whole, the poorest 10% of the world's people cause less than 10% of the international terrorism. so, simple poverty alleviation itself cannot be justified as a good investment in the global war on terrorism. another problem we have is the bureaucracy of usaid. it took strong political push to get them to put the flag on the back. they did not want to say, this aid is from the american people. they just wanted to give out the aid. so many of your staff are people that wanted to work at oxfam but wanted a retirement plan.
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what can you do to make sure that when we select the countries and the projects, when we design each part of that project, and when we publicize the efforts and decide how much resources to put into publicity rather than putting the money and telling the people that you are doing good that we are in fact honest with the american people that this is an effort to win the global war on terrorism and to protect them. because, as good a goal as alleviation of world poverty is, and as much as i would supported i don't support telling the american people we are doing it to stop terrorism and then failing to select, design and publicized so that we really are. if even your elected drucker see, what are you doing? >> thankb. thank yous or for tht comment.
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i do believe that our budget presentation prioritizes the intersection of the development investments in specific places in parts of specific civilian and military strategies that are designed to defeat al qaeda and support a stronger and more effective local security environment for our country. it is why we present our budget in the context in afghanistan and pakistan, where that is being carried out as a frontline state. i would also note that we have looked carefully at the data following the intimations and ami and i doubt you were involved in it, with the relief effort. the branding effort around usaid 's giving in that context more than doubled our favorability rating among the intonation people and in that same six-week period after this nominee reduced by half the favorability of the indonesian people. >> i have limited time. i would like your answer and i hope you will extend it for the
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record. i just want to urge you to do everything it can to make sure every aspect of design and selection reflects what we are telling the american people and i want to put forward one idea. in the impoverished world people have to pay for kids textbooks. if we were to print all the elementary school and middle school textbooks a we could make sure the content, while not entirely politically correct perhaps from an american perspective is good and secondly would be helping education and third we would we-- we would be reducing corruption because it is hard to steal textbooks and turn them into cash. >> thank you. >> the time of the gentleman has expired. the gentleman from california, mr. costa is recognized. >> thank you very much mr. chairman for this important hearing and thank you dr. shah for the good work you are doing. i want to cover your efforts and a host of countries that were focused and i would like some
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quick responses. obviously it was noted earlier about our efforts with regard to gaza and the west bank. how would you assess the results of the infusion does far of aid that has been provided and the palestinians ability to absorb the large amount of american aid , quickly. >> we track that very carefully. >> we made note of that earlier. how would you assess it? >> i think there has been more success in some areas than others. there hasthere is that there han success in infrastructure and development of road networks and building schools and there have been successes and health. in particular building a stronger health system and i think there are real challenges especially in gaza where there for a brady of the reasons have been issues with both transport mobility of goods and individuals as well as some interference, and so there is much to do to improve the effectiveness of those efforts and we are working for a tuple medic channels to help improve
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that. >> i would like to provide a letter written, both of those challenged areas. in afghanistan and pakistan obviously those are harsh environments. many of us have visited those countries in the past. it is mind standing that usaid personnel were only there for a year@@@@ related. >> that could be an administrative change could that? >> we have to balance that with our recruiting and process of
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making sure we have enough numbers. >> wouldwhat if an individual ds in pakistan or afghanistan they would like to stay beyond the year? >> they absolutely can if they would like to. >> as-- i have had experience with some folks from my area and have taken the time and contributed to build a hospital in afghanistan outside of kabul. i have seen where some of the money has been spent by us where we have had a lot of problems with corruption. it just seems to me that we don't have that right it right yet in terms of how whether we are building a road or building or school or housing or in this case a hospital. for $2 million they are able to build a state-of-the-art hospital, 100 and 20-- 120 beds with no corruption involved. whether you guys doing to figure out how you can avoid or learn from past mistakes?
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>> first i will say i am aware of that hospital and appreciate the advanced but that represents in the work for members of your district. i do think our work in afghanistan is tracked quite closely. health is a good sector example. we were very selective in working with the ministry of health. it took a number of years to build the procurement system and other tracking systems to give us the confidence we can enter into the agreement we entered into with them last year. we have now started to flow resources through that ministry, but we track every procurement action quite carefully. we monitor every strategic decision and in addition to that we have a series of audits that take place both from our ig and the special inspector general to major that those resources are being spent effectively. as a result of our health sector investments we believe we have more than tripled access to the health access for afghanistan, for the population of afghanistan and we think that is a tremendous achievement.
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we are optimistic. >> quickly before my time expires, mr. chairman i would like to see more work as it relates to determining how well we are applying the smart power and to ensure that the money is going into the right places. which brings me to iraq. what would you say as we ramp down and usaid ramps up in iraq are the lessons learned from the experience the department of defense? >> wells the or i think there are a broad range of lessons learned. some related contracting in the risks of very large and poorly supervised. >> you are going to sue apply those lessons? finally what you think your biggest do you think your biggest challenges are this year? >> our efforts in afghanistan and pakistan in haiti as well as our health and food efforts, when you put that together will severely strain our workforce so building a strong workforce and our ability to do that will be critical to success.
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>> thank you very much. >> thank you mr. costa. the gentleman's time has expired and now the gentleman from minnesota, mr. alice is recognized for five minutes. >> let me add my voice to everyone for the speedy response in haiti. i represent minneapolis, minnesota and we have a large somali community there. they are all, not all but mostly all concerned about what is going on in somalia. and i realize that the u.s. reduced its funding to somalia last year after ofac expressed fear that the extended supply line and insurgent heavy areas were operating that it could be diverted to al qaeda linked groups, but on the other side of the coin, the people in the u.n. have expressed concern about that because it results in a net reduction to food to people who
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needed desperately. what are the things that you think could be done to straighten the situation out, and do you care to offer some views on this? >> certainly, thank you. first i will start by saying we will follow and respect the law and the guidance around protecting and stewarding effectively u.s. resources. we have been in a very in-depth conversation with the world food program and they are our primary food distribution partners as you point out that they have been clear with us that this is not, that our policies are not impeding in any way their capacity to distribute food at this time. they are not distributing food margaret sibley in southern somalia for their own safety, security and logistics capacity to do so in a difficult operating environment. so that is not the current constraint. we will work with them if that
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becomes the constraint and they have the ability to distribute food that we have offered to them. if they agree to do that then we will work with them to make sure we have a policy in place that supports those efforts. >> i'm going to submit this article for the record with unanimous consent or go. >> without objection. >> i will send it to you and perhaps we can flush out a stronger answer because i would like to get to the bottom of this because it seems there was some sort of a technical requirement that we are being restricted and i am sure you are aware of the complaint. it sounds like you are saying it maybe is not a valid complaint. >> i am sorry, what i was suggesting is we will work through that and we are now in a different circumstance. the circumstance they are in right now and we are in direct communication is that that is not an operating issue any more. >> that is great. next, thank you for their work
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that you do to support the people in gaza. do you think that usaid could be more effective at its work if usaid personnel were able to enter gaza? have you reviewed a process by which usaid personnel might actually be able to enter not just work through surrogates? >> as a general principle, we do believe that our presence allows for improved effectiveness. we are reviewing a broad range of things we can do to improve the operations in gaza that include working with partner agencies, u.n. agencies more aggressively and working with diplomatic channels to reduce some of the issues. >> forgive me sir, i am sorry doctor. usaid is working through circuits now. i want to know do you thing it would be an advantage to having usaid personnel in gaza since we are our ready and other tough
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areas like afghanistan and iraq and others'? >> i think the core constraint for us right now is actually mobility, getting items in and a series of specific issues with respect to interference from hamas and others in that environment. in that context it is not clear that sending our people and is the immediate resolution to that. i think the immediate resolution solving those problems as a precondition for that so we are working with others to do that. i am happy to review that more specifically though and come back to you with a more specific answer. >> yeah and usaid does operate in gaza, and do you feel that an rot is doing all it can to keep materials and supplies away from hamas? >> we believe it is an incredibly important partner and needs to be successful with their partners so we work in
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coordination with them. i think we all can do a better job in any number of things in god's which is a different -- make difficult operating area. >> the time of the gentleman has expired and the gentleman from new york is recognized for five minutes. >> thank you mr. chairman and director it is good to see you again and i've want to join in the chorus of all those who have thank you and your agency for the work you are doing in haiti and resolving, responding to the emergency there as well and the people of chile and need your assistance as well. america is doing that, and you put a little polish on the reputation of our country in being able to respond in an effective manner and that is something the american people are grateful for. i also want to thank you for your assistance in the search-and-rescue team to get down to haiti and the resolution
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under the chairman's leadership commanding usaid and the civilian emergency response team as well as the military response team and we are grateful for that. dr. shah i want to follow-up on the gaza questions that my colleague from minnesota was asking. the presidents request included $400.4 million in economic assistance for the west bank and gaza. to "matt strength in the palestinian authority as a credible partner in middle eastern peace and continue to respond to humanitarian needs in gaza. to request dates that this assistance will "matt provide significant resources to support the stability of the palestinian authority, economic development of the west bank and increase the capacity of the palestinian authority to meet the needs of its people. dr. shah i would like to reiterate the importance of setting this funding and of course according israel. just yesterday the u.n. undersecretary for humanitarian affairs john holmes dismissed
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hamas' cross-border raid. the kidnapping of staff sergeant and hamas' call to israel's destruction by condemning israel. of course he completely neglected to mention the fact that despite hamas' aggression israel allows daily shipments of food medicine and supplies. given a statement sent to follow-up my colleague from minnesota how will usaid make sure that this funding does not end up in the hands of terrorists, specifically when we are partnering with organizations like unra. what sort of safeguards are in place if you can be as specific as possible and also if you could provide an assessment of the effectiveness of usa to the palestinians over the past several years. which economic projects have been effective and which have not? as u.s. assistance helped increase popular support for moderate palestinians in the west bank, a goal which we all support and what role does the
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united states aid hope to strengthen government institutions in the west bank? basically are we making a positive impact? >> thank you for those comments with respect to aid in your questions with respect to gaza and the west bank and israel. we do have, as i noted, we have a very rigorous system for vetting partners and for tracking any cash disbursements all the way through to bear and use. on partner vetting, we have a very sophisticated system that has been in place for more than two years attracts the names of all of our partners that clearly that's all key personnel and in a partner organization against a larger database and that allows us to follow-up on any positive hits that occur in that striking system. after we get any positive hits we have an aggressive process of investigation and review before going forward. so that is a very robust system.
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the cash tracking system is similarly robust. we track any authorized disbursements. we transfer resources through an israeli-based banking account into a special treasury account and a palestinian bank and then monitor all flows out of that account by every single disbursement being track specifically to its end-use. most of these disbursements, all of these disbursements are used to pay off creditors as soon as those resources go back out to other places. the question with respect to how are we coordinating with other partners and what can we do to improve effectiveness, i will just say i spoke to john holmes before he went to make the point you are making better goal is about effectiveness in that environment and that we need to look at the whole picture. it is the prm program that primarily partners with unra and not usaid although we believe that is an important partnership going forward.
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we will continue to have the safeguards in place. on effectiveness, there is some areas we think have been more effective than others, health and education and perhaps more effective than some full portfolio of infrastructure investments, although there have been some success stories there as well in the west bank in particular. in gaza with mostly humanitarian missions, it is a different operating environment. >> the time of the gentleman has expired and an impressive and-- impressive show of efficiency of time mr. conway, 45 seconds after entering the room is recognized for five minutes of questioning. >> thank you mr. chairman. i'm sorry i'm late that we had a weekly breakfast meeting with the speaker and it went a little bit over so i'm pleased to-- dr. shah for allowing me to come in late and allowing me to continue nonetheless. dr. shah, what one of the
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concerns i certainly have a 90 other members of the committee do as well as that in some ways usaid has been hollowed out in the last decade. and, i would hope that part of your mission is to turn that around. he had secretary clinton here ã, are so substantial, one is concerned about what could go wrong.
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may be preferably we would have them in the hands of professionals. i wonder if you could address that whole question of how do we consolidate, how do we make sure you are the go-to person for bilateral and multilateral assistance and we make any i.d. into a cutting edge development agency that actually does something and isn't just a place that facilitates contracts with others? >> thank you very much for that comment and that statement. i believe that right now is an incredibly unique time to seize the opportunity. we have a president and secretary and administrator completely committed to that goal and we have such strong leadership and support in the congressional committees and in congress to achieve that outcome. i also believe development is a discipline and i think it is a professional mull discipline that has the needs to benefit constantly from the learnings of the past and the learning
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learnings of the present and we need to represent excellence in the practice of that discipline on behalf of all development activities. our game plan for reestablishing our effectiveness in their transparency and their accountability and our operational excellence it's really to focus on a handful of strategic priorities. we will focus work in afghanistan and pakistan and try to show clear results against clear strategic metrics. in haiti and our series of key issues like health, food security and climate change. in each of these areas usaid can show through restructuring how we do our work that we can have more impact for less, that we can serve as a whole of government platform that invites and other partners in a matter-- manner directed against specific outcomes and makes tough choices about how we use resources so we get the most bang for the buck and are spending as we have tried to do with the relief effort around haiti. we are also pursuing a set of
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operational improvements and i want to thank the congress for its leadership in allowing us to have the development leadership initiative and rebuild the actual warren service corps which you are right to point out has been decimated over the past 15 years. we think we have a strong position. we have more than 4000 servers nationals that represent people with ph.d.'s and medical degrees and are entirely capable leaders that any other private company would think of is a tremendous as a tremendous core asset for a more globally impacted world. we need to rebuild our foreign service. we are doing at the midcareer technical level and do the dli. >> if i may interrupt you, count me as an ally in that effort. believe development agency as far as i'm concerned as has to be usaid not the state department. you are the hands-on guys, you are the people with experience and you just enumerated that in that is what we have to work with. in my 49 seconds left one thing i want to put in your cab usaid
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does provide funding to andy i do various bigots. one of the concerns i have had about their work is the modernization works from the bottom up and not the top down. i would like to see a much enhanced effort at working with the local governance in those programs. quite frankly i think we haven't done such a good job over the years and doing that. we have tried but it is a hard mechanism but they are going to take the lead from where the money flows and i would hope you take a look at that. if we really mean it about democratization the place you build that is at the local level. thank you mr. chairman. my time is up. >> the gentleman's time has expired and i thank him for echoing some of my sentiments on these issues, and an unusual occurrence. and, given the time, if it is
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all right with you i'm going to recognize myself-- no, i am sorry, mr. rohrabacher is here. you are next mr. rohrabacher. the gentleman is recognized for five minutes. >> thank you mr. chairman. how much aid have we provided to afghanistan since 2001? >> i am not sure the precise number since 2001. >> how much have we provided this year? >> this year we are proposing in the fy2011 budget that we would be spending 3.9 billion dollars, and that is down from 4.4 billion in 2010 when you include the supplemental amount with the inactive amount. >> okay, and how much will we be providing iraq?
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>> i believe that is going down as well from $700 million to $400 million but i will doublecheck those numbers for you. >> so iraq-- what are some of the programs we are spending 400 million for in iraq? >> which programs are priorities in iraq? our immediate priority is support for the elections and successfully completing the elections and we are also supporting the potential government transitions and ministries who support contracts that will work in the aftermath, currently up and running but will continue through that critical or to six months. back after the election and in addition to that we have a number of programs in health and education, economics and agriculture in particular. >> do you have the figures with you in terms of how much we have spent, how much aid has been spent in iraq since the liberation?
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>> i am my fingertips t i will follow-up on that. >> maybe you can tell us of the almost $4 billion, $3.9 billion that will be spent in afghanistan what are some of the programs that afghanistan will be receiving? >> sure. have restructured our afghanistan portfolio to be aligned with and very much a part of the president afghanistan strategy. we had two major strategic reviews in march of last year and then december when the president strategy was announced by the president. the priorities going forward are agriculture, which is the largest employer of individuals outside of the government in afghanistan. our investments investments they are have peaked this year at around $820 million and will come down to $425 million in the 2011 spending but that continued pipeline of investment will be the single greatest investment
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in growth activity sectors in agriculture and we are encouraged by some of the early outcomes with respect to performance in that sector. we also have major investments in both continue with major investments in health and education. the health sector is a sector we are partnering with the ministry of health. it has been a number of years in the making to develop a robust partnership with strong auditing trails and financial accountability for our spending and our priorities are on building an effective tertiary old system and primary health system and getting health access out into the rural areas to serve the needs of women and children in particular to most effectively reduce some of the disproportionate health arms in that context. we have a broader range of activities in partnership with other departments in the state department that include security, rule of law and counternarcotics but the aid administered programs will focus in the areas i describe.
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other economic growth priorities include roads and power as well. >> have we had-- how much did you say is being spent on agriculture? >> fy2010, when you include the supplemental is around 820 and the fy2011 request is around 425 that is agriculture and food security, and including alternative livelihoods in rural communities, not including counternarcotic activities. >> could you give us an example of some of the agricultural spending that we have gotten? >> we have programs-- first we work in partnership with the u.s. department of agriculture providing technical support to the ministries and the public sector and we are very focused on supporting the private sector. we have farmers support programs that are getting seed and fertilizer out to farmers to read voucher-based private sector system. we have programs to help farmers
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produce high-value products like apples and then export them in the region so they have sources of cash and income in addition to the reduction of basic foodstuffs and they are working to develop improved access to agricultural credit though that farmers can support their own pathway out of poverty through development. >> thank you very much mr. chairman. >> i am going to recognize myself for three minutes and mr. smith for three minutes and i just want to follow-up a little more specifically on some of the points raised by my colleague from virginia. in the context of what the secretary is referring to as a key foreign-policy priority, that is development and rebuilding usaid as an institution, specifically could
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you talk about the restoration of a budget development capacity and a policy planning capacity within a.i.d. and also in the rebuilding of the staff with the goal of doubling the number of foreign service officers through the development leadership initiative, you are priorities for hiring and recruitment of new people at a.i.d.? >> thank you mr. chairman. we have a strong effort underway through the partner some of our staff with members of the bureau to identify really a revised and improved budget process that would allow usaid to be financially accountable for the resources that spend so it goes without saying in order to be the world's premier development agency we have to be able to account for our spending and be held to account for resources
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that are spent in a transparent and clear manner, so we are actively working on that through the qddr and other processes. >> what about on the impact of developing-- accountability is very important, but the question is are you handed a budget or do you get to develop a budget? >> we will get to a place where we have the opportunity to develop a budget, working in partnership with others but we clearly need to be able to make strategic resource trade-offs in order to be held accountable for the performance of the agency. on policy planning, similarly sir we are building an active policy planning capacity. i am pleased to announce we have been real leaders in the field from the global development that just joined our team. we hope to have a world-class, innovative that valuation capacity that helps us learn
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from direct program beneficiaries through text messaging, all the way through doing a range of other efforts to do randomized control program trials to understand the impact of our work most effectively and rebuild their policy planning and evaluation capacities. on staff, we have hired 420 individuals do to a dli. we respect the leadership congress has provided. my prayers are to be look at how we do deployment in more rapidly deploy the visuals to our poor strategic operational priority since shorten the length of time that they are and current training program. >> my time is expired. the gentleman from new jersey is recognized for three minutes. >> thank you very much. dr. shah as you know w.h.o. estimates that health care in africa is provided by faith-based organizations. the catholic health care alone in africa constitutes about 40%. we know a number of other groups
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, world vision and others are doing yeoman's warfare. they provide expertise infrastructure trust to the people and an enormous number of volunteers that otherwise might not be fair and their ability to expand its incredible. what is your view of increasing the partnership with faith-based organizations and ngo's especially as it relates to implementing the global health initiative? >> thank you for that observation. i believe the partnerships and bringing those partnerships into a whole health system construct will be critical to the effectiveness of the global health initiative so i would see whether it is in kenya or other countries where there are significant egg-based organizations running hospitals and doing that work and where we are involved in providing support. our goal is to bring that support within the context of the health system and to make those more formally part of the integrated national health plan, so it absolutely involves
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expanding and deepening our partnership. >> i would hope you would be mindful that in some countries where church opposition to human rights abuses have been very strong. when integrated in partnerships and are formed in the government, health ministries and others might be less quick to want to embrace the faith-based community. i would hope that they would play a very positive role in suggesting when it comes to health care, you want the maximum impact certainly and it seems to me, i know places and i have been throughout africa. usually when there is corruption or human rights abuse by a dictatorship or authoritarian regime, it is reflected in other parts of that government when it comes to partnering, so they shun those partnerships in some instances so i would hope we would hope to overcome that. >> thank you. we will. >> finally and 40 in 40 seconds,
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and reading the micro-enterprise results reporting, i understand it is a real problem with meeting to 50% goal for providing microfinancing to the poorest of the poor. could you take a second look at how we might be able to reach out to those ngo's that are actually meeting-- we headed by -- big fight and i know because that was my bill and there was a lot of tugs and give-and-take, but when it comes to the ngo's that are there on the ground providing maximum benefit to the poorest of the poor, the goal is a real one and i think it is achievable so please take a second look at that. >> we will. >> the time of the gentleman has expired, because of the service for our late colleague, congressman murtha we will adjourn the hearing and we thank you very much for being here. we look forward very
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enthusiastically to working with you in the future or co-markup tomorrow at 10:00, and the committee hearing is adjourned. thank you. [inaudible conversations]
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this hearing of the judiciary committee, subcommittee on human law and the rights will come to order top today hearing is global internate freedom and the rule of law part two. after a few opening remarks i'll recognize the senators in attendance for an opening statement and then turn to our witnesses, and we appreciate their attendance. this subcommittee held our first hearing on this issue in may of 2008. at that hearing we learned that repressive governments around the world kreths censor the internet and advocates to express their views online. since then the scale and scope
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of internet censorship increased dramatically. at our hearing two years ago i showed some pictures of censored internet searches on google and yahoo!. today i'm going to demonstrate that unfortunately this censorship not only continues but in many cases is worse. let me start, if i can do this. what you're looking at here on the screen to your left is search for the word tiananmen. you'll find pictures of the famous tiananmen square protest in 1989. especially the iconic photo of a demonstrator standing in front of several tanks. now what you see is,
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google's china search engine, and a search for the same word. tiananmen. here you will find only beautiful postcard images of tiananmen square. let me be clear. i am not singling out google. yahoo! and bing, microsoft's search engine also censor the internet china and the leading chinese search engine censors even more content than these america companies. i want to commend google again for announcing that they plan to stop censoring their chinese search engine. i look forward to an update today on their efforts. and our first hearing we discussed the global network initiative, or gni, which was then being negotiated. the gni is a voluntary code of conduct that requires technology companies to take reasonable measures to present human rights. following the hearing, senator tom coburn, my ranking republican, and i encouraged google, microsoft and yahoo! to
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complete the gni negotiations and the code launched in october of 2008. i want to commend these three companies for their extraordinary leadership in promoting internet freedom. since then i've asked several dozen other companies to consider joining the gni. without objection, the companies written responses will be entered into the hearing record. it also made available on my website. i'm disappointed that a year and a half after the gni started no new companies have joined. base on the responses that i have received, only three companies, at&t, mack afee and skype have been committed to parting in a dialogue about joining the gni. one company, web sense, indic e indicated they're join the gni if the moneyship fee is waived. many told me it's not relative to their company's business. the last two years demonstrated
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that simply not true. the explosive growth of social networking services like twitter and facebook has helped human rights activists organize and publicize human rights violations in iran and other places in the world. however, repressive governments can use these same tools to monitor and crack down on advocates. i invited facebook and twitter to testify today. they refused. last year, the chinese government announced they would require all computers sold in china to include software called green dam, which censors political consent and records user activity. thanks to the opposition from the u.s. government and companies, the chinese government eventually backed down. this incident highlighted the human rights challenges faced by computer manufacturers. i invited hewlett-packard and apple to testify about these challenges today, and they also refused.
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filtering software produced by american companies has allegedly been used to censor the internet in several countries with repressive governments. i invited mcafee, which produces filtering software to testify today. mcafee initially agreed but on friday informed us they were pulling out. bottom line is this. with a few notable exceptions, the technology industry seems unwilling to regulate itself and unwilling even to engage in a dialogue with congress about the serious human rights challenges that the industry faces. in the face of this resistant, i've decided it's time to take a more active position and our hearing two years ago i indicated that congress could step in, if the industry failed, to take concrete action to protect internet freedom. today i'm announcing i will introduce legislation that would require internet companies to take reasonable steps to protect human rights or face civil or criminal liability. i look forward to working with
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my republican colleague, senator coburn, and my other colleagues to enact this legislation into law. i recognize that the technology industry faces difficult challenges when they deal with repressive governments, but we have a responsibility in the united states and congress shares in that responsibility to ensure that american companies are not complicit in violating freedom of expression, a fundamental human right enshrined in our first amendment of our constitution and the universal declaration of human rights. i recognize my co-chairman. >> narrator: coburn. >> due to being a little under the weather, i'll ask my opening statement be placed in the record. >> do you have any? >> no. i look forward to the hearing. thank you for calling it. >> our first witness, the u.s. government has an important role to play in promoting global internet freedom and ensuring companies do not facilitate
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government repression. i look forward to hearing about the administration's plans to advance freedom of expression around the world. our witnesses will each be given five minutes for an opening statement. their complete written statements made part ever the record and posted online. i'll ask if the witnesses would please stand and raise their right hands to be sworn. do you affirm that the testimony you are about to give before the committee will be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you god? let the record reflect both witnesses answered in the affirmative. our first witness, michael pozner, is the assistant secretary of state for democracy human rights and labor. our government's top human rights official. mr. pozner was previously founding executive director and president of human rights first, which he headed for 30 years. has expectese in corporate, social responsibility and played a key role in founding the global network initiative. mr. posner has a bachelor degree and law degree at berkeley.
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first testified before the subcommittee last year when he held a hearing on the implementation of human rights treaty it's. we're glad he's with us again. our following witness is daniel whitesner. policy development in the commerce department's national telecommunications and information administration and i think he's going to win a prize for the longest title having appeared before the committee. mr. whitesner is one of the nation's lead be experts on policy prior joins. part of the artificial laboratories decentralized information group and policy director of the world wide web connoisseur shum technology and society activities. mr. whitesner was also co-founder and deputy director of the center for democracy and technolo technology, electronic frontier foundation. your resume has to be loaded with titles. terrific. mr. whitesner has a bachelor's degree and law degree from buffalo law school. we thank you as well for joining
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us. mr. posner, would you like to make an opening statement? >> thank you. i want to thank you, senator durbin, senator coburn, for inviting me to testify and for your long-standing interest in this subject. i followed this issue quite closely and the subcommittee's involvement since your part one hearing in 2008. and it's great that you're pursuing this. when you first addressed internet freedom, the primary concern of those testifying were content filtering on the internet and harassment and arrest of digital activists. these problems persist today as secretary clinton highlighted in her january 21st speech on internet freedom, the state department continues to protest the arrest detention and harassment of bloggers in iran, in china, in egypt, vietnam and elsewhere and countries that seek to fit filter accessed information are only becoming more skilled at doing so. these problems persist. but the threats to internet freedom are expanding beyond
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restricting access to content. as again secretary clinton described repressive regimes are co-opting the media tools to crush, descend and deny human rights. the rapid increase in use of mobile phones creates new platforms for connecting people and providing information, it creates new threats to free expression and the free flow of information. we have a major set of challenges. state departments since 2006 has had an internet freedom task force, which has been relaunched as the net freedom task force chaired by two of our undersecretaries. and it is going to oversee the state department's efforts on these issues. i want to just quickly site three aspects of what we're doing. first, advancing internet freedom through programming. our effort is to provide
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unfettered information to communication. beginning in 2008 the bureau of democracy human rights and labor, which has implement $15ds million in programming to support internet freedom ip#,&i' and country reports. one of the things we're going to do in the coming year is review the reporting process and improve and expand on internet freedom reporting, which is an essential piece of what we need to be doing. we're going to make the reports more accessible to people around
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the world who have limited access to the internet and we're going to increase the capacity of our embassy officers to monitor and respond when there are threats to internet freedom. and that's really the third aspect of what we're doing. responding. it's unfortunately too often the case that those who were involved in human rights and other advocacy are themselves targeted because of their advocacy and those who are using the internet and social networking sites are being attacked precisely because they're communicating effectively. last, for example -- last fall when a popular social networking site was blocked in vietnam, we raised the issues with officials in hanoi and in washington. when bloggers in countries such as china and vietnam and egypt and iran are threatened, we speak out publicly on their behalf. this is an important part of what we can and need to be doing.
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i want to just say at last comment, and it relates to what you spoke about senator durbin in your opening. this is about issue where the government has a role but the private sector also has a role. as you noted, i was involved before coming into government in the creation of the global network initiative, which is a multistakeholder initiative that brings together companies, ngos, academic experts and social investing firms. i think it's really critical that we and you work to figure out ways for companies to step up and take responsibility here. we can't do it alone, and companies acting alone can't make a difference. there needs to be a collective response, and i'm personally very committed as are others in the state department, to trying to find ways to work collectively with the private sector to make a difference in this area. thank you very much. >> chairman durbin, ranking
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member coburn, members of the subcommittee, thank you for this invitation to testimony on behalf of the department of commerce and the national telecommunications and information administration. i'll work on shortening titles. on the global challenges facing the internet industry, as an advocate of economic growth innovation and exports, the department of commerce's goal is to is a sort a global open internet as a platform for the free flow of information of goods and services. the department of commerce is committed to our role as partnered with u.s. companies large and small as they grapple with the challenges of operating in countries that reject openness, transparency and the free flow of information. the great innovative energy of the internet is due to the fact that even the smallest u.s. internet start-ups can be reached by users all over the world. with this strength we must also recognize the u.s. companies can become the target of arbitrary foreign laws even if they have no offices in that country. today we'll summarize the challenges we see facing u.s. companies, discuss the
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importance of transparency.the internet and the update you on the commerce department's activities to support a commercial robe bufrt and transparent internet. let me highlight three major threats that we see very briefly. first, u.s. company, often pressured to blog or filter internet consent on communications absent evidence of illegality based on rules unclear, unwritten and lack due process or transparency. second, some governments would require that internet service providers to assist in electronic surveillance without due process or adequate judicial supervision putting these companies in untenable situations they shouldn't have to face. u.s. companies, third, risk being the victims of hacking attempts sponsored by overseas criminals, foreign governments or loose knit groups of both working together. in this area, era of globally integrated computing platforms, security threats in one country can put the entire global enterprise at risk. worse, securities become a
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pretext often for forced compliance with government imposed technically deficient standards, disadvantaging u.s. companies which support global standards and putting the entire internet at risk. unfair treatment of internet users and providers threatens the internet's fundamental modus ap ran dye, transbarreny. rapid innovation of the internet and applications that run on it. despite recent attention to vulnerabilities in the internet inf infrastructure, we must not lose sight that enables us to communicate through a common platform. transbarrensy at the heart of the internet's suction. looking forward the commerce department will continue its sectionful tradition of developing government industries civil society partnerships supporting internet development. we've been heartened by the global initiatives ongoing efforts. the government must be a full partner in this effort we
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believe standing up for individuals and businesses when the free flow of information and human rights are threatened. ensuring that the internet is open for innovation and social progress is a vital priority for the department. in the early months of the new administration we assembled a cross department internet policy task force whose mission is to identify leading public policy and operational challenges in the internet environment. our task force leverages expertise across many bureaus including international communications policy, trade, intellectual and corporate responsibility. work began with developing a new internet privacy and cyber security framework. the task force convened consult aces with major u.s. corporations and innovators across academia and civil society. we've added consideration of global trade barriers along with online copyright enforcement. in the coming months outreach continues as the task force issues notices of inquiry.
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based on the feedback the task force focuses on these challenges and continue to an administration-wide policy development. in closing from my own experience the internet was created and has grown because of a unique combination of cooperation and transparency. academic and commercial research you know came together in create and extend the underlying internet technology. at the internet grew it was often cooperative efforts of industry, civil society and government that came together to solve hard social and legal problems. the threats of the free flow of information on the internet are serious. we should look to solve them as much as possible with the unique cooperative transparent spirit that gave us the internet in the first place. i thank you again for the opportunity to be here and for your long-standing attention to this important issue and look forward to your questions. >> thanks a lot. we asked facebook to come, and they replied by saying, we have no business operations in china, or for that matter in most of the countries of the world.
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went ton say, as a young start-up, our resources and influence are limited. we do not have the resources to devote to gni membership. but here are the facts. facebook has over 400 million users, which makes it the second most viewed website in the world. about 70% of facebook users are outside the united states. facebook has over 1,000 employee, hundreds of millions of dollars in annual revenues and is worth billions of dollars. that is hardly a mom and pop flation can't afford to be part of gni, and facebook acknowledges that it engages in censor ship. in their letter, i quote, when consequent shared from a particular jurisdiction violates that jushg dictions local laws or customs facebook may take down that content. mr. posner, it's my understanding facebook recently asked the state department for help when blocked in jeet knap and you responded by raising the ish a you with the vietnamese
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government. is has right? >> yeah. we have responded a number of companies have come to us, facebook is one of them, and we are obviously trying to promote internet freedom. so we're trying to be cooperative with all. >> facebook expects our government to help in resolving efforts to censor their service, seems reasonable they accept some responsibility themselves for addressing human rights issues. mr. posner, does facebook face human rights challenges such as censorship that gni would address? >> yeah. you know, again, i don't want to single out one particular company, but i think it's fair to say that companies like facebook and twitter are certainly susceptible to a lot of the pressures that we've seen others face. technology's changing. the world is changing. government are getting much more aggressive from trying to regulate and control content. i think it's a -- >> i don't want to single out one company either. let me single out another one. let's take twitter. in a letter to me twitter
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expressed confidence they were having a positive impact on human rights. i believe that. they said, i quote, twit sir a triumph of humanity not  technology. helped activists organize and publicize human rights violation but they also face human rights challenges. for example, reports the iranian government is tracking down opposition activities, of those who use twitter. however in their letter to me twitter declined to join the gni saying i quote it is our initial sense that gni's draft policies processes and fees are better suited to bigger companies who have actual operations in sensitive regions, end of quote. mr. posner, does twitter face human rights challenges that the gni could address? >> yes, they do. and you know, i think one of the things that makes the gni to me an important part of the solution here is that companies are going to learn from each other. there's not one company that's going to have a monopoly on creativity or thoughts about how
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to deal with this. they need to work collectively, and that's part of what this initiative is designed to do. >> in our next panel, an iranian blogger, a witness today, says, and i quote in this testimony, it was not the iranian government who shut down my website. it was the domain and host provider in the united states that did it. end of quote. testimony by rebecca mckinnon, another witness on our second panel indicates that the u.s. web hosting companies denied service to political opposition groups in zimbabwe and syria. wrap can be done to ensure u.s. sanctions and export controls do not prevent the u.s. companies from providing internet technology and services like website hosting to human rights and democracy activists living under repressive governments? >> as you know, mr. chairman, the jurisdiction for export controls is shared between the commerce department. we enforce our export
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administration regulations and other rules that the state department as well as the treasury department. as the services such as twitter and others that you mentioned that don't employ any encryption software on the user end, as far as we understand, those services are freely available around the world with, from the perspective of u.s. regulations. obviously, as you note, other countries may block access to those service, but the commerce department's export administration regulations do not prevent anyone in the world from using a service like twitter. that is because it's a service that's based on the web. it doesn't require the installation of software. it's also the case that under commerce department regulations, publicly available, downloadable software with inkrepgs can be used widely. >> let me ask about another issue that's related. some commentators expressed concern about the appearance that the state department is too close to some american internet
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companies. for example, last week twitter's ceo jack dorsey was the member of an deutsche state department delegation to russia. top state department officials used twitter to post details about their personal lives. technology expert says and i quote, the kind of message it sends to the rest of the world that google, facebook and twitter are now extensions of the u.s. state department may simply endanger the lives of those who use such services in our third world countries. it's hardly surprising the iranian government begun to rescrew all twitter users with suspicion. mr. posner, are you concerned about the perception that the state department is too close to fis like twit around facebook and how can we combat the impress these company, just an arm of our government? >> i think we have to be able to work in multiple ways as a government. the fact that there are these social networking sites or internet sites that deploy or allow information to be
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disseminated quickly means that they're a tool for all governments and for private citizens. we shouldn't reject that. but at the same time, i think we have to be clear that there's a separation between government and these private companies. they don't -- they're not part of the government, and there are certain obligations we have to hold their feet to the fire to be acting responsibly as companies. we need to be really operating in multiple tracks here, not deny ourselves the ability to use the excellent tools that they provide, but at the same time keeping the lines clear of who we are and who the companies are and holding them accountable for their own actions. >> senator coburn? >> thank you. mr. posner, you talk about the three things you all are doing in terms of programming, monitoring and analyzing and then responding. and you spoke specifically about responding to two or three different instances, vietnam i think was one you mentioned. what's been the affect of that response? >> this is a long-term and tough
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subject for us to claim immediate results. it's not going to happen that way. governments are testing the@@) american values and american foreign policy. >> so there's definitely going to be a consistency to your message and a constancy to your message? >> if we're not consistent we're not going to succeed. yes. >> okay.
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mr. witsner, you mentioned the gni in your testimony. given your unique perspective of the diversity of all the companies that make up the industry, that offer internet based goods and services around the world, do you see gni as a framework that will fit every one of those companies? or -- is there the case that maybe this doesn't fit some of them? >> from the perspective of the efforts that we imagine at the congress department, our main interest is to be a partner with the gni. it seems unlikely that every single internet company in the united states would join. we certainly hope more do. these organizations have to figure out how to create the proper kind of fit between their mission and those who they hope to serve. that's not an easy challenge, as you know. but we think it's important. from the commerce department perspecti perspective, we hear from companies large and small across a dmub of sectors of the internet economy. certainly small start-ups may not be able to fully participate
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in the gni, but we think first of all they will benefit from the efforts of an organization like that, and we look, we are looking carefully at how we can make the trade assistance resources we have available on the ground and in over 60 countries around the world available to those u.s. companies who for whatever reason don't fit as well. >> but you do feel that ultimately they all will have some benefit directly or indirectly? >> i think that if the gni can suck sooetd at its efforts to bring greater transparency and a set of commonly accepted best practices that would benefit the internet as whole. >> what kind of guidance does your department give to u.s. companies offering the internet based goods and services, internet restricted countries to overcome the challenges that you outlined in your testimony? >> you know, i wouldn't say there's a single answer to that question, but as i noted, the commerce department resources working along with state
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department resources in many countries work on a case-by-case basis to work through barriers that, or misunderstandings that companies face. when those barriers are seen to be too hard to resolve, in individual cases we can escalate those to discussions with the governments and often to government discussion at whatever level can be helpful in a way that the company may not be able to muster all by itself. this is especially true for smaller companies, for companies that don't have the international profile that, of some of the cases we've seen in the news. so, again, we think that they will have an essential role to play in helping u.s. companies that way. >> are there instances success if you've been able to accomplish that? >> well, very often these are efforts that -- that require cooperation across the executive branch. i point to interactions
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involving the recent green dam filtering requirement proposed by the chinese government, as that issue was raised to various parts of the u.s. government including the commerce department, the international trade administration, the ustr, state department and others, we were able to have a dialogue with the chinese government that we think produced results. >> okay. the department of commerce seems to be on the forefront of some of the issues we're discovering, discussing today, bus on the other i was startled to hear efforts to target internet policy changes seemed to have only just begun. is the interagency internet policy task force the first such initiative undertaken by the department? >> the department of commerce's efforts in internet policy go back to more or less the beginning of the commercial internet in the mid'90s. early work was done in the department of commerce in laying out a framework for global electronic commerce in laying
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out privacy rules and approaches appropriate for the united states. i'm proud to say there's a long-standing tradition at the commerce department far pre-dating our work and we intend to continue that. >> how long before notice of inquiry runs in the federal register to solicit additional outside. s? >> we are hoping to do this in the next couple of months. >> why can't it be done immediately? >> well, we've been engaging in discussions, a variety of companies, and technical experts and academics to make sure we understand the questions we ought to be asking. we're actively engaved in that and will get it out as soon as we can. >> when does the task force make the recommended to commerce? >> working over the course of this year. we expect by the end the year we'll have recommendations but we'll be contributing based and what we learn in an informal way both to congress department efforts and to administration-wide efforts. we view this as an ongoing
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effort. >> based on, you know, you have a tremendous knowledge and tremendous experience. is it always going to be possible for u.s. companies to operate in ways that support a global open internet that facilitates the free throw of thfrgs, goods and services even with countries that do not share those values? and how do we get there? >> i hesitate to say anything is always possible. i think that it will be possible, and i share my colleague's, secretary posner, optimism that we will be able to make progress on this. i think the history the internet has been, that the spread of a rec nation openness is good for everyone. >> powerful tool. >> yes. >> okay. thank you. >> thank you, mr. chairman. mr. posner, congress has reserved tens of millions of dollars for funding at the censorship initiatives, just last december your bureau called
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for a $5 million of this funding. however, as bipartisan group of senators has pointed out, the application required a significant "in country presence requiring the groups developing anti-censorship software, for example, to actually physically be present in an authoritarian country." i'm no i.t. expert, but the impression i get that software is pretty portable. i also get the impression that it's hard to live in an authoritarian country, or as an anti-censorship programmer in a country like -- i don't know, say iran. why do we have this requirement and is it necessary? >> senator, i think there's been some misunderstanding of that requirement, and i will say we've gotten a range of very
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exciting proposals from more than 20 different entities. what we're trying to do is create opportunities for people operating in tough, repressive places like iran. to get access to information. when we talk about presence, we're not talking about having servers on the scene or complicated technical equipment. what we're trying to do is find entities, a range of different groups, who are looking as we are creatively at how to use internet. how to use telephone applications to better communicate with their own societies. so we have -- the field is wide open, and we have a range of different applicants for that money. many of whom are not physically located in the countries that were -- >> the -- in the proposals it
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says the bulk of project activities must take place in country, and last between one and three years. >> yeah, but when we say that, what we're talking about is, for example -- let's take the example of iran. what we're interested in doing is providing the kind of training, assistance protection to people, iranians, who are with their own society trying to open up free flow of information and access to information. we're working with a range of groups that are not themselves based in iran, or in china, or in any of these countries. but we're trying to create opportunities for people inside their own countries, their own societies, to communicate more effectively. that's the purpose of that language. >> okay. i'm not sure i totally follow, but let's go somewhere else. the "washington post" specifically criticized the state department for not giving
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a cent to a group called the global internet freedom consortium, and mr. chairman, without objection, i'd like to add a copy of that editorial for the record. according to the "wall street journal" these are the guys who develop the software that allowed protesters in iran to communicate during and after the government crackdown. can you speak to the post editorial? why hasn't this group received any funding? >> first of all, the group you mention is one of the 20-some that applied for funding in december, and those applications, or those, that money is now being disbursed or we're reviewing all of the applications. so we'll make a decision in the next few months, and they were open. the competition was open and we encouraged them to apply and they did, which is a good sign. our approach has been that there
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is not one magic answer to how to circumvent these restrictions nap there needs to be a range of tools, a range of different approaches. we sort of view ourselves as someone like the venture capital firms in the silicon valley trying a lot of different things. >> this particularly successful and not one that is receiving funding where. >> there are different views about how successful any one of these has been, and we're looking at that, but you know, we're absolutely open to there being a candidate for funding and looking at it very seriously. >> thank you. mr. weitzner, the free trade agreements are negotiated by the united states trade representative, not your department, but i still want to ask you this question. over time our frewer trade agreements have come to include robust projections for workers
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and for the environment. weren't of our latest fta, a korean fta includes a provision protecting "the free flow of information and facilitating trade" but it only covers international information flows, not intracountry censorship. and also isn't mandatory. will this administration support a simple mandatory ban on political censorship on the internet in future trade agreements? >> that's a question i'm not prepared to speak to right here but will certainly take it back and consider it. i think as we look at the free trade agreements we have that are being amended and the new ones that are being negotiated, it's certainly appropriate to consider the range of issues that affect the open internet. it's clearly in the interests of promoting free trade to have an open internet and we'll be happy to come back with you and talk in more detail about your suggestion. >> okay. and you've mentioned that you,
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part of your portfolio is trade and intellectual properties. i just wanted to ask. we're talking about free flow of information and internet freedom here, but i wanted to also talk for a second that as long as we're considering putting this kind of restrictions in our trade agreements, that will restrict censorship, what are we doing on intellectual property and can we put these together to prevent the countries like china from ripping off our, our intellectual property, our movies, et set virgincetera? >> as you know, a number of agreements have protection provisions in them and there are negotiations ongoing. in other venues to advance that
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to other countries as well. so it's an agenda that's being activity pursued by this administration. >> okay. thank you. thank you, mr. chairman. >> senator kaufman? >> mr. chairman i want to thank you for holding this hearing. it's timely, it's important. there's hardly anything i can think of that is more important than free exchange of ideas if we're going to be success until having a peaceful world over the next 20, 30, 40, 50 years. i spent years in the board of governors and we wrestled time and again with the problem of internet freedom, how you deal with it in certain countries and would like to reinforce what mr. posner said. late '90s out 0 to silicone valley and talked to experts, how do you do this battle and win jn they all to a person reassured us that they cannot block what it we're sending. it's always easier to send message than didn't is to block. like nuclear. you say one two, three four missiles. knocking them down is much more difficult than putting them up. so the key to this thing in the
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end is being creative and doing more and people will find a way. r
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what it means for internet freedom and what we can do about it in the state department and the commerce department? >> it is distressing to say the least that italian authorities have sought to make representative, local representatives of a private company in a sense the censors of content, and you know, we are clearly concerned about the
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>> thank you, senator. i'd agree that the case is very important and the larger issue that it raises is probably even more important. one of the, the first steps that the united states took in legislating, yaeting an legal environment for the internet was to recognize if we place third parties in the position of third party, whether they are internet service providers or those who host content such as youtube, if you plays those parties in the position of having to figure out what the rules about third party content might be, figure out whether they might be liable, that the internet really would grind to a halt. and i think that it's -- it's an issue that i think we tackled early on in the united states, and it's one that i hope we can raise awareness of around the world as we go forward. >> and there, again, government
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to government multilateral, this could bring the entire internet to a halt, it's not in the interests of anyone to have this happen, and if italy gets away with it, more countries will do the same thing. one of the models i think we should use going forward on this is not voluntary. that is the voice act. 20 deal with iran and the way iran blocks the interin the and the things they do. we have the voice -- has the, the government promoting ways to get around to help folks get around the iranian blocking of the internet, and mr. posner, we're expecting a report soon. can you kind of give me the status of where we are on that? >> as i understand it, the report was a draft of it has been prepared by the bbg, and it's now being reviewed and an inner agency process and i think you should get it shortly. it's certainly under way and i will make sure that you get it very soon. >> good.
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thank you. is there any examples beyond google what google is doing in china, of corporations taking on charges for internet, on internet freedom that you can think of off the top of your head? some good stories? >> yeah. i would say -- one of the things that was, again, has been encouraging to me about the companies that have participated in the global network initiative is that they've taken internally steps to do things to preempt or to anticipate problems. so, for example, we talk about google. i'd also talk about yahoo! in the same breath. they have really internally undertaken to make human rights part of their internal decision-making process, and when they've gone into new markets, they've undertaken to review and do country analyses. they know what they're getting themselves into. i think those sorts of steps, while they're not dramatic, are
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essential. if we're really talking about companies stepping up and taking responsibility, it starts with their own corporate structure, and it starts with their understanding the places where they're operating and taking the time to really evaluate the human rights and free expression risks. so i think that's the kind of initiative that i'm look and hoping that other companies will follow. >> you know, i think that's a business decision, having worked in corporate america. that's a decision to make, whether you sgee a country clearly you'll have a problem. but you know, many people attribute the end of segregation of the south to when american corporations decided to do away with the good neighbor policy. and i think -- with all due respect, with all due respect, until corporations decide they're not going to abide by the internet freedom good neighbor policy, we're going to be aiding and abetting as we have in the past. regimes from blocking the internet and a lot is being done with a lot is being done with the technology and the companies. i sense that we have to do it at
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some point and someone has to say i'm not going to do it. one of the slipperiest slopes is when you say if i don't do it, someone else will. that's the time to examine your conscious on what's going on. another interest of mine and i will finish with this, u.s. companies, what is say u.s. company today with multinational corporations having so many interests around the world. do you deal with the non-u.s. companies? >> i think one of the challenges we face now and the gni will face in their operation is trying to reengage particularly with the western european governments and companies and some of the asian companies. this cannot be a u.s.-based initiative in the in the discussions of the gni, several telephone companies from europe
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were involved preliminarily and they pulled back. we are keen to get european governments and companies in particular in some of these asian companies as well. this has to be a collective response. >> thank you, mr. chairman. >> thank you very much. i would like to ask a question that may retray by early training. i am trying to put in my own mind a spectrum of activity where is it would be most of us would approve of an internet company cooperating with the government. example one is child pornography. we ask for the identifying of those who had access of certain websites which we believe would be the basis for criminal prosecution. example two, people venting
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political feelings bordering on the suggestion of violence against certain public officials. number three, specific threats of violence against an individual and a member of congress and the president of the united states. number four, involvement in terrorism working with groups that are literally trying to do us harm. number five, the disclosure of information classified by our government as top secret that may compromise our national security. i have gone up the spectrum, you can see the severity and seriousness of the issue. i don't want to oversimplify what we are doing and saying it should be easy for companies doing business in other companies to know where to draw the line. where does gni come on and how do they draw the line? >> it's an excellent question.
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probably one of the how farrest to deal with in a practical way. we have constraints against pornography and supporting terrorism or engaging in violent acts or promoting that. i think we have to use the same frame globally and say there certain activities that the government has an obligation to prevent as a matter of law enforcement. the challenge we face is that the concept of law enforcement and national security takes on a very different coloration if you are talking about the government of iran and the government of china and many others. the notion of national security becomes so overwhelmingly broad that what we would consider protected speech, political speech and criticism of
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government action becomes under that. that's the challenge. companies say with some justification, we need to follow local law and somebody said there is a violation of national security. we need to be responsive to that. the hardest question is when do you say no, that doesn't feel to us like a legitimate national security question. you don't like being criticized. that's the world we live in. >> i draw the line. >> to be honest, we had many, many discussions within the negotiation of the gni on exactly that question and those will be the hardest calls for companies to make or for government to make. the good news for me is that there is an awful lot of activity and work that can be done that is short of that. where you are dealing with pure speech and your example of the
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video, the tianamen square image on google ought to be the same on the google site we all look at. there is a lot of room to be done in promoting free expression where there is clearly a path forward if companies work together, push the limits and as senator kaufman said we reinforce that. >> thank you. let me try to address the procedural aspect of that question. the substantive nature of that spectrum that you drew out, we recognize has some national variations around the world and we always had to deal with that. i think some part of the way we can come together in an environment where the internet can function globally where these national differences can be accounted for where they are reasonable, but where they don't become overall barriers to the
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free-throw of information and the viability of the internet is to keep in mind too important principals. i think we should have a basic expectation of due process. national rules may vary but when they become arbitrary, we all have a concern. that's most concern for the individual rights at stake. by the same token, transparency and predictability of the rules wherever they fall on the spectrum and however that spectrum evolves overtime are essential if we will have a viable commercial environment. companies cannot make these choices by throwing darts at a board and trying to figure out what's in the mind of the governments that have real power over them. i would say if we can stick to those procedural notions of due process and transparency, we have a chance as an international community of evolving towards a set of norms that everyone can live with. we will never close the gap
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completely, sad to say, but what we have to work for for the sake of human rights and for the sake of u.s. innovation and global innovation on the internet is making sure that we have an environment in which everyone can function with predictability and stability. >> senator coburn? senator frank? >> i guess i wanted to make this one thing clear for people listening or watching about the situation in italy. i know we talked on a high level about it. basically it is a platform and basically if you are a platform in america, you are not responsible or you can't be put in prison because somebody used your platform to print something
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that was liablous or something like that. that allows for the free-throw of information where as in italy what happened is that google executives have been prosecuted and convicted, right? we will have to go to prison because something showed up on their using their platform. i'm only saying this because i wanted to clarify it for people listening. sometimes i think we operate on a higher level here than or maybe i'm mismistaken. people are operating on a higher level than we are. >> i know you have -- hopefully some of both. i don't know. i know you have a witness from google on the next panel and i don't want to speak for them, but yes, i think it's a stark
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situation. there were criminal convictions handed out and indeed the situation and it is indeed the case that that sort of conviction would not have happened under the united states law because of the protections that we provide to service@@@@å
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i just want people to understand what that was and that what a platform is and that we can't hold those platforms responsible for things people put up on the platform. that's all. thank you. >> they can't place those. mr. chairman, i think i will ask you on your comments on legally how we should deal with this. if you go to these other countries and my experience of them, all, not just internet, but all of them, they don't know this amount about public discourse. this is about child pornography.
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that's the number one. american corporations when you go to them early on in this process and said what are you doing? we are providing equipment to deal with child and you see what's on the air, they are on the air, you see it and they say we are doing child pornography and controlling security. they use that in these sophisticated countries as why they are blocking the internet. is that fair analysis? >> it is. in fact after secretary clinton gave her speech in january, i talked to several chinese activists. that's exactly the way the chinese government and chinese media were portraying the speech. this is not about free speech. they want to promote pornography. we sort of live in a world where we assume there is a rational
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discourse about these things. our intentions are being challenged all the time. the notion of a kind of free, open internet is assumed to be for purposes that we in fact would also not prepare as legitimate. >> is you, senator kaufman and the first panel. we appreciate it and may have follow-up questions and hope you can answer them in a timely fashion. if the second panel would come to the table, i will ask for be valuable thing to the industry. let me start by asking the three witnesses before us to please stand and raise your right hand. do you affirm the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you god? let the record reflect that the
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three witnesses answered in the affirmative. the first is nicole, vice president and deputy general council of google responsible for company products and litigation. ms. wong, i want to comment and you your company for engaging on this critical issue. part of joining google, she was part of the law firm at perkins coal. she was named one of the lest lawyers under 40 by the national asian pacific law association. she testified before the subcommittee in the first hearing in 2008. we thank you for joining us again. following her, rebecca mckin on, cofounder of global voices on line and fun toing member of the initiative. she has been a fellow at harvard for internet society.
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assistant professor at journalism and media study center and worked as a journalist at cnn at beijing for nine years and bureau chief correspondent from 1998 to 2001. she holds a bachelor's degree from harvard college. thank you for being here and the final witness is a journalist and blogger. he was a rotary peace fellow at the university of berkeley graduate school of journalism and received human rights watch and defender award. he is awarded the golden pen award in 2002. he has been blogging in english and persian since 2002. he has a bachelor's degree from azad university. i know the iranian government persecuted you because you exercised your freedom of speech. thank you for having the courage to continue to speak out and joininginous that capacity.
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let us start with ms. wong. you have five minutes and your written statement will be put in the record in its entirety. >> thank you members of the subcommittee for your continued attention to the issue of internet freedom and i want to talk about the importance of an open internet. it's what allowed a national broadcaster to upload daily newscasts on you tube after hugo chavez revoked their license because their opinions were count to his policies. blog reports and photos of videos of hundreds of berm ease monks being beaten and killed even after the government shut down the national media and kicked out foreign journalists. the open internet brought the protest following the protections in iran for all of our attention. even after the government banned journalists and shut down the media and disrupted internet and cell phone service. the continued power of this medium requires a commitment from citizens, companies and governments alike.
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in the last few years more than 25 governments have blocked google services including you tube and blogger. it's consistent with secretary clinton's research where she cited cases. for example, our video service you tube has been blocked in turkey for nearly two years now because of user videos that allegedly insult turkeyishness. in 2009 in elections in pakistan, the pakistani government issued an order to block opposition videos on you tube. of course the experience in china where it showed a measurable increase in censorship in every medium including the internet. an open internet that continues to fulfill the democratic function of giving voice to individuals, particularly those who speak in dissent makes each of us make the right choice to support a free and strong government and resist censorship and other acts of speech even
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when the decision is hard. as google's deputy council, part of my job is handling demands from around the world guided by three principals. maximizing access, notifying users when information has been remove and retaping the user's trust by protecting privacy and security. no examples received more attention than china in recent months. in mid-december, we detected a highly sophisticated and targeted attack, originate for example china with a primary and unsuccessful goal to access g mail accounts. it soon became clear when it first appeared to be an incident was something quite different. other companies from a range of businesses, finance, technology, media and chemical were targeted. we discovered in our investigation accounts of dozens of users from around the world who advocate appear by 3rd
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pears. this happened placed on the user's computers. these circumstances as well as attempts over the last year to limit free speech online led us to conclude that we are no longer comfortable sensoring search results in china. wey reviewing operations there now. no particular industry much less any company can tackle censorship on its own. concerted action is needed to promote online expression and reduce the impact. we are grateful for lawmakers and particularly your leadership who urged more companies to join the network initiative. as a platform for companies, gni members commit to standards that protect user rights to privacy and freedom of expression. additional participation will help them reach full po tegz. beyond the gni, every one of us at the grass roots level should
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make every effort to maximize access to information online. in particular, government can take steps. first and foremost, the government should promote the openness as a major plank of a foreign policy. the free-throw of information is an important part of diplomacy, foreign assistance and engagement in human rights. second, it should be part of our trade agenda because it has serious economic implications. it tilts domestic companies and consumer choice. it also hurts businesses in every sector that use the internet to reach customers. thir, our government and governments around the world should be transparent about demands to sensor or request for user information or when a network comes under attack. this is a critical part of the process, allowing citizens to old governments accountable. google supports the congress and administration to make sure people who need to access the
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internet get the right training and tools. i want to thank each of you for continued leadership in the fight against online censorship. we look forward to working with you to access information and promote online free express around the world? >> thank you. >> thank you, mr. chairman for the chance to testify. i look forward to answering your questions along with those of other esteemed members of the subcommittee. after describing how authoritarianism is a dapping in ways that involve companies, i will offer policy recommendations. now authoritarian regimes accept they need to connect to the internet to be economically competitive. they are also working out how to control things well enough to stay in power. regimes like china skpirks ran and a agreeing list of others usually start with at blocking of websites and they use a range of other tactics in greater detail in my written testimony that include cyber attacks
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against activist websites, deletion of online content by internet companies at government request and the use of law enforcement demands in countries where the definition of crime includes political speech which means that companies end up assisting in the jailing and tracking of activists whether or not they intended to do so. at the top of my list of recommending as is corporate responsibility. mr. chairman, your recent letters to 30 companies in the information and communications technology sector were an important step in advancing the conversation about how american companies can compete in the global market place while at the same time up holding core values of internet freedom. soon after your 2008 hearing on this subject, google, yahoo and microsoft launched the global initiative, a code of conduct for free expression of privacy in conjunction with groups, investors and academics,
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including myself. they recognize that no market is without political difficulties or ethical dilemmas. every company, every production, and every market is different, therefore we believe in an approach that combines flexibility with accountability. fundamentally it's reasonable, i believe to expect that all companies in the information and communications technology sector should acknowledge and seek to mitigate the human rights risk and concerns associated with their businesses just as they and other companies consider environmental risks and labor concerns. next comes legislation. law may be needed to induce corporate responsibility if companies failed to take voluntary action. meanwhile, however, i recommend immediate steps. it should be made easier for victims to take action in a u.s. court of law when companies assist regimes in violating the universally-recognized rights.
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we need to incent vise the nation that supports internet freedom and revise export controls and sanctions in two ways. on the one hand we need to fix laws that now make it difficult for u.s. internet companies to legally serve activists from sanctioned countries like iran, syria and zimbabwe. on the other hand, we have to make collaboration with repression more difficult by making it harder for u.s. companies to sell products and services to regimes with a clear track record of suppressing peaceful, political, and religious speech. then technical support. congress deserves praise for supporting the development of tools that help people in repressive regimes get around internet blocking. they do nothing to counter other tactics regimes are using. our support should also include tools and training to help people evade surveillance, detect spy wear and guard against debilitating cyber
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attacks. tech nichls to preserve and redistribute content deleted from the internet and support for platforms for which citizens can share and fight internet and freedom. finally it's vital that we have "
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commend you for taking the historic first steps in that direction. thank you. >> thank you very much. if you would please -- thank you. >> i welcome to opportunity to speak on the important matter of internet freedom and i hope it helps people around the world to have more access to internet and information via the internet and the other means of communication. i'm a journalist and the receiverer for the rights of iran and independent nonprofit that monitors iran's compliance with human rights standards. in 2004 i was arrested by the iranian security forces and i was held in a prison in a
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solitary confinement. i was taken to another prison where hundreds of political prisoners, journalists and activists have been taken and being kept after the june 12th presidential election. digger my time in solitary confinement, i was beaten and psychologically and physically tortured and told i could not post my writings and should stop working as a journalist. there was no actual crime in my case. i was arrest and abused for using the internet for sharing information. last year the blogger died in detention. when i moved to the united states in 2005, my website had been shut down. don't get me wrong, it's not the iranian government that shut it
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down. it was a company that provided the domain and host for me. in a letter, the company mentioned restriction on any transaction with iranian companies. later i learned that many prodemocracy and human rights websites had to change their domain on that restriction and you know it's very easy for the iranian government to monitor that domain. so what i decided to participate in the hearing i talked to many bloggers and journalists and those who have difficulties to even send a simple e-mail or chat on the messenger. almost all of them believe support to give iranians access to the internet is supporting human rights and democracy in the country. supporting security in the persian gulf region and more importantly saving the lives of many people who are threatened by restrictions on information
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that allow the iranian government to operate behind closed doors and as it violates their basic rights. as a journalist and human rights defender, i would like to stress the importance of applying the standards in a balance in a plot political way. numerous other countries violate their right to access the internet as the other people today mention. the united states should support compliance across the board. otherwise the charge of holding double standards will stick. with that in mind, i would like to make four main points in my testimony. with relation to internet freedom, the internet sanctions on iran. certain sanctions or
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interpretations of the sanctions have damaged access to the internet and need to be modified. all mass market software useful for publishing and communications and education should be extended. second is the european company who is still sell censorship technology to the iranian government and need to be exposed and face sanctions. also online advertising is not allowed for persian websites. many companies such as google or facebook do not include persian or farcy as advertising on websites or allow targeting users with such a language. funding is needed to allow hiring a limited number of web developers in iran. many groups need to hire developers to build their websites. the number of web developers
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with the persian language is very few. these groups need to be allowed to hire the developers in iran. the amount of payments could be capped to 10,000 per year. they want to make sure such a solution is not abuse for other purposes. i have some other suggestions in regard to internet access and giving access to activists and using and providing satellite broadcast as you know. for iranian broadcast, the u.s. government dedicated a specific satellite which is hardened against using technologies that are similar to military satellites and providing iranians with free internet. e-mail security which is important and think there companies that can provide those technologies and pc security that is another idea that we can
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discuss later. thank you. >> thank you. we had a number of witnesses before this human rights chittee who have inspired us to continue our work and you are one of them. you have paid a heavy price for your commitment to your profession of journalism and for your commitment to free expression. >> thank you. >> your courage to come here today is inspiring to all of us. thank you very much for doing that. i can recall in the not too distant past when my mother's homeland of lithuania was seeking freedom and independence and what kepts us alive in the information that came from lithuania over fax machines. that was the technology of the moment. the soviets couldn't stop us. we were kept up to speed on what was happening and we were able
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to respond in the global media. technology has grown in so many different ways. it still is the right avenue as ms. wong said for us to seek it and use it to promote dialogue and expression and freedom which you have sacrificed so much for personally. in the course of your testimony you talked about the european company who is sell surveillance or censorship technology to the iranian government. as a result of u.s. sanctions against iran, u.s. companies are not allowed to sell that kind of technology to the iranian government. do you think the u.s. government should make certain american companies don't sell surveillance or censorship technology to other country on the internet such as china or vietnam. >> it's important to include other countries as well. iranians provide those kind of
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technologies through a third country. that could go to iran through china or the other countries that have a good relationship with tehran. >> i suppose after the election took place nine months ago there was an expectation of the so-called twitter revolution in iran would topple the government and change iran. obviously that is not occurring and we have seen the limits of internet activism in iran. can you give us your view of what impact this had and continues to have in inspiring those who question the current government? >> i think it was not the internet, god knows how many more people would have been killed on the streets of tehran and other cities. it is really important that people could dominate the event after the election. it was very significant.
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>> i think ms. wong made that point as well. i would like to ask you, you heard or saw the instruction hereof google and china and the reference to tianamen square and your company announced change in terms of censorship in china. can you me what your time table is to accomplish that? if you turn your mike on. >> thank you, senator. it's a very fair question. let me take it directly. we don't have a specific time table. we are firm in our decision that we will not sensor our search results in china. we are working towards that end. we have many employees on the ground. some of whom are very dear colleagues of mine. we recognize both the seriousness and the sensitivity of the decision we are making.
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we want to figure out a way to get to that end of stopping sensoring the search results in a way that is appropriate and responsible. we are working on that as hard as we can, but it's a human issue for us. >> thank you for stating your clear goal. i think we are all sensitive to the fact that there important steps to reach that goal that we want to you make in the right way and an expeditious way, but sensitive to those elements. earlier i spoke to the panel, the first panel about this gradation of cooperation between the company like yours and the government. i went through a list of possible activity on the internet asking where we would draw the line. cooperation with the government to stop child pornography. cooperation with the government to dealing with nonspecific
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politically threatening language. cooperation with the government for specific threats of violence over the internet. cooperation with the government when there is evidence of advocacy and terrorism and cooperation when it comes to the disclosure of information classified as secret by the government. you are on the firing line when it comes to this issue and the legal questions you have to face. how would google address these and where and how would you draw the lines. >> it was a very insightful observation because it's something we wrestle with and incredibly difficult not only to look at it as a specific piece of content, but to look at it in the context where you are operating. there multiple layers in which you try to address it. the first is making decisions about entry into a market in the first place. about what frameworks of law you
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had to work with. when you look at particular pieces of content, you try to make decisions based on what you know about the laws in that country. some of which there seems to be almost universally on child porn as a bad. on the extreme heavy handed censorship. our general solution is to try to figure out which laws are appropriate for us to abide by, given the values of our company and the places where we operate. the 2nd part of the solution is when mr. weissner commented on which is transparency. in every jurisdiction where we are required to remove information, we try to be transparent with the users and the information has been removed to comply. you have seen that in china where when we remove the search results from the property, we put a notice at the bottom of that search page to let users know that information has been
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removed as required by law. we do that on all of them and most of the services we link to the demand letter that asked us to remove the information. the user can see exactly who requested and what was requested to be removed. >> i would like to follow-up and ask about two elements. the element of due process in the countries. if you are to challenge a government and their assertion of the right to know the name of the user or to sensor information, do you use due process in that country to follow their laws and the standards you try to stand by? >> sure. yes. we do try to use the process to challenge the information and sensor demands we think are appropriate. we have done that in turkey. for example, what that got us is
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being blocked in turkey for the last two years. we are looking at the principals that are based on the principals of human rights. it is along those lines we are trying@@@ "@ d@ g$ '" gi@ @ @ @á
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is there something else you can tell us or share with us to make sure this is an american effort or international effort? >> that's a good question and a question i often ask myself. what is holding these companies back? it seems in part a fear of acknowledging that human rights is part of the business. telecommunications and internet companies no matter how you slice it have implications for privacy and human rights. a lost them are afraid of having the conversation for hanging charges on them of various kinds and they would rather avoid having the conversation at all. what we saw with google, yahoo and microsoft was an evolution of self awareness and a coming
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out in terms of recognizing it's okay to have this conversation. it's okay to recognize that you have responsibilities and in fact, if you hold yourself accountable that this is good for your business. your users are more likely to trust you and if you do make mistakes, there is a process by which you can try to figure out how to reverse them in a group that is trying to help you succeed. the point is not for the human ryes group and academics like myself to play gotcha, but to help them avoid making the mistakes by anticipating and thinking through in advance. the first step is acknowledging that you are not perfect, that you are fallible, and you might be corruptible as a human being in the pursuit of profits and you need help from a range of
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actors to do the right thing. just as it took a while for industry overtime to recognize they had to have public conversations about environmental issues, they adhere to labor standards and 100 years ago, it took a certain process for companies to be comfortable discussing these things in public and has been the past few years that companies in this sector have been confronted with this reality and just because you are connecting people to the internet doesn't mean you are automatically going to free them. you have responsibilities in terms of how you are setting up the business and how you are constructing the relationships with different governments and that matters. google, yahoo and microsoft are to be commend and i hope that
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other companies will recognize that this is essential to their credibility if they want a free and open internet to exist. >> i will close with this question. let's assume you are a customer or user or facebook and you are not part of this conversation. how could you if you are a customer or user who believes they should be part of this effort most effectively influence them through the internet? >> some of which are -- you can form facebook groups. part is for customers and users
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to think of themselves as citizens and you need to push the companies and the services to do the right thing. you need to be active and also investors should be thinking about, okay, when i'm investing in stock of these different companies, this should be one of the criteria that i'm using in addition to the environmental and labor behavior and when you are thinking of buying products and so on. there a bunch of different ways, but part of it is absolutely for consumers to be talking about this and to be putting pressure and saying this company is good and i can trust these people and these people i'm not sure. they are in denial about whether or not there any issues about my privacy. >> my guess is before we adjourn, there will be something under way. i thank you for your testimony and your patience. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i like to kind of follow-up on that. you are talking and i think the
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global network initiative is a great start. this is for both you and ms. wong and i can't tell you how much admiration i have for your work and your courage. i think gni is a great start, but microsoft is one of the members and yahoo is one of the members and i don't see them making the same kind of decision that google has made. i think that bill gates recently -- i called chinese censorship very limited. i think those were his words. what do you think we can do and
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others can do to help other companies follow google's lead in china and that's both of you. >> we actually -- i want to be clear that our decision is not an easy one. i don't think any company will confront how to do business as an easy one. we think we now made the right decision. we stand by our decision for sure. phi are puzzled by microsoft's statements because they are not consistent with the conversations we had over the last three years and in our view the censorship is a human rights issue and not to be minimized. having said that, we have been clear all through the process that we are not striving for one size fits all solutions. this is the right decision for google. we would not propose that to
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impose our decision on any other company. we do think it's important that they be part of a conversation where we are actively discussing how things are going in the country and that's an important part of gni. >> just to follow-up on that with microsoft and other companies made remarks that were quite disappointing and we had heated discussions about that. it is absolutely true as nicole said, it's not one size fits all and each has a kind of business going on in china. yahoo sold their chinese business to a chinese company a few years ago and don't have operational control over that anymore. microsoft's situation is also somewhat different so the idea is not to impose a one size fits
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all set of standards on everybody in a rigid way, but rather to help the companies be mindful about what decisions they are making and what the implications are and to be transparent and accountable about the decisions. part of the problem is they are in china and you have to comply, but how? it's an issue to what ex-at the present time do they feel comfortable that they are complying in a way that is transparent and responsible and they can do that within the context of that particular market. it may be possible for them to do it with the relationship they have with the government and the specific nature of their product. it is the case that google over the past year in china has come under tremendous pressure from
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the government and the chinese media. they have been slammed for exposing chinese youth to smutty content when you type smutty terms into the search engine, smutty results appear. that a lot of these crack downs and so on are done with the guides are law enforcement and damage we use in the west in a different context. there different decisions that have to be made and often times it's specific to the company. the point is to be flexible and accountability at the same time. next year is going to be the first year where we do our first set of evaluations and we benchmark how the companies have done so far.
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that will also help move the process forward and it is definitely important to get more companies recognizing and stepping up and taking responsibility. that this is not about engage or disengage, but there a lot of different ways in which you can engablg. it's about how you engage rather than in or out. >> china is a big market, that's my guess. you brought up the issue of companies wondering and doing examination and talking about how corruptible they are. i suppose if you are looking at the potentially world's biggest market and taking yourself out of it on a matter of principal, you are making a big decision
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about how corruptible or uncorruptible or incorruptible you are. thank you for your integrity and incorruptibility. and in your testimony you talk about what is keeping us from having a greater expansion of freedom of speech online and rightfully so. i have a different question. i might even over my time to the mr. chairman. can you tell us what technological tools iranians are using right now to get past government sensors and surveillance and if -- i want to know what's already working so that maybe we can do more to support that. >> there are companies that provide anti-censorship
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softwares so people can go beyond proxies and have access to the internet. they can see that the websites have been filtered. part of the company initiatives also can provide resources. if you want to do more and provide more access for them, initiatives can provide resources to support the development of technology design to combat internet censorship. many people are working on these softwares now in san francisco and silicon valley and the other states. those initiatives could be supported by this department or the other companies. i wanted to ask something about the fact that some companies like yahoo and facebook have not joined the gni initiative and there many rumors in iran that
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yahoo and facebook have made a deal with iranian government and eventually they will give them the information of the users. the rumors are so strong in a way that some people removed their profiles from facebook because of the threat that they feel. i think the fact that facebook and yahoo are not eager to join such initiatives. it's not really acceptable at times that it's really a matter of life and death. some people around the world. the world is not just the u.s. millions of people in other countries in iran and china egypt use the services and they are really responsible for what they do and what they provide. >> for occurs to me there was a magazine and a series of ongoing cartoons called spy versus spy.
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this whole thing seems to have an element to it where there is a technology and anti-censorship technology that is being worked on by some@@@@rr technology that the government has and that the people of iran don't. i was wondering in this spy
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versus spy kind of world that we are in here which includes not just technology, but policy, government policy and business ethics and self searching. what should we be doing about these technologies? you think the government policy here is wrong. >> my understanding is that the office of foreign assets controls has certain regulations that prohibit the download of applications containing encryption. that is why in order to comply with those u.s. laws, we do not permit the download of certain applications like our browser,
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for example. having said that, our web services are globally available and do not prohibit ourselves the access to our websites within iran. whether or not there should be a change in those regulations, i think that deserves just based on the conversation i heard today consideration. i think for example some of the regulations are framed and they go according to particular countries. you can have a regulation of not exporting certain things and we want to have the flow of education and materials to a country. we should start to think about the tools that companies like ours provide in that same category of access to information. >> i think he was saying that the government of iran already has access to the encryption so what's the point other than
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keeping this out of the hands of iranians, right? >> that's true and i think the sanctions are really a blanket and should be revised and modified. i understand the concern of those companies who do not not risk because the iranian market is small and these companies prefer to stay away from it and it's like spending tens of thousands of dollars on legal fees for the license, they prefer to forget it. if those sanctions be modified, i think that really helps. >> thank you, mr. chairman for indulging me. thank you for your courage. thank you, ms. wong and ms. mac ken on. >> i submit for the record and ask that it be made part of it.
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a letter to senator karl levin which notes that the department of state is recommending that the department of treasury's office and foreign assets control issued a license that would authorize downloads of free mass market software by companies such as microsoft and google to iran. for personal communication. our government is asking for a waiver so they can provide the additional information. i also have a statement which i will enter into the record. from the chairman of the committee, senator patrick leahy as well as business for social responsibility and commuter and communications industry and the global network initiative and reporters without boarders will be entered without objection. i want to thank this panel and s committee on a critically important topic brought home by your testimony, mr. memarian. you reminded us to think about
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the millions of people around the world, looking for a ray of hope each day that they should continue in their struggle for freedom. and finding it when they can reach others on the internet who share their beliefs. this is what made america in its earliest days, thomas payne didn't have access to the internet but his pamphlets were distributed and inspired a lot of people to fight for freedom. you have inspired us, as i mentioned earlier, by your coming here today and testify and particular by by the sacrifice you made in iran to help that country move forward. i want to thank you for that. we're going to continue to work on this issue. it may not be two years before we meet again. but let's hope that a lot of the companies that refuse to be part of this hearing will have second thoughts. and we'll make the right decision to move forward. this hearing stands adjourned.
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>> please welcome members of the united states house of representatives, secretary robert gates, speaker of the house, vice president joseph biden and honored guests.
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>> today we come together in statuary hall to welcome the family of jack murtha, his wife, his children and grandchildren. his brothers, robert and james. and his other family members and many friends who are here to honor his life and his legacy. please remain standing for the invocation. which will be delivered by father coughlin. >> my brothers and sisters, we believe that all the ties of friendship and collaboration
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and affection which is with us throughout our lifetime do not unravel at the time of death. confident that god remembers the good retried to accomplish, the love we have shown. let us together remember john murtha and offer to god prayers of thanksgiving and petition for those who grieve. let us pray. lord, jesus, our redeemer, you willingly gave yourself up to death so that all might be saved and pass from death to new life. we humbly ask you to comfort those in grief, the loss of john, and to receive him into your ever-lasting merciful
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arms. you alone are the holy one. we are your instruments to accomplish goodness, peace and security here in this world for those we love. you are full of mercy. by dying you unlocked the gates of life to those who believe in you. forgive john his shortcomings and sins and grant him now a lace of happiness, -- place of happiness, light and peace in your kingdom of glory forever and ever. amen. >> please be seated. ladies and gentlemen, the honorable paul kanjorski.
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>> madam speaker, mr. vice president, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen, we come together today not really to have a ceremony of jack's passing but really a celebration of his life. there aren't many folks in this room or in the congress of the united states that doesn't have a personal story about jack that if related would cause us to smile, chuckle, but also to cause us to recall some seriousness in our lives and in the lives of this nation. even today as i enter the floor of the chamber and i can't help but the first place i look to is jack's chair always expecting him to be there, even today. he'll never be there again. but he's there in spirit, and i
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thought, who is jack to us? to me and i think many of my colleagues here today and throughout the house and the senate, he's a validator. we wanted to check whether we were doing the right thing by him and we have the right thoughts and had we analyzed something properly. and then i thought to myself, because you see that i spent more than 5,000 days with jack murtha, about three to four hours every day. so probably more time than i spent with any other human being on earth, because i used to -- he allowed me to have a little standing room next to his chair. and when there weren't other 30's or 40's around, we talked about other issues, some passing time and having humorous thoughts. but he was also a father confessor. i used to listen to those confessions from many of the members and it was saving.
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i see some smiles of recognizing and missing that confession. well, we've lost our father confessor. we've lost our validator. but in his passing we haven't lost the treasure that jack murtha gave to the house, gave to the congress, gave to the constitution. that will always hold in our hearts and in our minds. and to joyce and the family, we say thank you for the tremendous contribution you all have made to the united states of america. thank you. [applause] >> ladies and gentlemen, the honorable michael doyle. >> so how do we pay tribute to our friend, jack murtha, in two minutes? it's simply not possible,
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although jack, i know you appreciate short speeches. [laughter] let me say four things about jack. number one, he loved his family. joyce, he talked about you all the time, and his children. he was very, very proud. he loved his country, and he especially loved the men@@@@rr"$ you every day for all the days that i'm here. pennsylvania will dearly miss jack murtha, as will this country. [applause]
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>> ladies and gentlemen, the honorable tim holden. >> today we pay tribute to our departed friend and colleague, jack murtha. over 17 years ago i heard jack say that his great grandmother said to him, you were put on this earth to make a difference. and, boy, did he make a difference. he loved his country and he served it with distinction at many levels. he served stateside during the korean war. when the vietnam war broke out, he volunteered again for the united states marine corps, serving a tour, receiving a purple heart, received accommodation from the commandant of the united states marine corps upon his retirement from the marine corps reserves in 1990. he was the first vietnam veteran elected to the congress. he was the longest serving member from pennsylvania ever to serve in the house of
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representatives. he never forgot those brave men and women in uniform and made sure that they had the resources and tools to do the job they do so well. he made sure our veterans had the care that they deserved and visit them so many times in our military hospitals. and he helped so many of us in this house. not one of us can say that we had not gone to jack during our career for help. he will surely be missed by the country, but most notably by pennsylvania. so, joyce, to you and your family, our thoughts and prayers continue to go out to you. thank you. [applause] >> ladies and gentlemen, the honorable robert brady. >> good morning. first, i'd like to advise mrs. murtha that i'm your adopted
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son. i don't know whether or not jack ever told you. good morning, mom. [laughter] i was under jack's wing. it was warm in the wintertime and cool in the summer. he showed me to be courteous to everyone. he made everyone feel special. when we'd visit the troops, he would rather be with the enlisted troops. you knew that because you couldn't find him half the time. he was compassionate. he had a brave heart. he enjoyed a good joke and had a great sense of humor. some of us didn't know that side of him, especially the press. [laughter] with the exception of his family, i was most fortunate than any of you in this room. before we broke any thursday or friday i would help him down
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because, as you know, he had a knee operation. would shake his hand and i would give him a kiss. probably a sight to see a guy like me kissing a guy like him. but we didn't care. [laughter] unfortunately, last january -- this january 27, not knowing it that was going to be the last time i saw him and was going to be the last time i gave him a kiss. so i thank the murtha family. thank you so much for sharing him with us. probably a lot too much. we know what that's like in our lives how we sacrifice our families for this institution. he will -- he will be deeply missed. there will never ever, ever be another jack murtha. so we had this flag flown over the capitol, and we put it on his seat, the only seat that is
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reserved in congress, and we had it there all week. on behalf of the pennsylvania delegation, it will be my honor and pleasure to present this to you. [applause] >> ladies and gentlemen, the honorable bill young. >> jack and i had a very special friendship and partnership. based on mutual respect for each other and based on a strong commitment on both of our parts to make sure that the united states had whatever it needed to stay strong. and that our troops who kept our america strong and whatever they need to accomplish their mission and protect themselves while they were doing it.
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despite that great friendship, jack and i ever socialized. i can't remember if we ever had lunch together. but we worked together every day. in his corner or in my corner or in the well of the house or in the speaker's lobby or walking back between the rayburn building and in the capitol, we talked, we visited, we checked with each other on what we thought were the important issues of the day. we traveled together. we went to far-flung places like the d.m.z. and korea, like to kuwait, like to bahrain, like to bosnia, kosovo. really exciting places like that. but jack's question was, is there anything you need that you don't have, that we can provide for you? the well-being of the troops were primary in his mind. i know there's a great envious in the murtha family.
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when i walk those same halls today, i walk in the committee room that he and i shared, we took turns prosiding, i have a tremendous emptyiness in my heart because here was a big man in my life, a big man in the life of the congress. and so i know the envyness that joyce and the family experience is nothing that can be described. and i know that my emptyiness is nothing compared to their envyness, but just remember, joyce, as tim holden said, jack murtha made a really big difference. god bless you and your family. [applause] >> ladies and gentlemen, the
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honorable stanford bishop jr. >> vivian and i thank you, joyce, and the murtha family for allowing me the time this morning. shakespeare wrote all the world is a stage and all men and women is the players. one man in this time may play many parts. so it was with john p. murtha. he was son, brother, husband to you, joyce, father, uncle, grandfather. a strong family man, the ultimate example to and of the murtha clan. he was a student, soldier, marine, officer and a gentleman. a patriot warrior, the likes of which our nation has seen far too few. a leader, mentor, counselor,
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encourager, advocate, helper, feared adversary, trusted ally, loyal friend who always literally and figuratively stood taller than his peers in courage, honor, dignity and service to others. though i could speak and master english, french, spanish, russian, chinese, vietnamese, farse and any of the other languages spoken by mankind, i would not have enough words combined to adequately express the positive impact that jack murtha's life and service had on his family, friends, his congressional district, congress as an institution, the men and women of our military and indeed the world. he truly made a difference.
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though we continue to grief his loss and know that murtha's corner on the floor of the house will never ever be the same, the pain we share must melt into joy for we have all been truly blessed to know, love and benefit from having shared the stage of life with this very exceptional man. all the world's a stage and all the men and women merely players. each has his entrance and exit. one man in his time may play many parts, but thank you, jack, for playing so many roles in so many of our lives. [applause] >> ladies and gentlemen, the honorable james moran.
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>> leadership is about character. jack had it. he led with it. he led us in putting our families first with his devotion to joyce, his love for his children. he led us in respecting this institution, the people in it, the people who lead it, madam speaker. and he led us in recognizing that the strength of our military comes not so much from the weapons we equip our men and women to kill with, as the values we equip them to live with. jack lived by those values. courage, discipline, compassion . but he was a man of few words who didn't men's his words. and so -- didn't mix his words.
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and so to sum up, jack murtha, you were a great man. we can't afford to forget you and we can't help but love you. [applause] >> ladies and gentlemen, the honorable jerry lewis. >> madam speaker, mr. vice president, friends of jack, joyce, we are very proud to have this moment to express our love and appreciation to you and your family. jack was an amazing experience for me over the some three decades that we worked together on the appropriations committee . i'll never forget a very special moment. it was the earmark of earmarks.
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we found a program in the intelligence committee. that program involved a new asset known as the u.a.v.'s. jack immediately, even though the air force could not imagine our ever wanting an asset where somebody wasn't sitting in a seat, jack recognized the potential of that future asset. and if it were not for his work and for his support for our effort, that $40 million earmark would never have gone forward and predator would have never been in bosnia. another occasion, a demonstration of incredible foresight and leadership. jack murtha joined me in the committee taking a look at tactical aircraft. we decided that we could not go forward with the f-22, and we pulled the procurement for the first seven of those aircraft. you would have thought we blew the top off the pentagon.
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and to say the least, lots of consternation out there, but jack fore saw that unless we tested the software in the wings before we started to fly this baby it never would fly. always willing to lead. charlie wilson's war would not have been charlie wilson's war had it not been for jack murtha. it was his effort that helped us and allowed us to foresee russians out of afghanistan, laying the foundation for the future for freedom in that entire region. all of us know that jack was there to make a difference. but indeed he couldn't stand those who wouldn't get to the point. he always said, let's get it done. any general, admiral, secretary or otherwise who decided that they wanted to have a powerpoint in the committee might as well take their charts and go home.
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[laughter] indeed, few people will have ever impacted the house of representatives and our country's freedom as jack murtha has. thank you. rr>@ "arr" rr"'rrá$ father, family man, man of the house, congressman, colonel, chairman, cardinal,
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dean, beloved. by townspeople, comrades, colleague and staff, man of his word, trusted, expeditionary son of john's town. from korea to havings, from hard-scrabble america in dear hunter country, brave, bold, direct, ready, bipartisan, volunteer for korea and vietnam , intelligence officer, two purple hearts, bronze star, vietnamese cross of gallantry. irish eyes always smiling unless fixed on the enemy. he taught us, observation did he teach us -- oh, did he teach us. pay attention to details.
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consult the ranks. get to the front. work the troops. he muse to charlie wilson, you don't say. is that so. achieve both career goals. marine colonel and member of congress who won his first race by 122 votes. his beautiful wife, joyce, where's a gold medallion today presented by her husband from that race. no one could have done more. lasting friends, enduring lessons, a giant oak. a lion now rests in the allegeny foothills. america's defense is the best in the world because john murtha lived to leave that legacy. at tip o'neill's memorial, jack gave an irish blessing from which we quote with love to his
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strong wife, joyce, children, donald, john and patrick, and their beautiful family, with the full heart of this house led by his speaker, nancy pelosi. may the sunshine warm upon your face and until we meet again may god keep you in the hollow of his hand. we know when love is real. it endures and grows stronger even beyond time. thank you. [applause] >> ladies and gentlemen, united states marine band vocalist, gunnery surge, kevin benear. >> ♪ god bless america land that i love stand beside her and guide her
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through the night with the light from above from the mountains to the prairies to the oceans light would form god bless america my home sweet home god bless america my home sweet home ♪ ♪ from the mountains to the prairies to the oceans light would form god bless america my home sweet home god bless america
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my home sweet home ♪ [applause] >> united states, national security advisor, general james jones. >> madam speaker, mr. vice president, joyce, members of the murtha family. >> when i think of jack murtha, i think of leadership, i think of a life-long commitment to this nation and all that it holds dear. on leadership, there's no question about his qualifications for high office. he achieved the rank of eagle scout when he was a young man. left college in 1952 to join the marine corps.
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and he came as was mentioned a drill instructor at paris island, south carolina, the marine corps recruit depot where he developed the finer aspects of his sense of humor. [laughter] his leadership was recognized early on and from there he went to officer kennedy school, was selected to compete for commission as second lieutenant which he achieved. and then left active duty in 1955. stayed in the marine corps reserve. always faithful to the corps. always serving whatever called for. 1966, he volunteered for duty in the republic of vietnam where he served with great distinction as a battalion intelligence officer on the front lines for which he was recognized with some of our nation's highest awards for valor. the bronze star with a combat v for valor, two purple hearts,
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the vietnamese cross of gallantry. he retired as a full colonel in 1990. those of us who have been privileged to serve with congressman murtha over the years in uniform and out of uniform will always remember his concept of the citizen soldier. in his elected capacity, he always went to the dangerous spots where men and women were serving their country. i accompanied him to sare yea vow -- sarajevo in 2003 which is not a good time to be in sarajevo. s a we were getting off a c-130, a piece of sharp nell flew past us and impacted on some sandbags about 20 or 30 feet in front of us. he turned and looked at me and said, i guess they know we're here. [laughter] but he did -- he did this time and again. he did it quietly.
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did he it modestly. wherever the danger was he went there to see how the men tanned women were, to see how our nation's interests were being protected. and he devoted countless hours to studying and learning about the situation that he was concerned with. he worked tirelessly for the needs of women and men in uniform. he was at the forefront of the all-volunteer force in its establishment for which those of us who spent our careers in uniform will be eternally grateful. as counselor of presidents and -- an advisor to senior military officers, he will inspire him for many years ago. life towards his family, towards his country and towards humanity we will never forget. thank you. [applause] >> ladies and gentlemen, the
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united states secretary of defense, the honorable robert m. gates. >> madam speaker, mr. vice president, joyce, members of our family. like general jones, i had a slightly different perspective than today's speakers since i was not one of jack's colleagues on the hill. but for nearly a quarter of a century i worked with him from the executive branch focusing on the great national security challenges our country faced. from our earliest contacts, i will always remember and be grateful for jack's personal efforts on behalf of the afghan resistance fighting the soviets, as jerry lewis talked about. efforts to help bring about the collapse of an evil empire and bring about the end of the cold war. over the last three or so years, i had the opportunity to work with jack on defense department appropriations. we met privately on a regular basis and had more laughs than you might have thought.
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one of his great qualities was that he was always candid about where he stood and what he thought, and you could always tell when he was getting ready to cut a deal because his eyes would begin to twinkle. [laughter] in october, 2008, about a month before the election, jack and i were meeting alone and he showed me a press article he had marked up. it was a piece speculating about whether senator obama, if he won would ask me to stay at defense and if he did whether i'd agree. in his way jack put his hand on his arm and said if he asks you have to do it. i say i want you to stay. now, coming from jack, that had a real impact on me even though i have somewhat edited his language for this occasion. [laughter] in all of our dealings and over his entire time in congress, it was always clear that jack's first priority and his loyalty
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belonged to the men and women serving our country in the intelligence community and especially in the military. he would do anything to make sure that troops had what they needed. i will greatly miss jack just as this congress and the country will miss an uncommon patriot and one of the truest and most steadfast friends of america's men and women in uniform. thank you. [applause] >> ladies and gentlemen, the speaker of the united states house of representatives, the honorable nancy pelosi. >> mr. vice president, members of the president's cabinet, members of the united states senate visiting to our side, especially the two senators from pennsylvania, senator specter and senator casey, we're honored by your presence,
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to all the many friends and colleagues of jack murtha, but especially to his family, to joyce and the family, thank you, joyce, for sharing jack murtha with us. mr. young said he knew jack very well and they worked together for a long time but they never socialized together. jack never socialized. he went home to joyce every night. many of us who are gathered here have had the privilege of calling jack murtha colleague. many also had a privilege of calling him friend. and so we gather today to mourn a loss of a friend, a dear friend and celebrate the life, a person who was a great legislator, a courageous soldier and a public servant to the end.
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a couple weeks ago a couple of planes full of members of congress, family and staff went to johnstown to pay our respects to jack murtha. we went there to console and we were consoled. we saw the tremendous outpouring of love and respect for jack murtha. thousands of people stood in the snow in line to wait their turn to say goodbye. again, members of the president's cabinet came to the service. and the president of the united states, william jefferson clinton, was there. i hope it was a comfort to the family that so many people at every level of our society appreciated jack's contribution, mourn your loss
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and are praying for you at this sad time. i had the privilege of speaking at jack's service, and i told people of johnstown about the pennsylvania corner. important to note that there are no other named locations in the house chamber. [laughter] pennsylvania corner was a place where jack held court. he was flanked by his two lieutenants. on the west mike doyle, on the east bob brady. senior member, mr. kanjorski, and then all of his pals around. members came from across the country and across the aisle to pay their respects, to get jack's blessing and what they were up to. he always gave them friendship, he always gave them advice. sometimes he gave them support. [laughter] for two weeks since he left us this flag that bob brady gave to joyce and the family has been


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