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tv   Jefferson and Hamilton  CSPAN  November 18, 2013 1:00am-2:11am EST

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>> we will find out how they came out when this is over. i want to talk with you about "jefferson and hamilton." their political battle was over the shape and character of the new american nation. that it has never ended but
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then jefferson came back again in the early 20th century and for a clan roosevelts a new deal embraced jefferson and during roosevelt's presidency in 1943 on the 200th anniversary of jefferson's birth of the memorial was open to it in washington. but then after world war ii was the cold war with america triumphant militarily with the urbanized nation hamilton's reputation and soared again and jefferson's has plummeted someone in the aftermath of the civil-rights revolution about his relationship with sally having this.
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in fact, during the lifetime of jefferson and hamilton both men were praised and condemned just as they have spent by subsequent generations. it seemed as if godhood call them into existence to save a world. there were those that condemned like abigail adams hughes said none of the she thought hamilton wish to be americans napoleon but with his wicked gaius but the devil is in them. [laughter] her husband john adams the talents are greatly exaggerated he went on to
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call him his ambition and restlessness and all the grandiose schemes with this super abundance of secretions that he could not find enough orders to absorb. [laughter] a/s and jefferson was praised by a sum that said he is one of the choice ones and john adams lauded his extraordinary mind and praised him as a gifted writer but lafayette called jefferson good and upright a and mightn't. while meeting jefferson once
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said he is the wisest and most amiable man i have met in europe. but there were those who did not care for jefferson would
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call a lower class background but jefferson on the other hand, was an aristocrat his mother was from the randolph family in virginia he grew up on the plantation. they word different is an appearance. hamilton was about average height 5-foot 7 inches tall so many people describe hamilton as having a somewhat feminine manner about him. jefferson on the and a hand was quite tall at our time period is the equivalent of making people six-foot
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5 inches or 6-foot 6 inches towering over most been. what was described as having a mildly and pleasing personality but it rather shy and serious and a great demeanor with poor posture where hamilton tote -- tended tuesday and ramrod straight and jefferson was described by a senator from pennsylvania while secretary of state as injury a room room, speaking without ceasing in rambling in his talk by offering spicy comments and information as he went said a observer. 10 team to go out going in his personality.
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jefferson hated confrontation throughout his life hamilton relished. jefferson was a manipulative individual and hamilton by the force of his personality but when women riyadh and but as a tough lady killer ailment when the army goes into winter quarters and women went to camp with their fathers hamilton courted so many that they call them hamilton but
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jefferson hated practicing law and the moment he got married in independence economically he quit his legal practice for good. with the fighting that led to on the jefferson has a passion for architecture and hamilton was largely indifferent. during washington's presidency inviting to the residents say the pictures of three men on the wall hamilton asked to are those three men? a response to the three greatest men in history. john locke, sir francis bacon and sir isaac newton
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and hamilton corrected to say the greatest was julius caesar and jefferson never got over that and never forgot that. but for all their differences there were similarities. but jeffers said tellingly so with colonial subservience coming from the author of the declaration of independence to break away from the colonial subservience. so i novelists like charles dickens would be hard pressed to write about i think, hamilton's mother was branded by the courts as a whole or. his father abandoned the
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family his mother and father never married so hamilton was a legitimate. in did not finding enough to occupy their prejudice featured illegitimate children. but on the child himself. he must have experienced some blows we know he was discriminated against in the sense but he said where he was growing up and i think out of that, hamilton is shaped like leaving the child is the father to the man.
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and then driven from that point on to seek fame to seek respect to drive him throughout his life. another similarity is a car with slave zero mate -- slave voting parents hamilton's mother owned five slaves those were extremely ambitious but then that was more than a little and a great deal in hamilton. both valued education. hamilton came tuesday maidenly and college days we can go to college head
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jefferson wrote to his guardian and then go to the college of william and mary saying it would give a more universal acquaintance for him it would be serviceable. both of these men like every one of the founders during the revolutionary era the cave and their patrons in did hamilton's case a presbyterian minister sending to the mainland colonies of what is now of princeton university but the preparatory education it is deficient and after april --
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steady ending up at columbia. shepherded a long term his favorite professor later from the of the lawyer in virginia and is signing the declaration of independence. similar in this sense that earlier i mitch did jefferson was shy and reserved but but so did his utmost to end. and then the other aids they would call him a hammy.
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but they were alike in one of their way that they were both revolutionaries. to be the entry gate and more of the two was hamilton win to determine why he became a revolutionary. if you are a senate barely the opportunist it was part of what went into him becoming a supporter of the american revolution. i don't think he was alone but he did say that about everyone. who was the major figure in the revolution but coming to new york in england which
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started a decade before he arrived a dent looking at the situation hamilton always wanted to do a cow can they did decision which is the best way to go? but if i choose america and a new nation emerges stores will open and is the way will be clear but i would not say opportunism of loan explains hamilton revolutionary bit their recent immigrant to your can like others at all times many embrace their new country and see it to give
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them opportunities that did not exist from where they came from a and they fall in love with their new country and want to serve the new country and hamilton to be sure was intense american and the nationalist from the '70's and 70's until his death in 18 '04. he serves a and risks his life to the revolutionary war. there was more than merely opportunist but in jefferson's case he becomes a revolutionary through the studies of the amendment and preparatory school delves further into it at the college of leaving mary and
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the of undergirding idea of enlightenment was to question everything and he does including his society in virginia and wonders why there are so many people who have so little power and others to have so much and then asks the same questions about english as well and for jefferson the american revolution from the very beginning was about reform to break away from england to create an america that would offer to use thomas paine's term first day of a new world that is slated
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jefferson was after. said to play a very different rules he was a soldier going into the militia then to the continental army and for the first year of fighting he is an officer of the artillery company the observer at the time seems that our retreat to against new jersey he said small and slender in the most delicate and apparently boston thought with his hand resting on the candid every now and then as
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if it were a favorite. have melted one year into his service was offered a position as an 82:00 p.m. did washington. he did not want that and is already offered a position as an aide to lord stirling. he wanted a field command. after all he was unlikely to win a desk job that could win the field command the hamilton debated several days before he finally accepted he thought it would be a short-term appointment as the commander of the ever
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paid. washington was cold and there is a the same way in private. hamilton had lost his father that he they have flooded washington id to be a father to him cella to have a distant relationship that 1.there is a blowup between the two february 1781 washington past hamilton and the hallway of the headquarters i need to see you and hamilton has a load of papers stand said the let me put those but along the
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way distracted by someone and fell into a conversation and forgot about washington. [laughter] when he remembered he went into his office quite late in washington abraded him nobody keeps me waiting he said to hamilton and hamilton's response was i quit. he did. but he told other people including his father-in-law general schuyler what he had done and he told him get back to washington and apologizing in hamilton did that in certain in the untitled position but he said at the time to a friend that i really don't like washington i have seen him close he is a course
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individual and overweighted hamilton said but also putting it to martha washington after her death in 7899 washington is my way to success so he stuck with washington and washington stuck with him during their remaining years. jefferson's revolution and was extremely different well with washington and in battle fighting in said said major is encasements encasements, risking his life at be surprised by a british patrol having to do dive off the boat into the river to swim for safety
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jefferson served first but then in congress but the principal author of the declaration of independence. almost immediately jefferson left congress in and returned to virginia because he was interested in reform the continental congress simply would be a managerial body to manage the conduct of the war and hamilton wanted to return or jefferson rather wanted to return to virginia to carry out as many reforms as he could. he did not always succeed but pushing for reforms so land would become more available id even proposed
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all off lee and less free men be given way and something that did not fly with the virginia assembly but he did push for religious toleration and reform of the statutes in virginia and many of his reforms were realized. is 70 and 79 and after release suffering washington came to the conclusion the best man that once served like benjamin franklin and adams had left and the congress was suffering in their absence washington wrote to mason in virginia to save very pointed the
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the, where is jefferson weather -- with his country needs him? that got back to jefferson and stunned by his apparent criticism jefferson agreed to serve as the governor of virginia. he served to extremely difficult and not terribly successful terms as the governor of virginia of the almost any one of those governors would have had difficulties jefferson had but certainly did have a tempestuous time as governor. for both the time period on the cusp of the 70 '80s were pivotal moments for hamilton the collapse of the american
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economy begins to collapse 1777 and an utterly collapsed i don't see campbell said understood the reasons and washington did body there the bill fiat was flat cahow -- lack of leadership but the problem was steeper than that a and beginning around 1779 getting up at headquarters survey to light a candle to study economics reid being the guy who has my favorite day of all maliki you never
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want to read that but at any rate him molted read those and then he came to the conclusion they english had the right idea the economic system was perfect to feature a strong government strong enough to tax or regulate commerce with the national government of funded debt and in fact, what many now call a fiscal military state in which a given the economic measures that came into play the nation had plenty of money for it to expand as it did
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it acquired more wealth flowing back into english and enabling it to expand even more. so inclined to in the mid 17th century was rather a backwater country in the affairs of europe had by that time become the largest empire in the western world since the roman empire of the country that won the seven year war or the french and indian war and hamilton begins to articulate the vision of the english economic system in a series of essays when he was only 25 years old writing about
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the continental last that pivotal moment ochers when he goes to france. i am not sure what he envisioned after the gubernatorial experience but he said he is finished with politics for a long time. what he may have envisioned was a life like benjamin franklin who retired in his early forties and wrote phillumenists lee essays and pamphlets and newspaper in jefferson saw him as becoming says sage instead of on top the health but do as franklin had done. but jefferson's life took of
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wrong turn his wife died of complications from childbirth. after eighth time in which he appears almost to be suicidal he says he says he may have committed suicide if not for the fact he had three daughters at that point. after he came out of that he wanted to get out of monticello he went to philadelphia where congress was meeting and stays there 75 days. hamilton accidentally was a member of congress at that point. hamilton was very close to james madison ases jefferson. i suspect to must have met
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during his stay in philadelphia although there is no record of any correspondence that either says anything about the other. jefferson eventually received an appointment that turned into a position from 178-4389. it was a pivotal moment. his ideas had already formed to. he longs sense had turned against monarchy and aristocracy and wanted major reforms to usher in the new world for which she dreamed
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but in europe, france and a glint with their shorts day to visit john and abigail adams, jefferson sees a world up close for the first time and he says once he sees it that presence in europe live day more wretched life than the most conspicuously wretched american lives it was epic scale of wretchedness jefferson said in'' civil tear who had said in europe one is either the hammer or the and fellow and did a society most worthy and fill a and jefferson and came away with the conclusion that monarchies and the aristocracy of the army that
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supported them that he be held. but the wealthy kept much of there they and idle for hunting but most people are live lost. where a new road should to cheer harrison said there were americans in the economic plight what america was experiencing told jefferson they were now taking of the good old days of monarchy before pirates
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of fat is if anybody thinks have them see with their own eyes is safe if addressee against the mass of the people. jefferson came home 1789 he planned to read in virginia only six months to get his own economic affairs in order and get his oldest daughter married while he was there and said he hoped to go back to france where he could be an observer of the french revolution that have already begun. when jefferson came home he
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knew a new constitution had been written. he read it and was not terribly happy with it but he knew that washington was to be the first president and was by then and follow all would be well as long as washington was in an office. but the launder jefferson was in america serving as washington is secretary of state of of hamilton was in the same cabinet but as hamilton program that was outlined more than a decade as the program began to unfold, jefferson began to
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see that there was what he regarded as a hidden agenda to hamilton's program. and not just about funding or a bank those were bad enough from jefferson's point of view be he believed hamilton had another agenda and came to the conclusion that they were counter revolutionaries to rollback the birthday of a new world. to restorer much of what as it existed before. why? for one thing during the the constitutional convention hamilton made a five hour speech they were secret that madison took notes with three or four other
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delegates in madison sure they broke the news that they favored a monarchies that he favored that one house of the congress to be the aristocratic body that the members held and they recommended that they we're redone entirely and steadied the economic program as he became more familiar with the constitution jefferson saw hamilton and his forces setting about to bring about what he thought of the european is asian-american.
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they had a constitution that gave the national government enormous power after all there was the supreme law of the necessary improper clause handsaw a program a situation in which in time northern businesses than 5/8 years would control the american end government. already jefferson said there was a corrupt squadron in congress will lead to a dance the interest it -- the interest of merchants over and above those of the average person and sought an incredibly powerful chief
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executive things were safe when washington was there but who would knew what would happen afterwards? to see if fiscal military state leading to the of gargantuan military before the end of the 70's 90's the size of the army was almost tenfold by hamilton's party in the emerging as the leading figure of that provision all our major he saw the program leading to use the doom of the birthday of the new world. in the end jeffers said and triumphs politically wins the election of 1800 in
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calls his victory the revolution of 1800 and roche to tom paid shortly after taking office and told him his election finance us to return generally to the sentiment of former times that had been shared by most americans in 1776 and says in his inaugural address the blood of hero's have been devoted to obtaining these ends and must be the creed of our political faith by which to try this services of those three trust. what were those? a jealous care of the right of election by the people
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and absolute acquiescence in the decision of the majority. that is a quotation from his inaugural address. if jefferson had won that election the revolution of 1800, the rivalry between the two ended with both winning and both losing. hamilton one that the country is transforming economically bad as a'' washington been repeated during the 17 nineties and led to a changing face of america. is still havelock john farms where hamilton proposed the first.
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>> but 18 for a you was working in a factory and that was a harbinger of widespread change throughout the 19th and 20th centuries. if hamilton one a couple days before he writes our real diseases anti-calls to locker see a poison. that is what as he made clear in his inaugural address. near the end hamilton
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realized his day had come and gone roche every day proves to me more and more that this american world was not made for me. jefferson's world was changing he had wanted and favored the arcadian american where most people live on farms and envision that for generations as the company expanded to the pacific coast to take centuries perhaps but jefferson saw of the smokestacks in the factories and new his world was finishing but unlike
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hamilton, jefferson seemed to shrug off his losses. we might as well require a man as civilized society to remain forever under the regime of their ancestors. but he also mary jury stiffed the of flames have spread leaving him down here to proclaim fat life a and celebrity are on a steady evasions. jefferson was certain he had played the fiddle role to establish what she called so world's best hope that there was no place for the tear in a of aristocracy. thank you.
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[applause] [inaudible conversations] >> thank you very much. i am a john adams person myself so these guys are interesting. a professor incredulous school told us that the more he steadied eli table to cover just since so i am curious free-fall in terms of who had a better
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fisherman talking about jeffersonian there was much too wiedmaier. his military service during the revolution, extraordinarily brave coming afire many times. obviously bright and without a doubt the right economic program in most respects for dealing with the crisis that existed at that time period. i did not abandon jefferson plaza attending as now my sense is put, economic
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program leading to coming to fruit is step one dash russian now a plutocracy, a wealth is now distributed just as jefferson said that it would be powering is increasingly the just on main street but with wall street so i think jefferson saw the dangers that were inherent in hamilton's program but i do want to mention one thing in my preface in one respect or minis that jefferson sold hamilton short but i don't think he would understate and the at one dash that
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with hamilton's economic program, there was a spreading of the wealth through the industrialization of america even if hamilton had never lived but he did and did advocate that so to give him some credit for that. and that distribution of wealth raised a good many of ships coming from the working-class background my family came from germany in the 1870's i was a fourth generation to come along put the first to have the opportunity to go to college and my dad was an example of
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him working in the industry thought and is able to send me to college. i admired to both of them. >> we study these people and we transpose into modern times that i was thinking where are they today with a current government dispute over resolutions, closing national monuments, who is to and where would they be standing? [laughter] >> not to dodge the question but it is tough to take somebody from the 18th century world which was so different from our were world.
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one of my favorite lines comes from the novel called the of go-between and in that novel his opening sentence is the past is a foreign country to do things differently. they did back in his time to make it very difficult to see how they would react with jefferson obviously favored a small government and more power for the state's anti-even flirted with nullification which is a variant now with the shutdown of the national government and hamilton favored a branch strong
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third government. the power is essential for liberty in the first. and at as close side can come to play in a contemporary context. >> is there a contemporary point they are putting us on the past two political parties or factions? >> jefferson in the wake of the passage of the basic bill washington inciting jefferson and madison go on the trip up to new york it was jefferson's attention not to found political parties but to take people who had reservations about the constitution is even
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more so people in congress who had reservations about hamilton's economic program to bring about a concerted opposition not to undo but prevent him from going any further with that. jefferson had not planned a political party but it becomes a political party and within one year madison calls it a party and calls it the republican party in hamilton does the same in response to rally people that supported his vision to put together the federalist party. early on they realize that
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something like political parties were around and no question with the presidential election the first contested election they both saw them as being in place. >> first-ever -- i enjoyed your lecture very much. i want to take issue quickly. washington became the father figure to lafayette to and there was quite a relationship so i have to give worthiness to washington as the father of our country. >> i said i was a cynic and lafayette was french and france was the ally in the senate could say how much of washington's relationship with coffee at was
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diplomatic and how much was father. >> no dichotomy there. in response to the person who wondered how they would stand today, you quoted i found it remarkable you talk about wearing the coat as a boy a civilized society of their ancestors but the next line that i think people will find pertinent to do jeffersons mind is a wonderful vision remind quite the opposite how they stereotyped his views of today that jefferson said. >> each generation has the right to choose for itself a form of government it
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believes most promoted of its own happiness a solemn opportunity of doing this every 19 or 20 years provided by the constitution. >> he says very much the same thing during shays' rebellion. and while many people were outraged by the rebellion jefferson passed it off to say the tree of liberty has to be watered with patriots. he measured a generation and lasting about 20 years so he was a revolutionary who favored a change in the sense each generation could decide for itself. quickly, hamilton is responsible for jefferson
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being our third president. is exactly. hamilton was never president but as a federalist with before a merger or a house to lobby for urd jefferson no weighing the difference over aaron burr because he said although we differ is in political philosophy he cares about this country as much as i do but ehrenburg only thinks of himself. so i want to sway the house to vote for jefferson for president. i think that is very fitting for jefferson's vision to be above hamilton is capitalistic vision to up old his egalitarianism. [laughter] [applause] >> i think he begrudgingly thought as bad as he was he
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was better than aaron burr. [laughter] >> jefferson is presented it did other work as dogmatic and self righteous and that seems to contrast with the enlightenment thinker and the great mind to have such cosmopolitan thoughts so if you see that contrast and what do you think of the portrayal? >> i agree with much of the portrayal. certain they jefferson's views form in the seventies and sixties.
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he expands those views but never questions from that point on a and what he came to at that point. but that was true of most of the people. >> thank you for your presentation. . .
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