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tv   Nato Thompson Discusses Culture as a Weapon  CSPAN  February 18, 2017 11:00pm-11:58pm EST

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. >> obama as legacy what he accomplished as president what is the most significant accomplishment of the obama administration quick. >> of the gaieties saved our economy but would he was handed 2009. we were in bad shape and he went to work. >> again what would he be most criticized for quick. >> what hurts the most with the separation of guns in
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our nation. >> can you find any policies or accomplishments of historical significance quick. >> of all issue of clean air or clean water and was done with 189 countries . >> good evening ladies and
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gentlemen. tonight we are excited to hear from the artistic director author and editor and curator. with the brand new book. we have christian viveros-faune been of art critic and most recently please join me to welcome christian viveros-faune and nato thompson. [applause] >> not exactly the best weather but deal know what happened? might train i was on amtrak
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and there are no trains going right now i was stuck on the train and then i thought i will miss my book talk and i talked to the two people next to me we ran out and got an uber at the google map said estimated arrivals 7:00 p.m. and i got your. i had to get that off my chest. it is nice to be in a comfy seat right here next to christian. but kate and chad and they
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are going at the bookstore also. with that phenomenal support. i will do little talk. get. >> not that occupy was depressing and at that time by a and looking and socially engaged art from around the of world. with the space between art and life. and one show that i was not doing and trying to make the
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world better place. event is the bigger show. when using culture and -- using the culture. but that the team party is the same thing. and marketers to be with the socially engaged charge. so to be quite aware that. but i was interested in a few things. and an art level to put art into the conversation
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because in many respects talk about it like we're still in 1922 with a the language of the arts that seems to be removed from the other world. to be radically inc.. with the brand new strategy and just to say that production of how we feel as a very powerful force but what is interesting as it started to work on this book with these larger cultural forces with the make negative shift of scale of course unless you're like a
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rich harvest but in general with that individual painting or that one expression that this treatment negative discrete act in terms of multiple images so one of the task was to put hour to into the language to talk about bald one impression and also was restarted, we will avoid this word for a little while because it is such a black call of conversation we will
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try to avoid the t word. but one of the things that struck me is a starkly a long tradition being blown away how irrational they are. so trying to understand why at the height the economic depression into seidman gave tyrannical dictator. and in london and thomas frank basically to
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understand why to side with the g.o.p. so that constant lament is like why? and i did think of this standing on the shoulders. but rather to have an answer was much more to appreciate the problem. if the people understood the economic interest it is just to get back to classic marxism. and not like humans but i
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feel like a one-two reshaped how difficult is to appreciate and then to feel a certain way. that unprecedented historical levels. since all many people with those desires and fears. in those personnel things but instead of saying that is not who we really are.
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and then to talk about the military. >> they certainly were. did you know, that ikea was built with the guggenheim museum in mind? fun fact. if you walk through their with the socialist branding in the early fifties and said this is amazing. and then you get a certain feeling just like that.
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because you were in a beautiful amazing the largest fall bookend the world. >> to give a sense of scale. >> is pretty hefty but i digress. >> to get from the u.s. military is the cultural turn of the military maybe we can harken back to american history word george bush already declared victory and basically said
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we will turn this war around from their hearts and minds. this is a brandy a marketing campaign. with those services are ground forces in afghanistan. so there is that. talk about the classic conversation is somebody said to me.
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in to be suspicious of creativity. this seems that everybody is on the planet and p.t. barnum of real-estate. with the mixed-race queer friendly blue -- boom and to be noted as he recanted his ways. i was wrong. >> after we made all this money on it.
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but to some degree has sold america but it is of lifestyle of urban living. in certainly that is very prescient to shape the world leader in. but coulter has a lot to play with that. what is that called? sounding duh trumpets.
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i was interested in something called cause related marketing. so philanthropy in doing good things in the world that is extraordinarily huge right now. to be familiar with the month of october with the color of pink that comes around with breast cancer awareness month. everybody wants to get in on it. so i just read that israeli military you can have the breast cancer awareness month.
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i am sure you are aware the nfl always as pink cleats as they are desperate to break into the female market. it is profoundly for most corporations a profound month but is something to think about. and people like to pay for that. what do we do? riddles. it is hard to be ethical in this life and in the final chapter with computers but what is profound about steve jobs is it is more like your
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own computer but it is very personal and think about when everybody to name his apple. and they're very personal. and private and loving and sexual and hungry and angry. but to understand very intuitively to be as part of the internet megaphone.
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to be exacerbated and perpetuated by a thing called the computer and with social networking with a radical revolution particularly in the age make us feel something. and to make it into the social computer. and then to walk down the street. what is going on in the collective heads? the shift from the television to the computer that nitrite to talk about
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and fearful man wanting to be lugged social creatures and are very connected. in ways that it will shape of world and now i a and i'm excited to chitchat with christian. thanks for coming out. >> as we mentioned before and then to propose that and then your parents and in this case me will limit discussion to the commander chief but i found his book
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as a lot to say about where we've got to be today but it puts forward when you put the titular attention to that phenomenon with that underpinnings with postmodernism and politicians as part of americana up. and increasingly in short supply at actor was referred to as the rational subject. and agent that is consistently rational and
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even with those six. human beings would understand that status with good interpreted the information. and is a fallacy. with a global strategy that is developed to be profound and ubiquitous weapon to remain an appreciative of automatic the shift and techniques of power have to come. and jeff 1 foot solidly planted in the world of reason.
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it you use a heavy pause. and something that democracy is a fallible project dependent on russia subject and does not exist. release nato? let me see if i have this right. and how they would miss use. >> to be quite fair to people barrett is a lot, we expect a lot in america we need to get our heads around clonidine judge with the financial system
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amalgamations of governments and americans in particular to feel up to the challenge. but when you think about where to begin our information from? so if you think even more broadly what makes us who we are not just knowledge but how you go to school or where you work and there is a secret history to america. it was not behavioral economics. to associate their way through the world.
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and that is the tradition to appeal to that so i'm not saying with the women's march that is amazing but to let go of that for a second. >> to appreciate? is there a way to consider mobilizing that like rationality? >> there is. totally we know a few things that the activist use all the time fear is the most important notion and naysay he only uses fear? any person empower would say
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why don't use the biggest gun in your arsenal if you want to win? those in chicago aeronautic and seducing fear and quite frankly the biggest benefit we have right now is he who will not be named as a backlash. fear and hate. and that seemed to work. so to instrumental lives so for whatever purpose we will get into this but it can be very profound.
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but videos that tend to circulate the most part the cops that beat the crap out of kids'. that seems to be the language is broadly important historical movement to get traction the most terrific video supply police violence so why doesn't that take it to the fears? why isn't that echoed for that strategy? oh i guess it does with black lives matter and i and and mystified as to why there is not an approach
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except from the left. >> what is tricky this is fun to talk about you know, that magician guy? he has black magic and white magic and it was basically using science and symbols to make somebody do something. basically not to instrumental lies but in a crass way i feel that many of us trade in black magic in a very basic level.
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like their online presence. you are summer always caught between the image of herself into instrumental lives of yourself to have basic rules of branding to construct those identities to be caught up in that language of coulter. >> the second chapter is titled the of persuaders corrects give us an idea. >> funny enough we should mention adam curtis at the big part of the beginning. >> we were talking about
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that yesterday. >> and then going down the cul-de-sac looking at me. [laughter] but looking at the early public relations with with the nephew of sigmund freud preachers predominantly the thinking just had that intuitive sense like karl rove like p.t. barnum but the unfunny enough we're in the world of locals and nephews that is interesting.
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id to represented the industry in a profound way with that early in the standing of truth. >> and with those alternative fax. and to save the following to me. so what do you mean? >> try this one.
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>> the problem with analyzing capitalism that is the classic marxist activists problem but that is like if there is water everywhere. isn't exactly the answer. i actually simultaneously believe the internet needs and fears to not play along those classical lines.
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that is why they cannot get right the fear of revolution and. with the earth itself. there isn't a profound respect to have answers to all kinds of questions not to say that with health care and social justice and with basic policy things but typically it is a very appreciative. >> but what you're pointing out is that initiative of the emotional turned and
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that is a super important part of your book. with the hyper normalization. in just like this behavioral economic -- economists. and just like those on the left we should be running away from. >> but the other part. >> and i would have mentioned that. >> there is a few things to this. because it is patently
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untrue. >> that is not even how i mean it there is a lot of pressure to be interesting self expressive people in that value particularly in america in capitalism even coca-cola will tell you representative the papers and the cubicles. i am a free individual but also and a way to save the arts. with those forces that are out there to language up we don't talk about scale.
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or impressions. >> cumene this in the biggest backer cents? but we are talking cultural phenomena in but i do think there is profound things to have on its side. if they don't want to help each other. >> we're trying to help each other. but those connections
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talking about ikea but those have existed for very long time. for what props up a little remember specifically where that is in the chapter but that is one of the many moments that you lay out that is serendipitous. >> in trying to imagines the basically to say they're really trying to get my attention and to but for him
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is amazing to be a novel experience but looking into that crystal ball that ikea is nowhere on the radar with three-dimensional cheap hotdogs and meatballs to talk about that incredible successive life of daycare that ikea offered because they employ the socialist values but yet they are blue and yellow apparently the one in red hook was so were overrun with parents with child care they had to rethink because it was the chaos so we did not really mean that. please? anita little bit of that.
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but just to say what is profound with ikea is that radical shift of all consuming know the brand can be. >> it is coming into your own home for. >> it is right there. >> i use amazon. and i feel like such a dick. >> teetoo you use uber? >> dated from philly to hear >> that's right. that is how you got here. >> i became a shareholder on the trip but before we run at a time let's get to the t word and the of the year
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chapter that you call for your machine? so in that chapter you refer to the infrastructure of fear that sounds like the title of a movie what is the infrastructure of fear? >> the classic is present at is whether like the term prison industrial complex in isn't accurate it makes you believe the way they're made is to make money but the reason they are made is because you can get a lot of power out of people being afraid of someone to go skyrocketing under reagan
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and bush and clinton the fear of the inner-city black male to get cheap political points over the course of the decade and then to have no rational reason to be here. nobody is even interested. it is just an aggregate of cheap uses of the year. -- fear. >> what do you mean by that? died just don't think fere has that i think if you say you will have something to
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hope for somebody says holy shit teeter is the man behind you with the ninth. run. we are not preprogrammed but obama was such a branded campaign getting into trump what is irritating with those neoliberalism with day class analysis with the abstract solidarity. and out of antipathy. and indignation.
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tuesday now that they are trolls. we're all sharing shan't information we're just like cranky little people in america because that is how we communicate. >> like when liberals tweet their outrage. that only goes to the like-minded people that is true. >> landed google tells you do no evil. >> we should probably take some questions. >> thanks for your talk.
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and while we live off of a grid 2.0 we are all participants i have not yet read your book but is it worth exploring at all those examples of the strategies and with those branches of culture. because it is all consuming? >> that is a great idea for another book. that is a great idea because it just says everything is the same land is not to the cultural machen nation's and quite frankly if you did grow up in a commune with no computer you'd be really
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different than other people. how you live is different than who you are and i was rereading the unabomber manifest very problematic died clearly but it does reid especially prescient with the deep desire to unplug and that sensibility that it is a dramatic effort to get help of that network world that we are in. also the biggest misogynist maniacally patriarchal. [laughter] >> but i meant to say i
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would not be surprised in the future and the tighter the web the more dramatic to get out from under it. i used to love it because the internet was so bad but we could actually focus. we have bad internet but things got otherwise they feel like my other life. >> does coulter and america change with interpreting right-wing radio or cultural productions inherently we
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don't see on the coast? is that how we interpret that that western culture is interpreted as a weapon? >> yes. i don't differentiate in this book. i tried but somebody out here i try not to get specific although i am guilty about that class said culture that you talk about with the ideas and those of what we belong to and in that sense there is a very different kind of culture. if you look at red state blue stay clear of the geography plays a profound
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role in the way you will understand who you are. if you live 30 miles outside the city you'll think radically different that is just empirical facts. a profound about five of those forces should give pause to think about ourselves. >> in your book you talk about how corporations and political groups use culture as a weapon into this whole terrible realm so to what extent may be gave them the idea in the first place so
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not to have to take that bullshit as part of that difference stratosphere? >> i don't know but i certainly think the arts are much more influential in the beginning period with branding and marketing with the much bigger machine people like oil will be and others once in a while they were barred from the art world but there is a guy named leo burnett because they did things that artist would never do. he had the yellow of a loop -- envelope and he was
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assessed with midwestern corniness. and trying to be a rages or to stand out where burnett strategy was to blend in. to fade into the familiar. that is something he came up with as far as advertising. so the are taking to -- dual lot but to be participating in that economy visual arts are contemporary arts because then you are an india luxury economy. >> more questions?
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>> i do have the quick question that part there are two quotations that are perfect in the persuader chapter. you have an investigative journalist say to live mostly by catch phrase that the public operates through pictures in their heads. so we come to the idea of what coulter does and i tried to save the link between storytelling and fear because we're not talking about the irrational subject the somebody who listens and is convinced.
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how do you reconcile that with your politics? >> back to trump. if we go to that we all benefit when there is a simple story to tell. trump is a good story to tell. it is party -- harder to rally people. who is the protagonist? but trump is a protagonist there are many stories to fill a book from his wild tales but it is a natural way that we think from the filmmaker from edward snowden does that bother you as a filmmaker because ultimately they have to reduce all abstract
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political phenomenon. and she said that is how we have got our information for so long. for the news stories and that is so true. because we've become very dependent on good guys and bad guys like that arc and obeyed the rules of storytelling and i find myself that dumb to it. >> my partner and i walked away very jazz after hearing the speaker and then november happens. i am curious about your opinions of the people who were in the luxury class. how has that responsibility of artist changed?
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>> the funny thing is that they do think activism that does great in the next four years one of the biggest social movement the country has seen i think there are so many people galvanized for all of the reasons i have articulated it is problematic that is the same reason why the movement will do very well. i think many people are mobilized in this country but ultimately at a very different level we're having a very soft arabs bring -- arab spurring spring in a profound way to put your
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finger in the of water like bernie sanders can say with socialism the way trump can be done nazi racist that shows you how wide-open and that bodes very well for those active movements, for creative production but the caveat is from those complex machen nation's better out there and will be supported by google and every corporation right now. so to untangle how this fits together of social justice. >> success with life for politics.
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>> board just get the fucker out of their laugh laugh. >> but there is a breach clearly from the activism and my caveat is that i know 1 tons and tons of work that is nothing but social practice. >> we have time for one more question. >>. >> [inaudible]
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>> yes. ultimately at would say as much as we get bored with things that our popular very fast idol but activism or social justice in a different category but that said there is a big movement with real issues so we do think it will grow but i do think it will struggle i mean all movements struggle with it like occupy will street already in the third month with a lot of internal tension so there will be a lot of grabbing on. >>


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