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tv   Global Energy Outlook  CSPAN  January 17, 2018 1:56am-3:43am EST

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tonight, a look at the global energy outlook. then the johns hopkins university hosts a forum on transparency at the food and drug administration. later remarks from russian foreign minister, sergei lavrov. next, a look at the global energy outlook with fatih birol. he testified before the senate energy and natural resources committee about issues including u.s. oil and gas production. this runs an hour and 45 minutes.
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good morning, efveryone. the committee will come to order. i'd like to provide specific welcome this morning to our new member, senator smith. it is good to have you as part of the committee. i think you will find that this is a committee that does good work. we like to focus on policy and we like to do things in a bipartisan way every now and again. looking forward to starting the new year off with that good foot. we don't have senator capito with us this morning but she is also returning to our committee and i look forward to welcoming
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her in her ongoing contributions. we do have a lot on the agenda today. our broad bipartisan energy natural resources bill where again we're looking forward to continuing that as the year progresses. our efforts to increase our nation's mineral security, our need for wildfire funding fix paired with for estry management reforms, park maintenance backlog, islands and territories. we've got a wide range of public lands. those are a few of the things that we have on deck for this new year. we're probably going to have a lighter attendance this morning. i think many members are still returning to washington ahead of this evening's vote, but i truly thank you, dr. birol, for your attendance this morning. i think, as i mentioned to you, we look to the iea for its guidance, for its forecast, for better understanding of what is
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happening around the world. so you being here this morning to help set the stage for the year and provide your agency's perspective on the domestic and global energy outlook is greatly, greatly appreciated. the good work done by the iea helps to identify market trends and provides valuable information to guide policy decisions both here in the united states and around the world. iea's insight and analysis helps us move our policies in the right direction. in turn, our work helps the iea with its core mission, promoting energy security, cooperation and stable markets. we cannot emphasize too strongly how significantly the role of the united states has evolved in recent years. as dr. birol notes in his prepared statement, he says the united states has become the undisputed global oil and gas leader. during my time here on the committee both as ranking member and as chair, we have gone from
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discussing the needs to site lng import terminals all along our coasts to now expediting lng export terminals. we've gone from lamenting our reliance on foreign oil and the steep price of that oil to the united states being the world's swing producer in an era of abundant energy. technology innovation and the shale revolution have led the way and the administration is working hard to reduce barriers to energy development, allowing for increased exploration and production in the united states as we did at the end of last year with the opening of alaska's 1002 area will provide for long-term security and allow us to expand our influence in world markets. at the same time, we know that these markets are cyclical and prices could rise substantially in the future if we do not take proactive steps to spur investment and supply.
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i know the iea has continued to conduct significant research on this matter and i look forward to delving deeper into that this morning. although the iea was established on the premises of cooperative oil security, the agency has also evolved and expandsed its mission to cover a wide range of topics including energy efficiency, the digitalization of energy and one that i'm particularly interested in and that's the cost reduction in renewable technologies which portend major shifts in how we generate and use energy. our committee has examined these topics largely through a domestic lens, so today we have the benefit, again, of an international perspective, a broader view that ties together world trends and events. we certainly look forward to it. so again, doctor, thank you for taking the time this morning to come and testify. we know that your schedule is very, very busy when you travel from paris, and we appreciate
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your willingness to share your expertise and the work of the iea with our committee. with that, i turn to senator can cantwell for her opening comments. >> i think i did suggest at one point in time that we visit dr. birol instead. i so appreciate him being here today and the focus on increasing energy security for its member nations and i appreciate its continued focus on expanding the definition of energy security as well because energy security means more than just oil and gas flowing in and out and across borders. it also means protecting critical infrastructure from both physical attacks and the cyber security attacks that have been the subject of a lot of the past administration's focus on the review and what we need to do to upgrade that and upgrade the security of our nation. we must take action to protect our critical infrastructure from cyber security attacks and
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ensure the security of energy, our grid and energy networks are under constant cyber attack from 2012 to 2016, reported cyber incidents against u.s. critical infrastructure more than doubled. now that our vulnerabilities have been exposed by various attempts including russians to hack into our elegrid, we must e steps to protect our infrastructure. i very much appreciate the chair last year traveling to the pacific northwest to see the latest and greatest both technologies and approaches to cyber security and she and i have worked on legislation that we passed out of the united states senate. we're hopeful that some time our colleagues in the house will make this a priority and move forward on working on cyber security since its infrastructure is so important. obviously diversifying our energy mix is another key part of the energy security puzzle and security means minimizing
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the financial consequences of climate impact which threatens our well-being at home and around the world, investing in renewable energies and moving away from fossil fuels and moving into energy efficiency and ways to help drive down costs. we've seen great, great examples of a -- i'm forgetting the right terminology but the fact that the energy savings from energy efficiency is continuous flow of investment into business that makes them even more competitive which then allows them to stay ahead on a competitive basis. those numbers on energy efficiency as we look at everything from the bullet foundation building to a focus on how to make more of these developments worldwide, very, very exciting technology that we're very proud of from the pacific northwest. according to the iea's world energy outlook, renewable energy will make up two-thirds of global investment in electy el.
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energy efficiency is also a key on the energy security side and having the total energy use would have more than doubled according to iaea without energy efficiency so this has been saving us in so many ways. as you noted, i think it's one-third the cost to develop a kilowatt than save. it's important that we continue that. while we're discussing energy dominance and energy security i hope we'll hear a lot less about just these exporting issues, although we worked hard here on the committee to come up with strategies that clarify what our national policies were on that and focus on what we can do to again drive the cost effectiveness of energy, whoever has the most cost effective energy solutions are going to continue to win in the
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marketplace. i look forward to hearing your comments on that today, and again, thank you for being here. >> thank you, senator. dr. birol, welcome again to the committee. for those who are not familiar with dr. birol, he took office as iea executive director in september of 2015 after 20 years with the agency itself. previously dr. birol held the position of chief economist with responsibility for directing the flagship world energy outlook publication. he's been the founder and the chair of the iea energy business council. he has a whole series of accolades and awards that have been con fefred upon him over the years. again, dr. birol, we appreciate the insight that you will provide for us and the good work
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of your team at the international energy agency. we welcome you and we invite your comments this morning. typically we ask those who are testifying before the committee to try to limit their comments to five minutes, but because you are the sole panel before us, i welcome your extended remarks and we'll have an opportunity to query you with regards to other issues. so thank you, and good morning. >> madam chair, ranking member cantwell, distinguished members of the committee, thank you very much for the opportunity to appear before you today and present the international agency's remarks for globe at energy markets. i would like to wish everybody a happy new year.
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2017 was a very successful year, a year of growth and continued success. one of the highlights of our successful year, 2017, was in november our ministers across the world came together to discuss the global energy issues, how they see the challenges in different countries and provided guidance to international energy agency. i would like to thank the u.s. government, especially secretary perry for his personal involvement. we have several businesses joining our meeting, at least part of it. several ceos from the united states joined us, the ceo of exxonmobil and other ceos in energy renewable companies
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across the world and we had a wonderful meeting with a very good discussion and i would like to reflect some of the discussion to you today. before going through some of our thoughts and findings, i would like to just very brief, if i may, madam chair, tell you what iea is all about. we were formed in 1974 in the wake of the oil crises basically by mr. henry kissinger himself and several other statesmen across the world, and we are now 43 years old. the motivation was oil security, to look after the oil security issues, providing a mechanism across the world. throughout these years our
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mandate has evolved, as madam chair mentioned. we look at the oil, gas, renewables, energy efficiency, environmental issues, investments and all the technologies. iea is a unique organization which looks at all the technologi technologies for the markets and our well-being. we have several member governments in all the continents and energy is a very hot topic in many governments, many countries, so we tried to bring some factual information for the governments, the decision makers to discuss, debate, and come up with hopefully good solutions for their countries and for their citizens. to provide a basis for our discussion, i would like to tell you how we see the global energy
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markets in the next years to come. i will highlight four major trends which will affect all of us. i would like to say that countries, even the united states, one of the most important energy countries in the world, even the united states is not an energy island. what percentage of other countries affect everybody else. four major trends, upheavals we call them, will affect all of us in the next years to come given the size of the changes and also the speed of those changes. it is important for all of us to take note of them.
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what are these four major upheavals which are going to transform our energy markets and some of the definitions, discussion we used to know but perhaps we need to change now. number one, madam chair mentioned the united states is said to become the undisputed leader of oil and gas production for many years to come. this is number one. number two, the cost of renewable energies are going down so significantly that they are becoming the first choice of power, new power plants in several countries across the world. these are not necessarily driven by environmental concerns but only for the cost concerns because they are becoming very cheap. when i say renewables, this is
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mainly solar and wind. this is number two. number three, china. china recently changed its economic policy, moving from being an industrial workshop, work house, manufacturer, slowly but surely to a lighter economy and with the new model making the skies of china blue again, china is moving in the direction of clean energy which will help major implications for all of us given the sheer size of the china markets. this is gas, renewables, nuclear power and others. fourth and last upheaval is that within the energy system we use energy, the share of electricity is moving very strongly.
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electric consumption is moving faster as our lives are becoming much more connected. so these are the four major upheavals that we see as very important. if i can integrate topics, and put the u.s. into the end, starting with the clean energy technologies. as senator cantwell mentioned, the cost fell down substantially. in the beginning, several countries subsidized, especially european countries, subsidized solar. but now, especially china, pushed solar and there is a concept in the economy learning
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by doing. the more you do something, the better you do it and the cheaper you do it and the cost of solar is not going to very low levels. the cost of wind is also going down, and in addition to industrial countries, major growth of renewables are coming from today emerging countries, especially china and india are the leaders. china is today number one country in terms of solar and number one country in terms of wind. when we look at the future, we see that the cost of solar and wind continue to decline and they are going to compete very soon with the traditional sources of electricity.
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this is something important and why china and others are pushing solar. it is not necessarily as some people may think for primary reason is not climate change. primary reason is because it is cheap. the second is that another issue, especially in china and india, is the city -- local pollution in the cities. to reduce the local pollution, those countries are pushing solar and wind substantially and they are becoming cheaper and cheaper. we are seeing a big growth of solar and wind in the next years to come, and if i can give you one number, in 2016 of all the power plants in the world, solar alone was more than 50%.
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other renewables plus coal, plus gas plus nuclear 50%. the other 50%, solar capacity alone. so this is something that we need to take into consideration. i should also mention that the renewable, especially solar and wind, also has a short coming, namely, they are very much tied to weather conditions. in india when the family comes home, the first thing they do is turn on the air conditioning, turn on the television when there is no sun. so it is difficult to -- it is not very easy, i should say, to match when there's sun and when the electionty is very high.
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but it's coming stronger and cheaper. another point on electricity, it is going very strongly everywhere. electricity consumption grows two times faster than the overall energy consumption. industrial processes are becoming more and more electrified and air conditioners are a major driver. this is important to note and therefore what kind of power plants we are going to build is a key question and at the same time it will be more used, more dominant in our social and economic lives, the electricity security becomes a critical issue. in the case of electricity consumption, our entire economic
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and social life and communication processes will be paralyzed. therefore it is an area that the international agency is working on, the issue of security. third, china, third upheaval. china is today the largest energy consumer of the world by far and in the last year china's president xi said we want to make the skies of china blue again. once again, pushing the chinese energy prospect into cleaner direction. lots of support for renewable energy. lots of support for energy efficiency. lots of support for natural gas and electricity. china is today in terms of markets to give you the size, half of the coal in the world is used in china. other half, everybody else put
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together. china today is putting a cap on the coal consumption in order to limit the pollution in the cities basically. china is with the new policy replacing coal with renewable but also with natural gas. if i may come back to what i said in the beginning, no country is an energy island. china is going from coal to gas in a very short period of time, major energy imports and as a result of that, within one year of time, the energy process in asia-pacific jumped from $6 to $11, almost doubled because of china's new policy. this will affect everybody, exporters and others. china is going to be the largest oil consumer very soon, overtaking the united states.
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another area which i would like to bring to your attention is nuclear power and china. china today is the country which is the most engaged with the nuclear power industry and we see that more than one-third of all the nuclear power plants in consumption today will be in china and with what's happening in the united states, our numbers show that in ten years of time, chinese nuclear capacity will overtake the united states and china will be number one and united states will be number two in terms of nuclear capacity if the current policies do not change. but in general, china's policies are changing. ten years ago you may remember, as a result of the china boom, it was an impact on the oil markets, coal markets, emissions. now this will also affect the
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energy markets. my final point, madam chair, is about the united states and perhaps another critical area of the energy markets. the u.s. is becoming the undisputed leader of oil and gas production worldwide. in terms of oil, oil production is going very strongly and we continue to grow all of our expectations and we think that this growth is unprecedented. the size of the growth and the pace of the growth. we have seen such a big growth in the history of oil only once.
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libya expanded their oil field, the biggest oil field in the world. in terms of natural gas, the united states again as a result of shale gas is increasing in production strongly and going to bring a lot of energy to the markets and we expect the u.s. will be the largest energy exporter of the world in the 2020s. both of these developments have implications for the prices, nor energy security worldwide, trade, investments and of course for the u.s. economy. this is definitely good news for the u.s. economy, both the developments on the gas and the oil side, and our projections
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show that this leadership of the united states in terms of oil and gas will continue many years to come, especially if it is combined with the right domestic policies. so these are the four major upheavals we see, madam chair, namely, the cost of renewables are going down substantially and they will be mainstream fuel, considered as a romantic fuel in the past. they are not anymore. they are mainstream fuel now. second we see that now. second, we see that electricity is becoming more important fuel in our society, and our economic lives, our social lives with a lot of efficiency gains, but also bring a lot of challenges, especially in the context of the electricity picture.
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for china, it is changing. policies going from coal-based, heavy industry economy, slowly but surely to a clean energy technologies. and making more and more use of natural gas and fourth, perhaps the most importantly, the united states is becoming the undisputed leader of oil and gas for the years to come. so i would like to finish my words, madam chair, that the energy agency is following the developments in the united states, and across the world. we are talking with all the governments around the world. and we are trying to bring the best advice based on effects, analysis and data, and we are today and anytime at your disposal to answer your questions. thank you very much.
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>> thank you, dr. birol. a great deal to think about here this morning. and again, to understand how the united states has assumed this role, as you say, to be the undisputed leader, certainly when it comes to oil and gas, but recognizing the nature of how we got there and how quickly we have assumed this position. it is certainly something to consider. but also recognizing what you have shared with us, and the role that china is playing, and how that, too, will not only impact energy production and consumption around the world, but more specifically to us here in the united states. you have mentioned that with regards oil and gas production
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here in the united states, that this is good news for the u.s. economy and for our trade, especially, and i'm quoting you here, especially if come bind with the right domestic policies. when you make that statement, are you -- are you referring to tax policies, are you referring to energy policies? is it a combination of all of that? if you can go just a little bit more into that, i'd be curious. >> of course. now, the united states is a very fortunate country because you have oil, gas, renewable energy sources, and you have very innovative business here. so by the improvement of the technology you will get more and more oil and gas from the existing resources if the right incentives are provided to the industry.
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this is number one. number two, i believe u.s. has huge potential to make more use of renewable energies, solar and wind especially. and i was really happy to see that the current support for the renewable energy policies are continuing in a strong way. >> the production tax credits? >> exactly. third, this one concept in the united states, which is very important, the independence, energy independence. and energy independence is based on two factors. one is the increasing the production a lot, and second keeping the consumption at a certain level and not to waste energy, namely energy efficiency. so i think the -- when i imagine a domestic energy policies, i
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believe in addition to the supply side policies, production policies have to increase oil and gas, we must also put emphasis on the using energy efficiently so that we don't waste energy, but have the same results and same productivity from the system. so all in all, i think u.s. energy system is going in the right direction, lots of resource. but domestic policies need to help them. >> appreciate that. let me ask you a question, specific to the arctic. i focus a lot in these spaces, and not just the u.s. arctic, but the arctic broader. and last year i had an opportunity to visit the nelkoya facility in hammerfest in norway, significant amount of natural gas is processed and shipped to europe. of course over in russia, what we are seeing on the yamal peninsula, and elsewhere, as
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they're exporting their lng across the world, including to china, what role do you see the energy resources from the arctic, whether it be oil, whether it be gas? and this is, again, not just looking at the united states, but the bigger energy picture, specifically coming from these arctic northern countries. >> thank you very much. we have huge deposits of oil and gas in the arctic region across the world. there are two challenges there. the one challenge is the economic challenge. we have a lot of shade oil. whether or not they will be able to get the investors. and second, some of the arctic resources may pose environmental
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questions. these are the two issues. moving from there, i will put oil and gas differently. in terms of oil, we have a huge, according to u.s. geological survey, we have huge deposits, and if you look at the -- especially the arctic nation resources area, we see that there is a very important effectiveness there, namely availability of the trans-alaska pipeline, which is under utilized today substantially. and you have the chances, if the production was to take place, you have the chances of the possibility of transporting it in a very easy way. this is definitely an advantage. the challenge, however, is that the -- in terms of oil again, the economic attractiveness in the current price and the oil
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context, therefore we think with the current context, it will be difficult to believe that a substantial amount of oil production coming from that region before 2030 unless we see some surprises in the markets. having said that, if a significant resources and the production come from there, this would be a good news for the economic and employment in alaska. coming to lng, this is a different story, the gas in the very region, and we know that unlike the oil, we have an issue of the infrastructure here and the main bottleneck, i believe, is the infrastructure building the pipelines here, and the lng
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plants. but i see here significant marketing chances, especially for asia. also given the geographical advantage. if i may bring it to the point i said a few minutes ago, madam chair, today china is moving in the direction of gas. they are going to import a lot of lng to replace their coal basically, and i see that there's a lot of opportunity in china and japan. i often visit japan and meet with japanese government, madam chair. you may well know that they are thankful to you after lng, a very, very difficult situation. japanese people never forget this good gesture coming your government. to sum up, i see from an energy point of view significant chances to provide gas to gas
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hungry asian region. >> very good, thank you very much. senator cantwell, thank you madam chair, and on that point, i think the chair would note that i have many times suggested to her that that should be a good focus or alaska, natural gas as opposed to the more recent discussion on the am wire. as you point out, china being the huge market opportunity for the future, poses with a shift in policies, as you've clearly noted, to a bluer sky, being the largest market opportunity for the u.s., so i wanted to ask you about what policies on that clean energy front do you think we need to continue to focus on here that would help us in looking at asia more as a market in the u.s. leadership? i say that both on the energy efficiency side and the nuclear policy side. energy efficiency in the context of -- i think you've stated it
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well, we're saving so much. and we need to continue to move forward. i look at it from everything from the efficiencies that we have achieved within our region to some of the technologies that are now being used in other countries. for example, one of our northwest companies has provided metered energy in south africa so they can just buy the power that it takes to turn the lights on when the kids comb home for school. energy efficiency is making our businesses competitive and it's also reaching marketplace. so what else do we need to be doing to focus on energy efficiency and other export policies on the clean side? >> thank you very much. now, first of all, u.s. becoming an exporter to -- gas exporter to china and asia in general. i mentioned china, but i should have mentioned the other country, very important in the
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region and growing very strongly, which is india. india is also very important because their economic growth is very strong, and they have a very, in my view, wise energy policy. both of these countries use gas at a minimum level. globally the share of gas in the global energy mix is about 25%. and in both these countries it is less than or around 5% only. so there's a big gap between the world average and them. both of these countries are facing major challenges in terms of environment, mainly local pollution in the cities, and this is an issue for, in many countries, both of these countries and others, a reason for social unrest, in fact. so one issue -- one solution to that is replacing coalyl gas. and then we look at the gas
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markets, we see that the u.s. is coming very strongly in terms of energy exporter, being an energy exporter, and it's good news for everybody, to be honest with you. i should say almost everybody except for the 12 traditiona u. to europeans vis-a-vis the major pipeline exporters. and making the u.s. stronger in terms of negotiation price when they make new contracts. they don't import one bcm of u.s. gas, the fact that they can import u.s. gas is a very strong card in their hands. coming to china, i think a -- >> on that point, could you elaborate on the russians as well? aren't they trying to play in this marketplace? >> yes. in fact, the russian government,
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as a result of the u.s. shay boom, the russian government is less stronger when it comes to the contract and negotiations with the european customers because if the european customers negotiate and try to bring the price down, if the russians would say no, then there's an option, which is u.s. gas. in the past, in the district there was only one shop in europe, which is the russia -- they need to gnd shop. now there is another shop opened, which is the united states. they can choose the europeans, which one is cheaper, which one has the better conditions, provide the better opportunity for the energy, and maybe in some countries' cases, the security and foreign policy. so u.s. gas is providing at
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alternative to europeans, the russian gas, very important, both in terms of energy security and the gas and context for europe. it is out of that, many european companies renegotiate successfully existing contracts and bring the price of gas down as a result of the new opportunities coming from the united states. in terms of china and india, huge opportunity for u.s. gas. it is going to, in the next five years, reach amount of lng coming from the united states, and i am sure asian region will be the primary destination for the u.s. lng. there's a huge opportunity for just to make money and for those countries to diversify the energy system and make gas part of the system and make it much
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more flexible and for the europeans diversify the source of imports, and provide, again, a minimizing the economic, social and maybe political risks. >> well, i see my time has expired. thank you, dr. birol, for elaborating what some people may not fully understand about what russian issues are as it relates to europe and to us, and to why some of these things are so important, people in the administration and conflicts and everything else. so i thank you for that. i'll submit some other things for the record. i want today thank my colleague and welcome her to the committee. i failed to do that in my opening remarks. i'm going to turn my portion over to her in the next round and let her continue on my behalf. thank you so much for your testimony. i so appreciate senator smith joining our committee, along with our returning colleague from west virginia, so it will be great to have her back. this must be a record number of women on the kmie. >> that's a good thing. >> that's a good thing.
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thank you, madam chair. >> thank you, senator cantwell. let's go to senator cassidy. >> thank you, great testimony. i'm intrigued by the electrify cation of transportation, if you will, but let me ask you to comment on this. yesterday, the ceo of fiat chrysler was quoted saying "i don't know of a business that is making money selling electrical vehicles unless selling at a very high end of the spectrum." this has made at the detroit auto show. so i guess how do you kind of position that versus your very bullish statement that within a relatively short period of time we're basically going to transition to a primarily or equally electric car marketplace? your thoughts. >> thank you very much, senator. i think the electric cars,
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number of electric cars will grow, but our numbers show that even two decades from you the biggest chunk of the cars we are running will be the existing internal combustion engines, the traditional cars. but electric cars will grow, especially in some regions, for example in europe. there is a lot of incentive and subsidy for the electric cars. in china, lots of support for electric cars. and with the cost of batteries for electric cars, plus the very generous subsidies in some countries, we'll see the electric cars are increasing substantially. having said that, some people say you say that electric cars will increase, but at the same time you think that there is a
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need for oil. how does it combine? it is the following, mr. senator. the cars are not the biggest part of the oil demand growth. oil demand growth today in the world is driven by trucks, jets, ships and most importantly, chemical industry. even though there would be a lot of electric cars coming into markets, running in the world, we will still see there is a need for new oil production. >> let me ask you this then. >> of course. >> there's been a move afoot to transition diesel vehicles, boats or trucks to natural gas-powered vehicles. do you see that impacting what you just said? or will oil continue to
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dominate? >> oil will continue to dominate. but as long as the cost of gas remains low or moderate, vc, especially the long haul trucks, there is a big chance of substitution of oil by natural gas. and also not only for trucks, but also for the ships. >> you say a big opportunity. but you've made specific projections regarding the percent of electric vehicles or the number. have you done a similar analysis, what is the -- what will be the rate of conversion of long-haul vehicles, or barges, or tow boats to natural gas. >> it was expectation they will increase at least three times compared to today, but still the big portion will be coming from the oil products. >> okay. >> namely diesel. >> now, i don't have it here in your testimony, you speak of the
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sustained model, which -- or something such as that, the word "sustained" in there, and i gather that would be compatible with a low carbon mandate. the degree to which we achieve that, to what degree is that conversion of natural gas -- excuse me, of goal to natural gas or nuclear, and to what degree is that the deployment of renewables? >> if i can give a very -- a few headline figures. we have to -- we have different scenarios. one is the current policies. the other one as you mentioned sustainable, keeping a close eye on the -- especially that of climate change. in all of them, natural gas does increase. natural gas is a winner increasing its role in all of them. renewables are growing very strongly in all of them, especially with the sustained one, especially for solar and
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wind, and a coal will be depending on whether or not we can use coal in a cleaner way, especially in the context of carbon transfer and storage. this is, for me, an extremely critical technology, and this is an area that i mention ministerial meetings, carbon capture. >> but let me ask, continuing on natural gas and renewables, and your current policy and the sustained policy, what is the relative growth of renewables? not only the relative growth, but by 2040, what is the percentage of the international energy mix that would be held by either the renewables or the natural gas? >> the share of natural gas will stay as it is now, about 20%.
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but the volume is going to increase. in terms of generation, it will grow also substantially, coming mainly from solar and wind. but coal will be a significant loser unless we can make use of carbon capture storage and technologies. one particular technology is nuclear power. nuclear power is a technology which can produce electricity without having any emissions. this would also be depending on the policy of governments, whether or not they would like-like to see nuclear power in the energy. >> i yield back. >> senator smith. >> thank you, madam chair, i'm really so pleased to be here and be a part of this committee. i must say ta former resident of alaska, and actually a person
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who worked fnt trans-alaska pipeline when it was first being constructed, this has always been a matter of great interest to me. i'm very pleased to be here. dr. birol, it's very interesting to have a chance to visit with you. i'm quite struck by your conversation about the transformation we're seeing around the world in advancing renewables and also energy efficiency. in minnesota, in my state, this has been a focus of our energy policy, a bipartisan focus of our energy policy, and today we get about 21% of our energy of renewables, and we're well on our way of hitting our goal of 5%, this means jobs for minnesota, 57,000 clean energy jobs in minnesota. i think a lot about the benefits of this kind of strategy, you know, also, my business background has taught me that diversification contributes to risk management and to security. and so i'm quite interested to
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hear you talk a little bit more about how -- how more affordable renewables and energy efficiency contributes to our overall energy security, which is sort of the primary focus of the iea. >> thank you very much, senator smith. now, u.s. is huge oil, gas, coal renewable sources. and it is very important that we make the most out of it in the -- "a," in a cost effective manner. b, secure energy, and c, in a sustainable manner. these are three important parameters. and a growing chance of u.s. making more use of renewable energies as the costs are coming town, and as madam chair
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mentioned, after the tax reform we see that the incentives, the support for renewables are still there. one area that we need to -- in my view, pay attention to, is the efficiency. when you say u.s. will soon don't need to import any single bale of oil, this is for two reasons. one is the biggest success of the shade oil boom, extremely important, and it's a big success story of the u.s. governments, u.s. industry, the shade oil boom production will go. and the second is that the, in my view, the standards in the united states keep the ga zillion diesel consumption for cars and others at a certain level and save oil at home.
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if you didn't have efficiency standards, we would use more oil at home, therefore the imports needs would be higher. therefore, i see in addition to oil, gas, nuclear, i see that there's also a role for renewables and energy efficiency to a very diverse and sustainable mix for the u.s. government, for the u.s. energy sector, make the economy also very stronger and resilient. >> thank you. and let me just ask you, how do you see -- where do you think this will -- kind of where we're headed in terms of overall cost reductions for renewables? >> i think we expect it around the year 2020, most of the renewables in the world may not need anymore subsidy. they can be competitive
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vis-a-vis traditional sources of energy. unlike 10 or 15 years ago, 10 or 15 years ago, in order to compete with natural gas, with coal, with the others, they needed to get a lot of subsidies, and sometime soon in five years or so we may see in many countries, most countries i should say, especially for solar, and onshore wind, we may not need subsidies. maybe for offshore wind we need a longer time, but the main message is they are becoming cheaper and cheaper, the mainstream fuel in many countries. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> thank you, madam chair. >> thank you, senator smith. i got so many things. boy, this is just fascinating this morning. i so thank you. as you know, a couple years ago we reversed a 40-year policy that we'd had here in the united
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states that banned the export of oil. we were successful in lifting that in december of 2015. there was some speculation at the time that not much would change in terms of the volume of oil that's exported from the united states due to the price of oil, due to the need for infrastructure improvements, other global supply factors. we haven't necessarily seen that, we haven't seen the price impacts, haven't seen the supply shortages that some claimed. can you discuss how the export of u.s. oil has changed the world dynamic? you referenced earlier in response to the question from senator cantwell how, with more lng that the united states has put out there on that global market, how that has impacted not only europe, russia. but can you speak to the role
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that we are playing in the world energy markets now that we are able to export? >> of course, madam chair. so december 2015 you took this, in my view, a very good decision. >> thank you. >> to lifting the u.s. oil export ban. because we look after the global energy security, a very positive contribution to global energy security. so it came in 2016 was a year where the u.s. oil industry had a difficult year because of the low prices, low oil prices. therefore that year we have seen the exports were just under 600,000 barrels per day. 2017, last year, we saw an increase in the exports. it was about 1 million barrels per day most of the time. but certain weeks it's ramped to 2 million barrels per day, a
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significant contribution. the important area here is that the -- not only the size, but the quality of the oil is very important that you are exporting. it is a light and sweet quality, which is very much in demand, and therefore it can be used in many countries, again one of the major buyers is china here today. so looking at the years from now, 600,000, 1 million barrels per day in 2017, with the increasing u.s. oil production and the increasing global oil markets, we expect a u.s. crude oil exports will play an important role, even though we are not there compared to natural gas, lng, but it makes also significant an import, both in terms of size and in terms of
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good quality. >> interesting. so when you think about where we have been historically with world conflict that comes about because of the virtual advantage that some nations have when it comes to energy resource, whether it's the middle east, other parts of the world, well you have given us kind of a new view of where we are going with the energy and energy worldwide. all that is coming on with regards to renewable. this means that countries that might not have fossil fuels at the their disposal have other ways they too can achieve their own level of energy production. when we think about is
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acceptable hot spots that come over energy, we have presentations in this committee in the years i've served on the committee, and it always seems to have been focused around the -- who has the capacity when it comes to those sources of fossil fuels. do you see this changing now that the broader world energy portfolio is a greater mix, whether it's what you're saying, china is looking to with regards to nuclear, the price competitiveness and the advent oz renewables are truly becoming more viable solutions, how do you see things changing, or am i oversimplifying things with my example? and we still have this same kind of historical energy hot spots.
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>> extremely important issue, madam chair, if i may say so. now, there are two important changes happening in terms of -- of energy, one of them is coming of renewables. it is important, it is -- for some countries, more important than others. but if i may, renewables we are using mainly for electricity generation, but for transportation, for home heating, for industry, we still use a lot of gas, natural gas. in some countries coal, in some countries electricity and others. so therefore the renewables are changing the -- of energy in a big way is not something i would agree. it makes a small dent, but it is not going to change the -- of
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energy centered on oil and gas currently. but the second change on the -- is coming from the united states. this change of energy, u.s. coming as a major oil and gas country, and being a major exporter change a lot of thinking, change a lot of issues. let me give you one example. several years ago united states was importing a lot of oil from middle east. very soon, or perhaps now days it's zero or close to zero. this is something very important. another thing, u.s. is competing with russia for european gas markets. u.s. is, today, exporting gas to poland, for example, whereas russia is -- it's changed the dynamics significantly there. and from u.s. perspective, i am sure secretary tillerson in
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intelligence negotiations with his country partners is sitting on his chair much more comfortably compared to predecessors, with a lot of oil and gas potential. having said that, if i have to pinpoint one vulnerability in our world in terms of oil and gas, it is a following. many countries in the middle east, and also some major eastern european countries, their economies are single product economies, oil and in some case gas. when the price of this commodities go down, or as we just discussed with senator cassidy here, in the future if electric cars one day become a major, major part of transportation, they may suffer the economies, and they are not -- they are not prepared for
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that. their entire economy, social life is based on oil revenues. this is a major vulnerability, especially today, when the oil prices will be, we expect, more and more volatile, and technology may make surprises. as an energy agency, we are going to focus on our next outlook, these vulnerabilities of these countries. and madam chair, i will be happy to report to you which countries and what measures can be taken there. once again, energy has been redefined as a result of the developments in the united states, and big times, but also introduction of renewable energies in some countries. >> very interesting, thank you for that. senator smith. >> thank you, madam chair.
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dr. birol, i was really interested in the information in your report about how global energy usage, we expect to increase by i think it's 30% by 2040, which is the equivalent of adding another china and india to global demand, and also i remember reading that yet there are still significant portions of the world where people don't have access to electricity at all. so there's this dramatic dichotomy in terms of where people are. i'd like to hear you, your views on what countries can do to take advantage of this growth and demand, i mean, from a competitiveness perspective, position themselves in their economies. this relates to what you were just talking about. and what countries can do to position themselves in their
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economies so that the literally trillions of dollars that are going to be invested in technology, that it -- that the countries can be well positioned to be competitive in that arena. >> and thank you very much. so when we look at the investment trends in the next years to come, we see huge investment opportunities, especially in the lex electricity generation, and transmission and distribution. asia and africa are key areas for investment opportunities. and here, of course, the -- as you implied, the u.s. companies can play a very important role, but in terms of the building power plants, providing capital, and also providing leadership in those countries. having said that, those
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countries, especially in china, india, and african countries, they have their own energy policies and their own targets. and when i look at those policies, they are geared at having energy at the lowest possible cost, keeping an eye on the environment, and also diversification of their energies as you rightly mentioned. i think those countries would welcome the investment opportunities from u.s. and elsewhere if the investments are in line with these three goals, namely the energy security, affordability of energy, and at the same time the production. in many u.s. companies are all working this those countries. but the demand for energy
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projects are huge across the world, huge infrastructure needs, especially in asia and africa. >> and what about this question of kind of research and technology and innovation? and what would you -- how do you see that in terms of how we can encourage that kind of innovation and research on new technologies? >> we made an analysis, how much the governments and the private sector is putting money in the research and development into new technologies. to be honest with you, despite all this discussion and rhetoric, in the last five years in real terms, there was no -- almost no increase in the r&d in -- across the world. what surprising also, when we talk about the -- we think about the r&d, research and development in clean energy, i
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personally thought before the analysis the bulge of it is coming from the private sector and less from the governments. but our analysts just chose opposite, bulge of r&d comes from the governments, 80%, and 20% from the private sector. there's a need for the private sector to be part of the game to push the clean energy technologies and energy efficiency. >> thank you, madam chair. >> thank you, senator smith. let me follow up on that to make sure i understood. your statement that the r&d in clean energy around the world. >> around the world. >> the vast majority of the funding, 80%, comes from government, 20% industry. >> exactly. >> that's worldwide. what about here in the united states? is that breakdown still about the same, about an 80/20 that we're not seeing the r&d in clean technology and development? >> i need to come back to you for that, madam chair, but
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worldwide it was a surprising result. >> yeah, it is. >> i thought when i read the interviews of the business leaders and so on, i thought it was the biggest part was coming from the industry and less from the public. but public was the main driver of the r&d in clean energy. >> it's very interesting. if you learn otherwise, and particularly on the u.s. side, i'd be curious to know about that. because that is -- that's not what typically we would think. you have referenced energy security many times. you know, we think about the security that comes with abundance of supply and how we can provide security that way. you've also referenced the electricfication that we're seeing around the world. you highlight increasing digitalization of power systems
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that can assist with levels of efficiency that i think is important, but i think we also recognize that with these opportunities it can bring challenges, certainly when it comes to the issue of cybersecurity. you haven't really mentioned the role that that -- that that plays with these interconnected energy systems. can you speak a little bit as to how you think digitalization provides levels of benefit, but also vulnerabilities? >> in fact, it's an area that we just started to work, madam chair, very important. because digitalization energy, they are becoming more and more vulnerable. when we recently made that report. and michael dave turk, the former u.s. government official who recently joined our organization, was leading that
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work. what we have seen is that digitalization provides a lot of benefits by increasing the efficiency of our systems. we save a lot of money. we save a lot of activity. and we need to be, for example, less power plants than otherwise needed as a result of digitalization. we are reducing the demand and improving our power systems. this is very good, and this is something that will continue. with the -- it would help us to make, for example, the most out of the renewable energies as well. i mentioned that there is a mismatch between when the sun and wind are available, and when the electricity demand is the highest. so digitalization would help to address this mismatch as well.
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now, what this is very good, that our energy system, our economic system is becoming more and more digital, more and more interconnected through different devices. but this also raised the issue of cybersecurity as the surface attack is becoming much bigger in terms of the unexpected deceptions. it is an area that we are working with our governments how we can increase the resilience of our electricity systems in order to minimize such attacks. what kind of measures, regulatory and technical measures need to be taken in order to minimize the undesired effects of digitalization in terms of making our systems more vulnerable. this is a serious issue with the
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electryfication. >> it is something we focus on here. as we work to enhance our systems and truly make them more efficient and make them more cost competitive, you realize you are also building in another level of vulnerability, if you will. one more area of vulnerability that i want to bring up, and i speak to a lot here in this committee, some years ago when we were more reliant on other nations for our sources of oil, we talked about that vulnerability. and it was not only energy vulnerability, but vulnerability for a security perspective, national security perspective. well, as you have pointed out, we're in a much better situation now, certainly with regards to oil and natural gas. and that indisputed position
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that you now refer to around the world coming from the united states. but there is another area where i see a growing vulnerability on others. and that is as it relates to our critical minerals, and our resources. the resources that we need to help build out, whether it is wind turbines, the lithium for the lithium ion batteries, the reality whether it's lithium, graphite, cobalt, nickel, these are what will allow us to help build out the battery, the storage capacity that when we're talking about elect trickfication, moving to electric vehicles, we have to have these sources. i view that as a potential
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bottleneck that will allow us to make this transition, or these -- move to these other areas that you have referenced. you referred to them as upheavals with what we're seeing with renewables. can you speak a little bit about that aspect of vulnerability, and where you see -- where you see the direction or the trend here? >> another excellent point, madam chair. if i may say so. with the -- the traditional fuel sources, oil and gas, the energy security is more or less well understood, and mechanisms are there for oil and gas. we have been working many, many years, and especially for natural gas with the g7 meeting in japan, we were asked by prime minister abe to look after the
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security, and cybersecurity, we are working on that. yet, another security issue. indirectly, but also very important in terms of energy, is the clean energy technologies. calls for copper, lithium, manganese, and it happens that, again, like the issue of the traditional resources several years ago, these are consumed in only a few number of countries. and again here resources, some of them are in latin america, latin american countries here, chile and bolivia. but china happens to be a country with a lot of reserves in that context. so it is -- when we're talking about the clean air technologies, this is very good, good for the environment, good
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for the domestic production. but one has to perhaps go one step further to think about where those things will come from, and what kind of security mechanisms we can develop in order to add this if some undesired problems arise as the terrorists of those technologies are concentrated only in a few number of countries. >> does iea not concentrate, necessarily, but do you factor in these vulnerabilities as you look to your world forecast? >> we mainly look at the vulnerabilities in terms of energy resources, oil, gas, electricity and renewables. but these are also important areas that needs further attention. >> thank you, i appreciate that. senator smith, further questions? >> no. >> i think i don't have any
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further questions. i'd just like to thank you very much, dr. birol, for your comments. this was quite interesting. and i'm very happy to be a part of this committee. >> we are delighted that you are a part of the committee. i've got one final question for you, dr. birol, before we conclude, and, again, i thank you for your time this morning. i have long maintained that nuclear in this country and part of our energy portfolio is significant, important. and we have seen -- we have seen the united states in our role with nuclear kind of, in my view, slack off in recent years. you know, we got one remaining construction project in nuclear,
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the plant in georgia. but you have indicated in your comments here this morning that china is coming on in a quite considerable and a substantial way. we've got the traditional nuclear in the global marketplace. we also have the role of advanced nuclear, and i think we're seeing some positive signs coming out recently in terms of these emerging technologies, and how they might factor in to the energy marketplace. but can you just share with the committee your view of how nuclear here in the united states factors in in these outyears, whether it be traditional nuclear, or the advanced nuclear opportunities?
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>> thank you very much, madam chair. i think nuclear is a technology worldwide, which can provide electricity, uninterrupted. without emitting carbon emissions. but after -- it became a challenge in many countries to build new nuclear power plants. the challenge is not only there, the challenge is also in the financing part of the equation to build new nuclear power plants. and even some countries like in the united states where electricity demand is low, where the gas prices are low, where the renewables are growing, to find even getting the electricity generation from nuclear is a big challenge. unless governments don't take any measures.
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so for the new builds, in my view, it will be very difficult to go with the traditional nuclear power plants. smol model reactores can provide the opportunity to address the project management risks, and financing problems. so this can be a solution. if i go from -- and i believe nuclear play in the u.s. and countries where it is accepted can play important roles in energy security and also for the issues can make a positive contribution. there is one more issue globally. as i said, as you also mentioned, in the u.s. we are building one only nuclear power plant in europe, the situation is similar in japan, similar, these countries were the main nuclear technology exporters until recently. but since they don't build
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nuclear power plants, they are forgetting how to build it, and china and russia are building a lot of nuclear power plants. and they will not only build nuclear power plants at home, but they may well be the countries who are exporting nuclear power technology to other countries, which is important from all perspectives. we have to look at the nuclear also, perhaps, from that angle as well, that the established nuclear technology exporter, such as u.s. and europeans and others, are facing strong challenge from china and russia for the other countries to build nuclear power plants. >> when you think about -- when you think about where nuclear has dominated, and again here in the united states, in europe,
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certainly in japan, that reversal, in a very, very short order, really in terms of the energy spectrum worldwide, and now moving that over to china and russia where we hadn't seen that much of a significant presence, it's really kind of an interesting phenomenon that it has moved as quickly and as -- i would say dramatically as it has in terms of moving the energy portfolios around. and i wonder whether -- and i'm just kind of talking off the top of my head here. but i wonder if an increased role and presence in russia, in china particularly, will promote
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or spur the united states to renew its efforts within -- within the nuclear space, or whether we continue to seed and take a backseat. it's not something that i think has been good. i greatly appreciate the role that nuclear plays in providing for not only a reliable power source, but a clean power source. and i regret that we are losing the skilled workforce, the level of leadership that we have played, not only from the production perspective, but how we then export the technologies and the smart people that come behind them. do you think that we change, or with low natural gas prices, we
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just continue in the direction that we are? >> i think natural gas is, of course, very good. it is cheap, renewables are also getting cheaper. but in my view, having a diversification, and nuclear, a position of nuclear in the u.s., a strong one, to keep that position is wise policy. i wouldn't let it go. but of course your government you serve to proceed with its policy. but it would be regrettable in my view of the united states being one of the leaders in the technology for years and years. it's developed in this country in the 1980s to give it up, that position, may not be the best way, in my personal view. >> do you see europe going back to more nuclear, or is that an irreversible direction? >> i think in many countries irreversible direction. but i think japan is going back
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slowly to nuclear power. but the biggest developments are coming from china and india. more than 90% of the new nuclear power plants are coming in the picture in the next years will come from china and india. and they'll build there, and the russians are building in europe and elsewhere several nuclear power plants. by building a lot of nuclear power plants, they are bringing the cost down, and making it cheaper, accessible to emergent countries. so it is, in my view, an energy issue, but maybe not only. >> one last question. i said my last one was going to be nuclear. you prompted another. prompted another in regards to india. you focused a lot of your comments today on the role china is playing in the world energy prark markets. will india move more towards natural gas, towards coal, towards nuclear? where do you see their energy
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portfolio? >> i think india it shows us a policy which is all of the technologies type of policy. and they are are pushing especially natural gas strongly. and once again to replace coal. but coal is also growing because in india people having no access to electricity in india almost 200 million people have no access. they have some power plants, but also more natural gas, renewable energy and nuclear. they are pushing in all of france, and to be very frank the government is pursuing it in policy, which is very good for the people. because in a very short period of time, almost 11 years they are bringing leelectricity to
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about 500 million people. it's a big achievement. much more diverse, and i expect the share of gas will increase significantly in the years to come. >> very interesting. ask i will look forward to learning more from this report that you referenced earlier that will focus on those nations that perhaps have greater vulnerabilities because they are more reliant on a single -- a single energy resource either for production or for their consumption and what that means. so it's interesting to hear that with india it truly is one of those all of the above approaches to energy. i truly appreciate what you have shared with the committee. it's always good. it's very important for us to understand what is happening
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with the global energy and the trends out there. as one who has been a strong proponent of u.s. energy production certainly within oil and gas, it makes me feel pretty good, actually, to hear you say that of the four upheavals that you have referenced, the first one being the u.s. being a leader in oil and gas production. as i say just in the few years that i have been here in the senate and serving on this committee we have gone from a respective of discussion about mlg inport-terminals to now export-terminals and a vulnerability on countries we don't like and they don't like us, and now weir truly in the driver's seat. so that is significant.
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but i think it is also very important for this committee to hear very clearly the other areas that you have identified that the cost of renewables are moving quickly and that the direction that is being taken and the advances in solar and wind, the fact that they are getting to that point where they can stand on their own and be cost competitive, that factors in mightily in terms of the direction that we move from a policy perspective. and paying attention to what is happening in the world, the leadership of china, it's been very easy for us to say that china is the big polluter out there. but when they are advancing policies that are really keyed in on cleaner energy and energy resources. and whether that is importing mlg that may come from alaska or
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elsewhere, but to recognize their leadership in nuclear. and then also your fourth point about the share of electricity growing faster than the other sectors and the implications then that portends. so a lot to think about as we begin the new year. but thank you for your insight, your guidance. we look forward to learning more from you about these very important geopolitical issues in the energy space. we wish you safe travels back when you return to france, so thank you very much. with that the committee stands adjourned.
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>> what i have been telling people is just don't get too exercised about it. this is draft, and this draft proposal put everything out there on the table. so zincy is getting all the feedback, good bad and indifferent. and i would expect that he would then take the, whether it's the letters from centers like this or the feedback from the communities, from the governors, he's going to weigh all that. your question about whether or not this pushes some who might be, who otherwise might have been inclined to be more cooperative at the negotiating table, pushes them to a different spot, that's possible.
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i'm not part of those conversations, but is he generating the conversation, yeah. i don't know. i think we'll see how it moves forward. >> one way to motivate people is revenue sharing. i mean this is to put onus on you to get something passed through congress. >> i was hoping you would ask. >> what's the latest on revenue sharing? >> revenue sharing is one of those issues that for me as a producing state and as a coastal state, revenue sharing has been something that i have introduced or been engaged in since i came here. so i will continue to try to
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advance that conversation. and the fact that there is -- there are a lot more who are now looking at this issue as for perhaps the first time in a long while -- i mean the reality is during the obama administration there wasn't much conversation about ocs production much less revenue sharing because if you don't have production there's nothing to share. so i think it does prompt more discussion about what revenue sharing might look like outside of the gulf states. >> have you had those in the past two weeks since the draft plan has come out? >> i have not. well, the draft plan was just last week, right? >> two weeks. >> it's just been a blur. isn't this october already? no, i have not had those specific conversations.
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>> what about your energy bill, then? we were hoping to see it in january, but it looks like our january schedule is -- >> well, in fairness i think most of us thought that these issues that we have in front of us now we would have dealt with already. so this was not my plan. my plan was to have a much cleaner slate in january. obviously lisa's plan did not have that. so we will get beyond where we are right now with uncertainty about funding the government, uncertainty about all these other things. and sooner is better obviously. because we do have a lot of things we need to be working on. we need to start moving on this energy bill. we've got a lot of other initiatives that i think folks want to try to get to and daylight's awasting.
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>> do you have any -- have you talked to the administration on time lines for when things will start to happen? like assurances of what will get done this year, next year? >> well, since passage of the bill, we have all recognized there is a great deal that is preliminary to any level of activity out there. and the folks over at interior have put together their teams. they're working on things. but before we can ask them to give us the time line here, they need to map out and lay it out. so we'll have an opportunity for further sit down. but as of right now there's no schedule other than what we put into law, which was the time frame of the two sales.
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but i think most don't fully appreciate the extent of preliminary work that the department will have to conduct and to basically organize and setup before you're going to see much of anything. and it is because this is, you know, i would call it a frontier area in a sense that -- that's my secret refrigerator there. yeah, so no one has been allowed or permitted to explore in this area. and so we're setting up a whole new process here. we've said this is to be managed similar to the national petroleum reserve in alaska. but having said that it is not the npra, and it is different so there will be distinctions. so it's going to take some time,
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but we'll keep people posted on it. you know, i was home this weekend and had a chance to visit with folks up in the fa fairbanks area and fairbanks is really keyed into what the pipeline can bring, what it means from labor perspective and jobs and working. and i fully expected people to say, well, you know, are we moving things today? but there's a level of pragmatism. it's like, well, this is new area. this is the arctic. we'll be patient, we'll wait, but hurry it up. but recognizing it does take time. >> if you look back at some of it previous bills and what you can do -- >> yeah, and keep in mind that we have been kind of laying the
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groundwork for the prospect of opening anwar for some time and sitting with the people who live in the town of two area. the town hall meeting i had back in april, i guess it was, there were concerns from the community about how will this move forward and what environmental protections will we have, and will there be coastal impact assistance like we had talked about in previous iterations of on anwar bill. and as you know through the reconciliation process you're very limited in terms of what you can put into that legislation. so there are other things that we would like to provide by way of protections, whether environmental or just process. so, yeah, we'll be looking to do that. >> can you do that through the appropriations process?
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>> you can do anything through the appropriations process. but i do think this is important that we have a process through the committee to take it up. there's not reason not to. okay, so happy to be back. >> i looked through the statistics -- >> no, i counted help. >> no, i think there's eight on help. i think you have more members on help than you do in energy. >> you need to get more i think women on your side. >> yeah, we got two over here -- six here. yeah, but that's kind of good. i'm pretty sure that help, there are more members -- i think
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there's probably two more members on help. so don't give them that edge. we got it. women are taking over energy, just saying. all right, bye. >> thank you.
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wednesday, former senate majority leader bob dole receives the congressional medal from house and senate leaders in recognition of the presidential candidate service as a soldier, legislator and statesman. watch live at 3:00 p.m. eastern here on c-span 3. c-span's washington journal, live every day with news and policy issues that impact you. coming up wednesday morning, democratic congressman bobby scott of virginia and republican congressman jason lewis of minnesota discuss bipartisan legislation they've introduced to reform the criminal justice
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system. and we're live in raleigh, north carolina with attorney general josh stein will be our guest aboard the bus. be sure to watch c-span's washington journal live at 7:00 eastern wednesday morning. food and drug administration scott gottlieb announced a new process to approve new drugs. this is 35 minutes. >> thanks a lot. thanks for the opportunity to be here today. we had a dialogue over many years, and i appreciate the relationship we had talking abouol


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