tv Newseum CSPAN July 4, 2013 7:10pm-8:01pm EDT
it's not because now we are better than before, but it's a good thing that someone tells you you are in the right way, continue working hard. it's good. >> you have a very different story. equallyprobably bizarre. i found out through facebook. [laughter] someone sent me a facebook message and said congratulations. i ignored the message and then people started tagging me and that's how i found out. i was in my apartment in turkey and my roommate, he was in his
room reading and i turned around and i knocked on his door and told them you are sharing quarters with a pulitzer prize winner. [laughter] that's it great we went to bed before midnight. [laughter] there really was not much to do. >> and your fillets are was for feature photography. tell us how you happen to enter that image in the competition. not entered myself, so i'm sure which category. the news, i figure the most appropriate place would be the features. sort of a slice of life frontline photograph. that's what i did and -- this was all new to you? >> you had no other reason to make the decision? this was your first time.
>> i think your instincts were right on the money. >> you are here representing the entire staff. i want to read their names -- they were all together with you in syria. give us a sense of how the day today staffing went. our photographers say you don't wake up and say i'm going to shoot a fillets are today. how did you organize yourselves into what you're going to do today?
>> first of all, we covered the year in different moments. that's an interesting thing because we have different moments of the story. my colleagues, at the end of the year, we tried -- it was powerful to have five different ideas of what it was, we never worked together. bestied to cover in the way possible. it's ethical to cover in syria. we arrived to syria and a tractor, trying to arrive in the place where we can cover the story without being killed.
you decide things very quickly every day. you have to think about taking the best pitchers and telling the stories are also coming back. then how to fight it. you have satellite phones, they were like blocks, basically. sometimes we could spend like six hours in winter. it was not easy. welcome, this is the hotel, it is a totally different environment. >> eating a photographer,
access is everything. being a journalist, access is everything. tell us how you develop the relationship so that the people whose lives and effort you are trying to cover will you be the access you need. >> on this side of the world, there is a lot of mysticism around covering the war. once you are there, you will find out it is fairly open and relatively easy to photograph. why? because people actually want the coverage. it is surprisingly easy to photograph once you are in sight. the larger issue is just logistics. if you go to the west come he have to walk. if you go to aleppo, you can catch a taxi from the border.
across the border, it is rebel controlled. somebody with a kalashnikov on the other side next to the desk. you would be surprised how easy it is to photograph and move around when people actually understand what you are doing and want coverage. differentd to make decisions. we were in turkey waiting to enter syria. yorkays before the new times, the reporter died trying to come back. one day after that, two journalists were killed.
you come to make these decisions to what you want and what the agency thinks. you can think about the story for the next week. you have every day to make a decision, the whole agency and whole story. >> let's share some of these images with our studio audience is and put them in the monitor. the first one is a photo you took of a child crying at the end of a funeral ceremony. let's find a monitor where we can see it. you know the picture. this is a child crying at the end of a funeral that was not what you expected. tell us what the circumstances were in terms of where the victims of these shootings were buried and how you came to see this child. >> we realized the situation was really changing with syria
because that funeral was in a park that used to be where people went to drink tea and children to play and was converted to a graveyard. the cemetery was meters from the check point, so they couldn't do it. we realized there was a shooting and four people were killed and we tried to cover the funeral. we walked with people and the population for 20 blocks and we arrived to the park and i tried to make pictures because people were crying and shouting against the government. i respect the funeral like not to be so close, and suddenly i
see this boy crying. next to where the father was. after that, i tried to ask more questions for the captain of the picture. after that, i spent like six hours in the room with a cell phone. dids sending a picture and it again and again and again. probably 20 times every picture to cairo. the next day, i tried to check
my e-mail and i received incredible news. the new york times, washington post. part of this date audience was important to me that finally, we can show what is going on. that was my approach of the conflict, more than taking pictures of combat and how brave the army and trying to find out who is winning the military. i'm more concerned about these children and how people try to survive, how people move to the front line with nothing.
that was my concern. that's what i was trying to achieve, like we have two file all different kind of pictures, but that picture reflects a lot of what i was trying to achieve. >> the next picture, give us a contrast where you have these young people burning photos of assad. this takes you right back to the nature of the people involved and how different the situation is from one location to another
and how difficult it has been from one year to the next. >> it is true. when i was there in march last year, it was totally different. that a cure reflects fathers, children participate in civilian protests. like few people with short weapons, but it was civilian unrest. now it's like a military with a different weapons, a military model. that's why i like to cover that story at the time because you can show both sides. the civilians and military together. you see those pictures and its people, normal people you see in the streets. >> on the one hand, the civilian population welcomes you because they respect your craft and want your story to be told, yet you have a sense of media
fatigue. tell us about that. >> there are two and a half years of conflict and dozens of journalists have come in and little has changed on the ground. they sort of question why you are going there. this is unfortunately typical of conflict after a certain amount of time. afghanistan is a good example. people don't really understand why the media is there and they don't see any immediate impact on their lives. you can't say that media will change things. the minimum you can provide to be able to inform in a way that agreements are made and there hasn't been any change on the
ground. it is getting worse and it is spreading. >> when i start taking pictures of that protest, people start embracing, you are a hero. what do you need, do you need food, stay with us. the situation changed a lot. >> that started to change at the end of last fall. in august, when i went there, a city north of aleppo, it was a protest right after friday prayers and it was in freedom square.
they renamed the square freedom square. i would say 2000 people or 3000 people in this square, namely children and women and civilians. i didn't see any kalashnikovs. people were very welcoming. the second day in syria, we are covering this contest, a lot of energy and people waving the flag and all of a sudden, everybody started to run and scatter. then you start seeing a plane going around in circles. then i heard they shot into unarmed civilians, but i'd never expect that a plane to
drop for bombs on a square filled with civilians. we started running and i get into this car and my colleague was surprised to see the plane diving and then to bombs came out. the blast basically threw me on the ground. all the glass shattered. and then they dropped two bombs and imitate a 50 caliber machine gun on the square full of civilians. my second day. that was pretty much clear to me that this is a very different
conflict than anything i have covered so far. an example of what sort of messages. >> there is a message in this next image. one of the most chilling photos. and awith a little boy toy grenade launcher. he believes this a little boy is going to need that skill when he is old enough to handle a real one. >> that picture, i took that 10:00 in the morning. civilian, itthe makes you think that the whole atmosphere of the place is concentrated by conflict.
the shops were closed, people, fighters were taking positions. children were playing with toys or walking with their mothers trying to find a place to shelter. daily life of these people are transformed. cities like a lebow used to be a really powerful city in terms of commercialism. that iss a city blocked. again, this is more comfortable. more comfortable shooting those pictures that show, i also think on what i'm going to show in the newspaper in the next day. ore withering in the u.s. europe or africa. you know, i do think they want to see all the time finding and fighters.
they want to see how life is there. they want to think about how these people think about. that is why i try. sometimes i fail. most of the time i fail. sometimes you can take a picture that reflects the big picture. the big picture of what is going on. >> you took your camera inside a closed area. we can see some of these civilians and of joining a militia, joining the resistance. they take up arms and do what they can. talk to us about how you get from where you woke up that morning into a place like this. who is with you? what is the strategy? what is going on from the inside of this sheltered place where the sunlight pierces through holes that have been made from previous battles. >> there are various ways on the
front line. sort of a behind the lyons headquarters for that, for the put tunes sized unit. so each unit, you could have various units covering a neighborhood. they always hold back to this main office. usually you get in there and you check in with them. there is somebody delivering ammunition or food for the fighters on the front line. and you typically run with them. you walk in with them. they walk in through the tunnels made from holes on the walls in that way the snipers from the regime, they do the same exact a strategy.
sometimes you go in vehicles with the free syrian army as well. once you are there, this neighborhood where the photo was taken, there is only two sniper alleys. you do not run very much. it is from here to be first row. a few meters. you sprint across and then you go into another tunnel and you go to a warehouse where this unit was standing. you finally cross one last alley and you go to a small warehouse. i believe it used to be a shop. like many of the shops, it is very typical in those neighborhoods. and so the tynwald was peppered with shrapnel and bulletholes. the sunlight was coming
through, creating these photographic, photogenic pictures. i positioned myself in the middle so the perspective would draw the reader back into the subject. >> in the meantime, so we understand, there is a cat and mouse between these two sides in what used to be a residential area. people shooting from shelter from both sides. >> yes. some apartments are still inhabited, some are not. that neighborhood was largely abandoned and almost completely destroyed.
so you can have a neighborhood and sustainable bard meant for two months and you would still see some structures. talking about six-story buildings. this neighborhood was smaller, two or three story buildings. after four months it was completely decimated. like i said, largely the civilians have fled. you are walking through these tunnels and you see how people left and you realize they left in a hurry. everything is -- you can see homework on a desk. you can see photographs because you can tell they went through some personal photographs and picked the ones that mattered to them most and then they fled very fast. >> how do you feel being and then enclosed area, and not with a weapon but a camera, as the fighting goes on? >> as long as i have cover, i feel safe.
i may be simplifying this. i have answered that many times. you are very close to the opposition, in this case the army. the closer you are and in some cases you can hear their steps under broken glass. sometimes it is only a wall. that separates you from the government facilities. [no audio] [inaudible]
kind of cameras you have and what kind? >> when you are going to enter and when you walk a lot in the mountains, sometimes to reach the places we thought that the best idea was to go with a very light gear, light equipment. so i carried a couple of cameras, small lenses, something really liked. -- light. and last night for example we walked six hours in a field. we put on all of our gear with a sleeping bag. we could not have big equipment. the first reason is you have to walk with all of it. the second is because all of the pictures were really near s.
we did not need big lenses, heavy gear. but the idea was to be really light just in case we have to run, just in case we have to move from one place. for example we changed locations four times in one week. we started sleeping in one house day and now, trying to avoid the attack of the army. you need to be like really quick. and fit. >> i do not know if we have a microphone in the audience bid am going to move, we have a request for one. i am going to move to your next image. it is another intimate look, it is a woman with her hands over her face. you talked about how you were trying to tell the story of the
people within this conflict. tell us about this woman. >> we were covering the army we took some pictures and then we realized the more important place was the red cross. so we'd stayed outside of the clinic where the wounded civilians were coming. after taking some pictures outside, it was really chaotic. no medicine. it was really setting chaotic to see that clinic. we went into a room and we saw that woman crying, full of blood. next to her three daughters. they were in two separate beds,
all of them crying. so we took some pictures. the relatives were there. some doctors were there. and with the camera guy, who covered three weeks of the searing conflict with me, we checked what happened. what happened that day. one of the relatives said don't ask her anything because she did not know at the time her husband and two of her sons were killed in the attack. so she was in complete shock. it was a really sad moment. again, civilians, the most
vulnerable people in this conflict and all of the wars in history. and this woman was crying, i received so many e-mails of people like, but looking at this picture, i think it is a very direct image. it's only her eyes and face. i tried to reflect that panic in her face. and i wonder what is the life of this woman now? i wonder, i tried to find out what was going on with the family. where they are now. because i do not think they stayed in that city anymore.
>> let's go to our audience. >> hello. thank you first of all for your candor and for your tragic but interesting stories. you are obviously very fine photographers and you probably take more than a few pictures of an event. when you get back to your studio or wherever, how do you decide, what do you look for in a photo to make a prize worthy? what do you see and what kind of shots -- i know people but will kind of shots was make you say, this one is the best? >> there is a lot of discussion, most of you like photography.
we have discussions about photoshop and technique issues. what i think is important for us when we choose a picture, that we use a technique in a way that we can transmit the idea of what we think about the conflict in the most powerful way. whether in black-and-white or in color or with more or less contrast and with photoshop, i don't care. we need to select the picture that can show and attract to look at the picture and to ask questions and to think about the issue.
to have a reflection, when they look at the picture. to have any fueling after that image. so i tried to think about that. i tried to think about pictures that tell the story in the most honest and powerful way. mei think the answer for would be you have the subject matter and you have the technical aspect. the tech glass back, our job is to stare at people for hours. for many days, four years. we stare at people. ater a while you get good predict in reactions to certain situations.
you try to position yourself in something that is going to yield the best framing and tell the whole story. it is all about information in one frame. what frame should tell the story? that is what we strike for. number one is going to be a photograph. you work on the aesthetics of the photograph. the information needs to be there. as far as the subject matter, you try to cover as broad of photographs you can. unfortunately in syria you can't cover both sides. you can't go into damascus and the bed yourself with governments troops because they will not give you a visa.
unfortunately it is one side of the conflict. other people are trying to cover it as best as they can, the site of the government. in conjunction, a newspaper should give you a fair and balanced story. for the most part, in my mind, syria is civilian casualties, civilian casualties, and then there is a revolution going on. the people that lose the most at the end of the day are civilians. they did not choose any sides. they are just getting bob. -- bombed or shelled. by both sides now. both sides are killing each other. the numbers in the opposition are the ones being punished the most. >> this last image we are going to look at shows you the moment where those civilians where the fighting has come to their neighborhood. we have families and you can see them about to flee.
tell us about this picture. >> i tried to explain this conflict, there is little organization. people react very quickly. there are really calm days where nothing is going on. nothing is going to happen. there are some negotiations in the europe and the u.s. and russia. people continue to live in the same apartment and suddenly, very quickly, things change. very quickly. in one morning. it is really chaotic. these families were taking whatever they can take to run.
they were bombing their houses. if you see the smoke in the picture, it was really near. they were fighting in the corner. they did not know where to go basically. the rebels organized some kind of shelter but there was nothing for all of the civilians. so everybody was running and trying to take cover basically, without any organization. that is why so many civilians are killed because the rebels fight among the civilians. you have to understand here is a phone line, here is where they fight, like a conventional war. in the army is coming here. so that was another picture that was important to find. if then they are iconic or not, we tried to show, we try to
select the pictures that tell the story. i do not know where the families go. and some of the guys say, where am i going? i will stay here. this is my house. i have nowhere to go. my brother was killed yesterday and i am going to stay here in till the end. it was really strong to see people that were basically waiting to die. that was every day. >> you talked about that also. a fundamental loss of human dignity where you have to flee your home but you don't know what is going to happen. >> absolutely. some of the flareups and the meeting points were opposition
soldiers. there are civilians there. they do not want to leave. they are not going to leave, the shelling is so bad they have to. their apartment might be hit two or three times. so unless the apartment building is completely destroyed, they are not going to leave. they tried to go to and family apartment block. and once that is shelter bomb, then essentially they are refugees. and then they go to the border. they go to the border with turkey and some of them apply. most people i know do not want to leave syria. syria is their home.
they do not want to live in turkey. it is a different country. i do not want to go to jordan. they can't stay. for them, it is a tremendous loss of dignity because they see their family living in a refugee camp. iss is a society that conservative. very little privacy. it is a huge loss of dignity. as i said earlier today, in refugee camps. you go inside of a tent and it is clean. they clean their tents. they wash their clothes. muchtried to keep as dignity as they can. in a place that, in a country that robbed them of many dignities. >> it is a really tough
decision. it is the u.s. trying to help us to find out -- we are talking, come with us. come with us to turkey. my mother is going to turkey. my girlfriend is here. if they get killed i am in turkey, how can i leave? how can i be in that situation. they ask these questions every day. >> where are the men of fighting age? they joined the opposition. they did not want to maybe, they
did not want to fight, they did not like both sides. aleppo was not joining the fight, for example, until the fight came aleppo. once you lose everything, you see your mother and your father, in a refugee camp, very little ditty, then your choices are very clear. and most likely you lost family members. that would turn anybody into -- >> >> it is important to take pictures of the complexity of the situation. it is not the good and the bad. it is everything is really complicated. there were engineers, somebody killed in a bomb.
you want revenge but you are not politically involved in the rebels. so for me, those complex pictures tell the story in a different way and show that confusion because the war is confusion. it is not good and bad. >> it is never black and white. it is always a shade of gray. i met this young 20-year-old through this place. i met him at the border. his father lost his legs in artillery. a mortar shell fell inside their living room. the mother was blind, by the same shell. and they lost a sister and a brother. they were still in shock, figuring out what they're going to do. 22 months later i met that young man again on the front lines and he had been fighting a week after i had met him.
he joined a group and started fighting. i think anybody would do that. >> you are involved in journalistic photography, which, at a risk of your own lives, and now you have won a pulitzer. what impact is going to have on your career and how you are perceived by your colleagues, which you think as you go out the door for your next assignment? >> rodrigo said it well. i am flattered and i am honored to receive this award. it does not make it any better than our colleagues.
a lot of my friends i have a lot of respect for that worked in many other places. it does not have to be conflict. it does not make you a better photographer. it is really nice when somebody points the finger at you and says, well done. but it does not make you any better. it is important to keep your feet on the ground. for they pulitzer, specifically for some reason people listen to what you have to say more than they used to. [laughter] i don't know why. nothing has changed. i am the same guy. but now for some reason people listen to you. >> even relatives. [laughter] they did not call you in 20 years. oh, your son. on tv.
>> for all of the people, you are never going to amount to anything. >> human nature. javier manzano, rodrigo abd, thank you for your photography, your courage, your dedication and commitment. i appreciate you giving us insight on what it means to be a freshly crowned pulitzer winner. [applause] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2013] [captioning performed by national captioning institute] >> >> a look at the use of big data to drive decisionmaking on a range of issues. discussion of recent report by his organization commission readiness, military leaders for kids which examines
the possible benefits of the obama administration's proposed pre-kindergarten early education program. after that, paul kern and a guest talk about how much americans and foreign visitors to the united states bendane travel and tourism. pleasure e-mails, phone calls, and tweets. -- plus your e-mails, phone calls, and tweets. a lot of us take for granted the opportunities that we have here. toother countries, going other countries, i see other people there. it is wonderful to be an american. i would not traded for the world. and as to sit back americans and think.
is better than a lot of other people. back and griping complain about this and that we should sit back and just think and so we do have. we're not where we could be at but we're better than we could be. >> it means that we have a mutual understanding that freedom and liberty leads to great success. here and raised in new york. i wish had a lot of american pride most because my parents came from india and they did not have much. the came to europe because they thought it was the greatest place for opportunity. i just graduated medical school. they see it as a place where they can come from nothing and bring it up to something. that is what everyone sees,
america as a place of opportunity. a place where you can make your dreams come true. i guess that sounds a little bit cliche but that is the main thing. i am proud to be american because my parents felt that it was better to be in america. i think it really is. >> one of the points we make in down on thee come side of it did make a difference. the senators began to act like house members which is not something any senator wants to year. the had to go out and deal with the people as opposed to if you have a state legislature and their 26 members of the senate, all you need is 14 votes. it can easily pay off and they did payoff 14 senators, paying
off their mortgages in a couple of notorious cases. to buy their election. >> more on c-span, former president bill clinton and new jersey governor chris christie talk about winning for and persevering through natural disasters. then a discussion on citizenship in america and how it relates to political engagement, unity service, and self governance. then a look the origins of instagram after two stanford graduates else the photo filter technology company in eight weeks before selling it to facebook for eight -- for $1 billion. next, former president bill clinton and new jersey governor chris christie talk about mining and persevering through natural
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