tv Bulls and Bears FOX Business August 25, 2013 8:00am-8:31am EDT
ekend. we'll see you tomorrow. >> i'm going to be singing a little. >> turn off your set. >> sounding, a new alarm on the health care law. but not on the hit of jobs. the hit to food prices. hi, everyone. this is "bulls and bears." u.s. farmers warning about price spikes when they tack on the pass on the law to consumers across the country. so how bad will it get at the check out aisle? the bulls and bears this week, here is tracy bird, john layfield along with david mercer. welcome to everybody. john, is the health care law turning into a rotten apple for shoppers at the supermarket? >> absolutely.
surprise, surprise. this is what happens when you pass a law that nobody has read. and you have a problem here. we're told you have a lot of undocumented workers that you're trying to get insurance to. also, you have simple margin errors. you have 2% margins that a lot of contract labors are farmed out on to the farms. you start adding 10%, they can't make money. this has to go directly to the consumer. we talk about low interest rates. our market, our economy is not -- has no shock absorber to absorb something like inflation. this isn't a huge spike. this is inflation. >> john, do you agree? >> we'll see higher foodprices. but we would see that if illegal immigrants picks up, too. at the end of the day, the most businesses, not like apple computer, they're if a tight margin. any additional cost gets passed on to the consumer. that's like saying we pay a lot for movies now because all the people that work on movies has insurance. this is an industry where no one has that cost and we get the benefit of cheap produce.
it's not like lighting money on fire. we're going to pay more money for food and some people will use money in the health care area. food sales will go down in the supermarket, it's not going to destroy the market. >> gary, california is really the nation's salad bowl. consumers are already squeezed. this is going to add to their problems, their budgetary problems, isn't it? >> i agree. i think it's going to add more significantly than jonas thinks. look, food in the average family budget is about 14% of their budget. that's second biggest expenditure behind housing. so let's just take that 14% and say food prices go up because of obama care by 10%. now you've increased the average spending by 1.4%. it doesn't sound like alot. but we're really increase inflation which is about 3% or so by almost 50%. i think that's going to hit people in their wallets.
i think we're going to feel effect. president obama said he's going to bend the cost curve. i think people find this cost curve is bent right around their neck. >> you know, tracy, one report says that this could add $1 per hour per employee. that's a lot. >> it's a ton. brenda, maybe you and i are the only two that actually food shop here, i think the prices are ridiculous now. if they go up more, i feel like i pay 74% of my bill to the food store some weeks. i can't afford to see this go up. milk, eggs, you name it. the thing with the farmers, they can't pick up and move like silicon valley can. california taxes are on the rise and not going down any time soon. farmer are getting hit. you watch your bottle of wine goup the next time you take your wife out for a nice fancy meal. you are going to pay more. i think jonas this is going to hit people in the pocket. it's going to hit low income people. $3.50 a gallon of milk may not
cripple my wallet but it will others. >> david, i know you do some shopping. >> i do. >> what do you think this is going to do to the economy? >> i don't think it's going to, as forecasted by the california farmers, going to threaten the economy. look, the cost of labor is going to more accurately reflect health care insurance which it should. and i think that eventually the market will bear it and adjust to it add cording ccordingly. we'll have employees with access to insurance with not much impact to the economy overall. >> i don't know. john, what does that mean, the market will bear it? that means that prices are going up. that's what happens in a free market. >> that's exactly what happens. i grew up working on ranches and farms in west texas. i understand the person everybody tries to squeeze is the farmer. the farmer cannot be squeezed anymore. marge rinz too low. this is going to be passed on to the consumer. the consumer is goin to see
is directly at the cash register when they check out. understand also, a lot of these people are illegals. they don't want this insurance. they don't want to take out 10% of their pay or whatever it may be for an insurance they're not going to use with a $3,000 or $5,000 deductible. they're not going to use this health insurance anyway. this is an absolute boondoggle that no one thought through. we see this every week. more and more things are coming out in this health care bill thateople have not thought through. they may have read this bill before they passed it may have helped. >> what do you say? >> if it were so bad for food to be picked by people tha had health care, then we should ban health care at all other companies. all price was drop if other companies didn't have to provide health care. the tv watch would be cheaper from the cable bill if they didn't have to pay health insurance to the workers. so it's a fee that we pay in all other areas. a lot isealth care coverage whether it is in germany, japan, or here. it's just the way it is. if we got rid of it all, yeah,
the price was drop. would the economy be better? they have to pay for health care with their own money. >>hey're having to pay stuff they don't want to pay for. they haven't budgeted for all these years. and, look, wages are not going up. we just talked about this last week here. you start to even incrementally increase stuff, 10 cents here, 20 cents there, that all adds up. if my wages aren't, that means i have less money. >> the wages are going up. >> they are not. >> the prices are going to go up to the consumer, the farmer can pay the worker more. >> no, it's just to pay for the costs. >> they cannot implement this. there is no way implement this. >> there is no possible way to implement this. how is it impossible to implement morehan any other industry where we demand employers to pay for health care? >> it is called immigration reform. you have illegal guys working on the farms and trying to give them some type of insurance. because we have immigration policies that does not work, you
cannot implement this with illegal workers that are working on farms. i grew up working with the illegal workers. i know this very well. >> if we don't have illegal workers, then the price won't go up as well and that is bad for the economy. remove the illegal workers? >> that's a matter of immigration reform, jonas. that's a separate debate. >> that's another show. >> consumer prices will go up whether we have health insurance for the workers or if i will ll immigrants are n allowed to work and we have to pay higher wages to pick vegetables. they'll see higher prices, there is no way around that. >> yeah, but gary, specifically talking about obama care and how it's having an impact on the industry that, is a $35.5 billion industry. this is huge. >> exactly. the other thing david mentioned that the market will bear this. i'm scratching my head on that. if we were talking about airline prices were going up, people
have alternatives. they can take, you know, a box or drive their car or not go places. if you say okay, food prices go up. what is the alternative? okay, then i'm going to go see a movie? then i'm going to go cut my grass? no! you have to eat. >> if you didn't have to pay health insurance, it would be cheaper. >> what do you mean? jonas, i just don't follow what you're saying. what if we didn't have to pay -- we have to in this case. prices are going up on food. you can't just say, yeah, but they're high also in other industries. >> let's say the airline industry, an industry where they didn't provide health care and now we're having this big debate. yes, my ticket prices are going to go up. they give go up when they give the stewardesses insurance. >> you're comparing apples and oranges here. >> they're not all illegal farmworkers. >> if you think immigration tomorrow, that's a separate debate. >> i have to end it there. thank you. why work when uncle sam pays
more? a brand new study on government handouts is begging that question. and neil's gang is on it at the bottom of the hour. but up here first, the chechic the fan. what they may be doing for the saudis that is undermining america. america. this man is about to be the millionth customer. america. would you mind if i go ahead of you? instead we had someone go ahead of him and win fiy thousand dollars.
as the chaos in egypt continues, america may be pulling foreign aid. now saudis are claiming to pull a fast one. if this isn't proof we need to get off mideast oil, he doesn't know what is, right? >> absolutely, brenda. i think we're actually closer, if we make a concerted effort to be energy independent even than i previously thought n 2005, net imports of all energy, about 30%, in this past year alone, it's already down to 18%. it's projected to be 9%. but in 2040. if we make a real effort, you know that all of the above fracking and oil and throw-in that silly green stuff, i think we can have the next internet age as far as industrial production. we can be energy free. and we can have a much safer america. >> do you think this is important, jonas? >> it's important. you know, one of the rules of
economics is you go to where the cheapest supply is. and if the saudis have cheaper oil than we do and they do, then we should use it. and that's just the way it is. if we don't buy it and we start pumping higher cost fuel out of canada, someone else is going to buy it. they're going to have just as much money they want to do crookedly or not. why wouldn't we want the cheap oil? i don't think we're going to drill -- we're not going to outdrill the audis. our innovation is technology. yes, we've had a huge technology boom that led us produce our oil production to saudi levels in recent years. but ultimately it's going to be something really unseeded. maybe 10 or 20 years away from that. we have already drilled all the he's why toy get oil. we're in a mess because of it. once we drill hard to get oil which is what we're doing now, then the saudis are going to go after the oil and be more powerful. >> tracy, what do you think of that? >> i don't know. they hate us. they hate us. so who cares if their product is cheaper? and to gary's point, we have so
much of it here. we actually -- we know that opec is getting nervous already about how much we have here. if it weren't for the regulations and all the nonsense here at home preventing us from getting it out, then we would be energy efficient. we could be faster than people think. if the regulationsoming out of washington are preventing this. >> david, what do you think? should we be less dependent on mideast oil given all that's happening over there? >> well, i think as gary pointed out earlier, we are reducing our dependence with regard to energy. and we should continue along that course of action and continue to reduce the dependence. however, i think it's a larger issue when it comes to egypt. and with regard to saudi, you know, they're not the onlial ally tha -- onlial yi supporting the military government. you have israel continuing aid to the government. on the other hand, you have the
turks and qatar working with the brotherhood. we have to work with allies on both sides so we can deescalate this conflict and bring stability back so we don't have higher oil prices and the like that will create an impact on our economy. >> well, john, we thought the saudis were an ally, too. and now they're go directly against us. do y think that's a reason we should try to get this stuff from mideast oil? >> yes, absolutely. and david is right. don't forget the russians. the russians lost their one naval base if the mediterranean during the civil war. they said they'll have a permanent base in the mediterranean. it's going to be in egypt. you have another group there now that is influencing politics. the middle east is in turmoil right now. so you're not going to see after labor day oil prices come down. you'll see them stay high. that is the reason for us to continue. we may not be energy independent from the entire world. it may be north american independence. but if we are, it won't lower global prices.
it will alleviate any problems of political rift in the middle east. >> jonas? >> again, don't think it's possible if we stop them from getting revenues from oil without a global drop in the price. that would require all the people like china consuming less on some level. we can't stop the money from going into iran. we don't buy any oil from them yet they still sell oil all over the place. the chinese will buy it. so again, there is no way to keep the money out of saudi abia while they have oil. let's use their oil and lower the global demand for it. just us drilling is a very small piece of the equation. >> but jonas, it's not just oil. it's natural gas you know, it's what we get from the oil sands. it's wind if you want to throw that silly stuff in there. so it's all that. i think we need dsto unleash th entrepreneurs out there by withdrawing the silly regulations liction you can't drill here. you can't frac here, all that
have the option to stiff more restaurants looking into ditching voluntary tipping and adding it right into menu prices. tracy, you stha plan is giving you indigestion, right? >> it's a service business. we tip in our service businesses. when you give a nice tip, you actually do get better service. so what happens if that goes away? where is the incentive to do well? i mean, they're going to get paid at the end of the day whether they're nice to me or not. and unless i tell their boss they were a creep, no one's going to know. so i actually prefer to tip for a job well done. >> gary, what do you think? i know you're a generous tipper. what do you think? it takes the control away from you, doesn't it? >> well, exactly. on the other hand, brenda, they tried this in a number of restaurants. they found that employees are happier. they make just as much money if not more. the tip pool is shared around with, you know, the people working as the chefs and things like that. the restaurant makes more. i think it's a good idea.
i think most people honestly struggle with how much to tip, you know, good service or bad service. i don't go back to enough restaurants by the way enough times for my one generous tip to affect my service the next time. i like this. just make it a flat fare. >> what does this do to the reward then and the motivation system? why should anybody give you a good service if they know they're going to get what 18% or whatever it is? >> i agree with you. also with tracy. as a college student and waiting on tables through my four years i can tell you that i had a lot of incentive to try to get more than 10% or 15% and get 20% by servicing my customers at the table. i would not have that incentive if i was pooling chips through the entire weight staff, in particular. and how i service my clients or
my customers. so i think we should leave it as it is. let the restaurants that want to include it as a gratuity in the bill. i don't think that they will be as competitive as the others. >> david, i'm sure you got good tips. john, what do you think about this whole thing? >> i think i should get a tip for doing this show in the middle of a storm in jackson hole. you have a few workers show up because of personal integrity and work hard. i think everything should be based on tips. if gary b. does a great job on the show, which he always does, i say pay him more. >> john, do we give you a tip when you come from bermuda, too? >> yeah. >> quit complaining. >> we have done something doesn't make it better. this is how it's done. in miami beach, there's no tipping. there are too many foreigners that don't understand it.
you get good service. people go there. >> 20 serz. >> all right. >> i get to kick in 2% if i want. make it 20%. >> you know, most people don't want to get fired or promoted. those things won't go away if we get rid of tipping. all jobs should have no fixed salary. based on this week you deserve $2,000. >> we have jonas excited. >> i don't think it's nose have tipping. >> thanks, guys. thank you to david for joining us. so the fight to push the minimum wage to $15 an hour going national. fast food workers across the country planning a massive strike. but are they about to strike out? ♪ [ villain ] well mr. baldwin...
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predictions. john, you're up. >> forget the fast food strike. >> i don't like yum. >> what do you like? what's your prediction? >> i think back to school is going to be strong. by gap, up 25% in the next six months. >> jonas, gap? >> be better than the gap. bear. >> jonas? >> okay. google is really working on this auto drive car. they're getting serious about it this week. that means people are going to drive further because they don't ha to dohe driving which is good for energy prices. >> john, bull or bear? >> jonas is smart. he's early. bear. >> okay. and tracy? >> all right. say what you want about microsoft ceo but we haven't
seen a ceo chomping down on facebook. >> i'm about the next show. neil, take it away. who needs a paycheck from work when staying at home might work out to be a better deal? welcome everybody. welcome to have you. good luck getting folks to leave home. not if a new study says welfare related benefits are topping $38,000 in several states. that doesn't mean that everyone getting welfare is lazy. but i trust a good nanny can do math. the math doesn't make it all that compelling to get off the couch. to ben stein, melissa francis, along with adam lashisty. what do you make of this? >> i talked about this a long time. i've been blasted on comedy central for being heartless. the fact of the matter is i've seen it in my own