tv Cavuto Coast to Coast FOX Business January 23, 2023 12:00pm-1:00pm EST
♪. stuart: all right. when was the presidential inauguration moved from march to january? ashley? ashley: i haven't a clue. i go with 1901. stuart: i'm the same thing. i haven't got a clue but i will go with 1901. ken? >> going to guess right after the civil war, 1866. stuart: i suspect we all got it wrong. yes we did. it was 1933. franklin d. roosevelt was the final president to be inaugurated in the month of march. by the way before we go, a few seconds, share some good news with you, that is my daughter emma and my 11th grandchild madeleine. she was born this morning. she is a few hours old. that, ladies and gentlemen, is love at first sight. that's it for "varney & company" "coast to coast" starts now. neil: are we at a turning point?
today we look at what is stake for stocks, while we're at it the country. while ken fisher says all the market doom and gloom talk is done. a turnaround could be here. maybe we're seeing a little bit of it today. david rubenstein has the proof, shows private equity deals are coming back this year. what do the billionaire brainiacs see others do not? we'll ask them. ken fisher, david rubenstein are here, only here. so is new hampshire governor chris sununu. he has never been afraid to si in. g donald trump but now he is. inging ron desantis. the new hampshire primary is less than a year away. can you believe that? welcome, earning, i'm neil cavuto, including what is happening with technology stocks today. they're rip-roaring away. you will find our connell mcshane at the nasdaq market site following all of that. connell? >> reporter: neil it has been a
theme here early in 2023. you come into work a big-name technology company announces it is cutting jobs. the stock price of the company then goes up. many times the rest of the tech sector or in stocks in it follow suit. today spotify an example of that. one of the best-known names in the modern music world. that stock has been a big gainer here at nasdaq today, cutting 6% of its workforce. we're adding spotify to the growing list of names in the technology sector that have been reducing staff. i mean you know the names already, like meta, microsoft, amazon and alphabet. we could put so many others up there if we so choose to do and you know, the thing is many of these stocks have really been outperforming the rest of the market as tech continues to bounce. think of it this way, the nasdaq 100 coming into today was 6.2% higher so far in 2023. meaning so far this month. the broader market, the s&p 500, just 3 1/2% gain.
so tech has been doing better than all the rest. the big names in tech have been doing better than many in the rest of the sector. the likes of an amazon, meta. chipmaker nvidia, all three of those stocks this year, just so far this month are double-digit percentage gainers. we're seeing a lot of money moving in here. sales force, another one you might have seen that on the list of companies that cut jobs, announcement came out last week. sales force today has been in focus because "the wall street journal" came out activist investomanagement e in the company. a lot is going on in tech. thato weeks will be really important, could be really telling for this sector and we'll see maybe if some of this is for real. is it just a case of investors kind of piling into stocks they know were beaten down last year? we get a little bounce to start this year? or is there more to it? will earnings hold up even as the economy turns down into
recession or something close to it. largely based on all the cost savings related to the job cuts? we'll see. we'll get numbers start to come out tomorrow. i mean ibm reports tomorrow. we get tesla with its earnings coming out on wednesday. i know intel comes out on thursday. so that is this week. neil, we move into next week as well. alphabet, google's parent company will report earnings. so far so good this year for tech. looking at the big board, nasdaq, 2% gain for the composite with s&p up 1.4 and dow up less than 1%. tech outperforms. will it continue? we'll find out a lot next couple weeks. neil? neil: thank you very much, connell. we'll talk to ken fisher about the whole tech juggernaut, whether that lasts. another factor for trade consider may have such long time kind of a consideration they're not, but this debt limit debate, where both parties stand. let's just say they are miles apart. hillary vaughn following it all from capitol hill. hey, hillary. >> reporter: hey, neil. well the u.s. has its credit
limit, the president though wants lawmakers here on capitol hill to figure it out. republicans want spending cuts in return for raising the debt ceiling but some democrats say it's a mistake for president biden to stay out of it. >> i think it's a mistake because we have to negotiate. this is a democracy that we have. we have a two party system, if you will. and we should be able to talk to find out where our differences are. who is at fault? everybody is at fault. we don't have a process. i've been here 12 years. no budget. >> reporter: other democrats say spending is not the fix, cutting spending is not the fix, raising taxes is. senator elizabeth warren says this without years of republican any earth h debt crisis should be laid squarely at the feet of republicans who helped wealthy americans avoid paying taxes. republicans say there are things
they can cut and they should. it doesn't have to be social security and medicare. >> social security is to be saved. people earned it, they deserved it. everything else, even medicare, medicare is not going anywhere, it is very important. can we bring efficiency to it? of course we can. discretionary spending, maria, democrats raised it by 12% this past budget and that is an outrage. >> reporter: neil one idea that has been tossed around to avoid default minting a trillion dollar platinum coin. over the weekend treasury secretary janet yellen says that is not something that is being considered. she doubts the fed would even accept that platinum coin deposit. neil? neil: that struck me as an idea right out of austin powers. i have here a trillion dollar coin. oh, man. i don't know how you deal with it, hillary but you do. hillary vaughn on capitol hill. delighted to have this next guy with me, ken fisher, fisher
investments, founder, chairman, arguably one of the most successful investors on the planet. also a very nice guy. good to see you, ken. >> thanks for having me on, neil. neil: is the debt thing noise? >> this never getting handled until the last minute, gets handled somehow, some way. the market wiggles when you get close to it. before then people do a lot of this. a lot of this doesn't do much. neil: i notice the time between these crises keeps getting closer and closer. we keep having them. >> this one is five months out at least. neil: okay. >> a long time from now. until it actually is going to impact the talk is just talk. neil: what if we're downgraded again? in 2011, s&p downgraded our debt from aaa. there was a deal that was still had. we didn't actually go belly-up but it was all the craziness during and up to that point that prompted a downgrade. could we have something like that? >> pray to the great god which is the marketplace. the fact of the matter is, if
that is to happen long before it happens, you're going to see that in bond prices. neil: really? in other words they would be crashing if that environment held? >> well before. markets pre-price. bonds are pretty darn efficient and there's little i know or you know, most anybody else knows that isn't in the price. neil: what is in the price of stocks right now? you were very, i would, optimism, might not be the word but you were not nearly as dour as a lot of your colleagues looking at the market. you looked at a lot of technical factors but you also looked at a lot of other big picture factors. i'm wondering for those saying we'll have a horrible recession this year, you say what? >> well i've been saying for quite sometime that's not true. the fact of the matter is, i said on your show before, as long as lend something relatively strong, it has been gangbusters all last year, the fed can raise rates all they want and it really doesn't cause the recessionary kneecapping
that people have long feared. neil: you you have to see that before you see something really bad, right? >> yeah, of course. the fact of the matter is, instead of folks focusing which they will not stop focusing on, what the fed will do to rates, what the fed will do to rates, owe, my gosh. the fact they should be going on what is quantity of lending. as honk as quantity of lend something robust we're not going into what people fear the most. there is lot of things to fear coming up this year, things i'm worried about looking forward but they're not most. it's a bull market. the bull market started in october. i said in my christmas day "new york post" column. this year should look a lot like 1967 looked with the exemption people will not wear their flowers in their hair. i was in san francisco at the time, i remember that pretty well. neil: you mentioned 1967, from 1966. >> bear market in '66. neil: to knight 82 how long it
took to cross a thousand on the dow. >> yeah but -- neil: are you worried we come back this year, people looking like the typical comeback, high double-digit comeback, that might not pan out. >> i don't want to go there first if you look at the dow. if you look at the s&p 500, that time period is 7% return. annual. neil: okay. >> second keep weighted, instead of price weighted. that is more important. secondly i don't really think about the way things might be 10 or 15 years from now, i never know anybody that can do that very well and deal with it today. what i would like you to do invite me back to the show another time to talk about the future when we get to another time. but the fact is right now you, i can't tell you what the market is going to be doing 10 years from now and neither can anybody else. neil: what do your investors tell you? obviously they need more guidance, more assurance, what do they tell me? >> mostly tell me i'm an idiot but the fact of the matter -- neil: got our emails.
you should read mine. >> seen posts online, not everybody is a fan way i am. neil: hurtful but they're all family members. what do you make of that, where we're going and -- >> the world is better than people think it is. if we don't get things that knock us astray, the bull market will continue. how long i don't really know but throughout this year i will go back to something i said on your show numbers of times before. we haven't had a negative third year after president's term since 1939. only down .9 of 1% as world war ii started. neil: really? wow. >> the fact of the matter, that is on the s&p of course. the fact is that period as i talked about on your before, midterm miracle starts october 1st of a midterm year, over next three three qua, those nine months are consistently pose h most profitable period in stock market history. gridlock takes effect. legislation false in america.
u.s. stocks ripple with high correlations to other developed markets and the fact is people keep doing all this, legislative risk is hugely decreased in the environment we have now because of gridlock, and, the world is better than people fear. people are suffering from pessimism of disbelief which is all that, no, no yes but, yes but we talked about before many times. the fact that happens in the early phase of every bull market. they can't believe it is real but ever since october, mind you, one thing i'm a little afraid of, just look right now. people are starting to see things a little more my way than they were before. that is actually -- neil: contrarian. >> a little scary. neil: vix in and out of these lows does that concern you? >> i never pay much attention to the vix. neil: really? we have graphics music, you just don't bother? >> i like the music, going i think now going back to 1967,
they should focus on joe macdonald. you remember joe macdonald? we need to go back to country joe and the fish. neil: might be something that can get some investors solace. ken, always good to see you. >> thank you very much, neil. neil: in the meantime we're getting signs it could be a very crowded presidential field. already quite a few sniffing around although donald trump said it would be act of disloyalty for anyone to challenge him. apparently there is long line of disloyal republicans. is chris sununu one of them? hard to say. he has taken on the former president number of times. the new hampshire governor is next. ♪. you'll always remember buying your first car.
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♪. neil: all right, they seem to keep finding these classified documents at the president's, wilmington, delaware home, and now they're eager to search his vacation home as well, which could explain why the president next weekend plans to visit camp david instead of either home or stay at the white house. jacqui heinrich what is behind all of this. where investigators are looking,
why they're looking. jacqui? >> reporter: neil, the president just got back to the white house from rehobeth a short while ago. he did not take questions from reporters. i will talk to you later. he doesn't have anything on his public schedule today. maybe we'll be surprised, who knows. we know the president plans to spend next weekend at camp david amid reports that the justice department are considering searching other properties linked to the president but the white house counsel's president said the wilmington search on friday became from an offer from president biden to search everywhere from bedrooms, bathrooms, to the utility room. >> president said offer up doj access to the house. i'm fully cooperative. i want to make sure they have the nation they need. so the president's attorneys reached out to doj, offered access to the house and it was provided. >> reporter: "the new york time" is reporting that the justice department had not even tried to find materials in locations other than the penn biden center for the last two months, because initial interviews with former officials involved in the
packing and shipping of president belongings from what he was vice president, didn't indicate classified material would be found anywhere else but the discovery of materials from the time in the senate is causing more questions how it ended up in the president's possession. >> who did show them to? this will be crucial i think to the special counsel's investigation is why did the president have these documents who did show them to, is it connected to the biden family business? >> reporter: all this news unfolds we can now confirm the president plans to replace his chief of staff ron klain with the former covid czar jeff zeints. neil? neil: for all of that, jacqui heinrich at the white house. chris sununu with us right now, the new hampshire governor, kind enough to see us on this day. governor, always a pleasure. these documents, it does seem out of control. of course the prior president of the white house had the same deal. if you were ever to become president, i know maybe from what we're told you're giving it a thought or two, how would you
prevent something similar happening to you? >> well, first i clean my garage. i, i think the most, most concerning point is that the president appears to be a disorganized slob that doesn't even know where his stuff is. i mean you've seen the pictures of the corvette and boxes of trash sitting behind it. so look, unfortunately this is really serious stuff. we joke about it, america has kind of thrown up their hands on both sides, there is no sense of accountability or transparency or public trust. so it's a symptom of i think a much bigger problem out of washington. look, you know, you got to stay organized, treat confidential material as it needs to be treated. both sides do. obviously they found files that he had as a senator and as vice president, as president. it opens up the whole question, well who else has these files? this could be a never-ending story of confidential files sitting all across the country. that is very important. so you have to get that under control.
but again it really has to start from the top. he ain't really leading by example. neil: one thing i could notice though, governor, there are a lot more classified documents a lot more documents period i understand for every president it goes up factor as four, four times as many as the prior officeholder. i would ask you, don't mind going back to that, if you ever did become president there is talk about getting very, very tough on this, policing this, whether it is the national archives which always seems to be the last one to know about any of this. why can't we build a system like a library where you take something out, the national archives is aware of it and you have to give it back? >> it's a easy system you can manage. as a governor i received classified information, i received secret information. i get the files. you know what i do? i literally hand them back to the folks that give them to. i try not to hold on to any of that stuff and i tell my staff.
neil: memoir purposes, write a book. that is why they dough it. >> write a book with secret documents, right? the insanity of that, should we be talking about that, everyone just wants to write a book. they think they need secret documents to do that? look, you're 100% right, neil, there is a very easy system to manage this, for whatever reason it has never been put into place. there is no sense of accountability. they should do the investigation, find all the files but to your point let's create a system and be very transparent how the documents are controlled. it ain't hard. neil: governor, i was trying to get you off-guard to talk about a presidential run. not everyone is. a lot of people in your own state are urging you to do so. i'm just wondering you would have the benefit being governor of the very state that kicks off the whole primary season, new hampshire less than a year from now, i can't believe, does that tempt you even in a field that will include the former president, maybe nikki haley, sounds increasingly like mike
pompeo, chris christie, a long list of other candidates? >> no, just the opposite. look, i think it would be a tougher challenge for me, even though i'm kind of the referee in the first nation in the primary. two things will happen if i don't win my state i would be done. if i don't win enough it will never be enough right? candidates should come to new hampshire whether i get in the race for not. new hampshire is first filter not just who wins three or four top candidates to make their next arguments. we're very different in every other state, you have to buy off on the person first, not just the policy. folks know me here to be sure. everyone has a chance. if anything folks are engage in politics in new hampshire. they know it's a whole different job and level of accountability. i have no doubt they hold me to the same standard as everybody else. neil: they know you were among the earliest to first zing president trump, humerus fashion, your message is clear,
you're not intimidated, didn't seem to matter the threat donald trump had, if you run against him as a republican a act of disloyalty, to you that does not seem to be the case. you extended seem to zinging governor ron desantis. where are you on this? these are titans in your party. you're going after them. >> sure, look, i like ron. ron is a good governor, let's be very clear. i'm just a big believer as someone with a little bit of a national voice we need leadership that holds both sides accountable and this idea that one party can take higher moral ground on any significant issue or transparency, both sides are blowing it out of washington, d.c. they really are. neil: what is your problem, what is your problem with governor ron desantis? whole woke thing using government to force issue? >> no, no. ron is a good governor. we have different styles, right? neil: right. >> again, i do believe i'm from the live free or die state. i believe there is a limit to
government. i don't believe telling private businesses what to do. i believe in individual liberties and freedoms and -- neil: you are concerns, you are against what he did with disney and you would not do that yourself? >> oh, absolutely not. look, i don't like the wokism. we need to stand up and fight wokism and cancel culture but you don't penalize private businesses because they disagree with you politically. it is still a private business. i ran a private business. if a government tried to come who i could hire, fire, what political things i could push on that just crosses a line and my point is this, if republicans stand up to do it on our side you bet democrats will do it and start penalizing conservative businesses or conservative non-profits. we can't get into that game. you can raise a lot of money, get a lot of headlines, we're rewarding the wrong things. we need to be results driven and believe in fundamentals as republicans, individual liberty, local control, low taxes limited
government, limited government, right? that is what new hampshire is about. folks are looking to new hampshire as a model, i'm proud of that. i travel the country doing that. ron is a good governor, we disagree on fundamental points. i think we can win as a party not in the primaries in november of 24 because all that matters by the way with the right candidates that hold true to those values. neil: we'll watch closely. governor sununu always good to see you thank you very much. >> good to see you, buddy. neil: chris sununu the governor of new hampshire. when we come back, david rubenstein what he believes about the political and economic landscape, his optimism for the country even with all the shouting back and forth in this country. ♪.
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♪. >> there is a lot of things to fear coming up in this year and things that i'm worried about, looking forward but they're not those. it is a bull market. the bull market started in october as i said in my christmas day "new york post" column. the fact this year should look a lot like 1967 looked with the exception people will not wear flowers in their hair. neil: people might wear flowers in their hair. ken fisher, billionaire investor optimistic it will be a good year for the markets. he is quite bullish to that extent. i wonder if my next guest agrees, david reubenstein. he is looking at private equity deals and talking to best investors on the planet being picking their fine brains. david, good to have you. >> thank you very much. i came back from davos, their consensus the world is not falling apart. there were some negative stories in the beginning but most people felt the world is flattened out, come back rebound from what happened last year. the markets were down last year.
this year we're off to a good start. i think private equity market will be as well. neil: look at goldman sachs, deals are drying up, changes to your point many in the market don't believe it. where are you seeing it? why are you optimistic? >> remember goldman saks numbers reflect the numbers. neil: absolutely. >> people are feeling in the end inflation is probably peaked, we're probably heading for lower inflation. i don't think it is clear we'll have recession. we could probably have a soft landing. i think the fed is sensitive to that. i think they do 25 basis points in february, 25 basis points in march. maybe call it a day for the while. people feel the fed will not ratchet down so much so than we'll have a recession. i think markets are feeling fairly good. neil: i was noticing the vix, the vix is at at low, a lot of people say it is getting a little too cocky, people are a little too sanguine with things and the counter indicator to
that would be the opposite of that. in other words that if you're a contrarian, you would be worried about everyone suddenly agreeing the market is coming back. >> you can always worry about something or another but for a couple last couple weeks, couple months consensus has been that the market was going to be down for a while because we were going into recession. neil: right. >> maybe for a few weeks people say we're not going into recession. who knows who is right, my own view we'll not hit recession, probably avoid it. the numbers we have in our own companies don't suggest a recession. we look at sales numbers from companies all over the world and right now we're feeling pretty good what you see. neil: when you say feeling pretty good what you see, they're off the worst of it? this year -- >> we're seeing rebounding in sales. we're not seeing the kind of calamities you might see sometimes if sales fall off. neil: you're seeing layoffs. in percentage terms very low but we're seeing them. does that worry you? >> two different things. layoffs don't mean necessarily the company is in trouble.
it means they're getting costs under control probably bill be more profitable. usually stocks go up when companies had layoffs. maybe they don't do that so much now. i don't think layoffs means the economy will collapse. people could have hired more than they should have. neil: you could be right. exactly what is happening at spotify in light of the layoff announcements. get your sense of the washington noise that could affect things. on you've been hearing document back and forth, new documents seem to be discovered every other day. what do you think of all of that? >> it is hard to put your head around all of it because i work in the white house for president carter. i haven't gone through my documents or files from -- neil: you might want to check. >> i might go through my files to see what i have. neil: how does that i can't understand how that happens, david. >> the truth is when people end a term in a white house, for example, they generally, certain presidents, vice presidents, don't pack up materials themselves, they have somebody else do it. can you picture president of the united states, vice president going through the files picking
what goes in, what shouldn't go in. neil: that is exactly what donald trump did. >> i don't know exactly what he did. we don't know yet. i don't know that he went through all the files. neil: i see what you're saying, he did take documents out, those he did know about. >> in his case he may have. he may have. neil: hundreds of them. >> i don't know the facts -- neil: you don't think it happened with joe biden? >> based on what i know i don't think joe biden was going through documents picking them up saying yes -- neil: how did they end up at his home? >> packed up -- i don't know the details. i assume what happened, somebody packed up his documents where was he going to put them? he would put them in in his home where he was living. he didn't have immediate office. he put them there when he got an office. i'm not there to defend -- neil: you preserved a lot national treasures. >> documents i've been preserving are not classified. neil: i understand. there is a process to how you were protecting them, doing that. it is very different with classified documents i get that,
but almost too easy for this to happen and i'm wondering is there anyone in the national archives, because not one of these incidents involved the national archives raising its hand saying we're missing this, that one? >> the national archives probably doesn't know every single document that exists. ones with they went after president trump was visible ones. letter from the north korean president. neil: right. >> i would say if you go through anybody's files working in the white house i suspect you will find something that maybe they shouldn't have. i don't know that for a fact but i suspect a lot of people are probably looking at their files now. the question who do you want looking at your files? yourself looking at it? fbi come to look at it or who? neil: but those files in the wrong person's hands -- >> of course. neil: you do see this going anywhere, whether involves the ones that trump had supposedly turned over or the ones that joe biden had some dating back five years, presumably being turned over? >> well documents that are classified should sometimes not
have been classified. i don't know whether all these documents, ones that really should have bp declassified because sometimes in government you classify things to make sure nobody else sees it, but maybe -- neil: maybe we overclassify. >> everything is probably oh classified in the government based on what i've seen but i'm not defending or attacking what happened. i think it is unfortunate it's a side issue. in washington from time to time we have side issues taking away what is more important. will we go into recession? will we pass legislation? passioning the debt limit bill in time. those things are more important. neil: do you think the debt limit will resolve it solve likes it had a zillion times. >> there is parkinson's law, as much time as available. we have until june 15th. it will get resolved june 14th. neil: study for the exam the night before. >> why fix the problem early? neil: do you ever worry we'll screw up? >> i think sometimes it happens
and comes pretty close. most people recognize if the credit of the united states is in question, we were to default the cataclysmic effect on our economy, global economy would be too great to talk about. i don't think any member of congress wants that to happen. neil: it happened debt was downgraded even when with h we avoided default. >> that is correct. neil: that happened in 2011. if that happened, what would be the happen? >> i don't know whether that will happen or not, i think the full faith and credit of the united states is one of the things we really sal you here and really we've never defaulted. i think defaulting now would not be good for anybody in washington or anybody in the country. neil: well-put, well-put. great seeing you. david reubenstein knows what he speaks. i get a sense he will run back to his garage, check it to be the safe side. >> i am going to do that. neil: but it is a neat, organized garage, that i have a feel. meantime we've been talking about stocks running un, but bitcoin appears to gain traction
life is for living. let's partner for all of it. i'm so glad we did this. edward jones ♪. neil: you know, i got to think that taylor riggs, brian brenberg, jackie deangelis are sew sick and tired of promoting their show they just want to do their show, right, guys? you've been like soldiers everywhere. for every show that wants to know what it will be about. 17 minutes, america will find out. what do you want to do? jump ball for anyone. >> the countdown is on, neil. we'll start talking about the economy, talking about debate over the debt ceiling, inflation. we're still seeing egg prices on the rise. other goods across the board. credit balances are up.
we'll break all that down. neil: when you want to break it down, going back to your bloomberg days, it's a matter of people say, i always hear business guys looking out for me. they're not looking ought for me, using acronyms and jargon. you know all of that stuff but you have been very, very consistent about avoiding it. how do you handle that to make sure you are reaching people. >> neil, you're spot on. we want to bring the audience around the table. we're at a table. we want this to feel like a fun conversation. finance is fun. we want to be accessible to people. we'll talk about issues that affect people. sometimes economic, sometimes federal reserve. we'll talk about it in a way to invite people at table to feel they're apart of it. finance should be accessible to all. we want to make it that way. neil: brian you've been doing that for years with your students. now of course you have america to teach. >> i can't believe it. we're in the classroom again.
i'm surrounded by such an amazing group of co-hosts. we've got smart conversation. we want to help people make money, make big money, why we call it "the big money show." i might learn which camera to look at the right time if these two help me out. we can get there, neil. neil: i've been doing that for decades, i screw that up consistently. good luck, guys, can't wait. only 15 minutes away. >> here we go. neil: i have a good feeling. good feeling, corner of wall and broad. we're up 300 points. stay with us. you're watching fox business. [ marcia ] my dental health was not good.
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♪. neil: all right, sales force is hurting. now a lot of, well, i don't know if you want to call them some ravens or trying to circle, to see what they can make pick out of this but all of a sudden this is trend among investors seeking to maybe take an opportunity to gain an opportunity. charlie gasparino has a lot more on what is igniting all of this interest. charlie? >> ravens or activists or vultures, i mean it is the carl icahns of the world. elliot management going after sales force. it is dan loeb at third point.
these are the companies that essentially buy minority stakes in other companies. these are hedge funds that buy minority stakes in other companies and look for change and the ones they're targeting right now increasingly in 2023 is likely big tech. what is interesting, neil, google laid off 12,000 people. you might want to know why tech is laying off so many people when they make a lot of money? guess what is going on, they are targeted by activists who demand layoffs because they did a lot of hiring. the story through 2023 is big layoffs from the tech firms, because they are targeted by activists who will demand that. one way to repel activists get ahead of them. you're seeing that with google and everybody else. will apple be in play? it has in the past. carl icahn went after this. these are big companies, you think it is hard to amass a stake to make a change.
carl amassed a stake, forked apple to do a buyback. two stories, neil, activists continue to target big tech because they think they're vulnerable. they overhired during the pandemic. got a lot of stuff on the balance sheet, number one. number two, neil, this is i think a even bigger story, layoffs in big tech are likely to continue through 2023 for precisely the reasons i laid out. activists are targeting them. back to you. neil: got you. thank you, my friend, charlie gasparino. elon musk is back on the witness stand. i wonder what he is saying? we'll have more on that after this.
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at t. rowe price, our strategic investing approach can help you build the future you imagine. neil: all right, elon musk is talking again. kelly o'grady following that out of california, what is going on now? >> reporter: good to see you, neil. he continues to testify today in class-action suit focusing on series of tweets he made back in 2018. as a remind he wants to pull up one of the tweets he shared, quote, considering taking tesla private at 420 and that funding was secured. so far the cross-examination dug into whether there is a causal relationship between musk tweets and the share price moving. they have even got enthe ceo to admit his account is formal source of tesla corporate information. the billionaire argued the condensed nature of a tweet doesn't at how for the context. it doesn't mean the content is intentionally misleading which is what the plaintiff is trying
to prove. musk pushed back on his tweets directly moving the stock price. i want to share a quote with you that he mentioned earlier, he said, quote, just because i tweet something does not mean people believe it or will act accordingly. the currently the examination is digging into the extent of the due diligence and legitimacy whether musk indeed had the funding. the billionaire asserting he was in talks with a saudi arabian public investment fund and they unequivocally wanted to take the company private. so far his testimony is riddled with claims that he doesn't remember the exact details from five years ago and that 420 share price was 20% premium, not cannabis related joke for his girlfriend's benefit. he is expected to be on the stand for another three plus hours today at least. neil, it is interesting the stock price doesn't seem to be unfazed by grilling 6 its ceo. trading up 6%, right now. i want to close emphasizing the trial it's a big deal, beyond what musk may have to pay in damages. because you don't normally see a
securities fraud lawsuit go this far, or get so we'll certainly be watching it, but i'll send it back to you. neil: you're right, this is unique and historic. i want to go to my friend, jonathan hoenig. we were talking during the break about this whole electric technology and all of that and i know, you know, very well 10% of all sales were of the ev types and all. he's the leader in the field, he gets all the attention. what do you think of the whole ev thing? >> the head of this exv world, charismatic and often colorful character. almost can't describe a more enigmatic character. tesla's almost like a cult, and to your point, people have assumption we have to have evs, electric vehicles. of course, many in government are pushing for that. there's question of the long-term ramifications of a lot
of the push towards evs, the impact for a lot of the rare metals in terms of making the batteries on the environment. not a lot of long-term thinking, when it comes to the stock as well -- neil: so even with the battering tesla's stock hassed had, you think it has a ways to go? >> it's amazing, the stock is down 70-80% in the last year, it's still up 500 president in just the last -- 500% in just the last five years. this is one of the few socks out there that has an e, f that's solely the 2ked candidated against shorting it. neil: that's right. >> a lot of bulls, a lot of bears -- neil: would you extend that to the whole ev arena, or is this a particular fixation? >> rivian is another example, done even more poorly than tesla. i think almost like what we used to think of as internet stocks remember in the late 1990s, you had stocks and then you had internet stocks. we ultimately found out every
stock had an internet component. neil: but learn survivors after that huge selloff. will tesla be a survivor after this one? >> we'll know in time, and to your point, you know, microsoft was dead money for 10, 12 years, priceline, ebay, that came back -- neil: but ken fisher says, all right, we've overdone it, now the bull market's back. >> look, you never want to think short term when it comes to the market, and you certainly never want to bet against america. but the short termism, i'm thinking about names like bitcoin, tesla, i think that era is over -- neil: what about bit bitcoin though? it's survived all craziness. >> it's rallied off the bottom in the last 3-4 weeks, but to borrow a line from jamie dimon, i think it's almost like a pet rock, neil. fixed income and higher interest
rates, there are other places t- neil: so you don't like the crypto plays, you're not keen on the market right now, you don't think it's come back. >> one place i think you can put money, actually, is good old gold. it sounds old-fashioned, it sounds pretty aftercayic, but this is an -- around cay quick -- archaic -- neil:st had a good year thus far. but you're not a ken fisher believer that this is a turn the-around year many general for the market. >> i think the market easily could be up year. again, don't put me many that dramatic bear camp. what worries me, for example, is the market being up 40, 50% of the first two years in the 1970s, then down in the second two years -- neil: you weren't even alive. >> i vaguely remember it. neil: jonathan, thank you very, very much. his view of the big markets which brings us to the big money, as in the big money show. brian brenberg, i think you've got an action-packed hour. >> neil, we have got an action-packed