tv Hannity FOX News November 23, 2011 6:00pm-7:00pm PST
edition of "hannity." condeleezza rice, since leaving office, has stayed quiet about the years she served at the top levels of the george w. bush white house. all that silence ends now. her brand new book, "no higher honor" a memoire of her years in office. and we are very honored to have with us the former secretary of state, condeleezza rice. great to see you. how are you? >> great. thank you. >> i love this about you.
i love the fact that you are a pianist, and i watched you play. you are amazing. >> thank you. >> and you also like led led zeppelin. >> i do. >> i have a hard time putting those together. >> stairway to heaven, a little mows -- mezart, it works. and if you had your way you would be the commissioner of the nfl. >> right. i told him when i struggled with the russians every day, his job looked so good but from northern california it doesn't look so good now so i think i will stay as a university professor instead. >> your story is fascinating. i would love to get inside of the minds of the people that were there. it's very interesting. when you made the transition after four years to become secretary of state, you knew this was going to be a tough job. you knew it was going to be a lot of traveling. you tell a story where a person
that would drive you to the airport, and you would have these long twelve, eighteen hour flights, you would always and that person what are you doing this weekend? >> right. i had wonderful drivers. at the state department it was a man named otis. the only advice i gave hillary clinton really was keep otis because he could make his way, if you needed to get some way in five minutes, and you only had three, he could do it. >> he could get you there. >> but he's one of those wonderful african-american civil servants that did his job. he had been a noncommissioned officer in the military. and i would ask him as we were going out to andrews air force base and very often i had already worked a full day, grabbed my bags and got in the car and i would say otis what are you going to do this weekend? he said i'm going to go to my daughter's basketball game and go for a long run, and i thought i've lost all perception of
weekends. >> and when i interviewed the secretary of defense, done rumsfeld and over the years collin powell, i don't know if people understand the enormity of sacrifice for public service. and as we are going to get into your story here tonight i'm thinking about all the guys that are running for president. as we discuss this, herman cain is under tremendous fire. an allegation that i don't think should have made it into the press. and, you know, we watched clarence thomas in the hearings. we have an african-american president, and i'm thinking these are great strides for the country, and i wonder if at times we don't take a step back, especially it seems african americans that are conservative are excoriated on a regular basis. i wanted to get your been on that. you served all these years. >> first of all, politics are a little rough. we know that. it's a little bit rough and tumble. when you go into the political arena you can expect it. i know that many, many times i would get up and i would look at
the newspaper and i would say is that the person that they are talking about? is that me that they are talking about? but you are there because you want to do a job and the people who are running for president i think knew that they signed on for this. so we will get through this. the truth will come out, and hopefully we can get past it so that the very interesting debate that we are having on the republican side about how to think about the size of government, how to think about dealing with our core issues like education and immigration, that we can get back to that. but i'm not surprised. and i will tell you, sean, i don't like to play the race card on either side. i would like to give us more credit than that. >> but there is a demographic issue that we cannot ignore and that is in almost every election african americans, about 90%, vote democratic. and many close friends of mine that are conservative that are african-american are called the most horrific names. what do you make of that
phenomena? you were called horrific names. harry belafonte comes to mind. >> i always tell people you don't need to tell me what it means to be black, i've been black all my life. and blacks have to think a particular way. you are the one who is actually prejudiced. if you were looking at somebody who was white you would not say well you have to think a particular way. and so if you look at somebody who is black and you say that about them, then check your own prejudice. >> but it wasery strong language. herman cain, and i interviewed him, as he has ascended in the policy against all odds, but he's had an incredible life. you have a pretty fascinating family background, so does he. i thought a great book i read was by clarence thomas "my grandfather's son." a great book. he grew up poor and the discipline of a grandfather brought him to be a supreme court justice.
both clarence thomas and herman cain have used a term "high-tech lynching," a powerful statement by both of them. >> i don't like language that is too evocative. >> too evocative? >> i think the language is extremely evocative. clarence thomas is a very good friend of mine. he was incredibly supportive of me the whole time i was in government. and i think the world of him. i'm sorry that he went through what he went through. but i think we need to get past the language of race on both sides. my view is that i try very hard to give people the benefit of the doubt. if i give them the benefit of the doubt, then i'm actually empowering myself because the minute that i give in to racial stereotype or to your high profile language about me, now i've lost, i've lost control.
so i just don't engage in it. >> but you work for a very conservative president, and you had nice words to say about president bush in your book during very historically consequential times. but yet other people, if they take a conservative position and they are african-american, why are they beaten up so badly and called these horrific names? you've seen. you've heard it. >> of course, i have. of course, i have. but as i said, sean -- >> doesn't matter. >> no one can tell me how to be black. i know how to be black. i've been black all my life. and again, if you look at a black person and you say that person has to think in a particular way, i don't care if you are white or you are black and you say that, then you've got a prejudice. you can't see beyond race to give that person the dignity, the ability to think as they might. so i really don't engage in this. i simply say to people, you know, i'll think what i think
and if you have a problem with that, it's your problem, not mine. >> do you have a favorite for president in the gop? >> no. i like where we are right now. this is the best time, actually, in our political system because we have an incumbent in the white house and we have a party -- >> know. i report on him a lot. >> you do. and we have a party who is going to challenge. happens to be my party that's going to challenge. and i think it's a good thing that we will get a chance to watch people over the next several months, we will get a chance to watch them under pressure, we will get a chance to watch them under the lights. i've never actually said that our political system is too tough on people. you learn a lot in these primaries about how people will stand up to pressure. and so, you know, we will have a nominee soon and then i will support that nominee. >> we are going that talk about the high pressure moments that you lived under, and there were many of them in the course of
your eight years working and serving round president bush. we will also get your thoughts about president obama. and coming up, more of my exclusive interview with former secretary of state condeleezza rice and her book, which is out in stores today. members of our audience will get a chance to ask her questions. there are a couple liberals there, too. that and more straight ahead. occasional gamble -
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>> we continue now with former secretary of state condeleezza rice. you write in your book, you got on board the bush campaign early, but you thought it was a long shot going up against al gore. >> i did. >> you did? >> i did. we were in peace and prosperity. there was really no hint of what we would experience somewhat later. and i did think it was a long shot. as a matter of fact, i was too polite to say that to then governor george w. bush of texas, but i sure thought it. >> it's interesting, because your background is pretty phenomenal. why don't you give a quick synopsis. you wrote very touchingly about your father and you thought that may have actually prevent you from taking the opportunity that president elect bush was offering you. he got sick, he had cardiac
arrest, and then later in the book he was a minister and he called you and he told you i'm going home just before he died. >> right. my dad was a very religious man, as i am. i'm the daughter of a presbyterian minister and grand daughter after presbyterian minister. he was very ill. i called him that night and he said i'm going home. i said daddy, you are at home and he said no, i'm going home. and he died a couple of days later. and it has always been very difficult for me because i told then president elect bush that i probably couldn't go to washington, this was just after the decision about florida had been made, and my father was still alive and he was very ill and i said i don't think i can go, i can't leave my father this way. and he said i'm not asking you to leave your daddy. i know how much he means to you. we will make it work.
he said we will let you go back and forth every two weeks. that wasn't going to be workable. but my father died and i always said i know john wesley rice jr., and something inside of me says that he decided it was time to mov on, and i hop he didn't do it so i could go on to washington. >> wow. that's a pretty, you know, revealing story and obviously a great man. you know, you worked for george w. bush for eight years. i have had the honor of being around him a number of times, including just before he left the white house. i had one of his last interviews. when his book came out we did an interview on this stage and i went to the texas rain. and got to interview him. i found him in real life, i wish that the person that i met, you know, i don't think tv was his favorite medium. >> no, no. >> you agree? >> i agree completely. >> you talk about him in terms of like even on 9/11, decide i have, alert, engaged, and
passionate in a way that, you know, i wish he could communicate to the american people. >> i think the greatest misconception about george w. bush that he was somehow not interested, not cure construction didn't have tough questions. i saw morebi oval office with their presentations about whatever issue and before they could get to page two, he would ask the most insightful questions that they had forgotten to prepare for. and he was a strategic thinker, always look at the big picture, always looking how to think about america's values, america's power in a way that would really progress, make the world more progressive, make the world a freer, more prosperous. and he was an exceptional president in that way. and i just loved working with him because he was so insightful. he also read five books for every that you know i read. in fact, the worst times at camp davis would be we were going
around the table at hundred and he would say, so, what is everybody reading? and i had been kind of busy, i was reading mostly cables, and i would say to myself, okay, did i say last week i was reading that book because he had moved on this something else. really, really smart, insightful person. >> he pushed everybody. you make the claim that you think what happened with the arab spring and what has happened with gaddafi -- by the way, were you shocked to find out gaddafi had an obsession and crush on you? >> yeah, it's a little weird. i learned about it before i went to libya. >> you did? >> oh, yeah, a couple foreign minister friends told me about it. >> are you suggesting he was flirting with you? >> i don't know if gaddafi flirted. i don't think that's not quite the right way to think about t all i know is i went there to do a job. he had given up his weapons of mass destruction. he had gotten out of the terrorism business. he was going to say reparations to the families, the victims' families. >> of pan am 102?
>> yes, and i said steady yourself, go in there, do your job and get out. >> you any he had a basic shrine to you and a crap book? >> yeah, but in the final analysis he left it behind when he ran so i guess it wasn't that important after all. >> if he would have been found in the tunnel with pictures of you -- >> that would have been really weird. >> right. i want to ask you ultimately because you credit president for the arab spring and gaddafi and what happened with other issues but i have questions whether or not we were strategic enough or whether we made a mistake and we are a little impetuous on these issues. i'll ask you when we come back. my exclusive interview with former secretary of state condeleezza rice, and then later the college students, audience, get a chance to ask questions of their own. you don't want to miss that. that and more straight ahead. [applause]
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>> welcome back to the special edition of "hannity." we continue with my exclusive interview with former secretary of state condeleezza rice. so we have the arab spring. you talk in the book you thought george bush really laid the foundation for this. gaddafi is gone, the guy who had a crush on you.
but why didn't we know -- we didn't know that the libyan rebels we were supporting to institute sharia two days later. why didn't people say, as bad as they were, that the muslim brotherhood would likely take over? did they not see this some did you suspect these things would happen? >> i fully suspected that in the first place the extremists might have the upper hand because the sad thing about the arab world is because of the freedom gap, because these authoritarians had essentially kept decent politics out of the public square, it was the liberals, the kind of democrats, who had been chased down by the secret police, their internet sites were shut down, they hadn't been allowed to form political parties, and the islamists, they organized in the radical mosques. and it's not surprising they would be stronger. but i think this is a transition
we will go through to a better middle east. because we've learned an interesting fact in elections of that been held in places like kuwait, even to a certain extent in lebanon and certainly in iraq, the extremists do well the first time around. but you know, sean, i would rather have them contesting in politics and answer the question what will you do? if their campaign slogan is we will institute sharia law and we will make your children suicide bombers, then maybe that won't be so popular after all. >> i hope so but you always wonder if they will fix the elections. look at the stronghold iran has over its people. i thought we made a mistake as a country, president obama did not support the students when there was an uprising. i thought we missed an opportunity. but it seems like if people desire freedom, and i believe that we aren do youd by our creator. >> it's universal. >> it's universal. we agree. but the problem is once it get a
hold, it's impossible to get rid of it without bloodshed. >> revolutions aren't pretty and when you have political reform this late off lot of anger and it has to work its way through the stem. but we ought to be concentrating right now on helping people to create institutions into which that anger can be fed, where people can begin to advocate for themselves. we ought to be concentrating with these folks on what their constitutions are going to look like, what rights are going to be reserved. >> you seem far more optistic than i would have imagined. >> i'm optimistic in the long run. in any kay, optimistic or pessimistic, authoritarianism isn't stable because sooner or later people lose their fear of the authoritarian and at that point he can't rule so it's not stable. >> there's 30,000 surface-to-air missiles in gaddafi's hands. they are missing. apparently some of them might have been used this weekend
against israel. could we wake up and some of those missiles cross the u.s.-mexico border and five commercial airliners are shot out of the sky because those weapons got in al-qaeda's hands? >> we are clearly in an unstable and very chaotic time in the middle east. but we tried, with the freedom agenda, to get ahead of this. the whole idea with the freedom agenda was to say to friends of ours, some of the monarchs who are our friends, reform now before your people are in the streets. i went to cairo and gave a speech. i said the united states had been with trying to trade democracy for it and got neither. i remember visiting him that morning before the speech and i said mr. president, you need to lead the reforms now before your people are in the streets.
he said you don't need my people. they need a strong hand and it's me or the muslim brother hood and then he engaged politics that made that come true. >> you saw it coming? >> i saw it coming. the freedom gap put the extremists on top that ultimately ended up in the al-qaedas of the world. so reinstituting an american policy in the middle east or instituting an american policy in the middle east, we follow it everywhere else, that freedom and stability are ultimately friends of each other, is important. >> you industry in the book the emergence of the bush doctrine and you were asked a specific question by the president, should we go after state-sponsored terrorism. we have proxy wars now funded by iran, and for example, they would fund some of the people
that were against our own troops in iraq and hizballah and other groups. they are lighting the fuse wherever they can. and now they may have nuclear weapons soon, but all accounts. it seems to me that the united states is coming to a very important decision. do we join with israel and take out their nuclear sites or do you think that's too aggressive? >> i still think there's room to put enormous pressure on the iranian regime without the use of military force, though you never take it off the table. the iraniance need to --. >> i don't think they fear president obama. >> i hope they recognize whoever the president of the united states is, has a lot of firepower at their disposal and they will use it. but the able to pressure on them is to shut them out of the international system. we ought to sanction the central bank, we ought to shut off oil
and gas exports, imports to the iranians. by the way, we can put pressure on them in iraq. back when they were making a lot of trouble for us, and they were killing our troops with the iraqi bad shia groups were killing our troops with iranian technology. president bush put out an order that we would capture or kill any iranian operative that we caught in iraq and we told them. we sent word through the russians and through several others, and you know what, when we captured their commander and kept them and let them know he was singing like a little bird, the iranians pulled in their horns for a little while. >> i want to ask you if you support the president's foreign policy agenda, and you said some words about getting bin laden and the news about that, but you also give credit to the bush administration. want to get to that when we get
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>> welcome back to the special edition of "hannity." we continue withorm >> welcome back. we continue with former secretary of state condeleezza rice. you describe your day on 9/11, the president shouldn't come back, all of the things that happened, how cool the president was under pressure you thought. you gave him really high marks. but i want to fast forward to we finally get bin laden. now if president obama had had his way, we wouldn't have had enhanced interrogations. we would have closed down gitmo, wouldn't have even opened. and rendition, black sites, et cetera. he opposed the very thing that got us the intelligent so he could make, i agree with you
what you say in the book, a tough decision. you give credit to both president bush and president obama. but we wouldn't have gotten there had president obama and others had their way. that bothers me. it seems he didn't understand this was the wisdom and war on terror. >> he wasn't the president at the time. when you sit in the oval office, you had better be ready to make the tough decisions to defend this country. >> i agree. >> yes. and george w. bush was ready to make those decisions. and, yes, he was criticized for them, and, yes, in the campaign people said things about what they would do that they end up not doing when they had suddenly the responsibility of being in the oval office. it's a very sobering thing to be the president of the united states and realize after you have seen that many people day, after you have seen a state less group of terrorists attack from a place they call afghanistan probably with $300,000 to pull off the attacks. you better do the tough things
to make the decisions. >> i agree. i think, for example, maybe it was president obama was naive. he said he would negotiate with iran without preconditions. he said that early on. yet he did make that tough decision. i thought it was a little ill-conceived. i wish he would have known sharia law would have emerged two days after they got gaddafi but i'm glad they got gaddafi. they said it was democracy with the arab spring but i don't think it is yet. >> it is not yet. but at least with the absence of an author tearian in gaddafi. >> wait a minute, but the muslim brother said at the time prepare for war with israel. >> but he didn't have the option to stay with the authoritarian. it's not stable. so the idea you had the chance to stay with him once his people are in the streets, it's not there. now you have to move on. i'm with you. i think it will be a very
chaotic and unstable time in the middle east, but i'm going to give these people a chance to demonstrate that with institutions they can make this work. we have to remember democracy takes a very long time. in my other book, extraordinary ordinary people, i remember growing up in segregated birmingham, alabama. my father couldn't register to vote in 1952. i was secretary of state a few years ago. it takes time for democracy to fully prove itself. but people have to get on the road to it or you are simply going to have the kind of chaos. >> you make the most persuasive case than i have heard from anybody to answer that question. i worry, is it 42 years of sharia, is it at a point i think we are at such a critical crossroads, do -- does the enemy, does al-qaeda, do terrorist groups get nuclear weapons in the time being?
i don't know if we have the time to wait for this process. >> we aren't powerless to effect this. we can certainly work hard to strengthen the resolve and the opportunities for people who are democratic forces. >> i would be neglectlyient if i didn't ask you about the relationship between you, donald rumsfeld, colin powell. you write pretty extensively in the book about it. you didn't particularly like one statement, i think it was donald rumsfeld said you were bright. >> right. >> and you asked him what's wrong with us? >> we were really good friends and we still are. >> because he supported you very early in your career, you write about that. >> right. >> and then there was some conflict. what did you say, hesen out snowflakes, letters? >> yeah, that we are critical, shall we say, of things that we were doing. but really these were substaive disagreements. and personalities are -- people
are people. everybody has got a personality. when you are working under enormous pressure, practically 24 hours a day, these personalities are sometimes going to express themselves more fully than they might under calmer times. >> you seemed like you were kind of in the middle of it a lot. >> well, i was the national security advisor. the national security advisor is always in the middle because you are the honest broker, you are trying to bring all views to the table. when i was secretary of state i wasn't in the middle anymore. >> one thing that is interesting, you wrote that you thought colin powell, had he run for president that year, would have won. >> i do. >> and that the president, president bush, knew that there was a lot of conflict within his ranks. and you often talked to him about it. >> we did. and i think from his point of view he didn't mind strong opinions. that's another kind of misconception that we didn't have strong opinions within, the president could take bad news, he could take debate, he could take controversy. for a long time we were able to work through it.
but frankly around the issues of iraq it did become very difficult and to a certain extent dysfunctional and that's when it is harder. >> are you read, for example, dick cheney's book and donald rumsfeld's book and things written about you? >> i was writing this book so i didn't have a chance to read those. >> you are aware of some of the comments? >> i am aware >> any response. >> i said many times my friend done rumsfeld is just kind of grumpy. [laughter] >> by the way, tv hosts never have these con flicks. we get along so wonderfully all the time. there's never any nitpicky, backstabbing in fighting. >> and the vice president and i just didn't agree a lot. i have enormous respect for him, for his storied career. when we didn't agree we actually did it in a civil way. i never felt it was personal. i know that he was disappointed in some of the decisions that the president decided to take,
particularly when i was secretary of state. >> one last question on this. when colin powell knew that richard armatage was the person that revealed the information about valerie plane and both armatage and colin powell did not say anything or speak out, was that unfair to scooter? he ended up taking -- >> this is a very murky episode -- >> i suffered some the episode, too. yeah, i wish richard would have said you just should have said it. >> we've got to take a break. when we come back former secretary of state condeleezza rice is going to answer questions from our student audience of liberals next. [applause] [ courier ] the amazing story of whether bovine heart tissue
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college and graduate school students. now it's their turn to ask the former secretary of state about her time in washington and in the white house. by the way, i was only kidding when i said you were liberal. there are a couple. what's your name? >> i am a student at the columbia university school of international and public affairs. >> thank you for being here. >> you too. >> and dr. rice you chronicled in detail in your memoirs your experience in washington d.c. and now having served in multiple government capacities, what advice do you have for aspiring public officials, public servants or diplomats. >> first of all, make sure at some point in your life you do public service. i call the book higher honor because i don't think there is any higher honor. but before you jump into the foray, become good at something. i tried to be a good soviet specialist before i went into
government at the time and i was known to know something about the soviet union, which is why i was tapped for that job. and take your time. not everything is going to happen overnight. but i hope you will take some opportunities to get internships along the way. there are plenty of opportunities to have a summer internship, maybe even a year-long internship, get your feet wet a little bit. and ultimately, this may surprise you a little bit, sean, you have to get involved in the political process. go work for a candidate that you care about. if you have some specialty that you know something about the middle east or you know something about asia, work on a little policy team for that candidate. that's really how you get involved. >> by the way, i'm glad you are not going to be a talk show host. we have plenty of competitors out there. we don't need anymore. thank you for your question. next? hi. >> hi. dr. rice, thank you so much for coming out today. my name is eric, and actually i am here with some of my friends, we run the college republican
club and it is a fantastic honor to be able to see you. >> good man. that's an i-plus right there. >> thank you. actually my question is after reading "decision point" i was wondering what are some of your greatest moments and what are some of the most inspirational moment you had with president bush? >> for me anytime that i saw people struggling toward democracy, i was inspired. i can remember going to iraq for the first time and standing on the steps where saddam hussein had been in this airport and thinking these people have a chance. i can remember the purple fingered elections in iraq, going to lebanon for the first time of a syrian forces had left. going to chile for the inauguration in a country that just a couple of decades ago had actually been a military dictatorship. and thinking about this ear
repress i believe drive to be free. it's the best thing we've got going for us in the world, that people don't want to live in tyranny. and we as the united states of america stand for that. so as secretary of state i got to go out and represent the united states of mesh, i felt that i was representing something very, very special and something very deep and those for me were the most inspirational times. >> would you like to get into politics, just as an aside? >> yes, sir, definitely. definitely. >> good for you. >> okay. you have my vote. one more question. this segment. hi. >> dr. rice, my name is todd and i'm from columbia universities. you were actually my provost back in the late '90s. my question is what was the biggest mistake you made while working in the bush administration, and what were some of the most surprising and important lessons you learned at secretary of state that you would want to share with future secretaries? >> the most surprising thing about being secretary of state
is the degree to which the american secretary of state is the in box for the world. i didn't even understand it as national security advisor. it's almost as though there is no issue that people don't bring to the secretary of state. and so you find yourself sometimes saying, well why is that my problem? and then you realize, you sort of get over your grumpiness about that, and you say it's because people really look to the united states to be a problem solver. they understand that we are prepared to do hard things. but i was surprised, even having been national security advisor at the scope and scale of the job of a secretary of state. in terms of mistakes. we made our share. whenever you are in consequential times you are particularly going to make them. i think we probably in iraq, if i had to do it over again, i would try to build iraq from the outside in, concentrating a lot less in reconstruction and politics in baghdad and working
more with the tribal leaders in the way that we finally got right in the anwr province, working with the leaders. and i wish we could have done more, another lost opportunity, i wish we could have done more with mexico. i think one of the costs of 9/11 and having to focus so intently on defending the country is that our great plans that fox and george w. bush, former governors had for mexico for immigration reform, for securing the border we really didn't pay enough attention and if i could go back i would do that again. >> we are going to take a break. we have former secretary of state condeleezza rice as we takes a few more questions from our live studio audience. thanks for being with us. announ] truth is, nyquil doesn't un-stuff your nose. really? [ male announcer ] alka-seltzer plus liquid gels fights your worst cold symptoms, plus it relieves your stuffy nose. [ deep breath ]
>> welcome back to this special edition of "hannity." our student audice, >> welcome back. who has the next question? >> i'm nick from columbia university. >> hi, nick. >> hi. my question is to ask you to predict the future a little bit. many see the future of constrained americans in the world and competition with emerging powers such as china. so i'm wondering if you agree with this view, and if you do,
how do you see that process playing out? >> well, america's best days are not behind it. they are ahead of it. but i am a very firm believer that we've got a tough job of internal repair to do if we are going to continue to lead. we have to get our economic circumstances under control and our budget deficits under control. we have to have a immigration policy that's true to ourselves as a country of immigrants and we have to fix k-12 education. we cannot continue in circumstances where i can look at your zip code and tell whether you are going to get a good education. that will sink us faster than anything the chinese could of do in their rise. so while i don't worry about somebody catching us from behind, i do worry about the united states that doesn't really take care of our core problems. and it's why i always say let's start with the internal repair. that is the source of american leadership abroad. >> would you of consider running for president? >> i have had my time. i'm a policy person, not a
politician. i'll let others do that. >> is that a definite no? >> that's a no. [laughter] >> what if somebody came to you and said i really want you to be my vice president? >> sean, i've had my time. i think it's time to move on to somebody else. >> i'll take that as a yes. [laughter] >> our next question. >> hi. >> dr. rice, my name is colleen from columbia law school. i've already mention add couple times tonight as you mentioned in your book you regret a lost opportunity for immigration reform. i would wondering how you would agross immigration today, more particularly. >> we have to address it at the federal level. i don't think a patchwork of state immigration reform policies is a good idea. i understand the frustration of the states. but we are a country of immigrants. i look at people like brinz parents who brought him here when he was 7 years old and he founded google and the guy who
came here to make 50 cents, and these are the most ambitious people in the world. if we don't get it turned around we are going to have a place like japan and europe. we better do it and do it quickly. i hope we don't play politics with it. there was an immigration reform bill in 2007 that george w. bush and john mccain and john kyle and teddy kennedy all want thed. we couldn't get it done but we are a country of immigrants. that's our strength. i hope we can get to a place where we remember that. >> my problem with immigration is if we don't control our borders, you know, i understand -- look, i have been to the border five times five different places, but i'm not worried as much about the person that wants to work and get a better life for him and his family, but somebody can walk across our border wanting a job. so, too, can somebody who wants to industry on american city. >> you are absolutely right about that. borders that are permanentable
where you have corruption, it's the same border permeability that allows traffics in arms or trafficking in persons. i'm all for border security and doing everything we can. but while we are doing that, let's not forget that this country was built because people from all over the world have come here from generations to be a part of the belief that you can come from humble circumstances and you can do great things. and if we of lose that, then we have lost the essence. >> as long as it is legal, and we get to vet people, i'm all for it. did you all have a good time? all right. just a show of hands, how many of you voted for barack obama? how many of you will vote for him again next time? how many of you have seen the light because of me? anybody? okay. >> soaks sean. >> how many are changing your vote? >> okay. as we said, it's
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