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tv   The Ingraham Angle  FOX News  February 18, 2019 7:00pm-8:00pm PST

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right and left should hear this kind of deep state. chris writes would have been nice if scott would've asked some real questions like what was the insurance policy in place? we are not the hate-trump media. let not your heart be troubled pair laura, standing by. >> laura: i have a question. do you people think people think you are the hate-trump media? when you say we are not the hate-trump media. >> sean: a little distinction. >> laura: come on. i was a little confused. >> sean: everyone speculates about the relationship with the president. i've known the president for over two decades. i knew he would govern conservatively. he has. i knew he was going to stop fighting for the wall. he is fighting and is winning. he makes up his own mind. i can tell you that. how many people told him to stop tweeting? is not going to listen. >> laura: no. [laughs] he's always been his own man. the funniest thing, hannity, when people say well, he watches
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fox or listens to someone and that is his view. if you think donald trump doesn't come to the table with his own set of views and ideas for policies, then you really don't know the guy at all. >> sean: he telegraphs every day. he's going to declare a national emergency. i will find the other funds. they are too full of rage to listen to him. >> laura: yeah, big shock. great show tonight. anyway, i am also not the hate-trump media. i want to clarify. >> sean: you had a great interview in el paso. good job. >> laura: it was fun. hannity tech, think so much. i'm laura ingraham. this is beating from washington so much. the crumbling case of jussie smollett and the shameful rise of the hate crime hoaxes in the age of the president. president trump. while the national media was happy to push the smollett narrative, we will speak exclusively to a local reporter who was a vicious from the start and breaking just moments ago,
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deputy attorney general rod rosenstein set to officially step down next month. very sad. joseph digenova has been calling for this for a long time. he's here to react with that and a lot more. what do former fbi leaders think of that anti-mccabe interview with "60 minutes" last night? two will join us later in the hour. you do not want to miss it. unfiltered thought from men who were actually there and understood the professionalism required at the fbi. but first, phony victims who inflict real pain. that's the focus of tonight's ankle. when the jussie smollett story first broke, many in the media seemed positively giddy. they were thrilled to push the story that the maga haddad dogs attacked a black,, liberal actor all in the name of donald j. trump. >> the start of the tv show
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empire. >> jussie smollett from the hit show empire was attacked and beaten early this morning in chicago. >> a hollywood star who is black and gay another victim of a heinous crime. >> the racial slurs and may be homophobic slurs being used towards him. you see how serious this crime is. >> absolutely despicable. this is america in 2019. >> laura: only as the chicago police department investigated smollett's story, none of it added up. now police sources are telling various networks that smollett himself choreograph the attack, paying a pair of nigerian brothers to carry it out, eating giving them money to fire rope at a local hardware store to make the news. the trio even rehearsed the encounter in advance. last week, the empire actor was afforded a friendly platform on gma to shop and defend his anti-trump script. >> i can only go off their word
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words. i mean, who says [bleep] empire, this maga country. [bleep] >> why do you think you are targeted? >> i just assume, i cannot really hard against 45. i come really, really hard against his administration. i don't hold my tongue. >> laura: and the oscar goes to... well. eventually those stubborn things called facts caught in the way and suddenly cnn's brian sattler and others are now doing the backstroke. >> there was a rush to judgment. i think it was mostly in the celebrity press and among actavis and twitter people. i think it was really careful reported by news organizations. >> if it turns out that smollett did indeed orchestrated this attack, paid the attackers, then he's done infinitely more damage
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to the african-american community, people of color. >> there's a lot to be concerned about here. let's start with the fact that we don't have all the facts yet. we should get them. one thing we have learned from how the story is unfolded as let's wait and see. >> laura: [laughs] finally. let's wait and see. some journalists thing to fall into a state of absolute morning. had the words of the ap's lindsay bar, the outrage has now been replaced by surprise, doubt, and in bafflement. the singers, actors and politicians who came out to support the empire star struggled to digest this strange twist that the case has taken. some conservative pundits meanwhile have gleefully seized on the moment. know, lindsay. you are wrong. it was the left, the political media and hollywood establishment that sees on the moment because this smollett tall tale advanced there anti-trump zealotry. now we are learning just the
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inverse is true. media and political heavyweights were once again willing to slander innocent people, an entire class of people, in a desperate attempt to justify their hatred of donald trump. the democratic 2020 front runners tripped over themselves to fan the flames of the smollett attack. cory booker and kamala harris called it "a modern-day lynching," and urged antilynching legislation in response to the attack. on sunday, booker suddenly took a more sober, careful approach, saying he wouldn't further address the matter "until all information actually comes out." how convenient. if only he had exercised such caution when the story first broke. of course he tried to get off the defensive really fast, contending at a town hall that... >> we know in america that you get it and biased attacks are on the rise.
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we know in this country that since 9/11, terrorist attacks on our soil -- >> laura: the man has absolutely zero shame. ditto for kamala harris. >> which tweet, what tweet? >> saying that it's a modern-day lynching. >> sorry. >> jussie smollett. >> okay, so i'll say this about that case. i think that the facts are still unfolding and i'm very concerned about obviously the initial allegation that he made about what might have happened. >> laura: i like how she does this. and then laughs. it's really funny. not. of course the dim bulbs in the entertainment industry were also eager to advance the maga lynching story, taking smollett at his word, despite
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circumstances that let's face it were really fishy from the outset. canadian actress ellen page made the pilgrimage to colbert where she made the mistake of delivering her own lines. >> the vice president of america which is i didn't have the love with my wife, connect the dots. this is what happens. if you are in a position of power and you hate people and you want to cause suffering to them, you go through the trouble, you spend your career trying to cause suffering, what do you think it's going to happen? people are going to be beaten on the streets. >> laura: well, this is the classic example of wish fulfillment syndrome. when you want something so desperately, that you're able to ignore the obvious warning signs. think about it this way. the left has staked so much of their own identity and credibility on the plot line that trump is a really bad man
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that they need him to be a really bad man. one who inspires vitriol and violence like the sort that the "empire" actor alleged. smollett is rabidly anti-trump and speculation is swirling that he orchestrated the photo attack to repel himself to some type of hero status in hollywood. in other words, think of it as the new superhero, jussie smollett, the maga slayer. the same rush to judgment happen recently with the covington catholic high school boys. when allegations became a liberal gospel. the white kids in the red hats made will have been wearing white hoods. like kavanaugh accusers christine blasey ford and julie swetnick before him, smollett was allowed to dominate a new cycle because his allegations ultimately reflected badly on president trump, or so he hoped. but where is the justice when the social justice warriors are
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actually the ones purveying fraud, hatred, and poison? nick sandmann, the covington catholic kid, his right to sue everyone who accused him of racism, and i hope he wins big. brett kavanaugh had his life turned upside down in the most humiliating way, and we are still waiting for the doj prosecution of julie swetnick and michael avenatti and meanwh, increasingly support herself collected over $800,000 through a gofundme account, supposedly applied to cover her security costs. as for that feinstein stafford who originally likely leaked her letter, we are still waiting on the senate judiciary finding there. the fact is most of the left-wing false accusers operate with impunity because conservatives usually choose to just move on. that's a huge mistake. if these phonies like smollett
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aren't made to pay for their defamatory tall tales, we will just see more of it as 2020 approaches. even the man who's in the false narrative hall of fame seems to kind of agree. >> if it is found that smollett and these gentlemen did in some way perpetrate something that is not true, they are the face of accountability to the maximum. but let's not act like this is some left-wing folks that some are saying on social media. >> laura: no, no, it's not a left-wing hoax at all, al. okay. what is it then? oh, speaking of fraud, may be andrew mccabe can argue that the president himself hired smollett and the nigerians at the behest of the russians to carry out the whole thing. hey, they might as well try to bring these fraudulent story lines together. think about how much fun that will be. and that's "the angle." joining me now is someone who's
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done some of the best and some of the most honest reporting on this case from day one. great for weigle, and he's a reporter with our fox affiliate in chicago and he joins us now. when did this story to you start looking really suspicious? >> well, as soon as we heard about it. i want to apologize for my casual dress here. i'm on a mini-vacation with my son here in las vegas so i dressed for cirque du soleil. i didn't dress for your show, laura. >> laura: no problem. you are excused. >> thank you. as soon as police let us know about it, i mutely called my source that chicago pd. my colleagues and i in the media locally, we were skeptical from the very beginning, and sore police but that's our job to be skeptical. with the old adage, if your mother tells you she loves you, check it out. when we started reporting this story in chicago, we did not report that jussie smollett was attacked. we reported that jussie smollett says he was attacked. growing up in chicago, i've lived there most of my life and
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you know, this was a pretty outlandish claim that he made given the geography and -- in streeter bill, it's having a heavily populated area, people walking around, something as extreme as this, wearing red hats, carrying bleach, putting a noose around someone'. it seemed unlikely that in that area no one would've -- >> laura: i have a question. i'm sorry to interrupt. hold on. i have so many questions. did anyone from the national media call you and say look, you know the area, longtime resident, chicago, what are you hearing? i was seeing a lot of people -- it was almost gleefully jumping on the story because it fulfilled a narrative that a lot of people on the left or who lean left want to believe, that donald trump hates all these people. >> i am generally a defender of my profession when we get attacked, but at the end of the day, we did mostly dropped the
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ball. we did not, at fox 32, but my media cohorts definitely did when they immediately reported that he was attacked without getting all the facts. when i tweeted out the skepticism that i was getting from within the chicago police department, i was attacked and i didn't take it personally because i didn't know that they work, you know, these are people who wanted a specific narrative. i felt confident in my sources that, you know, everything i was learning was accurate. they told me, you know, you can bet on this. yes, he was carrying the subway sandwich on video when he walked back into his condo. yes, we didn't find this on video anywhere. i stuck to the facts. >> laura: you were attacked and i think everyone watching, first of all, thank you for coming on. when you are supposed to be with your family, really appreciate it. everyone wants to on their show tonight so thank you for coming on. this is why black lives matter spokesman said, okay, he said "i realized today that chicago
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reporter rafer weigel is responsible for one much of the formation from chicago pd sources about jussie smollett as he literally repeats what the police say." there were similar things, chad griffin said something similar about leaks given to local reporters. and basically this is why victims of hate crimes, what they fear and why they often stay silent. lee microscope was trained on you and your local reporter colleagues at other networks who were like guys, who walked into their apartment with a noose around their neck or weights to take the news off. none of it made sense to kind of regular workaday reporters and yet you're attacked. >> i didn't take it personally. at the end of the day, real journalism shouldn't be partisan but i understand that this is a story that became heavily politicized from both the left and right. everybody wanted their own narrative, and all he wanted to do at my shop was to just take
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to the facts. we do have an intimate relationship with chicago pd. we have sources in there. they have told us things about this investigation that we are not reporting because we don't want to compromise the investigation. it's a delicate balance. we want to hold them accountable but at the same time, we also, you know, we have to deliver what we know. sometimes we are getting things from sources that maybe they don't want us to report for instance the fact that the brothers admitted that they were paid, that they did rehearse this. and that it was staged. from what i understand, jussie smollett was on his way in to talk to police and once i got out that these brothers had essentially rolled over on him, he changed his mind and i talked with grace's manager this morning and she said right now they don't have any plans to bring him in. in terms of the reports of the grand jury, tmz came out without. please tell me that's premature. that would only be a last resort if smollett does not come involuntarily. right now they are hoping he still will. >> laura: he ain't coming in. >> his attorney said they are cooperating right now doesn't
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appear that they are. >> laura: rafer, thank you so much for joining us and for your reporting on this and a sober, pragmatic and unbiased manner. we really, really appreciate it. we also learned today that sb 24 just reported, so smollett is refusing to meet with police. that according to the statement from his, as you heard, crisis management consultant. yes, he has hired a crisis management consultant. and kavanaugh, who gay is talking to, say that smollett's attorneys will an active dialogue going. we have no further comment toda today. i will point today compel smollett to speak to them? with roger stone, they showed up with 17 vehicles and guns drawn. i'm not saying they should do that but i'm saying that the overreaction was drawn to
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provide some insight, we are joined by l.a. pd detective fox news contributor mark fuhrman. i've been dying to talk to you about this case. number one, from the beginning we had said here on the show these are really serious allegations. they sound really bizarre but every fact should be followed, so this is what we said. and it started to get odder and auditor. he won't speak to police now and i don't like is going to speak unless he's compelled to. does that surprise you? >> no, not at all. i don't think he's going to because he has nothing to say except for the truth and there's really not going to listen to his lies. they've got everything prepared to destroy every kind of alibi, lie or fantasy that he's going to create. when you look at this right from the beginning, the red flags are huge. first, this is not from country in chicago. the second thing, it was not much of a beating. all i saw for injuries was a little scratch on his right cheek. the suspects let him keep the
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phone in which she was talking to his manager at the time of the attack and the manager heard the yelling and screaming. so when you look at all this and then no property was taken. there wasn't much of a beating. it's one of those raised eyebrow things that the first officers feel when they get there and they tell the detectives and they go okay, let's go through the motions, but this smells. this smelled from the beginning. >> laura: from the beginning. again, you want to believe people, they make serious and disturbing allegations. i mean, it is hard to believe people do this but it happens. it happened with kavanaugh. it happened with the covington catholic kids. it's happening in other cases and it looks like it could very well happen here. mark, erased all the red flags from the beginning. i think a lot of people were afraid to talk about those because then your being, you know, critical of someone who is a liberal, african-american, ga
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gay, and all those painful pejoratives come directed at you. people were afraid to say that. now we find out that the police went into the apartment or the place where the nigerian gentlemen were living and they seized a number of things from that apartment. they are cooperating fully with the police. can you go through why those items are so important to this investigation? the magazine and bleach and so forth. >> well, everything that was involved in smollett's description of the attack on him, that's what they're looking for in the search warrant. so they have been unavailable. they have been in nigeria. during this whole time, i think the whole investigation for smollett really came apart february 11 when he failed and refused to give them unredacted phone records. that was the first problem. then they knew that their suspicions were probably true. when they got off the plane and
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they arrested them and they issued the search warrant, and they went in, when they got these items, now they know that these two men have been connected to get into the apartment and how they have found evidence that further connects them. now they had to explain it all. when they got the station, after they were separated. i'm sure they were confronted with the evidence, and i'm sure they were rolled over in a heartbeat. they rolled over simultaneously into different rooms with the exact same story. i wouldn't doubt they gave them polygraphs. they probably give them -- how the money was paid. >> laura: the magazine in the letter that arrived january 22nd. they see is the magazine and maybe thousand letters were found cut out of that magazine. so this whole thing, well, the developing facts were going to follow them where they take us. mark, thank you for joining us.
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it's not just smollett in the covington high school boys fiasco. terror other hate crime hoaxes we want to share with you to make. dinesh to soothe her will tell us what they reveal about our current culture and a lot more. stay there. and it really shows. with all that usaa offers why go with anybody else? we know their rates are good, we know that they're always going to take care of us. it was an instant savings and i should have changed a long time ago. it was funny because when we would call another insurance company, hey would say "oh we can't beat usaa" we're the webber family. we're the tenney's we're the hayles, and we're usaa members for life. ♪ get your usaa auto insurance quote today. ♪ i'm a fighter. always have been. when i found out i had age-related macular degeneration, amd, i wanted to fight back. my doctor and i came up with a plan. it includes preservision. only preservision areds 2 has the exact nutrient formula recommended by the national eye institute to help reduce the risk
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>> laura: the smollett hoaxes one of many that fit a pattern, angry people unleashing vicious and hate filled attacks against or racial minorities. here are a few of more than dozens that are out there. in december 2015 a muslim woman said she was attacked by three white trump supporters in new york city on subway. she said they try to rip off her hijab. well, it never happened. then one day after the 2016 election, student at bowling green and ohio said that white males wearing trump shirts threw rocks at her and hurled racial slurs. protests at a university town hall ensued. the student made up the entire incident. and in september of last year, home and told long island she was driving home when four teens confronted her and yelled trump 2016 and then they told her "she didn't belong here." that too was made up. here now with is dinesh d'souza, conservative filmmaker and author. what does this tell us about the
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current local climate and the culture today? >> well the first thing it tells us is that these fake racial incidents have become normalize normalized. when the case broke a generation ago, this was a bogus racial incident involving an african-american woman who had claimed to have been abused ands anomalous. people really had to scratch their heads because this is such a freak episode. but now there is a profession of these bogus incidents of which the jussie smollett cases only the latest. i think for people watching, they are a little baffled because i probably think what kind of dementia causes someone to do this? why would someday fabricate an incident? and i think we are dealing here not so much with personal dementia but what can be called ideological dementia. you touched on it earlier. there is an narrative here that they are trying to advance. the narrative is that the maga
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supporters, the trump people, are a bunch of races. it's obviously a tribute to the trump-strs that they are not racist because jussie smollett despite being black and flamboyantly gay are going out there looking for people to pick on them and nobody is. so the facts are not supporting the narrative at all. so they figure why not make up the facts? why not adapt the facts of the narrative rather than the other way around, and i think this is the demented psychology, the demented progressive psychology that drives these racial faked incidents. the second reason for them is that they get away with it. >> laura: this is what my point, dinesh, conservatives are quick to say let's move on. i don't want to dwell on this. the fact that we don't have people in jail after what happened to brett kavanaugh, with that julie swetnick, what michael avenatti was pushing, all the promises of evidence of how he was drugging people, spiking the
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punch bowl, gain rape. people want to move on from that? i say no way. otherwise that stuff continues. same deal with the smollett case. it occupied everybody's time, and the chicago pd was demonized and of course trump supporters are made out to be these horrible, awful, terrible, wrong people because look, your people are doing this to this poor actor. >> it's important to realize that the jussie smollett incident is a hate crime. it's a hate crime but in the opposite direction. remember jussie smollett basically wanted to go and beat himself up, that's not against the law. the real crime here was attempting to pin this plane on a bunch of people who did nothing, on innocent people. it is this idea of trying to ultimately frame trump supporters for something that smollett himself perpetrated, so he's the perpetrator masquerading as a victim. it's very important he held
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accountable for that. otherwise the left thinks let's keep trying this. when it works, it works. when it doesn't, we get away with it. >> laura: dinesh, excellent analysis as always. thank you so much. it's not enough to reveal these phrases hoaxes. as we are talking much like my very important we run the whole gamut of these phony scandals and hoaxes and what happens after them. is anyone ever going to do time? is anyone going to get sued and is it going to stick? we are going to learn more about this because today covington student nick sandmann's lawyer says he's intending to file defamation suits this week. yay. that got us thinking, whatever happened to the criminal referrals recommended from michael avenatti and brett kavanaugh accuser julie swetnick? and what about the leak of christine blasey ford's story? we reached out to the senate judiciary committee and the doj and the fbi today. only the fbi got back to us. they say they had no comment. here now to weigh in, former u.s. attorney joe digenova. joe, who's dropping the ball here?
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where are the repercussions for this type of defamatory and i would say criminal behavior? >> the department of justice for years has tried to avoid getting involved in these cases and they are trying to do the same thing now. bill barr arrived today as the new attorney general and he's going to have a new deputy attorney general and i think he will make sure that these cases are looked at. the julie swetnick and michael avenatti case where they clearly submitted false affidavits and information into the senate committee under oath should be prosecuted. it should be put in front of a grand jury for this reason. we must prevent people from making false accusations during confirmation hearings so that they do not become, again, what the kavanaugh hearing became. i personally believe not only did swetnick live. i believe christine blasey ford lied. i believe her entire -- i
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believe her entire testimony was a falsehood and i believe that she should be put in front of a grand jury and have her testimony investigated to the fullest. there is no doubt in my mind and in my opinion that she testified falsely against brett kavanaugh. this must be investigated across the board, or we will encourage people to do the same thing in the future. we cannot have that. >> laura: don't you agree that the republicans always talk a good game in the moment. you and i discussed it. you were here. sol wisenberg was here. they were all talking, were going to investigate and we are referring and then you get nothing. nothing happened. >> well, of course the referral referral -- >> laura: i think we might have lost joe. we might have joe. we might've lost joe. think i know joe was saying. the point was the referral has to then go somewhere.. you can't just say we are referring is in the never follow
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through. the left never let's go. they hold on and they have like a death grip on an issue case and you've got to give them credit because they don't say let's just move on. they say how can we make the next point? joe, thanks so much. get this. some folks on the other networks are seriously referring to disgraced former fbi director andy mccabe asked a "patriot." up next, two former high-ranking fbi officials are going to tell us what they think about his actions. did you see that "60 minutes interview? oh, my goodness. we are going to play parts of it when we come back. stay there. (announcer) people with type 2 diabetes are excited about the potential of once-weekly ozempic®. in a study with ozempic®, a majority of adults lowered their blood sugar and reached an a1c of less than seven and maintained it. oh! under seven? and you may lose weight. in the same one-year study, adults lost on average up to 12 pounds.
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if you recently had a heart attack, ask your doctor if brilinta is right for you. my heart is worth brilinta. if you can't afford your medication, astrazeneca may be able to help. >> laura: one former fbi director andy mccabe admitted on "60 minutes" last night should alarm all of you. >> i didn't know when i would be out of a job, so i just put my head down and got to work trying
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to stabilize the people around me and do the things that i felt we needed to do with the russia investigation, getting cases open, and getting a special counsel appointed. >> is there an inappropriate relationship, a connection between this president and our most fearsome enemy, the government of russia? >> are you saying that the president is in league with the russians? >> i'm saying that the fbi had reason to investigate that. we talked about why the president had insisted on firing the director and whether or not he was thinking about the rush investigation, and did that impact his decision? in the context of that conversation, the deputy attorney general offered to wear a wire into the white house. now, he was not joking. he was absolutely serious. the discussion of the 25th amendment was simply rod raised the issue and discussed it with
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me in the context of thinking about how many other cabinet officials might support such an effort. >> laura: okay, just to sum up what he just copped to come of the newly promoted mccabe, out of political disdain, took upon himself to be the ultimate resistance hero. he's setting in motion a counter intel investigation against a sitting president of the united states, pushed for a special counsel and openly discussed removing duly elected president, commander-in-chief, from office. folks on the other networks are calling this guy patriot? what do former high-ranking fbi officials think about all this question right let's discuss with a couple grades. kevin brock was a former fbi assistant director for intel and terry turchie was a former deputy assistant director of counterterrorism in the counterterror division. kevin, you recently penned a piece calling mccabe's reemergence nursing. >> it's a huge embarrassment and i think terry will agree that
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for former fbi agents, current fbi agents. what andrew mccabe is doing what he did last night further misled the american people and actually manipulated the american people. because now suddenly he's a victim. after perpetrating, along with jim comey, severe damage to the fbi because of their now what we know clear biases, he is going on a book tour to sell books. >> laura: everyone is selling books. all of former fbi guys are pushing their books. got to make money. >> it's amazing to us. he is trying to rehabilitate himself with the damage is done and to do more damage. he has claimed, as you just pointed out, when he became acting director, he went on a binge of opening cases against the president of the united states. on the "60 minutes" interview last night, he was deceptive and
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misleading -- >> laura: how so? >> he stated that he had clear and articulable facts for opening up in fbi -- >> laura: what were the facts? i'm still waiting for the facts. >> he said the president criticized our investigation, that was number one. not a reason for opening up a case. he said the president directed james comey to let michael flynn off the hook. no, he didn't. if you go back and look at james comey's notes, he didn't say that. he said that rod rosenstein's prescient but the rush investigation -- there was all these things that don't rise the level of opening up legitimate -- >> laura: he looked really earnest. he looked really earnest. malcolm nance was on msnbc, former counterterror specialist, and this is how he describes mccabe last night. >> these phrases, taking down an elected president. bureaucratic coup. this is donald trump's characterization of what the patriots at the fbi and department of justice who were
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defending the constitution of the united states -- >> laura: terry, that's all he was doing, defending the constitution. >> yeah, he sure was. i will tell you, i couldn't agree more with what kevin just said to you. i can't even watch this tonight without my blood boiling. i will make three points. number one, as kevin well knows, as all of us worked in the fbi those divisions know, what he essentially told us last night's after having unverified information for a year in the form of the christopher steele dossier, and then going to the white house and being angry because former director comey had been fired and not liking the president's demeanor and the way he delivered words, he decided to go back and say the man was a great threat to america. that's about what we got last night and that's about what the fbi had. it's embarrassing. it's egregious. i never thought in my lifetime i would see this. it's interesting that he opened the case in may of 2017. we had just come off by a couple
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months, march, april, going back to do january of 2017, guess what had happened? where the outgoing obama administration unmasking people in the trump transition team. don't tell me that the collusion is now starting to come together and it's not all pointing to the president and russia. it's pointing directly at politics in the top layer of the fbi. kevin knows and i know and anyone who's been in those spots up there on the seventh floor knows that the fbi agents who work in the top positions were not following the rules, the guidelines are all the policies put together for decades to protect. >> laura: for both of you, what kind of fbi acting director convenes or takes part in a meeting about the 25th amendment and removing the president? is that part of what an acting fai director's responsibility is, to pronounce over meetings or to take part in them?
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>> he should have immediately got up and excuse himself from that meeting and said i will not be part of this discussion. first of all, the fbi has no jurisdictional entries or abilities in the 25th amendment discussion so he should have immediately recognized he had no role and should not abandon the meeting. >> laura: terry, bill barr just sworn in last week is the new attorney general of the united states. former and now current. how does he proceed here? it's almost like the entire fbi has to be dismantled and kind of reborn. to restore its integrity. a lot of good people do work there but it is so tainted now. this whole investigation with the frog from the outset and it's patently obvious that anyone will take off their political partisan cap and just look at the facts and i think andrew mccabe gave it away last night. he gave it away. i thought it was so obvious they had nothing of trump. >> exactly.
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i think the big problem confronting the new internally general as this. people may not want to get into this discussion. as we have a political party, the democratic party turning harder and harder left which in itself is a major national security risk, we also do not know exactly to this day exactly what happened in the fbi, whether there still exists within the fbi these kinds of issues. perhaps people appointed by mccabe before he left. we need to get to the bottom of all these things that are still out there in the universe and all these -- people need to know who orchestrated all this because it's absolutely just unbelievable that there is not somebody behind all of this that pulled it together and compromised the fbi. we are not getting into the fact that we could've had -- we could've had anything from bribes to agreed to ego. all these things, all these things are factors. kevin and i never saw in the fbi anything like this. in fact, we always prided
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ourselves, as we left, pass along the fbi we found a little bit better to the next generation. this didn't happen this time. >> laura: rosenstein is out. osundairo has a new deputy. former partner. is it time to finally -- you need repercussions for bad behavior. will there be? >> i have appealed and articles to the new attorney general to launch an investigation into the actions of james comey and andrew mccabe. these two colluded unfed off each other's biases to do a lot of damage of the fbi. >> laura: both of you, incredible conversation. i know you don't do a lot of tv. thank you so much for joining us tonight. tennis legend martin martina navratilova coming out her huge fire about what she said about transgender women competing in women's events. now, is it a form of cheating? the white-hot debate next. you.
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>> laura: do transgender athletes have an unfair advantage when competing in women's sports? tennis hall of famer martina navratilova, a gay rights advocate, said this week of transgender women competing in female sports "up with the argument at its most basic,
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megan decided to be a female, take hormones if required by whatever sporting organization is concerned, when everything in sight, perhaps on a small fortune. and then reverse his decision and go back to making babies if he so desires." it's insane and it's cheating. i'm happy to address the transgender woman in whatever form she prefers but i would not be happy to compete against her." here now to debate, said ziegler, founder of out and meg mcgannon. member of hands across america. sid, these are some of the tweets coming in about martina navratilova. we all grew up watching martina, huge fan, huge tennis fan. this is rachel mckinnon. martina navratilova has removed all doubt she's absolutely trance phobic. another tweet, transsexual says we are pretty devastated to discover that martina's transfer book and if trans women had an advantage in sports, weinert trans women winning gold medals left right center, et cetera. sid, biologically's and this
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pretty tough for women to compete against men who transition into a new gender because their bodies are still different, broader shoulders, stronger upper body. how is it fair? >> thanks for talking about this. if you look across the history of transgender female athletes, it's not a single woman has ever dominated their sports. lots of people like martina navratilova throughout these men and of men who are somehow going to seek fame and fortune in women's sports. martina knows perfectly well how undervalued women's sports car to our culture. this bogeyman she throws up is totally ludicrous and again, no trans woman has ever dominated -- >> laura: it's kind of just starting, right? it's kind of just starting. to be fair. >> i don't know. playing tennis in the 1970s. >> laura: in connecticut, in connecticut where i'm from,
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there's a real controversy involving track and field. and ray are wood and has not fully transitioned into beating everyone. >> absolutely. >> they took titles away from girls in that situation. this is a ridiculous argument that women are not going to suffer because men are competing in our sports. that's just ridiculous on its face. >> laura: what about the argument of the quality? that trans athletes want to compete in the area they want to compete in and they make it an equality thing. if you oppose them, you are horrible awful rotten person. >> trans women are men and women should not be forced to compete against men. this is basic fairness. i'm really grateful for martina for speaking out. she's going to make a lot of space for more women and more athletes to speak out on this. and say what we really believe which is the women should not have to compete against men in sports.
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it's very simple. >> laura: cyd, you must be a big fan of martina. she's openly gay, advocate, been out there for years doing so much for women sports, girl scouts of high school. she's done -- i was a pretty big athletes oh, i love that. to call her trance phobic, i mean, i think people lose credibility when they start going after martina navratilova as a hater. come on. >> i watched martina in the '80s in '90s. she's a hero for a lot of people, for women, for gay people. on this issue, she's wrong. men are not streaming into women's sports. to cheat or steal metals away from women. trans women are -- >> laura: your argument is that they are not doing it? your argument is that they are not doing it. it's a biological fact that internal organs of men are bigger, right? the heart, the lungs. they have a larger capacity. that's not a hateful thing to say.
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it's a fact. so -- if the top 100 or top 1,000 men in tennis wanted to get in to women sports and were transitioning or whatever, they could dominate this port pretty well. i bet that's what martina knows because she played at the top, top level. >> i think there's a real debate to be had about what an elite level sport, what trans policy should be. it also fact that when you stop testosterone and you start estrogen, many advantages change. >> laura: i don't think your shoulders are here -- we are out of time. we could go a whole hour on this. thank you for joining us. last bite when we come back. that's why she wears dr. scholl's orthotics. they relieve pain and give her the comfort to move more so she can keep up with all of her best friends. dr. scholl's. born to move. you might or joints.hing for your heart... but do you take something for your brain.
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the responsibility for fake news begins with us. if we -- we bear some responsibility for that we are not taking ownership of that and addressing it. we just want to blame it all. on somebody else. that's not how life works, right? >> laura: kudos to laura logan for laying bare we all know about the media. too many anonymous sources, not enough facts. pause before you make a conclusion. put an outrageous allegation other. that's all the time we have to fight. shannon bream and the fox news @ night" team take it from here and i have shannon's new book in my office. i just got it, although it's not out yet. i thought it was. i am promoting it all over the place and people can't buy it. >> shannon: preorders are never a bad thing. laura, thank you so much. okay we begin tonight with a fox news alert. led by california, total of 16 states my joining forces trying to block president trump from using emergency powers to build the border wall. and no


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