and do know the white house had reached out to mayor eric adams, he was the one face and voice you did not see at the very large gathering of leadership. >> just think how frustrated he is right now. >> second isolation. >> more frustration among the people in the car. god bless them. continuing breaking news coverage on "outnumbered." here is "america reports." >> john: harris, thank you so much. to brooklyn, new york, a shooting on a subway during the height of rush hour injured 16 people, ten with gunshot wounds. a man had a gas mask and green construction-type vest. good afternoon, well come to "america reports." i'm john roberts. and good to see you today. >> good to see you, i'm gillian turner in for sandra. this is "america reports." shooting happened below ground on a subway in brooklyn, 36th

street station, n, d and r lines. cell phone video capturing the chaos has emerged on social media. a warning, the video we are about to play is disturbing. >> john: passengers screaming and running for their lives as smoke pours out of the train. those injured hobble off the train, helped by fellow riders. bryan has the latest for us. sunset park, brooklyn. >> police just did wrap up a press conference, more details about the suspect still on the loose and a manhunt is continuing more than four and a hof hours after the incident happened. about 8:24 this morning just before 8:30, at rush hour, on the n train as it was pulling into the 36th street station

here at sunset park, brooklyn, heading toward manhattan, a man took out a gas canister from his bag, unloaded it, the smoke filled up the train as the train arrived to the platform and opened fire on people on the train as well as on that platform. we now know at least 16 people were injured. ten people with gunshot wounds. we had others that had essentially suffered from smoke inhalation as well as shrapnel wounds. we are told it was not from explosive but perhaps grazed bullets. one witness spoke on "america's newsroom," and what he said about the chaos and the pandemonium. >> i saw the individual bleeding out all over the place on the platform, people started rushing towards us, running towards us, one guy is screaming it's not

worth your life to get videos and stuff. >> so new yorkers helping new yorkers as being were being tended to by other new yorkers, first responders responded. suspect is 5'5", 180 pounds, black male, green construction vest, he had a gas mask on and wearing a gray sweatshirt. earlier the governor at the press conference, kathy hochul spoke, crime in the transit system up 68% compared to last year. >> sick and tired of reading headlines about crime, whether it's mass shootings or the loss of a teenage girl or 13-year-old. it has to stop. i'm committing the full resources of our state to fight this surge of crime.

this insanity seizing our city. we want to get back to normal. >> the nypd commissioner said there is no connection as of right now to terrorism, but it is an ongoing investigation so you can't rule anything out. and ultimately the atf, fbi, and nypd are on the scene. john, gillian. >> gillian: are you hearing anything from your sources there about where the suspect could be or where police are looking for him this hour, anything at all reportable? >> no, nothing reportable at this moment and that is just -- it surprising to so many as of right now, and a question i was asked at the press conference. how this person, wearing a gas mask and opening fire was able to leave a crowded subway station and make his way through the turnstile and out into the street. there was fdny responded about smoke, they arrived, saw people

injured and then the nypd came and in those moments this suspect was able to make their way out. but we do know between 20th street and 40th street and 3rd avenue and 5th avenue, they are about to open up for traffic. we believed there was a search ongoing but have no idea where the person could be or whether or not they had used the subway station at some point or where they entered or where they may have exited, i should say. gillian. >> john: bryan, it's john here. a little debate about what happened in the aftermath when the n train pulled into the transfer station. across the platform there was an r train, local. at that point the n train is an express train and the r train is a local. there was an r train pulled into the station just as the n train pulled in. a lot of people were told to get on that train and go. police say that took people out

of harm's way but i've seen other analysis that said that potentially gave the shooter a route of escape. what are you hearing down where you are? >> that's an interesting point. we had heard initially conflicting reports it started at 25th or ended at 25th station. and all we heard during the press conference was this was an incident that was isolated to the 36th street station, the very first station which this train pulled in. so, i have to kind of -- we are still trying to clarify as to whether or not that train continued to roll out on to the 25th street station and was there an incident there. but the nypd, according to their account from the commissioner, this happened on 36th street and the train was rolling in and that was the extent of what we have heard. we did not hear anything about another station or about whether or not this person was able to continue on that train. we do know that the trains were pulled into stations, pulled in all the trains into the station

and no trains that were stuck underground. you can imagine, john and gillian, having been in the subway system, that could be terrifying to be stuck in a tunnel, for instance, and heard what was going on. but we are told everybody was brought into a station and taken out. but as to where this person could have exited, it's pretty -- i find it interesting they are opening this area up after we received an emergency alert the 20-block area was blocked of o. so, who knows what they know where this person may be. >> john: let's hope they find this person as quickly as possible. we'll get back to bryan as developments warrant. right now, ray kelly, former new york city police commissioners. it's been a long time. so, all of this violence on new york city subways since covid hit. the mayor declared in recent weeks 0 tolerance for crime after the poor woman was pushed in front of a subway train fatally, and another fellow was

pushed and survived and now this. your thoughts in this moment? >> well, it looks to me, obviously we need more information but possibly deranged information. the crime, robberies, car thefts and that sort of thing. so right now this could be just a one-off with, you know, mentally disturbed person. we have to see. don't have that much information, quite frankly. we have ballistics information apparently because shell casings on the train, which indicated what the weapon was that he used. at least what the caliber of the weapon. so, this investigation has a ways to go. >> gillian: sir, this is gillian turner with john. talk to us about what we do know about the new york city subway system. the system itself, indeed the

very cars, a lot of them outfitted to help protect people, and serve them in emergency scenarios just like the one we saw this morning. how is it supposed to work when there is an active shooter on the train? >> well you know, concern about whether this individual got on. there are 472 stations in the new york city subway system. the second largest in the world next to moscow, and before pandemic carried 10 million people a day. so it's a big complex system. in terms of active shooter is concerned, there are lots of cameras in the subway system but not every station has cameras, i'm not certain about 36 street as to whether they had functioning cameras there. what the police will be doing, of course, looking for cameras in the immediate vicinity. they are not certain whether or not the individual got on the

train or escaped to the street. these things are under investigation. it may take a while to figure this out. >> john: our understanding, ray, is that there was a closed circuit television camera in that 36th street station but according to reports that we have had from eric shawn, you know him well, a great reporter, apparently the camera is not working at this moment. so we don't know if there is any footage that might be available from the platform as the train pulled in. but i mean, you used to run the new york city police force. they can do miraculous things when they put their minds to it. do you expect that they are going to apprehend this suspect? >> i do. i think the tips hotline will be very important in this case. this is a visual, apparently, had a mask on, did he run along the street, did people see someone acting erratically,

that's sort of information. it's not easy to get gas canisters. who sells them, where are they available, that sort of information i think will lead to the apprehension of this, of this individual. nypd is very good at what they do, and they have informants, they have other sources of information from all sorts of agencies. i think this will be solved but cannot put a timetable on it. >> gillian: to that point, sir, no one knows the subway map, indeed the city map better than you. where do you think police are looking for this suspect right now? >> well, it's difficult to say. i don't know if they have received any information on the tips hotline. i would say those tips would be significant. you can get lots of those tips that are wrong, no question

about it, but they have to be followed up on and i would say, i don't know why they closed down that area, that 10 or 20-block area. they may have had some information that some sort of suspicious activity in that area, apparently they have opened it up now. but a lot of people on this case. a lot of avenues to explore and that's what's happening right now. >> john: you know, ray, subway crime back in the 1970s, 1980s, was a huge problem. you helped along with your successors to clean up the streets, to restore a lot of faith in public transit there in new york. we have seen a declination since crime increased on the subways. what do you think it's going to do in terms of perception taking the new york city subway? >> it's not going to strengthen confidence in the safety of the

subway system, that's for sure. we know ridership is down about 50% from pre-pandemic levels. this is only going to hurt as far as getting ridership back on the system. i would like to see more transit police on the subway platform rather than up in the mezzanine. i think we need them to be more visible. the riding public has to gain some confidence that the safety is increasing in the system. right now that's not the case. so i think more presence and on the platforms themselves would make a difference. >> john: we think about previous events that have happened on public transit, ray, in a moment like this, and the closest incident that i could come to to compare this to would be what happened in 1993, and that horrific shooting by colin ferguson out in the long island railroad, which six were killed

and 19 others injured. thankfully no one has died in this incident. but what you said initially this could have been an act of a deranged individual. that is what happened in the long island railroad. what drives somebody to commit a heinous crime like this? >> we just simply don't know. what we know there is a lot of people who need mental health resources on the streets of new york city. it's a huge problem and has to be addressed head on. all you do is walk down the street in midtown manhattan and you see a lot of these folks. so it is a societal problem as much as new york. but new york has a fair share of it. people have to be -- some people have to be institutionalized. you just need more bed space for them, for their own good, to help them. about you right people are

staying away from new york and one of the reasons is folks that clearly need mental help on the streets of the city. this individual may very well be one of them. >> john: ray kelly, always great to talk to you and get your expertise. thanks for catching up with us today. appreciate it. >> gillian: bring in former fbi investigator now bill daly. the list of things we don't know this hour is longer, much longer than the things we do know. there were some reporting earlier in the day that the suspect was wearing an mta uniform, but now clarified it was a construction outfit. the big question remains whether he was an employee, former employee or in any way connected to the mta. tell us what kind of a difference that could make if this is some kind of an inside job or not.

>> i think it's too early to suggest that, unfortunately a lot of the equipment, whether it's a vest or what this person was wearing at the time could easily be gotten by individuals on the internet or maybe some secondhand store. so i hate to draw any immediate conclusion as to his dress, who is representing him to anyone. so, i think there are some things to be said, and building on what commissioner kelly just said, this individual has gone out and purchased a gun or acquired a gun. seems to be a gas canister, you need to make efforts to get, so certainly an intent and not just somebody woke up this morning thinking they are going to carry this out. there was some planning to it. so whether it was the vest or whatever they were wearing was part of the disguise, i would probably think it was and don't draw too much what he was wearing as to who he might be.

>> gillian: bill to clarify, if he is or is not connected to the mta, does that change the calculus for investigators, does it change anything about the way they are looking at this? >> well, certainly. i think, you know, things you don't want to rule out, this person was not part of the workplace, and workplace issue at hand. right now they are trying to put a broad net around this investigation, try to find out who this individual is so he does not harm additional people. and suggest other things to look at and i'm sure they are besides the video surveillance of the immediate area, i understand the camera was not working there. as commissioner kelly said there are multiple, multiple stops, 272 on the subway system, many do have cameras. where the person entered into the system would be very important. as well as perhaps social media profile. somebody out there who knows

this person, whether this person has kind of put this forward as being aspirational, carry out some type of act against a subway or using some type of gas or gas mask, there are a variety of things that can be searched that maybe will give the police, fbi, federal authorities working in concert a way to identify who the person is quickly. however, some things as commissioner kelly said may take a while. not an instant made for tv movie we find out today who the person is, we hope it is, but it may take a while for some of the forensics and investigation to what this person carried, the canister, the gas in it, etc., and try to tie that back to an individual. >> john: john roberts here, bill. i've been looking online and looks like you can get gas canisters online but does take as you point out some effort here. forensically speaking, who the suspect may be, 1993 and the

first world trade center bombing. when the fbi found a serial number on one of the parts of that van in which the explosives were loaded. i expect they'll be combing the subway car, the subway platform for any little tiny clue that they can trace back. in the world trade center bombing, though, they had pieces of a vehicle, as miraculous as they managed to find them. i expect the clues here will be far smaller. >> i would suggest the same. as you said, we have the canister, perhaps it was left behind, anything else left in the haste of the commission of the crime. and commissioner kelly said there are gun casings found, give them a sense as to the caliber of the weapon that's being used. so there are some things to be looked at. but i don't suspect, unless it is a quickly identifiable purchase of one of these items, a gas mask, a canister, a

workman's vest or construction vest, easily available if not found in the dumpster, they could be quickly used to identify who this person is. but you are right, maybe some a-ha moment immediately, it may take a while for this to be uncovered. >> gillian: bill, this is gillian again. talk to me about the investigatory part of the process underway by the fbi, presumably they want to build as you said a profile of the suspect. so i would imagine they are looking at social media, phone in email records, contacts, family, his travel. how do they build out a profile of this suspect, what else are they trying to get at here? >> and first off right now the fbi is acting in a supportive role to provide assistance as they can, whether from a technological standpoint, forensic standpoint, but the nypd is sophisticated in those areas as well, so they provide

assistance. profile an individual will give you an idea as to we are discussing here, whether it's something that was carried out by a deranged individual or somebody who has some type of ideological component to them carrying out this crime, and so they'll be looking to kind of look at that. but the immediate issue is trying to find out where this person is, and that will require really boots on the ground. we are certainly hoping that if somebody knows of somebody who they are speaking about carrying out this act or knows of somebody buying a gas canister or gas mask or seems to kind of fit this kind of immediate profile of the individual but they call in with that information, a good chance somebody knows this person and is in contact with them, but also just canvassing the area, trying to understand eyewitnesss upon his departure from the subway system, assuming it's at that train stop, where he went. try to find out very quickly how they could identify him and

bring him to justice. >> gillian: bill, very quickly, 15 seconds here. we are now five hours after the shooting took place. does it surprise you they don't have the suspect in custody yet? >> not very surprising given some dimensions of the incident. where it started off and appears to be maybe moving subways and massive number of people leaving the platforms, and also given some of the not immediate identifiable mechanisms, camera to capture this image, and certain things that may take a while. i liken it sometimes with a bank robbery, where people can with a crime, may not be able to get them in an afternoon but eventually will get them. >> gillian: let's hope sooner comes rather than later. john. >> john: out to the touch screen to give you a geographical idea

of where everything is happening. this of course is the island of manhattan, east river here, we have the hudson river comes down like this. and this is the borough of brooklyn, queens up here. what we are talking about, we should point out the n train that the incident occurred on, but it's also a station, 36th street that handles the r train and d train as well. for illustrative purposes, let's draw in a couple trains. n train comes up here from coney island, follows a path like that to the 50th street station, and then comes up like this and then crosses the manhattan bridge, into manhattan, and central park and then crosses across roosevelt island and heads back out into queens. the r train comes up here from bay ridge and joins up, but they run on the same line until they get to about here, and then the r train cuts into lower manhattan and this way. this is the station we are talking about here.

36th street and 4th avenue station. for the n train, a local as it's known, making many stops as it comes up from coney island, 56 street station, an express train. so only stops every once in a while as it runs into manhattan here. this one is a local train, r train is local so many more stops along the way. somewhere between the 56th street station and the 34th street station as the train was coming in the perpetrator, a gas mask, gray sweatshirt, opened fire. the same time, an r train in that station as well. and when the n train pulled in, many people on the train got on to that train, which then proceeded to go up in this

direction. is it possible that the gunman got on to that train and managed to escape into southern manhattan, we don't know. could that person also have gotten out of the train, as ray kelly suggested and gone to the surface, i wish the map was blown up bigger. police cordoned off between 20th and 40th, between about 3rd and 5th avenues here in brooklyn as they were scouring the area looking for any sign of the perpetrator after he might have jumped out of the train and run to the surface. when you take a look at this area here, and we'll try to get you a bigger blown-up satellite map, so many areas for a person to hide. this here is sunset park, an area that you could run through. here is greenwood cemetery, and while this area has got fences, it is a large area that if you hop the fence you could disappear into quite quickly and dense urban area in through here, you could disappear into a number of buildings.

don't know where the perpetrator might have gone, whether they are on a train, or in manhattan or queens, or disappeared somewhere else, that is for police to investigate. and that's what they are doing now is trying to put together the pieces of who this person might have been, where they might have been headed, how they got out, and trying to find out if there is any video that might have captured this person as they were on the way out the door because again, as eric shawn was reporting, the closed circuit cameras in the 36th street station apparently were not functional, at least not at the time of this incident, which is -- it's terrible, it takes away a huge piece of forensic evidence police could jump on right away. but there are so many closed circuit cameras all over new york city, not just in manhattan, but everywhere else here it's sure that he was caught on somebody's security camera and police will likely track him down. ray kelly believes it's going to

happen. nypd is very good at their jobs. at some point, john if it will be today, but some point we'll hear they have a suspect in mind and maybe even in custody. gillian. >> gillian: thanks, john. joined on the phone by hannah meyer, used to work at the nypd intelligence bureau. hannah, thanks so much for joining us. i want to pick up where you where we left off with former fbi investigator bill daly. we are now five hours since that suspect opened fire in the subway. he is not yet in police custody. the manhunt is still underway. does this surprise you? >> it sounds like this person was very prepared. he had, you know, all the tools he needed with the gas mask and canister and gun and had the timing. seems like somewhat worked out and managed to get out of that train and out of the fog and clearly had a plan for escape. so in that sense it's not surprising. i second what bill said about

people, they are going to be collecting every type of information possible and what investigators and intelligence analysts say collecting information and synthesizing it and prioritizing it in a world awash with information, figuring out, where the person could have gotten on the train originally, who -- what you see in train footage around the stops in previous days, putting down everything known how he looked as it comes in from different eyewitnesss, and then as people come in with reports. we have even a few changes, gray hoodie and green vest, you know, we have a physical description, 5'5", 180 pounds, black guy. people are on the lookout and so history and vigilance that we have right now make me optimistic it will be sooner rather than later he is identified and caught.

>> john: hannah, john roberts working with gillian. you mentioned about the timing a second ago. we heard from the police commissioner this occurred as the train was pulling into the station or just before the train was pulling into the station so if you are a perpetrator who wants to carry out an act like this, activate the smoke grenade, it will take seconds to billow and pull out the gun and start shooting, i would assume the perpetrator was trying to time it to the point where the train wouldn't stop in the tunnel and then he would be held captive, so he had captives in the train as it was moving and then the timing was that it pulled into the station at the moment he stopped, was able to get out of the train and get away. that would speak to some level of planning, that this was not just a spontaneous act. >> i agree. i mean, that sounds like a logical plan that you know would

make sense. certainly the train is a great spot if you want to inspire fear and have mass casualties, people are incredibly vulnerable in the subways. that's why people fear subway crime more than other types of crime, even if it's less frequent because you are vulnerable in there, you know, and so that was clearly a premeditated aspect of this, it would seem. and it's impressive if that was the timing he planned. i think so often with this attack things never go as the attacker planned out, whether it's, you know, big or small type attack, big or small targets, so we don't know if he in fact intended to cause more carnage, to jump out of that one and across the track and do more damage but i'm certain we will find out more. >> gillian: hannah, we know there is just a single suspect on the loose right now.

we did hear reporting which was confirmed by the commissioner that there are undetonated devices found in and around the scene. how sort of easy is it for one person to set those up and then go on a mass shooting spree? >> well, i mean, it's doable. weapons are available, they are certainly, you know, with the rise of isis and al-qaeda we saw how easy it is to distribute information online about how to build a bomb in the kitchen of your mom and lots of people did it or tried it. thankfully many of them messed it up. it's easy to build a bomb in the kitchen of your mom but not easy to make it work the way you want it to, and maybe that's what happened here. had these devices were intended to detonate, i mean, he certainly wasn't pulling punches about shooting people.

so that would be logical and i think one of the important questions we are all wondering, are there more devices, are they elsewhere, have they already been set, and that's where people need to be very vigilant and have their eyes open, which new yorkers are great at. >> gillian: thank you for joining us, appreciate it. >> john: back to bryan in brooklyn in a moment, but first of all dramatic video inside the shooting scene, from people on the train or the platform. this one we are about to roll here is particularly dramatic. take a look here, let's listen. [indiscriminate noise and talking] >> john: i've looked at this video at least a dozen times and

you can see that there was a person in the background there who was between the train cars. used to be back in the day that you could freely travel between train cars in the new york city subway, they didn't like you doing it, but you could walk and go to the car in front of you and get in. the doors to the early 2000s were locked. some members of city council suggested locking them was a potential hazard, if somebody felt there was a threat they were in they would not be able to move to another car as they got to the station. the person who is between the cars appears to be yanking on the door to that car, trying to get in, and then sounds like they are banging on the door. we don't know, gillian, is that somebody who was trying to escape, what was going on in the car in front that the door was unlooked and they were able to open it, but then they got in between the cars and could not

go any further. it's impossible to know what was going on, but the idea that that was somebody who was trying to escape i think would probably be a logical one. >> gillian: it would, and i can tell you from personal experience growing up in new york city and living my teenage years on the subway, it's a precarious place to be between the two cars. you don't want to be there unless you have to, unless you are escaping something or going towards something else. one of the reasons they decided to have them unlocked for a period of time back in the day was because it was a fire hazard to keep them locked. people needed to get off the cars. but it is loud, ricketty there and fall off and into the track. >> john: one of the reasons the doors were locked, on some lines the mta went to a longer car, so if you went around a corner the angle would be greater than in the past and if you walked out the door you would step into space because the car in front of you and the platform between the two cars would not be there,

it would be on such an angle you just step right out there and on to the tracks. so, dramatic video, amazing. check back in with bryan on the scene in brooklyn. what's the latest? >> i was hearing your conversation with gillian about that, and there are subway surfers, there are kids who go in between the subway cars. you can walk in between most of them, obviously i think this looked to be an older car, not a newer one, but it seems somebody is between the cars, one with smoke and one without, and people trying to make their way out. you can see on their faces some people are curious and other people are trying to a little bit more panicked. as new yorkers, you see everything and anything on the subway train, so even with some smoke, i mean, i'm just, i've seen so many incidents where there are, you know, people who are not right in the mind on the

train and things happen all the time and shrug it off. but in this case, i think there was the panic of the smoke and the sound and as soon as the doors opened up on the platform it was more clear. we were talking about when we think this gunman may have walked off the train. when we listen to the nypd commissioner from the press conference she said specifically the suspect ran off, ran off was her words at the 36th street station when she was describing what was happening, he opened up the gas canister, began shooting. people on the train and on the platform and then he "ran off." so he might, you know, she did not get into more details on that, but that would suggest the train that continued to go on to the 25th street station, the next station may have gone on but he may have ran off at that station. we don't know. and i know that there's been a lot of talk about the surveillance cameras reportedly not working at that station.

i think there is another question about whether or not the surveillance cameras at the nearby businesses, which we have not yet had a chance to go ask all the businesses yet, about whether or not their surveillance cameras were working and whether or not there are surveillance cameras, not visible to my eye here, from the nypd that could have caught at least the mayhem of people making their way out of the train station and potentially even the suspect. but i do believe if they thought it was in this vicinity, i don't think traffic would have reopened, so that would perhaps they know the suspect is not in the immediate vicinity. and we are trying to figure out the type of weapon. there is some reporting on it, i'm trying to source that and nail that down, but from what we understand it appeared to be some type of handgun used in the shooting as well. john and gillian. >> gillian: bryan, we have been following your reporting all day

on this. talk about the scene outside the subway station where you are in sunset park has changed in the five hours between when the shooter opened fire and now. >> from what we understand from eyewitnesss, 10 to 15 people came out of the subway station and into at least one business in the chaos of having heard and seen what had happened down below and they came up above ground on to this street behind me and ran into one of the businesses. that gives you an idea of the chaos at the time. by the time we arrived it was raining and the scene, at least from the first responder's point of view, there were hundreds of first responders from atf, fbi, state police, nypd, their posture has seemed to had lowered because i believe at that time everybody who was injured was rushed to the hospitals, and i do think it's important to know that five are in critical condition, but that they do expect everybody to

survive from these injuries. >> john: bryan, we will get back to you. and meantime, former assistant director of the fbi criminal investigative division, the fbi has been called in, chris, you can imagine they would, given the magnitude of the situation. what are your thoughts here with what we know so far? >> yeah, fbi is on the scene just in the event that there is -- this was a terrorist attack. what strikes me from the very beginning here is all the evidence of preplanning. the gas masks, the backpack, the canister, the vest, easily removed and confuse eyewitnesses. the escape, clearly planned it out, planned it well, able to injure ten people with one handgun and create absolute chaos. subway are a law enforcement and first responder nightmare. we have seen terrorist attacks

in europe and new york that involve subways, and rush hour, obviously this person wanted to inflict mass chaos and fear. >> gillian: chris, something else that i would think, correct me if i'm wrong, indicates preplanning here, the presence of the undetonated devices in and around the shooting scene. if those are shown to be part and parcel of the shooter's scenario, the scenario that played out, does that ratchet up this from a mass shooting to something else potentially? >> it does. when you start thinking about i.e.d.s, your mind goes to terrorism right away. if i were still with the fbi i would not be speculating like that publicly but i'm a commentator in this context, and your mind goes in that direction if you have some experience with terrorism, which i have, and i

think that this was -- i think whoever mentioned that earlier they had ruled out terrorism may have misspoken. this could be a lot of different scenarios. demented individual, someone obviously targeting someone or something in the subway, but you know, the jury is out on that. we have a manhunt going on right now, and that is probably the first and foremost on law enforcement radar. >> john: i think it was the police commissioner, chris, who mentioned that there was no indication at this point that it was terrorism but they hadn't ruled anything out. so i don't think it was a definite we have ruled it out, it was sort of we don't think that it's terrorism at this point but we have not ruled it out. but when you take a look at the scenario of what appears to be at least this point, there could be other co-conspirators not part of the actual plot itself, but when you take a look at this, is this suggestive more of

whether or not it's ideologically motivated, is this suggestive more of a lone wolf attack? >> indications are right now of a lone wolf attack, but you have to run out every possible lead when it comes to the possibility of other people involved. the fact that he got away so quickly, the fact we don't really have a good description of this person. video is going to be absolutely critical and i think behind the scenes they are doing everything they can to retrieve a good photo as they did in the boston marathon bombing to get a good video of the suspect, get that out to the public so we can leverage the general public to find him. but the jury is out on that multiple people, but that does present an even greater danger if there are more people involved. >> john: we asked hannah meyers the question, the fact he pulled it off as the train was entering the station and bolted out of the station as quickly as he could, does this suggest he

might have done some run-throughs? >> yeah, it does. it suggests some capability, it suggests someone who, it does not sound or look like a situation it's a demented individual engaged in a mass shooting and you know, there are just so many other indicators this is someone who has some capabilities, maybe some experience and maybe as you said, some casing or presurveillance or run-through sort of thing, under pd staking the timing of the trains and hit the station and doing what he did right before it hit the station. >> gillian: is there any chance, chris, the fbi or the nypd has a clearer profile of this guy than they are sharing at this point? what are the odds they know a name or they know whether he's an american or a foreign error whether they know any of the details about his demographic? >> i think the odds are good. the silence from law enforcement right now is deafening.

they have not really told us anything. and if they had a good photo, if they had a good idea, but no leads, no good leads, they would be going to the general public right now. so they are not saying anything right now. they certainly don't want to tip off anyone, or this person or any other confederates, so i think they are wisely playing it very close to the vest. if they had run out of leads we would be seeing some other pleas to the general public to help them out. >> john: the new york city police department has a good track record of finding perpetrators in circumstances like this. the fbi does as well. if i were to ask you, chris, how much would you bet they find out who this person is and they apprehend them? >> the chances are i think 100% they are going to find out who this person is and catch them. but the question is when. you know, they are -- they are hot on it right now. this is mass chaos inside behind

the scenes in law enforcement. they have to set up unified command very quickly, have to have a team going through the video, finding the video, managing the leads. leads are pouring in, and it could be very, very chaotic and they have to take several hours to actually get that set up and running, otherwise leads are going in every direction and people are passing, you know, passing over each other and you don't see a real comprehensive picture of what's going on. so the reason we are not hearing a lot, it's been -- 4, 5 hours into the situation is they are still trying to gather in all the information themselves. >> gillian: if there are eyewitnesss, chris, how soon after the suspect's apprehension will be made aware, if police take him into custody and no one sees, how long will it take them to alert the public, instantaneously or something in their interest to hold on to him without alerting right away? >> yeah, i think they are going

to try to question this person when they first catch them and i don't think they are going to go right out to the general public as soon as they get this person in custody. i think they will take some time, try to get to the residence or car, vehicle and get those searched and find evidence there, all the electro media. i don't think they are in a rush to inform the general public they have been apprehended. and there may be other people involved. don't want to tip them off that he's been arrested. >> john: chris swecker, thank you for being with us. and now here we go again. we have subway violence in the middle of a campaign from this mayor of 0 tolerance for subway

crime. people don't have a whole lot of faith in the safety of the subway right now, ridership is way down from where it was and yet here we go again. >> you bring up a very good point. fund the police, increase your police presence, increase your intelligence and information gathering apparatus. i mean, that was being done for quite some time and as soon as the idea to defund the police, you end up reducing the vital resources. you have to get back to quality of life of policing, when you address crime at a low level, you are not addressing crime at a higher level. >> gillian: mta crime statistics tell us crime is the highest in manhattan and the entire city than since 1997. plus, 33.3% rise in the murder

rate year on year. 14.3% for rape and 27.7% for felony assault. >> this is the result of bail reform, of criminal justice packages hindering the ability of the police to do their job. these packages, it's no secret, democratic leadership in the cities, criminals are emboldened to do what they want to do without any punishment. hopefully somebody will wake up and say enough is enough. about you that enough is enough of political correctness. let's get the cops back on the streets to do their job and then see some real action against the criminal statistic. >> john: steve, we got a statement from new york presbyterian hospital there on the east side of manhattan, says new york presbyterian, actually, from the brooklyn hospital.

brooklyn methodist hospital treating three patients from today's subway attack. one for a gunshot injury, another for a fracture, probably in the melee and the third is nontrauma-related, all three in stable condition. 16 victims, ten gunshots. five in critical condition but i still find it remarkable given the confined area that this gunman was operating in that no one was killed, at least no one has died yet. >> you are absolutely right and we can thank the good lord no one was killed, think the stampede, the gas canister, the weapons used. but again, thank god no one was killed, and now it's up to the police to get all the information and intelligence they have gathered with regard to the suspect and find him or her as soon as possible. i know people worry about, and i know law enforcement worries

about two things. another act being committed by this person or copy cat. >> gillian: steve, thanks so much for joining us this afternoon. really appreciate it. >> john: thanks, steve. >> gillian: bring in daniel linski, former superintendent and chief of the boston police department. looking at what we know so far, not many specifics when it comes to the identity of this suspect. we heard just a moment ago that law enforcement has been very tight-lipped. it is possible that at this point they know more about his identity than they are sharing publicly, perhaps even a name. what do you assess the odds at there? >> all of that is likely. they may be running tips at least on the ground. we had some individuals we were looking at on the marathon trying to match up video to see if this was them or not. we had surveillance set up at m.i.t. and they had nothing to

do with it. just because they have a potential subject, they will make sure the information is right and mature, to make sure the evidence backs up to bring the person to custody and any motive for the public or notice what is going on. sometimes they need to keep things in the dark so they have a tactical advantage and get all their information and ducks in a row before they move too quickly. however, once they are sure they have the subject in custody and the public is no longer in danger, they will make the announcement, they want to release the tension and fear, three days before the marathon bombing anniversary date, religious holiday weekend, clearly safety and security are on people's minds and are going to be first and foremost in people's minds with the event that occurred today. >> john: daniel, got an update on the number of casualties. new york university medical center says the number of

patients they have is now 20, all are stable, same nature of injuries as described, gunshot wounds, smoke inhalation. so a total of 28 victims. you know, the police commissioner said at this point it does not look like terrorism. but how do you really define -- how do you really define that? you had the tsarnaev brothers in the boston bombing, operating as individuals, and yet that was an act of terrorism. you had the person who ran down a bunch of people on the new york city greenway on the west side freeway, that was terrorism, even though it was individual. >> all terrorists are criminals, crimes and violence but do so on behalf of a movement to try and

change government, right. not all criminals are terrorists. so i think the commissioner is at this point saying based on the evidence they have, they have an active shooter event where multiple people were shot. they will develop the information and determine motive from that and if that motive turns to somebody doing this because they were motivated for right wing ideology, or left wing ideology, whatever it might be, but looking to change government or the mindset, terrorism will apply. and then a switch to fbi. after the boston bombing, we were in the command center after the bombs and we encouraged the fbi to step up and take the lead and i remember them saying we have not defined it as terrorism yet, and rick, two bombs on the marathon route, it's terrorism. it's just, we don't know what their ideology is at this particular point but two bombings is a terrorist event.

it's not a targeted crime event. this was somebody looking to get attention for a cause, and very quickly the fbi stepped over and they took the lead but we ran it with fbi state police in boston, all three of us doing it together. no particular unit was in charge. on paper, the fbi was and i hope is happening here. good relationships between the agencies, going to get the mission done and hold this individual accountable. >> john: and we know nothing about the individual, don't know if they were ideologically driven or if they were just out of their mind. we have no idea at this point. >> it could be a deranged individual. it could be a targeted criminal attack. maybe a personal vendetta and you want to cover it up by doing the smoke screen and event. we won't know until the evidence is collected and the facts identify what happened and why it happened here. >> gillian: could be a disgruntled former employee for all we know. daniel, it baffles me in the

21st century in one of the nations and the world's largest most expensive subway systems, hundreds of millions of dollars spent updating and renovating over the last couple of decades, there's not a camera system that works reliably enough to capture every square inch inside the system. does it shock you? it shocks me. >> so i think what i know of the system in new york and the camera system is pretty robust and advanced. it's supplemented with artificial intelligence. people who do things outside the al go -- algorithms, staying in an area too long, putting a bag down and walking away, it's wires and bolts and we need to have systems that make sure we are constantly making sure our cameras are up and running. we need systems when a camera goes off line, we can get it

backed up and fixed. i work with clients all the time, put a great investment in buying the cameras but you need to maintain that investment going forward. that's part of your operational temple if you are on the streets such as new york. >> john: dan, thanks for being with us. we will take a quick break. back in just a few minutes with more of our continuing coverage of the shooting on the n train in new york. let your queries be known. yeah, hi. instead of letting passengers wrap their arms around us, could we put little handles on our jackets? -denied. -can you imagine? i want a new nickname. can you guys start calling me snake? no, bryan. -denied. -how about we all get quotes to see if we can save with america's number one motorcycle insurer? approved. cool! hey, if bryan's not gonna be snake, can i be snake? -all: no.

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somebody in the vestibule between the two subway cars, can't say whether the person is connected with the attack or somebody desperate to escape. frantic motions make one thing clear, and we are not seeing that video at the moment, but will show it to you, that the person clearly wants to get into the next subway car. we have it now, watch here. >> john: it's unclear whether there are banging sounds for the person trying to get the subway door open or could be gunshots coming from the smoke-filled car beyond that person. >> gillian: it is clear the people inside the car wanted to get away, they are turning away and moving away from the sounds. unfortunately for some, there was no escape, though, until the train came to a full stop at the next station.

[screams] >> john: aftermath of the attempted massacre is difficult to look at. the smoke in the subway station clearing to reveal the wounded lying on the concrete platform stained with blood. people inside and outside the station say it was absolute chaos. >> laid out in the middle of the platform bleeding out all over the place. people started rushing towards us, running towards us. >> i saw a lot of people coming out of the train station, screaming, yelling for help. a lady was shot in her leg. and she was screaming for help. >> it was just like a scary moment. everyone was packed in the little station getting out, very scary. >> gillian: the fbi and nypd are undergoing a massive manhunt for the shooter.

he is it still at large, leaving the city of more than 8 million people looking over their shoulders this afternoon. >> john: bryan llenas has been live since it first broke. any idea when we are going to hear from police again? >> no, we have no idea when we expect an update from the nypd on the status of this now five and a half hour manhunt for the man suspected of shooting at least ten, well, shooting ten people, and we know new update, 28 people total who were injured from either smoke inhalation or from shrapnel. so 28 total injured and ten of those people with gunshots. good news, five are in critical condition but everyone is expected to survive these non-life-threatening injuries, from what we understand. the search now is on for a 5'5", 180 foot pound black man, wearing a gray sweatshirt, green construction vest and what the commissioner said about what

happened as the n train that he was on board, what happened when it pulled into the 36th street station at about 8:30 this morning. listen. >> as the train was pulling into the station, the subject puts on a gas mask, then opened a canister in his bag and the car filled with smoke. after that he began shooting. >> after that, the question is, where did this person go. there are reports the train continued on to the 25th street station where victims got on to a nearby r train or out of the station. we have no idea where the suspect could be. did he get out of the station, stay on the train, we don't know yet. the mayor, eric adams was not at the press conference, the governor was. the mayor did release a video, he was not at the press conference because he is quarantined because he has covid. this is what he said in the video about a couple hours ago, listen. >> we would not allow new

yorkers to be terrorized by a single individual. nypd is searching for the suspect at large and we will find him. >> in an interview in the last hour on another network, mayor adams said they have yet to make an i.d. of the suspect, a positive i.d. of the suspect. of course, we need to know whether or not they found the handgun purportedly used and lift some prints, or if there was any kind of surveillance video that captured this suspect going in and out of the subway station, reportedly the surveillance cameras in the 36th street station were not working but does not mean that perhaps other cameras did not capture this person before they put on a gas mask and caused all of this violence and chaos. one last thing. they do not believe this is terrorism, at least not yet. they are not ruling anything out. but that's the latest from the press conference and as soon as we get word, if we get updates from the nypd, we will let you

know. john, gillian. >> john: as you reported previously, after a number of high profile incidents, including a poor woman being pushed to death in front of a subway train, mayor adams came out and announced 0 tolerance policy for crime on new york city subway, increase the number of police on patrol, flood the zone to prevent anything like this happening. he comes out hours ago and says we are not going to allow this to happen. this is the worst thing that's happened on the subway that i can remember in a long, long time, after he has put in place all the new policies. >> john, you are not wrong. you are absolutely right. the reality is that despite eric adams, the mayor, being in office now for a few months, for four months, he has continuously pushed they are doing everything they can to fight crime but the statistics and the reality on the ground are same if not

worse. crime up 40% compared to last year, and transit system up 68%. he said look, we are getting guns off the streets, we have people pulling out the homeless in the subway system, including police officers and folks from social services to get the homeless off the trains, was a huge problem during the height of the pandemic. he continues to say they are doing all of these things, but at the end of the day you are right, there is now a serious question as to the safety of how people feel on the trains, not just from random crimes but now also from orchestrated crimes, and we don't even know yet about the motive behind this one, only that all the numbers seem to indicate that things are just up. shootings are up, hate crimes are up and only going to add to the fear that people have had. i mean, i think the city has been coming back alive as we get into the summer, but this is another reminder the crime situation is very much front and center as the democrats in albany continue to debate

whether or not they are going to do anything about bail reform and other things. >> john: millions ride the subway every day, 28 out of a million, but it does not do anything to restore confidence in the new york city transit system. >> gillian: team coverage, bring in eric shawn, from the new york city newsroom. >> can you imagine the terror and panic in the car. you are in the car, we understand the subway stopped in between stations temporarily because there was another train in front of it. so it's dark on either side outside and suddenly the shooter apparently takes the canister out of his bag, dons a gas mask, unleashes the canister of smoke and starts to open fire. that is what happened just before 8:30 this morning. gunman described as a black male, 5'5", a green vest.

there were no other unexploded devices found but there are reports that the police have recovered the weapon, there are shell casings in that car. you see a man there limping out. he apparently shot before he collapses on the platform and later a pool of blood. one of the things the mta subway system workers are trained for are incidents like this. you don't hear the sound on the video but there was another train, an r train coming into the other platform and the passengers were then told to go to the other train. that was a way for them to evacuate the platform so that you would not have more potential victims in the platform if this gunman kept on firing. in this video you can hear -- hear those pops, potential gunshots in the other car behind there of the gunman apparently opening fire. the concern now, of course, he is out on the loose here in new york city and reports say that those cameras were not working

in the station but there may be some images of him as police have as they are trying to get a line who the shooter is. we have not had an incident like this in a long time in new york city. but in 2020, a homeless man set a garbage can on fire in a subway car and that killed the motor man of that subway. in 2017, isis plot to bomb the subways. a pipe bomb went off in a subway corridor, and of course we have the incidents of subway gunman bernhardt getz in 1985, and the colin ferguson shooting on the long island railroad, that is seen as a racial incident. police saying in this case the victims are of different racial and ethnic group, so does not seem to be a specific targeted group on this, and not calling it terrorism, clearly they are treating this as a mentally ill

and deranged gunman who premeditated this attack by carrying the gas canister, the smoke canisters on board that subway car and then deciding to open fire and of course the big question now, in a few hours, the evening rush hour will start here in new york city as hundreds of thousands pack back in the subways to head home, john. >> john: and eric, the police pointed out and the mta pointed out they are running shuttle busses past the 36th street station there. a lot of people will want to get back to bay ridge or coney island or places in between on the n, r, and d line also runs through that station. when you think about this idea that as you pointed out, that the closed circuit camera in that station wasn't working, if you look at the british subway system, i covered the bombing there back in the early 2000s, and that's when closed circuit cameras were in their infancy,

they had footage of literally every moment. the guys with the backpacks on camera going into the subway, they had all the information necessary. for a place as sophisticated as new york city and the transit system which so desperately requires that equipment to not have functioning cameras you have to stop and pinch yourself and say why. >> in this day and age of terrorism it is an outrage the camera on that platform on that station were not working. two separate cameras not working. thankfully there are lots of cameras on the streets, hopefully there is video surveillance of where this gunman did enter the subway station at another station but that is going to be one of the searing questions, john, and total lapse of security and safety for those who ride the subways that you have any cameras, even though there are 400 some odd subway stations in new york. it's a basic, have the

surveillance cameras, we have seen how they can successfully lead to the capturing of criminal suspects and terrorists, too. >> gillian: and the subway system had hundreds of millions poured into it by taxpayers over the decades. stand by. we hope to bring you back. >> john: what do you want to bet they will find the suspect from a mom and pop bodega in the area. he brings up a good point, the northbound n train between 56th and 34th street stations in brooklyn had stopped in the tunnel waiting for another train to clear the station before moving on and yet still this shooter seemed to time this thing perfectly so that he could jump off the train and get out of there as quickly as possible

when the train hit the station as opposed to somebody, you know, pushing the button or pulling the chord or whatever to stop the train immediately. it kind of speaks to the idea that maybe this guy, like the 9/11 hijackers did, did some dry runs before pulling off this event. >> i think all of that certainly suggests that this was planned to a significant degree and you know, obviously executed with some level of success on the shooter's part, which is you know, really discouraging and illustrative of how vulnerable new yorkers are underground, and a growing sense of weariness about our safety in the subway system and the data has supported that sense of insecurity. in the latest report, transit crime is up 68% year to date. this incident is, you can be sure will only contribute to the

sense of insecurity, sense of weariness, which i think will drive people out of those public spaces to a significant degree which is problematic. new york city depends on the subway system being not just effective, but also safe and if it ceases to be safe, new york loses a central part of its identity and that's i think going to be a big challenge not just for the mayor but for leaders across the city and state. >> gillian: to your point, this is gillian, this is certainly, this event is a major test for new york's new leadership. both the governor and the mayor. what do you hope they take as the next first step, by the way, got to mention that eric adams is reportedly managing all of this from covid quarantine. >> that's right, that's right, this is going to be an incredibly large challenge. i think also a defining moment for the administration, depending how this is handled and one of the things that has to be looked at going forward, a

lot of talk about the fact the security cameras in the station did not seem to be working and just illustrates the importance of maintaining our technological superiority and ability to conduct these investigations through the use of technology. and i would note there has been a significant amount of pushback against the idea of expanding our technological footprint in the law enforcement arena. things like facial recognition technology have been fiercely opposed by groups like amnesty international, aclu, and legal aid, and what the tradeoff involves. the extent they don't know who the person is or where they might be, that illustrates just what we are losing out on if we continue not to take advantage or full advantage of the technology that's been developed, and this is something i think the administration will have to look at and double down on. this is part of the mayor's gun violence prevention plan but that needs to move up the list of items in terms of priority.

>> when the new york city police commissioner said this does not appear to be terrorism-related at this point, are we, rafael, almost into a semantic argument as to what exactly is terrorism? religious terrorism, is it international terrorism, is it domestic terrorism, some guy who is having a bad guy terrorism, i don't like the subway terrorism, it seems we are playing a semantic game. ten people were shot, 28 people in all who were put in harm's way, and it's only by a miracle that no one was killed. >> i think that's right. i've gotten some information suggesting that the caliber of bullet was a little smaller, i think it was a .380, you know, is obviously not going to be as lethal as say a .45, so that would seem to operate to the benefit of the victims. but i do think that yeah, there's been, sort of an odd

amount of attention paid to semantics and i don't think it matters to new yorkers at the end of the day. what matters is whether or not we are safe on the subway. this incident illustrates what our vulnerabilities are. a lot of attention is paid to kind of hardening the more obvious stations like times square, j street metro tech, but 400 some odd subway stations across the city. not all of them get the same amount of attention and what this is showing us we have to be vigilant across the board and maintain a high level of security so that individuals who are trusting the city with their own safety continue to do that. and i think, you know, the city risks taking that for granted if it does not take significant steps moving forward. >> gillian: rafael mangual, thank you for joining us. appreciate it. there is another major story breaking this afternoon right now in new york. the state's lieutenant governor

indicted for alleged corruption, part of what the feds say was a very carefully planned scheme. >> john: the news coming as albany is shaken by governor andrew cuomo's epic down fall. the breaking news on this latest scandal coming up next. veteran homeowners, need a financial boost? the newday 100 va loan lets you borrow up to 100% of your home's value and take out up to $60,000 or more. give them a call. veteran homeowners. you made a smart move when you bought your home. now make another one and turn your equity into cash with your va home loan benefit. the newday 100 va loan lets you borrow 100% of your home's value. upgrade the kitchen, add a pool for the grandkids, or have the security of cash in the bank. with today's high home values, turning equity into cash is a really smart move.

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>> john: fox news alert, new political chaos in albany. new york's democrat lieutenant governor brian benjamin arrested in what the feds say was a campaign donation scheme. allegedly took campaign money from a real estate developer in exchange for political favors when benjamin was a state senator. benjamin pled not guilty to federal corruption charges earlier this morning. arrest now creating a political

mess for governor kathy hochul who picked benjamin to be her second in command. governor appeared earlier today and said she would speak about the indictment later on today. >> gillian: another major story breaking today, and that is a brutal inflation report confirming what pretty much anyone who has bought groceries lately already knows and that is that prices are the highest for americans we have seen in a generation. consumer price index 8.5% compared to a year earlier, the biggest price hike in a generation. comes mostly in the meat department, fish and eggs up more than 10% but pretty much every other staple is on the rise. from milk and coffee, to salt and pepper.

the white house is placing the blame squarely with vladimir putin. hi, peter. >> we checked the tape, long before officials wanted to blame vladimir putin for rising prices they were blaming the pandemic and the supply chain and said inflation would be temporary like this time in december. >> i think you'll see a change sooner, quicker than, more rapidly than it will take than most people think. every other aspect of the economy is racing ahead. it's doing incredibly well. >> on the way to the president's trip to iowa in the last hour or so, the press secretary jen psaki briefed the travelling press that president biden still confident inflation will ease by the end of this year. but that's as republican senator lindsey graham is arguing the biden administration truly wants to find a case of record high inflation, the cause of record high inflation, all they have to

do is look in the mirror. dramatic record setting prices were not caused by vladimir putin but the bad choices of president biden and the democrats who control congress. and there is now a trump-era chairman of the council of economic advisors who is explaining a little bit further. >> what they have been doing, they have been mailing checks to people and printing money, and every, you know, very, very first year high school textbook frankly will tell you, economics textbook tells you if you do that, you get run away inflation. >> officials are sensitive about rising prices, and president biden is in iowa to talk about steps to lower fuel costs, allowing the extra sale of e-15, extra ethanol gasoline in the hot summer months ahead. gillian. >> gillian: peter doocy live from 1600 pennsylvania avenue, thank you. >> john: gillian, a manhunt for this morning's subway shooter

continues in new york city. jen psaki weighing in on all this. listen here. >> certainly we would assess every appropriate way through this channel. as we noted earlier this morning, not only briefed and latest developments, but white house senior staff are in touch with mayor adams, police commissioner, and offered to provide, i spoke again with the president earlier on the plane and he reiterated that is his request. anything they need, anything they want. >> john: jen psaki aboard air force 1, why the audience goes in and out. more than two dozen people hurt in the incident, no word on the suspect's potential whereabouts but the geographical idea where it transpired and where the suspect could have fled to. the 36th avenue station, on the line that serves the n train, the r train and the d train. d train not really relevant here, it's the r and the n

trains that were really talked about here because of their proximity to each other. so again, here is the station. r train sort of runs up here from the bottom of brooklyn, and then goes across here to lower manhattan, and then up. the n train comes up sort of this way and crosses the manhattan bridge before it hooks back up at canal street with the r, and then up here just south of central park, comes across like this. the r train continues this way and this one, the n train up to ditmar's boulevard in astoria, and you can get on a bus to laguardia. we don't know where the suspect fled after the train pulled into the station, but the understanding is, that the suspect fled the subway and went above ground, which is why initially police had cordoned

off an area, this is greenwood cemetery, by the way, between 20th and 40th streets in brooklyn. they have since lifted that. so at the moment we don't know if the suspect got on the r train, which went this way, because there was an r train in the station at the same time as the n train pulled in, or if the suspect merely ran up the stairs and out on to the streets. but you can bet the police are going to be asking anybody who has surveillance video in the area, and that includes mom and pop bodegas and other businesses and going through that to see if they can catch a glimpse of the suspect who was wearing this again green vest and gray hoodie sweatshirt. don't expect they would be running through the streets wearing the gas mask, they would likely have disposed of that. the nypd has a great track record of tracking down suspects, and hopefully if not the next few hours, the next few days they'll get an idea who the

person was. >> gillian: a scandal we told you about last week, showing no signs of abating now and threatens to spell the end of blm. the black lives matter movement is now apologizing for a multi-million dollar mansion bought with people's donation money. >> john: on the bet that we would never ever hear about it. the growing controversy ahead. '. he's finding some investment ideas with merrill. eyes on the ball baby. digital tools so impressive, you just can't stop. what would you like the power to do? >> tech: need to get your windshield fixed? you just can't stop. safelite makes it easy. >> tech vo: you can schedule in just a few clicks. and we'll come to you with a replacement you can trust. >> man: looks great. >> tech: that's service on your time. schedule now. >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪ psoriasis really messes with you. try. hope. fail. no one should suffer like that.

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hi, i'm william devane. did you know there's only been two times in american history - two - when the national debt was larger than gross domestic product? world war ii - and right now. that's a deep hole. and i don't know how we'll climb out of it. that's why i buy gold from rosland capital. rosland capital is a trusted leader in helping people acquire precious metals. gold bullion, lady liberty gold and silver proofs, and premium coins, can help you preserve your wealth. call rosland capital to receive your free rosland guide to gold,

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little bit of both. let's bring in special report anchor bret baier. one of the people who is most critical of this is the new jersey state senator, what she told "america's newsroom yesterday." >> it just goes way too far. we are teaching 1st graders, kindergarteners if you have a penis it does not mean you are a boy. if you have a vagina, does not mean you are a girl. we have lost our way what we are trying to teach our children. >> john: i remember 1st grade and i don't remember any of that coming up, bret. what children are being taught in school was a huge issue in last november's election and looks like it's going to be again this year as well. >> it does, good afternoon, john. i think this political issue is nuclear. it is potentially nuclear, crosses party lines, democrat, republican, independent, parents dealing with teachers and a 1st

grader coming home, you have not talked about the birds and the bees, let alone the birds and the birds and you are waiting to see and yet they are so young, so that's the concern for some of these parents and in new jersey it is coming to a head. and governor phil murphy is feeling the pressure again not just from republicans who have a point of view about schooling, but from democrats who think that progressivism has gone too far and hearing that throughout the country, you are seeing polls indicate there could be a big shift come november. >> john: this is a conversation that has come up in, you know, my daily life talking with a lot of parents of some of the other kids that our kids go to school with, and a question of whether kids in 1st grade even understand the concepts of gender identity, gender fluidity and stereotypes. it's an issue of parental control. parents are being told by the

state what their children will be taught and they say parents you don't have a say in this. >> and we saw that in real form in the commonwealth of virginia and governor glenn youngkin and his win, largely, dealing with the economy and other issues but education did play high in that race and i think the potential it's going to play other places. let's be clear, it's not about denigrating lgbtq, or not a safe space for the parents of the kids, but it's about teaching gender identity and teaching actual school classes or curriculum that deals with that. these parents who are speaking out of all ideologies are saying listen, just writing, reading, arithmetic, what i would like to start with. >> john: and after two years of covid lockdowns, maybe attention

paid to those. critics are concerned the discussions at this early age may push children in a direction they are either not ready for or may not be heading in at all. an interesting op-ed in the "washington post" written, as a boy she had gender reassignment surgery at the age of 19 to become a woman. now says she would have waited to make the transition, she writes i shutter to think of how distorting today's social media is for confused teenagers. i'm also alarmed by how readily authority figures facilitate transition. i had to persuade two therapists, and surgeon, and none would be under pressure as they now would be to affirm my choice. the pressure in society is leaning toward well, if you feel like you are not the gender that you were assigned at birth, like to say the way that you were born, either born with xx

chromosome or xy, you know, you are not part of society if you are not helping to push people in these directions. >> i'm not a child psychologist or biologist, but i am somebody who looks at political wins, and i can see this -- this is a tornado. and if democrats think that this kind of progressivism in schools is somehow going to get their base fired up, i think they are probably mistaken. and i just think practically from a political point of view, not from the scientific side, i think it's just what parents want to have a say in everything, especially that young. >> john: we are both parents, and you know, what our kids are being taught and how they grow up is the most important thing to us, and i think it's going to be a big issue november 8th, no question about it. bret, thank you. see you tonight, 6:00. >> gillian: now to a follow-up

on a story we first brought you on friday. black lives matter is defending the purchase of a decked out $5.8 million mansion in southern california. they bought it using donor funds. >> john: the organization now promising more transparency and accountability going forward without any specifics in blasting the very report that brought the secret deal to light. we will be joined in a moment, but begin with william in los angeles to lay it out for us. >> blm calls the media reports inflammatory and speculative but not says that they are wrong. seven bedroom, 7,000 square foot l.a. mansion for 5.8 million, purchased just three days prior for 3 million by an associate of blm founder who then gifted the property to a tax exempt delaware corporation that hid the identity of who really

bought the mansion. >> they are getting $20 to the entity think it's going to help benefit them and people in the community and instead it's going to buy mansions. >> talking about the donors, of course. the purchase renewed calls from critics for an i.r.s. investigation, especially since the group failed to file the i.r.s. form 990 that spells out how it spent $90 million it raised in 2020. blm has been silent about that cash, even as chapters around the country began leaving blm and several states have suspended their fundraising because of a lack of accountability. yesterday on twitter blm said this, despite past efforts blm global network foundation recognizes there is more work to do to increase transparency and ensure transitions in leadership that are clear. we know narratives like this can cause harm to organizers doing brilliant work across the

country and these reports do not reflect the totality of the moment. we apologize the distress it has caused to our supporters and those who work in service of black liberation daily. john, blm says it will use the house, still zoned residential, as a place for creative influencers. back to you. >> john: all right, there you go. william, thank you. >> sandra: author of "nation of victims." so, lay out for us in sort of layman's terms what blm means when they say they bought this $5.8 million residential house to use for influencers. what does that mean? >> yeah, in layman's terms, or legal terms, called a self-dealing transaction. in my last book, the cover of the book had a blm fist on it with a wad of cash in the hand. that's what it stands for. let me explain how the game works, i call it a woke

industrial complex. corporations actually many of them take millions of dollars of their shareholders money and workers money and donate it to organizations like black lives matter to deflect attention from their own sins. black lives matter with uses it in a self-dealing transaction who enriches somebody affiliated with black lives matter to buy a multi-million dollar mansion and any one who criticizes that risks being labelled a racist. and important part of the story, facebook was blocking stories from being shared about this actual very incident. and so this is the ultimate form of racial blackmail that deflects scrutiny from something defrauding not only donors but up the chain, up to the shareholders of the corporations whose money was subsidizing black lives matter the last couple years. and whether you are on the right or the left, it's a game pretending to be social justice.

>> john: you mentioned the charges of racism and sexism leveled against the author of this piece, the co-founder of blm. the person who wrote this for "new york magazine," sean campbell, african american, associate professor at the columbia school of journalism. i was a believer in the black lives matter movement and said it was the hardest piece he's ever written, discovered the organization was something different than he thought it was. >> i empathize with him, good journalism, but hard to see it sacrificed for the gain of the people who leave it. and whether it's the managerial class that runs corporate america or non-profit institutions or movements like blm, they portray the purposes they stand for. if you care about black lives, you would be talking about donating money to improve education, and culture, the blm movement does not like to talk

about. instead, they call for the defamation of the nuclear family structure and purchasing a multi-million dollars structure to house many families in it. only enriching and benefitting the people who are a part of that self-dealing transaction. so, i'm really empathetic to the person who wrote the story, it was good work, and sorry he went through what he did. >> gillian: your critics say you are losing sight of the forest for the trees here. they say blm has done incredibly important work over the last couple of years, who cares if they buy a house that you don't think is necessarily appropriate for the organization. look at what they have done to elevate the voices of america's minorities. what do you say? >> i thing blm is divisive, racialized the way people relate to one another, the support for a lot of the allegedly peaceful

protests that roiled the country has created greater racial mistrust, and further away from the dream that martin luther king had. even if you were on the side of what the black lives matter movement did, financial issue is a separate issue. >> john: and why it was purchased for $3.1.06 days later bought by blm for 5.8, and where did the money in between go. find out one day. always good to talk to you. >> thank you. >> john: fox news alert, new information coming in on the attack on the new york city subway system. police might have a clue that might explain what brought the gunfire to an end. >> the new york post is reporting that the gun that was used by this suspect jammed in the middle of the mayhem. it did have extended magazines for ammo, but because it jammed,

it perhaps helped save some lives. at least 28 people are injured, 12 people with gunshots. five in critical condition, but no one is expected to die, non-life-threatening injuries. we know from a police source i can report the nypd and the authorities are looking for a u-haul van with arizona plates in connection with this suspect who is on the loose. it is a regular u-haul type van with arizona plates. the manhunt is continuing but that's what police officers are currently looking for. the man, 5'5", black man, heavy build, 180 pounds, was wearing his green construction vest and a gray hoodie when he found his way outside the underground subway system and somehow disappeared from police officers and from the federal -- from the fbi who are currently looking

for him. we also know that there was a bag that was found with some items. i can confirm that there were at least fireworks inside of that bag, but i know other outlets were reporting other things were perhaps found as well. so that is what we have thus far in terms of the updates, john and gillian. >> john: bryan, come back to this van. what's the u-haul van about again? >> there is a u-haul van the nypd, a bolo was sent out to be on the lookout for a u-haul van with arizona plates in connection. >> john: does that suggest the gunman ran out of the subway system, jumped into this van and that's how he got away? >> it could suggest that this was a van that was used by this gunman in some capacity. but the police officers are looking for this particular van, maybe he got back in the van or maybe he used the van at some point in this process, but they

have sent out an alert to look out for this van. >> john: interesting. if the van was waiting for him at the s subway station that would seem to suggest a pretty significant amount of premeditation and preplanning. >> right, exactly. and so you know, all i know is that it's connected to the shooter and if it was used by him and that does suggest preplanning for sure. and you know, whether or not, how far this person drove with this van or as he drove at all, we don't know. but they are looking for it right now. >> gillian: bryan, we have been talking to our law enforcement experts all afternoon about this, and they seem to assess that while it is possible for a lone suspect to go on a rampage, a shooting rampage like this, and also do dry runs, as john has been reporting is a potential, also possible that they set up in advance the

undetonated devices. it would be an uphill battle for one person to do this on their own. are you hearing anything from your sources about the possibility of other people being involved specifically? >> no, i actually have not, because obviously we put all the pieces together that we have thus far and just like you, gillian, i thought the same thing. now that we are getting information about this van, the first thing you sort of think about is whether or not there was, was it a get-away vehicle, another person involved, that information i do not know. but i guess the fact is that we do know that at the very least we are looking for one person who was involved in this, have never heard anything, especially in the press conference there was any kind of lookout for other people. we also do know that the mayor just spoke on local radio and he talked about the fact that we don't have the surveillance video in that station. he says that he could confirm

that the cameras were not working, at least in that station. they are trying to figure out, though, whether or not it was the entire station that had a complete camera blackout, and it's important to also note that is not operated by the nypd. those cameras are the responsibility of the mta, which operates the subway system here, so as soon as we get more clarity -- is it possible at least one of the cameras is working, but it's not. pretty unbelievable that the entire system was not. >> john: let me come back to this high capacity magazine you were talking about. have you heard anything about the caliber of the weapon? we had rafael mangual on earlier and one of his sources told him that the gun was a .380 caliber and high capacity magazines for .380 run 15, 17 bullets, not the 50 or 100 round magazine that mcneil had when he shot two

police officers dead in new york city some weeks ago. so the size of the magazine would be somewhat dependent on the caliber of the weapon. do we know the caliber of the weapon for sure yet, bryan? >> i do not personally know. "new work post" said it was a glock, and also heard it was a .9 millimeter. >> john: if it was a glock, it could have a high capacity magazine. bryan llenas with the latest. we look forward to your next report coming up with martha. wow, and when you look at what's gone on in the new york city subway system since covid hit, you can understand why people are averse to reading the subway. the homeless situation, people pushed in front of stations, and a stabbing. stabbing not long ago, looked like it was a fight more than

anything and then this. this is the worst shooting incident on any kind of new york mass transit that i can recall since 1993 when six people were killed on the long island railroad. >> gillian: not a lot of folks want to risk their lives and health to make it into the office in the morning for work. >> john: thanks for joining us today. i'm john roberts. >> gillian: i'm gillian turner. and take out up to $60,000 or more. give them a call. veteran homeowners, newday wants to help you use your va home loan benefit to get more. more cash, more savings, more peace of mind. the newday 100 va loan lets you borrow up to 100% of your home's value. up to $60,000 or more. veterans are saving an average of $615 every month. with more ways to help more veteran families, no bank, no lender, no one knows veterans like newday usa.

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digital tools so impressive, you just can't stop. what would you like the power to do? >> martha: breaking right now, three big stories that reveal the tumultuous times that we're all living in right now. an active man hunt underway for a mass shooter on the loose in the biggest city in the country. a city of over eight million people that has arteries and bridges and tunnels that go to other parts of new york, new jersey, connecticut. so where is this person? sirens blaring all day in new york city. a 5'5" black male wearing a gray sweatshirt and a construction vest before he strikes