tv Outnumbered FOX News April 20, 2022 9:00am-10:00am PDT
all of that word to submit coming back and cross-examination. then with cameras in the courtroom you can see amber hurd's reaction. the entire time we've hurt showed you in a split screen. when she takes the stand what will her demeanor be like? we are covering it all. a lot of news being made, we are bringing you that at the same time. more of it with my partner, kayleigh mcenany, on "outnumbered" as i go to west coast on specialist time. >> think you come to harris. fox news alert. i'm kayleigh mcenany along with carley shimkus, shannon bream, and joe concha for the last few hours you've been watching the deformation trial, $50 million defamation trial between johnny depp and amber heard.
disturbing details. we petticoat in them and out because of some of the graphic images and languages. we'll bring that to you as we dip into the courtroom. for now, carley shimkus, i was struck by johnny depp. i'll quote him exactly. we got into arguments, never did i myself reach the point of striking miss heard in any way, nor have i struck any woman in my life. daily mail has obtained audio recordings that in which amber telmex never did i reach the point of stricking miss as she says basically i never punched him, but i did hit him. i am paraphrasing here. always to be said commit the he said, she said. we know this is a very toxic relationship. >> clearly baggage on both sides. just to back it up a little bit, the reason this is taking place is because, like you said,
amber heard wrote an article in "the washington post" think she was a victim of domestic abuse. she did not name johnny depp by name, but given the fact that they divorced in such a public setting and there were pictures of her with bruises on her face was clear clear she was referring to him. he's not saying the reason he decided to sue for defamation is not only because of him but because he has children. he wants to clear his name for his family. the money sound bite yesterday was when he said i never struck anybody, and a woman despite the fact that he did have obvious sub students abuse issues. we are finding out that she was also as well and she was emotionally and physically abusive to him. something i thought was really interesting came from a marriage counselor that they were speaking to. and she said that they engaged in mutual abuse.
they had terrible communication skills. she also testified that miss heard had a jack hammer style of speaking. she was very amped up. he had trouble talking at a similar pace. she loved him, he loved her. there are a lot of questions regarding who is more wrong in the situation. it does boil down to that, definitely falters on both sides. but clearly there was at one time passionate love there. and it has completely crumbled. >> that's a great summation. i wonder how it's possible to unwind all this. it seems like wrong on both sides. in fact if you do does go we heard from one of johnny depp's longtime friends who testified to text messages he received from johnny depp. they are graphic, one of them said that johnny depp hoped heard would be a rotting course decomposing in the trunk of a
honda civic. it doesn't mean abuse followed physically but those words indicate that something really bad on the part of johnny depp. >> very damaged relationship for sure. whoever coached him for today -- and these are actors we have to remind ourselves, has done a great job in having him appear to be very calm. his demeanor has been -- even his voice has been sort of very steady and low. he talked about what she -- they got back from this one trip when she said she was going to move into a hotel appear the questions were about who paid for it. he talked about what i did. i would never let her pay for this. he definitely is coming across is this guy who was trying to work things out with her, he's been very open about just how bad his own opioid addiction was. so it's painting him, he's doing a very good job of looking sympathetic and empathetic about her troubles as well. what's going to change this if
her cross-examination this afternoon, that's going to be a whole different vibe. can he hold it together once that starts? it's because that's the million-dollar question. joe, when you consider also the marriage counselor, carly referenced that testimony, the marriage counselor emphasized that sometimes heard would strike johnny depp in order to keep him in a situation. perhaps there were sometimes johnny depp initiated situations but it was more often heard that it was depp. now we'll hear from the defense, could be a totally different story. joe concha, quickly, before we take a break. >> i just wonder now if johnny depp regrets actually going ahead with this lawsuit. you see now everything that is coming out. even if he wins -- does he get his career back? of the "pirates of the caribbean" people going to see you one, come on back? everybody looks bad. >> both parties are badly damaged. we are taking you back live.
>> 20, 25 people may be. >> was there any alcohol served at the wedding? >> yes, there was alcohol served at the wedding. there was champagne. >> was anybody adjusting illegal drugs at the wedding? >> yes. >> who was doing that? >> well there was a schedule written out and sent out so that everybody would know exactly the time that everything would happen. on that sheet, the schedule,
there was some kind of rehearsal type thing. there was also, there was a great dilemma and who was going to be -- that's where the argument between ms. pennington -- >> mr. depp, who did you observe taking drugs at the wedding? >> a number of people were taking mdma. the list, after the wedding there was this like dinner, dancing, and drugs on the schedule that came from miss
was -- i don't know how much mdma they had, but for me that was -- for me to have taken mdma would've been a waste of the drug if you understand what i mean. you'd be taking someone else's high because it wouldn't have an effect on me. >> so how many drugs did you actually take that day? >> the day of our wedding? >> yes. >> i smoked marijuana, i don't
that was fine for me. dipping into a little tiny baggie, licking your finger and dipping into a tiny communal bag of mdma, it was pointless for me. >> when you and ms. heard got married did you have a prenuptial agreement in place? >> no we did not. >> why not? >> there was -- there always seem to be some reason or another why she wouldn't either wouldn't discuss it or if we did it became an issue that would turn into -- it would
springboard into unpleasantness and argument. then it was also too late. at a certain point it was too late. then the idea of a postnuptial agreement was brought up to ms. heard and that was in australia. that was the beginning of the australia fight. >> let's talk about australia them. first of all why were you in australia? >> i was working on pirates of the caribbean five. >> who from your team was with you in australia? >> jerry judge, malcolm connolly, nathan holmes, stephen tutors, keenan why it.
i believe that was it. yeah, that's it. >> was miss lloyd in australia as well? >> yes, ms. floyd as well. >> did dr. cabrera come down at some point? >> yes, dr. cooper came down a little bit later. >> mr. wyatt testified yesterday that he observed you having a meeting with sean bailey in australia. do you remember that? >> yes. >> could you please tell the jury who sean bailey is? >> sean bailey -- at that time was -- i believe he was the number three man at disney in terms of hierarchy. he was upper echelon disney.
he was under bob iger. initially under cook, who was removed from disney for some reason. so yes he was the number three man at disney. >> why were you having a discussion with mr. bailey? >> the discussions i was having with mr. bailey, sean bailey, were -- they had to do with -- as i think we've established, i have always -- from the beginning of those series of films -- i had always rewritten my characters words and jokes if you will, and situational comedy
and things that i would add. mr. bailey was very complimentary about some of the things i had done. he came over to me laughing after a take. >> this is just discussed and what they were talking about. >> mr. deppe, was miss heard in australia with you? >> she came later, yes. >> do you recall when she came down? >> i do not recall, no. no, i do recall. it was march. it was march. >> and what happened when miss heard came to visit you in australia?
>> miss heard was upset because, as i stated earlier, as it was too late for a prenup agreement there was a discussion of a postnuptial agreement. i had called my lawyer at the time and asked if i could have one of his lawyers and sit down with miss heard and give her a basic rundown. >> this is something he asked an attorney it's not a statement of fact being offered for its truth. >> also abstained the objection.
>> what did ms. heard say she was upset about when she arrived in australia? >> miss heard told me that the attorney she met with was rude and dismissive. all she was being shown was i example of postnuptial agreement. ms. heard stated to me that she was very upset. she stated to me that what she had said was that she said to
the lawyer, the woman, that this johnny cat, he doesn't know about this. he's never seen, he doesn't own this is what this is. no way that he would agree to this. and what ms. heard expressed to me was that the lawyer, the woman that had laughed at her, said he knows. yes he knows everything. it sent her into a tailspin. so by the time she arrived in australia, that was sunk very deep into her psyche. so much so that would really surprised me was that she kept
saying i'm not even in your will. i'm not even in your well. the thought that was an odd thing to say. especially since i don't think anybody at that time had had time to change wins or anything of that nature. so those things just -- it felt wrong. she could not let go of the fact that i was in on this postnuptial agreement, and that i was trying to trick her into essentially getting nothing if something were to happen. >> and how did you respond to miss heard? >> i just told her those were not my intentions.
at a certain point you don't know what to do. a person is telling you -- she's telling you you don't trust me, you don't trust me, you don't trust me. i can't speak about legal documents come i can't speak legalese. all i can do is try to calm her down and say i was not out to screw her over or put her in a position that was uncomfortable. it did not work. it escalated and escalated and turned into madness, chaos. violence. >> can you please describe that chaos and violence?
she was banging on doors and screaming obscenities and wanting to have a physical altercation. >> how did it come to be that your finger became injured? >> there was one point when i stayed in one of the -- sitting in the bathroom floor, she's banging away screaming. then suddenly she stopped and i could hear her walk away. i could hear her receding into the distance. yes, it became very emotional. there was nothing i could do to
make her understand. if that lawyer had in fact on that, and i did call my lawyer at the time, jake bloom, and i had them get these people on the phone. i am ashamed to say that i had taken that show the point when i was on the phone with them i had taken miss heard's words to heart. i laid out a ration of cash i was very upset that she was pushed to that limit. i had believed it. in fact none of it had happened.
it was all getting too crazy. again, i had been sober for many, many months. from alcohol and substances, aside from marijuana. i got -- i left the place, the room i was hiding in -- not hiding, had locked myself into, i went downstairs in the house. as soon as you walk in the house you can go upstairs or downstairs. downstairs there was sort of a rec area, a pool terrible and stuff. and there was a bar. i was a mess, i was a wreck.
i was shaking. i just did not understand why all of this was happening. so i went behind the bar, i grabbed a bottle of vodka that was there, and a shot glass, and i sat at the bar. she was nowhere around. i poured myself two or three stiff shots of vodka. the first taste of alcohol i had had in a long time. then she came down to the bar and found me there. of course she started screaming oh, you are drinking again. monster and all that. so she reached -- she walked up to me and reached and grabbed the bottle of vodka, and then
just stood back and hurled it at me. so i stood up, and i walked behind the bar. there was a larger bottle of vodka the kind with a handle. i grab that, i went and i sat in my seat again. i open the bottle, and i poured myself a shot, drank it. miss heard was flinging insults left, right, and center. she then grabbed that bottle and
through that at me. the way that the bar was situated, and where miss heard was -- so if i could show you -- if this is the bar. she would grab the bottle and go there. she went there. i was leaning like this in the chair, looking at her. the first bottle went, got the other bottle. takes a second bottle, which is the larger one. i'm in this position again.
my hand was on the edge of the sheet through the large bottle, and made contact and shattered everywhere. i honestly didn't feel the pain at first at all. i felt no pain whatsoever. what i felt was heat. i felt heat and i felt as if something were dripping down my hand. i looked down and realized that the tip of my finger had been
severed. i was looking directly at my bones sticking out. the media portion of the inside of your finger. it was -- blood was just pouring out. at that point i think that i went into some sort of -- i don't know what a nervous breakdown feels like, but that's probably the closest i've ever been. nothing made sense. i knew in my mind and in my
heart, this is not life. this is not life. nobody should have to go through this. as i said, this feeling of being in the middle of some sort of nervous breakdown i started to write in my own blood on the walls little reminders from our past that essentially represented lies that she had told me, and lies that i had caught her in. and then the next thing --
amongst all the madness i would hide in the bathroom or wherever, and i texted dr. kipper and i said you might want to come over. i cut my finger off here. >> which finger was cut, mr. depp? >> it's the middle -- the funny looking one. the middle finger here, you can see -- from the initial wound, all of these poems appear were crushed. so this -- this part of my fingernail, because of not
having use of the tip here, this is basically arthritis that kicks into the joint once that upper part of the finger is mangled. >> is that the right middle finger? >> yes. >> is that your dominant hand? >> yes, it is. >> mr. depp, after ms. heard through the bottle at you and severed your finger, what if anything did she say when she saw the injury? >> i don't recall anything but it was almost like white noise, just yelling, just a high-pitched constant attack of
insults. it was jumbled words to me in a very high frequency. i was in a bitter shock. i was in shock. >> you mentioned you reached out to dr. kipper. was -- did you receive medical attention after? >> yes. jerry judge, malcolm connolly, i believe debbie lloyd was there. educating had arrived as well? >> who was ben king. >> he sort of an estate manager. we worked together in london a few times and he's a wonderful
guy so i brought ben along to australia to manage everything. he's very, very good. then there was also -- i mentioned malcolm and jerrica mia, they were there as well. >> which, if any of the medical professionals did you tell what happened to your finger? >> i -- one malcolm and dr. kipper -- when they took -- first we went to malcolm apartment where he was staying while we were shooting the film, and tried to clean my hand,
because i had worked the day before. and obviously when you are playing a pirate, captain jack, your cover -- they paint on with rubbing alcohol, they paint dirt into your hands and into your face and everything. they were worried about getting my finger clean. they tried doing that at malcolm's and kipper said no we have to get to an emergency room and we have to get a hold of the tip of his finger. we went to the emergency room. the doctor asked me what happened. i lied to them. i said that i had smashed it in
these large accordion doors. >> why did you lie about that? >> i didn't want to disclose that it was i don't want to disclose that i -- i didn't want to disclose that it had been miss heard who had thrown of avodka bottle at me and then tok my finger off. i didn't want to get her in trouble. i tried to keep things as copacetic and easy as possible for everyone.
i didn't want to put her name into that mix. >> did you tell dr. kipper what had happened to your finger? >> yes. >> after you return from the hospital where did you go? >> i went to malcolm connolly's apartment and slept on his couch. >> went to the extent that you know, where was ms. heard at this time? >> miss heard was -- i was not there but i had -- it was clear that she had to -- she needed to leave. i asked her to get on a flight from melbourne or sydney or whatever. back to los angeles.
mr. depp, what is this a picture of? >> that is me in the emergency room. i see a detail that i had forgotten. it is d -- miss heard had taken my cigarette from the ashtray and stomped it out in my face, here. >> can you mark on the screen where you see that? >> thread about that green dodge. >> do you know who took the picture? can we please publish this to
the jury? >> all right. 145 in evidence. >> end, mr. depp, now that the jury can see the photograph can you again explain what the green dot is identifying? >> just above the -- just above the green dot is a the wound. miss heard taking my cigarette and, this is after the finger done away, she stopped it out in my face, on my cheek.
so that's the result of that. >> if we could please take this town, i like to show you, mr. depp, plaintiff exhibit 154. >> yeah, that is -- >> what is this a picture of? >> the remains of my finger. >> was this taken shortly after you were injured? >> i believe this was taken at the emergency room i would imagine. >> would move this new evidence but i'd also like to warm the jury and the people in the audience that this is a very
graphic picture. >> any objections? >> all right, 144. we can take this town, thank you. mr. depp, how long after your finger was injured to you return to l.a.? >> after the emergency room the following day i was sent to -- they found a surgeon in australia, so that i could go -- they wanted me to take x-rays and all that. so we went to that doctor, the
finger surgeon, and he asked me what happened to my finger. again i lied and i stuck to the story that it was smashed in the large accordion door. he looked at me as if i were lying. the next thing i heard was circum- that is a wound of velocity. >> objection, hearsay. >> runner this is communication in the context of medical
relation. >> sustain the objection. move along. >> why did you return to los angeles after seeing that surgeon? >> i believe it was probably the next day. it might have been kipper, or somebody who hooked me up with a wonderful, a great expert in reconstruction. of hands, fingers, digits, whatever. so i went to see the surgeon, we prepped for surgery pretty quickly. >> and what type of surgery did you have on your finger?
>> the majority of this was all missing. essentially hollowed out, if you will, because the bone had shattered, and there was the bone that was sticking out down there. so we had to take -- do a skin graph from this part of his hand. and graft it onto my finger to give me a finger again. >> anything else that was done to your finger to stabilize it? >> i don't think they initially
they did give me shots. >> how long did you wear the bandage? it was all the way through surgery and finishing parts of the caribbean. the injury took place in march. finished "pirates of the caribbean" five at the beginning of august, july. so there was a bandage on it the whole time. what i had to do was wear -- because of -- there is a special-effects trick that they had planned basically whatever bandage i had on, as long as
they -- they would put little green dots on the splint in the finger and all that, and the bandages so that in postproduction they could use what's called computer-generated imagery, cgi, to erase the bandage and but i -- replace it with the normal finger. that's how we finished the film. >> if we could please pull a plaintiff exhibit 61. if we could scroll to the second
picture. third -- can you keep going one more please? another. sorry, this is a series of pictures. to spare everyone i don't think i will show you the immediate injury again. it's this one right here, thank you. mr. depp, do you recognize this picture? >> yes i do. >> what is reflected in this picture? >> this was taken in the office. i would go and -- i had to go in every couple of -- every few days to have it checked out for infections and stuff. and this -- the finger was
wrapped quite heavily. there was kind of agree seem, medicated thing on top of the wound itself. this, i believe, seems like when the pen was an here. add the wrapping is the bandages -- well i had my choice. i thought, well, might as well take the kid bandages. dinosaurs and hearts and unicorns. at least have some humor to deflect the pain. >> your honor i would like to move plaintiff exhibit 61 into evidence. >> do you want the whole exhibit are just the picture? >> the whole exhibit.
>> any objections, 61? >> no, your honor. >> all right. >> so how long after your injury was this picture taken? >> after the initial injury? i would say no more than test it would seem to me no mor than five days to a week. >> how long was this bandage on your hand for? >> i was wearing bandages all the way up until i finish the film, then -- you come up through august for sure. and beyond. i had to keep it covered. i had to keep it protected.
>> do you recall how long after the injury -- excuse me, how long after the surgery of the pins were removed from your finger? >> i would have to say maybe -- i think it was about two or three days, because i remember there was maybe more i just remember the pain seem to be getting worse and worse as w would rate it, this is an of ten, this is a 3 out of 10? that kind of thing. at a certain point it became kind of a 12 out of town because it felt hot, very, very hot.
there was throbbing, it was throbbing, and the pin in their -- it was like i could feel the pin. we called the surgeon. i called the surgeon and told him. i think it might've been devin lloyd -- i knew i had to see the surgeon again, something felt very wrong. i went there and she removed all the bandages, he found that my finger was indeed infected and that i had contracted mursa, which is a flesh-eating disease. it was a pretty grotesque site.
with the pin in and so what they had to do was say that. >> mr. depp, did you ever taken the opiates during that time? >> no, no more. >> your honor, i'm about to switch gears so it makes sense to take our lunch break. >> we can take our lunch break and come back at 2:00. do not discuss the case and do not do any outside research. we will see you what to. >> so we are just coming back from the trial of johnny depp, amber heard and a countersuit on the part of amber heard. coming to you, joe, there is a really emotional moment work johnny depp's prosecution team put up an image of him lying in
a hospital bed, suggesting that amber heard had touched a cigarette butt to his body that had burned them and put them in the hospital along with another injury. really eye-opening picture there. we'll wait to hear what the defense says in response. >> burned it on his face. this is graphic, ugly stuff. i go back to what we talked about in the beginning. i think charles going to elaborate on it. it reminds me of the roger clemens trial, when he swore he never took steroids. he went to a trial and he was able to prove that he did not. he never got his career back at him he never got into the hall of fame. i wonder what happens here with johnny depp. even if he somehow wins this trial, was this really worth it? if i'm a movie studio i'm not touching the sky with a 10-foot pole at this point. >> to this point it's hard to see a situation, where johnny depp gets the $50 million he's asking for. that's a lot of wrongdoing alleged by both parties.
on his career he said this, it's been six months of drying time for me. it's strange when one day you are a cinderella and then a .6 seconds you are quasimodo. i don't know if he's getting his career back but it -- >> i think there is a big motivation to get the career back on track and i think that's why we are witnessing this event in this courtroom today. he had a $650 million career over decades, all of those earnings, he has people hanging on, he's got agents and managers, he's been talking about that today in the last hour. trying to rehabilitate enough to get a month set. movie studios will not insure him because he has become a huge liability, putting hundreds of jobs at risk when he was out doing drugs and is been very open about that. but yes, there is a 2020 court case in london. he failed. he's trying it again now. but why is he doing this now? why is he dredging this up again? he knows his career is over if
he does not rehabilitate his image. this is how is trying to do that. this may sound insensitive, remember he is an actor. when you're watching all of this play out live on your television remember who this is. this is johnny depp, a very talented actor. >> they are both factors, which means they are both public figures, which means that a defamation trial they have to prove actual malice and that amber heard when she wrote this "washington post" op-ed she acted with reckless disregard for the truth. you have to prove she intentionally slandered or defamed johnny depp. >> again, think it goes exactly to cheryl's excellent point, and that i do think this isn't about the $50 million. he knows he's not going to get $50 million from her. is it enough but he gets his name cleared and after the point that he has employable peer that would be the victor in this whole thing but again, i think it's going to be interesting this afternoon when her team gets a chance to cross-examine him. does he keep it together? does he -- does he continue to
portray how he was worried about her and felt sympathy and empathy towards what she was going through, you've got to think about the objects of this, the way he's dressed is sort of like hollywood hustler. crook. i do not. his gut earrings. she has shown up every day like she is straight out of talbots. she is hardly any makeup on, very conservatively dressed. all of that factor in. >> remarkably emotion lead, he watched amber heard's face as she's hearing this, that is exactly what struck me. you are watching johnny depp speak but everybody is also looking at amber heard. i think i would be compelled to show some sort of emotion like knock my head or shake it, no that's not what happens. she's been very well-coached on remaining completely emotionless. he's doing a very good job of saying listen, i'm no angel, but neither is she. so even if he doesn't win in
terms of the jury trial, it may be enough for him to just air out all of the dirty laundry and paint her in a negative light, like sort of drag him down with her, which is so unfortunate that -- it's a very ugly situation. >> it is probably going to go on another six weeks or longer. >> visages the prosecution questioning. there will be questions from the defense. we are bound to hear a much different version of events. thanks to everyone, now >> sandra: begin now, "america reports," with the defamation trial that has hollywood and the nation buzzing. johnny depp taking the witness stand a second straight day to testify against his ex-wife. sordid details of depp's marriage to amber heard, he says was plagued by drugs and violence. he wants her to pay him 50