tv FOX News Sunday With Chris Wallace FOX News April 1, 2012 2:00pm-3:00pm EDT
>> chris: i'm chris wallace. with republican leaders uniting behind mitt romney rick santorum fights for his political life. we'll talk with the candidate about his chances in tuesday's important primaries. and growing pressure on him to drop out. presidential candidate rick santorum live only on "fox news sunday." then, a preview of what an obama/romney campaign might sound like. two party leaders debate the key issues in the general election from healthcare to rising gas prices. former republican chair and governor haley barbour and former republican chair and governor howard dean. plus, the trayvon martin case. we will have the sunday panel if there has been a rush to judgment. and our power player of the week, saving lives in and out of the operating room.
all right now on "fox news sunday." and hello again from fox news in washington. well, after a week off republican voters return to the polls tuesday for three more primaries. joining us now from brookfield, wisconsin, is the candidate who needs to persuade voters and gop leaders this race is not over yet, senator rick santorum. welcome back to "fox news sunday." >> well, thank you, chris. good to be with you this morning. >> chris: this week i don't have to tell you two of the conservative young guns in the party, paul ryan and marco rubio endorsed mitt romney and suggested that you and the others should get out of the race. take a look at what they had to say. >> i think it is important that we just coalesce as conservatives and focus on defeating the president in the fall. >> they are saying the only way to win the race is by having a floor fight in tampa in august and i think that is a recipe to deliver four more years to
barack obama. >> chris: , senator, do you feel added pressure to get out of the race and give mitt romney a clear shot at barack obama? >> no. you know, you you should have told kansas last night when they were down 20 points in the first half you know what it is almost over and you guys should just pack it in. this race isn't even at halftime yet. we haven't even selected half the delegates yet. governor romney isn't even halfway to the magic number and we look at the calendar ahead and feel very good about where we are going and we he four years ago everyone said we got to wrap this thing up and we did and john mccain was the nominee and barack obama and hillary clinton went into the summer and pounded it out and guess what they came up with the best candidate. we came up with someone who well, just simply wasn't able to win. we don't need to repeat that again. we don't need to bail out and not have the best candidate to take barack obama on the fall and when you look at the huge
advantages this man has been running for are president for six years. he has all of the establishment behind him. he has a 10 to 1 money advantage. he has the media singing every question i get is when are you getting out. i mean the whole narrative has been in romney's favor from the beginning of the race and he still isn't even close to closing the deal. that should send a signal to the people inside the bubble the senators and congressmen and party leaders inside the washington bubble maybe something is going on across the country when over 60% of the people even hearing all of this still think rick santorum should stay in the race, we need a conservative to be a contrast with barack obama, not the same old tired establishment person that is going to be shoved down our throat. >> chris: let me look at this another way. you talked about four years ago. i want to talk about it on the republican side. mike huckabee decided to stay in the race until john mccain had it wrapped up, had half the
delegates enough to clinch the nomination but huckabee campaigned for himself not against mccain. you on the other hand are still out there pounding romney. do you worry at all and i certainly underand it that the points you make. he hasn't wrapped up the nomination. romney hasn't. but do you worry at all about hurting him in case he ends up being the candidate who faces barack obama? >> well, let me assure you that barack obama is going to pound governor romney or whoever the republican nominee a lot more than i am. i focused on the issues. i haven't been criticizing governor romney personally or any other way. i focused on who is the best person to make the case in the general election and win and then the mandate to govern. that is my focus. >> chris: you are talking about him as an etch-a-sketch candidate and not being a real conservative. you are certainly criticizing his credentials. >> well, i would just say this that i am criticizing his policies and the policies that would best juxtapose against
barack obama as opposed to let's just be honest here about who is running the negative campaign. governor romney has spent tens of millions of dollars running negative ads about issues, taking things i said completely out of context. trying to convince the voters of wisconsin believe this one, chris, that i'm not prolife. these are the kinds of ridiculous campaign tactics the romney campaign has taken on. we are focused on the big issues, energy, healthcare. we are talking about national security. i just gave a speech out at jelly belly jellybean factory talking about national security and the regan legacy and who is best prepared to do it. we run a substantive campaign. governor romney has run negative, negative. negative. he hasn't painted a positive vision for the country or been able to close the deal with conservatives much less anybody else in the party and that is not an effective tool for us to win this general election.
>> chris: let's talk about an issue and i think you would agree the big issue in wisconsin right now is not the presidential race it is the recall campaign against scott walker the governor because of his effort to remove some collective bargaining rights from state workers. the romney campaign and you can say it is negative but they point out that as a senator you voted against a national right to work law to allow people to get jobs without joining a union. and you repeatedly supported the davis bacon act that requires government contractors to pay the prevailing wage. they say and in fact it is the case on both of those issues you sided with big labor. >> in my 16 year career of representing two of the heaviest labor districts in the country and a state of pennsylvania which is a very heavy labor my voting record with labor was 13%. i did not along with i think almost 70 other senators vote to have a federal change in the
right to work statute because i represented, pennsylvania, which wasn't a right to work state. but governor romney well, knows when i announced i was running for president i said i would sign a national right to work. he seems to ignore that fact. i was running for president, i'm not representing the state any more who had an interest in keeping the laws what it was, that i was representing what i thought was best for the country and that is what i take for that position. the head of the afl-cio in pennsylvania said that calling rick santorum a friend of big labor is like calling mitt romney a conservative, neither are true. they spent literally millions of dollars to beat me he in 2000 and 2006 and even before that i assure you, someone who supports governor walker and what was doing with the public unions. and you will find someone who is very strong in making sure that people have freedom in this country to contract with their employers instead of
having to go through a union. >> chris: i'm not quite sure i understand this. you are saying because you were the senator from pennsylvania and pennsylvania had a right to work law you were not going vote. >> did not have a right to work law. >> chris: you were not going to vote to create a national right to work law. abortions were legal under certain circumstances in pennsylvania but you vote the for a constitutional amendment to end that, right? >> well, of course. i mean there is certain issues that ones that i think could be left to the states to decide and we do that all the time. i believe in the 10th amendment and that states have the right to make the decisions on a variety of issues but not every issue. there are some issues that we need to have national laws in place. that is the constitution clearly laid that out. there are some things that can be left to the state. other things the federal government has a limitation of power on and other things the federal government can do. >> chris: you said at the very beginning all the questions you get about are are you going to
drop out. i hate to fall into that. i guess i am. are you saying no matter happens, win, lose or draw in wisconsin which is a midwestern battleground state you are in it to stay regardless of what happens in wisconsin? >> absolutely. we are moving forwarded. we are setting up our teams for the 26th. if you go past this month of april and we have got these primaries and then five more at the end of the month, the map in may looks very, very good for us. texas and arkansas and west virginia, north carolina, indiana. i mean kentucky. we have got some great states where we are ahead in almost every poll in almost all those states and if you list tonight folks across this country we are hearing over and over again stay in there. we need a conservative. we cannot do what we have done in the past which is republicans which is settle for something that the establishment wants to give us. in the last 120 years we only defeated one democratic
incumbent president as always the establishment says we have to nominate a moderate that is going to win and the one time we didn't with ronald reagan that is when we won and beat jimmy carter and that is what is going to win this election. a clear contrast in vision. someone who has a solid record that can make president obama the issue in the election, not have barack obama turn it back on the candidate because he too supported cap and traded a wall street bailouts. that is why the race is so important. >> chris: you are convincing meow are not about to drop out. i will ask you this because pennsylvania your home state does come up on april 24. the polls closed and we show here that back in february you were leading by 29 points your lead in the franklin marshall poll is now down to two. if you were to lose in your home state would that be it? >> well, first off, the that does that has probably
gotten more polls wrong than i know of anybody in the state. two other polls have us up 20 and the other is 17. this is a pollster just -- i think he just draws numbers out of a hat sometimes. we feel good about pennsylvania. we will do exceptionally well, there. governor romney is already out there spending money, dumping his millions in but we have a great grass roots strong network. we have the strong conservative base in the state of pennsylvania that is going to come out and come out strong for us and look, i go back in pennsylvania, i was the first conservative to really be out on the scene in republican politics. the republican party in pennsylvania was very much a moderate to liberal party for many, many, many years and i was the guy that sort of broke through the sooling. there are folks in the republican party who want that party to going back to being the moderate republican party that it once was and they lined up behind governor romney but the conservatives have and will
line up behind me and i think we will see a good victory in pennsylvania as a result. >> chris: senator, we have about a minute left and i want to ask you two questions. you have convinced meow are not dropping out, number one. and number two, you are in this for awhile. but let's assume for the minute that this doesn't go the way you want and look, you would admit that you have a tough road to win this nomination given the hole you are in. win or lose you have done much better than a lot of the so-called experts had predicted that you were going to do this year. you talk a lot about ronald reagan. he lost in 1976, came back and won in 1980. do you ever think at all about, you know, if you were at some point this doesn't workout you could come back in 2016 as the frontrunner? >> well, let me just say this. you know, in 1976 i think the republican party made a mistake in not choosing ronald reagan and went on with a moderate to lose the election and we suffered four years of jimmy
carter are and we already know, we didn't know what we were getting with carter. we already know what we are getting with obama. we can't make that mistake again. we have to nominate someone who is a strong conservative. all i would say is i'm not thinking about the future. we need to win this election and we need to reelect a republican in 2016. that is my focus is to win 2012, reelect a republican in 2016 and put the country back on the right track. >> chris: finally and i can't end this interview you have shown some mad bowling skills on the campaign trail and you may not be able to see it but we are now putting them up and i can see you rolling and it's a strike, senator. how good a bowler are you? >> well, i'm not all that good. you know, when i was a kid, i mean i grew up actually doing a lot of bowling. actually when i was younger i had my own bowling ball. i love the sport. that is what i grew up in when i used to visit my grand parents in johnstown the
bowling alley was a quarter mile down the road and we used to hang out at the lanes owl the time. i love the sport and the fact that you can sit around and drink beer and hang out with folks and talk to people from all over the place. just a fun afternoon with the family and friends and that is what i like, i like doing it. >> chris: we are running out of time. what is your high score, sir? >> 241. >> chris: remind me not to go bowling with you, senator. >> it was 30 years ago. i started out with 7 straight strikes and i thought i was headed toward a perfect game and got an 8-10 split in the 10th frame. i remember that like it was yesterday. it was red. >> chris: if i had done that i would, too. senator santorum thank you so much for joining us today. we will watch to see what happens tuesday night and it is clear beyond tuesday. >> yes, sir,, thank you very much. >> chris: up next, a preview of the general election campaign.
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>> chris: with president obama and mitt romney setting their sights squarely on each other, we thought this would be a good time to look at how the general election campaign might play out. joining us now are two party leaders from jackson, mississippi, former republican party chair and governor haley barbour and from burlington, vermont, former democratic party chair and governor howard dean. we don't have the lights around bells but keep it short, 30-40 second answers and start with the big issue this week. obama care. if the supreme court strikes down the individual mandate, governor dean as you have predicted that they will, won't republicans be able to say that this is a president so far out
of the mainstream that his signature legislative accomplishment of his term in office turned tout be unconstitutional in the. >> that depends. the mandate is something that is not really necessary, first of all. if the justices strike it down it might actually help the president because people don't like the mandate. if the rest stays intact i think it will ultimately be seen as a victory for the president and i think he will do fine. >> chris: governor barbour, do you think that is a victory for the president and let me ask you about a problem republicans have. there is a lot in obama care that people like. they like the idea that people can't be excluded from coverage because of preexisting conditions or that kids can stay on their parents policies until they are 26. if let's say the whole bill is struck down republicans talk about repeal and replace. what are you going to replace that with? >> well, let me state, first of all, i think it will be interesting if former constitutional law professor president obama's signature law
gets kicked out because it is unconstitutional. but i think there is a very good chance that that will happen. the fact of the matter is that the law is very unpopular. unlike most entitlements, it has continued to stay unpopular after it was enacted. i think that is very revealing. the american people know there is a lot in there that is bad but that doesn't mean everything is bad but look, let me give you a perfect example. you mentioned preexisting illnesses on the fact that that is popular. well, 35 states already had risk pools to allow people who couldn't buy health insurance immediately because of preexisting conditions to buy through a state risk pool. we have more than 3500 people in mississippi. we had that law since the mid '90s. you know how many people are in the federal risk pool set up by this law? 120. that just goes to show you a lot of what was ballyhooed into
the reason to need this federal law was already being done at the state level but the left doesn't care they say if the federal government doesn't make you do it it doesn't count. >> chris: i'm going to -- i'm going to ask you a different question governor dean and you can do what candidates do, either ask you the question i ask you or respond to haley barbour. i want to turn to gas prices which have more than doubled since this president took office and now headed north of $4 a gallon in a lot of the parts of the country. the president has cut back on drilling since the bp oil spill. he has rejected or at least delayed the keystone oil pipeline. fairly or unfairly, isn't he going to have to take a political hit on the price at the pump? >> ile take your suggestion. it is true as governor barbour said that people don't like this law. what is not true is that they actually do like what is in it. that is poll after poll showed if you mention the particular parts of the law people like it but if you talk about the whole
law they don't like it. i think the president is in great shape in healthcare unless they strike down the whole bill. this is the most political supreme court we ever had. 73% of the american people believe that politics motivates the supreme court. i'm one of the 73%. i think what motivates this is politics. >> chris: before we get to gas prices, i just want to give governor barbour a chance to respond. there is thought if this is struck down barack obama will campaign against the political supreme court. >> well, look, the american people are going to favor the supreme court's opinion if the supreme court does in fact strike down the law so it won't surprise me to see president obama complaining about the supreme court but also president obama's policies on healthcare, on energy, are his problem. they are the wrong policies. they are bad for the country. >> chris: let me go back to gas
prices. i interrupted you, governor dean. isn't the president going to take a hit on gas prices? >> i think the president will take a small hit. i think most people understand that the president is not responsible for gas prices. i actually think the oil companies and the republicans will take a hit because of the vote we just had where the vote -- where the republicans sameoted to keep giving the big fat $4 billion a year subsidies to the oil companies. the president is not responsible for gas prices any more than president regan was responsible for gas prices or president bush was responsible for gas prices. the fact is oil production is higher today than it was when george bush left office. so it is true that it was cut back after the bp spill and with good reason and i think people in governor barbour's home state will tell you it was good reason but the fact of the matter is the president is not responsible for gas prices. the american people know it and there is more production today than there was four years ago.
>> chris: governor barbour i want you to respond to governor dean but i also wanted to second or at least to elaborate on what he said which is that the president is going to try to say hey look, the republicans are in bed with big oil and they, of course, had this bill the republicans and some democrats voted against to cut the oil subsidies. here is what the president said on friday in the rose garden. >> members of congress have a simple choice to make. they can stand with the big oil companies or they can stand with the american people. >> chris: so governor barbour, the president's responsibility or lack of same for high gas prices and his effort to turn this into he is looking out for the middle class and republicans want to protect big oil. >> well, look, there is one thing you can always rely on with barack obama. when something is wrong it is always somebody else's fault. so oil prices are high so barack obama says well, it is the oil company's fault, it is
the republican's fault. the fact of the matter is we have more production of oil and gas in the united states today despite obama's policies. no, we in the gulf did not want a moratorium. knew there didn't need to be a moratorium and the president's own expert panel said don't have a moratorium but the politicians in the white house slipped in to their report have a moratorium. every -- almost every single policy of this administration has sent the signal to the world market the americans are not going to produce the abundant affordable american energy that we are blessed with. and that has helped drive up the price of oil and therefore the price of gasoline. >> chris: governor barbour i want to switch because everybody thought going into the last six months that the economy was going to we the big issue in this campaign and a bad issue for the president but the economy keeps getting better. it has reiated more than a million jobs in the last six
months. unemployment down to 8.3% even though a half million people entered the workforce last month. can't the president make the argument look, unemployment is still too high but inherited a mess and things are getting better? >> he is certainly going to make the argument that it isn't his fault but despite the liberal media elite saying how great the economy is the fact in the united states today or last month 58.6% of adults had a job. except for the obama administration you have to go back 30 years to 1983, 29 years, to find a time when that small a percentage of americans were working and 10% of those have a part-time job. so if they want to tell us how great it is, the 42% of americans who are not working probably have a different view. >> chris: governor dean, a couple of facts, there are
still more people unemployed than when this president took office and remember that barack obama said if you pass his stimulus that unemployment won't go up above 8%, a trillion dollars later. it has never gone down below 8%. >> chris, here is the fundamental problems that republicans have and this is due to the occupy wall street people who changed the dialogue. the most people in this country believe now there is a 1% that has a lot and 99% that gets treated not so well. and last poll i saw 70% of people in this country believe that governor romney who i think is going to be the nominee is in favor of the 1%. 30% of people believe that about barack obama. you know as well as i do the most important question in any poll is who do you trust to understand candidates leak me. this president is trying to do everything he can to turn around the economy that he inherited when took office. and he has done a lot of good things and there are jobs being created, a million of them in the last six months. when people look at the economy getting better.
not good jif yet but getting better and they will look at who they trust to do something for them as opposed to the wall street people this is going to be barack obama's election and i predict today he will win, florida, ohio and virginia. there is not any republican candidate who can win if we take florida, ohio and virginia. >> chris: less than two minutes left. give you each less than a minute and wrap it up with kind of a big picture. governor dean assuming that romney is the nominee what is the basic case against mitt romney? >> he has no understanding of what it is like for ordinary people. he is just building a zillion dollar house in california with an elevator for his car in it. he had bank accounts in switzerland, invest in the cayman islands. nothing illegal about any of this. a guy who brags on the stump that his wife has two cadillacs and that it was funny when shut down a factory. this is a decent guy and i think governor romney is a doesn't guy and santorum is right he is a moderate at heart but has no connection to the
ordinary americans of this country. >> chris: all right, governor barbour i will let you wrap tup. the same amount of time. the basic case against barack obama. >> the case against barack obama is his record. here is a man that cannot run for reelection on his record and normally presidential elections are referendum on the president. in this case the policies are not only unpopular, they make it harder to create jobs when the government sucks owl of the money out of the economy. when potential employers are told that the president is going to stick them with the largest tax increase in american history, $1.5 trillion of new taxes how do potential employers say well, gee, i think i will hire some more people even though i'm going to lose all of that money. when they don't know what their obligations are going to be for healthcare for their employees but they know that the cost of healthcare has gone up under the obama administration how
are employers expected to have more jobs? we talked about bad energy policy. if this election is about obama's policies he is going to lose and the democrats will try to do neglect they can do to keep it from being about his policies. >> chris: we will leave it there. governor barbour and governor dean i want to thank you both for coming in today and we will have you back to continue this debate as the campaign rolls on. up next, our sunday panel on the trayvon martin case. justice denied or a rush to judgment? we'll be right back. [ male announcer ] for making cupcakes and deposits at the same time. for paying your friend back for lunch from your tablet. for 26 paydays triggered with a single tap. for checking your line, then checking your portfolio. for making atms and branches appear out of thin air.
trayvon martin said something to the effect of you're going die now or you are going to die tonight, something to that effect. >> george zimmerman doesn't exhibit a broken nose. he doesn't exhibit blood on the back of his head. he doesn't exhibit his clothes messed up. so america can judge for themselves. >> chris: the lawyer for trayvon martin's family and the father of the shooter both speaking out this week as the martin case keeps getting bigger on more complicated. time for the sunday group. bill kristol of the weekly standard liz marlantes and fox
news political analyst juan williams. bill, what do you make of the trayvon martin case and the legs that it continues to have? are you surprised that more than a month after the shooting that zimmerman still has been charged with nothing or is this another duke lacrosse case where the public is rushing to judgment? >> i don't know if the public is rushing to judgment but a lot of people decided to make this into a national political matter when it should be i think a local or state law enforcement matter and we don't know what happened and i hope, i trust justice will be served and it is a terrible thing that this young man was killed obviously. but the idea that national politicians and commentators are rushing in to make judgments where they don't know what happened is distressing and the degree to which people are willing to play the race card, you know, without -- not in a constructive way and not in a way that helps race relations in this country and in a way that helps promote justice in this case is
distressing i think. >> chris: liz? >> i would add to that that i think the media attention and the pressure from activists did serve a purpose initially in that now we have a special prosecutor investigating and the justice department investigating. i think you can say arguably none of that would have happened if there hadn't been a certain amount of attention paid initially. i think we are at the stage now where there is an investigation and we need to let that investigation do its job and this week the special prosecutor imposed a news blackout so the media was left dealing with various leaks and speculation as opposed to real facts and so i think at this point we need to let the justice be done and let the legal system run its course. >> chris: there are still, though, even if we don't know what happened, we certainly don't know what happend that neat. there are interesting things to be said and one of the people saying them is this person over here, juan williams who had an interesting article in the
"wall street journal" basically it is much more complicated than people are portraying it. i want to put up on the screen a quote from your article. you wrote the martin case is different from the emmett till case. black america needs to get out of the rut of replaying racial injustices of the past. explain? >> well, you know, such an overwhelming situation today in terms of black and white america but if you look at it, it is totally different than the civil rights history and yet because the ney rative is so familiar to so many people, people keep trying to fit things into the narrative and want to make the trayvon martin case into an exemplar of the placef justice that took 50 50 years ago. it is not. it as horrific situation down in florida in which a young black man with ice tee and skittles is walking along in his hoodie and this guy views
him as suspicious. i don't know if it is racial. refused to follow instructions from a 911 operator. i think people fear for their children, black, white, hispanic what if my kid is seen this way and it ends up in this kid's tragic death. the larger point is this. you look at the kind of images of young black people on tv today. the participants down. the do rag. nobody says a ward about it. about the fact that almost halftime of the murders in the united states are of black people and 90% are committed by other black people. what is the carnage in the black community every day of the week and nobody has a march for them. it is outrageous. people talk about the larger context. the bad schools. where are the marchs against the schools failing the kids that lead to the 0% unemployment rate for black teens in the country? to me this is the civil rights challenge of this generation and yet people want to replay what was happening 50 years
ago, chris. >> chris: i think juan's article was spot on. i can tell you when a child or a teenager dies it as tragedy for whatever reasons. now, we are looking at something larger. i have a 15-year-old little brother from big brothers and big sisters. this drove me to call him immediately don't wear your hoodies. what are we so afraid of? the most important thing to hear from the national leaders is turn the volume down and let the investigation happen and see what the facts are in this before we again throw the race card out for everything like that this happens. >> chris: it is interesting because we do stereo type and profile and if it turns out in this case there was profiling by this fellow george zimmerman of trayvon martin he looks suspicious. turns out zimmerman's mother was hispanic and the media
portrayial of him as a racist they say is as far from the truth it is a could be. we tend to as one says to fit the people into preconceived notions when that may not be the case at all. >> we do. and other people, frankly, i think most of the media would have been content to let this play out and i agree with liz at first there seems so have been a lack of interest in pursuing by the local authorities so it was right to raise alarms at first. now, it is just demagoguery. it may be unjustified shooting of this young command and then some counter reaction by some on the right who feel this is unjust and now we are going to go attack trayvon martin or something which is ridiculous as well. i agree with what one says. this is a legitimate debate to be had about whether the florida law contributed to this and whether that is a sensible law. seem there's is a trayvon standard of self-defense of
having a reasonable fear for your own life. this law goes further and makes it if you feel threatened you can use deadly force. i'm not sure we want a society in which that is the case. that is a reasonable debate to have. that is the reasonable debate we should have. >> i think a lot of people are fearful for their own kids. kids act crazy and they dress in a way, you know, the kind of, you know, gangster rap thug fashion and people think oh, my god, this could be my child. the think tha thing that the te point of concern is why was the decision made not to arrest zimmerman. let the legal system take the case and settle the facts. the idea that someone would kill this little boy 17 no matter what his behavior are would kill him when he is unarmed seems outrageous and at least the arrest is necessary. >> chris: all right, there has been media overled, we will stop talking about it. we will take a break here. when we come back, the republican party starts to
we should understand we are not just selecting who will guide us as president but a choice between two distinct paths and destinies for america. >> governor romney has called the president of the united states out of touch. that is a quote, out of touch. for encouraging young people to try to get manufacturing jobs. out of touch? romney? >> chris: mitt romney making
his case against president obama while the vice president heats up his rhetoric against the republican frontrunner and we are back now with the panel. we saw a series of endorsements of mitt romney this week from young guns like marco rubio and paul ryan and old lions of the party like george h.w. bush, bush 41, chip, how effective do you think they will be in forcing the other candidates? it didn't seem from my interview with santorum, forcing the other candidates from the race? and is this primary battle in effect already over? >> it backs effective over a long-term period of time because each happened and less and less momentum for the other candidates can happen and less and less money they can raise and makes it tougher and tougher to win states. and looks like everybody is already onboard to i might as well get there, too. we have three states on tuesday and then pennsylvania, rick santorum's home state coming up at the end of the month. i think you can see an effective end at the end of the month. right now they still have a
case. rick santorum made a case why he should be in the race. nobody has won 1144 yet and like i said until somebody wins 1144 we don't have a nominee. >> chris: and liz, what is the end game here, how and when do you see the republican primary battle wrapping up? i. >> i would argue that we actually have kind of seen it wrapping up this week. i thought it was significant this week of all weeks when healthcare was really the major focus for much of the week and that is theoretically supposed to be romney's achilles heel this week he seemed to consolidate a lot of party support behind him and felt like there was a turning point this week and wisconsin could be the icing on the cake for romney. yes, santorum may stay in until pennsylvania but a big win for romney in wisconsin would really kind of finalize things in terms of the public's overall sense of how it is going. the only other point i would make to chip's point as is sort
of a counter to this. cnn had a poll where they asked republican voters if they wanted to see the race wrapped up at the primaries or at the convention and 43% said at the convention. there is desire for -- >> chris: i voted several times. >> we are are all voting for that. >> chris: of course. even if romney wins this i think it is clear and i will put up some polls myself that the battle for the nomination has really hurt romney, bill. let's take a look. in february, president obama was leading romney by 5 points. that is now up to 11 points. and back in january independents had a favorable opinion of romney by plus 7 and he is now minus 16. how much of a hole is romney in from what happened both his self-induced problems from his gaffes and also the attacks from the right from republicans? >> the i would argue that
everything that is critical of mitt romney has been said already anyway and better to have him overcome it in the primaries rather than have him sail through the primaries anded have the six toite month assaults from the democrats and independent actors on governor romney. i think he is down slightly. president obama improve his approval rating also. the economy picked up some. he is now about even in approval disapproval. i think it is a 50/50 race but romney will be a better candidate if he does win wisconsin tuesday. do want to say and it would be wonderful in my contrarian guy but i picked against kansas and kentucky making the finals and all that. >> chris: come of us didn't. >> chris has won the fox news pool having three of the final four. really amazing. >> chris: i really didn't even pay you to say that. >> and i'm losing the weekly standard poll. >> chris: we have known each years and this is the firstd30
time you looked at me with even a scintilla of admiration. >> the voters of wisconsin said let's just vote for santorum and keep the race alive. i would personally like it as a sort of gesture to the republican establishment. >> chris: he is still flogging the ryan rubio just in case you can't get the sub text there. juan? >> joel bennett said in washington this week that the fact that more than half of the amican people have an unfavorable view of romney at this point tells you something because the obama campaign has not put out the big dogs in terms of attacking romney. the obama campaign will pick up on what you played from president biden that romney is out of touch and this rich guy looking out for the rich and it plays into the notion that you
can see in terms of the ryan budget plan that the budget so far again makes it very clear they want to have strong cuts in terms of entitlement spending but where are the cuts in terms of the loopholes and deductions and things you were discussing last week. it is just not clear and plays negatively for mitt romney at this juncture. but i do think that right now in terms of the republican primary race it is just about over. it is not just that he is going to win this week i think in wisconsin but that the big money starts to come out with the big money endorsements. the bush people, the super pacs. they are going to unload money right now for mitt romney. >> chris: in the time we have left, a little bit of final four analysis. assuming it ends up being obama and romney, how do they match up? >> an interesting match up. we have seen where the battle lines are drawn and some of the polling indicates that obama can pick his fights with romney and mitt romney still having to fight the right-side of the party to get his nomination.
i think they match up interestingly. a tale of two parties and two economies. a tale of two countries almost. and you are going to see one person say this is my vision and that is going this way and obama is going to say this is my vision and goes a different way. completely different paths. completely different styles. completely different almost campaigns and it will be an interesting race in november. >> chris: you are saying it is going to be a philosophical choice which way do you want the country to go? >> and a philosophical choice on how we get there and that is the only way we win. we can't do it on sheer personality. the president has a wonderful personality and gives a great speech. that is not governor romney's strong suit. it is fix it, the economy and this this is how we are going to do it. it is one to say this country has problems and i know how to fix them. >> chris: liz, how do you handicap -- we are jumping the gun, we admit it. >> i was going to add to what chip said i think in
presidential races particularly the personal does matter and the sense that voters have a who this guy is as a person, his character, his values, all of that is really important in presidential races and do i think that the narrative of romney is out of touch which we see the democrats talking about is damaging and to some extent i find if really curious because romney keeps doing it to himself. this week of all weeks when seemed to get all the endorsements and wrap up the nomination he made two gaffes totally voluntarily. made the comment about his father closing the plant in michigan which got a lot of play. >> and moving it to wisconsin. >> which he seemed to think was a joke and didn't play all that well. and then there was that story about the renovation he is doing on his home in la jolla. it doesn't play well for him and he is kind of doing it to h himself. i found that a little keyous and i do think it will be a problem for him going forward. >> chris: bill, 30 seconds to
wrap up. >> two paths forward. a second term for obama we cannot afford. the fed helped him put off the day of reckoning on the debt and deficit. we cannot afford a second term with president obama. >> chris: i suspect we will continue this conversation. and don't forget to check out panel plus where our group picks up with the discussion on our website fox news sunday .com and follow us on twitter @ fox news. up next, our power player of the week. [ kate ] most women may not be properly absorbing the calcium they take because they don't take it with food. switch to citracal maximum plus d. it's the only calcium supplement that can be taken with or without food. that's why my doctor recommends citracal maximum. it's all about absorption.
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this is your moment. let nothing stand in your way. devry university, proud to support the education of our u.s. olympic team. .... >> chris: he is a trail blazing doctor that has given away millions through his own charity. now, he has written a prescription to solve the nation's ills. here is our power player of the week. >> human potential is something that we don't really talk about a lot. >> ben is a world renown brain surgeon at john hopkins medical center in baltimore. both in and out of the operating room he is about maximizing the potential of every person. >> your brain can process more than two million of bits of information in one second. its amazing how you program it.
>> chris: he is legendary for taking on the toughest cases. hopeless patients. for him its calculation. >> it becomes clear the only shot this person has if you do something. >> chris: he believes in the potential of every person because he has lived it. >> as a youngster, growing up in a single parent home in the inner city with dire poverty, all things that would seem to preclude success, i was able to become successful. >> his mother dropped out of third grade and was illiterate. but she made the kids read books and write reports on them. she couldn't read. >> she would put check marks and highlights, it would look like somebody went through. >> so the class dummy became a brain surgeon. he and his wife have given back.
sending up the carson's scholar fund. >> for. over the years it has given more than $5 million in scholarships to help kids go to college. >> i have nothing against sports and entertainment. what is going to maintain our pinnacle position in the world, ability to shoot a jump shot or the ability to solve an equation. >> chris: he has written a book called "america the beautiful." he says like great empires before us, this nation is learning it's a way and needs to return to founding principles. >> this is a country that was a country created for and by the people, not of for and by the government. >> you sound like a conservative republican. >> if shb smb can show me where
government handouts and entitlements lead to a great society. i'm all ears. >> chris: but you don't believe it? >> i haven't seen it. >> chris: while he helps the most to get out of their lives. he will keep striving to get the most out of his. >> we'll have to wait until the lord has in store for me. >> you figure there is something? >> it's always better than what you thought. >> chris: dr. carson says for all his training he still prays before every surgery. god made everything so he knows how everything works. that is it for today. have a great week and we'll see you next fox news sunday.