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tv   Dewbs Co  GB News  January 26, 2023 6:00pm-7:01pm GMT

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6:00 and this is troops in cairo. the show. we'll get into the things that have got you talking today. now, a middle aged and what age even is middle aged and what age even is middle age these days anyway? i'm fascinated by that box. apparently the middle aged and not voting conservative any longer. why? i just because of the things like the mess up around the whole mortgage, the interest things like interest rates and things like that. is popping up. that. child care is popping up. are of these people? are you one of these people? would the tories your vote would the tories get your vote next time and them, then next time? and if not them, then who and pays that are accused of
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sexual misconduct ? should they sexual misconduct? should they be barred from parliament? please note the use of my word accused because of course in this country we are indeed all innocent until proven guilty, are we not? and do you drive a car or at least attempt to drive a car these days? because it's more difficult whenever, isn't it? i'm talking about things like, look , traffic, like, look, traffic, neighbourhoods, lc ns as they called, they pop up absolutely everywhere . and now a council everywhere. and now a council has to turn 75% of its roads into these concerns . what do you into these concerns. what do you think, too? that is all. well meaning? or is it just a kind of a war on cars to get you off them, onto your feet, onto your bike? should it be the council that are getting on their bikes? give me your thoughts and well—meaning circle charities when comes to this whole kind when it comes to this whole kind of channel crossing crisis. now, do you think that these charities are helping or hindering according to the french, they are hindering what
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is stand on that. we'll get into all of that and more . book fair all of that and more. book fair show will bring us up to speed with tonight's latest headlines . michelle, thank you. good evening to you . the top story on evening to you. the top story on gb news tonight, the former chancellor nadhim zahawi has given hmrc approval to release files relating to his tax affairs to be in to investigate , outed by an independent monitor . it follows the tax monitor. it follows the tax accounts . chief executive jim accounts. chief executive jim harra telling mps there are no penalty fees for innocent errors after being questioned before the public accounts committee. the tory party chairman is facing calls to resign after it emerged he had paid a penalty to hmrc while he was chancellor. the prime minister says no issues were raised with him when he appointed zahawi to his current role because nadhim zahawi himself put a statement into the public domain and it was on the reporting. there are questions answer and that's questions to answer and that's why asked independent why i asked the independent adviser conduct an
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adviser to conduct an investigation fully establish investigation to fully establish the facts and provide advice to me about nadhim zahawi compliance of the ministerial code. compliance of the ministerial code . at least 11 people have code. at least 11 people have died in russian missile strikes in ukraine a day after the us and germany pledged to supply the country with tanks and infantry fighting vehicles. more than ten were wounded in the attacks, which covered 11 regions, including the capital kyiv. germany's defence minister says he expects the first leopard 2 tanks to arrive in ukraine by the end of march . at ukraine by the end of march. at the same time, the uk has challenged two tanks are thought to be arriving. russia has responded with the kremlin, saying the deliveries of military hardware amounted to directives . movement in the directives. movement in the conflict by the west . a member conflict by the west. a member of ukraine's parliament, kira ruddick, told gb news, sending tanks isn't enough . a year into tanks isn't enough. a year into this war, we are still in this david versus goliath situation where russia has more people, more weapons , more military
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more weapons, more military production, more supply . so we production, more supply. so we have to be different . we have to have to be different. we have to fight harder. have to be different. we have to fight harder . we have to have fight harder. we have to have more sophisticated weapons and we have to use different strategies and having tanks is one of those strategies . well, one of those strategies. well, as you've been hearing all day on gb news, scotland's first minister has confirmed a transgender person convicted of rape will not be sent to an all female prison. earlier this week, isla bryson was found guilty of raping two women before choosing to change his gender to female . at first gender to female. at first minister's questions, nicholas sturgeon addressed the row and whether or not bryson should be held at colton vale prison . she held at colton vale prison. she also confirmed risk assessment has been carried out by the scottish prison service. it would not be appropriate for me in respect of any prisoner to give details of where they are being incarcerated . but given being incarcerated. but given the understandable public and parliamentary concern in this
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case, i can confirm to parliament that this prisoner will not be incarcerated at cornton, the women's prison , and cornton, the women's prison, and ihope cornton, the women's prison, and i hope that provides assurance to the public. presiding officer , not least to the victims in this particular case. now, andrew, britain has threatened to sue the former health secretary for defamation following an online post he retweeted about the covid jab. early this month , the north—west early this month, the north—west leicestershire mp was stripped of the tory whip after retweeting a post by a consultant cardiologist which said the number of people suffering with heart problems after having the covid vaccine was the biggest crime against humanity since the holocaust. matt hancock referred to britain's comments as antisemitic in the house of commons , a statement that commons, a statement that britain has refuted. more doctors and nurses than ever are working in the nhs. doctors and nurses than ever are working in the nhs . figures from working in the nhs. figures from nhs digital show nearly 5000 more doctors and 10,000 more
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nurses are working in the health service. last year compared with the previous year. that comes as the previous year. that comes as the government plans to recruit 50,000 more nurses by next year. meanwhile thousands of nhs physiotherapists in england have become the latest group to join the ongoing industrial action in the ongoing industrial action in the health service. a 24 hour walk out involves physios and their support staff at 30 trusts. it's the first time members of the chartered society of physiotherapy have gone on strike in a dispute over pay . it strike in a dispute over pay. it claims no new offer has been put forward despite the government saying it is open to dialogue . saying it is open to dialogue. and health workers in northern ireland are also staging a 24 hour walkout today. members of four different unions are striking in a dispute over pay and conditions. paramedics are among those involved . unions say among those involved. unions say contingency arrangements are in place to ensure emergency care continues despite the strike action . and lastly , the king has action. and lastly, the king has been given a warm welcome during
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his first visit to the new africa centre in south london. his majesty spoke to staff and visitors and heard how the centre provides a home away from home for africans living in the uk. the new building is a former 1960s office block and has been transformed into a community hub for african culture and heritage . you're up to date on tv, .you're up to date on tv, onune .you're up to date on tv, online and dab , plus radio with online and dab, plus radio with gb news. now back to michelle with dewbs& co . with dewbs& co. thanks for that, polly. follow along, michelle dewberry. and i'm keeping you company until 7:00 this evening alongside me . i've got lord alongside me. i've got lord daniel moyle and the concepts of power the house of lords and power in the house of lords and laurie who is a laurie leybourne, who is a policy researcher. good evening, gentlemen . we've got munching gentlemen. we've got munching glasses on all of us today, laurie. i chose on purpose. want
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to. you want to be more like me? no, that's very flattering as a thank you. also, you know the drills that you want. troops and how about us three how it's not just about us three with matching glasses. it's with our matching glasses. it's about at as well. about you at home as well. what's on mind tonight so what's on your mind tonight so you get in touch? gb views. you can get in touch? gb views. ed is the or he ed is the email or he can me at gb news. a quick can tweet me at gb news. a quick reminder. i want to talk to you about low traffic neighbourhoods. do you have them around you? are you a pedestrian that them or are you that quite likes them or are you a driver? them a car driver? finds them a little bit infuriating . or little bit infuriating. or a cyclist perhaps is somewhat in the middle. also, i want to ask you about the charities. are they helping or hindering this migrant crisis? the channel crossings ? your thoughts on that crossings? your thoughts on that one? and employees that are accused of sexual misconduct . accused of sexual misconduct. should they be banned from the parliament tree estates? and if so, when ? the point of so, when? the point of accusation , the point of arrest, accusation, the point of arrest, the point of charge . i want your the point of charge. i want your thoughts on that and my top story. i'll be getting into as well about who we'll be voting tory or not at the next election
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. and by the way, when is middle aged a happy birthday? by the way, speaking of age to one of my regular viewers, mick , who my regular viewers, mick, who turned 40 yesterday. i wonder if that puts you in the middle age bracket these days or not. get in touch with me. let me know your thoughts. your girlfriend, lucy got in touch and asked me to wish you a happy belated birthday. i hope you spent it last night watching where last night watching me. where else? else to do on your else? what else to do on your 40th birthday? then tune into dewbs& co i say nothing if you ask me. right let's move on and talk about voting, shall we? who will you be voting for in the next general election? how old are you, by the way ? because are you, by the way? because apparently middle aged people are turning away from the tories. this is all to do with this big study about the generational divides in this country. middle aged people, apparently those in their forties and fifties , are turning forties and fifties, are turning away from the tories. i found it quite astonishing that forties is classed as middle age these days, but you know, apparently
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it is. do you what do you think is going on? because previously it would have been that if you were slightly older, you would have gravitated more towards the tories. it seems now less so . tories. it seems now less so. things like the mortgage costs, the issues, etc. do the childcare issues, etc. do you this is concerning for you think this is concerning for the tories or not? well, i'm looking forward middle age, looking forward to middle age, michel . you're going to let me michel. you're going to let me know when you get that. i just want to get that in there right at the outset. i'm looking forward to getting there eventually. i'm not there yet. the you mention the issues you mention are important . people are the issues you mention are important. people are very anxious about mortgage , cost of anxious about mortgage, cost of living, things like that . i living, things like that. i understand all of that . but what understand all of that. but what this study shows is just this study shows is not just that anxious about those that they're anxious about those things their underlying things, but their underlying views on certain matters have moved much more to the left and are much closer to younger people than they are to older people. and i think half of the reason for that is that nobody is actually articulating the case for a conservative values society in this country anymore.
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what does that we're not seeing as a value? we're not. well, we know what it means. we know a lot of people about what it means. well that's true. but i suppose you're right. that's the point. i make a lot of people don't know what it means and people making the case people aren't making the case for society in which you have for a society in which you have responsibilities after responsibilities to look after yourself family, not yourself and your family, not just responsibilities , just social responsibilities, not state, to look after not the state, to look after everything. work is everything. that hard work is really important , that savings really important, that savings are important, and that you can't look to the state to do everything for you . also, of everything for you. also, of course, a lot of people have been distracted. we're going to come this later healthy come to this later on healthy ends. they've been very ends. and they've been very alarmed by the by the extravagant and unjustified language used by a lot of language being used by a lot of the green wing, language being used by a lot of the green wing , which suggests the green wing, which suggests that is an immediate that there is an immediate crisis or an emergency , that crisis or an emergency, that they've got to do something about. and i think that nobody i don't see anybody out there from the government actually making the government actually making the case for a conservative society, and they haven't done society, and they haven't done so for years. so it's hardly surprising people drift off and
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believe the things they are being told when they're not being told when they're not being given the other side of the case. yes, i believe in typical concern of its own values, if you want to call them that personal responsibility, small state, tough law and order and all the rest of it. but many people will watching this. people will be watching this. they share , you in they might share, you know, in principle, there's principle, laurie, there's values, but they're shouting at the . good. yes, michel, the screen. good. yes, michel, i would love be responsible for would love to be responsible for myself. love to have myself. i would love to have savings. but the cost base that people have, their mortgage is obviously inflation . all the obviously inflation. all the rest of it. it's making it to the point that even if you want it to have conservative values, you would struggle. you perhaps would struggle. now yeah. mean, the conservatives yeah. i mean, the conservatives made over the last 12 made choices over the last 12 years that made this country less and less safe to less secure and less safe to things like the energy shock and that we experience at the moment. so what's happened as time on is that it time has gone on is that it affected wider wider affected a wider and wider segment society starting to segment of society starting to those who have managed to save a lot, who have got a home, have got a mortgage and so on, and i
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looking at the data, we've got people who are talking about things around the cost of living the fact that their pay has been suppressed, a really big finding that came out in the report is that came out in the report is that you have a lot of people who are in this a slightly blurry age bracket, what we call middle age. now, who was saying that more control in that they wanted more control in the feel the workplace. they don't feel they enough power for they have enough power, for example, feel example, and they feel that that's back and hitting that's bouncing back and hitting their pay and they're worried about the fact that public about the fact that their public services, the education, the hospital have, the hospital services they have, the right to because they're paid into the system, have suffered from chronic underinvestment. so decisions that were made to under invest in this country that made it less secure are starting to blow back against people who in the past may have been more economically secure. and as a no surprise and i see it as a no surprise that to people to that that's leading to people to want move away from the want to move away from the conservative party. i wonder, where go if are where will you go if you are someone that's listening this someone that's listening to this and agreement with and you're in agreement with what , you're less what you're hearing, you're less likely perhaps go the next likely perhaps to go to the next election. where will you go then? will you anywhere? it's
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then? will you go anywhere? it's always the will always had out in the or will you say, you know , no, i'm you just say, you know, no, i'm not time? the not bothering next time? by the way, say your first point way, you say your first point that was energy that you made was about energy security this country. you security in this country. you said the last 12 years of said about the last 12 years of the tories, many would say, hang on a second. the reason that we're situation with the we're in the situation with the energy failings of energy is not the failings of the power of the last the people in power of the last 12 years, but it's gone beyond size. successive size. many successive governments failed us governments that have failed us now we're reaping the reaping the we're the the rewards. we're reaping the consequence that consequence. and says of that failure, i suspect. consequence. and says of that failure, i suspect . but where do failure, i suspect. but where do you think these people will go then, daniel? if less likely to 90, then, daniel? if less likely to go, tory, than were ? well, we do go, tory, than were? well, we do know that things like this disillusionment with the existing political parties does have an effect on turnout and that there will be people who will simply stay at home and curse on both of you or all of you or whatever it is. and i'm not going to vote because they feel their vote doesn't make a difference. so i think you're one them. i there'll be one of them. i think there'll be well, discourage that well, i would discourage that because very because i think it's very important exercise vote important to exercise your vote even from a list of people whom
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you don't really approve of, because it's is the most because it's it is the most valuable democratic right. you've right of you've got the right of participation so would participation. so i would i would encourage to cast your would encourage you to cast your vote even if even if vote tomorrow, even if even if you find it difficult to find a party, there'll be one out there that'll be less bad than the others. and i think you should. i'm not saying who would be for you, you make own you, but you make your own choice. think you should choice. but i think you should cast vote. but believing cast your vote. but believing that to one side, some people, i think, will not their vote. think, will not cast their vote. some of course, will some people, of course, will go to labour party cast to the labour party because cast armour is, know , he's sort armour is, you know, he's sort of trying to try to sweep them up the big interesting question is whether any of those will go to a new party or a fringe party and what effect that's likely to have and i don't know the answer to those questions. a lot of you are getting into this, by the way, about age thing. way, about middle age thing. i do that your middle do not believe that your middle aged might be aged in your forties might be statistically and don't statistically wrong. and i don't know about. it know what i've about. yeah, it feels very odd to me. well, do you think that labour will stand to gain from this tory
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disillusionment? yeah, i think the polls show that people have experienced one of the hardest penodsin experienced one of the hardest periods in recent memory. they're looking at a party that seems to have an endemic problem with behaviours that border on or outright corruption . you got or outright corruption. you got a guy who was chancellor who you know, accidentally missed a guy who was chancellor who you know, accidentally misse d £5 know, accidentally missed £5 million on his tax return while people at home trying to afford their bills and then being also told by the prime minister that they're going to have to inevitably pay more, tax. it just the whole edifice is crumbling of competence and hypocrisy and you're talking only about energy . i totally only about energy. i totally agree with you about energy policy over time, but it was a choice made in the 2010 is to suppress gas wages, say in the pubuc suppress gas wages, say in the public sector. and you would have found yourself now down the line where many people who are in this age bracket we're talking about would have had a bit more money to be added with stuff themselves working stuff and themselves working hard and building up their own
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self dependence of self dependence instead of relying on the state withstand the that we've been the shocks that we've been through. it was the through. but it was the political choice to suppress those wages at a time that wasn't as unstable as it is now. so i think if you look at the polls, i mean, one came out in the last couple of days showed tories being almost completely decimated election, decimated the next election, i don't surprising. don't think that's surprising. well, i hope that suppressing wages, you know, the 2010 government inherited a total financial from gordon financial crisis from gordon brown and behaved in a way that tried to be sensible , trying to tried to be sensible, trying to be sensible about public finances and, you know, criticise is at the margins, you know , should you be a little bit know, should you be a little bit higher, a little bit lower? that's what politics is all about, having that argument. i understand that but idea understand that. but the idea that know, that's what that was you know, that's what you describing as you were describing as suppressing wages. call fiscal suppressing wages. i call fiscal good sense . i just want me to good sense. i just want me to quibble about what la said about the polls. when we see those polls that come out and i agree, they show a huge lead for labour because they do. that's what
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they show. i'm not arguing about that, by the time we see that, but by the time we see those they have, of those numbers, they have, of course, them. the course, removed from them. the people voting . so people who are not voting. so some so what don't some polls. and so what we don't see don't see is how see what we don't see is how much, you know, how many people will see me. but you may not be the only one. you may not be the only one, but wouldn't know only one, but you wouldn't know it from those leads it necessarily from those leads . yeah. the point here is . yeah. and the point here is that when we're as we get closer to election, you i think we'll have to have parties that are very that have a very credible story about how we can economically renew this country. gordon brown did not cause the collapse of the american housing market. so, no, it's not to do with this started in what you said it is it all start the point it starts in america now. we all started here under gordon brown's what the point here and he then spent billions saving the world as he put it. he wants to tell you the point. well, what's the point? if you look in towards the next general election, you've got to look at
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parties that have got a vision for how we renew this country economically. doesn't economically. and it doesn't mean getting in the same bind mean us getting in the same bind that where on one that we're in now, where on one side we've got chancellors avoiding taxes and giving contracts for fake ppe to people in the house of lords and then over here expecting us all to have to pay higher bills and not be given a support and suffer under an nhs that didn't get investment. story does investment. that story does not add i find it quite add up. i do find it quite interesting that when we're talking day polity talking about present day polity x and governments, you know, you will say about corruption and you blame it all at the door of the tories in power. yeah i know. but when daniel then talks about the situation and in 2008, you immediately said, well that was global factors, whereas actually some would argue that if you look at lots of the mess that's going on in this country, a lot of that a global fact says, but how come you don't give credit to the global factors now, but you give all the credit to global factors then? is a crucial point then? so this is a crucial point that you said it talked about
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gordon brown's economic crisis. it abroad. the it came from abroad. the question what domestic question is then what domestic responses now the responses are made now the labour government in the years before the two thousand and seven crisis spent way too much time cosying up to the city, deregulating and so on, making us more vulnerable to that then shock that came globally . a shock that came globally. a similar culpability is happening here where the conservative government, prior to the shock coming, has made us more vulnerable . i'll tell you what vulnerable. i'll tell you what would have made us the domestic more vulnerable as well. anyone with memory will remember with a good memory will remember when we were talking about trying of these trying to come out of these lockdowns and things that. lockdowns and things like that. if memory do separate and if my memory do separate and i think it does, it was keir starmer was the one that starmer that was the one that was chris michael of us coming starmer that was the one that wasof|ris michael of us coming starmer that was the one that wasof lockdown. l of us coming starmer that was the one that wasof lockdown. the us coming starmer that was the one that wasof lockdown. the pace ming starmer that was the one that wasof lockdown. the pace ofng out of lockdown. the pace of which we were coming out. i think he would have had his way. we have been locked down we would have been locked down for longer. and of for a whole lot longer. and of course, all seeing course, we are all now seeing the magnitude of consequences that came down from locking our economy down for as long as we did . brian says, i'm 54 and i've
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did. brian says, i'm 54 and i've always voted tory, but no more. he says i don't trust labour or the lib dem. so bill reform uk that gets my vote at the next general election. peter you say pretty much a similar thing, but you're not 54, you're a couple of years older. i'll be polite. the lots of you are saying that you used to be tory and that you are not anymore. lots of you saying that you would switch to reform, but you know a few months how long forgotten now till the next election? a year or so, perhaps. that is a long time in politics, isn't it? let me know your thoughts. so gb views archie we .uk is my views archie, we use .uk is my email address now i'm going to take a quick break, but i'm going to stick with a theme, if you like, of parliament at least, because if you were accused of sexual misconduct in the workplace , would you expect the workplace, would you expect to be essentially banned from your , your shop, wherever your office, your shop, wherever it is ? that's what's perhaps it is? that's what's perhaps being proposed right now. two mp and i wonder what you make of
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that. and i wonder what you make of that . it's is such and i wonder what you make of that. it's is such a complex thing, isn't it? you've got your accusations, you've got your arrest, you've got your charge . arrest, you've got your charge. at what point should some of the consequences kick in? give me a thought. i'll see you .
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in two. hi there. i'm michelle dewberry. this is dewbs& co and we're keeping you company until 7:00 this evening alongside me. i've got lord daniel moylan, the tory peerin got lord daniel moylan, the tory peer in the house of lords and laurie lep on a policy research show. welcome back everybody . show. welcome back everybody. we've just been talking about voting and you will vote for voting and who you will vote for if all by the way, the next if it's all by the way, the next general election. says general election. kev, says michelle, the standard of mp on both sides is so low and pathetic that there is nobody to vote for , he says. it's in vote for, he says. it's in barry, saying dave . dave has barry, saying dave. dave has beenin barry, saying dave. dave has been in touch as well and say that he will spoil his ballot
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with some strong choice words. i've said this often, but when you do stand for parliament as a candidate, when you stand for election as a candidate, you gather around at the end of the count. so what happens is, is any kind of uncleared ballots or spoilt ballots or whatever all the candidates gather round. if you go there and you have to agree. this one's agree. yes, this one's definitely spoil it perhaps definitely spoil it is perhaps a vote or her or whatever. vote for him or her or whatever. and it is hilarious to see the messages and the scribbles and the scrolls that people are in this. actually, i might even be talking myself draft and talking myself around draft and not might more not voting. i might be more amusing actually do something amusing to actually do something like suggests. perhaps like dave suggests. perhaps anyway committees anyway, parliamentary committees . i consider considering this way whether not mps that are way whether or not mps that are accused sexual misconduct accused of sexual misconduct should banned from the should be banned from the parliamentary states. the parliamentary states. while the claims are investigated . this claims are investigated. this stems , by the way, there was an stems, by the way, there was an mp. you're probably familiar with it. you continue to attend parliament whilst on trial for sexual assault . he was, of sexual assault. he was, of course, eventually found guilty. i'll to your first because i'll come to your first because
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you are indeed in the murky world of politics yourself. what do you think ? so this suggestion do you think? so this suggestion barring people from the parliamentary estate and if you agree with that, what point ? i agree with that, what point? i think it's very dangerous because what you've got to do is avoid giving opportunities for people who maliciously make false claims . so if it people who maliciously make false claims. so if it was simply a question of an accusation of i could get i could get keir starmer out of the house of commons for three months by setting up a false accusation that people who do that straight away, they get him out for three months. by the time it was proved wrong, out for three months. by the time it was proved wrong , the time it was proved wrong, the three months would have been lost. and during that period his constituents would not be represented and he wouldn't be doing job. so i think the doing his job. so i think the point accusation is not the point of accusation is not the point of accusation is not the point at which people should actually be asked to step back. i do think again about the guy who was attending, but i do think when you get to the point that you're charged , you're
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that you're charged, you're probably not welcome on the parliamentary estate and you should take time off and go and conduct your self and your trial and prove yourself not guilty. if that's the case and you've got the right to do that, but i do think that's very dangerous if you give people an incentive, malicious addition, malicious people. in addition, i'm saying don't get me i'm not saying don't get me wrong, i'm not saying the accusations that have been made so malicious false , so far on malicious or false, but i'm saying that you would then, given incentive people then, given incentive to people to make false accusations , and to make false accusations, and that breaks a democratic bond and does a deserve this to people who need the services and support of their mp. i had a political editor on my panel once, not that long ago, actually a couple of months ago. whatever. many people might have seen the programme and he said to me that he's aware of lots of employees that have been alleged to of sexually harassed members, either of their staff or the people in and around that proximate say. and i asked him, well, if that's the case, why don't you report on it then? and
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he said to me, well, i can't because i can't prove it. these people are not willing to go on record and they're about record and they're worried about the so the consequences. so. daniel so is at the point of charge, then these can be asked to these people can be asked to come on the parliamentary stage. but do you get to that point but how do you get to that point of because parliament of charge? because parliament has imbalance has a huge power imbalance right? if like, know right? so if i'm like, you know , admin junior , , like the office admin junior, whatever, and my boss is the all powerful mp for whatever . yeah, powerful mp for whatever. yeah, you know, i would be a bit anxious because i think, oh, he's powerful and no he's really powerful and no one's to believe me. so one's going to believe me. so how to that point of how do you get to that point of charge don't have some charge if you don't have some form of ability to indicate that this person is under you know, investigation or whatever ? in investigation or whatever? in most workplaces in the country , most workplaces in the country, there's a there's a whole set of processes hate jaw department and so on, that enables some kind of process of dealing with these very complex situations . these very complex situations. right. that is , as you're right. that is, as you're inferring, they're often missing inferring, they're often missing in the context of parliament. you've got a number of policies
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and places that people can report things, but then you've also got a situation where you have mp who are employing these staff and there is, as you say, a big power imbalance. there and i think that it makes it very difficult for us. you know, you hear stories about the policy as a means of reporting , not a means of reporting, not necessarily being massively useful, but then a power imbalance, a feeling basically that you will end up jeopardising your career in politics. your staff often a bit youngenis politics. your staff often a bit younger, is a big disincentive to that. so i think internal to parliament that needs to be and people are talking about this for a long time, a process of trying to create more structures. so that staff do feel more supported, like they can speak out. and also part of a wider cultural change that does try to sort out some of these clearly quite toxic cultural elements within the context of parliament. i agree there's a cultural issue, but let's be clear, this power imbalance has been recognised in
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recent years very strongly inside parliament, both in the commons and the lords. and i think you're unfair in not recognising that there have been structures very seriously put in place and compulsory training for, so that people can report confident internally. i don't think it's ever easy. it isn't easy if you're working in a in a factory or an office because your if you're complaining about your if you're complaining about your boss, you know, you know , your boss, you know, you know, there's going to be ructions and thatis there's going to be ructions and that is true in parliament as well. but i do think we should acknowledge the efforts that have been put in place to create these structures which i think partly explains why there are so many more complaints than there used yeah, they used to be. yeah, but if they were wholly though, were wholly effective though, you a situation you wouldn't have a situation like had not that like what i had on here not that long ago where you've got a political saying, political journalist saying, oh, nationals television, that he is aware of accusations and people that are behaving wrongly, but he can't stack it up . he can't he can't stack it up. he can't do the story. well, that's a
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different matter. it you could have perfectly effect let's take an office environment. nothing to house of commons. to do with the house of commons. you have perfectly you could have perfectly reasonable with h.r. reasonable structures with h.r. department people reporting them, very different them, but it's a very different thing say and i'm going to go thing to say and i'm going to go and tell the newspaper and put my face on the newspaper reporting that incident. but i might be willing to report it internally . but why do i want internally. but why do i want the publicity ? that's a very the publicity? that's a very difficult for the boss is difficult for me. the boss is a wrong'un and it's not just doing it me. you might want to go it to me. you might want to go all over them. you might want to do that, but i think an awful lot people say, i am, lot of people would say, i am, i am, i will reluctantly leave because very traumatic. because it's all very traumatic. but will reluctantly report but i will reluctantly report this feel i have to, this because i feel i have to, on , on behalf of on my behalf, on behalf of colleagues, the system colleagues, to the to the system set up by h.r. and so on and have that processed. but i certainly don't want this being on the front of the local newspaper. it's a totally different michel i say, different thing. michel i say, i'm must confess i've i'm afraid i must confess i've never been sexually harassed in my workplace or anywhere, quite frankly . if was , then frankly. and if i was, then i think and it's easy for it's
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easy to say, because i'm in that dynamic. but especially as a younger person, if you're starting out your career, you've got to start as you mean to go on.and got to start as you mean to go on. and if you've got this old pervy guy or whatever , what's my pervy guy or whatever, what's my language? if you've got this boss that's behaving in a way that's inappropriate to you, you . so what? in a way, you get your courage from that. you've got your voice. you've got to find your voice. you've got to find your voice. you've got get in front of this and got to get in front of this and you got to stop it. you can start trying to go on, but if someone is a mass offender, a serial offender, they serial offender, then they should should be should be outed. they should be convicted. a criminal convicted. if it's a criminal act they and often act that they doing. and often the only way that you can do thatis the only way that you can do that is by making it at the pubuc that is by making it at the public some degree so that public to some degree so that people and go, yeah, people can chip in and go, yeah, he's me. well, the he's doing it to me. well, the other the other thing is other thing the other thing is the other thing is in parliament, at least we are all mps and members of the house of lords now under an lords are now under an obugafion lords are now under an obligation to report any behaviour we like that behaviour we see like that in any . and if you any other member. and if you fail to report it, we can be done breaching it. no, no
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laughing. all right. done breaching it. no, no laughing. all right . we can be laughing. all right. we can be done for breaching the code of conduct as well. so i think i'm not defending the system as it stands , but i'm saying it's stands, but i'm saying it's a lot better than you say. and i don't think that it's i think there's a big difference between reporting something and wanting to have it dealt with and expecting the protection of your employer and the structure in which you work and going off and tittle tattle a bit to the newspaper about it and seeing yourself on the front of the newspaper. i mean that that obugafions newspaper. i mean that that obligations that have existed for over 100 years, i mean, it's a bit obligation. it only is there. no, no, it isn't. there. no, no, no, it isn't. it hasn't existed formal hasn't existed in the formal sense you could actually sense that you could actually yourself formal punishment yourself get a formal punishment and suspension for failing. and a suspension for failing. but do it as a note, as a but you do it as a note, as a natural, moral obligation of one person to another. it's there , person to another. it's there, but nobody's enforced. nobody's beenin but nobody's enforced. nobody's been in a position to enforce it in the past. now you can, but youris in the past. now you can, but your is in is my understanding, correct, that when you were employed as a as as a staffer employed as a as a as a staffer to mp, you're employed by the
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to an mp, you're employed by the mp and not by a wide organisation. this is where the root you're your root comes because you're your boss person that may have boss is the person that may have done to in another done that to you in another organisation and you would your employer organisation. it employer is the organisation. it is not that one person who the allegation may be there's nothing that's happened. the complaint is not to the boss. the complaint is to the organisation , just as it would organisation, just as it would be. and it's the organisation that goes into effect to investigate the organisation being who being the parliamentary body set up and i forget his name, the parliamentary body set to receive these complaints and to investigate them. but you , on investigate them. but you, on behalf of the commons and the law, but your contract is still , as you as a member of staff is still to the individual. it's not to the organisation. you're not to the organisation. you're not employed by parliament. right. as a body. you i'm not i'm not all of this makes the biggest difference in as big a difference you but difference as you think but you're right you're not employed by the mp. by your employed by the mp. that's true. where do you stand on this? and this is very
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complex it? complex as well, isn't it? because it branches out way beyond of beyond parliament. lots of this does for example, does because for example, you will have been familiar with the cases in the past where some body talking about body i'm not talking about politics generally. i'm talking about of perhaps has about now a man of perhaps has been accused of sexual misconduct, he will misconduct, whatever he will often get named , whereas the often get named, whereas the accuseris often get named, whereas the accuser is granted anonymity . accuser is granted anonymity. and there's been lots of cases like that recently which kind of always sparked the debate. where is anonymity? where should it be granted? what's the right process and procedures to follow in these kind of cases? give me your thoughts, . do drive a charles . right. do you drive a charles would be a fine thing many people will say, because, yes, you can have a cow. but being able to freely travel around these days is either a difficult be impossible or seem very expensive, it ? and there's expensive, isn't it? and there's a now that planning a council now that a planning essentially to most cars essentially to ban most cars from 75% of its roads really. what do you think to that? is it all fantastic for the climate or is it just a war on cars? give
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me your thoughts and i'll see you into .
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hi there. i'm michelle dewberry keeping you company until 7:00 tonight and i've got alongside me lord daniel moylan, tory power in the house of lords and lorry lebon, who is a policy research chair. most of you guys getting in touch about that whole conversation about sexual misconduct and innocent until proven guilty, etc. jim says surely until anyone's guilt has been proven , life should go on been proven, life should go on as normal . he asks anyway, what as normal. he asks anyway, what kinds of choose sexual misconduct these days ? it seems misconduct these days? it seems asking someone out for a drink would classify men have to do these days is look the wrong way and he's a. he's innocent until guilty, he says again. what do you make to that ? phil says. you
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you make to that? phil says. you always have to have due process if someone's guilty , by all if someone's guilty, by all means, get rid of them. but you cannot just go on accusation alone and angry , says all tory alone and angry, says all tory mps accused of anything. these days seem to be immediately judged guilty by the media and judged guilty by the media and labour. it seems that these guys will not shuts off until the accused life is wrecked. do you agree with . keep your thoughts agree with. keep your thoughts coming in. i'll have some more in just a few minutes. but for now, let's talk cars . we. do you now, let's talk cars. we. do you have one? do you drive one? i think chance would be a fine thing because more and more cities , councils, etc. seem to cities, councils, etc. seem to be piling on the restrictions it comes to motorists and one council area. now get this what's seen most vehicles banned from 75% of its roads within the next three years. this is hackney council, by the way . hackney council, by the way. this is all stems around the low traffic neighbourhood schemes. they are popping up absolutely everywhere. like. do everywhere. it feels like. do you have one anywhere near you?
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do you celebrate? say, i don't know. might have a cafe know. you might have a cafe owner put chairs and owner that has put chairs and whatever. you think it's great. oh you might it's a pain oh you might think it's a pain in bottom because it makes in the bottom because it makes you knows which you go goodness only knows which route. lorry . it route. now to get home lorry. it seems me that there is just seems to me that there is just a war on motorists now. am i wrong? well, hang on. so the story this is not correct . story this is not correct. they're not banning 75% of cars from these roads, 75% of no that make 75% of their roads low traffic. you have to hold. so let's define that. it's not what that infers, which is what i did say that. but anyway, you stop. yeah so, but what is a low traffic neighbourhood? it's no, it's not. i think the thing was about banning was and anyway the point a low driving point is a low driving neighbourhood a neighbourhood there is to do a number things. one of which number of things. one of which or maybe even the most common of which restrict the running which is to restrict the running that happens through certain roads i know i suffered roads which i know i suffered from before. and i know many other people do. the road elements are still accessible by local residents so on. the local residents and so on. the idea here is to create a
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different type of urban environment . that doesn't mean environment. that doesn't mean there much of this there is as much of this congestion and poisonous air pollution that we suffer from in many cities, and that many of our cities, and that comes alongside a number of measures or should including the ability to make safer for ability to make it safer for people to cycle more options where they can put their bikes and hopefully better public transport people have a transport so people have a better alternative. it is not banning some vehicles or completely pedestrianised roads happening in some places. this instead is about providing measures . you kind of flippantly measures. you kind of flippantly say, yeah , that's happening in say, yeah, that's happening in some places, as though the banning of cars and the closure of roads to cars is kind of right. but those things aren't the pedestrianisation certain the pedestrianisation of certain places is quite rare. obviously happens. it's. tell me now you because i don't think it's that right. i can think of someone right. i can think of someone right near me actually where they've closed the whole word, they've closed the whole word, the cafes and restaurants shop the cafes and restaurants shop the tables and chairs onto those rows and they're entirely pedestrianised so lorry says it's right on. is that right? is
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it? but the, you know, the headune it? but the, you know, the headline that was about 75% of roads having their cars banned from them . that's not the case. from them. that's not the case. it's trying to crack down on, trying to reduce some of this congestion, some of this running to make sure that the streets in which people live are safer, that have , for example, a higher that have, for example, a higher cost to apps whizzing past, because that's a quick way that they have an excuse to make. the way in which you know i used to do for highways my borough the way in which you assess whether something is dangerous, a road is dangerous is by looking at the accident record and seeing have there been accidents . most have there been accidents. most of don't have of these roads don't have accidents. didn't to accidents. they didn't need to be safer . the next is be made safer. the next thing is we say we're doing it. you say you're doing it in the interests of air quality. we know almost nothing about air quality in london because we know almost nothing about air quality in london because the stations that measure air quality of very, very few in number and they're mostly on main roads and you do
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not know the contract for them is quite limited and you do not know if you really want to know about air quality. you should be doing mobile air quality sampling . nobody does that in sampling. nobody does that in london , so you get a picture of london, so you get a picture of what's happening behind the main roads because the evidence shows what what evidence there is . if what what evidence there is. if you get away from a main road, even block away from a main road , the air quality improves dramatically and many of these side roads blocked off do not have an air quality problem . have an air quality problem. there's no air quality station that shows what the air quality is. there was no evidence for any of this. and the last thing i'd say is it's socially unjust because let's face it , on the because let's face it, on the really busy main roads where there is an air quality problem , that is very often where you find your social housing and the leaf is streets behind. where i say in most cases there probably isn't an air quality problem. we certainly don't have the evidence to say there is there actually there the middle classes and they're the ones who
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are piling up value on their on their houses. and this suits them really well . rat running is them really well. rat running is a term people when i want to use the public highway i paid for that's fine when it's my road it's an it's somebody else using it. it's rat running. so be absolutely clear about that . absolutely clear about that. these terms are loaded and they're a way of shifting advantage from one group to another . and it largely accrues another. and it largely accrues to better off people and against those who were worse off. in addition , very little evidence addition, very little evidence to support it . so it's not to support it. so it's not having any of it, basically. laurie, what would you say about to that? i mean, it's just loads and loads and loads evidence. and loads and loads of evidence. i know the contract if i mean, i know the contract if you know anyone really you know where anyone really with polling stations on google or google air pollution and or the google air pollution and you will find a multitude live maps that get because we're talking about a london council live maps of where the air pollution is across nappies and monitors. there are outside primary schools have given primary schools that have given us of bad the air
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us an idea of how bad the air pollution facing young pollution is facing young children , the evidence about air children, the evidence about air pollution, and then we kind of we've done that now it is there and this is an effort that might be had to do with that. people are upset. i think logistic really, because feel they really, because they feel they don't given enough don't be given enough opportunity to see be opportunity to see to be consulted about the introduction of some these . well, of some of these. well, actually, there were pushed in under this whole kind of covid thing . so they didn't have a lot thing. so they didn't have a lot of the consultation, a lot of the scrutiny and all the rest of it. and before you knew it, many people just looked outside the window. and at these things outside with very little consultation. i you got any of these areas, all these zones nearby you and how do they work nearby you and how do they work near you? are they completely closed off to cars cars allowed on the i want thoughts on that . on the i want thoughts on that. nigel says if you pay road tax, you should be able to go anywhere on the king's highway . anywhere on the king's highway. you know, people are asking, do we get a refund if you go
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elton's popping up anywhere, do we get refund on any of the kind of convert type taxes that people are paying for? lots of people are paying for? lots of people as well. mentioning you last, bringing that up again, i personally, i do have a car and i use my car. i've got a kid that i transport. i've got all the paraphernalia that goes with that. the paraphernalia that goes with that . and i also cycle , by the that. and i also cycle, by the way. but i do feel that there is an attack on motorists and a lot of it feels to me, by the way, like it's a bit of control . so like it's a bit of control. so many people in my mind anyway seem to be a little bit too power hungry. and the prospect of to tell somebody, of being able to tell somebody, no, actually you cannot go down that street anymore is too good to pass up for. some people run, say is he's been in touch. well my view is saying to him all of this stuff when it comes to curtailing, driving, etc. feels a bit of a moneymaking scheme. i've got to say, i don't disagree with you on that concept at all. i've got to take a break. when i come back,
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a quick break. when i come back, i'll have some of your thoughts on those last few topics. but i also i want to ask about the also i want to ask you about the channel crossings, the charities that seem to involved that seem to be involved these days. think they days. do you think they are helping or helping the situation or hindering ? give me your hindering it? give me your thoughts and i'll see you into .
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hi there , michelle dewberry. and hi there, michelle dewberry. and i'm keeping you company until 7:00 this evening alongside . me 7:00 this evening alongside. me i've got lord daniel moyle and the conservative pair in the house of lords and laurie leybourne, who is a policy researcher we've just been talking about cars, low traffic , neighbourhoods and all the rest of it. and in the break lorry was just saying would we support road charges ? oh no, no, support road charges? oh no, no, i would argue for i was just asking your opinion on no. would
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you just get a little bit tired of all, you know, all of this stuff , this i mean, you'll be, stuff, this i mean, you'll be, you'll be right onto it but all of this kind of zebra, you know, all of these are going to be penalties. but that is life all the time to get to net zero. i mean, i'm sure it'll be right real straight, but what i put when congestion right and air pollution which we do have lots of evidence about how do we solve those problems ? you get on solve those problems? you get on your bike, go over to china, go over to india and on a wet with those congestion, rather than doing here congestion a little bit extreme. just congestion doesn't over china . an doesn't come over from china. an air hasn't wafted over air pollution hasn't wafted over from china. these are all according to daniel used to work in sector . according to daniel used to work in sector. he's saying the in this sector. he's saying the air pollution the it's air pollution the way it's measured, etc. isn't really the issue that it's been that we have very i'm saying we have very limited evidence and people don't want the evidence because it would actually spoil them in that wonderful green . get us that wonderful green. get us back to a primitive state, 15
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minute city policy . don't want minute city policy. don't want air pollution outside my kids primary school byker school . primary school byker school. yeah, more than just school . yeah, more than just school. yeah. people say, well, look at school. he walked in school. i don't i don't have kids yet, but if i had kids i wouldn't. but i would i would want to make sure that the wider roads have not got the level of congestion, air pollution know pollution that they do. we know because there evidence that because there is evidence that that the case many cities that is the case in many cities that is the case in many cities that pollution around school. that pollution is around school. the zero compensation, the the net zero compensation, the air pollution , taxes, air pollution, the taxes, all the rest it, well, rumble on the rest of it, well, rumble on and on. so i going to move and on. so i am going to move things on because at the things on because look at the time when it flies, doesn't time if when it flies, doesn't it, when having the it, when you're having fun, the charities in place to charities that are in place to try this kind of try and help this whole kind of situation the charity the situation about the charity the charity crossings think channel crossings they helping or crossings are they helping or hindering this whole process the french of accused with these charities of constantly frustrating their to intercept channel migrants. i'll start with you on this one actually laurie what do you make to the
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helping hindering or what? i mean, i think that that the accusation here is the charities that are trying to engage in humanitarian support for migrants have caused some kind of problem and upset is very difficult to comment on the case because it said problem between the french government and the charity. if we're trying to blow this up to a bigger thing of saying that there are loads and loads of charities for striking the ability for us to deal with migrant crossings, i'm a bit sceptical about is making a bigger story of this. the law is sceptical . the bigger story is sceptical. the bigger story is that the government is failing to have a proper that means its handung to have a proper that means its handling the people that do get into the uk and processing those claims and then safe claims and then giving safe routes the situation routes to handle the situation of are then trying to get of people are then trying to get into daniel your into the uk. daniel your thoughts like lorry? i thoughts about like lorry? i don't know the facts about this particular case the french say and they wouldn't say it lightly, they're causing lightly, but they're causing problem. they're not problem. they say they're not i'm not they're the ground i'm not they're on the ground and can't say who's right in
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and i can't say who's right in that. but the french sound as though they have point and though they have a point and they're asking the government to do about i don't do something about it. i don't know we funding these know why we funding these charities . apparently charities. apparently the british funding british government is funding some them. why? well, some of some of them. why? well, some of these they? but the these why are they? but the truth these ngos out there, truth is, these ngos out there, the reason they're there, the reason they're out there, i'm of the volunteers i'm sure some of the volunteers are well—meaning are genuinely nice, well—meaning people. who people. but the people who driving these charities have an agenda. it's not just about agenda. and it's not just about helping who need. the helping who are in need. the plenty of people in this plenty of people in need in this country. it's not about helping people are need. it's people who are in need. it's because they have a particular vision world in vision of a borderless world in which want which most people in this country don't accept. and they actually to change our they actually want to change our country. and they're not asking about what lengths about it now, what lengths they're to in france to they're going to in france to achieve their objective. i can't comment on this. i say you have to rely on me. we had two sides of a story, but most people do not want this. and i think the best hope they would give many of people, not those of these people, not those fleeing genuine war and persecution, come , persecution, but those come, come, primarily come, coming, but primarily economic reasons is to say you
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really should go home because there are no opportunities for here. you don't want you you you know, we have we let people in. we let people into a genuine refugees, but we're not going to let human to each go home once you make to it all, make your own country strong . make your own country strong. make your own country strong. make your own country strong. chance would be a fun thing, wouldn't it, for this country to be made strong? many would say that we're going in opposite in the complete opposite direction comes to that. direction when it comes to that. steve he is steve has said that he is a businessman. he would love it if all the roads were pedestrianised because he owns a bar outside space, bar and the outside space, he says, help economy. he says, would help the economy. he goes say that the need goes on to say that the need pubuc goes on to say that the need public pay it and he gets public pay for it and he gets free, rent free. of course he'd love well, he says there's love it. well, he says there's no need for cars in town parking. ride is the way forward. steve, have ever forward. steve, have you ever tried to on park rides with tried to get on park rides with you back pram, with you back with your pram, with your kids , the of it? your kids, all the rest of it? i'm sure it would benefit your profit let's be honest. profit margins. let's be honest. but would it convenient for but would it be convenient for the rest of us? you tell me, bob says quite simply , michel,
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says quite simply, michel, charity begins at home. lots of you are saying that you feel that many charities mean well, but they're actually now encouraging what is ultimately illegal activities . keith, you illegal activities. keith, you have that exact same view as well. you're saying that many of these charities seem to be hindering while you say that you accept that actually their intentions perhaps may be good . intentions perhaps may be good. lots of you kind of pushing back against this whole kind of net zero thing many people are saying that the some of the obsessions and the policies and the ambitions when it comes to this net zero seem to be money making . do this net zero seem to be money making. do you this net zero seem to be money making . do you agree with that? making. do you agree with that? i suspect that lorry would definitely not and was making money from low traffic neighbourhoods . you say no one's neighbourhoods. you say no one's making money from low traffic. what about what about steve. e was just saying that he loves these things , he can make it these things, he can make it think and the council i suspects if you've got low traffic if you've got a low traffic neighbour my bottom dollar neighbour i bet my bottom dollar you've that being
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you've got fines that are being made out these low traffic made out for these low traffic neighbourhoods. been neighbourhoods. and i've been making fortune making this huge village fortune anywhere me where you anywhere you tell me where you stand on it, that all i have time for. thank you, gents. thank you to at home. have thank you to you at home. have a fantastic and i'll you fantastic night and i'll see you tomorrow . hello fantastic night and i'll see you tomorrow. hello again. it's aidan mcgivern here from the met office drive . for many of us office drive. for many of us over the next 24 hours, with light winds and with clear spells overnight as well, we had such a frost by dawn on friday. high pressure is extending its influence from the west . and influence from the west. and under this ridge of high pressure , we're going to see pressure, we're going to see clear spells and light winds, especially for scotland and northern ireland overnight. that's where the frosty conditions meanwhile conditions will be. meanwhile for eastern england, there will be further showers in be further showers coming in from sea and one or from the north sea and one or two of those will reach the pennines into the midlands, east anglia southeast times anglia in the southeast at times overnight, before eventually fading away. of as well fading away. areas of as well for eastern and southern areas. so mostly frost free towards the southeast, although that's actual ground frost or frost in your first thing be your cars, first thing can be ruled out more extensive
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ruled out the more extensive frost across scotland and frost likely across scotland and northern ireland, minus one minus celsius, perhaps lower minus two celsius, perhaps lower in and some dense in some spots. and some dense fog, especially for northern ireland fog will actually lift as this area of cloud to the northwest moves into northern ireland and western scotland , ireland and western scotland, bringing some patchy rain for the western isles by the afternoon and increased breeze 6 to 8 celsius. typical though across the uk and for much of england, wales, southern and eastern scotland . a bright fine eastern scotland. a bright fine afternoon to come with sunny spells and actually under clear skies across the north wales overnight into the start of the weekend. what's going to be another frosty one with some dense fog patches forming in the south? meanwhile area of rain across scotland and northern ireland pushes into northern england by the start of the weekend. but it really diminishes into light and patchy outbreaks of rain with this cloud tending to keep things frost free first thing this weekend, but also fairly grey across the central of the uk. so
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for northern england , parts of for northern england, parts of wales, the midlands, generally cloudy skies, not much rain associated with that cloud though by that stage it looks largely dry across the uk and the best of any brighter weather will be in the south and the far
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it's thursday night and this is by raj atwal . long from the by raj atwal. long from the drawing . please welcome your drawing. please welcome your host , nigel drawing. please welcome your host, nigel ferrer. good evening . karen crowley . hello, prempeh. . karen crowley. hello, prempeh. can we still we'll be talking about that . we're careful. we'll about that. we're careful. we'll be asking all of the tories
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down. i will


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