tv ABC News Special Alec Baldwin Unscripted ABC December 2, 2021 8:00pm-9:05pm PST
banking feels good. chase. make more of what's yours. the gun goes off. >> tonight, the movie star who held that gun. >> hollywood star alec baldwin firing a prop gun -- >> killed the director of photography, injured the director. >> alec baldwin, speaking exclusively for the first time, after that fatal shooting, only to george stephanopoulos. >> the big question, and the one you must have asked yourself a thousand times, is how could this have happened? >> 911 what's your emergency? >> we have two injuries from a movie gun shot we need help immediately. >> the interview, his answers, what everyone's been waiting for. >> there's only one question to be resolved, only one, and that is where did the live round come from? >> do you believe the set was sabotaged? >> a movie set of a church, for a film called "rust", now surrounded by crime scene tape. >> it wasn't in the script for the trigger to be pulled? >> well the trigger wasn't
pulled. i didn't pull the trigger. >> why did you choose in your 40 years to not to check the gun yourself? >> and what of halyna hutchins, the woman whose life was taken? >> she was someone who was loved by everyone who worked with liked by everyone and admired -- >> now, alec baldwin, nothing off limits. >> you described it as a one in a trillion shot. and the gun was in your hand. do you feel guilt? >> are we ready? phones off? >> good. >> alec, thank you for doing this. you -- you haven't said much in public since that tragic accident. why -- why speak out now? >> well, i think that -- there's a criminal investigation that
could be a while. there's all kinds of civil litigation. and i thought there were a number of misconceptions, most of it from sources i really wouldn't concern myself about, but a couple that i did concern myself about where there were these authoritative statements about this is what happened. the sheriff's department hasn't even released a report to the d.a. yet. and the reason i wanted to sit down with you is 'cause i really feel like i can't wait for that process to end in february, march. i mean, i'm not asking them to speed it up for my benefit, that's ridiculous. but i am saying that they're gonna do what they need to do, and i wanted to come to talk to you to say that i would go to any lengths to undo what happened. i would go to any lengths to undo what happened. i think the big question -- and the one you must have asked yourself a thousand times. "how could this have happened?" >> well, there's two things i want to say about that. one is that, when i talk about this, my concern is that i
don't sound like i'm the victim. because there is a victim. there's a woman who died and my friend got shot. he's my friend. and she was a new friend. i met her when we worked together on the -- some of the mapping out of what we were gonna do on the film, which, you know, in the movie terms, if you go make a movie with scorsese, you and the d.p. don't sit down. they're -- they solicit your ideas of how to make the film, you know what i mean? in the case of halyna, we sat down collaboratively and talked a lot about what we wanted to do in that precious amount of time we had. but -- i -- i -- i want to make sure that i don't come across like i'm the victim 'cause we have two victims here. and the second thing is is that all of what happened on that day leading up to this event was precipitated on one idea and that is that halyna and i had something profound in common. and that is we both assumed the gun was empty. other than those dummy rounds. >> i want to get into more
detail on the day in a minute but let's take a step back. what was it that drew you to this project in the first place, to rust? >> i had worked on a project with joel before. >> joel souza, the director -- >> souza, right. he di -- he did this movie "crown vic" that i produced with him and he said i want to send you this. i said i love it. >> "rust", a low budget western tells the story of an aging outlaw on the run with his young grandson, baldwin, the film's star is also one of the producers. >> and -- very excited. very, very -- so excited that we finally got this made, because every independent film has many false starts, you know what i mean. when it finally goes, you feel like a plane, when you finally get some lift under your wings, it's very gratifying. i am a purely creative my authorities as a producer
are casting and script, which are actually married to the role of being a lead actor in a film. >> so you're not the kind of producer who's looking at the line item of each budget, do you -- >> no. no, no, no, no, no. there -- there do -- there are basically two types of producers who are - - who are really in charge of production. people that raise the money and the people who hire other -- and people who spend the money. i don't hire anybody on the crew. >> not even the cinematographer, no one? >> no, no. but what we -- he will apprise me of what he is doing. i have every email from this -- and he'll say to me, "i got halyna hutchins to be the d.p." i said, "how do you feel about that? are you excited?" "i'm very excited. she's wonderful." >> what did you know about halyna hutchins before she started working on this? >> n -- i knew nothing about her until joel said to me, "i got her." now, again, in the ten years or so that i've seen the glass ceiling truly be broken for women in the film business -- she was fantastic. >> halyna hutchens, the talented cinematographer praised by many in the industry, was a trailblazer in the field historically dominated by men. the ukrainian born cinematographer quickly gelled with baldwin. and -- but the people who watched the dailies said that her work was beautiful. she was someone who was -- loved
by everyone who worked with, and liked by everyone who worked with, and admired -- sorry. and admired by everybody who -- who worked with her. >> "rust"'s 21-day production began filming on october 6th at the bonanza creek ranch, just outside sante fe, new mexico. the ranch has long been a favorite location for filming westerns. >> we need a place to lay low. >> the day that i flew there, they had been shooting for a week already, i come the following week on the 11th. that night of the 11th, i had dinner with halyna and joel. and we talked about some of the compositions i was thinking of to -- >> that was the first time you met? >> first time i met halyna, yeah. >> what was your first
impression? >> when i met her, i knew she had that spark. i knew she had that flint to her, that she was gonna get that day's work done and get the shots that she wanted. she was very focused. >> she had a vision for the film -- >> she was very focused. we had a discussion about compositions of shots in which you were shooting these beautiful tableaus of the west, she had that intensity. every day you went to work, she would say, "good morning. how are you? how was your evening?" boom. it was small talk, go. we weren't gonna hang out and -- and chit chat or whatever. she knew that the clock was the enemy and we have to move forward. >> once on set, baldwin posts this video. >> i want to say i look at myself. the mirror at reflection i'm kind of appalled. we're here shooting a film. we start tomorrow and no i'm not playing santa claus. >> on the 12th i had a safety demonstration with hannah reed the armorer.
>> 24-year-old hannah gutierrez reed, seen here in photos by the dailymail.com, was hired as the film's armorer, in charge of all weapons on set. the daughter of a famous hollywood armorer, "rust" was only her second film in this role. she spoke to the "voices of the west" podcast about working as lead armorer for her first film, before "rust." >> i was really nervous about it at first and i almost didn't take the job because i wasn't sure if i was ready, but doing it, it went really smoothly. >> we spent an hour and a half shooting the pistol, her giving me all her safety instructions -- >> did you think she was up to the job? >> i assumed because she was there and she was hired she was -- she was up for the job. >> and nothing she did raised any red flags with you? >> no. >> the -- this -- this training course you do. what did she tell you? >> she'd say things like, "remember, this is -- this is blank round. so you have to create the discharge yourself 'cause there's no projectile. so if you shot the gun, you go
"bang." when we roll the camera you gotta go bang and have the gun -- the gun will snap back. you have to create that." she would give you little tips about firing. and she'd say to you, "you know -- when we're done, point the gun down. when we're done, you give the gun to me or to halls. only those two people." >> dave halls was "rust"'s assistant director, also known as the first a.d., seen here in his imdb photo responsible for keeping the production on schedule. >> sometimes we would be on a set that was a very, very cramped set. and they wanted people in that room on an as-needed basis. if i'm -- holding the gun and they say, "cut," i then hand the gun to halls if she's not there. >> yeah, why halls, not hannah? some people have said that only the armorer should be handling the -- >> no, no, no, no, no. that -- that's -- that's in -- inaccurate. meaning in -- in -- in the protocols of the business, meaning -- hannah's supposed to hand me the gun. hannah -- to hand me gun 99% of the time, no, what -- whatever, the -- the preponderance of the time. but when we would say, "cut," if hannah was away from the set, i would hand halls the gun.
>> hannah guiterez reed had a dual role on set. armorer and she was also the assistant prop master for the film. >> one of things her attorney has said is that she was hired for two positions on the film, and therefore was stretched in an inappropriate way. did she raise any of those concerns with you? >> no, i assume that everyone who's shooting a lower-budget film is stretched, myself included. and i -- i -- i got no complaints from her or the prop department. i'm not sitting there when i'm getting dressed and ready to go do a scene saying, "oh, my god, the prop woman seemed very harried today." you know, i didn't get a sense of that from -- from any of the -- the -- the people on the film. the first time i heard that there was any problem with anybody -- in the crew of the film was when luper said, "well, we have some issues here." >> lane luper, the first camera assistant, would email production managers a resignation letter later that night citing safety concerns.
during the filming of gunfights on this job things are often played very fast and loose. so far there have been two accidental weapons discharges. he also wrote about concerns about "reasonable rest" and "housing" for local crew with long commutes to set. >> when he quit -- now, the day before that happened, we wrapped. and he came up to me and he said, "thank you for the position you've taken on behalf of iatse and the union on social media." i said, "my pleasure." >> this photo, posted by halyna, showed the cast and crew in solidarity with iatse, the international alliance of theatrical stage employees, which had been on the verge of a strike. and alec posted this on instagram. >> i want to state to the people in iatse do what you need to do. you want to go on strike, go on strike, 'cause i'll tell you about the executives. they don't give a [ bleep ] about you. he said, "because we have some issues here." i said, "such as?" and he said, "my men need a better hotel room." there was no mention of safety issues. >> he didn't say anything about the accidental discharges --
>> he did -- >> -- on set? >> he didn't say anything about anything other -- he goes, "my men need better hotel rooms." i said, "well, we're leaving. we're wrapping. will you be here tomorrow?" he said, "yes." because what i was about to do, which i've done on any number of films and tv projects, was to give more of the -- my salary back to the production to pay for x. and i was about to say to him, "let me know what it would be to b and b you guys in a house that's closer to the lo -- how we can address your problem. i will be happy to contribute to -- to that." the next day, they were gone. >> so you had no sense from anyone on the set that people had been stretched to the point where safety was compromised. >> no. no. i never heard one word about that, none, none. >> "rust" producers told abc news "mr. luper's allegations around budget and safety are patently false, which is not surprising considering his job was to be a camera operator, and he had absolutely nothing to do with, or knowledge of, safety protocols or budgets. safety is always the number one
priority on our films." >> when people say -- "cutting costs," i don't say this with any judgment or any cynicism. spielberg wants to save money. tom cruise wants to save money. everybody who makes movies has a responsibility not to be -- reckless and careless with the money that you're given. now th -- those are men who make movies that cost $205 million. and i'm making movies that cost $5 million or thereabouts -- >> the question, though, is were costs being cut at the expense of safety and security? >> well, i -- in -- in m -- in my opinion, no because i did not -- now, i did not observe any safety or security issues at all in the time i was there. >> back to in person at the office. blimey, it's exhausting. >> that morning luper and six other crew members walked off the set. filming continued with a replacement camera crew. scene 118 in the church was
slated for after lunch. >> everybody there was having a positive experience. people who are watching the show, people who -- back home, you have no idea how unique an environment a motion picture set is. it's kind of -- there's an instant familiarity. the amount of care -- these are people who are professionals who have really good jobs in a field they love. and i looked at all these people and -- and i see how hard they work. they're so hard working, and they're so conscientious. and you're around people -- and you're part of one of the great collabortive processes in the world, movie making. everyone moving like a watch to get everything done. and -- and when you kind of mi -- i don't make that many movies anymore 'cause movie making demanded that i travel. and i didn't wanna leave my family. all these movies i made, i stayed home. i didn't wanna go -- if i went away, i went away for a week. to leave my family for four
weeks and go shoot this movie th -- shoot this movie, that was a big deal. and i sat there on that pew, and so help me god, i sat on that pew right before they called lunch -- said, "this movie has made me love making movies again." 'cause i used to love to make movies, i did. you know, i worked with people once -- i was gonna do the movie "the edge", and -- they called me and said they got tony hopkins to do the film. and i started sobbing. i just -- i just started sobbing 'cause i thought, oh god, that meant i'm gonna have a chance to work with this guy. when they cast me in "it's complicated" with meryl, i thought, "i'm gonna get to go make a movie with her." y -- you know -- i'm sorry. you know, people, they have their dreams.
no matter how old you are, you have your dreams of people you wanna work with. and this movie made me love making movies again. i really thought we were onto something. >> next -- >> she goes down, and i say to myself, "did she faint?" ever notice how stiff clothes can feel rough on your skin? it's because they rub against you creating friction. and your clothes rub against you all day. for softer clothes that are gentle on your skin, try downy free & gentle. just pour into the rinse dispenser and downy will soften your clothes without dyes or perfumes. the towel washed with downy is softer, fluffier, and gentler on your skin. try downy free & gentle. recognized by the national psoriasis foundation >> it was the 12th day of their like pulsing, electric shocks, sharp, stabbing pains,
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21-day shoot. >> that day i did exactly what i've done everyday on that movie. >> baldwin was preparing for his next scene, a sootout inside this wooden church. >> set the scene right before that happened. you're sitting in a church pew in the church. >> right. >> what's the scene supposed to be? >> the scene is the two, two guys are there. two have got me, uh you know, cornered and they think i'm shot pretty bad, and i'm kind of wilting. and they -- they have a gun, and then a sound outside distracts them. and i then draw the gun -- at cross-draw out of my holster, pull the gun up like that, and start to cock the pistol. cut. i'm handed a gun, and someone declares, they say, "this is a cold gun." >> dave hall? >> the first a.d. >> in my years on the sets of film, "hot gun," meant that there was a charge in there and, "cold gun," meant there was nothing in there. and when he's saying, "this -- this is a cold gun," what he's saying to everybody on the set
is, "you can relax, the gun is empty." >> that's what, "cold gun," means? >> well, "cold gun," means there's no charge in there. there could be dummy rounds. a dummy round looks like a real bullet, but is completely inert. it contains no explosive charge. >> and you were rehearsing that scene. was it an actual rehearsal? there's some disagreement about that, whether it was a formal rehearsal at that time. >> this was a marking rehearsal, she's standing next to the camera. she's like this. you're me. she's got a monitor here. she takes a monitor his -- that is his monitor, the operator, and turns it toward her, it swivels. and she says to me, "okay, hold the gun lower. go to your right. okay right there. alright do that. now show it a little bit lower." and she's getting me to position the gun. eerything is her direction. she's guiding me through how she wants me to, hold the gun for this angle. and i draw the gun out, and i find a mark. i draw the gun out, "cut." and what's really urgent is the gun wasn't meant to be fired in
that angle. >> so, if you're shooting directly into the camera lens you're not aiming -- >> i'm not shooting into the camera lens; i'm shooting just off. >> just off. >> right, in her direction. >> i'm holding the gun where she told me to hold it, which ended up being aimed right below her armpit, was what i was told. i don't know. this was a completely incidental shot, an angle that may not have ended up in the film at all. but we kept doing this new -- so then i said to her, "now, in this scene i'm gonna cock the gun." and i said, "do you wanna see that?" and she said yes. so i take the gun and i start to cock the gun. i'm not gonna pull the trigger. i -- i said, "do you see that?" she goes, "well, just cheat it down and tilt it down a little bit like that." and i cock the gun, i go, "can you see that? can you see that? can you see that?" and she says, and then i let go of the hammer of the gun, and the gun goes off. i let go of the hammer of the gun, the gun goes off. >> at the moment. >> that was the moment the gun went off, yeah. that was the moment the gun went off. >> it wasn't in the script for the trigger to be pulled. >> well, the trigger wasn't pulled. i didn't pull the trigger, >> so you never pulled the trigger? >> no, no, no, no, no. i would never point a gun at anyone and pull a trigger at them. never. never. that was the training that i had.
you don't point a gun at somebody and -- and pull the trigger. on day one of my instruction in this business, people said to me, "never take the gun and go, 'click, click, click,click, click,' because you didn't -- even though it's incremental, you damage the firing pin on the gun if you do that. don't do that." >> and hall's attorney telling abc news that he was watching and agrees that alec baldwin did not pull the trigger and that his finger was outside the trigger guard. >> so you have this colt .45, you just pulled -- >> the hammer as far back as i could without cocking the actual gun. >> and you're holding onto the hammer? >> i'm just showing. i go, "how 'bout that? does that work? you see that? do you see that?" and then she goes, "yeah, that's good." i let go of the hammer, bang. the gun goes off. everyone is horrified. they're shocked. it's loud. they don't have their earplugs in. no one was -- the gun was supposed to be empty. i was told i was handed an empty gun. if they were cosmetic rounds, nothing with a charge at all, a flash round, nothing. she goes down, i thought to myself, "did she faint?"
the notion that there was a live round in that gun did not dawn on me 'till probably 45 minutes to an hour later. > 45 minutes to an hour. >> well, she's laying there and i go, "did she hit by wadding? was there a blank?" sometimes those blank rounds have a wadding inside that packs, it's like a cloth that packs the gunpowder in. sometimes wadding comes out, it can hit people, and it could feel like a little bit of a poke. but no one could understand, "did she have a heart attack?" because remember the idea that someone put a live bullet in the gun was not even in reality. >> did you go up to her? >> i went up to her and then we were immediately, we were told to get outta the building. we were forced to get outta the building. the medics came in. i mean, i stood over her for 60 seconds as she just laid there, kind of in shock. >> was she conscious? >> my recollection is yes. >> 911, what's the location of your emergency? >> we need an ambulance out at bonanza creek ranch right now, we've had two people shot on a movie set accidentally.
>> director joel souza is also wounded, his shoulder hit by the same bullet that travelled through halyna. >> when she went down he went down, and he was screaming really loudly. and i thought, why is he, what happened? >> so was it loaded with a real bullet or -- >> we don't -- i don't -- i cannot tell you that. >> okay. >> we have two injuries from a movie gun shot. >> okay, we're getting them out there already, just stay on the phone with me. >> thanks. >> within 15 minutes or 20 minutes after that the police arrived and took the church set, and put the crime tape around it, the yellow tape, and forced us all to the perimeters of the parking area where we sat and waited. she was in the church and she was not taken outta the church for quite a while. >> in the aftermath there was chaos and confusion. >> but nobody told you what happened? >> no. no. >> did you know? >> wasn't until i was in the police station hours later, i mean, it was like seeing aliens. it was -- it was utter disbelief
over the idea. it was unacceptable, the idea that it was a live round. and finally one of the police officers at the conclusion of my interview- i was there for, like, an hour and a half or so. she takes her phone and she slides it across to me. she says, "that's what came out of joel's shoulder, a .45 caliber slug." it was a real bullet. >> had you known that joel had been hit? >> no one had any idea until that police officer -- that sheriff's officer said to me, "this is the slug. .45 caliber slug they took out of joel's arm." and then the kind of insanity inducing agony of thinking that someone put a live bullet in the gun.
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>> tonight, breaking news -- >> a fatal shooting on the set of alec baldwin's new movie in new mexico. >> something went horribly wrong here in santa fe. >> we've all seen that picture of you, off the set, in that hour or so after the gun went off. what were you doing? what was going through your mind?
>> at the end of -- she was laying there, and she was there for a while. i was amazed at how long they didn't get her in a car and get her out, but they waited and a helicopter came. and by the time the helicopter took off with her, and -- i mean, literally lifted off -- we were all glued to that process outside. when she finally left, i don't know how long it was she was there. 30 minutes, 40 minutes. it was -- it seemed like a very long time. but they kept saying, "oh, she's stable." like, nobody -- just as you disbelieved that there was a live round in the gun, you disbelieved that this was gonna be a fatal accident. >> so you didn't know exactly how serious it was? >> at the very end of my interview with the sheriff's department, they said to me, "we regret to tell you that she didn't make it. she died." they told me right then and there. and that's when i went in the parking lot and called my wife to talk to my wife. >> shock and grief. halyna's husband, matthew,
posting a tribute to halyna. "halyna inspired us all with her passion and vision, and her legacy is too meaningful to encapsulate in words. our loss is enormous." >> when this happened, her husband comes to town, her husband, matthew. and i met with him and their son. and he was as kind as you could be. >> what can you possibly say to him? >> the -- i didn't know what to say. he hugged. and he goes -- he goes like, "i suppose you and i are gonna go through this together," he said. and i thought, "well, not as much as you are." you know, and his little boy there who's 9 years old. i have six kids now. i have my older daughter, ireland. of the six kids that hilaria and i have, my oldest is 8. i have a 9-month-old baby. and i think to myself, "this little boy doesn't have a mother anymore."
and i know that in my life, i'm with my kids. and i'm doing quite well with my kids. my kids and i are havin' a great time, right until my wife walks in the room. and then i become invisible. my kids all go and they jump on top of their mother. and this boy doesn't have a mother anymore. and there's nothing we can do to bring her back. and i told him, i said, "i -- don't know what to say. i don't know how to convey to you how sorry i am, and how i'm willing to do anything i can to cooperate." >> in the aftermath of the shooting, a torrent of criticism. >> the first thing you do when you pick up that gun is make sure it's never pointed at anybody. >> he should've know that an a.d. handing you a gun and saying that it's cold isn't the same as several people showing you an empty gun. >> if i were holding the gun, i
would have checked it. wouldn't you? >> people said to me -- i mean, i got countless people online saying, "you -- you idiot. you never point a gun at someone." well, unless you're told it's empty, and it's the director of photography who's instructing you on the angle for a shot we're gonna do. and she and i had this thing in common where we both thought it was empty, and it wasn't. and that's not her responsibility. that's not my responsibility. whose responsibility it is remains to be seen. but i do -- >> yeah, well, there are some who say you're never supposed to point a gun on anyone on a set no matter what. >> unless the person is the cinematographer who's directing me at where to point the gun for her camera angle. that's exactly what happened. that day, i did exactly what i've done every day of -- on that movie. >> which is what? >> which is that there's an armorer there, and that word is new to me in the years i've been in this business. >> what did you call it?
>> it was a prop guy or woman. and the prop person would come and sometimes they would insist on demonstrating for you and the camera crew. they take the gun, if it was a contemporary gun. they'd show you the chamber. they'd show you the clip. they'd say, "the gun is cold." and you look at it and go, "thank you." and in the 40 years -- >> sometimes that would happen? not all the time? >> well, but -- no. no, sometimes they wouldn't demonstrate to me. some insisted on demonstrating. they would do the demonstration for everybody there right before we rolled the camera or rehearsed. then there were others who they didn't do that because i trusted them to do the job. and again, this is not just me pointing a gun at somebody else, people pointing guns at me. i've gotten shot and killed in films before where people had to shoot a flash round at me, and i trusted them to do their job. and in the 40 years i've been in this business, all the way up until that day, i never had a problem. >> how many times do you think you handled a gun in those 40 years? >> oh -- i don't know. i don't know. what amazes me is how many bullets -- how many rounds of
bullets do you believe have been fired on the sets of movies and tv shows in the last 75 years? >> no idea. >> right. it could even be in the -- could even be above a billion. you've had hundreds and hundreds of millions of bullets fired on the sets of films and tv shows, and four or five people were killed. now, those deaths are -- tragic and abhorrent. and believe me, i would do anything in my power -- i would do anything in my power to undo what was done. i don't know how that bullet arrived in that gun. i don't know. but i'm all for doing anything that will take us to a place where we're - - this is less likely to happen again. >> every single time i'm handed a gun on a set marc, every time, they had me a gun, i look at it. i open it. i show it to the person i'm pointing it to. we show it to the crew. every single take, you hand it back to the armorer when you're done and you do it again. everyone does it. everybody knows. >> how -- how do you respond to actors like george clooney who say that every time they were handed a gun they checked it themselves?
>> well, there were a lot of people who felt it necessary to contribute some comment to the situation, which really didn't help the situation at all. you have your -- if your protocol is you checkin' the gun every time, well, good for you. good for you. i probably handled weapons as much as any other actor in films with an average career, again, shooting or being shot by someone. and in that time, i had a protocol. and it never let me down. >> why did you choose in your 40 years not to check the gun yourself? >> what i was taught by someone years ago was, as i said, if i took a gun and i popped a clip out of a gun or i manipulated the chamber of a gun, they would take the gun away from me and redo it. the prop person said, "don't do that." i mean, i was young. and they'd say, "one thing you would need to understand is we don't want the actor to be the last line of defense against the -- against a catastrophic breach of safety with the gun. "my job," they told me, man or woman. "my job is to make sure the gun is safe, and that i hand you the gun, and i declare the gun safe.
the crew's not relying on you to say that it's safe. they're relying on me to say that it's safe." when that person who was charged with that job handed me the weapon, i trusted them. and i never had a problem, ever. >> and this was from the beginning of your career? >> from day one. there's one person that's supposed to make sure that what in the gun is right and that it's -- what's wrong is not in the gun. one person has that responsibility to maintain the gun. and -- >> what is the actor's responsibility? >> i guess that's a tough question because the actor's responsibility going this day forward is very different than it was the day before that. yeah, now i can't -- first of all, i can't imagine i'd ever do a movie that had a gun in it again. and i can't. when you say, "what is the actor's responsibility?" the actor's responsibility is to do what the prop armorer tells them to do. and we did not have a problem. i mean, the -- i understand there was an accidental discharge at one point on the
set of a blank round. but we did not have a problem, for me, until that day. and i mean, everything gets slowed down zapruder film-esque here. and the issue with that is there's only one question to be resolved. only one. and that is, "where did the live round come from?" for people living with h-i-v, keep being you. and ask your doctor about biktarvy. biktarvy is a complete, one-pill, once-a-day treatment used for h-i-v in certain adults. it's not a cure, but with one small pill, biktarvy fights h-i-v to help you get to and stay undetectable. that's when the amount of virus is so low it cannot be measured by a lab test. research shows people who take h-i-v treatment every day
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>> the particulars of what happened, the particulars, most imimportantly, of how a piece of live ammunition ended up on this property -- it wasn't supposed to be on the property. it wasn't supposed to be on the truck. it wasn't supposed to be in the kit. it wasn't supposed to be in somebody's fanny pack, whether they have arm- the -- the -- a live round is not supposed to be anywhere near the set. >> how did a real bullet get on that set. >> i don't -- that -- that -- that -- but i'm saying, that -- that -- what i'm saying is that's for a criminal investigation to solve. i have no idea. i have no idea. i take that back. i have some ideas. but that's not for me to say. i've spoken to the sheriff's department multiple times. i don't have anything to hide. you know what i mean? the -- the facts as i see them are what i've stated on the record. >> you're not worried about being charged.
>> i've been told by people in the know that it's highly unlikely that i would be charged with anything criminally. >> in the aftermath of the shooting, authorities investigating how live rounds made it onto the new mexico set, earlier this week, a search warrant executed at an albuquerque prop house owned by seth kenney, who, told detectives he was hired to supply "rust" with guns, as well as dummy rounds and blanks. >> pdq arm & prop supplied the guns, the blank ammunition and 50 dummy rounds to the show. >> he says he wasn't the film's only supplier. >> it's not a possibility that they came from pdq or from myself personally. when we send dummy rounds out, they get individually rattle tested before they get sent out. so if you have a box of 50, you've got to do it 50 times and then at that point, you know they're safe to send. >> baldwin says he placed his trust in hannah guiterrez reed. according to that search warrant, the young armorer told investigators she loaded five dummy rounds into baldwin's gun
before lunch and a sixth after, when the gun was retrieved from a safe. guiterrez reed's attorney has said she has no idea where the live rounds came from. he raised the possibility that someone may have deliberately mixed live rounds in a box of dummies in an act of sabotage. >> you wouldn't bring a life round on the set. second of all, why would you place that in a round of dummies other than to try to cause some incident on the set? >> her attorney has said he believes the set was sabotaged. do you believe the set was sabotaged? >> well, i didn't believe that halyna was shot and found out that she was shot with a live bullet. so there are things that i never imagined could happen which turned out to have happened. do i believe that -- the set was sabotaged? no, 'cause i can't imagine how that would have been effected.
i don't-- i don't know how somebody would have done that. i mean, in -- in -- in -- in -- in a world i was told in which one person loaded a gun, then another person picked up the gun to bring me the gun. whatever happened in that preceding us rehearsing and her being killed, whatever happened -- i don't know. but when he made those claims, i thought, "that's -- that's a big swing." that's a -- that's an enormous charge to make, that someone came and did something for what purpose? to attack who? to discredit who? to harm me, the production? i mean, tha -- that you -- means, motive, and opportunity, you know? what -- what was their motive in doing that, if somebody did that? it's overwhelmingly likely that it was an accident, you know? >> the santa fe district attorney leading the investigation has said she does not believe sabotage is a possibility. >> i know that some defense attorneys have come up with conspiracy theories and have used the word 'sabotage.' we do not have any proof. according to a search warrant,
assistant director david halls seen in this imdb photo -- told investigators guiterrez reed opened the firearm used by baldwin, but halls could only remember seeing "three rounds" and that "he should have checked all of them, but didn't, and couldn't recall if guiterrez reed spun the drum." halls also told investigators he didn't know there were any live rounds in the firearm. but his attorney has said it wasn't his responsibility to confirm whether the gun was loaded. >> let me just say something else but i don't want to see anybody suffer unnecessarily. i feel terrible what's happened to hannah. i do. i feel horrible what happened to halls. i do. i mean -- i mean, this is something where -- i mean, as far as i'm concerned someone put-- we're-- the-- the-- the investigation's going to find out. but someone put a live bullet in a gun, a bullet that wasn't even supposed to be on the property. i hope that the sheriff's department doesn't give up on, that -- that -- that they follow this to the ends of the earth. where did that bullet come from?
somebody brought live rounds, plural, onto the set of the film. and one of them ended up in that gun. and if the -- and if the bullets didn't come on the property, we wouldn't be having this conversation. now at the same time, i -- i -- i don't want to see hannah suffer and halls suffer and all these people suffer the agony of having to face what they're responsible for, what they did. it makes me sick because, you know, i myself-- i mean, i -- i -- i'm married. i got six kids. i want to just live my life in peace. and i've had all these people say-- you know, say, "you're a murderer. and you didn't do this. and you didn't do that. it's been very tough. >> one of your brothers, daniel, suggested that you've also become a target for your political views. do you agree with that? >> well, i don't-- i don't think that anybody has said anything about-- and has -- has used this as an opportunity other than people you would fully expect to have done that. >> like president trump? >> the former president of the united states said that -- that
i'm -- a wacko or whatever, and i probably shot her and killed her on purpose. >> or loaded the gun. he said that i did it deliberately. he said, "he killed her deliberately." and i thought to myself that things can't get more surreal, here is the former president of the united states making a comment on this tragic situation, which also brings me to two civil suits that were filed which i find odd because those two people are lunging toward making sure their suits are filed before the husband files his suit? they couldn't wait until matthew, on behalf of his son, filed his suit first. >> so you expect matthew to file a suit? >> oh, but how could it be otherwise? his wife-- his wife was killed as a result of someone's -- i mean, i don't wanna say negligence, it's not for me to use that word. that's a legal term. but, you know, something happened here that resulted in his wife's death. he's entitled to something, as far as i'm concerned. i would be stunned if matthew on behalf of his son did not file some kinda civil suit against -- the production with its insurers
and so forth like that. but -- >> likely to name you -- >> well -- >> as a producer? >> well, i think that all the producers will be named. it remains to be seen which producers had the responsibility for hiring the people involved. and you're convinced matthew doesn't blame you in any way for halyna's death? >> i-- i can't speak for matthew. i can't. i can't. >> have you -- >> when i -- when i -- >> spoke -- >> met with him, he was-- he was there. we went to dinner with his son. we went to the memorial service together. the crew had a little memorial service for her before we left, which was very beautiful and very simple. and-- i've communicated with him a couple times since then. but i do believe he's -- gone off in a direction where he's not gonna communicate with people at the advice of his lawyer right now. >> i tried to save her life. >> serge svetnoy, the film's chief of lighting filing the first civil lawsuit against the production company, and the crew members who officials say handled the gun, including alec baldwin, alleging they "failed to implement appropriate safety
standards and measures on the rust movie production." the second civil suit from script supervisor mamie mitchell also alleging there warning signs of the "dangerous conditions that existed" on set. >> the attorneys for one of the-- for script supervisor mamie mitchell who filed one of the suits said, "mr. baldwin chose to play russian roulette when he fired a gun without checking it and without having the armorer do so in his presence. his behavior and that of the producers on rust was reckless. >> right. >> how do you respond? >> there are two people that filed civil suits, so far. and one of them walked up to me outside the church probably within 15 or 20 minutes of the event itself and put their hand on me and said, "you realize that you have no responsibility for what's happened here, don't you?" >> was this serge? >> no comment. one of those two. and now that person is suing me. now, again, they're entitled to change their mind. more importantly, they're entitled to sit down with a lawyer who will convince them to
change their mind. serge, for example, this is the only thing i'll say about someone specifically, he was her dear friend. he was a very close friend of hers. and yet, he's chosen to file his lawsuit in advance of matthew's suit, which i find. >> and there's only so much -- >> strange. >> money. >> well, if you get into settlements alone, the -- there's a pool of the insurance money, there's a c -- couple different policies. there's a pool of money that's available that is finite. and you could -- access more money somehow if you sue people individually and find them individually responsible. i just found the filing of the two lawsuits, civil lawsuits, in advance of matthew filing his lawsuit, i found that to be -- unsettling. >> serge svetnoy telling abc news he did tell baldwin what happened that day wasn't his fault but now believes differently and that the actor should have checked the gun. when we come back -- you felt shock. you felt anger. you felt sadness.
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>> in the month and half since halyna hutchins' tragic death on the set of "rust," alec baldwin says his life has become a recurring nightmare. >> i am not somebody who has a lot of vivid dreams. but i have dreams about this constantly now. i wake up constantly where -- where guns are going off in some these images have come into my mind and kept me awake at night. and i haven't slept for weeks, and i've really been struggling physically. i'm exhausted from this because i've gotta try to be there for my kids.
my family's all i have. i mean, i -- honest to god. i couldn't give a [ bleep ] about my career anymore. >> is it over? >> well, i -- well, it could be. it could be if i decide that i -- i mean, could i work? i'm gonna go make another movie in january. and i said to them, "do you wanna get out of it? do you wanna get rid of me 'cause of what happened?" they said, "no." but i say to myself, "do i wanna work much more after this? is it worth it?" >> for now, baldwin is spending much of his time focused on his family, trying to stay out of the public eye. >> my kids are in the car crying. i'm just asking you -- we sat down as a courtesy now to talk to you, now please would you just not follow us for the rest of the day? just leave us alone. >> just go home. >> we gave you everything that we could possibly give you. >> thank you, alec. >> you mentioned your kids. have you been able to talk to them about this, or are they too young? >> i had to tell my two older kids what happened, yeah. my wife and i told them what happened. 'cause they're gonna go to school and -- it's less about what kids say at school than what the parents say at school. i live in new york. i always loved living in new york because it was this -- you
were one of many people and, you know, nobody gives a [ bleep ] who you are, really, until this happens. and then you're walking down the street, you see a lot of this. someone hits somebody. they're like, "oh, there he is." you see a lot of this, with people in a coffee shop with their phone go like this. you see a lot of people behaving a certain way. >> how do you not internalize that? >> oh, i do. i do. it w -- just has made me sick. but, again, i don't want to sound like i'm a victim. i mean, again, we have two clear victims here. >> is this the worst thing that's ever happened to you? >> yes. yeah. yeah. because i -- i -- i think back and i think of what could i have done? >> your emotions are so clearly so right there on the surface. you felt shock. you felt anger. you felt sadness. >> yeah. >> do you feel guilt? >> no. no.
i feel that there is -- i -- i feel that -- that -- that -- someone is responsible for what happened, and i can't say who that is, but i know it's not me. i mean, i -- i -- honest to god, if i felt that i was responsible, i might have killed myself if i thought i was responsible. and i don't say that lightly. >> baldwin is now anxiously awaiting the outcome of the sheriff's investigation, hoping whatever it uncovers helps to ensure a tragedy like this never happens again. >> what do we come out of this learning? what do we come out of it -- what changes can be made? 'cause where you have a person -- where -- where -- as i said, this is one in a billion that someone puts a real bullet in the gun. that never happens. and the idea that a real bullet was in that gun and would come outta that gun and kill that woman, that -- that was not even in the realm of possibility. and that's the thing that they must find out, is where -- who brought bullets onto the set.
>> she's a wonderful mom and a wonderful wife and was just a wonderful soul. >> is there anything, before we go, that you'd like everyone to know about halyna? >> well -- [ sighing ] i've worked with some of the greatest cinematographers. and she was the loveliest woman, one of the loveliest women i've ever worked with. and one of the most professional in terms of her demeanor. after she died, all these statements were made by her friends, and things about her. how loved she was, and is. >> i would have been lucky to have ever done another movie with another person like that, or with her.
and i don't get to. >> and i think it's important to remember that she was as admired as she was loved. that's -- that's essential to say that, is that she's someone who people really, really thought she had a great talent. i was told i was handed an empty gun. >> who is to blame? >> why do shocking tragedies keep happening on movie sets?
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