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tv   Charlie Rose  PBS  September 9, 2013 12:00pm-1:01pm PDT

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>> rose: welcome to the program. we begin with this week's news on syria and my colleague inñi washington, al hunt. >> i think without being hyperbolic aboutñi it, this is n extraordinarily -- an extraordinary moment for the president politically. his heart niece the right place. he's approached this like the lawyer he is. he's thought through what he thinks the right thing to do is& and it's left him today, one week after secretary kerry's impassioned statement, in a verr perilous position because people on the hill in both parties think he has badly, badly mishandled this. >> rose: we continue with billy jean king, the great tennis champion and human rights advoc profile ofñi american masters nt week. >> i'm going to be 70. 40, 40, 40 we call it. the 40th anniversary of the w.t.a., the 40th anniversary of
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the prize money. so that's the 40th year anniversary and then of course russian is 40th. it'sñi my 70th birthday in november and i feel like i have one great thing left and i'm going to be working on leadership for women. >> rose: we conclude with christopher schroeder, his book is call startup rising, the entrepreneurial revolution, remaking the middle east. >> people ask me often what' going to happen in syria the next six months and i don't have the ability to have that crystal ball but what i can tell you with complete certainly is that in the next three years there will be a lot more technology in the hands of people all around the world and the ramifications of that are think are very significant. >ñ@ñ=se:ñr a conversation about syria with al hunt,ñrñi billie n king and christopher schroeder when we continue.
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captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >> good evening, i'm al hunt, cazlie rose is on assignment. president obama continued to make the case today at the g-20
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meeting in st. pex intervention in syria. butxd he faces a tough battle,ñi bothaabwz foreign leaders andçót home with congress.ñi m[svakes are huge for american politics and global security. joining me today akññ three ofçó theñr foremost journalistic experts on these matters. from new york, mark halperin, editor at large and senior political analyst for "time" magazine and here with me inçó washington, david ignatius, diplomatic columnist in for the "washington post" and jackie collins, white house reporter for the "new york times." david, let me start with you. we sawñi considerable tension at st. petersburg. it'sçó seemingly not a lot of conclusions. how is this playing out? >> well, it's añr poignant situation, two years trying to avoid taking a strong position onçó syria isi now caughtñr having said that he favors military interventionçó d support both domestically in congress and internationally at
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st. petersburg is slipping awayr heñi left st. petersburg really withlecsr in terms of international support than he had when he arrived. the french, who were initially going toñr be our military allis and join in this operation, are now saying they're not prepared to act until after the u.n. inspectors makeçó their report. there is a very small and frail coalition behind obama. i think that there is still a possibility that in quiet conversations that have been taking place between the u.s.ñs& andñi russia that there can be some diplomaticçó movement. whether it will come in time to avert açó u.s. strike i don't know. but if you ask the white house,i if you asked the state department they continue to say that they think theñiçó only soó resolution of theñr syriañi cris is a newñr geneva conference tht is brokered by both the u.s. and russia. that's the only way out. they're not seeking a military victory. they keep stressing that in every conversation i have.
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so if that'sñi what they're aft, there still is a littleát another week, to get there. >> you said the odds are not good for that. but the they do that, does assad stay?çó >> the issue now for moreñi thai assad'sçó departure. the russians haveçó said publicy understand that basharxd al-assd at someçó point will leave as president of syria.ñi the issue is whether he'll have añr dignified exit, the u.s. has triedxd to say, as theçó opposin says, he must leave as a precondition of talks.çó that's the kind of thing you could probably find a nuanced solution for if theñi russians decided that their interests were best served by beingñr part of theñr diplomacyñi now as oppo crush the rebellion. >> let's assume for a moment that doesn't happen and either we strike, he gets congressional authorization or we don't strike how does it change the dyna
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in the region? how does it affect not just the civil war in the region but how does it affectñi iran?ñr >> the middle east is nearñr to cracking athrong shi'açó sunni fault line as it is. that's why the syria problem is such a deep crisis. it's a crisis which has saudi arabia on one side, iran on the other fighting through proxies to get a sense of what lies ahead on the ground i talked to the free syrianñr army commander in the southern region afternooi damascusñiñr.ñi he fed is the u.s. strike he is has 30,000 fighters prepared to movi quickly to seize control of most of the city. he said secondly that unlike in the north where the extremists, the al qaeda affiliates areñi vi strong in the south around damascus they're weak and i'm
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told that will by other intelligence sources. so i thinkñ you can expect to see a decisive strike. it won't be a slap on the wrist wherever the president says, whatever the resolution says, it will be a significa >> rose: and what does iran do? >> i don't, i think -- i think iran believes that assadñh ride out theçó strike, believes that the u.s. will become ever moreñi isolated.çó interestingly, iran has sent some signals that if it's made part of the diplomatic negotiations, if it's given a seat at the table it may be willingçó to cooperate in some discussions..ú visit to tehran last weekñiñixdy former secretary of state jeffrey feltman who's now part of the u.n. secretariat. he went to tehran specifically to talk to the iranians about syria and i'm told it was a very interesting, complicated discussion. >> that would be a fascinatingñi development. jackie, stakes are huge at 1600 pennsylvania avenue. how do they feel?ñko do you get a senseñi they thinks
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congressional authorization assuming nothing else happens? >> they honestly don't know, just like all of us don't know. áñi problem here is just as it was from the beginning and, as the president,ñi when he last friday evening took his little walk around the south lawn with his chief of staff, dennis mcdonough, dennisñi mcdonoughñi opposed doingçó this and when ty went in to the oval office and called other aides in one by one, he told them what he wanted to do and went one by one to them. everyone -- if they didn't oppose it outright they at least used their time to lay out why this was añr bad idea. >> in talking to allçó those people-- almost none of whom have ever faced voters-- he didn't talk to johnñr kerry, he didn't talk to chuck hagel and i don't think he talked much to joe biden who between them have about 70 years of experience in the congress. that's remarkable.xd >> and by all account this is didn't come up during the previous week when they were involved in it. then he went up to the residence and called them last fridayñr night.
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but the common thread this through this is that congress ir a wild card. the house republicans are a wild card. you have an institution where even their own leaders-- speaker john boehner and majority leader ericñr cantor-- have this year failed to their own surprise to get through their own pet legislation and mutinies on their own side causedñi those votes. and so we have a president who's not only has= rating than anyñ2háime in his presidency but in their own districtñi is just hugely unpopularñi. this is not -- from a political standpoint, this is an easy call for house republicans. >> jackie, if heñr lose thisñr - i hate to exaggerate these things-- but does he become anñi impotent president? does it affect other issues? >> it mostñi certainly does. the irony is, his entire first term his strong suit was foreign policy. so when you have, you know, still slow economy, slow growing and the unemploymentñi report, u know, we'reçóñr stillxd sort ofg
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stuck, growing but not very fast. so you throw in -- now his foreign policy acumen has been questioned.ñrñi it's rem he had -- you know, since l.b.j. the saying is you got the first year of your term really to get your priorities finished and his first year is almost going to be up. it sort of reminds me of george bush in 2005 when he set out his priority was remaking social security and he failed at that just as katrina came and that was a double whammy that -- >> at th >> rose:ñi handicapped him. >> mark halperin, the politics of this are fascinating. let's start with republicans. it used to>x8q inñi washington f you have the speaker of the house, you have the majority leader of the house, you hadñi e chairman of the house intelligence committee m% rogers and you had one of theñi darlings of the tea party cotton of arkansasñr all sayingó "i'm forñr this" you could count on a solid majority in the
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republican caucus. you can't today and what are the politics forxd republicans?çó if you look at the last week-- and we've been at this a week now since secretary kerry came outçóñi,ñr almost nothing the we house has done would be in a textbook of how to build añr domestic and internationalñi coalition same-sex coupleñrly te president will speak tuesday night, i expect apac andñi maybe some other groups normally notao begin their lobbying effort bus they'rexd fascinate ang extraordinary situation. to me the most fascinatingçó is public opinion. ask any member of congress from anywhere in theçó country whatñi they're hearing, not only are they hearing numbers 95% to 5% atñr bestñrñi in temples of peoe opposing that action but they're hearing it unpromptd from people on the street and from people they say they don't normally hear from. not superpoliticalñr peopleçó.
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there's something going on right now in the country, there's virulent opposition to any action in syriaçpe:en though president is not talking about extending --çó extended engagemt or ground troops. so that's añr big problem moving public opinion. >> rose: >> i would just quickly interrupt to say that on friday afternoon john mccain had a town hall meeting and he got clobbered by hisñi fellowdp izonans. >> and that's typical. i'm struck by hearing from members who say i can't even think aboutñi voting for this nw because my constituents are so opposed to it. so that's one something public opinion. despite theçó leaders in the republican party you talk about, the house is a big problem. most people believe they could get something through the senate but getting enough cooperation between house republican leaders and democratic leaders to do one of those joint whip operations to say leader pelosi can't get as many, we need more republicans to get to 218, that
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seems very tough right now. i think that the president might be able to get throughñi the senate and then may make a decision to say i'm not going to do the house. i'm going to get a senate vote and that will be enough. that may be what he has to do because today, i don't care if you're leader or republican leader, rank and file, you can't fiel anybody who thinks it's possible on the hill for him to get it past the house. and just to say finally, i thini without being hyperbolic about it, this is an extraordinary moment for the president politically, his heart niece thó right place, he's approached this like the lawyer he is, he'i thought through who what he thinks the right thing to do is and it's left him today one week after senator john kerry's impassioned statement, secretary kerry's impassioned statement in a very perilous position because people in the hill in both parties think he has badly, badly mishandled this. >> my reporting indicates almost
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everything you said is right with one caveat: that is don't underestimate nancy pelosi. she has a way of delivering votes when people think it can't be done and she'll have to deliver a whole heck of a lot of votes on this. 100%. al >> although she said earlier she didn't plan to whip this, she was going to make this for her caucus a vote of conscience, i agree with you. i think the way this happens the sequence is a vote in the senate that passes may be more robustly than people think now andç"then nancy pelosi delivers almost the entire conference -- caucus and then aipac and boehner deliver what they need. the problem for the president then politically is that just leads to all back to all the difficulties of what is the mission at that point? what happens if things go badly. what happens if they're unintended consequences? that doesn't end the political problems for president and it's a big lift even if notice decides i'm going to get the president 90% of the caucus. >> i think mark makes a good
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point that when the push is on for the senate the votes may appear. the other point i wanted to make-- and it's related-- is if you're the israeli government looking at this spectacle of a weak president unable to deliver either at home or internationally you say to yourself the chance that this man will go to war against iran, that he attack the iranian nuclear facilities if he can't get an acceptable deal, that he'll follow through with that red line, you have to say the chance of him doing that is significantly less than it was a month or two ago. so i think it's more likely people should understand that one consequence of what's happening is it's more likely that israel will decide to act unilaterally concluded that the possibility of america acting on its own is much less. >> rose: and topd that point, remember that when president obama drew this red line and in effect put himself in this box
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he's been in over whether to intervene in syria, it was in large measure because of israel and the pressure that israel was putting on anymore a reelection year to show that it was willing to strike iran if iran developed a nuclear weapon. and for a long time last year remember, we thought iran was going -- i mean israel was going to strike iran because they didn't think the president and the united states would follow through and the president drew his red line. one other thing on apec, it's not -- in the time i've been in washington you used to think of apac that had influence on democrats only. this is now a group that has at least as much influence with republicans usually. i think in -- what you're seeing is a little bit being offset by their hatred of the president of the united states. >> mark, let's talk about the politics of 2016. two of the big players in that committee last week were rand paul and marcoñi rubio.
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is it too early to gauge what impact it has and does it affect hillary clinton? >> well, i think republican party's clearly on still on a lot of issues trying to decide what kind of añi party. is it an activist party? is it for a strong executive? all the issues are tied up in this. i think while there's been an unusual amount of jockeying amongst the people eyeing a run who are members of congress, this issue is bigger than that. however they end up voting i think as a matter of in the moment analysis of the decisions i think it's not going to be a particularly momentous occasion assuming we do get a vote in the senate which i think we will. in terms of secretary clinton, one of the pieces that again we haven't talked about that i think will come into play next week is i think we're going see the kind of superfriend lobbying that we've seen in the past on some big issuesñr like. this think aa#ut nafta when there was events involving former president.
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i suspect the white house just as they've waited next week for the president to speak in part because he was overseas and in part because congress was away, i think you're going to see statements from people like bill and hillary clinton, perhaps, former president bush, james baker, other peopleiñr who have been low key or not visible at all on this issue and i think she'll speak out given her past on this issue pretty forcefullyr the big variable on the democratic and republican side, secretary clinton and rand paul and others is not what is the resolution? part of the problem they've had is you've seen a number ofñi members jump out against pretty fast without giving deference to their leaders on either side, if it there's a new resolution in the senate, give members a chance to hear from apac, hillary clinton and others and say i was against the original thing the president propose bud now i see that as a slightly different i can be for this. >> let me ask you quickly. david, what what's your guess as
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to how this plays out in the next two or three weeks? >> assuming there's noñi diplomaticñiñr rabbit that canñe pulled out of the hat i think the president is committed to take some kind of actionçó.çó he's so weak the action may be less than he was contemplating a few years ago. the real problems -- this shows you what happens when an american president loses credibility. >> jackie? >> i think it's going to go right up to the end. i think we're going to see one of these votes where they're switching -- if it looks like it's see añi stampede to vote against it and it will look like a bigger defeat than it might have otherwise been but i can't -- i still find it hard to believe he's going to lose in the end.ñi >> i must say i agree with you but none of my reporting suggests. >> i agree. >> what it may be is jackie we are old school, we don't understand the world has changed. >> all the factors that mark just mentioned,çó they don't hae any impact on the house
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republicans. >> one wild card is the u.n. inspectors' report. the u.n. inspectors are going to issue a report. it will probably leak before they make it. from everything we've heard from the u.s. side, that reportñr wil say syria used chemical weapons. >> and that could be a game changer. >> one thing we haven't mentioned. children were killed and that's where theçó president's heart is and that's where most americans haven't focused on yet. i think it's possible -- >> i was going to say. you'reçó right, all the passionn this debate has been with the anti-s. to win this thing they have to turn that around starting on tuesday. this has been an absolutely fascinating conversation. mark halperin, jackie collins and david ignatius, thank you so much. >> thanks, al. >> rose:çóñr billy gene king is here, she's one of the most successful players of all time. a former world number one, she's won 39 grand slam titles, 12 of them singles. throughout her career she's used
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her public platform to champion the cause of equal rights. this coming week she will be the first athlete to be profiled on pbs's american masters series. here's a look at the trailer. $as a childñi i decided i was going to spend the rest of my life fighting for equal rights and opportunitys for boys and girls, men and women. and i knew tennis would be a platform if i could become number one. >> wimbledon champion. >> billie jean king's amazing skill is taking her to the women's singles title for the third time. >> how lucky are we to have had billie jean king in tennis? >> priceless. >> when the prize money started appearing it was obvious the men were up here and the women were down here it was totally unfair. >> she became ourñi leader for equal prize money for women's. >> what we are talking about is açó revolution. >> there is little more revolutionary than for women to becomeñi physically strong. >> we express exactly what the women's movement is about.
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we sweat, it's real. just being the best we csf be and whatever we want to be. >> she wants equality for women in everything, not just sport. >> so it started with women's tennis association. it was vital to be together. we had to be unified, we had to be together to be powerful and have one voice for women's professional tennis. >> eventually everybody voted yes there would be an association >> this is it, this is our moment, this is our opportunity to change the future. >> she's carrying theñi banner r women's lib, i'm carrying the male is king no matter what the difference in age and we can beat the girls on our off the court. >> it's a bunch of bologna. >> the bobby rigs billie jean king match was presented as a battle of the sexes that if he won it would prove that allçó women could be defeated by any man. she changed consciousness with that one match. >> i was just playing for myself
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>> this was for everybody! >> rose: i'm pleased to have billie jean king at this table again. welcome. >> thank you for having me, charlie. i love your show so much. >> rose: thank you, thank you. i love what you have done, not only for equal rights and civil rights but also for tennis. i mean, you have been añr hero when you think about what tennis has become.ñi >> we have a long way to go. we always have to keep working at it.ñi >> tell me where you think we'd come in tennis and where you think we have to go. >> one of the things is it's truly a global sport thanks to the brits in the 1800s spreading it around the world. whether it was soccer -- >> rose: they had an empire. >> i had a british empire class in tennis but i thought about the sports they've given to us, whether bit cricket or tennis or soccer. we are a global sport now. when i started tennis basically we weren't. and it's just evolved because it
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became a professional support is when everything took off and that was 1968. when people talk about open tennis or the open era or modern tennis, it means itñi started in 1968 and that was the first time we received prizeñi money. >> and suddenly people who -- it changed everything. when you -- where does it have to go? what are the challenges ahead forçó tennis to get better? >> i think when we talk about tennis, when people in the united states ask me why aren't we doing better in tennis what they really mean why isn't american tennis doing better? because it's gone to the european players like the federers and nadals, theñi djokovics,ñr the as rank a. thank god we haveñi serena williams. that's where it's gone, to europeñi and --. >> rose: why is that? >> well, that's a goodçó questi. i don't know. a lot of people will say they're hungrier than we are but i think there are american kids that want to be the best, that have
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fire in the belly. i'm going to be very optimistic about that. it's just difficult, too, because it's not one of the top two sports in our country. for instance, in a lot of european countries it's the number-two sport after soccer whereas we're not the number-two sport in the united states america. >>ñr rose: we don't have the sae number of programs and development projects. >> we don't have the critical mass of children playing and we need to have the critical mass of children to come up through the pipeline.çó we have an aging population that's played tennis. the u.s.t.a. knows all about this. the governing body of our sport -- >> rose: globally the game is okay. >> at the professional level it's fine. in asia now it's the place. for instance, the women for the next five years after this year will be playing in singapore. the w.t.a. just got a new contract for millions and millions of dollars, the women will play in singapore for the next five years. so it's a global sport. but as an american i will -- i mean i think back to the family
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and martina and jimmy connorsñi and myself, casal,ñr we had john mcenroe coming in there.y playing and we were both in the men's akpñr women and we've basically dominated the sport. it's hard on us once we dominated in the '70s and early '80s and we don't know. that's hard. >> rose: sloan stevens you like@ i don't like to talk about them too much because i think what happens when they have one or two good matches, you know, everybody makes such a big deal out of them now. >> rose: and too much is expected too soon. >> one good match or something like vicki duval and everybody's all -- you know, all flapping around. there's so much work for thesexd kids. madison keys is the one that most people think she's top 40 rightñr nowñi.
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madison is probably the one. i'm not coaching day in and day out i always listen to others so that's christina mchale. >> rose: how about on the men's side?ñi >> we're hurting. i mean -- >> rose: hiser? there. >> queries. jacques faulk a lot of people think is our best betñr.ñr we're not -- it's the first time an american male hasn't gotten to the fourth found in the u.s. soapñi that's an indicator that we're not cutting it so it's a really hard -- it's very difficult. >> rose: do who do you like best among the men? >> to win? >> rose: among the men who will be competing at the u.s. open. by the time we see this it will be -- >> i think we have to go to nadal. he's just playing out of his mind. he has nothing taped around his knees. i always looked at his knees
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first and there's no tape or anything that i know. his knees are healthy and he's running like the wind. he has become the best hard core player, i think. he used to stand back too far, he's moved forward, he is a great volleyer. he used to be a good volleyer. i would consider him a great volleyer now. adapted as well as anybody i've ever seen that when i saw him say eight, ten years ago, he's become such a terrific and of course djokovic i adore. he's great. and içóñr love feder who's obviy not in it, anymore. but he's got a lot of great tennis in him. if he still wants to play -- >> rose: is this a question of heart rather than game? >> no, i think it's a question of age and kids can get better. i retired at 40çzo, i've been . >> what changes as you age? i asked laver this. he said "the stroke is the same,
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it's getting to ball." >> it's not your eyes, it's your legs. with me it's my legs. i've had eight knee operations and i've already had probably -- by the time i was 40 i'd probably had four or five and in those days they weren't as successful as they are nowñi and it's just -- you're a half a step short. strokes still stay the same, your desire still stays the same at least for me. >> rose: (laughs)ñi >> and the kids get stronger. i'm a big believer in every generation. >> rose: when people say "let's talk about the good old days" i say "the good old days are ahead of us. >> correct, i totally agree with you. >> rose: when you think about your career, do you know anybody that had more heart than you do? anybody that wanted to win more than you did? anybody who was more competitive than you were? no. >> i don't know.
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>> rose: who would be even in the same room with you? martina? >> margaret court, chris evert, mariañr bueno, martina navratila steffi graf, they had as much heart. you can't measure -- it's hard to measure.xd but tennis was secondary to me. tennis was my platform.# >> rose: social changeçó was yoó primary thing. >> since i was 12 years old. if you watch the american masters series -- >> rose: not yet but i'll see you. >> when people see it they will see it says right there i had this epiphany thatñr i decided i want to change thingsñiñr. the >> i absolutelyñi wanted to chae things when i was 12. >> rose: what did you want to change? >> i come fromñr team sports. my younger brother became a major league baseballñi player, randy moffat, played 12 years, most of them with the giants. >> rose: san francisco giants.
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>> san francisco. not the new york -- he's a baseball player and he had a good slider, relief pitcher. so i grew up around team sports all my life. when i got into tennis i was sitting there when iñi was 12 oe day at the los angeles tennis club and i started to realize that everybody in tennis wore white shoes, white socks,xd whie skirts, white shirts, played with white balls in those days and everybody who played was white andñi the question i asked myself is where is everybody else? and that started my head just going crazy. not only about my sport which is a tiny universe. whatever universe you're in, whether it be dance, sports, teaching, whatever, they're all tiny universes. they seem big to us because we're in them but they're very tiny. >> rose: what are you proudest about as an agent of change? >> i think when i played riggs i got very fortunate that we had a platform where it's so many millions and millions of people were watching.
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theçó timing was correct. it was the height of the women's movement. remember, there was only four channels in those days. people forget. no table television. you understand. and then we had no social media like we do and remember title nine was passed june 23, 1972. and this match i was playing bobby riggs was [n '73. and i do not want title nine to be weakened. that was very much on my head and very much i wanted to bring men and women together because everything i thought about as a 12-year-old was i wanted to fight for equal rights and opportunities for girls and boys. i think having a brother i didn't think about girls or boys things were different were us. we didn'tyñet called on as much in the classroom, we didn't get the attention. we just didn't. and things are bublging up and starting to readize something's not quite rightñrñi here.
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sy thought ant my sport, the reason i doxd world team tennis was because of teams. it's coed. the socialization is really important to me. the reason i live new york city is because i play team tennis. people go why do you live here? i'm from southern california. i love all the things that new york has wonderful things but -- so i knew by the time i was 12 that tennis if i were good enough would be my platform to start trying to make these types of things happen. >> rose: did youñi have lot of natural ability? >> yes. >> rose: so you had to step up? >> my brother and i were -- >> rose: natural athletes. >> lucky. >> rose: jeans -- genes and all the rest. >> we had great parents that kept us grounded. they didn't care if we were good. whatever we did in life, everything we had and education was important to them.
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but randy and i had something special. my third grate teacher wrote home about me and randy had mrs. hunter as well and sheñi wrote home about randy i'm sure. i can't remember. but she owe that i loved -- keep in in sports, that i loved pressure, i was always the captain of the team and there it is. that's leadership, all the thingsñr that -- >> rose: with respect to how you saw gay rights and women's right was it all the same for you or was itñr distinctively different for you in terms of what you had to do? >> to me they're the same but circumstances are different and how people perceive things. i was outed -- >> rose: this is about human freedom for you. >> about human freedom for boyce and girls under -- it doesn't matter. no person shoulbi be a second-class citizen. >> rose: however -- you started to say "but for me --" >> i think for me being outed
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and not being able to come out on my own terms was very difficult. i do come from a very homophobic family. i grew up homophobic as a child. so i think also in 18981 when i was outed i think i'm the first athlete who was outed but glen burke from the brooklyn dodgers in the '70s used to talk -- he was out but nobody ever -- nobody would talk about it. and i'm just learning more about glen burke who i think should br celebrated because he lived his life as a gay man but it was very difficult. he was with the dodgers and they offered him $75,000 to get married, for instance, just to hide it. and it was terrible way people treated him. but the media wasn't even ready to talk about in the those days. you know how the baseball writers were very protective until recently and now it's hard to protect any privacy but i think i was probably the first athlete to be outed in 1981 and
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then martina came out -- >> rose: how did you handle that? >> i had to fight with my lawyer and publicist that i wanted to have a press conference and they said "no, you don't do that." >> 5 i said "i don't care, i'm going to tell the truth that i had an affair with this woman. and so for 48 hours we argued, they caved in, i flew from l.a. to new york, my former husband larry met me and we went before the media and i told the truth and my lawyer just about died. he just said you don't do that. we had to go to trial and i said -- we had to keep it narrow because we were going to trial and i said i have to tell the truth. the media has been good to me and people don't probably remember but without the media your story wasn't told. they'd always been good to me. you know better than anybody you have to keep telling your truth and do the best you can and i just -- i couldn't -- my parents brought me up -- my homophobic
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parents brought me up to be honest because and to thine own self be true and that came threw. in tend the values my parents gave me was very hard on my mom and dad. my brother was great. he's like "who cares?" randy moffat is my brother's name. >> and lairly. >> larry finally we had to start talking about it.ñi i'd been asking for a divorce for years and years and larry never want pad divorce so it was very difficult. >> he liked you. loved you. >> i love larry and i think he's great but that's not the way it was going to work. but his children are -- my god children. my partner lana, it's very nice, it's great. but it's been a long difficult journey. >> when you look back, what would you changed, what would you have done differently? how -- because you are so truthful. >> what would i have done? i probably.
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>> rose: would you have come out early on your own? >> oh, i would have come out in a heart beat! back then, noñr. in theñi '70s i was too afraid from the tour. the 70s were just started. i don't want to hurt the tour. i was just -- i was paralyzed. i didn't want to hurt anybody so i got paralyzed and i think the way our culture was at the time it bread that -- those feelings too high and i look back and i'm just so thankful that it's not like that anymore for the young people in are being born today. >> rose: what do you think of bobby riggs? >> i love bobby riggs, he was one of my heroes. that's the reason i beat him because i respected him. >> you had no doubt that you could beat him? >> oh, no, i doubted that. i was scared. >> rose: because you knew youçó had a lot weighing -- a lot riding on your shoulders? >> i think people -- yes, this wasn't about a tennis match. this was about social change and
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social justice. and bobby had beaten margaret court, people forget about that. and they say oh, that's right, she played that oh, oh, yeah, yeah. and she lost so badly that i was -- i didn't have a choice. i had to play bobby. but then i realized this was an opportunity for change and i really thought about title nine, how i wanted to start the change the hearts and minds of people. that the right thing to do is have equality -- >> rose: do you think it might have been good if you had gone into politics and become a politician? >> a lot of people asked know go in. i think i would have liked plikts, probably. if i were a young girl today, why not be president of the united states? why not? i think girls need to think -- dream big and go for it and boys need to dream big and go for it. we need more women in politics. we're not even at 20% in the
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congress. it's quite pathetic. the c.e.o. situation very few, we need leadership desperately from women. we needñi both genders to be -- >> rose: not only having a different kind of experience in those role bus because it's an i spiring role model for people. >> it is but you want different cultures. you want both genders because they're going to come up with better solutions. >> rose: so what are your crimes now? >> i'm going to be 70. it's 40-40-40 this year. the 40th anniversary of the w.t.a., the 40th anniversary of equal prize money at the open. the u.s.t.a., the u.s. open was the first one to give equal prize money in '73. so that's the 40th year anniversary and then riggs is the 40th. it's my 70th birthday in november and i feel like i have one good thing left andñr i'm going to be working on leadership for women but i'm going to include men. with team tennis it's coed, equal, both boys and girls, men
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and women. that's what i want to trld who look. we're in this world together, we have to help each other and champion each other. i will have in this leadership opportunity wherever -- i'll figure it out in the next two or three months that i want to have more men involved. i think we need to have men so much involved to solve these problems for women. is because men are in power and the powerful supreme to help others to come up, to champion others and men industrial in the most powerful position. i grew up with a strong father and mother, my dad was fantastic to me, i think being -- growing up with the brother was great. i think him being a professional athlete and i wanted to be professional athlete, it was pretty funny. not funny is the wrong word but good. we're very close and we talk very truthfully. i think i understand that we need both boys and girls in this leadership. a lot of times leadership thinks
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they have a few men come in and discuss things. i'm not gonna have that same model. i'm going to shift it because i'm -- it will look like team tennis. if you watch a world team tennis match you'll see my philosophy. that is it. it's men and women competing on the same team against each other equal contribution by both gender it is way we set up the format and if the trial comes out to watch he and she see this cooperation, sometimes the guy's the star, sometimes the woman's the support sitting on the bench. it's -- in basketball how the guys sit on the bench, the girls and the guys around the team? that's what we do in team tennis. you're on there, supported and sometimes the girls, the leaders boy or girl can coach. it's like this is the way the world should look. i know it's a sport but this is the way the world should look and sports, art, music, all these things are a universal language. >> rose: tennis is better, equal rights is better, gay rights is
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better because you have been here. so thank you for doing this. >> not finished. just like you're not finished doing interviews. >> rose: or anything else. >> exactly. >> rose: "american masters" will air billie jean king on tuesday september 10 at 8:00 p.m. back in a moment. stay with us. >> rose: christopher schroeder is here, he is an internet entrepreneur, a venture investor. he traveled across the middle east and observed what he calls the new hotbed for technology startups, he writes about his experience the region's innovators in a new book called "startup rising, the entrepreneurial revolution, remaking the middle east." i'm pleased to have him here at this table. welcome. >> it's an honor to be here. >> rose: how did this come about? you went and observed and said there's a story and a narrative i have to tell? >> i've been running tech companies for a decade, i've outsourced technology all over the world. so it should be no surprise that it's happening in the middle east because it's in south
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america and asia and africa now. in 2010 a couple of good friends of mine who have been talking about technology in the arab world for years held an amazing gathering in dubai they called celebration of entrepreneurship and in many respects my going there to speak, my world view changed from before that event and after the event because at tend of the day there were 2 4shgsz00 people from north africa to yemen, nobodyçwants to talk about politics, nobody cared about obama's cairo speech. they were there to build things and like any great startup gathering, some thing brs great, some weren't so great but their heads were down and i was excited that i extended my trip and went to amman, cairo and i said something very, very big is happening here. >> rose: and what did you see in other than sort of a lot of people with entrepreneurial ambitions? >> it's more than ambitions. you see people who are incredibly savvy about technology and thinking about problem solving. like many emerging markets that come to technology you see entrepreneurs who take things that have worked in the west and they bring them to their home. so in russia and china by do
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great search companies have been powerful. so yahoo! bought a company in the middle east. >> rose: where was that started? >> in jordan and then it moved to dubai. >> rose: so when i go we know there are startups in israel. it's become a center for entrepreneurship in the tech sphere -- >> this is what surprised me. a lot of people in silicon valley say what's going to be the hub of this. as we say, amman is amazing. one of the big stories here is now that technology is everywhere and in so many people's hands you see hubs of innovation where anybody has access to broad band devices. amman is extraordinary and the king of jordan has put emphasis there but the fact of the matter is they've seen some of the best entrepreneurs in cairo, they're in the gulf, dubai, beirut is a thriving center of startup tech and i have to tell you tragically--s have very important-- some of those remarkable young women and men i saw were in damascus and some of them are still building
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companies. >> rose: despite what's going on in syria they're still there? >> it's been a mix. some have stayed there for a long time and one company floored me who would commute to have board meetings across beirut. but the last six months to nine months a lot of moved out. >> rose:ñr where did they goçó ? >> beirut is an obvious hub because that's closest. due into a big hub but if you talk to them they're counting the minutes to their ability to go back. >> rose: it's where i was born, where i started? >> exactly. >> rose: it can change the middle east? >> every note? the world now. we wouldn't have had that conversation ten years ago anywhere. but when you have access to technology at the scale that it's rising right now you see the way everybody else lives you have an ability to collaborate, work together and invent subpoena you get to solve problems.
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and some of those unique ramifications could be global. people ask me what will happen in syria and i don't have that crystal ball but in the next three years there will be people around the world and the ramifications are very significant. >> rose: what are you seeing in africa? >> africa is a wonderful case study as well and we in the states have a proclivity when we're talking about africa or the middle east as one thing so in the same way sometimes we think what's happening in syria is the same thing happening in dubai, which is wrong. people look at africa and think what's happening in mall zi what's happening in kenya. what people don'tçó understand about kenya it is literally the number one mobile payment country on earth. almost 20% of the entire g.d.p. of kenya goes through a thing called impesa which is a texting capability to move cash around the country. >> rose: remarkable stories that i hear from people who for
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example i.b.m. executives, lots of other people say watch africa watch africa, watch africa. i don't know whether they say that because the potential is so huge because of the base in terms of the technology base is lower or simply they believe that they can already see something so exciting that it makes them get excited themselves. >> what is interesting is that investors in particular become lemings, we'll go around something that seems to be right so africa is a thing but it's wherever is the thing. the same things that excite people about kenya organ that or nigeria is the same thing that's happening around the world. >> because youñr can use it to raise money, stay connected and all those things that entrepreneurs need money, information knowledge -- >> all their at your fingertips. >> rose: and the capacity to train people in can further their ambitions. >> every mobile provider i interviewed for this book told me over the next three years that will be 50% smart phoneçó
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penetration. and we in the states sometimes think smart phones -- >> one out of every two people will have a smart phone? >> now as you know in many of these countries and africa as well mobile penetration could be 100%. meaning people have literally more than one device they work on. >> rose: another phenomena. what isçó interesting is that people think that's great. they'll have sexy phones or better entertainment devices and i saw david stern is going toe merging markets. >> rose: that that's how he's going to spend his time now. >> because he knows everyone will have smart phones which means they can watch video but what people tend to underestimate which mark andreessen talks about in the forward of my book is that these are supercomputers. they're not just phones. this means broad band computing in the hands of half of humanity in the next decade and when you have access to essentially all the world's knowledge on our fingertips for free and you connect with anyone for free --
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>> rose: so what can stand in the way of the fruition of all of this? >> what's happening is the most obvious. >> rose: political struggle. >>r what you're seeing i think in many ways is a battle between 20th century proclivity to hold things top down, to consolidate capital in the hands of few whereas the phenomenon i've describing the bottom up. but because it's happening at scale doesn't mean these regimes can not make decisions that can knock them out of a competitive global marketplace. >> rose: does entrepreneurship and technology and democracy flourish on each other? >> i can remember this conversation going back into the early '90s when tiananmen square happened. i was in business school and the general thesis was you cannot have a great growth economy if you don't have political stability and democracy. >> rose: they hadn't heard of state capitalism. >> the world is a complicated place and as things are coming from bottom up we'll see interesting counterintuitive results
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>> explain to that to me. >> democracy in the purest sense as we envision it here is the only way that there can be economic growth is not necessarily to think about it. having said that, ecosystems matter. your ability to get capital out safely, to have some stability matters and i don't mean to dismiss it out of hand. is c entrepreneurs, mubarak was still in power, this was happening despite the mubarak ecosystem so it's interesting. >> rose: and some of them fueled the revolution. >> no question. i'm asked quite often did this come from the arab spring and it always surprises me because in point of fact they're part and parcel of the same thing. people -- you want your political voice, your social voice, culture voice, of course you want your economic voice. >> and the arab spring was an idea and what technology did is gave fuel to the idea and allowed it to be heard and resonate and brought in an extraordinary number of people which gave size and influence. >> rose: which i believe it will do in business in the same way.
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>> rose: what do you hope to accomplish by this book? what do you want people to come away with? >> so i think a way the first thing, particularly for american audience is the same ah-ha moment i have. understandably at one level most of just one narrative about the middle east. we were raised on one narrative but the world is changing in a profound way. so for people to stop and breathe and see there's something hopeful happening in parallel within terrible scenario wes know so well will be very important because right now i can tell you many business institutions certainly non-government organization institutions are almost in a cold war mind-set that big aid programs are the only way to make things happen, top down is the only way to make things happen. if you understand what these young people are doing, the opportunities you can co-author? >> totally bottom up and it's historic. >> rose: you mentioned mark andreessen wrote the forward here and he tells indeed how he's excited by. this he also says i sure hope schroeder is right.
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are you sure you're right. >> mark also goes on to say in some ways i certainly am. in terms of the access to technology, in terms of its growing, in terms of the transparency that's created, the fact that now there's over 20 years of experience of investors understandinging the political risk in emerging markets these things are winds at the back. but the infrastructure issues you touched on before, not only the political once are very, very serious. >> rose: rule of law. >> rule of law, education. so education is -- obviously it stunned me, charlie, that they spent unbelieve amounts across the region in education but it's on the wrong kind of education, it's top down, learning, classroom sizes. >> rose: which begs the question will any other part of the world whether it's the middle east, africa, whether it's latin america, will they be -- any part of the world resistant to the forward march of technology and the power of the internet because of their own culture
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norms? >> if it is i haven't seen it. most people i've seen is people adopt technology for their cultural norms. it becomes almost like water, almost like anything in their life. it's something they become. >> f. >> rose: mark says you see three portions driving tech innovation from unexpected corners of the globe that are taking advantage of that and one is highm technology that offers a level of transparency, connectivity and inexpensive access toçó capital and market which is i mentioned. however two decades ofñr experience in navigating emerging market investment made global capital more comfortabler with political risk and understanding. and thirdly with rapidly increasing access to technology there's large untapped markets of consumers and businesses seeking software solutions. if you have people and problems, there are software solutions and that develops apps and a whole range of other things.
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>> rose: one of the most moving set of entrepreneurs i call in the book are the problem solvers who look at most infrastructure problems as software problems to be solved. so i talked about education. if you talk to someone my age or older they say all the bad things i've said before. if you talk to somebody in their 20s they're like i'm going create an academy in arabic and i'm going to have people come and do interesting things to teach themselves. >> rose: the book is called "startup rising." chris schroeder, forward by mark andreessen, subtitled "the entrepreneur revolution, remaking the middle east". thank you. >> great to be here. >> rose: thank you for joining us. see you next time. captioning sponsored by rose communications captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org
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the following production was produced in high definition. ♪ and their buns are something i have yet to find anywhere else. >> 'cause i'm not inviting you to my house for dinner. >> breaded and fried and gooey and lovely. >> in the words of arnold schwarzenegger, i'll be back! >> you've heard of connoisseur. i'm a common-sewer! >> they knew i had to ward off some vampires or something. >> let's talk desserts, gentlemen, 'cause i see you

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