>> imechris wallace and this is "fox news sunday." governors eve are truggling too balance the budgets. they already have a record of workers and turning the state around. we will sit down with indiana governor and possible presidential contender mitch daniels. then the 2012 campaign. the frond runner for the republican nomination. does he have the desire to get in the race? we willle ask former governor mike huckabee. daniels and huckabee, only on "fox news sunday." >> the latest on the revolution in libya. and we will ask our sunday group could president obama do more to topple qadaffi? and our power players of the week. taking on the leaders in iran

by making fun of them. all right now on "fox news sunday." >> chris: and hello again from fox news in washington. as states struggle with huge budget gaps and take on public workers our first guest has become the new it boy of american politics. mitch daniels of indiana is being celebrated for turning deficits in surpluses and adding jobs and some are saying he should be the republican nominee for president next year. governor daniels joins us now. welcome back to "fox news sunday." >> thank you, chris. >> chris: and what is going on there is you just had rotator cuff surgery and you will not be ready for spring training. >> ju are in thtrain. >> you are in the middle of a stand offy house democrats. they first said that they were

fighting against the right to work law which is now dead and now they say they are fighting against 1 othe 11 other bills e agenda. are you prepared to make a deal to get the house democrats back to indiana. >> no, if they come back we will talk about the changes or amendments they might want. while they are sub verting the democratic process there is nothing to talk about. when they come back to work we will talk about their concerns. you describe is quite accurately. it is different than wisconsin. this is not about government unions. this was a bill that i did not initiate and i thought ought to wait for a different time because i thought it might happen and it might get in the way of a very important agenda in front of the people of indiana. reduce the corporate tax to attract jobs and reform education and so forth. they ran off to illinois

ostensibly over the right to work bill but then issued an ultimatum from a hot tub over there. the first things they want killed are president obama's race to the stop agenda. >> when unions started protesting the right to work law this week and house democrats took off you said that you thought that the bill should be dropped as you just pointed out. then you added this. >> what we heard from has every right to express. >> chris: conservative bloggers hammered you and said you weren't tough enough and said you wanted a truce on fiscal issues and the day after you issued tougher statement and here it is. >> the house democrats showed a complete contempt for the democratic process. >> chris: are were you trying to reassure conservatives that you are tough enough?

>> no, i was reiterating what i said the first day. i was a little careless, the statement i made i willle make again. i was referring to the private sector protesters. the union members who came to disagree with the right to work law. they had and they have every right to express their first amendment point of view. when i was distinguishing -- >> chris: you weren't talking about the indiana house democrats. >> in fact i guess i'm glad i made the mistake because it alus me to make the distinction. it is one thing for the people in the private sector to express their point of view. publicuite a thing for sector run out to a state and hide out.

>> chris: you took away, what is going on in wisconsin you took away public workers collective bargaining rights by executive order six years ago the day after you were sworn into office but now are calling their unions the privileged elite. teachers, public safety officers the privileged elite. >> we had a huge in version. there may have been a time where public employees were mistreated and vulnerable and underpaid. if that was a problem we have overfixed it. not everywhere but in many places. as you know very well public employees in america most decidedly federal employees but everywhere are better paid than the taxpayers that pay their salaries. much more generous benefit and pensions on top and then near total job security in the last recession. >> teachers, would you really call teachers a privileged

elite? >> i was really talking about the government unions of whom their union, of course, is one. it is true that teachers are paid in indiana 22% more than the taxpayers who pay their salary. benefits raised that further, that is all true. i happen to think that is a good idea. we have some of the best paid teachers in america and i think that is absolutely fine. one of the bills the democrats rant uwant us to kill would als to pay the best teachers more. we have a phenomenon at which public sector unions get billions much dollars in dues and hand that back to the circle. >> chris: you have a strong record of balancing the budget as governor of indiana. let's take a look at the record. you in hair rate inherited a dd turned into a surplus the next year. and ended with a is urinara

$830 million. and you talked about the greatest threat facing this conditionry. >> we face our enemy, lethal delivery and even more applicable than those america has defeated before. i refer, of course, to the debt our nation has airmailed for itself over decades of indulgences. it is the new red menace this time consisting of ink. >> chris: i want to do a lightning round. what would you to about social security? >> bifur kate it. say those in the program or approaching it here it the deal, nothing changes. to the young people paying for today's retirees and tomorrows we want you to have something when you retire. we will need a brand new compact. it starts with means testing. we shouldn't send a pension check to donald trump. concentrate the resources on those that need them the most. in the future we should raise

the retirement age to catch up to the medical reality of our time. i think we should protect the benefits against inflation but not overprotect them. as i said many times in the past that is my cut at it. if somebody has another read that gets us with assurance to the same results i would like to hear it because i just want to see a solution to this before it destroys the america we have snowplow. >> you talk abouknown. >> you talk about medicare 2.0. >> instead of a top down monestrousity that we have today i would divide the program and say to those in it or about to be in it nothing will change for you. for the young peoplele coming up who are going to shoulder the bill we ought to trust them to make more of their own decisions. again, concentrate the resources on the poorest people and also in this case the least healthy people. people who are better off.

>> chris: private doctors if they could choose their own insurance plan. >> i would. >> chris: you even say government should put limits on end of life care. is that what sarah palin called the death panels. >> what i worry about s the government making these decisions. i was stating what i think is a simple fact. i wish it was county but i think it is. we cannot afford in an aging society to pay for the most expensive technology for every single person regardless of income to the very, very last day. >> chris: who makes that decision. >> a part of it has to be the family and the patient himself or herself. i mean there -- >> chris: does the government at some point say we can't afford to give the 92-year-old the liver transplant? >> i think what out to happen to medicare or social security, i think this problem will have

to be addressed. i don't pretend to have an exact answer to this one except that auto pilot won't work. >> chris: do you think voters are ready, you had spoke of what seem to be some political taboos. do you think voters are ready? >> maybe more confidence in the american citizens than some in politics today. i do believe people are ready to step up ones they have the real facts or many of these facts that you may know have not been shared honestly with the american people and i give a little more credit than i think some of the politicians do. >> chris: you also have a record as the first budget director under president bush 43. when you left, two and a half years later the deficit was $400 billion. you were also there when president bush launched his medicare drug benefit plan that

now costs $16 billion a year. i know there was a recession but do you think it was wise at a time when we were fighting two wars to have two tax cuts and launch a huge new entitlement. >> the recession, two wars and a fort attack which led to a whole new category called homeland security. nobody was less happy than i do see the surplus go away. it was going away no matter who was president. chris, i was proud to be part of that administration. yes, i think the original tax cuts were good and timely and helped the economy to recover very, very quickly from that recession. but if you want to know what i think about fiscal issues, don't look at two and a half years where i was in the supporting cast with no vote. look at when i was in the position submitting the budget and fighting for them. there is the record that i think is most accurate.

>> chris: you also infuriated the right by calling for a truce on social issues. here is what you said at cpac. >> big change requires big majorities. we will need people to rush for glen or sean. >> some say that marriage shouldn't negotiatable. mike huckabee says that he was disappointd that profamily activists would just lie down. >> that isn't what i suggested. first of all, a truce that both sides agree to stop fighting for are a little while. there was is august really tactic amly. starts with the promise that our nation is at mortal risk. i would love to learn that that is not threatening not just our economy but or entire way of life and our role in the world and maybe even our national security.

if you share that opinion then all i'm saying is we have to unify a lot of america and get a lot of people together to make the changes. you asked me tackling these problems that we are talking about is supposed to be politically undoable. if we are going to do the undoable we need to gather ourselves together as a nation and that will by definition mean that there will have to be some folks in this coalition who do disagree. >> chris: we have about a minute left. where are you on running for president? >> haven't decided to do it, haven't decided not to. i'm keeping the option open as i have been urged to jks i never expected to run for any office. all i set out to do was to try my best for four years, maybe eight to maybe a better state, proper prosperous state in the place i live and, you know, any thought i had about national issues was maybe we could set good examples and create

something others could look at and ear and there a constructive thought and that is still where i am. >> chris: have you seat timeline for yourself? >> others keep suggesting the deadlines and then they keep passing. that is one of the great breaks we had as voters that this thing didn't start. i will tell you this. i'm giving my full attention to the duty, the job i hired on for and i hope that our democrats get out of the hot tub and go back to work and we will finish at the end of april. but if they don't i will still be there and so will they eventually. if is means the deedlines pass, it does. >> chris: some people have suggested, that you don't look presidential. barack obama is 61, you are 5'7". he is charismatic and some people suggest that perhaps you are not.

does that matter? >> probably, you know. in the time, i had i never suggested to the voters what they should consider as a valid criterion. if it comes down to height and hair i probably wouldn't do well. i guess that is something in the balance with many of the other factors. >> chris: governor daniels thank you so much for coming in. always good to see you. and we will be ready to see what happens in indiana and what happens on the presidential campaign trail. thanks. >> chris: up next, another possible 2012 contender leading the gop polls right now. former governor mike huckabee. back in a moment. but when i was diagnosed with prostate cancer... i needed a coach. our doctor was great, but with so many tough decisions i felt lost.

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>> chris: by almost any measure mike huckabee is one of the top contenders for the 2012 republican presidential nomination in and it is a big if he decides to run. he has just written a book called "a simple governmenting" which offers a blueprint for a possible campaign. earlier i sat down with him. governor huckabee, welcome back to "fox news sunday." >> thank you very much, chris. >> chris: let's start with the big question which is, of course, whether or not you are going to run for president and you have recently sent some negative signals if i may. you said this week you are making big money for the first time in your life and you worry

you will be completely december destitute if you run and lose. i don't plant to jump into a pool with no water. and in your book you say of campaigning i actually dread the process. should someone run for president who has so many doubts? >> i love campaigning, chris. i think i need to qualify. i don't enjoy what i would call the peripheral of it which is the part you dread and that is that you spend so much of your time defending rather than going out and talking about issues that you think would make america a great country. i don't think that is going to change any time soon. but what i find interesting is if you are even halfway honest when asked a question it is sort of like the old jack webb everything you say can and will be used against you and i'm finding more and more that

trying to give an honest apes that i don't know but here are the -- honest answer which is i don't know. the fact is i'm very much considering doing it again. i think i have the advantage not only because of poll numbers but i have been there and done it and i know what i would be walking into. a lot of people don't. >> you are promoting a book and being a potential candidate is good for business in that sense. here is the serious question relating to all of this. don't the american people deserve a candidate who believes that al with all of hs or her heart that they are the best person for the job. >> absolutely. and one of the reasons i have not yet made that decision is because i'm working through that process. i think i would be an excellent president and a good candidate. but what i want to know is do i think i can carry it to the finish line. can i raise the level of money an obscene amount of money necessary to win the presidency and then to challenge an incumbent president who will

have a billion dollars piled up waiting for someone to challenge h him. >> chris: you say this in your book about barack obama. just about everything he thinks is good for america is actually bad or our present and worse for our future. explain? >> his accumulation of debt is horrifying. he has created more debt in two years than george bush did in eight. the debt that we face i believe is the most serious crisis outside of the threat of terrorism, the threat of jihaddism that confronts america. and we cannot rebuild our economy and get people back to work and on a job site as long as we have a president who thinks that if the federal government just keeps on spending money we will be so much better off. the first rule is if you are in a hole quit digging. if you are in a family and you just lost your job and you are broke you don't go on a spending spree. you start figuring out how to cut your expenses.

>> this week the president decided that the defense of marriage act which bars federal recognition of same-sex marriage is unconstitutional and directed the justice department to no longer defend doma, the defense of marriage act in court. you say that that could destroy the president. isn't that over the top? >> no. i will tell you why. i mean that is a hyperbole but presidents are given a little hyperbole as are talk show hosts. he alieniated the african american community. they support traditional marriages more than hispanics and more than whites. 56%. 65% in the hispanic. 75 in the african american community. you have african american church leaders like anthony evans saying the 34,000 churches that he networks with are up in arms over this.

>> chris: he said he believes it is unconstitutional. >> he said that because the lower court decided that part of doma was unconstitutional he would not enforce it. then he should not try to implement obama care because some lower courts already decided that it is unconstitutional. that is hyp hypocritical. was he dishonest when ran or dishonest now or did he change his view and when and why? >> chris: if he did change his view is that legitimate? >> he better explain why. why is it that on one hand he has been saying this issue should be addressed legislatively and now he is doing it not even judicially. he is doing it administratively. i don't think that what he is doing is constitutional. if a president begins to decide which pieces of the law he will

choose to support or endorse or enforce, based on a lower court decision, not because it is actually bubbled up to a final adjudication, that is an unusual presiden precedent fora president to take. >> chris: he says he is not going to defend it in court cases. >> it is really the same thing. he has decided that this is a part of the law he doesn't like so he is not going to recognize it. i don't think a president in the executive branch can thumb his nose at a branch of government that is incomplete in its assessment of the law. >> chris: ronald reagan's 11th commandment was thou shalt not speak ill of any other republican. i would submit that you have been breaking that. you say that mitt romney's plan for massachusetts "if our goal in healthcare reform is better care at lower cost we should take a lesson from romney care

which shows that socialized medicine does not work." socialized medicine? >> i think there is a difference in ronald reagan saying don't speak well of another republican and don't evaluate what another republican's proposals are. let's go back four years ago and look at all of the things i was criticized for by fellow republicans including mitt romney. policy issues are different. if you start attacking integrity that is different which i haven't done. the "wall street journal" analysis of the massachusetts healthcare bill showd that it was exactly almost a carbon copy at the state level of what obama care was at the national level. costs have gone up. they are out of control. people are waiting longer to see a doctor and the quality of healthcare is down and the people of massachusetts are less satisfied with their healthcare than they were before the program went into play. >> chris: is romney care is as it is, the signature issue for

mitt romney signature accomplishment as governor of massachusetts and you say in your book an experiment that grew up, socialized medicine. what does that say about his fitness to be the republican nominee for president? >> i don't think it disqualifies him. let me surprise you with this. i think the purpose of states are always to be laboratories of government. i wrote about this in the book and i quote justice from 1932. >> chris: is socialized medicine good conservative? >> not a good plan but he attempted something that he wanted to see would it work. i think his answer ought to be it is not what i really did, it is different. it really isn't that much different. i don't think he out to try to say well, it is the same plan but they didn't implement it the right way. we tried it and it didn't work like we thought but that is what states ought to do. i don't have a problem with any stuff in any state taking risks, trying something bold

but if it doesn't work let's not put it in all 50 states. >> sarah palin, michele bachmann and rush limbaugh all criticized michelle obama's antiobesity campaign as a nanny state run amuck. you say they are all wrong and in fact we should be thanking the first lady. >> i didn't say they are all wrong let's be clear because it sounds like i'm in a war with sarah palin and michele bachmann and rush limbaugh. michelle obama has proposed that we recognize that we have a serious obesity crisis which we do. 75% of the military eligible kids can't call qualify for the physical because they are overweight or obese. this is no longer a health issue an economic issue, it is becoming an issue of national security. >> less than two minutes less.

>> chris: two issues that you face if you get back into the process. all the got yous that you say you dread. if you do run for president. conservative fiscal groups said you you were a big tax and spender as governor of arkansas. taxes went up a net of $500 million during your years as governor including an increase in the sales tax. increase in the cigarette tax and a 3% income tax surcharge. >> the surcharge i did not support or sign and i did sign its repeal. that is a misnomer. secondly, the half million dollars sales tax was because of a court ordered education case that we had to deal with. >> chris: you had another sales tax increase when you came in as governor. >> that was a 1/8 for conservation which meant that we were able to dedicate a significant portion of funds for the preservation of the national state which is the states motto, natural preserves. it was supported by the voters. it was on the ballot. did i support it? yes. so did the voters and they voted for it.

here is what i did do. cut 94 taxes. the largest number of tax decreases in the history of the state. and in addition to that, we did some tax policy that really helped people at the bottom. eeliminateed the marriage pennalcy. improved the child care tax credit. we made sure that we cut the capital gains tax so that businesses could afford to keep going. that is a record that i am proud of. >> you going to decide when? >> i'm waiting to see what kind of reaction. this book is my message and what i stand for and what i believe. i want people to say that guy has ideas we could live with or maybe they will say this guy is a crazy fool. >> chris: if it tanks you are out? >> if you can't sell your own message chances are there is not a big constituency out there. to run for president you have to have people who believe what you stand for. >> chris: you said you will decide by this summer? >> at the latest.

>> chris: we will be watching for what you decide. thanks for being here. >> chris: up next, a report from libya and the sunday panel tells us if there is anything more that president obama can do to stop the massacre. cooked the cube steaks and steamed the veggies. entertained dad, and mom, and a neighbor or two. kept watch on the house when they slept. and tomorrow we could do even more. we're cleaner, domestic, abundant and ready now. we're america's natural gas. the smarter power today. learn more at anga.us. all your important legal matters in just minutes.

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get ready to defend libya. get ready to defend the great man made river. get ready to defend the oil. get ready to defend dignity, independence and glory. >> chris: that was libyan

dictator muammar qadaffi rallying supporters to fight to the bitter end. there are widespread reports forces loyal to qadaffi continue to shoot unarmed protesters. for more we turn to fox news correspondent leland vitter in eastern libya. >> the battle lines here are drawn north to south. in the east you have the rebels which have gained control of much of the country. they have set up shop and are bebeginning to take charge and have a provisional government set up to try to provide the basic needs for the citizens. in the west colonel qadaffi and his forces that control the capital of tripoli. very ar bands shooting on citizens. qadaffi, though, has now said that he is going to open up his arms depots to supporters and

order other civilians to take shots at the protesters to try to put them down. the united nations stepped in with sanctions against libya and also referred qadaffi to the international criminal court for his alleged attacks on civilians. of course, here both sides describing this as a no surrender situation and promising they will fight to the end. it may come down to a question of who is willing to spill the most blood. a couple of days ago, i was able to meet with one protester who was shot through the abdomen. we had a long discussion and i said was it worth being shot and he said i would gladly take a hundred bullets for the chance of freedom in my country. back to you. >> chris: leland, thanks for that. it is time now for our sunday group. bill kristol of the weekly standard. mara liasson of national public radio. former white house press dana perino and fox news political analyst one williams.

where is libya headed. is this bloodbath going to continue? >> i hope not and i think we can do more to end this quickly. qadaffi is losing ground. i think we should move quickly now, tone force a know fly zone and not let qadaffi use what part of his air force is remaining to kill libyans. probably enforce a no tank zone so he can't use tanks and armored tanks to kill people in the street and probably recognize the provisional government which set up the predicate for a some what orderly transition. qadaffi is going to lose. we can do a lot to make the civil war less bloody and make the loss much quicker. >> chris: there is growing criticism of the president's response. before we get to the mil mility option world leaders were calling for qadaffi to go. only yesterday that the president finally said qadaffi

should go. other are countries sent warships to evacuate. we sent a ferry. is the criticism legitimate? >> up to a point. the white house says the reason why it couldn't come out and call for qadaffi's exit until yesterday is because they were waiting for the ferry load of americans to get out of there and they were afraid of a hostage situation. they were afraid of how qadaffi might react beyond you could argue that maybe the united states should have been better prepared to evacuate its people but they did get them out and now the president is working hard at the united nations get sanctions and enforce a no fly zone. the white house might have been behind a bit but they caught up. >> chris: with you as forgiving and -- are you as forgiving and when you have a dictator who is willing to fight to the death, what can you do? should we enveteran's stadium enforce a no fly or no tank

zone? what could we do? >> they have more information than us in the situation room. they have the in tell against that we don't have at our disposal. the white house could have done is three days ago provided the information that mara provided to us. which is background to say this is why he is not coming out and saying, this is why he is not being as strong as you might have thought he wa was in egyp. give us some time. they only started doing the backgrounding three days afterwards so is does look like they are playing catchup. every president has multiple audiences. your allies and people at home and the people of libya. the people of libya did not hear a strong enough american support this week. >> chris: two questions, juan. one, what could we do? and two, does the president deserve more criticism for what he has failed to do so far? >> i think bill laid it out well.

the key is international cooperation. the united states has a lot of power and we could send ships into the mediterranean to protect the oil resources and that is a growing concern in this country with gas spiraling at the moment. we need to protect the oil sources. i think you want to prevent any signed of genocidal action by qadaffi but you do it in coordination with the international community. i don't think you want the united states intervening to the point where people are saying the united states is stirring the pot or qadaffi can blame the united states. with regard to the blame, i think people are knit picking. like they just want to go after president obama. clearly we had i believe it is 167 foreign service officers on the ground. you should protect those people. they are putting their lives on the line for the united states and i don't think that we have any reason or the president has any reason to come out and suddenly say this is why i'm doing it. if he says that to us then qadaffi.

>> i'm not saying he should have done it. the communications team could have done it effectively to call people three days ago and explain that rather than playing catch up. >> chris: but what about the people on the ground in libya. >> i think the chinese removed 15,000 nationals over the last week. the british and other european nations sent in warships. the british sent in a c 130 to send people out. wee rended we rented a ferry wt want to look too militaristic. i think it would have been kind of useful to move an aircraft carrier into the mediterranean. i think the president's response was wildly overcautious, reflect the view that god forbid the american people should look like they are helping the arab people overthrow a brutal dictator. what do you do when a dictator

wants to fight to death? you hasten his death and his departure. there is still -- he is still slaughtering people. >> do you think that it is reality that qadaffi is not a rational person that he is a terrorist and a sick man and do you think there is evidence historically that his response to american military efforts have been off the board and done things that are threat not only to his own people but middle east stability? >> what you are suggesting is wreckless action that was provocative to qadaffi. >> you just said he was a reckless sick man and you can't provoke such a man.c he is a little scared of the u.s. force and we didn't use enough force. having said that, fine, they were slow. we got the diplomats out. now, can we finally help the libyan people end this thing. >> chris: and you have no problem with the military

force, no fly zone. if there are tanks on the streets, take out the tanks? style magazine in conjunction with united nations. >> and you don't have a problem with that either? >> bill and i agree. >> chris: bringing you two together. >> an international coordinated effort 86 like that u.n. sanctions have been put in place and sending him to a criminal court, it is not about the united states, it is about the libyan people. >> chris: we have to take a break here. when we come back, can republicans and democrats here in washington cut a deal to prevent a government shutdown, at least for a couple of weeks?

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next week congress will focus on a short-term budget for the sake of our people and our economy we cannot allow gridlock to prevail.

>> all our goal as republicans is to make sensible reductions, not to shut down the government. >> chris: president obama and new republican senator rob fortmann both hoping to avoid a government shutdown but offering different solutions. we are back with the panel. the continuing resolution funding the government runs out this friday and the best it seems that congress can possibly come up with is a two week extension to avoid a government shutdown. house republicans who want to cut spending by $61 billion the next seven months said fine, give us the prorated amount which would be $4 billion. senate democrats said no way and then house republicans identified 4l $4 billion in cus that obama wants next year and said we will give you the cuts, we want the cuts this year. question, mara, will there be a deal and will they avoid a government shutdown for two week? >> i think they will avoid a government shutdown for two

weeks. both sides moved that the house proposal gets its $4 billion from things obama would have ended anyway and takes welcome some ear mark money. vulnerable democrats can say they voted for cuts and tea cuty members say see, we gut the agenda. after three or four weeks you can't do that any more. you have to decide on what level of spending cuts you will agree on for the remainder of this year. and what is the number? i mean i don't know what the number is but i do think that if it is anything close to what john boehner originally wanted which is about $30 million it will be a victory for republicans. >> chris: well, i -- i'm just a moderator. you think that the house republicans would agree to $30 billion in cuts total when

they are now on record asking for $61 billion in cuts? and more importantly, i guess, would the tea party freshmen allow him to sign on to that? >> there is no reason they should. they have the leverage right now. what senator reid has found is he has a formidable opponent in john boehner who is creative and has kept the new freshman class together with him for now and you might see some more creativity from there. he rules differently than nancy pelosi who really had a caucus and ruled with an iron fist. and bainer as we have seen recently opened up the flood gates and let people do their amendments. people have a little more stake in the process. and boehner is like the tortoise and the hear and he will come out ahead in the head. >> chris: if they work out a deal is it more on the house

republican terms, bigger, more cuts or the senate democrat and president's terms, smaller less cuts? >> smaller less cuts because there is tremendous pressure in the country to reduce the size of the deficit. when it comes down to the brass tax what are you actually cutting. talking about things like food safety, homeland security. border security. talking about things like education spending, schools. the american people are just not going to react well to that. they are just going to freak out and go what are you talking about. this is taking a hatchett to the budget, it is not doing something that is even going to produce jobs or grow the economy. that is not juan williams talking. that is diamondback goldman, s. >> they said if you cut so much

and that is a number that would mean so many jobs. if that worked the stimulus we would have unemployment under 8%. >> no, because we had continued losses and the losses were accelerating. that is the obama administration position. >> chris: we are going to go back to spending of 2008 and twine. and we remember things were just horrible in those days. >> i think republicans can stand up to the one williams goldman, sachs nexus. the republicans went home and they were nervous going home and the leadership was a little nervous. what are the freshmen going to hear. they going to go home and have the same experience the democrats had and the public wasn't thrilled to be spending $800 billion and the tea party got launched and the rest is history. john boehner's clever maneuvering here is that the republicans went home and the dog didn't bark. citizens are not outraged. juan wishes that they were

outraged. >> there was a conference call at the house. >> chris: we are running out of time. is there going to be a shut down eventually or not and if there isn't and they have to make a deal whose terms will it be under? >> there will not be a shut down i don't think it will be a good deal for republicans and shut real spending in real time. >> chris: the conventional wisdom is i think fair to say whether it is right or wrong is back in 1995 when there was a government shutdown it work today the benefit of president clinton and the detriment of newt gingrich and the house republicans. but there is big differences. i went back and checked. the deficit in 1995 was $164 billion. it is now $1.5 trillion. >> i mean people are in a mood to cut. they want the deficit resolved. here is the dirty little secret. what they are talking about now has nothing to do with cutting the deficit. it is about securitying spending that is for sure. the deficit is being drive been i thinks that none of these negotiations are about.

it is not about domesticthon defense discretionary. it is about entitlements and tax cuts. i think that both sides would be hurt by a government shutdown because it would look like, washington, can't get its act together. what kind of jokers are they that they can't even keep the government operating. there is a huge fever in the country to do something about the debt and deficit and spending. you don't have a leader like newt gingrich out there boasting about how he is going to shut the government down and i think it is very, very different. and you have the house republican, all house leadership in both houses saying we are not going to do it. >> chris: address juan's point and i think this is what democrats are counting on. when we tell you specifically what they are going to cut you will hate it. >> that will not work. >> my first day on the job was the first day of the first government shut down. i remember it well. lots of changes since then. 16 years or whatever it has

been. i think that the american people are not freaking out about it. i think that the senate democrats who of up for election in 2012 are hoping that this doesn't work, that the government doesn't get shut down and they have a chance to vote on some cuts. >> chris: thank you, panel. see you next week. check out panel plus where our group picks up with the discussion on our website foxnewssunday.com and we will post the video before noon eastern time. up next, our power players of the week. curtis: welcome back to geico gecko: kate from mill valley, it's all yours. kate: well, i'm shopping for my first car. gecko: nice! i do hope you'll choose geico and save a good bit of cash... curtis: what color is the car? i bet you'd look great in a blue car. kate: no...actually, i'm torn between a fuel-injected inline-6 and a higher torque turbo diesel. gecko: yeah...now that's quite a quandary! umm, i mean of course you could save either way. curtis: yeah but is one of them blue? cause i'd go with the blue one. anncr: geico. 15 minutes could save you 15% or more on car insurance.

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unitedhealthcare. >> chris: as protests spread across the middle east people are taking on the dictators every weapon they have. guns, the internet and even humor which brings us to our power players of the week. >> a half hour show that voice of america beams into iran each week. it takes on the regime by making fun of it. these are its createors. >> we need people to think again. ahmadinejad said if iran wants to build a nuclear bomb he has no fear of enemies. they are saying their fear is that you have no fear of using the bomb. >> during a protest in cairo, saumon pretended to be in tahrir square.

they say the rulers in tehran are easy to satirize like this week when they condemned what is happening in libya. >> they denounced the government's. and you listen so to these guys and you are like are you serious? >> what do you think of ahmadinejad? >> i think he is nuts. >> what do you think of the supreme leader. >> he is a tired old dictate. do you worry at all about your safety or the safety of relatives back in iran doing what you are doing? >> they call us the enemy and knowing their track record it does kind of scare you once in awhile but the fact is we are not like the kids. >> the regime tries to jam their show so people in iran can't watch it. which is how they came up with the show's title.

>> we called it static so if we ever by chance get through then we are hiding up the name of static. >> you remember all this, i foregot. >> it was a long night but i remember. >> chris: they are certainly getting through. they have 30 million followers on facebook. both men left iran years ago to escape the repression. now, they enjoy being the iranian version of jon stewart's daily show. >> you are the prophet. >> this is like driving hyundai for all your life and now this is ferrari. this is it. >> i'm excited. >> chris: they real illini there is a big difference from what stewart does. >> even if he jokes it is still democratic. we deal with tyrants and people that probably want to kill you. >> both men say their goal is

not revolution but they can't help dreaming. >> i think at some point we will be in iran during the show. >> chris: you will invite me. >> you will be a vip guest and we will take a plane there. >> i see it happening. >> chris: earlier this month, one of other friends on facebook was killed during a protest march in iran. that is it for today. have a great week and we'll see captioned by closed captioning services, inc.