tv Democracy Now LINKTV November 21, 2012 3:00pm-4:00pm PST
11/21/12 11/21/12 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] >> from pacifica, this is "democracy now!" >> the united states will work with our partners here in israel and across the region for outcome of bolster security for the people of israel, improves conditions for the people of gaza, and moves toward a comprehensive peace for all people of the region. >> as mediators try to secure a ceasefire, bombardment of gaza continues for an eighth day. the palestinian death toll has
topped 139. meanwhile, a bombing aboard a bus in tel aviv injures as many as 21 people in israel. we will go to gaza city to speak with "democracy now!" correspond sharif abdel kouddous and host a debate between the jewish institute for national security affairs and the palestine center. then, will black friday give walmart a black eye? >> because we live in america and we work for the world's largest company and we're still not making it. >> because after choosing between paying my bills -- >> because i'm 52 years old and i cannot afford my own apartment on what i make a walmart. >> walmart workers across the country planning to stage unprecedented walkouts and protests on friday, the busiest shopping day of the year. all of that and more coming up. this is "democracy now!," democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. violence continues to flare in
the israeli assault on the gaza strip as a cease-fire remains out of reach. and breaking news, about 21 people have been wounded in a bus bombing near military headquarters in the israeli city of tel aviv. israeli police say two suspects threw a bomb on to the bus before fleeing the scene. the attack marks one of the worst inside israel and several years. tuesday saw an unrelenting wave of israeli strikes on the gaza strip, with the palestinian toll climbing to over 139 dead and more than 1000 wounded. palestinian rocket fire also continues to hit israel from gaza. to israelis -- a civilian and a soldier -- were killed on tuesday, bringing the israeli death toll to 5 over the past week. the violence follows rumors of an imminent ceasefire announcement with secretary of state hillary clinton's arrival in the region tuesday night. a truce was reportedly agreed to through the egyptian government in cairo, but hamas and egyptian officials say is requested a
delay at the last second. shortly after her arrival, clinton spoke alongside the israeli benjamin -- minister benjamin netanyahu in a brief joint appearance. >> if there is a possibility of achieving a long-term solution to this problem through diplomatic means, we prefer that. but if not, i am sure you understand that israel will have to take whatever action is necessary to defend its people. >> in the days ahead, the united states will work with our partners here in israel and across the region toward an outcome that bolsters security for the people of israel. improved conditions for the people of gaza. and move toward a comprehensive peace for all people of the region. >> secretary of state clinton met with palestinian officials in the west bank today, but will not be going to gaza. on tuesday, the obama administration blocked a u.n. security council resolution on the gaza conflict seng fell to address the root cause of
palestinian rocket fire. among the latest palestinian victims were three palestinian journalists killed in their vehicle in gaza. after the attack, hamas government spokesperson condemned the killings of palestinian journalists. >> the israelis are going insane. they lost their minds. they're killing our children, killing our civilians, targeting everything today, targeting journalists. they tried all kinds of crime wars or war crimes, actually. >> tuesday marked the third consecutive day of israeli attacks on palestinian media. in separate incidents, israeli strikes also damaged gaza buildings housing offices of two media outlets. in other violence inside gaza, six men accused of being spies for israel were publicly executed in gaza city on tuesday, one of the bodies was
dragged through the streets. at least one young child was among the 31 palestinians reportedly killed on tuesday. according to unicef, israeli attacks on gaza have killed at least 22 palestinian children and left another 280 wounded, including 88 less than five years old. the palestinian health ministry has given a higher toll of 34 palestinian children dead. at least 11 israeli children have been wounded in rocket attacks in israel. at the united nations, relief officials expressed alarm amount of children killed. >> attacking schools and religious sites as well as reported the targeting of homes and media outlets in the past 48 hours raised serious concerns about israel's commitment to its obligation under international human rights and humanitarian law. >> children are showing signs of severe distress including an inability to sleep, being afraid to go out in public, clinging to parents, bedwetting, nightmares,
and withdrawal. the children are surrounded by images of death and destruction. there are constant funerals going on in the streets. there's a lot of chaos and panic. >> we will have more on gaza after headlines. syrian warplanes are continuing to bomb a suburb of the capital damascus for a second day in a bid to strike rebel-held areas. opposition activists say syrian government attacks have killed at least 23 people since monday. new figures show greenhouse gas emissions have reached an all- time high. on tuesday, the united nations said global emissions broke all previous records in 2011. unveiling an annual report on emissions, michel jarraud of the world year-old school organization warned the increase will likely assure a global temperature rise of more than two degrees celsius. >> the amount of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere once
again has reached a record level. the current concentration of the greenhouse gases like co2, like methane, like nitrous oxide are now such that the target of within two degrees temperature increase is getting increasingly unlikely. >> jarraud added the increase includes record levels of gases most responsible for global warming -- carbon dioxide, methane and nitrous oxide -- which will remain in the atmosphere for centuries. >> 1990, 2011, in the last 20 years, there have been a 30% increase, meaning an increase in the temperature. it is what causes the warming effect on our climate. some of these gases, in
particular co2, once released in the hemisphere, will stay there for very, very long time -- even centuries or longer. even if we were able to stop the missions tomorrow -- and we know it is not physical -- but even if we were able to do that, these greenhouse gases that have already been sent into the atmosphere will continue to have an effect for centuries. >> he is the executive or secretary general of the world media neurological organization. rebels and the democratic republic of congo have captured the country's largest eastern city doma in the ongoing fight with government troops. aid group said it temporarily suspended operations in several areas following violence that's caused the displacement of thousands of people. at the london nations, aid officials won the conflict between the drc government and the and 23 rebels is endangering
civilians. >> the entire committee working ongo arern c extremely concerned about the effect it is having on civilians and the displacement of them read they're concerned about the-- >> it prompted many people to flee toward goma and rwanda and a major id p camp has been virtually emptied. previously, the round 60,000 people there. >> the and 23 rebels are rwandan from hundreds of congolese soldiers turned themselves in to them, surrendered in goma. the united nations has disclosed a number of new aids infections has declined by half in 25 of the world's poorest countries. the unaids chief said the eradication of aids is within
reach. >> we're already achieving the minimal development goals of halting in reversing the aids epidemic. new hiv infections in aids- related deaths are declining. we still have only three countries in the world. thailand, uganda, and senate all as a model. today, 25 countries have reduced new infection by more than 50%. >> despite the progress made, some 2.4 million people were infected with aids last year while only 1.4 million received life-saving treatment for the first time. the u.s. government has joined with some of its biggest foreign rivals in opposing an international moratorium on capital punishment. the u.n. general assembly voted against the death penalty earlier this week by a vote of
110 to 39, with u.s. joined in opposition by countries including iran, north korea, syria, and china. british prosecutors have charged two former top executives at rupert mourdock's news international with bribing public officials for information. rebekah brooks, a former editor and onetime head of news international, is accused of conspiring to pay $160,000 in bribes to a british defense ministry official over a seven- year period. brooks has been a close confidante of mourdock's as well as a friend of british prime minister david cameron. in a separate incident, andy coulson, a former editor who once served as scammers spokesperson, is also facing bribery charges. he and brooks already face criminal charges stemming from the scandal that led to the shutdown of murdoch's news of the world tabloid last year amidst revelations executives and reporters conspired to hack phones and intercept communications.
four people -- two u.s. citizens and two permanent residents -- have been arrested on charges of plotting to join al qaeda and kill americans overseas. the fbi says three of the suspects were detained in california last week while the fourth was seized in afghanistan. they are accused of planning to meet without, militants to carry out attacks in afghanistan or yemen. dozens of undocumented college students marched tuesday to the office of kansas secretary of state kris kovach to demand he focus on his state level job instead of the anti-immigrant crackdowns across the nation. his credited with the anti- immigrant laws in arizona and alabama and continue to litigate issues related to immigration and other states. on his website, he refers to myself as a "defender of cities and states that fight illegal immigration." secretary of state kobach father lawsuit challenging president obama is deferred action program that provides temporary relief to some undocumented young
people. on tuesday, students from kansas and arizona delivered a letter calling on the secretary of state to focus on his state job or resign. a 13-year-old girl was shot and killed in miami on tuesday while riding on a private bus to school. the shooting occurred in front of the victim's younger sister and seven other students. a male student has been arrested for the shooting and remains in custody. a federal judge has rejected a request by lawyers for accused attacker jeremy hammond to release the prison activist and be under house arrest. he's accused of being a member of the group anonymous and has been charged with hacking into the computers of the private intelligence firm stratfor are. the whistleblowing website wikileaks has continued to release the stratfor documents, which number in the billions. supporters say the documents shed light on how the private intelligence firm onagers activists and spies for corporate clients. jeremy hammond has been held without bail or to offer more
than eight months. this lawyers argued tuesday the accused hacker would be unable to review the troves of digitize evidence related to the case from jail, but their request for his release was denied. jeremy hammond's supporters defended his actions. >> the media calls germy a hacker and member of anonymous. the courts call him a criminal. we call jeremy a hero and we ask, what crimes has jeremy committed that have equal expose the crimes committed by the very state prosecuting him? again we say, exposing the crimes of the state is not a crime. >> those are some of the headlines. this is "democracy now!," democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. >> welcome to all our listeners and viewers from around the country and around the world. the israeli bombardment of gaza has entered its eighth day with the palestinian death toll now
topping 139. more than 1200 people have been injured. on tuesday, to that israelis died in rocket attacks bringing the israeli death toll in the past week to five. earlier today, 21 people were injured in these really city of televisa when a bomb exploded aboard a crowded bus. israeli police say two suspects threw a bomb onto the bus before fleeing the scene. the attack marks one of the worst inside israel in several years. so far, no one has claimed responsibility for the bombings. >> international efforts to secure a ceasefire have so far been unsuccessful. hillary clinton has just arrived in egypt where she will hold talks with egyptian president morsi about a possible truce in gaza. clinton already has met with palestinian president abbas and ramallah and israeli print minister benjamin netanyahu in jerusalem. we go to gaza city where we're joined by "democracy now!" course on sharif abdel kouddous.
this latest article was just published by "the nation." explain how you got into gaza and what is happening there now. >> i got in through the rafah border crossing, the only border that bosra has to the outside world not controlled by israel. i had to wait three days on the border to get in from egypt, but i eventually did. it is really a dystopian reality, one of raleigh -- widespread violence and suffering. there is heavy naval bombing with the buzz of the drones overhead that really gives you the feeling of being under constant threat. you can hear the outgoing rockets being fired into israel. the streets are quite empty, shops are closed, there's a heavy tension in the air. last night, talks of a cease- fire were under way. it was particularly brutal. there was a nonstop barrage of
bombing that made the ground literally shake every 10 minutes. this was as clinton was arriving in israel, i believe, for these talks. around 2:00 in the morning, there was a missile strike that landed in an open area not more than 30 yards from where i'm staying in my hotel and two hotels there by our housing many journalists, blew out the windows of the surrounding buildings including my hotel room, left a massive crater in the ground. one journalist told me -- journalists were in the lobby for the summer and shot and some are laughing nervously. one said, this is intimidation. this is a fraction of what many have gone through in gaza. nearly 140 have been killed, mostly civilians, 34 of them children. the attack last night, which was terrifying, it followed attacks that hit the offices of al
jazeera and agence france presse. yesterday, they proudly admitted killing two palestinian journalists in their car. that strike in the car happened on the corner of a school run by the united nations, which yesterday was turned into a mass of shelter for displaced gazans. more than 1800 came to the school yesterday after the israeli military dropped leaflets on towns in northern gaza, ordering residents to evacuate their houses. many fled after reading these leaflets. they were hit with fear and panic. in the bombings started, so they fled. many of them left behind most of their belongings. these families are crammed into the classrooms of these schools, with little water and have not eaten since last night.
there are many traumatized children. one could not stop willing and throwing herself on the floor. her mother said she had been like that since the bombing last week. another mother said her 13-year- old daughter could not stop crying unless she is being held by someone and embraced because she's overcome by fear. this is what's gaza is like. the threat of bombing in violence is ever-present. the infrastructure here is being systematically destroyed. it israel targeted a large bank, targeting one of the biggest drag so far was the civil administration building. they target police stations. the edifices are being destroyed. people have little recourse for any kind of safety. >> quickly, did you hear about what happened in televisa? what is the reaction in gaza right now with the bombing of the bus? >> i did hear on the streets. i cannot hear the latest news as
much, but, ino, i did not hear much reaction. there was a bombing of a bus. some people were hurt. this is the reality of gaza every few minutes. you know, the reaction here, i mean, i honestly did not know the news until i came back to the hotel room to be on the show so i cannot really speak to that. what i can say, the difference -- there is no equality and what is happening in israel and gaza. the number of people being killed, the number of buildings been destroyed, the number of people being wounded is nothing compared to what is happening in israel. i think news organizations have to report what is happening fairly. fairly is the cold hard numbers speak to the reality of what is happening. >> you have just come from cairo. how is the role of egypt and mohamed morsi's new government
there being interpreted in gaza? what the people there expect egypt to do? >> most gazans sought egypt as standing with gaza. this ought egypt sending the prime minister for a visit to gaza as a real show of solidarity. however, if you look at the policy, it is not really changed at all. there's been an easing since the mubarak era. it is still largely closed to trade with -- to trade. they ignore human rights and justice and equity. they're looking at it from a security issue, which does not make or is not a real break a policy from mubarak's era.
i think there is not an insignificant things that morsi has done that has helped to significantly change the tone of the issue of israel and palestine in the middle east, but in terms of actual policy, not much has changed. >> is that because the military is still determining egypt -- the israel-palestine policy and not so much the demonstration of morsi? >> for years, the entire palestine issue was not handled by the egyptian ministry of foreign affairs but by military intelligence. yes, that is a separate state institution that still does deal really with the issue of the rafah crossing, to whom ever mission is received and should be passed from hon a crackdown on militants. these are the kind of questions that asked an absence are questions of historic rights and justice and law. to the large extent, the
security services are still in control. for me to get into gaza, i had to some of my papers to [indiscernible] and it to me three or four days to get in. that is the issue. that is the fear that over the long term, not much will change. even if we as these -- achieve a ceasefire, the cycle of violence stops, we have to look at the long term. the long-term issue is, gaza is under occupation. this is the root cause of the problem. if that problem is not solved or tackled, a new cycle of violence will occur. >> as you're going over the rafah crossing, is it true that hundreds were also going to bring aid to the opening in rafah? >> yes, this was really an inspiring display of revolutionary initiative. over 500 activists boarded buses from near tahrir, came to the
rafah border crossing and basically told the border guards, if you don't let this go through, we will cause a huge problem for you and morsi. they unfurled a massive palestinian flag and started chanting in the departure hall. what must of been an unprecedented move, they were let in and came to gaza. there were only allowed to stay one night, but they did visit the main hospital. i think many people in gaza were very touched by the display of solidarity. it also shows really what happens on the ground in egypt with social movements and so forth, really has the most powerful effect rather than the top-level government issues. >> quickly, the reporters killed in a car, the idf has just tweeted "warning to reporters in gaza. stay away from him as opera chips and facilities. hamas will use you as human
shields." the three reporters with -- tv. >> i want the idea of spokesperson to tell me if i'm standing next to hamas people so i don't get killed. these kinds of threats, i don't know what they're meant to do. the rhetoric coming from israel, probably in meeting to assassinating journalists, to say, stay away from hamas because they're targeting anything. there was a hamas official in the hospital or does came from, are they going to bomb the hospital now? are they going to bomb schools? civilians are being killed. that is a fact. that is what is happening. either israel has pinpoint accuracy and is targeting these civilians, or they don't have pinpoint accuracy and they are raiding hellfire down on one of the most densely populated places on earth. there is no other explanation.
>> thank you for being with us, sharif abdel kouddous. the very, very careful. his latest piece is in "the nation" magazine. to clarify, the three journalists who were killed, two for cameramen t working forv, killed when their car was bombed by the israeli military, and a third was killed and another israeli missile attack. he was an employee for educational radio, a private station. israel also struck a building that houses the offices of the french news agency. when we come back, a debate on what is happening right now in gaza. this is "democracy now!," democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. ♪ [music break] ♪ [music break]
>> this is "democracy now!," democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. his efforts to secure a ceasefire between israel and hamas continue, we host a debate. james colbert joins us, policy director for jinsa, the jewish institute for national security affairs. yousef munayyer is executive director of the jerusalem fund and its educational program, the palestine center. james colbert, we have figures, and they're changing every moment, more than 139 palestinians have been killed, five israelis have been killed, the cease-fire has not been achieved at this point. the israeli military is continuing to bombard gaza and in tel aviv, with a bomb exploding on a bus, injuring
about 21 people. talk about what is happening right now. >> you're seeing an ongoing conflict hamas is raging against israel that has been going on for a very long time. it cycles up as a mass feels more emboldened by changes in egypt, changes in support from iran and other changes related to the palestinian authority. the rapidly has increased the amount of rocket fire into israel and then took the unprecedented, but further step in week and a half ago of targeting israelis in israel not for indirect fire rockets and mortars, but i direct fire, anti-tank missiles and to any israeli position and they buried on that was tunnelled under sovereign israeli territory, both of which resulted in
casualties to the israeli military. this is seen in israel as an escalation in conjunction with the massive increase rocket fire, paralyzing the south of israel. the israeli authorities believe they could no longer sit by and not respond to this latest round of fighting the hamas initiative. >> can you respond to what james said and also talk specifically about what you do in your most recent article, yousef munayyer? >> i think one of the biggest mistakes we make is we totally removed the situation from the context in which it is in. to describe this as a war is incorrect. if it is a war, it is a war on the people of gaza. to describe it as a war increase the impression there are two people sides in any way is really misleading. this is not an international conflict between two states. this is a domestic issue within
the israeli state that it is using massive force to repress the palestinian population. if you look at the gaza strip on the map, it is this tiny strip of land in the corner of what was palestine. a 80% of the people there are not from the gaza strip. there from outside the gaza strip. they were made refugees in 1948. what you have is literally the backing of thousands of people -- millions of people come into a corner. -- millions of people, into a corner. until we look at the underlying causes here, this type of really horrific scenes we're seeing is going to perpetuate. >> james colbert, can you respond to that? what do you see as the underlying causes of this conflict? >> it is hamas's absent
rejection of the israeli state, the manifesto, if you will come explicitly calls for the elimination of jews and israelis, the israeli state and its replacement with a bureaucratic islamist finalist published fundamentalist state to be ruled by sharia law. it expands even larger, possibly the world. areorganization's goals well known. they do not shy from announcing them and repeating them. this is the proximate cause, the underlying cause in an ongoing struggle by many organizations and groups to delegitimize israel, removed is your from the region because they consider to be an illegitimate state. >> what do you see as the reason for the latest israeli assault on gaza? what was the cause of this? >> the most recent we already
discussed, the ratcheting up of violence perpetuated by hamas against israel. it has not gone away. if you look at the number of rocket and mortar attacks, it has been ongoing for the last several years. what is really simply try to do is deter hamas from launching any more rockets and mortars. >> let's let's yousef munayyer respond. what you see as the timeline. >> i disagree with the timeline. if you only want to look at the actions of palestinians, then you will only noticed the time line that is convenient for your narrative. if you look at all of the facts, there is persistent violations territory, violations of palestinian human rights and side gaza to the firing on fisherman to the firing of people inside gossip from the outside, bombardment three
airstrikes. this began on the eighth of november when the idf, the israeli military, a pathologist it crossed into gaza and killed a 12-year-old boy during clashes. this is when the responses began. the responses were fairly limited and the situation began to die down for 24 hours. there was a lot quiet where we thought this was going to end. at the end of the 24 hours, it was when the hamas leader jabari working on a long-term cease fire with the israelis they decided to assassinate him. the other point i want to respond to is the question about palestinians to nine the israeli state's right to exist. if you look at the declaration, one does that exist. there's a universal declaration of human rights. the jimmy dullish legitimacy of state is based on people respecting human life in their
borders. the question is not does israel have a right to exist, but the way in which israel exists, as a colonizers and occupier and apartheid state, right? i think many people throughout the world are 100% within their rights to say, no, this is not right. this is what has been going on for 64 years. the genesis is not with the creation of hamas. it goes back much farther to the depopulation of palestine in 1948. i think if we want to start our calendars and dates that are convenient for us, we will have a problem. we have to look back at what the entire context is, and that begins with the zionist colonization of palestine. >> james colbert, can you respond to what yousef munayyer has said? >> absolutely not. using slogans such as the population and apartheid -- this is not a debate.
this is just sloganeering. these terms have no basis in a reality. on one hand i hear claims of genocide, of an attack on the civilian population, and yet what we see after hundreds of israeli airstrikes, all of which were nearly all of which are video and put online, how can israel drops so much tonnage of precision weaponry over and over for days, destroying hamas rocket arsenals and the the reports from as it is, 130 plus people have been killed. unprecedented in warfare. >> i don't understand. are you saying that is a lot or a little? what i think it is unbelievably little >> 139 and hundreds wounded? what we're talking about the tonnage of precision weaponry dropped on hamas arsenals, which are put in civilian structures,
based upon hospitals and apartments -- >> you're talking about 139 people killed, many children, and over 1000 wounded. this is not a large number of people? >> is this not a large number of people? >> at least 139 is the last count and over 1000 people when it. >> when any person loses their life in a conflict, it is a terrible tragedy. however, israel is trying to destroy the hamas weaponry that is placed amidst the civilian population of gaza. it shows the character israel is trying to avoid civilian casualties that so few relatively have been killed considering where these missions are stored intentionally, where there fired from. video evidence by the hundreds shows, as it chooses to launch rockets from the courtyards of mosques, hospitals, and schools, roofs of apartment buildings. this is a military force that cloaks itself in the civilian
population and there's its enemy to attack it. meanwhile, showing no compulsion about attacking israelis directly and announcing their target is civilians free of the you cannot compare the two. >> i want to turn to the role of the u.s. in the present situation in gaza. a clip now president obama responding to a question about israel during the third presidential debate last month in florida. moderator bob schieffer asked the candidates would be "willing to declare an attack on israel is an attack on the united states." this is part of president obama's response. >> first of all, israel is a true friend, our greatest ally in the region. if israel is attacked, america will stand with them. i have made that clear throughout my presidency. we have already made that declaration. >> i will stand with israel if
they are attacked. this is the reason why -- working with his role of critic the strongest military cooperation between our two countries in history. in fact, this week we will carry out the largest of the to exercise -- august military exercise with israel. that is this week. >> yousef munayyer, can you respond to what president obama said? >> he is describing his policy. he stood 1/2% by the israelis. i think the problem is, it shows a complete lack of strategy of how to move this forward, strategic thinking that echoed, by the way, in the israeli government. they're referring to what they're doing in gaza as mowing the lawn. the bombardment of and largely civilian population, most of whom are refugees, they refer to with the callous idiom of mowing the lawn.
and bombardment they have to do to set at the capacity of the factions there. that is not strategic. what morality is there an award is repetition is planned? there is none. there is the strategic thinking in israel about how to move the situation florida. the answer from them has always been to respond to palestinians with force. you simply cannot think mowing the lawn is going to succeed. a note to our -- on the language, it is a problem with describing them as a native or indigenous, take it up with the zionists who quite those terms in the early 20th century. >> let's go back to president obama on sunday. >> there's no country on earth that would tolerate missiles raining down on its citizens from outside its borders. we're fully supportive of
israel's right to defend itself from missiles landing on people's homes and workplaces and potentially killing civilians. >> yousef munayyer and then james colbert respond to this. >> i think the problem again is the lack of context. what nation would accept being depopulated from their homes, being colonized, being besieged, being trapped, been bombarded? what nation would accept that and accept have no right to self-defense? there is no security for anybody when the idea of security is a zero sum game rid unfortunately, that is the thinking we have seen at of israel. as long as the palestinians are more insecure, the israelis will be more secure. but that is simply not the case. >> james colbert, what do you see as a solution? >> this solution to which specific issue are you referring? it is very important to note.
>> what is happening right now, the bombardment of gaza by the israeli military and also the broader solution to how this conflict will end, which clearly, endangers the security of palestinians as well as israelis. >> the immediate hostilities could be brought to a conclusion if the hamas is willing to abide by a cease- fire, which has structural elements that show it will last, not simply a status quo where -- which we assume the past, or the rocket fire will increase over time to appoint or the sovereign government israel cannot sit idly by while its citizens are attack from the territory outside the borders of its state. i am petraeus to understand the description of gaza as occupied considering the israelis withdrew from it and in many critics have said by many ways they have paid a secure a price either withdraw because had they still been there, these rockets
would not be flying. his release chose to do that because they were seeking peace -- israelis chose to do that because they were seeking peace. they pay a security price for not being there. >> an that issue of occupied bosra? >> occupation is to find effective control over territory according to international law. just because they're remove the colonists who were there in 2005, who should never have been there to begin with because it is illegal under international law, does that mean they no longer exercise effective control over gaza. to think they do not is to say that you do not effectively controlled the life of a fish living in a fishbowl in your house because you don't swim with it. >> that is a ridiculous analogy. >> they control what goes in and out of gaza, the aerospace, imports and exports. they control who gets to go from
gaza to the west bank, which is a violation of the concord they agreed to. the idea that there is no control is preposterous. >> that point alone, hamas, which took over the gaza strip, made sure there would never be another election after winning yet, throughout flattop in a brutal but civil war in which fattal activists were thrown from the roofs of buildings rather than being perpetuated somewhere else, to this day, gaza's occupation is nonexistent. it is not occupied. these terms -- international law, we could discuss the territories as the remaining 10% of the old palestine mandate. there's a history that can be opened up and looked at. but the call of the people in gaza refugees and israelis colonists, the slogans and terms take this discussion and put it right back into a gutter, of which there will be no progress. none at all.
israel is a liberal and tolerant state that exists. to pretend it isn't or is illegitimate really set the stage for no progress at all. the help of the israelis has been focused on the palestinian authority which has taken a backseat to hamas and its violence and it's expected support from egypt and the support is receiving from iran. >> yousef munayyer you made a comparison, as have others, of the most recent israeli military strikes on gaza and what happened four years ago during operation cast lead. you say the cause has something to do with the forthcoming elections in israel. can you talk about that? >> when you look at the dynamics of fire over the past several years and you look at when the rockets and projectiles had been fired from gaza, the vast majority have occurred, probably
over 90%, after israeli extrajudicial assassinations in the gaza strip. the israelis can control the escalation here with their ability to inflict high casualties in the gaza strip. it is very clear from a point of view of security that the way to solve this problem is through dealing with the parties on the ground. every time they have done that, through third parties with the egyptians, they have been able to largely limit this rocket fire while the same time continuing to have their way with the people in the gaza strip through periodic violations. the question here is, why now? you look at the situation now and look at the fact this did not have to happen. the israelis knew by attacking in the gaza strip and murdering jabari that there would only provoke a significant amount of rockets, so why do it?
the only answer is they are domestic, political calculations here on the part of the israeli government. we saw the same things par to cast lead in the is to the operation in 2006. -- and the israeli operation in 2006. there's a correlation between the military operation and elections happening shortly thereafter. >> t c a one-day or two-day solution being solution, ultimately, james colbert? what's that ultimately, the united states government is committed to a two-day solution in the israeli government has accepted it. the problem is finding a partner working toward that goal. as far as recently said, i'm sorry, but the assassination of the hamas leader, the targeting killing of an known terrorist with blood on his hands, this is saying that the u.s. should not have taken at osama bin laden because by doing so you would inflame al qaeda worldwide and
invite more attacks to the united states. free democracy the show justice and show its people it takes care of them, it must follow through on its laws. hamas is considered a terrorist organization by europe, is row, the u.s. and other countries. this is not some kind of benign entity.= >> yousef munayyer, your final response? what's the reality is, between river and see, there are a least 10 million people, almost half of them are palestinian arabs. the vast majority of which have no right to vote for the state that controls them. that is the reality on the ground. if our friend here wants to call that democracy, i think we should probably be engaged in a profession of rewriting dictionaries. that is not with that is. that is the fact of apartheid.
the u.s. has only helped perpetuate the situation by telling the israelis there are no costs to occupation and that may perpetual occupation an option. >> thank you for being with us, yousef munayyer, executive director of the jerusalem fund, its educational program, the palestine center. and james colbert, policy director for the jewish institute for national security affairs. at least nine palestinians have been killed in air strikes so far today, bringing the palestinian death toll to 146, up to 21 people injured in a bus bombing in the israeli city of tel levee. jerusalem post reports none of the injuries to those wounded in the bus bombing are life- threatening. two israelis, a soldier and child, were killed, bringing the death toll for israel to five. u.s. secretary state clinton is spending with egyptian president morsi as we broadcast to discuss a possible truce in gaza. we will be back and a mom.
>> this is "democracy now!," democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. >> the nation's largest private employer walmart is seeking to block a series of protests and actions critical of its labor conditions at stores nationwide. late last week, walmart filed an unfair labor practice charge against the united food and commercial workers international union, or ufcw, claiming it's unlawfully try to disrupt its business. the move comes just days before a group of walmart workers are preparing to strike on black friday, the busiest shopping day of the year in the united states.
the strike will be accompanied by rallies and flash mobs outside walmart stores nationwide. one of the groups organizing protests is our walmart -- the organization united for respect at walmart. in an advocacy video, walmart workers explain why they are planning to walk out. >> because together, we're stronger than alone. >> because i like to make a difference for those who are too scared to come aboard. >> because will market afford to pay us better. >> stand up, live better. >> to talk more, we're joined by william fletcher, a wal-mart worker and josh eidelson is a contributing writer for "the nation's." we welcome you both to "democracy now!" what are your plans for friday? >> friday, we're planning to have walked out that many of our stores. the one i work that is one of them. we're hoping to have as much of
the committee joined us so we can try to make a strong impression that walmart will listen to us and and retaliation that happens in the stores nationwide. >> what are they doing? why are you protesting? >> whenever an associate tries to speak out or worker tries to speak out to the media or anyone, really, about what happens in our stores and the way we are treated, they get retaliated against. many are fired, threatened, pulled into the office with three or four managers and talk to for about an hour or longer. we are doing it because we don't want associates to feel they should be afraid to speak out. it is our rights as american workers and american citizens. >> we invited walmart to join us on today's show. they declined our invitation, but their national media relations director kory
lundberg issued this statement -- william fletcher, can you respond to that statement from walmart? >> simply, it is not true. every member of our walmart is a former walmart employee. that is fact. as to their not one to be that many stores participating, we're looking at about 1000 stores nationwide i would say that is large. as to being union, we are not. we're just the wal-mart employees who have gotten
together to say we're tired of the way we're being treated and the retaliation. >> josh eidelson, first of all, respond to what the spokesman said and the wider significance of these protests planned for the next friday. >> walmart has a public and private message. the public messages, dismissing these workers is fringe. the private is in meetings been held on work time it walmart does not like to waste money, paying workers to sit in a room and be lectured to about why they should not participate in these strikes. i spoke to a worker in oklahoma, a manager read off questions and answers during a meeting. one question was, if we participate in this action could we be fired? the answer was, no comment. and the manager left. in terms of larger significance,
walmart is a pioneer both in the low wage business model, which even union competitors of walmart have had to emulate or chose to emulate. walmart is the pioneer in human busting. in the wake walmart has fought off unionization has been copied by other companies. if you can make walmart say yes when it wants to say no, all kinds of things are possible for the labor movement. if you cannot, there is a cramped future to the labor movement as more companies follow their lead. >> on tuesday, our walmart announced they had filed a charge for the national labor relations board saying walmart was making illegal threats to prevent workers from joining the black friday protests. in particular, they cited this statement by walmart spokesperson david tovar from monday's edition of "cbs evening news." >> just another union publicity stunt and the numbers they're talking about are grossly exaggerated.
if the assessment are scheduled to work on black friday, we expect them to shop and do their job. if they don't, depending on the could bences, there consequences. >> can you respond to that? >> my analysis for "the nation," wal-mart would have to prove first, they might be able to prove ufcw, even though it is not the group named in the protest, has a legal responsibility. what was seem very hard for them to prove, based on everything that is public, is these are strikes trying to win union recognition rather than strikes fighting against retaliation. i have asked walmart for evidence and have not provided any. what seems more likely is this charge is designed to make workers think these strikes are not legally protected, and it is part of a campaign to make workers believe they could be fired if they participate on friday.
>> william fletcher, as you and helping to organize for black friday, have people, walmart workers, spoken to about these kinds of threats in the event they do participate? >> yes, many of them have. a lot of assessing its are afraid to speak out. they're even afraid for me to speak out. simply the answer to that is to simply not be afraid. this company is an expert at propaganda. it is what they do, what they're great at. that is what they have been doing to us. they have been spreading this year campaign that makes associates feel if they speak out that something will happen. again, it is our right as american workers. i cannot stress the importance of everyone. if you see something wrong, feels something is wrong, speak up. >> we have to leave it there but we will continue to see whether these protests on black friday will give walmart a black eye.
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