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tv   Inside Story  LINKTV  October 19, 2021 5:30am-6:01am PDT

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>> time for a quick check of the top stories. colin powell them remembered as a trailblazing soldier and double met after his death from covid-19 come occasions. he was the first african-american to become chairman of the chiefs and u.s. secretary of state. >> secretary powell was simply and completely a leader. he knew how to ruled -- to build a strong and united team. he treated people how he expected them to treat each other and made sure he knew -- they knew he would always have their back. the result was that his people
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would walk through walls for him. >> the u.s. state department watchdog will review the end of the biden administration operations in afghanistan. it will take in the evacuation of the embassy and how the special immigrant visa program was handled. it includes processing of afghanistan's as refugees and resettlement in the united states. the u.s. envoy to afghanistan has stepped down. his resignation comes less than two months after america's withdrawal from afghanistan. he led trump administration talks with the taliban that resulted in the agreement for u.s. troops to leave. as deputy, thomas west has been named to take over. at least 43 people have been killed by attackers in a nigerian state. gunmen stormed a market on sunday and the assault carried on until monday morning. attacks by gangs have been increasing in northern nigeria. the death toll after floods and landslides in a southern indian state threatens at least 35.
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more rains expect of this week. the ethiopian air force has launched attacks on rebels in the capital. a tv station said three people were killed. ethiopian state media said info structure was targeted. this follows intensified fighting in two other regions where the military is trying to push back against territorial gains by rebels. the streets of port-au-prince are largely empty after unions and organizations called a strike to protest against haiti's dire security situation. this follows the kidnapping of christian missionaries and family members. a team was sent to haiti to get them released. those were the headlines. the news continues after inside story. stay tuned. ♪
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peter: protesters in sudan demanding resignation of the government. a widening between citizens and military leaders, could this affect the transition into democratic rule? what is the way out of this crisis? this is "inside story." ♪ hello and welcome to the program. sudan has been led by a government made up of civilian and military leaders for more than two years now. tension has arisen between those in charge and steering the
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country toward elections under a power-sharing deal, that allows the forces of freedom and change, a civilian coalition that led a protest against the longtime leader, omar al-bashir. that group is to manning representation in the government -- is demanding representation in the government. those who back the military have called on generals to take control of the country. thousands are holding a sit in in front of the presidential palace in khartoum. the president has warned this is the worst political crisis in years. >> i would not be exaggerating if i said this political crisis is the worst and most dangerous crisis that threatens the transition and even threatens our entire country and warns of a terrible evil. this is due to the deep splits among civilians and the military, as well as between the civilians and the military. peter: we will get to our guests
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in the military. first, we set up our discussion. reporter: the sit in in front of the presidential palace is in the third day with protesters demanding the prime minister dissolve the executive cabinet and form one they say is more representative of those who participated in the revolution in 2018. thousands gathered in front of the presidential palace here in khartoum, but today, a few hundred of the protesters went to the prime minister's office as an emergency cabinet meeting was held to try and pressure him to dissolve the cabin he is meeting with. -- the cabinet he is meeting with. this coalition is a subset of that that led protests against the former president, omar al-bashir. they say they are not represented in the government despite that they took part in the revolution. the issue of representation is
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not just an issue here. in the east, there are protesters who have been blocking the road for a month, saying an agreement signed october of last year is not representative and they are demanding the government cancel that and start negotiations for a peace agreement that has to do with the east. sudan is a country with many ethnicities, tribes and coalitions. many have taken part in the revolution. but many say they are not represented in the current transitional government. the prime minister has described the current crisis as the most dangerous in sudan's history, and has called for dialogue. so far, that has yet to happen. peter: tensions between the military and civilian sides of the suit on's government have increased since -- sudan's government have increased since last month attempted coup. there have been calls for
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replacement of the cabinet. support for the transitional government has dropped in recent months after it slashed fuel subsidies and inflation soared. while those that back a civilian leadership have accused the armed forces of wanting to take back control. ♪ let's bring in our guests. joining us from khartoum is mubarak ardol from the democratic alliance for social justice. we have waleed madibo, president of the sudan policy for imputed and also -- policy forum. and also hajooj kuka, an award-winning film maker. it has been described as one of the worst crises they have had in years, but is the prime minister part of the problem and not part of the solution?
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mubarak: let me greet your guests, i want to wish the best movement of sudan for transformation and revolution. the problem here in sudan is one of the big problems we are facing. we describe it as it is easy to be solved and easy to be addressed. the people can sit in together, especially the people that hijacked the government of the revolution, who are now taking the government from the suburban counsel to the council of ministries. they have to sit and discuss
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with others to expand the participation of the government, to bring others to the government, to expand the participation, socially and politically, in order to avoid the country from going into a dark era. peter: let me pause you there and put that point to waleed madibo. if the country is to expand politically, if that is a solution, that means getting more people involved in the process. at the moment, we understand the military is not united. the civilian administration is not united. so with that as a back story, how do you bring more people into the process? waleed: i can understand the sense of frustration of the sudanese people with the forces of freedom and change. in a way, they have been manipulating the general
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assembly, the center of policy and executive office. however, i can't understand how dissolving the government can help resolve the situation, because if there is any failure, it is the failure of the sovereign and the prime minister's office. when we speak about being more inclusive, representative, i think we should think about ways by which we can make the process of negotiation within the forces of freedom and change more democratic and more inclusive. that can be achieved by getting engaged in deliberative sessions that put the higher strategic
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objective insight. the higher strategic objective is making sure this transition is successful. if it is not successful, we will get into, get back into areas of authoritarianism and totalitarianism. when we speak about expanding the government and being more inclusive, we have to speak about the legislative body, we have to speak about the commissions, we have to speak about the security reform. we cannot simply speak about the prime minister's office. all in all, there are at least 26 ministers. we cannot all be included in the council of the prime minister's office. but we can get included in other forms of government. peter: ok, hajooj kuka, the people you speak for and the people you speak to, how unified are they?
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hajooj: let's talk about the urgency of the moment. we are talking because there's something very urgent. there are protests and a sit in in the street that does not look like anything in the revolution. when the youth go to the sit in, they are not welcome, it's because it is obviously orchestrated by rebel groups by national security officers. some really weird sit in where there are tents and food being delivered. it does not look like a revolution and it is right in front of the palace, a place we could never reach good it -- never reach. it is definitely ok by the military and committee. this is the real problem, and what we as revolutionaries look at, that we see this as handing over power to the military. our revolution was against two
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things, the dictator in the military. the military was supposed to handle the chairmanship to civilians very soon. with this timely sit in and attack on the government, it is a way for not handing it over to civilians. what we have on the street is not to stop more dice -- diverse people in the government, it is to stop the military from taking power. when people go out on the 21st, it is to stop people from giving over power, to stop the minister of economy, and others. these are people in the government. i'm really disappointed in a friend and comrade in the revolution. out of everybody, he has been very close to this and it is baffling to me how he thinks, although he is in government, in
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a very high position in government, and how does he think he needs to change. i feel like this is not the right time for what he is doing or the right way to attack and change the government. the government needs to be changed from inside. he is inside, but to hand over the government to military rule and go back to dictatorship is a surprising and exactly what we are fighting. peter: ok, i am assuming you want or need to have good relations with the military. there are people looking in on your country, saying the military will never relinquish what they've got at the moment because they are worried that at some point, they have been held -- they will be held accountable. mubarak: let me remind hajooj kuka that we are coming from a different background. peter: it is quite a short
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program, could you just answer the question? mubarak: the missionaries, you don't need to describe them as revolutionaries. they are coming from different backgrounds and areas. we are in semi democratic era. you don't need to say they are a different group. they are part of the agreement. they are already of a political movement. and now we are having a serious problem of the democratic institution or issues related to the government. the military relations as described in the constitutional government, we don't need to give them more than what they have, and it is to have their rights and keep our relation with them.
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sudan is in a region that is facing some stability problems, security and political instability. there is a fragile peace in south sudan, and there are problems in the western side of the country. we don't need an escalation in the relation between the military and civilians, until we face the problems of instability. that would increase other problems and we would go back to the era of al-bashir. we need good relations and and the era -- end the era of transition and enter the democratic era. we have to go for serious measures of democratization. peter: just let me boil those
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points down if i can and put those two waleed madibo. the military is also making demands. what is the difference between the military making its own demands of the civilian part of the administration or indeed the people of the country? what is the difference between that and the military basically aging a power grab -- staging a power grab? waleed: if you look at the situation, the military officers keep accusing the civilian government of failure. but the army itself has been part of that failure. they have obstructing justice. they -- the peace agreement, that is causing a lot of trouble now. they had foreign affairs, they
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went ahead without consulting the sudanese people. they refused to bring into account the companies they have been administering for almost three decades. what i see here, peter, given the situation of political instability, i don't see a problem with the president continuing even to finish the period of the transition, provided they can give back -- that should be under the discretion.
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the deadlock here is caused by two things. the first problem is he wants to finish the transitional period, and people should sit down and discuss the viability of that. the second issue, always in the back of the minds of the military officers, is the attack attempted against protesters. the officers know that unless they are given immunity, i don't think even at the end of the transitional period, they are going to give up power to the civilians for -- civilians. peter: hajooj kuka, democracy is a living thing, and it seems from what you gentlemen have been saying, democracy is not alive and well, it is frozen.
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the world bank is saying the economy is trending in the right direction because inflation has come down to 388%, which is an astonishing figure. they are so many variables in the country and the broader region. is there a chance the country is actually at a tipping point and could get head back to the bad old days of the 1990's? hajooj: i don't think we are back there. i feel right now we have reached a point in sudan where going back to war is an uphill battle. it will be really hard to go back to war. the rebel groups you are talking about, the minister of economy is one of the people trying to get the military to move or not. the fight is political. the fight moved away -- even today if you look at the sit in, a lot of them are rebel leaders.
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the way people are finding is different. i hope we never go back to war. right now i don't think there is a threat of going back to war. people are not threatening to go back to war. what we need at the top is what the gentleman was just talking about. exactly the idea when we become a fully civilian country and take over running the country using civilian methods. that is what the revolutionaries want. yes, the economy is really bad and going in directions that the ministers no better than anybody else because they are at the forefront of the economy. there is a long battle to get there. we need to finish this transitional period and get to a period where people can fight over ruling the country using democratic methods. i feel like we could get there and we need to get over this one big hurdle, which is the symbolic gesture of giving power
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to civilians. that's why thanksgiving over -- that's why i think giving over the chairmanship is important some bulkley. it tells the military now is the time for civilians to rule the country and as a military, the job is to defend, not to rule. peter: what if the people you speak to and the people you speak for our investing in the military and it is the wrong side of the argument to invest in? because arguably there are threats inside the country. that's why what is going on in sudan has flipped on -- blipped on the radar in washington. you need a competent and capable military. the worry outside the region is the sudanese military is not competent and not capable. mubarak: let me say one thing, we don't need to involve the issue of military as to avoid
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discussing issues related to civilians. the military, according to a constitutional document, they will hand over the government to the civilians in 2022. this is what i heard from one of the classified officers in the ministry of justice. that is not the issue for now. the issue is forming the ruling coalition. now the problem, now we have to oversee. even to hand over to the civilian, we have to agree whom to hand it over to. moreover, the issue is not handing over. democratization will not appear here.
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it will appear when we go for serious democratization like voting register and the will of the parties, and go for the forming of the election commission. and the wills of the people in the transitional legislation, so that we pass all of these bills. and those groups of the revolution, they will be part of the legislative council to pass the bills. peter: pardon, i'm going to stop you. the last two minutes of the program, i want to go back to the others. how much genuine desire do you detect on the part of everyone involved in this scenario to get back on track? waleed: i think they are all
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very genuine. i don't want to accuse anybody of ill intention in this scenario. i think the groups need to understand that the political polarization of the society will more help us with stabilizing sudan and move toward a democracy. it will negatively affect the current situation, but we have to be in mind that some pressure bought to be exerted -- pressure ought to be exerted to make the government more accountable to the people. if you think about the economic policies adopted by the
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government, it went exactly against what the revolutionary front has been calling for. they went to the imf and adopted these economic policies. peter: pardon me for interrupting you. the last point to hajooj kuka. in 30 seconds, are you optimistic the civilian part of the administration will react in the right way to the pressure being directed at it just now? it seems to be ignoring what is being said to it. hajooj: we are coming into the street from the 21st of october, and we are pushing for a civilian vote. i think is more important to have civilian rule than anything else. i think right now we are on the right track for a change. the most important thing about democratic transition is to get to democracy and the rest will follow. peter: gentlemen, thank you so
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much thank you. thank you to our guest. you can watch any on our website. and for further discussion, go to our facebook page. you can also join the conversation on twitter. from me and the team here in doha, thank you for watching and we will see you soon. for the moment, goodbye. ♪ cccccc=súsúsdko @a■oñ
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♪♪♪ andrew cuomo: the president said this is a war. i agree with that, this is a war. then let's act that way and let's act that way now. karishma vyas: as new york rose from the ashes of 9/11, first responders became america's heroes. now they're under attack again, this time from a hidden enemy. male: yo, mike, close the truck, close the truck. karishma: new york is a key battleground in the global war on covid-19. megan pfeiffer: there's been a lot of deceased people, a lotta people just waiting to die. karishma: over two weeks, we'll take you to the frontlines.


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