tv The Mystery of the Candy Heiress MSNBC December 3, 2011 9:00am-10:00am PST
approaching high noon here on the east coast and the suspense is building in atlanta. supporters of herman cain are awaiting his announcement whether he's going to quit the race for the presidency. this is an extended edition here. the crowds are gathering at herman cain's headquarters in atlanta. this hour, they're expected to learn if their candidate will press on or if they will have to pay attention to those other guys in the race. peter alexander is in atlanta. peter, another good day to you. any sense yet which way this is going? >> it's a good question right now, alex, if herman cain does announce that he's pulling out of this race, it will be a first time that reporters have seen them with a blues band and barbecue being served here, which is taking place even as we speak. this is a party-like atmosphere. even members of his own campaign say they don't know what's going to happen.
he's now elsewhere at a double tree hotel about 15 minutes away. we'll keep you up to date on that, as well. we spoke a short time ago with the head of the georgia press secretary for the cain campaign. he acknowledges they may not find out what herman cain will announce until everybody else does. obviously the biggest headline has been the latest allegation from a 46-year-old georgia woman who said she had a sexual affair for 13 years with cain that cain denies. here's his press secretary responding. >> any time those allegations come out, it's always tough on anybody. it did take away a little bit of the steam, but i think we're back on track. i think the conversation that he had with his wife last night were positive. and we're hoping that we're here
monday and we're up and running and moving forward. >> we've been speaking out potential indicators what herman cain may do and what the impact of those decisions will be. there's a new des moines register poll out that shoes just about a month ago when herman cain led in that early caucus state. he had 23%, those numbers now have dropped all the way to just 8%. so clearly he's having a great deal of difficulty in terms of support and one of the challenges is financial support, as well. alex? >> nbc's peter alexander watching the action there for us in atlanta. the crowds are certainly gathering there. so we'll stay with this picture and the story. thank you very much, peter. and the big three panel is bag with some extended duty today.
>> so with a good morning, i guess afternoon now to all of you, all right, chris, your expectations, what do you think based on everything coming to this point, and if you lose this bet that's okay, but what do you think is coming here? >> i'm struck that the staff of herman cain does not seem to be read into this decision. >> i asked that question earlier. >> the interview they just played, i hope the talk went well with his wife. the polling numbers show whether herman cain acknowledges his campaign is over, it is functionally over. this is a question whether he's going to go out with a big bang or whether it's just going to peter off and we'll remember him the answer to a trivia question about this campaign. all the data shows that herman
cain campaign is not -- >> there are not a lot of people that would disagree with chris' take, but i'm curious, joe, if chris is right, or if chris predicts correctly he still may continue, what kind of campaign does that look like and how viable is it? >> well, if you have a campaign, if you're a candidate for the republican nomination for president, the reality is if you terminate your candidacy today, it's likely you'll get no more money and no more money will come through the doors to eradicate that debt. so from the stand point of being i suppose a realist, you would have to continue on to raise money, even if you know you're going to lose, to raise enough money to at some point eradicate your debt and make a graceful exit. but that's all common sense stuff. we know this much, that herman cain is an uncommon man and
what's going on in atlanta doesn't look like i'm getting ready to suspend my campaign announcement but i'm getting ready to fight some more announcement. >> it's the place to be, because, again, this was planned a long time ago. i want to pick up with you, goldie, joe was just saying he's an uncommon man. would any other candidates in this position already have bowed out? >> i think joe makes a good point, that herman cain really will do what he wants to do. he will call this race over at the time and place of his own choosing. whether he does that today is up to him. but i do think that chris makes the better point that whether herman cain faces it or not, his campaign is functionally over. he's got to decide whether that is today, next week or next month, but at some point or other, he's going to have to pull the train over and decide whether he's going to be able to
take his political capital and use it toward the greater good of the political party in terms of investing it in another candidate or another cause or have a crisis of arrogance and takes what he believes is his and goes home. either way, his campaign is functionally over. >> what is interesting also is just -- the degree to which they seem completely unprepared inside the herman cain campaign for the revelations that we see and the accusations. there are two lawsuits that were settled. those are the kind of facts that as due diligence you go through and dig up on your own candidate. and this campaign has been so sort of bizarrely fly by night and they're going to all these states that don't have early primary campaigns. sometimes the way you look at the way the campaign has been
managed, you have to wonder if that's the case. >> there's a woman, a 61-year-old woman polled, and she said look, you have to know all the issues, foreign, domestic and everything and there's too much coming out about his past that's not very presidential. so you, erin, the question about being presidential, how much do you think this all taints the eyes of voters that are looking at herman cain and they say it's just too much baggage, we're done? >> that's exactly what it is, and he knows that with those poll numbers going from 23% to 8%. the real statement is, his chances of getting the nomination are over. but he's unpredictable. the campaign could go on and he's going to get plenty of attention. because we, the media, i hate to say it, but reporters love to go on death watch. so if he goes on, we're going to keep following him and he's going to get attention every day and we're going to be waiting
for the end if it's not today. >> you talked about the whole issue of looking presidential and these allegations and how you handle them. you know, there have been others who have had the same challenges before. president clinton had these challenges. >> he was president already. >> arnold schwarzenegger started to have the same challenge. he came out and said i've been in the public life for decades, i've done some things i'm not proud of. if i've done anything to anybody who is female and i've done anything inappropriate, i apologize now. by doing that, he deflected the barrage of problems. >> let's be clear, though. i think it's important to divide the allegations against cain into two categories. there's the allegation of the consensual affair, and you may view that as immoral, but then there's the allegations of him
using his position and the power he had over subordinates, essentially to exploit them, to pressure them into sexual relationships with him because he held the power of their job over them. so much so that they -- there were settlements because they felt so pressured. that's a far graver offense in my estimation and speaks much more deeply to the qualifications of someone who is going to hold the office. >> and usually going after women, those women who made these allegations, who were in financial difficulty. so there's almost -- it's like prey. they were like sitting ducks. >> that's the pattern of allegation and i think that we should be careful a lot of times this stuff gets tied up in the same bundle, and there are real distinctions. the irony is what seems to be the final straw is the least damning allegation. the more damning allegation is someone saying you tried to coerce me into sex to get a job. the less damning allegation is
we had an affair for 13 years, which is awful. but far less damning in terms of what it says about who he is and what he would be like as a president than the earlier sexual harassment allegations. >> that's a great point. i've been shocked that the sexual harassment allegations have not gotten a much deeper discussion over this past month or so, because that's a big deal when you're talking about women and how they're feeling if some man is trying to go after them and be president. i'm just in shocked that we haven't talked more about that in the last month and what that means. i thought we would have a much bigger discussion of sexual harassment in this country but we haven't had that. it's gone from thing to thing to thing. it's a problem for herman cain that we haven't talked about it on a deeper level in this country. >> it may be something that people do start talking about, because if he bows out of this race, there will be this
overhang of sexual harassment. people are just trying to dog paddle. >> if you're herman cain and you note the iowa caucuses are some 30 days away, this is not what you want to talk about. he has a real problem just because this is what is grabbing everybody's attention right now. >> okay, i think we're going to take a short break here. goldie, do you have anymore button up? >> yes, these issues are separate but they're tied in that he continues to involve himself with women who are economically disadvantaged or not of the same station as he is. >> we're going to take a short break, everybody. we're continuing to keep our eyes on the herman cain headquarters there in atlanta. we'll bring you the live picture here as to what's happening there. we'll have more on the announcement expected that could come at any moment. also, we're going to get to some
other news including the former penn state coach accused in a sex abuse scandal who goes on camera and answers some pointed questions. a lot of us are asking how did his lawyers let that happen? but we'll hear the answers he gave to "the new york times." ♪ when your chain of supply ♪ goes from here to shanghai, that's logistics. ♪ ♪ chips from here, boards from there ♪ ♪ track it all through the air, that's logistics. ♪ ♪ clearing customs like that ♪ hurry up no time flat that's logistics. ♪ ♪ all new technology ups brings to me, ♪ ♪ that's logistics. ♪ [ male announcer ] you know why you don't see other full-size pickup trucks straight off the line
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we are continuing to watch herman cain's headquarters there in atlanta. cain had been planning to open a new campaign headquarters, but within the hour, he's expected to announce whether he's going to stay in the presidential race. meantime, jerry sandusky is revealing new details in a new interview. he spoke to "the new york times" in a wide-ranging exchange that
stretched over two days, and he denied he ever sexually abused any young boys. >> the allegations are false. i didn't do those things. i don't know. >> he was also asked about the interview he did last month on nbc. >> are you sexually attracted to young boys, to underage boys? >> am i sexually attracted to underage boys? >> yes. >> sexually attracted? you know, i enjoy young people. i was sitting there saying what in the world this question, what is -- you know, am i going to be -- if i say no, i'm not attracted to boys, that's not the truth, because i'm attracted to young people, boys, girls. >> yeah, but not sexually.
>> right, that's what i was trying -- i enjoy spending time with young people. i enjoy spending time with people. i mean, my two favorite groups are the elderly and the young. >> michael isikoff is in state college, pennsylvania. with a good afternoon to you. we've been discussing this and looking at, this and every time you think, did he not hear the word "sexual" in the questioning from bob kostas and having the lawyer shout it out to him, it is bizarre. but there are some details that we're learning, michael, such as what? >> reporter: well, you're right, alex. this is -- the really puzzling question is why he gave the interview at all. because both stylistically and substantively, there's a lot in there that can be used against him. he struggles to answer a question -- the question about the bob kostas interview, and
also when he's asked about when he was confronted by then and penn state athletic director tim curley about the 2002 shower incident. he struggles with that answer. but then substantively, he also talks about how he gave gifts to kids, gave money to kids. even opened bank accounts for them. now, he's presenting that as an example of how he cares for these kids, and was trying to look out for their best interest. but it also fits what prosecutors say is a pattern in which sandusky was targeting these kids, trying to get them to trust him so he could then use them and sexually abuse them. >> i want to play a little how he reacted when talking about curley. let's play this right now. >> i told him that i, you know,
it didn't happen and there wasn't -- in my mind, there wasn't inappropriate behavior. and i said if you want, you could speak to the person that was involved. >> so legally speaking, where do things stand, michael? >> reporter: legally speaking, there is a preliminary hearing in ten days on the case in which prosecutors say they're going to present a full day of evidence, multiple witnesses who will testify to make their case that this needs to proceed to trial. it's going to be the fullest airing we'll see in public so far of exactly what they got, and given what they're previewing here, a full day of testimony, multiple witnesses, victims being prepped we're told to testify on that. it could be a very revealing day and perhaps a very damaging one
for jerry sandusky. >> michael isikoff, thank you so much. meantime, back in washington, president obama says the dramatic drop in the unemployment rate is not enough to help americans struggling. the national unemployment stands at 8.6%, the lowest level since march of 2009. he says the government needs to keep the growth going and urging americans to tell republicans in congress to extend the payroll tax cut set to expire. >> tell them not to vote to raise taxes on working americans during the holidays. he will them to put country before party. put money back in the pockets of working americans. >> good saturday afternoon to you, my friend. so let's get to these jobless numbers and what they tell us. >> you know, these numbers are -- you can't deny the fact that it's good news not only
economically but also politically from the president. but nobody here at the white house is going to be popping those champagne corks. they are careful not to declare victory. they've been through this before. it's come back to bite them when they talked about green shoots in the economy or predicting the number of jobs created by any particular policy. this presidency has suffered from the anemic economic growth and skyrocketing unemployment, which is dropping right now, the 8.6% in november. let's look inside the numbers. not all good news. retail jobs up 50,000. professional and business services up 33,000. leisure and hospitality, 23%. construction jobs the only dark spot, down 12,000. here's a fly in the ointment. the ethnic breakdown.
african-american up employment is 15. 5%. hispanic unemployment, 11.4%, whites 7.6%. part of the reason the rate sank so randy in november is because 315,000 americans stopped looking for work. there are still 13.3 million meshes wh es who are looking fo and can't find it. wall street saw its best week in more than two years. the drop in the unemploy mementt the stock market up. we're waiting for herman cain's announcement on the future of his campaign. it's live from atlanta where we're live as well. we'll have more after a short break. usa prime credit... this peggy...
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and we're going to give you a live look of things happening at the herman cain headquarters in atlanta. you see the crowds are gathering. they know it's a headquarters opening. it's a big announcement expected and on the right you see the man in the revolutionary costume. he is a cain supporter and a member of the tea party. so we'll bring you herman cain's announcement live once he takes to the podium. so as the clock ticks down to the new year, have you used all your vacation days in 2011? probably not. and you're not alone. according to travel industry experts, americans leave billions of vacation days up used. i'm going to add to this. these vacation days add up, i got a bunch of them. >> you should use them. people don't use them because they feel they don't have the money.
the average salary is $39,000, so they don't want to spend the money. the second reason is lack of planning. they can't get away because there's so much work. it's a vicious cycle. you're doing the work of two, three people in a lot of cases. >> and the average person is not going to use two vacation days this year, which adds up to millions across the country. but that makes an estimate of $33.4 billion of vacation that doesn't get used. is this only something that americans do? >> americans are the worst. the french use all of theirs. no surprise there. 30 vacation days last year. they used every one of them. same with brazil, spain, uk workers get 25 days and they use all of them. so it's a problem here. >> look at all the lelectronic gadgets out of there. with all of that, are people not
worging at all, working from home? >> the vast majority check in at least once. but the problem is, those people are checking in two, three, four, five times and ruining their vacations. even though they know full well that they're turning electronics off and dewinding is good for them. so it's good for employees and employers, it's good for them to have somebody who is taking a break. >> we said many times you come back from vacation and it's more exhausting. >> what can you do? >> vera, don't go on vacation, stay with us. thank you very much. herman cain is set to make his big announcement shortly. we'll bring it to you live here. ♪
we take you back to atlanta where a real crowd has gathered in in anticipation of herman cain's announcement. we were told originally it was a noon announcement. where do we stand on the timing? >> reporter: we anticipate this is going to happen between 1:00 and 2:00. we understand that herman cain is meeting with some donors at a hotel, about 15 minutes from here. we have other crews there in an effort to speak to the donors to learn what's happening in those private conversations. we'll give you a pan around right now. you can see about 200, 300 people have gathered, and this is a festive atmosphere. this was planned to be the grand opening of the georgia
headquarters for the herman cain for president campaign. they have barbecue and music and this is a festivity. this is not the end of the campaign. they acknowledge even the georgia press secretary that he's not spoken to the candidate in several days and doesn't know what he will say today. he says he will likely learn what that announcement is as it's been described. alex? >> we're going to keep a close eye. we're looking at the top of the hour for the earliest realistically, huh? >> reporter: i think that's fair to say. >> thank you very much, peter alexander. very good. let's go now to washington, d.c. with a welcome back to you. cain is going to mark his announcement here during this event. it was supposed to be marking the opening of the georgia headquarters. look at that backdrop. do you get and indication of what his next move may be? >> i think it's very difficult
to read anything into herman cain, the tea party, what might happen. we just saw, you know, a member of the -- a supporter of the tea party, defiantly standing by herman cain. so i don't think anybody really knows what herman cain is going to do except for herman cain and his wife, gloria. we know that that's where this turns, that this week herman cain said that he did not tell his wife about his friendship with ginger white, the atlanta businesswoman who accused him of a 13-year extra marital affair. he had to go home and talk to his wife face to face for the first time in weeks, alex. >> do we know anything about that meeting? >> so far the campaign has been pretty quiet on what exactly has happened. even the press secretary, the georgia press secretary who peter has been talking to, hasn't said he's heard anything
even from cain. so even people close to him on this campaign don't know. >> okay. we do know that cain has lost nearly 2/3 of his supporters there in the state of iowa. he's got about 8% support there right now come pained to 23% just a month ago. 32 days left to go until the caucuses. is there anything he could do where he could stay in the race after today and salvage the state of iowa? >> if he stays in this race, he's going to have to figure out how he gets himself back on that merry go round. how he's able to take a newt gingrich out of this thing, where newt gingrich now appears to be the one surging in the polls. "the des moines register" poll is coming out tonight that shows cain at 8%. tomorrow on "meet the press," we're going to have fresh numbers. and if everything shows the trajectory of gingrich going in one direction, cain going the other, it's going to be very
difficult. you mentioned this meeting with his donors. he has to cokeep them in place d be able to draw a wedge and regain some of that momentum. but it's going to be very tough to do that. >> i don't know if you have more updated numbers than i have access to, but the last i read was an update on his campaign finance situation as of the end of september, which he had about 600,000, maybe a little more than that in the bank, in the black. so he was looking good at that point. but in the last couple of months, think about the expenses and the dwindling down of donors. people have not been giving to him as much as they were when he burst onto the scene. so could a lot of this be about getting money in to recoup some of the losses to he doesn't end up in the red? >> a lot of the spin has been moving toward, you know, this is
a seminal moment for the cain campaign and he has to figure out how to say -- to give confidence to people to say we're on track. we wouldn't be covering this if we didn't think it was a major announcement. if he was going to say the cain train is staying on the tracks, yes, he's getting a lot of attention. make he'll blame the media and try to use that to gain some money back. what we do know numbers wise is from october -- through october, he's gained more money than he had his entire campaign earlier, which that is not going to be showing up until january 15 when it's going to be on the website. but we do know that his campaign has spent about $104,000 on ads in iowa, according to a republican ad tracker we've been using. and a super pack affiliated with cain, supporting cain rather has spent about $20,000 on ads, including that lie detector expert ad that they've been
using that kind of odd ad that you haven't seen a lot of campaigns use. so you know the money has been coming in. what we haven't heard is in the last couple of weeks, especially after that libya moment where he blanked, we haven't heard all the pronouncements of look at how much money we raised. we haven't seen the press releases and that might be an indication that his donor support has been slipping. >> okay. thanks for staying with us. some good news on the economy as the unemployment rate dropped. can it help the president as we head towards 2012? it's not the bayer aspirin you know. it's different. first, it's been re-engineered with micro-particles. second, it enters the bloodstream fast, and rushes relief to the site of your tough pain. the best part? it's proven to relieve pain twice as fast as before. bayer advanced aspirin. test how fast it works for you.
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tell them to put country before party. put money back in the pockets of americans. pass these tax cuts. >> back now with my panel. goldie, you know i love you and i'm going to begin with you. give me an explanation of this table tax and what it means in the pockets of americans. >> sure. when the payroll tax holiday was first instituted, it put somewhere between $1,000 and $1,500 back into the pockets of the average person making around $50,000 a year. so that means more groceries, another month or two worth of rent payment. so that's real cash in their pockets. with the expiration, if it's not extended, that means that money won't be coming to them but
going to uncle sam frankly. to get this done, we needed to see some relief or a surcharge on the very wealthiest of americans of about 3.5%. but it just isn't going to work, so we're going to see working class americans losing about $1,000 of real money they could have used to put back into the economy, create more jobs. and by not extending it, the early estimate says the american workforce will lose about 1.5 million jobs. >> joe, isn't the republican party always about tax cuts? why do the republicans that are being seen as somewhat obstructionist at this, why wouldn't they be fully on board, as john boehner is? john boehner says he will, and he's not able to corral all the republicans in the house. >> republicans are not across the board in line with or against this tax cut.
in general, republicans always support tax cuts because we believe that it's better for americans to have more money in their pocket, because when they have more money to spend, they spend it and they invest it and that's good for the economy. right now we know that our economy is struggling. but i think some republicans would tell you that the big challenge becomes whether or not we can afford it at this time. and then if we consider the fact -- what we've seen on the part of democrats is the effort to create this class warfare. you've got a lot of small business owners who -- for the first time in their lives are making a good income and they're being told they have to pay their fair share. and if you penalize them in any way, the way they're going to respond is probably by laying off workers. so that would just raise the rate of unemployment again, which isn't good for the economy. so you have to figure a way to do it in a balanced fashion, in a way that doesn't hurt small business owners who are hiring people and who are possibly
going to create new jobs if they get the right incentives and not penalizing the worker himself or herself. >> if i can jump in there for a second. republican leaders are saying about the payroll tax cut specifically is that they have evidence that that before does not stimulate the economy. what they want to do is stimulate the economy. that's their argument on that. however, the optics are back here. they're saying not all tax cuts are created equal. as you know, they don't want to see taxes raised on millionaires, this millionaire tax. and they're saying that a tax cut there will help because those are job creators putting more money into the economy. so it's a problem because it does have this notion that not all tax cuts are created equal, but they're trying to present evidence toe help one tax cut will help the economy, one won't. at the end of the day, republican sources say we're probably going to have to go for
it with this and unemployment benefits will be extended. it's the holiday season, it's going to be bad if they don't do it. so we're going to get something to work out here it looks like. but there is a little bit of an optical problem here. >> yeah, optical problem is one way to put it. >> i think the optical problem is -- >> go ahead, goldie. >> i can't hear. i think the optical problem is the last several years have been the most profitable in history for american business. they have more cash on hand that they've ever had in history but still not investing back in the economy. extending the payroll tax holiday for working americans does impact small businesses. they use the surtax they're trying is -- is on the 1%.
>> if they think they're about to get hit with a big tax, they're not going to make that movement and hire more people. >> what do you think, joe? >> the sad reality is, unless we simplify the tax code, the wealthiest americans are going to hire people to find loopholes so they don't have to find the tax any way. and the whole idea of taxes is to find more revenue for the federal government. so i think ultimately in a much more macro sense, a guy like senator pat toomey has the right idea. take away the loopholes and simplify the tax code and you can arrive at a fair system where everybody gets justice. >> okay. erin mcpike, joe watkins and
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is suspected to take the podium there in the center of your screen and announce whether or not he is staying in the race for the president. he's been fighting the new allegations this week of an extramarital affair, one that allegedly lasted 13 years. this on top of earlier sexual harassment claims and it's been a lot of turmoil in the camp. herman cain denies all the allegations, both the harassment charges as well as the affair. i'm joined again by my panel. so i'm going to ask you all for predictions, and don't say, we can't predict things. what does common sense tell you, goldie, is going to be happening here?
>> this is the strangest thing i've ever seen in the history of politics. >> there's honesty right there. >> conventional wisdom would tell you that he steps to the mike with his wife and family and says he loves his country and family and it's time to spend some time with them and take his life back. that's what a reasonable person would do. but as joe said earlier, he's not a common guy. anything could happen this afternoon. >> erin, what do you think? >> you know, i any the same thing. i think he has to get out. because it's been really bad for the republican party leading up to the primary. we've been talking about herman cain and allegations of sexual harassment and his affair for two months and not talking about the issues. for him to keep his level of support, whatever he wants to do in his career, for the good of
the party he probably is going to come to a realization he has to get out of the race. >> joe, you're the blatant republican in the mix here. as a republican, is all of this just taking away from substantive discussion that we should be having? as herman cain done so much damage to himself, be it because he's guilty of these accusations or because maybe through no fault of his own, all these things have come his way and it's ruined his campaign? look at the numbers from "the des moines register" poll that came out. he's dropped down to 8% among likely republican caucusgoers. >> remember, in these presidential primaries, it's every man or woman for him or herself. it's not the parties they hurt, they hurt their own candidacies. they're trying to win the
republican nomination. everything you say is on point. this has been a very bad stretch for herman cain, sliding from 23% in iowa to 8%, going from the top of the pack to the middle, heading toward the bottom. and then talking 30 something odd days out from iowa whether or not he's had an affair or whether it's true or not. that's not the conversation you want to have at this point. but i raise the point as somebody who has been in politics and business, you've got what looks like a new campaign office. you have staffers that need to be paid. you've got an existing campaign staff that needs to be paid. you've probably got some debt. there was about $600,000 or more on the books, but you need a lot more than that to run a decent national campaign. even if you suspended your campaign at some point in the future, common sense as a business person would say you don't announce today that you're ending it. the moment you announce you're ending it, the funds stop
immediately. so my guess is he comes out and says he's going to press on, have his wife by his side and continue to fight. that's my guess. my best guess. >> but as a counter to that, too, as we were talking earlier today, alex, the media is going to go on death watch. the other thing they're going to do is look for more evidence of this affair, this allegedly affair with ginger white. but the media is going to try and dig up more dirt about that, and it's only going to get worse and it cuts off any more support. instead, maybe the media stops digging and he can regain his support going forward for his own life and career and just -- >> and you know what? we're going to wrap this conversation up, but peter alexander said herman cain has been meeting with donors. you have to wonder if what he says when he gets to the podium
took into account what he may have just been told by these donors. if they're saying we're not going to continue contributing to you, he's got to be done. but if they say we're backing you, we're going to continue giving you money, that may be an entirely different thing. so it may be the reason his press secretary in georgia doesn't know the answer as to whether or not he's going to pull out of the race is because he may be just now making that decision. so that having been said, we're all on pins and needles. we'll take a short break here. stay with us, everyone. a lot of patients are using toothpaste to clean their dentures.
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