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tv   Lockup  MSNBC  July 4, 2013 11:00am-12:01pm PDT

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it is 2:00 p.m. on the east coast. i'm richard lu. you're watching msnbc. egypt swears in a new president. >> will the prosecution rest? >> and on america's birthday, a reminder how the union survived. a look at the battle of gettysburg 150 years later. we start this hour with the zimmerman trial which is in recess for the july 4th holiday. so far jurors have heard eight days of testimony, and when court resumes tomorrow there are hints the prosecution could wrap up its case. yesterday prosecutors focusing on demonstrating george zimmerman's knowledge of criminal justice by calling two of his former college professors to the stand. jurors also heard testimony from a dna analyst and a firearms expert. we've been reporting george zimmerman is charged with second degree murder in the death of trayvon martin. he has pleaded not guilty. he contends it was self-defense.
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we have sarah from sanford, florida. sarah, this could be the final day the prosecution could rest. i guess the question is if they were to, is this right on time based on what a lot of people have been thinking? >> exactly, richard. we actually expected the state to rest wednesday. the judge indicated in court that they would be doing so, but testimony from those technical witnesses really filled up the day. we are, as you said, expecting them to wrap up tomorrow with testimony from trayvon martin's mother. it's going to be easily some of the most emotional testimony of this entire trial. so on wednesday before this holiday recess we heard from technical witnesses including a state firearms expert. she testified about the contact stop that killed 17-year-old trayvon martin, contact meaning the gun barrel was actually touching the sweatshirt he was wearing when the trigger was pulled. we also heard from a police
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crime lab analyst who stated that he found neither trayvon -- zimmerman's -- excuse me. i'm sorry. he found neither george zimmerman's dna under trayvon martin's fingernails. he also did not find trayvon martin's prints on george zimmerman's gun. the defense raised questions about storage as well as weather and temperature that could have affected that dna evidence. also heard from one of george martin's -- several, in fact, of george martin's several professors including one who said he did teach during the course self-defense law as well as florida's stand your ground law. he said zimmerman was one of his better students and zimmerman was given an a in that course. now court resumes about a half an hour earlier than usual tomorrow with the prosecution, as we said, expected to wrap up their case. jurors, meanwhile, still being skes administered on this july 4th holiday.
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the court did plan special activities for them. they declined going into any detail on what those activities were. details of the sequester have been rather limited keeping those very, very private. richard? >> okay. friday's another day tomorrow that you'll be watching. sarah dell off in sanford, florida. joining us in studio is criminal defense attorney seema iyre and msnbc legal analyst, kendle coffee. seema, to what we learned yesterday. when we saw the witnesses give testimony with regard to the educational background there of george zimmerman, that was debated before they actually brought in that instructor. were you surprised by the judge here saying, yes, we can bring in his testimony? >> not at all. it's completely acceptable that anything in the defendant's background that is relevant to his credibility is allowed into the case. so even though defense tires go through the motions of making
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these allegations, it's completely admissible. >> will that mean whether trayvon martin's educational background will be brought in? >> it's different with the victim. you have the right of confrontation in the constitution. trayvon martin is not getting that because he's not here. the defendant's credibility and he has the motive that's at issue so that all comes in. there are different rules for the victim and the defendant. >> okay. kendall, the prosecution is showing zimmerman's interview with fox news and another example of zimmerman's first-hand account of what happened. why do you think they are using the strategy of bringing these recordings forward? >> well, i think it's a reminder of what any criminal defense lawyer would say to any client who's been charged with a client is don't do interviews because no good can come of it. the interview that took place has a couple things in it that are negatives for george zimmerman. one of the things that we've been talking about is the course that apparently many times
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discussed stand your ground law. george zimmerman took that case and he goes on national television and says, i never heard of stand your ground before the tragedy. that implied that he's trying to cover up his knowledge about stand your ground and that's going to imply, as the prosecutors might argue, that he used his knowledge of stand your ground law where he got an a to cover up. >> the instructor of that course discussed the stand your ground statute. then the defense turned it, right? >> oh, yeah. >> they turned it and they were saying basically did george zimmerman have the right based on that teaching. >> what we're talking about here is directly from the jury instructions, and that is this, it is okay if george zimmerman confronted trayvon martin if trayvon then escalated the violence. then george zimmerman is allowed
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to retaliate with deadly force if he's in fear of imminent death, great bodily harm. so the tables are now turned. it is okay if george zimmerman was the initial aggressor if the rest of the facts follow as such because that is the instruction the jury's going to get. >> kendall, did you get a set -- allude to go what seema is talking about here. one of the defense was laying out that line of questioning. they were saying if this aggressor initiated this interaction, ie, alluding to it perhaps being george zimmerman. he started the questioning saying that. was that a hint to you at all as to what they might do going forward, the defense specifically, or an admittance of some sort? >> i think the defense is not going to want to admit that george zimmerman in effect threw the first punch because it's one thing if they have to concede that george zimmer manual followed trayvon martin. that seems to be what the evidence is showing. perhaps it could have even been george zimmerman who began a
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verbal confrontation, but it becomes awfully important in terms of whether george zimmerman can invoke self-defense if, in fact, he violated the law by throwing the first punch. the evidence is pretty murcy as to who threw the first punch. >> when that witness was describing that series of possibilities, he answered by saying it is a less than ideal self-defense and -- but he still -- in essence was he still saying it's an acceptable self-defense excuse? >> well, i heard it a little differently. i think that in the law in florida, something is not an acceptable self-defense. it may not be the crime of murder but it could be the crime of manslaughter. i was intrigued by that line of discussion because the case is charged as second degree murder. a lot of folks thought it was overcharged. one of the sides is likely to get an instruction on
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manslaughter. a self-defense claim that is legally insufficient can lead a jury to convict on manslaughter. >> they're going to get manslaughter and they're going to convict him at manslaughter. they have a better chance at manslaughter. i'm concerned the prosecution is tanking the case. >> thank you. giving us a lot more awareness of what's happening there in the courtroom down to the defenses. shifting to egypt. it took only three days of protesting in tahrir square before the military ousted egyptian president muhammad morsi who's reportedly under house arrest right now. egypt is under the temporary leadership of aldi mansour. he was formally sworn in this morning. on wednesday the president said he was deeply concerned about egypt's actions. he called for them to move quickly and responsibly to return full control back to a democratic government. joining me is ayman.
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who is aldi mansour? >> reporter: he's the chief justice of the supreme court. a well-respected individual appointed by former president hosni mubarak back in the early '90 '980 -- '90s and he's been widely unknown. he was appointed by president morsi and now is effectively running the country after the ouster of former president muhammad morsi. he is an individual that was considered by most a consensus individual. now given the fact that the military has defended the constitution, they didn't have to appoint him as the individual. certainly to get the coalition of people that were next to the general who made the announcement, you had the people from the church, many other notable figures, it seemed that he was the individual that a lot of people could get behind for this transitional period. >> you know, as you said, ayman,
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very clearly this is effectively a civilian government. now they have appointed this interim president of egypt. but does he gain confidence from egyptians or is he seen widely as a puppet here? >> well, that's going to be the test in terms of how he asserts himself, the kinds of decisions he makes in the short term. there's no doubt about it that this is a military appointed individual. that doesn't mean the military will call the shots. the military looms large over egyptian politics and will have the say when it comes to national security, foreign policy, egypt's national tret yis. he will have some very important tests early on getting the economy back on the right track, trying to get the transition to democracy, going back again. there's going to be some tests that will determine whether he is calling the shots, whether he has the kind of sovereignty and independence he needs to make tough decisions or whether the military will be behind the scenes but still pulling all the scenes. >> the pictures you've been
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bringing to us, ayman, now local time have been amazing in terms of the number of individuals in the streets. at this moment who do they look forward to in terms of a potential leader. you brought up muhammad a al faradai. is he somebody that would be broadly accepted in the north and the south, the south where the christians are? >> reporter: well, this is a double edged sword in egypt's revolution. it's been extremely successful. it's an organic movement driven by the youth. it's leaderless. there is no one individual that's been the driving force of this movement. as a result, when it comes time to translating that into politics, the youth organizations, the political organizations have struggled to have a single individual speak on their desires or demands. at this stage it's still, again, too early to see how the protesters will try to organize themselves politically going forward. yes, muhammad is one of the more
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popular figures among the liberal opposition in this country. he's been chosen by various organizations to speak on their behalf in the past. he certainly represents a lot of the ideals of the youth movement but there are several others, particularly younger individuals, who are also making their name heard. whether or not they can translate that into political traction in the coming elections, it's still extremely premature. >> aymen, how have the messages, the chants changed. what have they said differently as this narrative has changed so drastically? >> well, on one hand it's shifted a little bit from this drastic sense of euphoria and complete celebration. i think there's a sense of realism that is settling in that yesterday may not have necessarily solved all of the country's problems. they're waking up to the reality that there's a lot of work to be done. i think the tone has shifted from celebration to cautious
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optimism. it's all against the back drop of wider tensions in the country between supporters of the country and the muslim brotherhood and those that oppose them. that is the tension that's constantly in the back of everyone's mind and the concern is that as the days go forward there may be more clashes, may be more confrontations between these two ideological camps that are now deeply engrained in the society. this is as divided as egypt has ever been since its revolution back in 2011. >> july 4th, 2013, there in tahrir square, egypt. nsa leaker edward snowden is still on the lamb. is he doing himself more harm than good by staying in the shadows? then later, a live look at this weekend's essence festival in new orleans. then a preview of what we have in for for you. you're watching msnbc.
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the number keeps on growing. edward snowden now has applied for asylum in over 20 countries according to what we understand right now, but none of them stepping forward to receive him. the nsa leaker is stuck in a transit area. joining us to discuss snowden's predicament and the civil liberties debate he has foster, we have rebecca sinder brand. and bill snyder. bill, a lot of people thinks that snowden's leaks about nsa surveillance was a good thing in terms of sparking a debate about civil liberties but that his subsequent leaks detailing u.s. espionage efforts and his flight from justice have hurt the cause take everything net net. what's your take? >> my take is that the story is now about him. it's about where he is, what's going to become of him, the fact
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that he con sorted with countries like russia, china, sought refuge in venezuela, he can wa dord, bolivia. those have all over shadowed what he thought he was doing. it's now really a manhunt. >> a manhunt, 20 countries as we were noting here. when we look at that number, rebecca, he has to go through a legal labyrinth. each and every country has a different process in terms of the way that you might apply for asylum. can he be doing this alone? is he sitting there in this airport in moscow going through legal transcripts and law books trying to figure out what to do? >> well, you know, that's one of his theories of unanswered questions. one of them has been who's advising him. of course, what the role of wikileaks may be in all of this. we saw that statement from snowden on their website which raised a number of eyebrows. some people immediately alleging that it didn't quite sound like
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him. at the very least assembled with someone from wikileaks. the question becomes who's advising him? who was helping directing him in guiding him through the legal processes in the long string of nations. worth noting that at this point he seems to be getting a series of nos. not a lot of success to this point. his options are dwindling as the days continue. >> bill, at a certain point when does he run out of money? it's not cheap. one of the motels in terminals d, e, f is not cheap, $300 a night. >> i think that will be taken care of by supporters. the problem is no one has come forward who's actually been damaged or harmed by these revelatio revelations. there's a debate over surveillance. the united states was shown to have spied on friendly nations in europe. they're very friendly. what's missing is the body.
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who has been damaged? who has been persecuted? who has been harmed by these revelations? we need a body and someone needs to say i was illegally spied on. i was harassed and so far nobody has done that. >> boy, has it been a tale, two different tales, shall we say here. rebecca, you have the white house saying we're not going to scramble jets to apprehend this individual. on the flip side you've got this huge, huge story, this narrative that we've been covering now for the better part of a couple of weeks now, if not longer, of edward snowden. who is damaged more in this entire story? >> well, you know, what a difference a couple of days makes. it's very interesting to think back to where we were when edward snowden first left hong kong getting a series of pretty frustrated responses from the justice department and others highlighting days and days of pleading with hong kong officials and high-level contacts all for not. and now all of a sudden we seem to see the tables turned.
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we're seeing even while vladimir putin is refusing to turn over snowden, he's making it clear that if snowden is going to stay it's going to be terms that are a bit more to the u.s. liking, that is not to be revealing anymore of the information that he's taken and we're also seeing a series of nations who had made very positive-sounding statements with regard to snowden starting to step back a little. most notably, ecuador. the president getting a phone call over the weekend, this past weekend, by vice president biden and all of a sudden sending a different tune when it comes to how receptive his nation might be to taking edward snowden in. >> we can't forget bolivia and that whole issue of his plane being grounded. bill and rebecca, i guess what we might be able to discuss next time is how many books will be written about this. thank you both. have a good july 4th. >> thank you. >> up next, the latest on the condition of one of the world's most recognizable figures. nelson mandela. plus, rare reaction from his
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wife. and later marco rubio and jeb bush are two names mentioned when courting the latino vote. there's one person they don't hold a candle to. this is msnbc, the place for politics. fresh-over. we want you to eat some peaches and tell us what you think. they're really juicy. it must have just come from the farm. this right here is ideal for me. walmart works directly with growers to get you the best quality produce they've ever had. what would you do if i told you all this produce is from walmart? wow! is it really? (laughter) find fresh peaches and all your quality produce. backed by our 100% money back guarantee. walmart.
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good day to you, ron. >> reporter: how are you, richard? >> so if you can tell us, we were just listening to a little bit here from, again -- about nelson mandela, how well he's doing. the wife speaking there just as you heard. how is he doing? what is she saying about his condition further than that? >> reporter: well, we know that he is in critical but stable condition and he's been that way now for a couple of weeks or so. his wife graca machel said he's uncomfortable sometimes, in pain sometimes, but he's fine. we understand he's on life support but we don't know what that means because the family has vehemently denied reports that he's in a situation where his life could be terminated if medical care is withdrawn, if the plug is pulled, if you will, for example. so they have denied vehemently that it is that kind of a situation where they could make a medical decision that could terminate his life. so we don't know all the details. they are trying to make him have
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as much dignity in this process as possible. it was unusual for her to leave the hospital and make those remarks. this was in johannesburg about 25, 30 minutes from here. she spends most days at his bedside. the president, jacob zuma stopped by and made a statement but saying essentially the same thing he has been saying, the situation is critical but zblabl ron allen in pretoria. thank you, ron. america's birthday is being celebrated around the world, including among our nation's heroes. >> my name is first lieutenant jim seguin. i want to give a shout out for happy 4th of july to my beautiful wife erin o'connor and my family back home in garden city, michigan. love and miss you all. ♪ ♪ what makes a sleep number store different?
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egyptian forces raided al gentleman zir ra offices on wednesday night just hours after the army toppled the morsi presidency. they're demanding the release of its staff members detained overnight in cairo. joining us from washington is the washington bureau chief, fukara. good to see you. >> reporter: good to see you, richard. >> what is the status of the al jazira reporters in cairo? >> we still don't know what the final outcome is going to be. >> we don't know. we're talking about the offices of al-jazeera which is similar
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to cspan here. they've had a rough ride with many egyptians, not all of them. some of the egyptians see it as a platform for morsi and the muslim brotherhood but generally al-jazeera has been viewed by many egyptians as a positive force that has helped galvanize public opinion against him. it's being seen negatively by people who say it has stood on the side of the muslim brotherhood. the fact that the offices have been raided by the egyptian authorities is obviously cause for concern given that there are a lot of egyptian channels that are criticized by egyptians themselves spewing out unhelpful things over the last few years. it should be justice for all. if you start that process, you're going to start that and it's a dangerous ride. >> on safety for your personnel there, have you made any
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changes? have you taken any action here? >> i mean, we have always been very conscious of the safety and security situation in egypt. i am sure that the people in headquarters, if they haven't already taken measures to secure the -- make sure of the safety of their staff, that it is forefront of their thinking at this point in time especially as egypt goes through this period of turmoil. >> yeah, the question being of the safety of journalists there. >> yeah, that's what i meant. >> thank you so much. appreciate your time. abderrahim fuokara, thank you very much. 2016 and hillary clinton, are they an unstoppable combination? later. we go live to the big easy. msnbc is taking center stage, a
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democrat. new polls and a new tactic by the gop are all fueling new speculation about a possible 2016 presidential run by hillary clinton. house minority leader nancy pelosi adding fuel to the fire on "meet the press" when she expanded on comments that the democratic party is now coalescing behind clinton. then came a slew of articles. why democrats are sold on hillary clinton in 2016. there's also this on "the daily beast." a lifetime of experience may hinder hillary clinton in 2016. joining me now msnbc contributor goldie taylor and rich gaylin publisher of >> let's start with you, goldie. is she unstoppable?
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>> no. she wasn't unstoppable last time or the time before that. the issue is democrats have a problem with coronations. primary elections are just that, when people go to the ballot box and choose the person of their choice. hillary clinton is a strong candidate. she has a lifetime of experience. she is likely the most vetted candidate that will ever enter a presidential race. i have great respect for her and her lifetime of work, but she's going to have to, if she chooses, get into this race and run a vigorous campaign just as if she had never run before. i think, you know, name i.d. and some of these other things will certainly be on her side and shoel' certainly have the wind at her back, but i don't discount joe biden and many of the other strong democrats. by the way, no one really knew who barack obama was this time when we had the first election when he came to office in 2008 so we may not even know, may not even know who the nominee is today. >> goldie's got the recent political history down there, rich.
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what's your thought of this latest round of discussion around hillary clinton? >> i agree with everything goldie said. you know, back in 2007 when everybody was saying, well, mrs. clinton gets into this then it's over, and what happened is we went into iowa and hillary clinton and -- oh, gosh, what's his name? the guy that had the baby. i can't remember his name. had the -- the senator from north carolina split their votes about 30% each. >> are you talking about john edwards? >> yeah, john edwards. i'm sorry, i had a brain freeze. >> it's july 4th. it's okay, rich. >> around the barbecue. >> thinking about the barbecue. come on back. be with me. be with us. be with goldie. >> i'm with ya. i'm on target here. they split about 30% of the vote, mrs. clinton and john edwards. barack obama only won iowa with about 38% of the vote. if either one of those two had jumped ahead we would have had a completely different eight years. to goldie's point, you can't tell this far out. but it's fun to talk about. let me make one quick other
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point. in washington we know these people. we know senators. we know cabinet secretaries, we know former cabinet. so they're always at the top of the list this far out because the washington press core knows them, they go to receptions with them, they go to correspondent centers. there are a ton of governors on both sides of the aisle that i think are peering over the transom to wait for their chance to see if they can be the one that gets into this thing. i suspect both sides will have a group of governors jump in and have a spirited primary. >> you know, goldie, to you on this one. it looks like the gop has a new strategy waiting in the wings. the new york magazine puts it this way, i'll read it to you, quote, the republican party, which has not been popular with the kids of late, has a not so innovative strategy for taking the youth vote from hillary clinton if and when she decides to run for president in 2016. remind the public that she is an older woman. will that work? this ageist attack that some have called it in the daily
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beast, for instance? >> good luck. that is about as likely to work as their outreach has been with black and brown americans over these last several years. i think that, you know, hillary clinton certainly connects with people from across the age spectrum, people from across the ethnicity and gender spectrum, you know, so i think she's going to find some resonance not because she's an older woman or that she happens to be white but because she believes with issues that resonate with certain constituencies. i think her positions as she stated before, she's pro choice. she is certainly someone who has shown herself to be on the side of students coming through college. she's on the side of parents as they support their children. i just think that she's going to have a message that resonates with young people. she's going to have a message that resonates with older people and i just don't think you can box her in to being an older white female. after all, ronald regan was older. >> that's going to be a tough line to make right there, rich,
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as goldie has been discussing for us right now. i mean, she's still got her memory, for instance. >> as opposed to me. >> yeah. >> the bigger point i think, and i don't disagree with goldie, but the bigger point i think for the republican party is they've got to stop doing this, got to stop saying this person is bad because of this, this person is bad because of that. what the republican party has not been able to do successfully over the last -- they have mid term elections and they will this time again. at the national level they have not been able to come up with a positive message that says take a look at us because these are the things that we want to do for you and your family as we move forward. and i think they've got to get off this -- they truly are the party of no. >> msnbc contributor, goldie tailor. always a pleasure. the affable and memorable strategist rich gaelin. boston is beefing up security for the 4th of july. more than half a million people
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are expected to watch the boston pops play along with the fireworks. that's always great stuff. that show happens on the charles river. coming up, remembering our roots. this week marks the 150th anniversary of the battle of gettysburg when more than 50,000 americans lost their lives. we'll take a look at how america's oldest magazine, still in publication, by the way, covered those three harrowing days. to make their money do more. (ann) to help me plan my next move, i take scottrade's free, in-branch seminars... plus, their live webinars. i use daily market commentary to improve my strategy. and my local scottrade office guides my learning every step of the way. because they know i don't trade like everybody. i trade like me. i'm with scottrade. (announcer) scottrade... ranked "highest in customer loyalty for brokerage and investment companies."
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as families get out and celebrate the july 4th holiday, new orleans is gearing up for a weekend long celebration. final preparations underway for the 19th annual essence festival. the three-day celebration shines a spotlight on culture, community, empowerment and inspiration. of course, there is music to boot. joining me live is nbc news's marra schiavocampo. marra, i was expecting you to lead in with your report with
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music but i guess the party hasn't started with that. >> do you want me to break into a rendition of -- >> come on, it's july 4th. >> the headline act, the star of them all is beyonce. she is performing on the last night of the last day. so hard for her fans who will be staying for that. you can hear a little bit of noise here, but it still is pretty quiet in terms of attendees. the convention center is being put together. this is our msnbc set. this is where a lot of the shows will be broadcast. it's getting the final tweaks and touches. the official kickoff is tomorrow. that's when tens of thousands of people are going to come to town for what's called a party with a purpose. so the purpose part really takes place during the day. it's what essence calls the empowerment experience. they have a number of panels on a range of issues from some really important and serious topics in the black community like gun violence, health, jobs to some things that are a little lighter like how to channel your inner vixen if you're into that
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kind of thing. the night is party and performances from a number of acts, l.l. cool jay, the queen beof them all, miss beyonce performing on the last night here. essence has been doing this for almost 20 years. it started out as a celebration of the magazine's 25th anniversary. it started out as a music festival. they call it the essence festival honoring the broader scope and it's good for the city of new orleans. it brings tens of thousands, about 90,000 people to town at a time when they need it. this is the slow time for tourism in new orleans. surprise, a lot of people don't want to be here at the height of summer when it's hot, humid, muggy. essence's people come in droves. it brings a lot of tourism dollars to the city. an estimated $90 million in 2009. it's a great thing for the city. it brings the community together to talk about issues that are important to them, kick off the heels in a city that knows how
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to have a good time. >> there's a health clinic that is ongoing as well throughout as you mentioned before. a lot of things happening in new orleans. there's nothing like it. there's nothing like it, i think you can mara. thank you so much. >> yeah. thanks so much. >> enjoy beyonce too. >> we'll have coverage beginning at noon eastern. alex wagner, tamron hall, al sharpton ed schultz and marra schiavocampo. if the south had prevailed in the civil war, world would not exist as it does. world history would be substantially altered. it almost happened until the three day battle at gettysburg put a union victory within reach. this week marks 150 years since that bloody battle that left some 51,000 people dead or wounded. put it this way, at the height of the iraq troop surge with
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166,000 americans in harm's way, the casual at this rate was 1 in 500. at gettysburg it was 1 in 4 for union soldiers. for the confederates it was 1 in 3. throughout the battle the "saturday evening post" served as readers eyes and ears. now 150 years later "the post" is reliving the paper's coverage of gettysburg. jeff nelson is the director of archives for "the saturday evening post." thank you for joining us. can we talk about the significance of this battle. >> i don't think anybody's overstated it yet. i've heard a lot of claims that this was significant, this was the decisive battle and i have to agree with every one of those decisions, every one of those calls. >> some make comparisons to the battle of midway. they say we have it completely, as i was mentioning earlier, completely different role of order if that battle had gone
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one way versus another. >> i would agree with that also. what happened at that battle really decided the war and that war decided the destiny of the united states and i would say by extension it also decided the destiny of the world because i can't imagine a world war i or 2 rome ii. >> what's going to happen are thousands of individuals being involved and reenactments of that battle still relevant. people looking at it. it's very historic as you just described but also it brings up a reaction, if you will, or do you think this is just something that is mythic in some ways as we look at some of the occurrences, some of the developments of that battle so many years ago? >> i think that the battle strikes a resonant chord with americans. americans are by nature patriotic but also very sentimental and have a romantic
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streak and i think getty'sburg appeals to all of those. it was a huge battle, highly memorable. 160,000 men fighting. it's the largest battle ever waged in the western hemisphere. it was a time when the united states was working out what sort of country it would be. so it's very important to the country's future and to our present day. >> now "the saturday evening post" if you go back in time and you were to break those papers open, it had a very key role in the coverage in terms of what was happening at that time. the offices were just a few hundred miles away from the fighting there and you have articles showing images of confederates in chambersburg and harrisburg just to name a couple. >> that's right. this was very much a local news event. it wasn't just something that was happening far down into virginia. when "the post" started covering the confederate invasion of pennsylvania, they were very concerned for themselves. they already knew that people
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were fleeing chambersburg, york, carlisle and harrisburg trying to get away from the confederates, and particularly black americans were trying to get very far away because hundreds of them had been taken by the confederates and shipped south as slaves, so the reporting didn't really cover this historic event. their first concern at the time was for residents of pennsylvania to join the militia and to contribute to the sanitary commission which was going to help provide the wounded, they expected a large number of wounded casualties, to provide them with food, clothing, shelter and nursing. >> and, again, all of those locations that you and i have just been discussing not really more than 150 miles away from modern philadelphia or philadelphia then. so very close in a very short space in terms of, you know, as they were in williamsport as you saw some of the soldier movements there and looking at some of the old pictures. these are all drawings. can you tell us about how the
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post dealt with getting images to the papers then? >> well, those drawings are reproductions of drawings for the two or three larger publications, the new york herald and frank leslie's weekly. they would get an artist to copy those. it was copied from frank leslie's weekly. there are slight variations. you can see the originals in those newspapers. >> let's finish off with the pace of the news how it's different today versus 150 years ago. i was noticing some of the dates on the pictures here. some were sometimes a month after the actual battle of gettysburg. >> i think that the closest they ever came to reporting in real time was five days. it was a weekly publication and for many people, particularly people living out in the country, they didn't need their news any faster than that.
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but when the final report of the battle of gettysburg appeared it was seven days after. >> seven days? >> seven days. it was already decided. lee's army was already across the river back into virginia and many people were just starting to hear about it in pennsylvania. >> boy, times have changed, huh? >> that's right. >> all right. jeff nilsson, thank you so much. >> thank you very much. >> and up next we go life to cairo where there are a lot of unanswered questions. just one day after the country's first elected president was ousted from power, plus key evidence presented in the trial of george zimmerman. what will it mean for the prosecution's case. stay tuned. you're watching msnbc. up meeting a lot more people but a friend under water is something completely different. i met a turtle friend today so, you don't get that very often. it seemed like it was more than happy to have us in his home.
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noon elsewhere. happy 4th of july. egypt removes embattled islamist muhammad morsi. prosecutors in the george zimmerman trial are on the verge of resting. and a week after some of the most significant supreme court decisions in recent memory, what's next? the future of same-sex marriage and the brewing battle over voting rights. first off this hour, celebrations continue in cairo this afternoon as egyptians rejoice over the ouster of president morsi and live pictures here from tahrir square. not everyone in egypt is feeling victorious. morsi remains under house arrest. they're reportedly cracking down on the muslim brotherhood today arresting several members and egyptians are calling for a friday of rejection against the military. 9:00 p.m. local time. joining us is foreign correspondent a man mohyeldin. talk about these crackdowns and
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the arrests. >> reporter: yeah, certainly it has come very quickly and very swiftly. it has people on edge because the nature of this crackdown really is not yet clear. the government or at least the police force is saying this is a matter of law and order, but obviously given the backdrop of what just happened in the country, people here are concerned that it is now politically motivated and there's an attempt underway to try and suppress the muslim brotherhood and their leaders. some of the things that you were talking about, two of the most notable figures, the leader of the muslim brotherhood and his deputy both now have arrest warrants out for them, for their involvement in allegedly inciting violence against protesters outside the muslim brotherhood headquarters back on sunday that killed eight people. the former president, muhammad morsi, is being investigated even though he's under the custody of the military. he's being investigated by a cairo prosecutor on charges that he defamed the judiciary. that certainly has put him on a travel bana long with eight


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