tv All In With Chris Hayes MSNBC May 13, 2014 12:00am-1:01am PDT
as i said, liberalism has to work. that's "hardball" for now. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. the collapse of large parts of the ice sheet in west antarctica has begun and unstoppable. and marco rubio is probably running for president. >> it seems obvious you're moving closer to running for president? >> i've said it is something i'll consider at the end of this year. but i'll look at personal factors and also whether i could best promote this message and actually put in place these ideas that i want to see put in place. >> senator marco rubio says she's ready to be president, if the platform will allow him to promote his ideas.
one idea is climate change denialism. >> you don't think human activity has caused warming? >> i don't believe human acting is causing these dramatic changes to our climate the way scientists are portraying it. and i do not believe the laws they propose will do anything about it except destroy our economy. >> it is now officially the price of entrance into the 2016 republican field. you either need to literally know nothing or pretend you know nothing. back in 2007, rubio treated global warming as an accepted truth. >> on the issue of energy, global warming, dependence on foreign sources of fuel and capitalism have come together to create opportunities for us that were unimaginable for us a few short years. >> he advocated florida take the lead on energy. >> this nation, and ultimately the world, is headed towards emission caps and energy diversification.
demand will create an industry to meet it. florida should become the silicone valley of that industry. >> just last year, rubio was far more cautious in his denial, saying there was debate on the issue. >> the climate's always changing, the fundamental question is whether man-made activity is what's contributing most to it. i understand that people say there's a significant scientific consensus, but i've seen reasonable debate on that principle. >> but his ideas on climate change is in line with the republican party. the gop's embrace of climate denialism is one of the most dispiriting trends in the last decade. in 2003, 52% of republicans thought global warming was due to human activities. now it's 41%. and it's no better with republican politicians.
as recently as 2008, the republican party called on the members to address the risk of climate change based on sound science. today, just six years later, gop 2016 hopefuls are running away from sound science towards denialism. in 2011, chris christie said climate change was real and impacting new jersey. >> when you have over 90% of the world's scientists who have studied say climate change is occurring. it's time to defer to the experts. >> two years later, he dismissed it as not worth his time. >> several experts say the destruction from sandy was probably more severe because of elements of climate change, including rising sea levels. are you not willing to say that's true? >> first of all, that's their business and they said probably, maybe.
i've got a place to rebuild here and people want to talk to me about esoteric theories. >> and his take is right in line with other 2016 contenders. >> you always have to be worried about something that's considered a scientific theory. >> on the left, science has decided this, so you can't have a view. >> everybody that's studied it knows that over long periods of time that the climate changes. i'm not sure anybody knows why. >> this is political cowardess at its worst and most dangerous. but it's become increasingly cringe inducing just to watch. marco rubio hedged and equivocated out of fear and weakness, because the republican party is losing the debate on climate change and they seem to know it.
joining me now, reporter robert acosta. am i right that there is this discomfort you see in republican candidates when they have to address this issue? they're neither forthrightly in the denialist camp or the climate camp. they're trying to thread a small needle. >> in 2016, you'll see a lot of candidates echo rubio. they know there's just not room at a national level, there's not space to take a stance that's really different than marco rubio's. they're really in lock step on this conservative position on climate change. >> i can sense in the rubio statement and you can sense it when we were combing through the different tapes, they also are aware they do look increasingly ridiculous. even john carl in that interview into is a main stream journalist, saying wait a second, you're saying putting carbon in the atmosphere is not
heating the planet? i think there's a distance in the orthodox of the republican party and what accepted opinion among everyone is. >> the most interesting thing about climate change within the republican party is it's similar in some ways to gay marriage or abortion. it's one issue the republican position has not changed and will not likely evolve in the near future. republicans, especially the conservative base, are not interested in doing that. at the same time, at the national level, if you look at a run for president, are you going to lead with talking about climate change denial or with talk about marriage, are you going to lead talking about abortion? probably not. i don't think rubio is going to run on his climate change position, but will stay with it so the tea party doesn't desert him. >> there's the issues they want to talk about and the category issues they don't want to talk about. in some ways those two categories are just as important as the messages. you see there in a very
contested race, gary peters who is a democrat running for a senate seat, going after his republican opponent to say we want to hear where you are on climate. this is terry land's people saying, she believes there should be a healthy debate on the impact of human activity on our environment. i thought that was fascinating. she basically doesn't want to take a position but hand wave it away with a debate. >> you've seen this from her on other issues such as minimum wage. i did a piece in "the washington post" and she is supportive of a small increase in the minimum wage. it takes her a lit of different from some of the republicans. this is because a lot of these purple states, republicans are nervous. but they're not nervous enough to break from the gop line, but they are nervous enough to have these almost vague positions where they try to come up and thread the needle.
>> you're so right about what it signifies to voters. climate is an issue whether even people that don't care, they're not thinking about it all the time, it becomes a signaling point, is this person like me? do i want this person in the white house? when they're the person that knows 97% of scientists are engaged in a massive conspiracy, you think that's not the person i want in the oval office. >> when i speak to democrats, in a disengaged year when democrats are worried about turnout, when they talk about climate change, base voters get energized and reminded why they're on the ground fighting. >> joining me now is joe rome, chief science adviser for the years living dangerously.
one of the ironies here is that if you look at the modeling of what parts of the country are going to be hit the worst and are feeling the effects worse from the climate, florida and miami specifically where marco rubio is from is at the top of the list. >> absolutely. you know, i was thinking that in the real world, rubio's remarks should disqualify him from being president of united states. but it really disqualifies him from being a senator from florida. you mentioned the study about antarctica. we're going to have five or six feet sea level rise. that is going to depopulate southeast florida. the other point is you cross a point of no return, sea levels
keep rising and rising to the point where most of florida ultimately would be under water. >> i want to stop you there. that's obviously super depressing. let's try to address that. one of the things that is so nefarious about that rubio answer is basically this republican denialist front, climate change is not happening. then they move from that to well, we can't do anything about it. we've stalled long enough, it's gotten so bad that we're screwed, so we shouldn't pass cap and trade. you saw rubio pull off that one-two dance move in that very interview. >> yeah. that is a sweet one, where you go from denying there's a problem to saying oopse, it's too late to do anything about it. but the scientists i've talked to say it's not too late. it's certainly not too late to make a big difference in let's say the rate of sea level rise and the ultimate amount of sea
level rise, whether it's 10 feet or 200 feet. it's going to take centuries to do this, but if we listen to the marko rubio of the world, all we'll ever remember him by is somebody that put a buoy out in the ocean. this is where miami was. >> a marco rubio legacy buoy where miami used to be. maybe it will have one of -- joe rome, thanks for being on. >> be sure and have people watch "years of living dangerously" on showtime. what's in a name? everything. when that name is obamacare. the new hard data that backs up what a whole lot of anecdotal evidence suggests about the affordable care act, next. he pln but with less energy, moodiness, and a low sex drive, i had to do something. i saw my doctor. a blood test showed it was low testosterone, not age. we talked about axiron the only underarm low t treatment
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there's story that came out of kentucky where some folks were signing people up at a county fair somewhere and some guy goes up and he starts looking at the rates and decides he's going to sign up. he turns to his friend and says, this is a great deal. this is a lot better than obamacare. which is fine, because we -- i just want the thing to work. >> president obama took that anecdote about an obamacare opponent in kentucky who got health care under the affordable
care act in the early days of the fight to get people signed up. the president lost kentucky by a whopping 23 points in the 2012 election. kentucky officials branded their exchange not as obamacare but with kynect. it turned out to be a success. as noted by kentucky democratic governor steve bashir, more than 413,000 kentuckians purchased insurance or qualified for medicaid. 75% were people who lacked health insurance before obamacare. now, the story the president said was anecdotal. but today we got numbers to back it up. a new poll found while obamacare remains enormously unpopular in kentucky with a 57% unfavorable rating. kynect is more loved than it is loathed. so there's good news and bad
news for barack obama and the democrats. the bad news is that the gop message of obamacare is a disaster still resonates in the minds of many americans, particularly in kentucky. the good news is when the health care law is depoliticized, the reviews in a deep red state like kentucky get a whole lot better. since as we've been discussing on this show, republicans are now effectively waving the white flag when it comes to attacking obamacare, with house republicans planning no votes or hearings on the health care law, the polling may serve as a preview for how americans will soon view obamacare nationwide. joining me now from lexington is elizabeth jenson, a democratic candidate for kentucky's 6th congressional district. you have run an ad about your support for the affordable care act. i want to give folks a small listen to the radio ad you ran. take a listen. >> that's an attack ad against your republican incumbent for
voting against obamacare but in that ad it shows up as kynect. >> yes. so is that a question? >> clearly you're making a judgment there this is a popular program and you have the political wind at your back on this issue. >> absolutely. i've spent more than eight months talking to folks in every county, those 19 counties in this district and i've listened to people in every county telling me it's working for them. i have stories from small business owners who are saving $10,000 to $12,000 a month by allowing their employees to get their insurance through the state exchange, through kentucky kynect. i talked to a mother here in lexington saving $2,000 a year on her children's premiums.
i met a woman last weekend who for the first time she's 57 years old, for the first time she's had health insurance and they found a heart condition and she immediately had to have surgery. she might not have gone to the doctor if she didn't have insurance. so there are real stories out there every day. there's 413,000 people enrolled, and andy barr and mitch mcconnell are going to have to fight against that if they want to repeal this act. andy barr voted 19 times to end kynect. >> do the people know that? do you have a kind of voter education role to play while you're campaigning to let people know that's the same thing he voted against, not the abstract obamacare monstrosity, but the kynect that your cousin is on. >> that's what we're going to keep reminding everyone, that it's working and andy barr and mitch mcconnell have been voting
against it for two years. >> do you think you're going to see any turn around by your opponents, do you think they'll stop talking about obamacare as we head down the stretch, do you anticipate them making a decision that it's no longer politically expedient to beat up on obamacare when it's having that success in the state of kentucky? >> they've been talking about this and trying to repeal it for years. it's going to be hard for them to back pedal. they should be ashamed. the state that kentucky is in, our health, we are at the top of the list for obesity and heart disease, lung cancer. our state needs this. it's getting people insurance and covered. it's getting people health care and it's wrong for them to fight against this for so long.
and they're going to have to take the blame for that. >> you think they will take the blame for it? are voters going to make that connection? it's one thing to have it and have it fade into the background. it's another to keep it alive as an election issue. it seems democrats haven't figured out how to go on the offense with this politically. >> i'm going to be on the offense for it every day and make sure the voters in my district are aware of it. i think all of the democrats in our state should stand up. our governor has done a great thing to get this rolling, to get 413,000 people in our state covered. and it should be a model for the country. >> elizabeth jenson, thank you for joining us tonight. up next, i agree with senator rand paul and senator paul agrees with the aclu. that's next. those little things still get you.
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ever since senate majority leader harry reid pulled the trigger on the nuclear option, the fortunes of the obama white house in filling judicial vacancies has turned around. during the six months prior to senator reid's decision, the senator confirmed 24 of the president's nominations. six months later, 39 more have been confirmed. but now the administration has run into an obstacle with two proposed nominees set to be considered tomorrow. one of whom is michael boggs, conservative democrat who is opposed by pretty much every single liberal interest group, for good reasons. he voted to create choose life license plates and tighten restrictions on minors seeking
abortion. and to keep the confederate insignia on the georgia state flag. the other is david barren, he's being opposed by democratic senators, code pink, the aclu and senator rand paul. they're making a simple request. when barren worked in the justice department's office of legal counsel, he co-authored a legal memo that provided the basis for the u.s. government to target and kill u.s. citizen al awaki. they want that memo and others that he authored released. whether or not you agree with the memo on constitutional grounds, i can think of no reason the logic contained therein should be kept secret. senator rand paul in today's "new york times" said, legal
arguments that affect the rights of every american should not have the privilege of secrecy. that may be true or not, but we don't know without seeing the memo. the request for transparency is absolutely right, and warranted. independent of david barren's own merits as a nominee, but if this is the lever that is going to pry open this public information, so be it. release the memos. governments are entitled to keep secrets, they are not entitled to keep secret law. katy perry's new insta-glam collection from covergirl new ready set gorgeous makeup insta-gorgeous skin new bombshell curvaceous mascara insta-bombshell lashes
woman: what do you mean, homeowners insurance doesn't cover floods? [ heart rate increases ] man: a few inches of water caused all this? [ heart rate increases ] woman #2: but i don't even live near the water. what you don't know about flood insurance may shock you -- including the fact that a preferred risk policy starts as low as $129 a year. for an agent, call the number that appears on your screen. i'm going to let you in on an open secret. when lay people like us think about real money, we think about investment banks, hedge funds. but in wall street, what they refer to as real money are the pension funds. that's where the gigantic
buckets of unguarded money really is. the investment banks and hedge funds want to get their hands on real money to manage them and charge fees for doing so and make a killing. these huge pools of money that are such invites targets and the state of new jersey has these strong rules to make sure that the politicians charged with overseeing that money don't give out contacts to manage that money as a quid pro quo for campaign donations. governor chris christie criticized among other things then governor jon corzine's close connections to wall street. the ad included this clip from the movie "wall street." >> the point is, ladies and gentlemen, greed, for lack of a better word, is good. >> since then, things have changed.
new jersey, among all 50 states, ranks number two in the amount of pension funds it's invested in wall street hedge funds. right now the chris christie administration is fending off a flurry of inquiries about new jersey treasury rules. the kicker is that the federal republican politician charlie baker is running for governor of massachusetts, for the second time. here's the basic timeline that no one is disputing as set out in an exclusive and corroborated by "the boston globe." candidate charlie baker donated $10,000 in may 2011 to the state party committee of governor chris christie new jersey. seven months later, a christy controlled fund contributed $25 million to which baker is a member. even that he was not an actual employee in the strict legal
sense of the firm general catalyst partner. even though 33 documents suggest otherwise. so it's possible baker did not violate new jersey laws, but baker would have to explain a great deal more to make it clear. the same may be true from the chris christie administration. joining me now from denver is the author of that piece. all right, david, baker's folks are saying you're out of line, this was completely innocuous, and he's not really part of this firm. convince me they're wrong. >> well, i think he's already tried to convince you that you're wrong when he filed as his employer on 33 separate documents the same firm in question.
the fact remains that charlie baker made a $10,000 contribution to the new jersey republican state committee a few months before the new jersey pension fund controlled by chris christie gave that same firm a large pension contract. charlie baker never disputed that he was an investment person. never disputed that he was an employee at the firm. all of the news coverage previous to this, only now when pay to play rules have been brought up is charlie baker saying all those 33 campaign documents that i said general catalyst was my employer and i said i was an investor, executive or partner with that firm, all that stuff now was an error. i made a mistake. >> but explain to me -- let's say -- this was your investigative report, you found this, you published this, you published the followups. it's been front page on "the boston globe." money changes hands, he gives chris christie money, his fund
happened to get money. what is the problem there from any kind of rule breaking sense even if it turns out to be the case? >> well, it's because chris christie first and foremost has a responsibility under new jersey division of treasury rules to not give out pension contracts to firms whose employees or associates, that's in the rules, associates have given money to chris christie or really any state politician in new jersey. so first and foremost is the question is where is the due diligence from new jersey in the middle of a culture of corruption? is there anybody looking at these rules in the chris christie administration? the larger problem is this comes out of a problem where people as you suggested before have been spending money on campaign contributions. pension money is supposed to be invested solely with the fiduciary regard for retires,
not spent with regard for whether the pension fund of a person or the politician controlling the pension fund is connected to a political donor. >> so we've heard a lot of reaction from baker's people. baker had been pushing back against this very hard, saying i'm not an employee. we heard nothing from the christie administration, but it seems the implications are more severe for them. i'm curious, what have you heard, have you gotten any response from the christie folks? >> the only response that we've gotten from the christie folks is that general catalyst, charlie baker's firm that he listed 33 separate times, that he's been in the press, the only response he's gotten is they filled out his disclosure firm and they didn't list political contributions on that, is that the only due diligence that the chris christie administration is doing? aren't they even searching new jersey's own government searchable contributions? this is on the new jersey government website.
the fact that the christie administration did seem to know about this is astonishing. >> and you've got to think about the fact that new jersey happens to have very strong rules. so the possibility of a rule violation here where a contribution happens and a few months later a contract goes out, that's only a possible violation of other rules or the law because the bar is so high in new jersey. there's 49 other states which the bar is much lower and i kept thinking as i'm reading all this reporting that you've been doing on pensions, what the heck is going on in other states where there's essentially very little in the law to stop this kind of thing from happening? >> that's a terrific question. if it's happening in new jersey, you can bet it's happening all over the country. we have a situation now where there are $3 trillion worth of money in public pension funds, and it's the wild west in many cases. we reported earlier about the company black stone and how it employs an army of lobbyists in the state of kentucky and it's gotten large pension contracts there.
these are example after example after example where wall street is funneling money, wall street and financial firms are funneling money into the campaigns of the legislators and state officials who are overseeing these pension funds and the question is, what is being given out? they're a rip-off for taxpayers and retires. >> most of the hedge funds that i saw missed the s&p performance this year and charging fees from two to ten times what a standard index fund would. if you have a pension fund, they better be getting a good return for that taxpayer dollar, otherwise their face is ripped off. david, great work on this. thank you. >> thank you. michael sam becomes a ram and the first openly gay football player to get drafted in the nfl. now what? his agent joins me next.
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the nfl draft has become this big television event. it gets bigger every year. this year even more people tuning in cheering for your client. >> there was a time in this country when jackie robinson broke the color barrier, we were far ahead of the civil rights changes that happened. if people passed over mike because of his sexuality, it will signify the sports has fallen very far behind the rest of society in terms of where we're at. >> there were 256 players selected by teams in the 2014 nfl draft, an event that's become a three-day multimedia extravaganza which fans flock to manhattan and millions watch on tv. all of this just for the pleasure of other people reading a list of names and hug the nfl commissioner roger goodell. somehow it's imbued with tremendous drama. this year there was extra drama.
by saturday evening on the third and final day of the draft, 248 people had been drafted, only eight more selections remained. and the parlance of the draft, this guy, the s.e.c. defensive player of the year and openly gay athlete michael sam was still on the board. with everyone watching and time running out on the draft, the question lingered of whether the nfl was going to, well, frankly pass the social test set before it and bring an openly gay football player into the game. then the call finally came. >> the 249th pick for the 2014 nfl draft, the st. louis rams select michael sam, defensive end, missouri. >> and then the reaction from michael sam himself. [ inaudible ]
>> the reaction to that instantly iconic man when michael sam celebrated by kissing his boyfriend went two fays. fans inside music radio hall were head chanting his name. even president obama said in a statement, from the playing field to the board room, lbgt americans prove every day you should be judged by what you do, not who you are. the other side, i'm not watching this espn until this michael sam story dies. it's got. cameron, take me through what you guys were thinking in saturday morning, into midday saturday, friday when it was
getting very, very close to the end of this draft and looking like your client might not make it. >> you know, tensions were high. it often gets that way on draft day. obviously the stakes were higher here though. we were just continuing to put feelers out there, talk to people we knew on the inside and trying to get an accurate gauge of where michael was going to go. >> what was the atmosphere in the room like, as the possibility of not getting drafted must have entered the picture? was there frustration, did you get any beef between people like we shouldn't have come out, we shouldn't have done this? i'm mad about this? i can imagine tensions get so high in these circumstances because you have no control over the future of your life and career. >> the room was tension but there was never finger pointing. we have an unbelievable relationship with mike. scouts already knew that he was gay. if he was going to fall in the draft because of his sexuality whether or not he came out publicly was still going to
affect him. >> so there are arguments about whether he landed in the draft compared to where he was possibly projected, early projections had him in the fourth round. he said he should have been taken in the first three rounds. do you think his sexuality and him coming out accounts to slipping to the final round of the draft? >> there's a lot of things that going into where a player is taken. the way he did on the field the year before, mike had some results in the combine which we weren't happy with. to speculate what role his sexuality played in the minds of 32 general managers, for me to comment on that would be conjecture. i don't think it had anything to do with it. >> so he has to make the team now. it just occurred to me as i was watching the tape of him, this is a high pressure situation, professional athletes are under a tremendous amount of pressure.
these are young adults, 21, 22-year-old individuals. now on top of that, he's got the whole world looking at whether this seventh round player is going to make a team that's got a good defensive line, like is he ready for this? it strikes me that the amount of interest natural fortitude this guy must have to put himself through this situation is remarkable. >> yeah. we know what he's got to do, too. he's all about work. he said after saturday night, he's going to turn the page and it's all work from here on out. he's going to a well-coached unit, a great organization. and he knows he's going to have to compete his butt off if he wants to make the roster. >> do you worry about what happens if he doesn't make the team? both from a personal standpoint and also this dream dies, that there is all this coverage and second guessing. you've got to set yourself up for another climactic moment in the near future.
>> that seems to be the michael sam story. we're very confident he's going to make the roster. if not with st. louis, he will be contributing with someone this season because he has the tools to do that. >> i thought the kiss was so incredible and moving. you guys have had to manage these intimate parts of his life in a way that is not normally expected of an agent with a heterosexual player. was there discussion about that? was there discussion about oh, we should do this or not do this. these people should be in the room? >> i didn't know it was going to happen. neither did joe. frankly it didn't matter to either of us. we've seen them kiss many times. the joy that was in the room, the sense of relief that was in the room, i thought it was completely appropriate and it was a beautiful moment that people were allowed to share with mike and us. >> cameron weiss who is michael
sam's agent, congratulations on the draft. >> thank you very much, chris. >> michael sam might be poised to be the first openly gay player in the nfl, but he won't be the first gay player in the nfl. we'll talk to someone who lived it, next. i always say be the man with the plan but with less energy, moodiness, and a low sex drive, i had to do something. i saw my doctor. a blood test showed it was low testosterone, not age. we talked about axiron the only underarm low t treatment that can restore t levels to normal in about two weeks in most men.
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uh...little help? i got you! unh! it's so beautiful! man: should we call security? no, this is just getting good. the name your price tool, still only from progressive. peoi go to angie's listt for all kinds of reasons. to gauge whether or not the projects will be done in a timely fashion and within budget. angie's list members can tell you which provider is the best in town. you'll find reviews on everything from home repair to healthcare. now that we're expecting, i like the fact i can go onto angie's list and look for pediatricians. the service providers that i've found on angie's list actually have blown me away. find out why more than two million members count on angie's list. angie's list -- reviews you can trust. 2013 defensive player of the year is ready to [ bleep ] show the world that he's ready to work. >> you sound like you're ready to get out there in the regular season now, michael.
>> let me tell you something, if we were playing the vikings right now, i'd have three sacks. >> former defensive lineman for the nfl and author of "alone in the trenches, my life as a gay man in the nfl." mike, michael sam's agent did not want to speculate on this question everyone is asking whether he slipped in the draft because of the publicity around him being gay. what do you think? >> projected to be a fifth round before the public knew he was gay. he did not do well in the combine. so we don't know why, but it's totally plausible, given his overall resume that he would slip. the reason he went, the coach of the rams said he didn't work out well, but he was so good on the field. at least one team wanted him. >> there was some ugliness after the moment he was announced. but to put it in perspective, miami dolphins player don jones tweeted omg, horrible, after seeing the kiss.
he then put out an apology statement. i felt like we were running to twitter to search for horrible things people were saying but it was not that much. twitter to search for horrible things people were saying but it was not that much. that seems to be the story so far, not that big a deal in the way people dealt with it. >> i know, the big kiss, right? when the rams announced that they picked michael sam, i tell you what, it was such an amazing feeling. such an amazing feeling. it was such a different response from when i got drafted back in '91. you know, i had a panic attack when my name got called. but to see michael sam embrace his partner and show affection was the most amazing, amazing feeling for me. that this young gentleman is going to be able to go into the nfl and be himself and not have to worry about looking over his
shoulder, not having to worry about not introducing his partner to the team or anything like that. for me, it was very emotional and i was very excited. but i also was a little ticked off. like a lot of other people, that he went in the seventh round. >> you said you had a panic attack in 1991. -year -- your draft day, well it probably wasn't broadcast live to 80 million people. why did you have that panic attack? >> you know, i had a panic attack. it was because i was in the closet, because i was gay, and i was living with this crippling secret all my life. for me, i was thinking that someone would see my name on the board, my name on the board and contact the green bay packers that they just drafted a gay guy. and that's -- i wasn't able to enjoy it that way. but man, just from when i came out, when i got drafted to now, absolutely amazing. it was such an historical moment.
>> that's the answer to when anyone says why do we care about his sexual orientation, why can't he keep it to himself, that's called being in the closet. >> i have to tell you guys, when i went to the super bowl with atlanta, i'm watching all the wives and the families come in, they're getting introduced to all the coaches and everything. so my partner at the time, mitchell, had to hide in the shadows. that's the kind of stuff that really took a toll on me. and put me into that depression, because i wasn't able to do that. what michael sam, not only that, he can play to the best of his potential. without having to deal with any of that. let me tell you, it's going to be amazing. >> i keep thinking about the amount of -- i'm really blown away by this guy, michael sam. as an individual. just the -- i mean, this is
someone who has chosen to do something that puts such unbelievable stress and pressure on himself, as a 21, 22-year-old. even the kiss itself, it was just so awesome and courageous and proud. and it just -- it makes me admire this guy. an incredible story. >> regardless -- please. go ahead. >> i was just going to say, it just seemed so honest and non-contrived in the moment. i'm going to kiss vito because that's what i do, kiss vito. >> that's how we celebrate in america, right? >> exactly. >> when something good happens, you embrace the person that you love. so that's -- it was just natural. but i've got to tell you this, i'm excited he's going to the rams. not only because they picked him, but i'm excited that because my coach will be his coach, defensive line coach with the rams. so i was able to talk to mike today and we had a great discussion. >> here's my question to you, mike.
do you think there's anyone in the nfl on the phone with those teams as it was getting down to the 10 and the 8, being like, you better take this guy, because if he had not been taken, it would have been the story everywhere on monday. >> they deny it, but they set a tone and they make it clear that not only will he be welcomed and this will be a good thing for the league. i think that the circumstance for the rams, and who knows, maybe one of the other teams will pick him, too. the owner went to missouri for like all three, and he's got a nice home there. seventh round picks are not guarantied to make teams. he might get cut or make a taxi squad. i went back the last five guys picked in his spot, and they've all played in the nfl. i think that's what's going to happen with him. >> thank you gentlemen both. that's "all in" this evening.
"the rachel maddow show" starts right now. good evening. >> good evening, chris. my favorite thing about the kiss was seeing michael sam's shoulder and then michael sam's head and then his other shoulder all being as big as the other heads in the room. >> everyone is talking all week, he's undersized, undersized. then it's a reminder he's a massive human being in context. >> i just liked being able to see an nfl player in a room full of normal sized humans. to recalibrate my capacity of human understanding. thanks to you at home for joining us. big show tonight. all right. if you find yourself in huntsville, texas, and sadly, you need to get yourself to the hospital, you have a number of options in huntsville. there's the huntsville memorial hospital. there's the memorial herman hospital, also there's the conroe regional medical center and for specialty oncology care, you can go to the sam houston cancer center in huntsville. there's a number of hospitals in huntsville, texas. there ot