tv The Last Word With Lawrence O Donnell MSNBC May 7, 2015 10:00pm-11:01pm PDT
that the patriots did it. the report continues, quote, it >> chris christie and his dimming white house hopes, first swing through new hampshire after those indictments. >> i said in january of 2014 has turned out to be exactly what happened. >> i knew shutting down that bridge was retribution. >> i have no misgivings about it. >> christie 2016. >> that so-called deflategate report. >> i haven't had much time to digest it.
>> more probable than not brady was generally aware. >> but when i do, i'll be sure to let you know about it. >> i just hope this doesn't change bill belichick's happy go lucky attitude towards the press. tonight, the united kingdom is facing a difficult election. >> he's got no plans. >> he's toast. >> i'm sick and tired of hearing you shout out. >> president obama is speaking >> president obama is speaking at a dnc fund-raiser in portland, oregon. he's expected to talk about the biggest problems he has had with congressional democrats in his presidency. the international trade deal, known as the trans-pacific partnership, massachusetts senator elizabeth warren is leading democratic opposition for the president in congress. here is what president obama has said about senator warren's opposition.
>> i love elizabeth. we're allies on a whole host of issues. but she's wrong on this. >> but in politico today, unnamed administration officials are privately calling senator warren's attacks baseless and desperate. today, senator warren deemed up with bill de blasio to cowrite an op-ed in "the washington post" outlining what they say will be the new progressive agenda by increasing the minimum wage, allowing families to refinance student loans at lower rates, giving every child access to full care prekindergarten, investing in infrastructure, roads, bridges, rail, water, power and broadband, strengthening and expanding social security, strengthening the rules of the marketplace, ending billions in tax breaks for corporations and promoting fair trade policies that strengthen our economy, create good jobs and establish fair companies around the world. yesterday mayor de blasio said his strategic information for
this new policy agenda came from what newt gingrich did 20 years ago. i obviously disagree with newt gingrich on many things, but in 1994 he put forward a contract with america. it was a clear, sharp set of ideas about how to change america. in my view in the wrong direction. but as an organizational tool, it was very effective. on tuesday, may 12th, we'll offer a straightforward clear, sharp, progressive agenda for addressing income inequality. >> joining us now in washington, greg peters, he's an msnbc political analyst. david corn, msnbc political analyst and annie carney, with politico covering hillary clinton. the description of fair dread that bill de blasio and elizabeth warren are going for is exactly what president obama
will say is in the deal that he's making. >> this probably goes back to nafta, when bill clinton promoted nafta. we're going to take labor rights, environmental rights and other issues into account when we do this deal. and i think by and large, a lot of the unions and a lot of the, you know, economic critics on the left to that deal, even some on the right, remember pat buchanan and ross perot were against it feel like at the end of the day, those things are secondary. people like bill de blasio and elizabeth warren see they don't see how this helped american workers here. and elizabeth warren adds another ingredient into the mix when she's been talking of how wall street types and republicans want to use these fair trade agreements -- or free
trade agreements, i should say, to undermall wall street and other regulations. so she has a lot of skin in this game from very different directions. >> and, jeremy, what is elizabeth warren up to here? why did she need bill de blasio to cowrite an op-ed piece. >> well, that seemed fairley smart to me. that way she tamps down on a little bit of the speculation about whether or not she has presidential aspirations. she can put identity de blasio and say no, this is a joint effort. so one thing, though, that i think the democrats need to be very careful about is assuming that republicans can't talk about these issues that they -- that she and de blasio outlined in this op-ed. so democrats are very concerned that republicans are coopting their messages on the middle class, on economic -- which republican? >> i think jeb bush is doing it
quite well. >> what specific is -- >> he took -- yeah. at this point, it is a lot more general talk of providing economic opportunity to the poor, to making sure that people who are born poor are not condemned to a life of poverty. and it's a message that marco rubio has. it's a message that rand paul has. >> in terms of from a policy perspective, we aspire to give you policies from ronald reagan's day that will do these things. >> the policies are vastly different. and i don't want to leave any ambiguity there. what was in the op-ed today that de blasio and elizabeth warren wrote, almost none of those policies would be something that you would see a republican endorse. but their tone is softening and they're learning how to get at this issue in a way that i think is going to open some ears. >> annie, what is the clinton campaign's strategy for dealing with elizabeth warren?
and by that, i mean she is this very powerful force in the party. she's probably -- hillary clinton has been careful not to take a solid position yet on this trans-pacific partnership in her candidacy, although she did take that position as secretary of state. she's going to have to contend with elizabeth warren, it seems to me, whether elizabeth warren were to be a candidate or not. >> she does. and one thing about the op-ed, aside from the free trade piece, a lot of their points are things that hillary clinton has been talking about herself, whether she's being pushed that way because of elizabeth warren, i don't know, but she's talked on the trail about paid family leave, she's talked about raising the minimum wage. she hasn't said how much, but she says she's in favor of raising it. she is definitely, i'm hearing, going to make student debt a huge part of her campaign. we'll probably hear something about that the next few months. what else is in there? she's been talking about cutting
tax breaks to billionaires. so a lot of those bullet points, if you took off the bylines, i think you could still tell who wrote it, but she's taking some of those messages herself. and even some of the language, i think, in the op-ed is talked about the game is rigged. hillary clinton's line right now is the deck is stacked against you. so even the language that they're using is similar. i don't know if it's in reaction to them that she's taking on these messages or if there's less difference there than people are make it out to be. i'm not sure. >> let's listen to what bill de blasio said on "morning joe" yesterday about hillary clinton. >> you are waiting to see what hillary clinton's message is and you are not there yet. >> i'm optimistic. i'm seeing some very powerful signs. but i think it's important to hear how she will address inequality. >> this is one of the most fascinating things this
political season, that someone whose political career basically was based on working for and with the clintons is now waiting for her to say something that in her entire political career apparently she hasn't yet said to make him endorse her for president. >> well, what i think is interesting is having spoken to and listened to elizabeth warren is that these people, you know, really care about issues. i mean, this is like -- and it's basically -- usually in a political campaign, a presidential campaign, we're seeing this ralt on the republican side. they are real differences. people care about politics and policy get to fight these things out. i don't think people like bill de blasio want to give this up yet. >> i'm told he's on the subject of the trade bill now. let's listen. >> we are not afraid of competition. we are concerned if the playing field is not level. and that's why we've got to have the kinds of enforceable, tough, fair trade deals that are going
to make sure that american workers and american businesses aren't locked out of these markets. that's part of a middle class economic agenda and it is a priority. for us. we've got to make sure it happens. we've got to make sure that we are training our young people for the jobs in the future. and that's why i've proposed to make sure that the first two years of community college in this country are free, just like public high school, that every young person can at least get that kind of start for the jobs in the future. and for folks who still want to go on for four years, it's not bad having two years free. that will cut our debt. the student debt that is such a burden on so many young people all across this country. so that has to be a priority and we've got to make sure that early childhood education is our priority because we know that young people, when they get a
chance early on in life, it is the best investment we can make, that every dollar we invest in early childhood education means higher education rates, lower teen pregnancy rates. it means kids are going to do better, they are going to be successful citizens, they'll pay taxes. we will get that money back. they're fought going to be going straight from school to jail. they're going to be going into college and they're going to be going into jobs and that's the kind of america we want. that's what we believe in. we've still got to make sure that we get comprehensive immigration reform passed in this country. i couldn't be prouder -- i couldn't be prouder of the work that we've done to executive action to make sure that our young dreamers, young people who were brought here as children and are americans just like our
kids except they don't have the right documents. the notion that we would be keeping them in the shadows made no sense. we've got to solve that larger problem and only congress can do that and you've got some great members of congress who understand that. now we've got to get all members of congress to understand that and we've got to get that thing passed. it's the right thing to do. >> we'll monitor that speech in the control room. we'll go back to it if he gets into anything controversial. jeremy peters, he's in oregon where the leading democrat and the senate finance committee rob widen is with him on this trade bill. the pacific states tend to be more in favor of this because this is pacific trade we're talking about. >> i think for most of america, they're thinking trade what?
this isn't exactly -- >> the trans-pacific partnership. you hear it he ever where you go in washington, right? >> it's like an acronym. we're all going to know what that is. >> david, the president finds himself in a fight he's never been in before and this is with his own party. that's what's standing in his way to get fast track authority which every president prior to him has had, fast track trade authority and to get this bill done and you know, when i think back to the way nafta moved through the congress, democrats were against it, the majority leader, he was against it. but he didn't fight it. if anything, he facilitated it and less it slide by. >> there is strong republican opposition to it, too. and that's news. >> the populist list coalition
of left and right. we may see some of the republican presidential candidates speaking out against it, too. nancy pelosi is an interesting figure here. she's from california, she leads the democrats. she has always been in the president's corner the. but she has been more will it liberal than a lot of her party has been. so how she finesses this is going to be pretty interesting and i think reed will be there trying to get as many democrats as he can on the democratic side. >> what about hillary clinton, how is she going to finesse it? >> she's between a rock and a hard place. and i do wonder if obama's big speech tonight will make her have to answer more questions. as second of state, she supported these free trade negotiations. if she now says she's against it, that could be a problem. if she's for it, she alienates
the unions and what they need. so far she's given out one statement that was kind 06 bland and managed not to piss anyone off, but didn't really give any answeres and she's still on the hook for telling us where she stands on it on and seems to be in no rush to choose a side right now. >> we're going to take a break here. when we come back in massachusetts tonight, tom brady answered a couple of questions about the nfl report on his deflated balls. but, of course, he refused, as any gentleman would, to say anything about his balls. he's just so modest, that guy. and in new hampshire today, chris christie had a big problem with being asked about the indictments of bridget kelly and bill peroni. our own casey hunt will have questions.it's a full day for me, and i love it.
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new revelations tonight about that terrorist attack in garland, texas. the fbi says that it sent police in garland a secure electronic message with elton simpson's picture and license plate number three hours before sunday's event began. the fbi says it acted as soon as it developed information that he was interested in going to that event. but had no reason to believe that he wanted to attack it or even that he had left phoenix. police in garland declined tonight to say what they did in response to that information. fbi director james comey told reporters i know there are other sheldon simpsons out there. fbi director comey and johnson will participate in a video conference tomorrow. up next, casey hunt asks chris christie about those indictments.
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when you aren't treated like a priority. we do things differently. we'll take care of it. vo: we put members first... join the nation. thank you. ♪ nationwide is on your side ♪ governor chris christie made his first appearance in new hampshire since his indictment on charges related to the george washington bridge lane closures. the presidential hopeful was asked this by nbc's casey hunt during one of his stops in manchester. >> how can americans trust that a christie white house wouldn't end up facing indictments? >> you know, such a silly question i'm not even going to respond. >> but he did say this about how he handled the george washington bridge lane closures. >> it's how you respond to that crisis. that's what leadership and management is all about. it's not that no one will never make a mistake in judgment. it's how do you respond to that mistake and judgment.
we acted honestly, directly, swiftly. i don't think fair people looking at it will have misgivings, either. they'll understand that mistakes get made and they want to know do they have a leader who is strong enough to own up to those mistakes, be accountable and take the action necessary to fix them. >> a registered 80% of republican registered voters think country christie is the least likely to win. he comes in second just behind mr. donald trump. joining us our panel now is msnbc political reporter casey hunt. casey, keep up the silly questions, please. i can guarantee you if you get into this debate stage, he's going to hearing this we know. how will americans trust that
while in white house there would be no indictment? is his strategy going to be to simply deal with once i discovered how bad my administration was then i immediately did what i had to do to fix it? >> well, it experience seems that way, lawrence. i mean, i'll let you judge bloovs bloov that was a silly question, but it seemed to me to be the question raised by these indictments. why is it christie has fallen in these new hampshire polls? it is questions that has been raised by this conduct that has ultimately proven to be criminal. while he does say on one hand look, i led on this, i stepped out there, i was honest, wasn't the fact that this happened at all a failure in leadership? i think there are questions about whether or not -- you know, how -- how is it that he was playing the role of the strong leader if he didn't even know that this was going on,
right? so i think that these questions are going to dog him all along the way and i think one of the other things you're seeing in these polls is the reality is this is a wide field with a lot of quality candidate toes choose from. if christie was the only republican to choose from in this fight, it might be a different story, but the fact is republican voters have so many choices here it butts christie at a serious disadvantage. >> casey, i watched christie one time and he was better received than any republican i've seen for him in new hampshire. how is that going now? >> he's absolutely well received here. his brand of politics fits a lot with this state. he's doing it both in policy. he gave a very -- a strong speech on entitlements. he took some stances which normally would be considered controversial. his slogan, you're always going to know where he stands.
and that plays well. i think the issue is whether or not he can convince people that there's no disconnect between what's going on that they can see in front of them on that diner or on their tv screen and what he and his people are doing behind the scenes, the things that they can't see. and i think there is this real demand right now in the electorate for a government that is honest and accountable and that just works and i don't think they're seeing that from -- whether it's the bridge scandal, whether it's pensions in new jersey, i think christie has a disconnect that he's going to have to solve if ultimately he's going to sell it. i think he's well on his way to doing it. i think voters are very receptionist, but i think it still remains to be seen. >> we took a vote of the panel while you were speaking and it's unanimous, it was not a silly question. david corn, thanks. >> christie's position seems to be i'm shocked. there was bullying going on in my administration.
who could believe that i would have aids that would bully a political opponent in this manner. but the investigation is supposedly continuing on some pay to play issues and his pension law that the biggest thing he sees celebrates in terms of an accomplishment might be overturned by the courts in new jersey. economically, new jersey is not doing too well. so i think he has a boston load of problems and i'd be surprised if even brothers at this point are willing to invest in him. >> it is the tone that the idea that people who carry this out were acting in his name, acting in the way that they would expect him to respond favorably to. and that's the biggest problem he has to get over. you mentioned the debates earlier and kind of -- you know, it got me thinking, that's where his strength is going to be. if he runs, if he makes it through to the first debate, i think that that is his first opportunity to come and show the
country the real -- the chris christie that was so popular that was able to win election in new jersey in a very blue state. makes me think of newt gingrich. >> i don't know that christie would love that comparison, jeremy. >> but casey, what it does make him, though, what these polls are starting to make him is the candidate with nothing to lose. and if he decides, look, i'm going to go into new hampshire even though i'm polling below carlie fiorina or whatever, what he -- he has nothing to lose and that can make him pretty dangerous on a debate scale. >> i think that he has to -- like new hampshire is his best hope. you know he's not going to win iowa. he's already had a little infrastructure in the state party, i think, from his constituent services, like casey said, he plays well in those forums.
he's this independent guy who tells it like it is. so new hampshire, he has to give it all he's got there. if he doesn't win new hampshire, i think -- like new hampshire is the reason he can be considered a presidential candidate. i was also going to say, i found the comparison between tom brady and christie and is bridgegate, i found it funny that he defended tom brady. they're both in a similar position. >> yeah. we have that clip. let's listen to what he said about the tom brady thing. >> doesn't seem all that conclusive to me. people in public life wind up becoming targets for various reasons. so here is tom brady. great looking guy. wealthy beyond imagination. married to gisels bundchen and four super bowls. it seems like tom brady's life is almost too perfect. >> and we have the republican ticket, chris christie and tom brady.
>> that's a winner in new hampshire, isn't it? >> you know, i'm impressed that he can prosecute nouns gisele's name correctly. that's a lot of knowledge there. >> and he -- i love that he did not think that was a silly comparison. >> i love that he didn't -- he would have looked like more of a hypocrit to come out and blast tom brady. they're not, right now, doing anything to prove it. >> they're just two good looking guys. >> they have a lot in common. >> we're going to leave it there for tonight. >> go ahead, casey. >> thank you, lawrence. i would still like to see both tom brady and chris christie's text messages, for what it's worth. >> we'll see what we can do. thank you very much for joining us, all of you. coming up -- tom brady spoke tonight.
his big moment, his first public appearance since the report on deflate gate. he said absolutely nothing about those footballs. he said he'll think about maybe saying something about it in the future. buying a used car can be a scary proposition. you walk onto that lot and immediately you are surrounded like a guppy in a shark tank. it just feels like car salesmen want to sell whatever car is best for them, not best for me. there's gotta be a better way. ♪ ♪ as long as people drive cars carmax will be the best way to buy them.
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tonight in salem, massachusetts, patriots quarterback tom brady was asked about the nfl report that says he probably knew patriots personnel were deflating footballs just the way he liked them. >> i haven't had much time to digest it fully, but when i do, i'll let you know how i feel about it. i dealt with a lot of things in the past. i dealt with this three months ago before the super bowl. i've dealt with it over my career, my life. i'm very fortunately so many people that loved me and support me. we earned and achieved everything we got this year as a team. i'm very proud of that and our fans should be, too. as a human, you care what people think. i certainly care what the people that are close to me think and what they care about, i think also the public figure you learned that there's not everyone is going to like you, either. so good, bad, indifferent. there's a lot of people that don't like tom brady. >> joining us now from salem,
massachusetts, is the host of msnbc's up with steve krenacki. also joining us is jordan schultz. so he said absolutely nothing after all that build up. he just said, you know, i haven't really read the report. a little flurry of football questions around his feelings about the situation and that was it. >> yeah. and that was it. and then, of course, the clock was ticking. the rule coming in there was we could videotape it, we could pull the plug. the local affiliates here that were blasting it with the color ball webs that's how abrupt they were. they stuck to their word on that one. i was a little surprised that he said as little as he did. i wasn't expecting too much. i wasn't expecting a lengthy statement here. i was expecting he would say something, even with the low threshold i had, he didn't quite reach that level. but at the same time, you look at the posture that brady and his camp are taking.
his agent today put out a defiant statement just sort of throwing back everything the nfl said, trying to throw it right back into the nfl's face, in some cases using the same language that the nfl had used in that report that said that tom brady probably knew and probably had some level of knowledge. i think what it comes down to here is there's a relation on brady's part, there's a relation of the people around their part that in the court of public opinion, outside of where i am right now, outside of new england, he's never going to win this. people think the patriots are cheaters as an organization. maybe they're right. people think tom brady is a cheater. maybe they're right. they're always going to stand by and what tom brady is thinking about right now is the question of the suspension. are they going to make him sit for a game next year, for two games, for four games? some people suggested half the season, eight points. what brady's team is looking at is at that point, there's a lot of qualified statements. we think it's likely, we think it's probable, we think it's more likely than not, but no smoking gun.
>> oh, the gun is smoking like crazy. the language couldn't be -- you know, jordan sharp, because they say fair preponderance of the evidence, people are saying, oh, wait, that's not proof. yes, it is. in american courtrooms, that is the standard of proof for everything that is not a criminal case. if this was civil litigation, if the nfl was suing him, they won. >> yes, it is. unfortunately for tom brady, i think the legacy question now comes into play. steve, i know you're a big patriots fan. you know i'm from seattle. we have to kind of go out of here. i look at it like, okay, this is going -- this is probably going on across the whole league. and, you know, a lot of teams are doing this. a lot of quarterbacks are doing this. some of them happened to get caught during the playoffs. and, obviously, the pin has fallen. so i'm disappointed, though, on a bigger scale in the league because they have taken this and they have just continually drawn
it out over time. the fact that we're talking about this the week after the nfl draft, to me, is appalling. and tom brady, this is unacceptable. i mean, at some point you have to take responsibility, steve, and i know you're saying it's no smoking gun, but don't you feel like after the report that came out, over 240 pages, tom brady being implicated and then not sharing text messages, to me, that's the ultimate. >> couldn't be more guilty. >> steve, before we rely, i want to remind jordan that tom brady beat your team using the regulation football. okay? that's not in doubt. he won the super bowl using regulation footballs and that ultimately, steve, in the world of sports, that ultimately is his best defense. i could have won the games if i was using regulation balls even though, obviously, i was conspireing not to. >> well, right. i would would raise the question, too, why would they even do this in the first place?
realistically, yeah, as a patriots fan i can admit does it look like they were up to something here? yes, absolutely. does 95% of the country believe that? yes, absolutely. but the analogy that's been drawn for me, think about the game of hockey. the game of hockey, every player takes the stick and they try to bend it, right? they try to put an arc, a curve in the stick. there are rules in the nhl that you can only have so much of a curve in your stick and every player tries to get away with -- >> these are patriots fans, so desperate. >> limited and -- >> because we did not get to hear tom brady talk about his balls tonight, we're going to have to go back to a little video of the last time we heard tom brady talk about his balls. let's listen to this. >> to me, they're perfect. i don't want anyone touching the balls after that. i don't want anyone rubbing them, you know, putting any air in them, taking any air out. to me, those balls are perfect
and i go in there and i choose however many balls are necessary. but you go through that process of breaking the balls in and getting comfortable with them. everybody has a preference. some guys like them round and some guys like them thin, some guys like them tacky, some guys like them brand new. some guys like old balls. they're all difference. >> and that's going to be the last word on tom brady's balls tonight. steve kornacki, thank you for bearing with us on this. really appreciate it. >> no problem. coming up, tonight's good news report, courtesy of stephen colbert.
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>> oh, bulls fan? i didn't know you were a bulls fan. >> when it's playoff basketball time, you have to be all in. so don't make the same mistake she made. >> i thought you were all in. >> well, i'll all in now. let's just watch the game. >> go cavs. >> the cavaliers have, of course, apologized for the video today saying domestic violence is a very serious matter and has no place in a parity video that plays in an entertainment venue. we sincerely apologize to those would have been affected by domestic violence for the obvious negative feelings caused by being exposed to this insensitive video. joining us now, kadifa davidson and also with us jordan schultz. this is really stunning. i mean, they put out an apology that says, you know, this was obviously bad. and the same people who put out this apology looked at this
video and said, oh, this is great. let's show this. this is just great. >> right. and that's really what you have to ask here is how many levels of approval did this have to go through and was there not a single woman in the room when this video was being approved? and we know the answer to that question, actually. the nba has the best record of the four major sports when it comes to gender hiring. and it's really just mind bogglings that a spot like this can be approved. >> jordan, when i look at it, it has all those great production value owes avenue cleveland production. >> yeah. >> you can tell this wasn't done by the pros in l.a. or new york who, you know, i have no doubt that the people involved in l.a. and new york who do this kind of thing for a living, someone there would have said, are you guys out of your mind? this thing is horrible. >> lawrence, a man or a woman or somebody in the building, this is appalling for a lot of reasons. on the heels of what happened in the nfl with domestic volume.
adam silver knows better. this is on dan gilbert, as well. whoever hired this video department, this is a joke. and the houston rockets recently fired an employee on social media for tweeting out basically go home dallas mavericks, it will all be over soon. this is on a whole other level of disgusting to me. as an nba fan, for this who happen, it's almost worse than what happened in the arena. you can only imagine how many kids are there. and it's also an embarrassment during what has been one of the best playoffs we've had in a very long time. >> do we know anything about what the reaction was from the crowd in the arena? a lot of times these things play and they don't capture the attention of the crowd. >> well, i think that's exactly what happened here. i think there was a lot of stunned people. but for the most part, it seemed to kind of play as a normal kind of thing. you had a couple of journalists on twitter who reacted and said frankly this is appalling.
the thing that gets lost in this is how lucky the nba has been that a ray rice incident has come to national attention. the nba has itself a poor record with dealing with domestic violence offenders. and for something like this to pass through, it's really appalling. >> and jordan, you know, when i first looked at it, i thought, oh, the actor, the guy made a mistake because he made this look like it was deliberate. when -- and then you see the rest of the ad and it's like, yeah, that was the point. he was throwing her. that was a deliberate, violent act. >> yeah. and you know what, lawrence? not only was it deliberate, but the cavs, they go back to gilbert, they've been incredibly active in the community. they tried to get cleveland sports fans to buy into this whole lebron is back for round 2w0. for the most part, they have. they've gotten rid of some bad apples. they've brought in a new coach
for david blatt and things have been going pretty well. for this to happen, it's embarrassing, it's appall, it's shocking to me because we think of the may have been, you mentioned the history of domestic violence, but adam silver, the new commissioner has done a really good job of taking a strong stance on numerous issues including domestic violence and how unacceptable it is. .obviously, the nfl, you would think the cavs would have learned from this. clearly, they haven't. but how many sets of eyes, back to your point, had seen this and okayed it? it's unbelievable. >> and it's just poor business, also. in addition to it being morally reprehensible and poor to watch and enabling of a culture that doesn't take violence against women personally. 30% of nba fans are women. it's alienating to people would love watching basketball and hate watching violence against women. >> thanks for joining us. coming up, voters in the united kingdom are deciding between their current prime minister and the challenger who has been described as being weird, too weird for the job.
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and now for the good news, steven coal bare has donated $800,000 to fund almost every request made by south carolina school teachers. stephen colbert is on the board of directors of donorschoose.org. more than 800 south carolina teachers have projects on that site. coming up, why all of the pre-election polls in the british election turned out tonight to be wrong. very wrong.
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♪ [music] ♪ jackie's heart attack didn't come with a warning. today her doctor has her on a bayer aspirin regimen to help reduce the risk of another one. if you've had a heart attack be sure to talk to your doctor before you begin an aspirin regimen. breaking election news, it is almost 4:00 a.m. in london and the votes are furiously being counted in the general election in the united kingdom. as of now, it appears british prime minister david cameron, the leader of the conservative party, will keep his job.
joining us now is dan roberts, washington bureau chief for the guardian. he's a former editor for "the guardian" in the london. dan, what happened here? all the polls leading up to this said it was going to be not just a squeaker, but a really strange one in which, you know, labor would be trying to pull a couple of votes out of one little party over here and conservatives would be trying to cobble something together. what is this? >> i think the pollsters are the ones looking for new jobs. the biggest upset probably in british politics since 1945. >> but it's an upset of the polls, though, right? >> yeah. i think also everybody is pretty shocked at what's happened to labor in scotland in particular. i mean, you are seeing the break-up of the united kingdom really speeding up here. >> because in the results in scotland, the independence party, the people who want to have scotland leave the united kingdom, they won every seat? pretty much.
we're just finding out now, but it looks like labor got wiped out of their sort of socialist heart. >> it used to be a strong hold. >> and that is a sign that the fortunes of evolution that we saw in the independence referendum are speeding up and the country is fragmenting. and the government that we formed is also committed to a referendum on leading europe, as well. you could see the uk split, europe split. this is momentum stuff. >> talk about that, this possible referendum. cameron has promised a referendum on leaving the european union. >> against his better wishes. i mean, he was forced into it by the forces of english nationalism. the uk independence party, they forced him in that direction. he's in a strong position. clinging on to power is something very few expect him to do. he's going to have to hold that referendum. it's a nervy time. >> how does he handle that? does he campaign against that referendum? >> it's a good question.
i think a lot of people don't think his heart is in it. but his party will force him to at least be be neutral. labor would be the one party fighting strongly to stay in europe, decimated. the third parties, the liberals, are decimated. it's unclear, the next year or two will be bumpy. >> there was this theory that i read about prior to today calling it this shyness when it comes to polls, that there are people who know they're going to support the conservative candidate, but they just don't want to say that to a pollster. and it's unique to the conservative side of polling. >> i think it's -- i think it's spot on. i think it's also one of the issues globally. we've seen polls badly wrong in the u.s. midterms, the israeli elections, and i don't think it's conservatives that often too badly. and i think people are not ashamed to vote for the party, but they're sometimes ashamed to admit they're voting for these parties. >> dan roberts, thank you for joining us on what turned out to be a not so suspendble evening.
thank you very much, dan. good evening, i'm chris matthews in washington. did tom brady give that order for softballs? did he. did he purposely get the patriot equipment guys to sneak off to the bathroom to deflate those game balls before the american football league championship. and if so, if it's found to be true, what's the nfl going to do about it? brady himself will speak tonight at this hour up at salem state university. steve kornacki is there, ready to report. >> reporter: yeah, chris, we are about a half an hour away, you can probably see behind me, we're outside the o'keefe
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