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tv   The 11th Hour With Brian Williams  MSNBC  May 23, 2017 8:00pm-9:01pm PDT

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warren's initial reaction to that. >> first of all, donald trump reveals these secrets to the russians, and then turns around and says, and i didn't point out that the information came from you. i never said that. you know, and the question then becomes how do we protect ourselves from our own president? how do we protect intelligence? how do we protect our allies? since donald trump seems determined to think of no one except dald trump. rs last, and every moment in between. >> elizabeth warren gets tonight's last word. you can see our entire interview with elizabeth warren on our website. "the 11th hour" with brian williams starts now. tonight, the president is apparently lawyering up. donald trump expected to retain a private attorney to represent him in the russia investigation. also, the cia's concerns.
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the former director shares his worries from 2016 about the russian contacts with the campaign. while michael flynn is taking the fifth with the senate committee, now the senate committee has subpoenaed his company. and companies can't take the fifth. "the 11th hour" begins now. good evening once again from our headquarters here in new york. day 124 of the trump ads administration, and the president is hiring a lawyer. it comes less than a week after the department of justice appointed a special counsel to oversee the fbi russia investigation. sources familiar with the decision tell nbc news president trump is expected to retain mark casse wits as private ernl attorney on matters related to the russia investigation. casse wits has represented trump in the past, including according to the "washington post," some of trump's divorce settlements and accusations of fraud against
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trump university. we also heard today from former cia director john brennan, testifying before the house intelligencecommittee. early on in the oceedings, the question of russian collusion came up. >> having been involved in many counter-intelligence cases in the past, i know what the russians try to do. they try to sub on individuals, they try to get individuals including u.s. persons to act on their behave either wittingly or unwith ittingly. and i was worried by a number of the contact has the russians had with u.s. persons and so therefore, by the time i left office on january 20th, i had unresolved questions in my mind as to whether or not the russians had been successful in getting u.s. persons involved in the campaign or not to work on their behalf again either in a witting or unwitting fashion. i encountered and am aware of information and intelligence that revealed contacts and
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interactions between russian officials and u.s. persons involved in the trump campaign. >> did you see evidence of collusion, coordination, conspiracy between donald trump and russian state actors? >> i saw information and intelligence that was worthy of investigation by the bureau to determine whether or not such cooperation or collusion was taking place. >> we also received word today that after michael flynn's attorney said he would invoke the fifth amendment in response to the senate intelligence committee's request for cuments about his communications with russians, the chair and vice chair of that committee said they are now issuing subpoenas for flynn's business records. and as a sort of possible rebuttal vice chairman warner has said the fifth amendment won'ting a factor this time. >> we issued two s&ps to the two
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michael flynn businesses that we are aware, michael flynn intel, llc, and i think flynn intel, inc.. while we disagree with general flynn's lawyer's interpretations of taking the fifth. it is even more clear that a business does not have a right to take a fifth if it is a corporation. those subpoenas, one has been served, one is in the process of being served. and we keep all options on the table. we think the committee has moved forward aggressively. >> flynn's lawyers are saying their client is the subject of outrageous allegations. let's bring in our panel before we delay too much. nbc's mike very kara who covered it all today on capitol hill. rick stengel is here with us again. former undersecretary for public diplomacy and deposit apairs in the state deputy the obama administration. also the former editingor of "time" magazine. and the host of deadline netw k
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network. nicole i'm going to begin with you, i'm going quote you back to you from your broadcast today. you had a moment where you u quoted the cell phone commercial "can you hear me now". essentially to your fellow republicans saying, let's remember what this conversation is about. >> right. i'm troubled by tray doubty who has had bright moments and has had low points. i mean we covered his stewardship of the benghazi hearing. and he has had highs and lows and in full view. but that he's making this such a narrow question to brennan about do you have evidence of a conspiracy? that's not the question. we know that russia set ott to meddle in our elections. we know they were successful in hacking the dnc and hacking hillary clinton's campaign advisors.
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it is really beyond my ability to come prehence and excuse why republicans would become towedies for a white house that on the same day the front page of the "washington post" has a story that no one at the white house knocked down about how the president essentially wanted to enlist the chiefs of the two intelligence agencies in his pr rapid response effort to knock down and shut down comey's inquiry into russia ties. but thateel like it's their job and their work to narrow the question to do you have evidence of a conspiracy? well, no, not yet, but that wasn't my job as the head of the cia is what brennan was trying to say. i had evidence of contacts, so i kicked it over to law enforcement. and trump is the guy that fired the head of that agency. >> mike very kara on capitol hill tell us about the moving parts that weren't necessarily on tv today and just reset. we have house intel. we have senate intel. and notably, we just showed warner. as much as possible he tries to
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be side by side with burr, the republican chairman. very important to those two to appear as a duo. what kind of cohesion did we see, or lack of it on the house side today. >> certainly on the senate side you see richard burr and mark warner there. they are the grown ups in the room. there are four committees, senate judiciary, outoversight and house intel where john brennan appeared today. jim comey has chosen to give his testimony before senate intelligence, that of course coming sometime after the memorial day recess. the most detailed and extraordinary accounting from a top intelligence official. keep in mind that john brennan was in the cia more than 25 years. he served in the obama white house on the top adviser on counter terror. he intended the obama term as the cia director. here he is sitting before the
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committee, the house intelligence committee, and i agree with nicole. republicans have a talking point, where is the evidence of collusion, they have asked time and time ain. that's what they are going for, because they know that brennan is hamstrung in how much he can say. yet i think they got more than they bargained for today. brennan didn't name who they were, but u.s. persons involved in the trump campaign had contacts and interaction with russian officials. i mean, you can't get any innuendo or hence any stronger than that that where there is smoke there is perhaps fire. and republicans certainly have a cause to be concerned top. >> rick stengel, so the president now has a personal lawyer because the white house counsel really represents the institution of the white house. and you if i have had this discussion before, the kind of government worker ethos, the
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career public official ethos that if all these reports are true the president has bumped up against miscalculating the kinds of people perhaps that he was going to run into. >> in his dealings with comey, in his dealings with the other people that he has perhaps tried to subon to obstruct justice these are career officials who are just deeply offended by being asked about that. i mean we have seen those stories in the paper n the "washington post" story today. i think he doesn't come prehelped this idea that people in government are loyal to the american people. they are loyal to the constitution. their loyal to their jobs. in the case of director brennan, he served grge bush. he served president obama. he is n a choir boy but he believes deeply in those values that he has upheld during that 25-year career. the one thing i would mention about what we are both saying, that everyone was saying today, this idea of the republican trying to establish collusion is a bit of a dogleg in the sense
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that you can obstruct justice trying to quash an investigation of a crime that was never committed. that may be what president trump is doing or has done rather than all of this -- all of the -- >> the problem with that is that's a chess move. and he plays whack a mole. i don't think that's what he is doing. that's like 3d stra teejry. i think he was deputily offended that one was looking into a question that may have undermined the size -- he loves size, and he loves victory. and he was irked that there was an investigation into the legitimacy of his win. and i think the white house is in a real jam. they are defense snooshs the win could be legitimate, he is offended by anybody suggesting that it's not, he tries to back that down and he can obstruct justice in doing that. that's all i'm saying. >> no doubt, listen, from being inside the white house, when people called us evil geniuses, i mean, it was usually an
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accident when we did something that looked so smart and strategic. but, you know, what they are mad about, and where they are right nowate as a white house is that their defense now -- in the last ten days thr defense on the outing of israel and their defense on a lot of these questions is oh, he just doesn't understand. he either doesn't understand what the fbi is and does, what the top people in his own intelligence agencies do and don't do. they are not tools of your press office. they don't rapidly respond to a story you don't like about what jim comey is investigating. >> even congress didn't understand brennan today when people were saying, well where is the evidence. the cia doesn't collect evidence. the fbi collects evidence because they want to indict someone. >> right. >> the cia collects intelligence. >> right. >> and then they present it to leaders and say have a look at this see if it's useful. >> in this case, brennan called over to the fbi. >> right. >> mike very kara, correctly, a lot of people are watching for migration among republicans.
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i'm curious to see if you can name any names, what signs you are seeing. nicole and others have talked about the kind of slow walk away from trump that started this past weekend. >> you know, i think that a pattern has emerged. i think it dates back to the access hollywood tapes, frankly. you see republicans increasingly trying to find that balance, that alchemy between expressing concern and making sort of ominous sounds about -- about their concern for what president trump has done. the it laest thing, whether it's selling sergey lavrov classified secrets in the oval office or talking to the director of national intelligence, trying to get him to publicly kno down the idea that there was collusion between the trump campaign. and incidentally dan coates, between the trump campaign and russia. incidentally dan coates who testified, the director of national intelligence pretty much didn't try to knock down that story. he didn't deny, didn't confirm it.
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most people took that as a confirmation. you see this republican dance now. they have been warned -- burned one too many times i think by going too far over. they have underestimated the appeal that donald trump has to his base, frankly. and i think they are very wary to cut ties completely. look after the gop closed door meeting last week on capitol hill we were take staking out the rnc. i talked to half a dozen conservative members. they said look support for sprump is as strong as it could ever be in my district. that's the majority of the house republican conference. they are not ready to cut and run yet. there is a great deal of kerchl i think that's obvious at the point. but there is still a strong foundation here. certainly not ready to turn their backs on it. >> nicole i'll give you the last word. forgive the use of english. if talking smack about the home team in the oval office to two visiting russians doesn't cost you support among republican office holders who will? >> i think the white house is
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more worried than they let on. there is a story they are thinking about bringing back corey lewandowski, that's all about shoring up his political capital. i don't think republicans want to part ways with his. i wish there were more voice like john mccains and i wish they remained as appalled as they are in the moment that these stories break when they sort of recede. i think it is a farce and it's crawling in the sand toward a marrage and needing the sand to think they are going to sort of work through a republican conservative agenda. donald trump isn't an idea logical person. he doesn't care about repealing obamacare. he is not working with paul ryan. he doesn't read his own bills. i think they are eating a whole lot of sand and i don't think it's going to end well for the republicans in the mid terms. tomorrow he will have a conference with the pope. thanks to our lead off guests tonight. thank you for coming out and
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joining us tonight. coming up, two former spies, one russian, one on the home team, on john brennan's fear that russia could have colluded with trump associates with or without their knowledge. are they really that good? when "the 11th hour" continues. [ music stops suddenly ] ah. when your pain reliever stops working, your whole day stops. awww. try this. for minor arthritis pain, only aleve can stop pain for up to 12 straight hours with just one pill. thank you. ♪ come on everybody. you can't quit, neither should your pain reliever. stay all day strong with 12 hour aleve. a 10-speed direct-shift 5.0transmission.ine. a meticulously crafted interior. all of these are feats of engineering. combining them with near-perfect weight distribution...
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former cia director john brennan as we showed you was the latest of several long serving and high-ranking intelligence and law enforcement officials to testify about our nation's investigations into russians russian interference with our election. the first public hearing, let's not forget, came in january. the most recent was today.
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alongside everything we've learned from reporters, everything they have learned, and what we have learned from trump white house leaks, here now a look at what we have learned in public hearings on the record and under oath over these pastive months. we have high confidence that prident putin ordered an ininfluence campaign in 2016 aimed at the u.s. presidential election. putin and the russian government also developed a clear preference for president-elect trump. >> the fbi, as part of our counter-intelligence mission s investigating the russian government's efforts to interfere in the 2016 presidential election. and that includes investigating the nature of any links between individuals associated with the trump campaign and the russian government and whether there was any coordination between the campaign and russia's efforts. >> is it fair to say that the russian government is still involved in american politics?
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>> yes. >> the russians also knew that general flynn had misled the skp vice president and others. and that created a compromise situation, a situation where the national secured adviser essentially could be blackmailed by the russians. >> if there has ever been a clarion call for vigilance and action against the thread to the foundation of our democratic political system this action is it. >> is it accurate in a the rank and file no longer supported director comey. >> no, sir, that is not accurate. i can confidently tell that you the majority, the vast majority of fbi employees enjoyed a deep and positive connectiono director comey. >> just a brief look at where we've been. and the latest in that line of testimony, again, under oath, and before congress, brought this today from the former head of the cia.
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>> i studied russian intelligence activities over the years and i have seen it again manifest in many different counter intelligence cases. and how they have been able to get people, including inside of cia to become treasonous. and frequently individuals who go along that treasonous path do not even realize they are along that path until it gets to be a bit too late. >> mr. brennan is a veteran of what we call the silent service, the business of being a spy. joining me now, jack barski a former kgb spy living in the u.s. during the cold war. he later cooperated with the fbi and is now an american citizen. he is also the author of "deep undercover". and malcolm naps, msnbc terrorism analyst, 35 year veteran of the trade including navy intelligence, special operations, homeland security. malcolm literally wrote the book on what just happened to our election as it was happening. gentlemen, welcome to you both.
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jack i'll begin with you. the russians have been described kind of like mutual fund managers in this business. they have endless pairs, they are willing to invest in someone even knowing in a a small percentage of their investment comes true at the end. but how do you turn someone without that person knowing they have been rned? >> fundamentally, you can't. you know, you can cultivate a source and make them really comfortable with you. let's say i'm fsb. i'm a business person. and i befriend an american business person. and i become chummy with them. and i -- you know, i get information, and i go him some information. it's almost like a friendship developed. the american doesn't know that he is being played. to turn a person, you have to become direct. you have to, you know, somehow there has to be an agreement in place that the other person is
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going to give you something that you want for whatever you pay him. either that's money or is, you know, not disclosing a secret or something else of but just getting somebody to do your bidding without them absolutely knowing, that's to me is impossible. >> malcolm, same question, what you know about how this process works. >> well, it's quite simple. and what jack said there was very, very true. this is a relationship. it's a dance that goes on between two people. and if you don't know that that officer is an intelligence officer, and they spot you as a target, they can very easily manipulate you through that relationship. and as i wrote in "plot to hack america", donald trump had a relationship going back decades. but in 2013 his relatiohip changed with people who were in russia that he thought of as oligarchs, people who were
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extremely rich. but those people are operating at the sufferance of vladimir putin a former kgb human intelligence officer. and that person knows that he -- that his intelligence service collects individuals like donald trump and his acco lights in an effort to tuesday use them to do their bidding. that explains trump's foreign policy being almost mirror image of moscow's. that being said, you know, using money, ideology, cooption, coercion and ego, which spells mice, which is the basic recruitment tool it is easy to put individual strings on to individuals and turn them at first into unwitting assets and then into witting agents. >> jack, knowing what you know about the russian system, how they operated, do you have any doubt that this runs as deep into the campaign as some have
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alleged? >> yeah, i have some doubt. and i respectfully disagree with mr. brennan when he talked -- when he talks in admiring words about the soviet and russian capabilities. my fbi friends tell me that the fsb, the secret service tt now runs the service over there is not as eective as the kgb was. case in point, you probably remember that in 2010 there were five undercover agents, couples they were called. they were undercover, on behalf of the fsb. and when i saw and heard how they operated, i wassic sh isha head. they missed the beginners class on how to be an undercover agent. so while they are still capable and cagey and smart, and they know what they are doing, they are not as good as the soviet kgb was. >> malcolm, we've established
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that kgb had "cagey" in the title. do you concede that the fsb is not as impressive. >> i think it is a different animal. the kgw was idea logically oriented and very target focused. the fsb is a creature that came out of putin's rise to power on the back of an enormous quantity of illegal money. so the fsb has been oriented more -- you know, they still have all the basic hallmarks of the kgb but they use mon and integration of capitalism as their main introductory too much of they don't pay as we all know they don't pay at all in the way that a real intelligence agency would. but they do manipulate people on the basiof money. you may recall the post most famous of that team anna
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chapman, her job was to run around and make contact with high value people and posed as a high level real estate agent at one point. >> malcolm, jack, if you ever have dinner together i would love to be there just to listen. thank you for participating tonight. we will take a break. when we come back, two members of the house intelligence committee are standing by to talk with us. liberty did what? liberty mutual paid to replace all of our property that was damaged. and we didn't have to touch our savings. yeah, our insurance won't do that. well, there goes my boat. you can leave worry behind when liberty stands with you™. liberty stands with you™ liberty mutual insurance doctors recommend taking claritin every day distracting you? of your allergy season for continuous relief. claritin provides powerful, non-drowsy, 24-hour relief. for fewer interruptions from the amazing things you do every day.
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welcome back to "the 11th hour." back with talk about today's house intelligence committee
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testimony, two members the committee. up first, republican chris stewart of utah. thank you very much congressman for coming one us. what's our short version of your number one take away today from brennan. >> i don't know that i can say just one thing. we have had the director before the committee a number of times, both in open and closed sessions. i think he said -- once again, he reiterate there is no direct eviden of collusion. he did talk about some of e more troubling aspects that i know some people are focusing on. that is the contacts that were troubling to him that he felt needed to be investigated. i agree with that, those should be investigate. but i don't think we are ready to draw conclusions. and i think many people are. >> i'm look at brennan's quote, it should be clear to everyone, russia interfered with our election. there is no mistake where you are concerned, correct? >> absolutely not. absolutely not. i mean that's very clear. i came back from moscow last august and i said a number of times at that point, they are
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going to mess with our elections. they are committed to breaking down faith we have in our institutions, to breaking down our faith in the electoral process. as i think i said to you last week, brian, oh, my heavens they have got to be just thrilled with the result. they look at this and think it's beyond what they would have expected in their wildest dreams. >> yep. >> and i think it we hooves us then as americans to understand how they did it and how we responded so they are not as effective at doing it in the future. >> somebody called it effective roi, return on investment. >> indeed. >> finally, congressman, if it gets proven, as alleged, that the president went to comy, coates, and rog erls and said some form of the following, say this is cleared up, make this go away, do you think that is just a rookie mistake politically, and a miscalculation? or do you think that's potentially criminal and potentiay obstruction of justice? >> you know, my gut feel on it,
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after watching mr. trump, i think you would agree with this, he speaks emotionally, extemporaneously and speaks in the heat of moment. that's frankly what endeared him to a lot of people. i think it sometimes gets him in trouble. my reflection an those comments that's probably his intention. i don't think he actually expected nor was asking that the investigation not go forward. i think he realizes the american people expect answers to these questions. i don't think it was appropriate if he did put pressure on them. but i don't think it rises to the level of obstruction. and you know, the good news, brian, is this, we have got mr. mueller. he's going forward with the investigation. i think it's going to take a little time but most of us have a lot of faith in him. as the house intelligence committee. as the senate intelligence committee, these parallel investigations go forward. we will tell the american people what we learned at the end of this. and in the meanwhile i think it's fair for us not to jump to some conclusions like some
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people have done. >> chris stewart, republican from the state of utah, thank you for coming onto the show. >> thank you, sir. you owe me some beauty sleep. >> you and me both, who do we see about that. mr. heck, democrat from the great state of washington joins us now who also sits on the house intelligence committee. congressman heck, we will begin with youhere we left off with congressman chris stewart. that is if it's prove that as alleged the president went to those three men, senior officials all, and said some combination of, make this go away, can you say it has gone away, do you think that is a political rookie mistake or do you think it's potentially criminal and obstruction of justice? >> brian, i'm not a lawyer but i don't think you get a mulligan on one of these just because you haven't been in office very long. i think what's really over due that there be other committees in the house than the house
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permanent select committee on intelligence doing their work. the oversight committee, the weighs and means committee, and the judiciary committee. they ought to all be entering this discussion ought to be requesting the documents and the memos and the tapes where it exists to begin to do their work as well. >> when you go back home and your constituents look at you and tack your hand in theirs and say, please assure me these investigations will going to be on the up and up and you guys, meaning congress, are going to get to the bottom of this, what do you tell them? >> i tell them i'm not going to stop pushing until we get to the truth. as long as you ask, brian, this is the number one question i do get asked when i'm home, at the movie, or at the nar faction after church having coffee or at the grocery store pushing the cart around. whether i know them, this is the issue on the tip of their tongue. they bring it up, everywhere i
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go, the american people yearn to know the truth hyped this. >> do you think there was an attempt today to politicize brennan despite the fact he has been in the intelligence business, presidents have come and they have gone, and he has still been there? >> there are few people that i have more respect for in public service than john brennan. he is immune from any effort to politicize him whatsoever. you asked chris what the number one takeaway is. i want to answer that question because i thought he said something incredibly important which was affirming the value of having as much discussion out in the open with open hearings as is possible. stop and think about it. if our objective here is to prevent this from happening again, how do we best do that? certainly one of the ways in which we best do that is to have an open public discussion about it so that the citizens understand what did they do, how did they do it? how can i best arm myself against that going into future elections? >> let's thank both members of the house intelligence committee for coming on with us at the end
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of the long day, congressman denny heck of the state of washington. thank you very much. we will take a break. when we come back is the president about to hire a crisis manager, a name from the news not long ago. ♪ that's it? yeah. ♪ everybody two seconds! ♪ "dear sebastian, after careful consideration of your application, it is with great pleasure that we offer our congratulations on your acceptance..." through the tuition assistance program, every day mcdonald's helps more people go to college. it's part of our commitment to being america's best first job. ♪ you need one of these. you wouldn't put up with an umbrella that covers you part way, so when it comes to pain relievers, why put up with just part of a day? aleve, live whole not part. tell you what, i'll give it to you for half off.
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a lot of people around the president say they have actually told him you have got to stop with the tweets, you have got to stop with some of these public comments. but he is doing a lot of this on his own. who can actually guide president trump at this time? that's an open question within the west wing. >> and that is a great question. and that's why we have our friend robert costa of the "washington post" on this broadcast all the time. he was there posing the $64,000 question about this white house staff. and joining our conversation here tonight to try to help answer it, national politico reporter for politico ileana johnson and from his home state the great state of wisconsin longtime radio talk show host and msnbc contributor charlie sykes. >> i want to read your headline.
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it says trump eyeing lewandowski, bossy, as crisis managers. let's assume people know the name lewandowski. not so much bossy. explain to us how they left the trump orbit in the first place. >> sure, brian. corey lewandowski was donald trump's first campaign manager. he vaulted trump against some experience politicalcal operatives and politicians and left the trump campaign over the summer in kind of a cloud of controversy. he was accused and actually charged with a felony battery charge. the charge was eventually dropped. but certainly somebody who attracted controversy and became known during the campaign for his aggressive defenses of his candidate. he constantly said let trump be trump. david bossie was a name
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well-known to anybody who covered the clinton administration in the '90s who stoked lots of controversies around the clintons and who appeared again at the ends of the trump campaign very close to trump's chief strategist steve bannon and served as deputy campaign manager from the time steven bannon came on at the end of the campaign all the way through the end of the campaign. neither man ended up joining the white house. but they are the people that trump is turning to now as scandals threaten to engulf his administration and derail any substantive agenda. >> charlie, we have a president with let's call it situational loyalty. giuliani and christie were with him for a long ride. they are not around anyme. he may miss these two guys. it may be that he feels even though itnclude victory in the electoral college, he feels the turbulence started when they left his orbit and he is got to have that comfort factor so far.
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>> ileana's story is fascinating. it's sort of like having a burning house and getting two guys with kerosene cans. these are the bomb throwers, the enablers. lun do yousy said let trump be trump. the question that we wering and is who is going to be able to tell stop trump, no, stop doing this. not these two guys. i remember when we were younger and naive you and i were discussing would there be a time in the white house when they would bring in a grown up like david ger gwen. apparently not. >> i think i got in trouble for naming david gergon for a senior white house post. which would be his fifth white house post, nonetheless. >> but it would be aen gro up. >> ileana, let's tuck about who is getting through to the president. it's been reported and rumored chris christie was among those saying you have got to lawyer up, you have got to get off
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twitter. i imagine, ileana, even when you are president, the expression, you need a lawyer, gets your attention. >> i was going to say, i don't think there are too many people around the president who are telling him that his legal woes are not severe right now, that he dsn't need a wyer. i don't think there are too many people around the president telling him he should tweet more often than he does or that his cell phone is a good thing for him to hold in his hands when he goes up to the privatence residence. i think the question is is there a comfort ant around him who he respects and listens to. note argumenty that reince priebus and press secretary sean spicer weren't with him on the campaign. we talked for our story to the sort of master's of damage control and crisis management who came in and saved the clinton administration, and they were very clear that there's not much anybody, even the most trusted and skilled crisis managers can do if the principle
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himself isn't willing to stick to a disciplined message. >> charlie always i say the same thing, that is republicans were the heros of watergate. which republicans are you watching? do you sense any migration, any movement. >> no, you are not going to see the elected officials move until the base moves. you are going to see a chriscal mass of principled republicans around john mccain. you know, so you are going to watch the john mccains. you are going to watch the ben sasses, watch the lindsey grahams, what they are going to do. again on this whole issue of what's going to change and deal with the crisis, almost every single crisis that this white house has experienced has been self inconflicted. they are doing it to themselves, and bringing in other outside people is not going to change this when at the core of this white house is donald trump and donald trump is not going to change. but, again, it is going to be interest to see when republicans will draw the line. we are a long way from seeing that happen, i think. >> charlie sykes, who has happened me establish that like
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me, he was a young man once. then along came this campaign. charlie, our thanks, as always. ileana, who remains youthful and energetic enough to have a featured byline piece on the in politico thank you both for coming on our broadcast tonight. one more break for us. coming up, just who is in contl of the leading investigation now into the tmp russia ties? and do legal veterans feel it's in good hands? break through your allergies.
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welcome back. another jam packed news day. the senate subpoenas records from michael flynn's companies after he pleads the fifth. while the former cia chief says he warned the fbi about contacts between russia and the trump campaign that he came across. the background to all of this, the russia investigation, run by the special counsel, robert mueller, who will answer to the deputy attorney general, rod rosenstein a man who was largely
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unknown to most apparently until the firing of james comey. with us tonight, two men who know mr. rosenstein very well, having worked with him, doug gantszler, very well. doug gantsler and james trusty who is a former federal prosecutor. welcome to you both. doug, i would like to start with you. we only have the capacity for so many new names and in 124 days of this administration a lot of people come and go around here. we have met a lot of them. americans learn about this guy named rosenstein because his three page memo is held out as the reason comey got fired. we now know the truth. i don't imagine your friend was happy about that. >> no. you just talked about the grownups in the political theater that is congress of john mccain and lindsey graham. what you can take solace in is that rob rosenstein and bob
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mueller, these are two impeccable men with impeccable character, of integrity and ethics who are not subject to the amateur hour that we have seen in the trump administration thus far. they are going to behind the stage undergo and take an incredibly thorough investigation to what actually happened between the trump officials and trump administration and russian government and will uncover facts and apply the facts to the law and they will not be swayed by any of the other outside influences. i think they both have great reputations. rod rosenstein was the u.s. attorney of maryland for 12 years. he was appointed by a republican and lasted throughout the obama administration through eight years in one of the most democratic states in the country because he is so apolitical and seen as somebody who would not get involved. when that memo came out those of
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us who knew him knew he was not the person to get the fbi director fired because fbi directors don't get fired by the deputy attorney general. that is not something rod rosenstein would do. by nighttime president trump said no. he said it was i who fired director comey and he just bought himself bob mueller and a real investigation. >> the impressive part o rosenstein's bio to a lot of people when you read he is the longest serving of all u.s. attorneys. comey is quoted as saying -- where do you think people should come down on rod rosenstein? >> i think that might say more about comey than rod. rod is just not a compromising guy. he is not a political figure. the people from any party that have dealt with rod rosenstein have found him to be principled,
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professional, aggressive but fair. so he is really the perfect guy. he is the man for this position because it calls for an apolitical professional prosecutor who doesn't compromise his principles. i think comey might be succumbing to washington a little more than rod rosenstein would. >> having established that and let's agree for the purposes of this discussion that mueller and rosenstein are of similar caliber, how does a guy who doesn't love press attention assure an anxious nation that the public trust will be tended to and followed and satisfied in this enormous and hugely eventful investigation. >> the 24 hour cycles that are cable news you will never see either of them on the television set. they will do the work and thoroughly and with due diligence. at the end when all the facts are in and used the grand jury to get to the bottom of what
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actually happened and what did not happen they will come out with a report and a statement at that time and at that time only. both of them are very aware and i worked with both of them in very high profile investigations and prosecutions. they do not want the limelight. they do not want to be in the press. that is why you will hear about what happened with that memo. it came out from donald trump. he worked behind the scenes in classic fashion. >> you get 30 seconds all of it for the last word. a question i keep asking what happens if mr. mueller comes across something more urgent that he feels needs to be shares that is elemental to the investigation? is there a mechanism for him not to keep that for the final report and to not go public? >> i think those are two separate issues. bumping it up the chain is easy. he can bump it up the chain to rod rosenstein.
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the memo that rod wrote was critical of the notion of vetting facts publically for people who haven't had a fair shake, haven't had their day in court. i don't think either will be very tolerant of partial disclosures or announcements by investigators when prosecutors are supposed to make the final decision. >> thank you both for coming on. we would love to invite you back. thank you both. another break for us and coming up two politicians with very different reactions to what we witnessed last night in manchester, england. but there will still be pain. it comes when your insurance company says they'll only pay three-quarters of what it takes to replace it. what are you supposed to do? drive three-quarters of a car? now if you had liberty mutual new car replacement™, you'd get your whole car back. i guess they don't want you driving around on three wheels. smart. with liberty mutual new car replacement™, we'll replace the full value of your car. liberty stands with you™.
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this attack stands out for its appalling sickening cowardess deliberately targeting defenseless children and young people. we experience the worst of humanity last night we also saw the best. the cowardess of the attacker met the bravery of the emergency services and the people of manchester. >> outside number ten, the last thing before we go that is teresa may reacting to the story that had us on the air in the early hours of this morning. suicide attack follows an ariana grande concert that left 22 dead, scores injured. many victims children. here is how the traveling president ofhe united states reacted to and condemned the attack. >> so many young beautiful
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innocent people living and enjoying their lives murdered by evil losers in life. i won't call them monsters because they would like that term. they would think that is a great name. i will call them from now on losers because that's what they are. they are losers. >> as we said, a contrast after the tragedy in manchester. that is our broadcast for this tuesday night. thank you for being here with us. good night for all of us from new york. we are following several different stories that continue to develop into the late evening tonight. in terms of a time difference,


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