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tv   MSNBC Live  MSNBC  May 24, 2017 12:00pm-1:01pm PDT

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i'm katy tur in new york. my colleague ali velshi, take it away. >> we'll talk later. breaking news this hour on that terror attack at the ariana grande concert in the united kingdom. the father and this man you're looking at, the younger brother of the suspected suicide bomber have been arrested. this is the picture of the brother. the washington report is that he was planning an attack in tripoli. this colonels as the "new york times" releases incredible brand new details of the bomb used in the attack. the bomb was reportedly held in either a backpack or a black vest. the suspect attacker was found with a possible detonator in his hand. we now know what was possibly inside the bomb. we're talking about nails, metal nuts and screws.
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kel kelly is standing by. malcolm, let's start with you, kelly, on a this news, what can you tell us about the suspected bomber's family and the latest on the raids going on in manchester. >> well, first to that latest arrest, which is the father of the suspected bomber, ramadan abedi taking into custody according to itv news. taken into custody in tripoli, libya this afternoon. a member of their team was there when it happened. it is unclear why he was taken into custody but the younger brother was also taken into custody. this coming from the libya interior ministry. they say he was 20 years old and that they have interviewed him. his name is hesham abedi.
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he traveled from manchester with six weeks ago. they say that he admitted to them that both he and his brother are, were, members of isis. and that he was part of preparation of the attack here in manchester, and they say he admitted to being in constant contact with his brother salman abedi in the weeks and days leading up to the attack in manchester. all of that, incredible detail coming out of the libyan ministry. meanwhile in manchester, the investigation proceeding at a fairly quick pace. five people are in custody and going back to the family ties, one of those is the older brother. he's been in custody about 24
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hours. three others were taken into custody earlier today. and another person was arrested in wiggin, he was taken down by plain clothes police officers. he had some sort of bag and they're still assessing what that bag is. >> is that five in total or six in total? >> we have five in total in manchester. the gentleman in wiggen, the three suspects arrested earlier and the brother arrested yesterday. >> investigators have found what appears to be a remnant of a backpack or a black vest. there appears to be a detonator in the hand. they're finding nuts and screws
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and bolts and things like that. the impact of that punctured a metal wall. if you're not familiar with bombs, this is remarkably deadly and damaging as we've seen. what can you tell us about this bomb? >> well, it appeared it was a backpack device, according to the reporting coming out now. and there are some image that's haven't been verified. a backpack that may have been carried by the bomber and that backpack would have been able to carry somewhere between 20 to 25 pounds of explosives, or more depending on the size of the backpack. if it was tatp or one of the more rudeimentory but more table explosives, it would have been able to carry out the enormous carnage we've seen. they put anti-personnel shrapnel
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inside. twisted nails, screws, screw heads and items like that to act as fragmentation projectiles. and we've seen a lot of evidence of that. even seen eyewitness testimony where people had nails and screws projected across their bodies. more importantly is the blast device, it knocked people physically off their feet. i've been around a lot of bombs. i've been in the radius of multiwill suicide bombings and the blast effect tells you this is not a -- >> some of the things coming out suggest that redundancy was built into this bomb and it was not as crude a design as the typical they know you would see from a lone wolf. there was a 12 volt 2.1 battery. the plunger was one you hold in your hand so he had a couple
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ways of detonating it. the arrests made, not just those around manchester but the arrest of his brother and his fatherinn libya may lend cedence to there is a real isis connection as opposed to isis takes credit every time someone slips on a bath mat. >> isis has been taking rather tough hits in libya but most attacks eliminated the hard core of isis down in the city. that was in central libya. the one personal we had seen a lot of teft and it appears the family may have some connections with that. it was in north western libya all the way to tripoli. that's where terrorists from isis have been infiltrating into tunisia to carry out these attacks and would it make a lot of sense that they would be in the capital city of tripoli and have this fluid ty but outside
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the zone where major isis personnel would be located which means they would be relatively safe. and because they had british passports, they had the ability to travel back and forth. >> to give our viewers some sense of, this you've been to libya. you've spent time in will he be i can't. like yes, ma'am yerngs pakistan, afghanistan, like parts of somalia, are, operate in a governmental vacuum. these are ideal environments for al qaeda or isis to recruit and train. >> yes. you're absolutely right. as a matter of fact after the revolution of 2011, which i helped in, there was a vacuum of the central government. and the country was run by almost five years by militias in these temporary governments. the country is split woo two factions. to the east and the west. two separate governments. that lack of security allows
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groups like al qaeda and isis to run covert cells in places like tripoli. if you come in with money and you have relatives, you can operate under cover for a very, very long time of the no one will suspect you because you're a dual citizen. that's how the sophistication of these bombs could have the lent to that. >> back to manchester. the suspected bomber who was killed in the attack was known to british authorities. maybe known to american authorities. a lot of people asked the question. if someone knows or suspects someone is a terrorist or up to no good, why can't we put police on them all the time and watch them? some of the issue is at what point do you determine that someone who has been thinking thoughts about terrorism is in a position to start doing something about terrorism? how do intelligence law
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enforcement think about this? >> well, believe me, if we had to arrest everybody that had gone from an inspirational idea on to, had not moved on to an action phase of taking on concrete steps, we would be arresting tens of thousands of people on terrorism. it is very intensive. it is not something that can be seen theed 24/7. the united states hasn't been able to seen the long term counter surveillance intelligence since world war ii when we could bring in 50, 60,000 people. they rely on technical intelligence like gcsq. if an individual is within a country, even if he is known, he may have gone on an isis internet site or may have had links to a foreign terrorist group in some remote way. if there is not a warrant and you don't have a national security priority to go after
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that person, to put the 15 to 20 or 30 people, you would be required to go after one individual to track down the rest of the network. it is just not financially sustainable. and we're seeing what happens when people who are not. in get. they can carry out acts as those just inside. >> an important point that you bring up. it takes 15 to 20 people per person to keep someone under surveillance all the time. thanks to both of you. i want to bring you up to speed. warner brothers has cancels the premier of the wonder woman film in london. they've put out a statement saying their thoughts are with those in the tragedy. we're going to find out more about whether that's a security concern or they didn't think it was appropriate to go ahead with the premier. coming up, we're going to switch gears and head to washington where we seem to be heading
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toward an answer on what if anything happened between the trump campaign and the russian government. david. what's going on? oh hey! ♪ that's it? yeah. ♪ everybody two seconds! ♪ "dear sebastian, after careful consideration of your application, it is with great pleasure that we offer our congratulations on your acceptance..." through the tuition assistance program, every day mcdonald's helps more people go to college. it's part of our commitment to being america's best first job. ♪ hey, need fast try cool mint zantac. it releases a cooling sensation in your mouth and throat. zantac works in as little as 30 minutes. nexium can take 24 hours. try cool mint zantac. no pill relieves heartburn faster.
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a high stakes political showdown is getting closer and closer by the day. so many headlines to cover when it comes to the russia investigation. a few moments ago we learn that had former trump adviser carter page expects to testify before the house intelligence committee the week of june 6.
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as the house prepares to issue a subpoena to mike flynn, the senate judiciary committee says it hasn't heard back from the fbi or the white house on material that it has requested and today is deadline day for that request. on top of that, trump is lawyering up. sources tell nbc news he is expected to retain his private attorney on matters related to the russia investigation. perhaps of concern to him, 54% of those polled think president trump is abusing the power of his office. 43% do not. the same poll shows donald trump's approval rating is down now to 37%. all of this boils down to the central question in all of this. what does james comey have to say? >> a guy with a story to tell. i think if i were donald trump, that would scare me a lot. >> does it concern you that the president referred to james
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comey as a nut job? >> he's not. >> the strong presumption would be if people don't cooperate, we'll subpoena them. >> i think the american people are demanding that we get to the truth. >> there continues to be smoke that might result in an actual fire. in other words, real collusion going on between us and the soviet union. >> that all just happened today. let's start with the russia investigation. katie, this business about the house subpoenaing mike flynn. gout that from house chair adam schiff. tell us how that's different from the senate who subpoenaed him and he didn't want to respond to that subpoena. >> it is honestly not terribly different. just because we didn't know the house side was planning to take similar steps. the overall change is that there were initially subpoenas for
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documents. they asked mike flynn and his lawyers to produce meetings that happened and send them to the committee and there had not been an official request for flynn himself to testify. then his lawyers said, if we give you these documents, that will amount to self-incriminating testimony and we will not do it. so attorneys said we need to do this differently. they'll send subpoenas to his businesses, a business can't invoke the fifth amendment to protect itself in a case like this and they said we'll subpoena mike flynn himself directly. so that's essentially the next step. from there, the question is, what happens next? in theory, congress could hold flynn in contempt. it is unlikely because they control both houses of congress. they would have to go along with it to have a vote on that on the senate floor, and the house floor. and then the added wrinkle of bob mueller, the special counsel
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now investigating in the wake of james comey's firing. and that has changed the tirks of these investigations. everybody is very careful and concerned about screwing up the investigation. if they find new information, if there's public testimony, that can affect in sometimes very unpredictable ways how mueller's investigation might proceed. so that's where it stands. >> we'll get back to you in a little bit. it certainly feels like we're in the open stages of a devastating chapter of american history. evidence is mounting for the president's meddling in the russia probe. all these stories in the last two weeks. the president fired jim kl. president trump said he was thinking about the russia investigation when he fired james comey. first, the president had a private dinner with comey in february where he reportedly asked him to stop investigating mike flynn.
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second, that he allegedly bragged to russian officials about firing james comey. and out this week, that trump pressured two top intelligence officials to publicly state that there was no evidence that his campai campaign colluded with russia. we don't know what jim comey's side of the story is. joining me,ari melber, and msnbc political analyst heidi, senior political reporter for usa today. you and i talk about this every day. does any of this actually point to any sort of collusion? that may depends on what james comey has to say about this. >> i don't think even jim comey can answer authoritatively. that goes to the investigation. he has naktd ways that question whether he would interfere with annvestigationhich itself is
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the kind of thing that is often per sede as obstruction of justice. and the questions going forward is how does the investigation proceed? who cooperates and how much of a back seat does congress take? >> let me and you this. what is the best road forward for the white house? >> it is interesting that you say there is increasing evidence. the truth is, there isn't evidence, as ari just said. all we have is stuff that doesn't look good for the white house but that could be for a whole host of reasons. donald trump could say i was loyal to michael flynn because i'm a person who is always loyal. >> what we're saying there's evidence of is that donald trump is meddling in the investigation into russia. we haven't got evidence of collusion. even john brennan said, they've seen evidence of collusion. we do know that donald trump is meddling in the investigation. >> we know from the memo from
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jim comey which is why the most interesting part of this will be when we hear from jim comey directly. and hear what he had to say, that donald trump hadn't told him to lay off the investigation. the best case for the white house is probably to do what the white house is doing at the moment. that is, hire as many lawyers as they can. this is going to go on for a while. and there will be more speenl as coming. i don't see any way around that. >> let me ask you, we just showed you the poll, over 50% of americans who think president trump is abusing his power. we don't typically ask those questions. we haven't had to since the early 1970s. what are the implications of that? >> lots of them. mostly about getting anything done in congress but i think that will be overshadowed by the russia investigation. i think what is significant is
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that he's hovered, since sgoomicoming into office, around 40. we're starting to see some cracks in the base. the reason is because so far all the republicans, privately who i talked to on commeapitol hill, looking at those numbers, more republican cosmetic start breaking with him and could start being harder on him publicly as well on russia and on a whole host of other issues. you said john brennan didn't fi anyvidence of collusion. that's not joh brennan's job. his job is to find intelligence and pass on that information to the filibuster. i thought what was significant about this week is that we are talking about the c word again, collusion. because of what he said. he said he saw suspicious contacts, suspicious enough that he thought it might be a possibility someone within the
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campaign a might have been recruited either wittingly or unwit goly and that's a big development. >> that concept of wittingly or unwittingly. john brennan went to great lengths to say at the espionage works, the way anybody's apparatus works, they try to get information from people. that doesn't mean the person they're trying to get information from is necessarily cooperating with them. >> bingo. the question is, are you a user or getting used? it is entirely possible the foreign governments might be in the united states or have important jobs and that doesn't mean they're part of a conspiracy. they look closely at what was your state of mind? were you showing evil intent, criminal intent? or did you just get used? that's a big open question. to restate the obvious but sometimes it bears repeating. the problem for the trump white house, they are not conducting themselves like they want to get
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to the bottom of it. if they found someone who got used, help get them out of orbit of foreign intelligence. sometimes they just want it to go away. >> we have seen reporting that israeli intelligence is rethinking the way it quoompts the, the way it cooperates with the united states. they're rethinking this. donald trump is in brussels. this all important meeting with nato. he didn't think it was important before the election. had. >> these things are starting to have national security implications. >> and i'm hearing directly from the uk over the manchester bombing, for example. and you showed those pictures in the "new york times," a lot of questions about how they got to the "new york times." enormous concern about sharing intelligence over the manchester
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bombing with american counter parts and then that leaking to american media. i've been speaking to a top british official who isaying, they have on get arip in the white house. they have to do a betterob of letting us know, when we give them intel, it will be secure. we saw the israeli ambassador immediately arrest it came out. the meeting with lavrov. he said it is okay. we still trust the americans. you're hearing the questions already from europe. particularly from britain. they're really not happy about these leaks coming out of american intelligence services. >> there was talk in the beginning. donald trump's lawyer came out in one. first press conferences and said they'll make sure donald trump doesn't face conflicts of interest. if there's foreign money going into businesses, they'll donate it. you've learned otherwise. >> we've obtained here an internal trump organization dpomt shows they're not tracking all foreign cash. i'll read it to you. it is clearly a violation,
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saying it is not their intention for identifying them as being a representative of a foreign government. you see where this goes. they're saying in a period where we've been talking about foreign government influence, they'll leave it up to foreign governments, to decide whether or not to self-report when they're frequenting and giving money to trump properties or not. it is a huge change in an environment, we have a lot of other news. there is a federal court in manhattan that will rule whether that kind of money konconstituta gift. they're not trying to track it at all right now. >> thank you. thank you to all three of you for this discussion. coming back, we're peeling back the many layers of trump's budget. we know it covers many cuts.
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we're getting new reaction from both sides of the aisle on
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president trump's new budget proposal. >> you have said that the foundation of your budget is 3% growth. and i have looked every which way at how you might get there and you can't get there. as a consequence, i think it is just disastrously consequential on a 3% budget. the bible says you can't build a house on a sandy foundation. it perpetuates a myth that we can go out there and balance the budget without touching entitlements. it is not only a myth. it is frankly a lie. >> that budget that trump has presented is a grotesquely immoral budget. it is an horrific budget. >> i haven't seen the specific cuts that have been outlined in the president's budget. certainly we need to look at this and the president has
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increased spending in defense, which is something we all agree needs to be done. >> i wasn't sure how members of congress haven't seen the cuts. we have dug into the larger cuts in president trump's proposed budget. let's take a quick look at cuts you might not have heard of because you're not a member of congress. each of the following programs will see spending cuts compared with projected spending under the current law. we do it over ten years. you can see them in that context. first of all, the centers for disease control. you may not think you have a lot to do with them but you do. they research e-ebola and zika. this is the organization that helps people by finding treatment or providing treatment for addiction and mental illness. both are on the upswing. opioid addiction on the upswing. they also run the national suicide prevention hot line.
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national institutes of health. they deal with cancer research and prevention, aids research, a lot of that being cut. embassy security. remember benghazi? lindsey graham said this budget would create a lot of benghazis. we're cutting embassy security. food stamps. back before the recession, the number was in the 20s of millions. 44 million people don't know where their food is coming from. food safety and inspection being cut as well and mass transit. you know we have commuter delays, buses, amtrak. if you prefer to fly, airports and airways. cuts to the faa. you will see more delays. all of that is in this budget. michael, you have just penaltied a new piece called budget scam. you heard the legislators who
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were commenting on this. we started with mark sanford. he is a freedom caucus member, a conservative mental of the u.s. congress who says this whole budget is based on an assumption which is incorrect, that we will have 3% growth in this country. >> that's right. i wrote in my piece that you can say you have a plan to balance the budget in ten years, just like i have a plan to slam-dunk a basketball. if my plan is to just grow a foot next year, that's not very likely. you can say it is a plan but not a very serious plan. they just stimulate that they'll have 3% growth when the cbo is predicting 1.9% over time. and that is a way of juicing yourself an extra $3 trillion to play with. >> i want to play a clip from nick mulvany. this is his ball. he is playing this thing. he is the one talking about it. >> the foundation for the plan is 3% growth.
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that's are trump-onomics. it is whatever can get us to 3% growth. i can assure you when i'm in the oval office as the president, we're talking about trade policy, tax policy, health care reform, we talk about budgets. we're trying to figure out a way to get to 3% growth. >> i have news for you, both parties, if we do not get to 3% growth, it is unlikely we'll ever balance the budget again. >> this is important. this is not partisan. bernie sanders would have liked 3% growth. barack obama would have liked 3% growth. we're at 2% growth. so making a budget on the assumption of getting to 3 is very difficult to do. that's unfair because you'll end up with bigger deficits handle the you have now. >> 3% growth would be terrific. 4% growth would be even better. what presidents have to do when they do the budget, they have to use the official forecast. there have been times when
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president obama came in a couple tenths ahead of the but this is an entire percentage point and this is just cheating. it is just one. wats he is cooking the books. there are some real increases in defense is that homeland security while cutting spending for the poor. in terms of making the numbers add up. >> two separate issues. >> bernie sanders thinks it is an unfair budget for the poor. that's a valid issue. the math doesn't work. you've written about the tax dodge in your article. this budget assumes tax reform that steve noox, the treasury secretary said not likely to be seen at the earliest, the end of 2017. as you know, very hard to do in and of itself. >> and not only that, they assume that it would be deficit neutral. another one of those, like the old joke that the economist on the desert island who needs a can opener and says, assume a can opener.
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they assume they'll cut taxes by $6 trillion but somehow that will be deficit neutral. either they're fluffing the numbers and expect meerkts, or they're not telling us about $6 trillion worth of tax likes. >> so in some ways, we're counting the same thing. we're going to unleash animal spirits. business will take off. tax revenues are growing up. if the assumptions are wrong, all the numbers end up wrong. >> either you're talking about a major tax cut that will in your mind produce speck spend growth as it didn't do under bush and did not do in kansas, for example. otherwise, you're had, you can raise taxes to offset it. you can get rid of tax breaks.
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and they are completely silent on increase. >> all right. up next. the clock is ticking on the cbo score. where is that? it should be out any time now. we go to talk to the senior senator on why he is not getting behind it. you could fill a book
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i keep talking about the cbo score. that's not the point. what is important is any minute now we'll find out how many fewer people are going to be insured with the republicans health care plan and how much more it is going to cost people to get health insurance over the course of the next ten years. this is a complicated issue. already top dogs from both political parties are offering up pre buttals. >> so whatever cbo says about the house bill today, this much is absolutely clear. the status quo under obamacare is completely unacceptable and totally unsustainable. >> i remind my colleagues how unusual it is for a cbo score to come out nearly three weeks after a bill is passed. it is like test driving a brand new car three weeks after you've already signed on the dotted line and paid in full.
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republicans in the house were so worried about how bad the cbo score might be, they rushed trump care through. no hearings, no debate, no score. >> joining me now, senator bill nelson, democrat from florida. and i guess, senator, i'm trying to remind our viewers that nobody knew what the score was before, they don't care. the issue is people, health care, premiums. >> absolutely. but look who will be denied. veterans and senior citizens on medicaid. remember 70% of medicaid pays for seniors in nursing homes. how about all the people that have the guarantee of a pre-existing condition, won't deny them health insurance? that's everybody in the country. those are the protections at
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risk. >> we know in the senate, even republicans have said the bill as passed by the house probably the won't pass muster in the senate. we'll get cbo information and that will inform your colleagues in the senate. in the end, this can't be a trump care or obamacare they know. what will you do? either improve obamacare or make this acaa manageable? >> well, there are a few tweaks that you could make to the existing law, not repealing existing law, to the existing law, that would make it financially stable and would keep the premium ts down. such as the support to those in the range of 250 to 400% of poverty. that is potentially being cut out. that could easily be fixed if the will, the bipartisan will, if it were there.
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>> senator, i want to move to the russia investigation. james comey will testify sometime after monday. what is the one piece of information you really want to make sense of this russia investigation? >> well, i think we're seeing the drip, drip, drip. just recently, dan coates, the head of intelligence basically without saying it, admitted that the president had asked him to try to derail the investigation. i mean, it is going to be an accumulation of these things that leads one to a conclusion which, as joe friday on lament used to say, just the facts, ma'am, just the facts. so let the facts come out with the special investigation and
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then apply it to the law and let's see if there is collusion between the trump campaign and the russians. there sure a lot of smoke. and i usually find where there is smoke there's probably some fire. >> good to talk to you. senator bill nelson there florida. i want to tell you those of you watching the markets, the dow is up above 21,000 again. it's been on a bit of a tear since we had a day last week where the markets decided donald trump's presidency was not going to get everything done that it wanted but the market keeps going higher. we're just moments away from getting the cbo valuation. will in it, critical figures. premium costs, and the biggy, the number of people who would not be insured as a result of it. it is make or break time for the obamacare repeal effort. and governor john kasich with
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want to underscore this -- nonpartisan congressional budget office, dot, dot, dot, headed by a republican right now. so, before anybody starts trashing the cbo, that's what you have to know about the congressional budget office. we are looking for numbers on the number of people who are going to be covered, predictions on where health care premiums are going, and the impact this whole bill is going to have on the zdeficit. the health care bill. for more i want to bring in msnbc anchor, business correspondent and the other half of velshi and ruhle that airs at -- >> not the velshi part. >> and andrew ruben, vice president for medical center affairs at langone medical center. think we added an extra word. vice president for medical affairs. >> close enough. >> good to have you both here. andrew, i worry we talk about cbo score, cbo score, cbo score, people drone out. that's not important. what we're looking for is the measurement of what this new american health care act is going to do for people who need health insurance, for people who pay for health insurance.
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>> right. and remember, medicaid has historically before health care reform been something that people didn't like to talk about. it was just for this -- the really poor seniors who were in nursing homes. but under health care reform, 70 million americans are now on medicaid, 20% of the u.s. population gets their health insurance that way. it's your friends, your neighbors, kids who graduate college and are looking for jobs. this hurts a lot of people. whatever the cbo score turns out to be, there's going be major cuts to medicaid. and states fund a big chunk of medicaid and the federal government does. the books just don't balance, and they're there are goire are cuts. >> stephanie, 17% of people liked the last time the american health care act was shown. there's no way this is better because this is a tougher bill. so it's going to be unpopular with people. >> who this is really difficult for from the get-go has been paul ryan. what the freedom caucus, what paul ryan wants to offer is not what president trump has continued to offer.
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so, to say we've got you on pre-existing, we're going to cover everybody until they're 6 26, everyone is going to have a bigger and better plan and it's going to cost less, the numbers don't add up. when we get the cbo score, we've gotten the soft cushion from mitch mcconnell saying, well, that number doesn't matter. i'm not saying the number is perfect. it's not perfect. it's the same measure we used under obamacare as we're going to use under whatever you want to call it, trumpcare. >> that's relevant. >> it's going to cover less people, then people aren't going to be happy. >> this is an important point, when people who say don't trust the cbo scores, that's the ruler we use. the ruler may not be great, but it's the same ruler we use -- >> we always use. >> it's the ruler we always use. bottom line, there are real implications for health care and health outcomes overall when fewer people get health care, right? what mitch mcconnell says, we're going to give people the right to not be forced to buy health insurance, which is why cbo is going to show that more people will be uninsured in 2026. but in fact, what happens to the
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health care system when that many people fall off of it? >> premiums got to go up because everybody has to be in the game for insurance markets to balance. we've talked about this before. if only the sick people are in the health insurance markets, then people won't be able to afford the premiums because the insurance companies are going to pay huge claims for the sickest people. the math doesn't work. >> before we start weeping for health insurance companies and saying, my goodness, aetna dropping out of the state of virginia, well, aetna's ceo was paid $17 million in 2015. health care and drug company ceos are among the highest paid -- >> the stocks are among the best performing stocks of all in america. >> thank you, my friend. >> all right. >> that's the -- in fairness, i think it's important to say, these are big companies, complex companies to run. you want the best talent running them. you don't have to -- the insurance markets aren't making it -- >> i'm going to tell my ecutive producer to please ask whoever's up next to wait for a few minutes because andrew rubin
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opened up a big can of worms. stephanie ruhle is going to open a big can of something else on him. >> should have the best ceos possible. this idea that the companies and ate fo can't afford to stay in business in states. sorry, charlie. >> it's about balancing insurance markets. the insurance companies run medicaid in many states. they're investing a lot of money in health outcomes and transforming how medicaid patients get their health care. the public doesn't really see that. i see that in my job every day. we are working on making the population healthier for the medicaid beneficiaries. that's a lot of money, and the insurance companies are funding this because they actually believe that this might work. you cut that money, all those programs are going to dry up and we're going to be where we were 20 years ago. that's not a good place to be. >> all right. we're going to continue to follow this as the story comes out. stand by, everybody. the cbo score, the measure -- the ruler that some people don't like is coming. as we wait, a reminder "velshi &
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ruhle" saturday msnbc catch up 12:30 eastern, dvr it, do whatever you got to do. we'll be back right after this. we're keeping our eye on congress. it's time your the "your business" entrepreneur of the week. michael is a frustrated musician turned urban winemaker. he started city winery to put together all of his loves. it's a restaurant, a winery and a music venn ye iie iic venue. he's taking the leap now expanding now to five cities. for more, watch "your business" at 7:30 weekends on msnbc. prese? american express open cards can help you take on a new job, or fill a big order or expand your office and take on whatever comes next.
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it is a make-or-break moment for the attempt at an obamacare repe repeal. we're moments away from the revised cbo score, congressional budget office score, on the house approved republican health care plan. fortunately, i'm not going to be around to get that score, but you can always find me on twitter, facebook and instagram
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@alivelshi, snapchat @velshi. thank you for watching. "deadline white house" with nicolle wallace starts right now. hi, everyone. it's 4:00. today as president trump turns from the tightly scripted part of his first overseas trip to the unpredictable realm of diplomacy, the man he told to stay strong, former national security adviser, mike flynn, is facing mouche ining mounting le at home. members of the house intelligence committee are talking about subpoenas for mike flynn and his companies as part of the investigation into flynn and possible ties between donald trump's campaign and russia. this follows calls yesterday from the senate intel committee for the same material. we go straight to our reporters covering the latest developments. nbc's peter alexander is at the white house, "new york times" reporter glenn thrush joins us from his newsroom. kasie hunt made it by the hair of her chinny chin chin. kasie, i want