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tv   Deadline White House  MSNBC  May 25, 2017 1:00pm-2:01pm PDT

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facebook, instagram @alivelshi. on snapchat. up next, "deadline white house," joe lieberman for an exclusive one-on-one for the first time since he's withdrawn his name from consideration for fbi director. hi, everyone. it's 4:00. president trump takes his turn on the world stage, and what a turn it is. the president shoving his way to the front of the pack, apparently this is what america first looks like at a nato summit. in brussels today, president trump played up his role as the alliance's dues collector and played down his role and america's role as the kind of ally who would defend a member nation facing a security threat from an adversary. the tradition known as one for all, all for one, established 68 years ago after world war ii. here's the president today. >> nato members must finally contribute their fair share and meet their financial
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obligations. but 23 of the 28 member nations are still not paying what they should be paying and what they're supposed to be paying for their defense. this is not fair to the people and taxpayers of the united states, and many of these nations owe massive amounts of money from past years and not paying in those past years. >> with all the day's best reporting, we have nblsc's hans nichols, and peter baker with "the new york times." pete e i want to start with you, alternative allies were looking for those were some reassurance that if a member nation were threatened from, say, russia, we would be there and the president did not deliver those words that they were waiting to hear. what's the effect of that? >> yeah, it's pretty stunning. the bar was pretty low here. all the president had to do to make the european nato allies happy was to say that he would do what the united states is
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already legally committed to do under the nato charter, which is as you say, defend any ally that happens to come under attack. the only reason this is an issue is the president, himself, put it in an issue a year ago when he gave an interview to one of my colleagues of "the new york times" and said he would commit to the defense of nato allies only if they paid up, to use his phrase, that they spent enough money on their own defense according to the formula that nato has used and you just played on the clip here, 23 of the 28 don't meet that 2% standard that has been set in the past. well, you know, that makes a lot of allies wonder, does that mean he really is committed to article 5? he had the perfect opportunity today, he was speaking at the commission of a memorial to article 5. the only time article 5, which is the self-defense, we're all in together clause, has ever been invoked was on behalf of the united states after 9/11 by european allies and the canadians and he chose not to say those words at the speech today. now, sean spicer, the white
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house press secretary, says, of course, we're not playing cutsie here, that's his phrase. he's 100% committed to article 5, and its laughable, he said, that anybody would think he had to actually say the words. well, it wasn't laughable to a lot of the europeans and he's left a lot of sour feelings. >> hans, i want to ask you about the atmospherics because i've been reading the recording all day but you're there on the ground. it was a chilly reception for this president and it was a simple thing. all he had to do was say the words but it was almost petulant he refused to do so and i understand secretary of defense mattis and others around him have been doing quiet diplomacy to reassure our allies we will, in fact, be the ally we've always been. >> reporter: secretary mattis and tillerson have done private and public diplomacy. mattis here in february was very clear russia is a threat and article 5 is the cornerstone of nato. nicolle, the focus of our
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reporting today going forward should be was this an intentional omission or simply an oversight from potentially a tired white house that didn't quite know that they needed to send a direct signal? so i think we need to figure that out. did they intend to do this as some sort of negotiating game, trying to goad and convince other allies to meet their 2% targets? and the other thing is we need to be careful on what and very attentive to what allies, especially the baltic, the newer members, those on the eastern side, what they are saying publicly and privately about trump's omission. if they didn't feel reassured, it's up to them to make that call. there's some reporting that suggests, yes, they would have like to have hear a little bit more. the meeting, dinner, just wrapped up. we'll try to figure it all out and see how many languages peter reads. i'm sure peter reads a lot of newspapers and a lot of languages. >> peter, that's a good point, you've been stationed in russia and you covered america from other points abroad.
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obviously, vladimir putin watched this speech today and had to have given a high five to his pal, sergey, and for mr. lavrov. america taking a very vague position about whether or not they would defend their allies against russian aggression. >> well, that's right. i do think they're probably very happy in moscow today. i think they're very unhappy in vilneas, rega, the baltic states once were part of the soviet union. no one feels more threatened, vulnerable, than they do. they're members of nato and there are american troops who have been rotating in and out the kuchb tcountries to offer af support they feel the urgency of nato o nato's commitment to defending them if something happens. they've been under asausault fr russia, cyber type warfare, subterranean. it may not have been a big thing to some people in the white house or seemed like a big thing to some people in the white house, it's a very big thing in eastern europe. the truth i do think, as hans said, the question is did they
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really understand this? just yesterday they had been saying, yes, don't worry, he's going to actually say that in the speech. there had to be a struggle going on, perhaps the president decided at the last minute he didn't want to make that commitment as a negotiating stance. it's hard to say. maybe he said, look, this is ridiculous, i'm standing in front of an article 5 memorial, of course i support it, why do i have to say the words? >> why do you have to say it? because everybody thinks you're vladimir putin's puppet. that's why you have is to say it. i'm done with the stupidity defense. i'm drawing my own red line here. hans, i want to give you the last word. i want to know how the military feels. they've thrown open the door, invited press in to show up the american troops who are protecting these nato allies. i've seen footage on our network and others. the military making very clear that from a military-to-military perspective, we are standing with our nato allies. regardless of what this president says or doesn't say. r >> reporter: you saw that concretely yesterday, nicolle,
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this is in trump's budget -- >> to we think he read his budget, hans? >> reporter: there's an additional 1.4 -- i'm going to assume there is. there's an additional $1 president$1.4 billion for nato defense. it was a significant increase. now, maybe you're right. i think your instincts may be right there. maybe this is the pentagon trying to signal themselves just how important this is. it was in trump's budget and folks here at the european command really put a stamp on it, put out press releases and really wanted to draw attention to that. i just take one other note, this is kind of -- i'm cutting against the grain here a little bit but the idea this could have been an omission, that is he did -- president trump did call it the russian threat. and that's the strongest i've heard trump say that in some time. and i think that -- at that point he was very -- he was speaking to the ears of the eastern europeans. at other points he clearly offended them especially by tieing this whole idea of immigration and mass migration
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to refugee crisis here and saying that's a nato crisis. you know, a lot of the countries see that as a human rights issue and angela merkel, for one, has been working very hard to say these are universal values, not security values. so, you know, there's a lot to digest. great thing about nato, you had 29 leaders in there, they're all going to talk and we're all going to get a pretty good readout. they only have three minutes -- the leaders only get three minutes each -- >> i remember. >> -- to talk. i'm looking for that readout. >> all right. come back if you get anything good. peter baker, thanks for being with us. hans nichols, thank you for being on the receiving end of my russia ire today. joining the panel today, former democratic congressman harold ford. now a policymaker and re and re of the university of michigan gerald ford's school of public policy. biana, who i'm guessing has strong feelings about the body language at nato. john heilman, executive producer and co-host of show time's "the circus." and rick stengel. i got to start with you, biana.
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he didn't push aside anyone, he pushed aside -- >> there's no bigger thorn at putin's side than nato obviously. this is once a again a big coup for vladimir putin who has been watching this very closely. the fact that the president as we mentioned the bar was very low and know the other countries there purposely didn't bring up the russia issue and their concern that much about ukraine because they didn't want to sort of appease the president, get to know him and be flattering -- >> how about who pushed aside? >> yes, the newest members of nato who the president voted for, montenegro, not a very welcoming gesture on the president's part. >> rick stengel, you've been in charge of public diplomacy. read the body language to me. what does this say? i thought it said -- you have the job of helping to sell america around the world. >> i think it's a high crime and misdemeanor. >> yeah, manye, too. >> when you go to the boughtics as i did at the state department, they tell you you have to say our commitment to
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article 5 is ironclad. that is the word they use over and over. >> i feel like -- >> ironclad. >> -- the "snl" cue cards might have helped, couldn't someone have held one up to him? >> here's the thing putin did in interfering in our election. he most hoped for is somebody might get elected who might relax the sanctions against russia. never in his wildest dreams did he think an american president would not have an ironclad commitment to article 5. >> well, i think there's a -- i agree with everything that's been said so far, but there's a defiance in this speech. i don't thichnk there's a mista. >> i totally agree e. i won't be handled by you uptight -- >> and more, more than that, i think he knows, the president knows, that he's been -- the suspicion of his connections to russia, potential collusion, these investigations, they're not just domestic issues, they're international issues. the international intelligence community in western europe is looking at him. is scrutinizing his speech. his attitude i think in the speech was screw all of you, think what you want, i'm going to -- i am going to defy all of
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your expectations and i'm going to do something and invite you to say that i'm vladimir putin's puppet. that's the -- he's not -- i just -- >> he goaded me. >> i think he was goaded and just the idea that, like, they left it out of the speech. as rick said, there's a script. >> lot of -- >> let this go for generations we've been saying the same thing over and over again to avoid this kind of confusion. >> harold ford, did he buy himself legal trouble? anybody who's looking at motive, intent, state of mind, vis-a-vis russia, had a proof point today. >> they did. it was a tale of two trips. he travels to the middle east after all the things he said about muslims and what he started his presidency off on and struck the right tone. not only struck the right political tone, he struck the right substantive tone. he then travels to be with our most enduring allies and we've obviously seen how he's behaved. it's almost like he thought he was still in the campaign and speaking at a gop state dinner somewhere in the middle of the kcountry trying to fire up the
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base. a lot of what he said in the speech held some truth. nato to focus more on terrorism and immigration. and there was a way to segue to how we may need more help -- >> sure. >> -- more contributions from all of us. i've made some comments in the past. i agree with john, it was a defiance but a misplaced defiance. he ought to hire the speechwriter who wrote his speech or carry the speechwriter who wrote the speech for the middle east with him more often than the fellow or woman who wrote his speech today. the air of unpredictability, he said in the beginning, i want to be unpredictable, president obama was predictable. when talking to nato is predi predictabili predictability, exactly what you want. >> this came on the hills of an attack in manchester. >> why does he have such a hard time, you know, after the syrian chemical attack when we launched strikes against the airport, the airfield, even then he did not have any harsh words for vladimir putin. he goes to a nato summit, sticks
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his finger in their eye, talked to them about paying their bills and says nothing really positive about america's continuing a 68-year tradition of defending them. what is that about? >> right. he thought 49 tomahawk missiles would sort of squash the speculation that he was putin's puppet. in fact, we know now the russians and americans are talking more than they had before behind closed doors, behind channels in syria. i think the president, you mentioned him going to saudi arabia and giving that speech. he purposely said we're note going to be lecturing you and comes to the europeans, our closest allies -- >> embarrasses them. >> -- and proceeds to lecture them. you can't help but notice the body language, he looked much more comfortable with the two sergeys in the oval office. >> for sure. >> go ahead. >> to make one last point about this defiance, when he did the speech before the joint session of congress and had been told a week before by mcmaster, don't say radical islamic terrorism, don't say radical islamic terrorism and got up and everybody said, mcmaster was -- he got up and said, radical islamic terrorism.
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that defiance streak he has in certain big moments, big stages where he's supposed to do something, says no, i'm doing exactly the opposite. i've seen it before. we're sees it here. >> is it going to get him in legal trouble? >> i think the trouble he'll get in legally if there's legal trouble will be based on the facts, not on this particular speech. >> is this a window into the facts, a window into his state of mind about russia? >> they may very well be. >> look, it's a pattern that's going on, not about last night, it's a pattern that's gone on for 18 months. we didn't need the speech to illuminate that fact. >> to john's point about the vindictiveness, the thing he said -- >> vindictiveness toward nato, this is where my brain -- >> back dues like there's back rent, there's no such thing as back dues or back rent. you pay 2% of your gdp. if you underpay that, you don't have to go back and do that. he made that up complete hi. >> by the way, 23 of those countries did step up in payment last year, made an agreement in 2014 before the president -- >> no one's against nato paying their dues but it's a far more significant issue. >> not one or the other.
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>> tone, tone, tone. >> you made a really important point, he was in the speech very much speaking to not like it was a campaign rally, he was speaking to the domestic audience. he's done so much in his presidency which has been about speaking to his base. i think he thought as much as anybody he was not just thumbing his nose at everyone's expectations and the establish the and nato, but he was also speaking to the trump voter back here in america that says, damn right they should pay more, they should pay their dues. of course they should pay back dues. >> it's colossally -- >> i'm not justifying it. i'm saying the domestic audience was on his mind today. >> harold, last word since your name was invoked. >> amen. >> there we go. all right. we're going to take a break. when we come back, replacing jim comey at the fbi. the man who was reported to have been the front-runner in the search joins us for an exclusive interview. we'll ask senator joe lieberman why he withdrew his name from consideration. you've heard of bare knuckle politics. the gop candidate in mtontana
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took it to a new low with broken eye glasses and body slamming. is donald trump to blame for calling journalists the, quote, enemy of the people? we're waiting to hear from the montana sheriff and we'll bring you his comments live. new reporting on russian targets for influence. how russian spies sought to get to trump through top campaign aides paul manafort and mike flynn. oscar mawe went back toig the drawing board... and the cutting board. we removed the added nitrates and nitrites, by-products, and artificial preservatives in all of our meat.
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the running for fbi director. one of his best friends, senator john mccain, says democrats are to blame, telling k ining cnn, democratic colleagues clearly did kill lieberman's chances. this is their nominee for vice president of the united states. if anything would make you cynical about this town, that's it." we're joined by senator lieberman in his first interview since he interviewed for the job of fbi director with president trump. senator, thanks for joining us. >> glad to be with you. . thank you. >> so i want to make sure we have -- because you're private and the president kept this process pretty private for president trump. were you offered the job? >> i can't say there was an actually offer, but -- >> but he said sort of if you're interested, let me know? >> yeah. i don't want to go too far. he was very encouraging. this happened very quickly and very surprisingly. i mean -- >> did he call you on your cell phone? how did it go down? >> he did. he called me and they found me at a meeting of a corporate board i'm on in chicago. that was a week ago tuesday. really. very recently.
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and said, i'd like you to think about whether you want to be director of the fbi. i think you'd be great at it. i'm sure he said that to other people. and i'd like to talk to you more about it and my first reaction was just honest, mr. president, i'm honored that you'd ask me to think about this, but honestly, i have a -- i'm very happy with my life now. >> i know that to be true. i know your wife. i know that -- was there part of you that thought, because someone said it's such a mess, senator lieberman would never go in. i said, you know what, that's why he would. was there part of you that thought this might cap a career -- did you think you could help by going in? what was your personal -- >> yeah, so you wrestle with it. you got the good life, you're spending a little more time with your wife, your children, grandchildren. we've been blessed with 11. i'm very busy. i'm halftime at the law firm working on advocacy groups like united against nuclear iran, no labels, et cetera. but here comes the call and, you know, it's in my blood to say when the president of the united
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states asks you to do something, to serve your country, you got to really think about it seriously and, yes, part of the challenge was to step in and try to restore respect for the federal bureau of investigation which i deeply respect and part of that, strangely enough for somebody who comes from a political background, is to have a director who lowers the profile and just has the bureau do what it's supposed to do, fight terrorism, fight crime, do the best investigations in the world. >> that part of the job appealed to you. >> it did. >> you thought seriously about doing it? >> i did think seriously about doing it. called to service. certain amount of pride. yes, i can do this and make a contribution, but then on the other side, of course, was big change in life. i was 40 years in elected office. i've been out for four year. >> you're aging in reverse. i don't buy any of that. you interviewed for the job the day the president got one of the bombshells of his young presidency, the day bob mueller
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was announced as special counsel. can you tell us what the mood was like when you were there and changed your calculation whether you'd want to run the bureau while mueller was investigating russia ties? >> well, it did happen that day. it was a strange coincidence, but, and i could see that as i walked in, but our conversation really was about the fbi and him making an appeal to me why he hoped i would do it and giving him some of my ideas, same i just spoke to you about. listen, the men and women of the fbi are the best in the world. >> they are. >> at what they do. it would have been an honor to be their leader and their advocate but i also told them why i was hesitating and a lot of that was personal. he urged me to please think about it. he called me the next night, thursday night. he said i wanted it decided by tomorrow morning before i leave for the foreign trip. i don't know if i can do it. think about it. and then i decided to postpone it which was really fortunate for me because i just heard 2 1/2 days before about possibly
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an upheaval in my life. let me come back to what you said about mueller. bob mueller. i'll just give you what was sort of a surprising answer. to a certain extent, the appointment of bob mueller as special counsel made me feel that that, itself, would take some pressure off of the fbi. >> i knew you were going to say that would reassure you. >> yeah. bob mueller and i, and his wife, ann, wonderful people, happen to be neighbors of ours when we were in washington. so he's a straight shooter and i thought, okay, the fbi agents will be working with him, but now he's going to separately, accountable to the justice department, not the president, take on this investigation. it made me feel better. >> you know jim comey, too, though. did you reach out to jim comey while you were deliberating? >> i honestly don't know jim comey. i may have shaken his hand once but i don't know him. i called two friends who were former fbi, one was bob mueller, and the other was louie free who
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served during the clinton time. >> sure. >> and -- >> did they tell you to take it or not take it? >> louie, i think it's fair to say was very affirmative. bob mueller, he was asked to be special counsel, he said this call is your call. here's what the job is like, you come to it with a different set of skills which is to say not immediately out of law enforcement, although i've done law enforcement, or the judicial -- >> a.g. of the state of connecticut. >> he said, you can do it, you'll do it in a different way. >> were you surprised your friend, congressman crowley, was new york was very pained when i pressed him last friday about whether or not he would support you. he said no. were you surprised or pained some democrats were resistant to the idea of you as fbi director? >> you know, i was disappointed although i guess when i step back from it, i wasn't surprised because everything is so partisan in washington, and there's still a group probably on the far left of the democratic party that still doesn't forgive me. >> you weren't as much as your
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friend, john mccain. >> that's why i love john mccain. >> john and linsey unfiltered. >> let me ask you something that bothers all three of you, this question of russia. donald trump today at nato refused to affirm or commitment to article 5. i know you, john, lindsey, three amigos are known to travel to america's allies, most vulnerable from russian aggression. how do you feel we have a president today who refused to confirm or commitment to our most vulnerable nato allies? >> i was disappointed the president didn't say he would support the entire nato charter including article 5. i was reassured that sean spicer apparently afterwards said, of course -- >> because he's so in the loop. >> yeah. so i can only -- i'll offer a fourth or fifth alternative explanation to what your excellent panel just had on. maybe the president sees this as something he wants to almost use to get the nato nations that are
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not paying as much as they should -- >> but why wouldn't you play hardball with russia, why are we playing hardball with nato? >> look, they have -- there's not a good answer for that except to get them to pay more of what they owe. listen, there's nothing new about this. every time mccain and graham and i went to european capital or visited night tonato, said we g do spend more of your money on defense. we're carrying beyond our fair share. so there's nothing new about that, but, of course, we always believed in article 5. it's the key. we got to defend each other. >> are the questions about trump's teams and their ties to russia getting bigger and are there more dots? or are they getting less for you? >> well, there's a lot swirling so that's why it's good we have bob mueller. i mean, in my mind, and i thought john brennan the former cia director said something interesting. sometimes the russians develop relationships with people and
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they begin use an interesting word, suborn. >> i saw that. >> sort of creep into their brains and make them dependent and that's a key question here. i don't think that kind of relationship reached president trump at all, but i -- it is a question now raised about a few of the people. >> mike flynn, paul manafort? >> they have to defend themselves. >> my last question before i let you go back to your wonderful life, i know it is, would you take another job if it was a right fit? would you answer the call to serve in the trump administration? >> i might, depending on what the circumstances were. i mean, i -- when marc kasowitz became special counsel, it was clear to me with everything swirling in washington, you can't have a director of the fbi coming from the same law firm as the president's private lawyer. it's just -- it looks terrible. so that was that. >> that was sort of the nail in the coffin? >> again, i believe in service and to me, there's no higher calling. so who knows what the future
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will hold. >> all right. thank you so much for coming and talking to us. we're very grateful. >> be well. all right. when we come back, campaign thuggery and russia's influence. ♪ [ male announcer ] tora bora fallujah argonne khe sanh midway dak to normandy medina ridge the chosin reservoir these are places history will never forget but more important are the faces we will always remember. ♪
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all right. i'm back with my rowdy panel. so the most interesting thing that senator lieberman said about the trip was when he was just speechless about why the president would go to a nato summit and refuse to sort of affirm our alliances. the same place where we left off. i want to bring in some of the reporting today from "the new york times" about russian efforts to get to trump by influencing paul manafort and michael flynn. i think we can put that up on the screen. "the conversations focused on paul manafort" on behalf of the russian, "conversations focused on paul manafort and michael flynn, undirect tries to russian officials and appeared confident each could be used to help shape mr. trump's opinions on russia. ""how long does this go on until someone in the white house
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convinces the president to just, i don't know, demand that everyone sort of come clean? >> i'm not sure that they'll ever come. >> really? >> all of the reporting coming out of the white house is they're getting into, they're gearing up for a protracted period of total war and the -- >> talk about that. they've said a war -- they didn't have a war-room as a campaign. >> that's true. they've been studying past administrations and taking certain lessons selectively from them which is to say they want to try to create a rapid response and an operation that's dezisigned to deal with this son theory it doesn't get in the way of other things they're trying to do. talking about putting corey lewandowski in the room. if you're bill clinton or george w. bush, you don't go for a highly partisan kind of bomb thrower. you try to find someone who calms the waters. they're going the other direction. so for everything i hear from the white house is we expect to be fighting this war until the last dog dies. >> you know, i mean, it's
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obviously smart to sort of set up a surrogate operate, a surrogate operation requires you have to message discipline. this president can't coordinate with his own press office. what's the potential for success with the surrogate operation? >> going to be challenging for the reasons both of you all are saying but add this wrinkle, in our lifetime we've seen a clinton situation, some have seen a nixon situation. the uniqueness of this, you have a republican congress, a republican senate, a republican basically special counsel in mueller who obviously has served both administrations, but i think it's probably safe to say probably leans a little more right. and you have a republican president. at some point your surrogate operation is going to be fighting people within your own party. >> right. >> you have a chairman of the intelligence committee who is irked that general flynn won't talk. i think it boils 60 to 75 days. i don't think this goes on forever. i think comey testifies, we get a good sense of what he knows and where this thing goes. the counsel's office will continue to look at whether or not trump's people knew things and whether trump knew anything about it. it won't take long.
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mueller is not looking for a new job. he's not looking to advance. he may make a few more bucks after this but is not looking to get another job after this. he wants to get this over. if you're paul ryan and mcconnell, you don't want this dragging to september and october. if there's something there, move on. if not, i think the country will say we move on from this and the president will probably be stronger, not probably, will undoubtedly be stronger than he's ever been if he sir skrour this. if something's there, we'll learn quickly and the congress will be ready to move on it. >> the reporting, biana, is that the russians were trying to get through manafort through his ties to yanukovych. who represents the bad guys and paul manafort was one of them. how hard was it for the russians to get to paul manafort? >> cultivated by years in the making, we spent all this time talking about flynn and his russian ties. look at manafort's money, you follow the money, it's much, much deeper than anything reported thus far with michael flynn. he's supported with one of
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russia's richest billionaires, $12 million from the pro-russian ukrainian former president yanukovych. talk about jared kushner having ole ga oligarch. you're talking about billions of dollars among russia's top richest elite. >> rick, how dependent are democrats on these intelligence committees on their republican chairmen to really drive the investigation? >> well, the republican chairman, i mean, in the senate, at least that seems like a bipartisan effort, i think to go with what harold was saying, this is going to follow its course, but i want to mention something about the -- what the russian reporting about manafort and others. the russians try all the time to suborn people. they knock on every door. if you answer the door, they're delighted but they get a lot of misses. in the case of someone like m manafort, it wasn't an unwhiting
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relationship. this was a very witting relationship. they went to their easy guys first. they're trying everybody all the time. >> here's the place where harold, having prized haised hi before, he might be wrong on this. the investigation right now, this is proceeding on two tracks. there's an obstruction of justice track and there's a collusion track. >> right. >> if mueller is going to spend a lot of time, the collusion thing could take a lot longer it seems to me than 60 or 75 days to sort out. that could be years long. we've not seen special prosecutors that get done in f 0 or 75 days. that's a complicated story, it's financially complicated. there's a lot of -- foreign elements to it. if the obstruction charge, that could be wrapped up pretty quick if there's jgenuinely a clear-ct obstruction of justice case. right now the prime ma facia case on that is very strong. this is one of the questions, is it quick? what does mueller think he's doing? does he think he's doing one of the other? again, he's a great men, what we've seen from many great men who have been special
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prosecutors, they become ahab and get into this and don't quit -- they start following one lead to the next lead. these always mushroom and always metastasize. >> thanks for being with us. still ahead, the latest on the shocking all tern case betwe between a reporter and a congressional county in montana's special election. >> get the hell out of here. the last guy did the same thing. you with "the guardian"? >> yes, you just broke my glasses. >> last guy did the same damn thing. >> you just body slammed me and broke my glasses. >> get the hell out of here. it's time your the "your business" entrepreneur of the week. michael is a frustrated musician turned urban winemaker. he started city winery to put together all of his loves. it's a restaurant, a winery and a music venue. he's taken the leap, expanding now to five cities. for more, watch "your business" weekends at 7:30 on msnbc.
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should the gentleman apologize? yeah, i think he should apologize. i know he has his own version and i'm sure he's going to have more to say, but it's no call for this no matter what, any circumstance. the people of the state of montana are going to decide today who they will send to congress. >> oh, my god, his own version,
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speaker ryan, what version could there be? that was house speaker paul ryan weighing in on the montana congressional candidate greg gian sw gianforte, altercation, body slamming incident with a reporter from "the guardian." ryan saying he would let gianforte take a seat in congress if the vote goes for his favor tonight. does it look like it might? >> we condition taan talk abouts later. it's already taken place. >> early vote. >> montana is a state, you think of it as a red state, donald trump won it by 21 points last year. think back to the last republican president when he got. political trouble, george w. bush, 2006, iraq was out of control, his popularity was dropping. montana is one of those states that swung -- >> yeah. >> tester to the senate, me had schweitzer as governor. obama came within three points of winning montana in 2008. so it was up to 21 last year. but you got a republican president now and if his approval is coming down, this is the kind of state, this is an
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at-large district, the entire state that could start to come back into play. >> the sheriff is briefing, we don't have a good shot, but listen to a little bit of what he had to say about the incident. >> probable cause existed to issue a notice to appear to greg gianforte for the offense of misdemeanor assault for which he is ordered to appear by june 7th in gallant county justice court. >> all right. and this was trump's guy, i got a robo call here that the president recorded for him. let's listen to that. >> vote for my friend,s republican greg gianforte, for congress. he's a wonderful guy, he knows how to win, he's going to win for you and i'll tell you what, the people of montana are going to be happy. >> so, we had this conversation this morning. it bears repeating i think you can draw a direct linebranding journalists enemies of of the american people and a republican
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candidate warmly embraced by donald trump body slamming a journalist whose coverage he didn't like. >> i'm as troubled by anybody by the things trump has said about the press and the broader context so i'll never give any quarter on that. i also think this guy's behavior is so extreme -- >> you think he's just a nut in. >> i do. there's obviously some mental or emotional instability here because just on the basis of what we heard on the tape, hooehe's asked about the cbo score, he's got a pirk microphone in his face, going to face 30, 40, 50 every day if he gets to capitol hill. i think this person is not well. so do i like the context? no, i do not. do i think this kind of thing flourishes within that context? yes, i do. do i think it's causal, somehow trump saying these things caused this guy to be this way? i don't. i think this guy's behavior is, again, so extreme that it speaks to some very particularized individual pathology that we're seeing play out with this guy who smacked his reporter for no good reason. >> so he's either a lunatic egged on by the climate created or mentally ill. what do you think?
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>> the fact that even body slamming a reporter has become somewhat -- >> can't believe we're having this conversation. >> partisan issue online, social media, you saw paul ryan sort of choosing his words carefully playing obviously poor guy has to play principal every single day and remind us what manners are like. you don't see more of the party coming out. i think ben sasse today said definitively, this is wrong, we don't do things like this. we need to see more of that. it's become political -- >> what is the possible defense for this behavior? what is the possible -- what could we possibly learn -- >> you can take -- >> -- on the other side? >> take his spokesperson at his word. i think john is on to something. i disagree slightly here because his press spokesperson came back and used the word, "liberal press. "liberal reporter asking these questions. that's from the trump playbook. i don't think the president wanted to see this happen. but when you create this kind of climate, things can happen which is your point. now, the profile in courage in this belongs to that young lady who's a fox reporter. had she not come forward to
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corroborate the story of the young reporter from "the guardian" -- >> would have been a he said/she said. >> -- we would have had a he said/she said and would have pa republicans try to hide behind it. the fox story, the reporter to come forward and say, look, lets me tell you exactly what happened, she's been on network after network after network. this guy has no business being in the united states -- >> now you got "the guardian," indisputably liberal sort of world view, and a local fox reporter, corroborating this account, which i guess he could have bumped into him and not body slammed him, but certainly what we hear on the tape makes it sound like an act of aggressi aggression. what is sort of the power of sort of a right/left media narrative against a candidate who's acted allegedly inappropriately? >> i mean, i guess we'll find out. at least to the extent the folks who go out and vote today to the extent we can get a glimpse of how they voted today versus before today. we might get a readout on that. there's an important piece of
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context with gianforte when if comes to this trump question. i'll stay away from the issue of did trump directly inspire this or anything like this. gianforte is actually a very good symbol of what happened in the republican party on november 8th when donald trump won. last year, gianforte was the prub can n republican nominee for governor of montana and could not have distanced himself from donald trump. he said publicly i'm reluctantly backing donald trump because his name is not hillary clinton, wouldn't cam wane wipaign with . stay as far away as he could. when donald trump won anyway -- >> he lost. >> he lost the race as trump won monta montana. montana, one of these states last summer when trump's campaign was hitting a low point, you had democrats say we could even make montana close. even republicans were feeling that. when they turned around and watched trump survive but win by 21 in montana and win the election, they thought twice about distancing themselves. that's what you saw in the campaign. gianforte brought donald trump's
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kid out there to campaign for him, talked about draining the swamp, endorsed trump -- >> you have numbers to tell the story as well. you want to take us through those? >> yeah. we were talking about what the early vote does to all this. there's an election going on today, the election in a lot of ways already happened. here's what i mean. so, this is what people are waking up to today in montana. however, they already sent out a minute ago 350,000 ballots statewide. they september them out in the mail. as the close of business yesterday, which is to say, before this incident happened, before anybody heard of it, more than 250,000 had been returned. by the way, tens of thousands were also still in the mail. what does this mean practically speaking? here you can see it. this is rise of mail-in voting over the last decade in montana. see it goes up every election. it was up to 65% last november. best estimate today, probably going to be 70% or maybe even more. 70% or more of this election already conducted before this incident happened. so if you're a democrat and looking for some sort of a hope that there's a switch on election day, it's two things,
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montana's a same-day registration state, if you aren't registered, you could go to the polls, register, get a ballot today. also if you were mailed a ballot and didn't vote before today, you could fill it in today but would have to bring it into the polling site physically. if you put it in the mail today, won't get there in time. won't count. so those are two things maybe democrats are hoping for there at least. >> steve, let me put you on the spot and read you a tweet from our colleague, steve schmidt. he tweets "the montana incident is one more example of the rotten, fetid and corrupt culture that metastasized around a bankrupt gop." do you think the gop would like to see him win or lose? >> i think they'd like to see him win because if he loses, they have an excuse. they would like to have the seat. the question then is they can marginalize him for two years and maybe get somebody else in the seat? >> let me be clear, i'm not suggesting trump did this. my only point, if you look at the statement from his press secretary, they didn't say this reporter said this to him. they said this liberal reporter. second, this guy's yet to
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apologize. >> right. >> he's yet to come forward himself. he's still hiding behind what seems to be -- >> and the reporter -- >> -- untruth and some would use a different -- >> the reporter went to the hospital. let's not -- i wasn't drawing a direct causal, either. i was saying he created a i wasn't drawing a direct causal effect. our own reporters have been harassed. >> i criticized the contact fully. i think this guy has some problems. i'll get myself in trouble with this. the more generic part of this, it is something you've done and others have done. attacking "the new york times," a long time, in a presidential campaign. you were in trouble. you attacked the liberal "new york times." and that communication strategy is time honored in republican politics. you get in trouble, attack the liberal "new york times," the liberal media. it has metastasized, it has
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gotten grotesque and ugly. you never invited violence. if you trace the genesis of attacking the liberal british guardian newspaper. that goes a long way back. >> i'll use one of my three life lines. >> look at the corporations like united, for example, when they're tone deaf to physically assaulting a passenger. we're getting a tone deaf response that we saw. they're doubling down. and that's the point you're trying to make. >> they're raising money off it. they're fundraising off this. that's the craziest thing. >> don't go anywhere. he might attack me again for my past life. ♪
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we have a special relationship with the usa. it is our deepest security partnership and that's built on trust. and part of that trust is knowing that intelligence can be shared confidently. and i will be making clear the president trump today that intelligence shared between law enforcement agencies must remain secure. >> so that was british prime minister theresa may expressing some concern about sharing intelligence with us. how big of a problem is this for our national security agencies, if our closest allies, never mind the ones that we have more
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discreet relationships with, become nervous about sharing intelligence with us because the president either shares with it the russians or it leaks to the press? this seems like pretty brave concern. not to owned a downward note where you're not attacking me anymore. if this thing happened this week where you have british intelligence saying we're not going to tell america what we know because we're afraid that it is not secure anymore. if that is the beginning of pattern, i think that happens across the world because people feel they can't trust donald trump or his administration to keep our secrets. it is devastating. it is as bad a thing that could happen. because the global war on terror is all about collaboration and all about information sharing. if that becomes crippled, it is not just horrible for american national security, it is horrible for the world. >> we were hearing that from our intelligence when he became the
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nominee. there were reports the u.s. was saying be careful what you tell to the israelis. so i don't know. i don't know why he feels this need to have these constant communications with russians, with duterte in telling him where our subs are. i don't know if he's order doesn't know the difference. >> do you think one of the saving graces may be one of the bipartisan glimmers of hope seem to be the two intel committees, they seal to be working together as well as they traditionally do? >> in particular the relationship between richard burr and mark warner. not to dwell on the point but this point with may and the story that was out about this, the not trusting us, made even more compelling and incumbent upon the president while at nato to strike a very, very different tone that he. did he's chosen the path that he's chosen and we find
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ourselves in a ditch. this is probably the most important thing all day. >> don't say that. >> that threatens a fabric of security and safety around the globe. >> if you want to owned a positive note. the counter to my point is the place where there's a tremendous amount of trust is in the actual intelligence community in america and abroad. if you're at mi 6, they know, pick your intelligence agency in the western world. they've been working together for gentle ragss and it doesn't mat here the president or the prime minister is. >> if you're afraid to tell commander in chief -- >> that's a separate problem. the one ray of hope is that the international intelligence committee is still one and will continue to talk. >> is there a price to be paid for someone on the world stage who stands alone literally and figuratively? >> it is an extension of what wednesday about trump. part of job of being president
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is to communicate in behalf of the institution. and he doesn't do that. for better or worse, he speaks on behalf of his personal brand. that's what he has always done and he has shown no interest in president as communicating anything other than the donald trump that we have known. >> are you surprised that his ego didn't want to make him be liked more on the world stage? >> i guess after 70 years or whatever the cliche is. this is how he thinks it works for him. this has worked for him in so many a areas. to abandon that now, he doesn't have the back ground in politics. i don't think -- >> he was different in saudi arabia than he was there. when he struck a very different tone. after all the things in the campaign, his first week in office. >> like that night he won the election. for about two hours, maybe we're seeing a different trump. >> another thing he prefers is the deal. >> it is always better when
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you're all here. thank you so much. thanks to my panel. that does it for this hour. next is mtpdale. >> that was an all star panel. we'll see you. if it's thursday, the political punches have gotten real. tonight, no apologies. >> i think she apologize. >> the montana republicans special election candidate faces an assault charge for a reporter as the final votes were being cast. where is the outrage among republican office holders? >> the people of the state of montana will decide today who they will send to congress. >> plus, the dubious document definitely unreliable intelligence inform james comey's handling of the clinton investigation? and america first. president trump hits the world body he once called objection least. >>


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