tv MSNBC Live With Stephanie Ruhle MSNBC July 25, 2017 6:00am-7:00am PDT
you go into and all you're doing is work og the bill on the floor, it's not an open process. it's a controlled process, whoever's in the majority. harry reid was accused of it when he was a democrat, republicans raised holy cane, and now the democrats. if you want to fix this bill, repair it, put it in the committee. let us recommit that bill immediately the first vote, put it in committee and let's repair it and fix it then. then you have time to do it. >> senator joe manchin, thank you very much. ryan goodman, we'll have to have you back as this story unfolds. thank you as well. >> thank you. >> stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage right now. >> thanks, mika. i'm stephanie ruhle with breaking news. jared kushner heed back to capitol hill to face more questions but this time he'll be under oath. >> let me be very clear. i did not collude with russia. and back for battle. senator john mccain set to make a triumphant return to the senate in order to vote for the
republican health care bill. >> for senate republicans, this is their chance to keep their promise. plus, on the outs. the president tearing into his own attorney general. the first senator to back his campaign. is trump trying to force jeff sessions out? take a look at this eye roll. >> mr. president, should jeff sessions resign? that wasn't funny. we're going to begin with the breaking news. jared kushner on his way at this moment to capitol hill. and since he's going to be under oath today, the stakes are even higher. and you're in luck, i've got the best team to break it down. first to garrett haake live on capitol hill. garrett, we saw what happened yesterday. today under oath, the bosses are in the building. what's going to happen? >> reporter: hey, stephanie. good morning. the stakes are a little higher for jared kushner this morning not just because he's under oath but also because of who he's going to be in the room with.
remember the meeting yesterday was with senate intel committee staffers. today's interview will be led by the members themselves. that makes for a little more of a politically charged atmosphere, even though there won't be cameras in the room. remember yesterday donald trump took a shot at the top democrat only this committee on his twitter account. that democrat and others in the room have had a full day to review jared kushner's statement both on paper and what he said to the cameras afterwards and they'll be looking to parse things like this, which he said yesterday on the white house driveway. take a listen. >> the record and documents i have voluntarily provided will show that all of my actions were proper and occurred in the normal course of events of a very unique campaign. >> reporter: stephanie, all of these members have run campaigns of their own. they're going to have a very different perspective on what normal and proper campaign activities are. so we look to see that as being part of the line of questioning today. already this morning the president jumping back in also
to defend his son-in-law with his favorite medium. he sent a twitter message morning read, "jared kushner did very well yesterday in proving he did not collude with the russians. witch-hunt. next up, 11-year-old barron trump." the president trying to dismiss this today, but one advantage the white house won't have when this meeting is over, these members in the room, unlike the staffers from yesterday, can come out and tell their side of the story if they choose to. so far no one's saying that they will, but there is an opportunity at least to hear from the other side today unlike what happened yesterday morning. stephanie? >> here to tell jared kushner, very unique, unique is a word that needs no modification. there you go. just here to help you out. my panel, jonathan swan, national political reporter for axios, jason johnson, politics eld or the for the joon root.com and msnbc political contributor, and megan mercury the editor of bloomberg "business week," or as i like to refer to them my two favorite boy scouts and the grand dame of den mothers in the
house. jonathan, you heard what gerald had to say in the statement prepared by his lawyers, that in front of the white house. today what are the biggest unanswered questions? >> i think that the statement that jared kushner put out yesterday was actually fairly complete. the real question is whether there are things missing from it that we'll find out down the track. that seems to be the big open question. honestly, inside the white house, this is least of their concerns, what happens today. the real concern, the thing that is burden of proofi iburning fo ongoing investigation and whether he veers into their business activities. that is the thing really distressing people inside the administration. it's not what jared kushner will say today. and we saw again this morning donald trump is clearly pushing in this direction of wanting jeff sessions to either resign out of humiliation or who knows, maybe he will actually fire him and appoint someone that he believes would actually fire
mueller. >> let's stay on that. i want to bring in peter alexander, live at the white house. to jonathan's point, the president is clearly intensifying attacks on his own attorney general, jeff sessions, who basically was with him from the beginning of the campaign, the first senator to back him. i mean, the president waking up this morning while health care is on the table, talking about jeff sessions taking a very weak position on hillary clinton crimes. are you kidding me? >> yeah. this is clearly the first thing on his mind as he went to bed and appears when he woke up again this morning, the topic of his attorney general jeff sessions and really the frustration, he's been fuming privately and now increasingly publicly about his a.g., who was with him since the start. moments ago here in the white house driveway i had a chance to catch up with the new communications director anthony scaramucci who likened the strained relationship between the president and sessions to sort of the tensions that exist before divorce. he said to me, you either
reconcile or you separate. he says specifically of that relationship he said they need to either get together or separate. that obviously would be the two real options right now. it appears that he has an opinion, at least in terms of what the president's thinking, he was on the hugh hewitt show earlier, scaramucci, and asked if the president wants jeff sessions gone. he said of that, you are probably right. sarah huckabee sanders today on fox news expressing these similar frustrations saying the president has made it clear he doesn't think anybody serving on his behalf should have recused himself or herself in the circumstances of a russia investigation. you saw the president's tweets yesterday. he referred to his own a.g. in that unor the odox way as belea. the president, known for the catchphrase "you're fired" appears to be putting the screws on making it -- we think sessions may be forced to
resign. just a few days ago he said he would stay as long as appropriate. at some point it bears repeating whether or not this would be the appropriate time to serve a person who obviously can't have confidence in you. >> jeff sessions recused himself over three months ago. why didn't the president fire him then, megagap? >> well, he's clearly trying to make it so difficult for him to actually stay on now and eventually bullying him all morning. it gets worse every day, a drip, drip, drip. what i find so fascinating about this, crucial health care vote in the senate today whether to proceed with this bill. anyone that's looking to loyalty to the party, loyalty to the president, has only to look at his tweets he's put out this morning about his own serving attorney general and someone who gave up a safe senate seat and tep your to become his attorney general. that is the kind of treatment you risk yourself for the president. you republican senators who may be on the fence as to whether to vote to proceed on this crucial health care bill, you do something that upsets the president, you're going to get this kind of treatment, whether or not you care enough he's at
47% approval rating and this bill is at less than 20% is the crucial factor true today. >> why doesn't trump just fire him? i'm guessing the president has probably copyrighted and owned "you're fired" at this point. why not just fire him? you pledged to be courteous, loyal, obedient with the boy scouts yesterday. why don't you say you're out? >> i think trump or members of his administration are afraid. this is one thing about jeff sessions different from a lot of the other senators. he's his own man. i have serious disagreements with him and his desire to steal the right to vote from tons of people and take asset forfeiture, but he's his own man, a true conservative, and he is not going to leave this position. he's going to make trump fire him. and if he does, they don't know what the he might be willing to say. trump thinks you can bully this guy, you can't. jeff sessions is too tough for him. >> jonathan, jeff sessions ain't quitting? >> i'm not so sure about that
when i speak to people who have worked with him, friends of his, they say that they just don't see how he can continue under these conditions. jeff sessions is a man who takes his personal honor very verasly. there's a reason he offered his resignation to donald trump only i guess it was probably two months ago. donald trump refutzed it at that time. he certainly wouldn't refuse it today based on my reporting and the conversations i've been having. so, yeah, i wouldn't be so sure he won't resign. >> all right. i've got to bring peter alexander back in. you have new news about paul manafort? >> reporter: new information we're receiving now, a source close to paul manafort, remember, he was the former campaign chairman for the trump campaign during much of 2016, that source telling us manafort will be appearing on the hill within the next 48 hours to talk with senate investigators. remember, we fist reported last week he was expected to testify alongside donald trump jr., frankly, before the senate
judiciary committee. we have not heard about whether trump jr. would be testifying. manafort will be here. it's about that trump tower meeting that took place in june of 2016 where a russian-born, now american lobbyist all participated alongside jared kushner, paul manafort, and donald trump jr. it's expected according to this source that manafort will likely share his notes from that meeting having taken place now a year ago. that news according to a source close to manafort is he's likely to be on the hill in the next 48 hours. the initial date for his testimony was scheduled to be this wednesday. >> knowing this it sort of makes president trump's ire and fury this morning bring up jeff sessions make a bit more sense. if he's most worrieded about his bitz ties, business entang entanglements with russian oligarchs, it's clearly an issue for paul manafort. i want to go back to what jonathan swan said, megan, in terms of jeff sessions, if jeff
sessions is a guy who does not want to be disrespected, a guy true to his word whether you agree with his beliefs or not, why not stay put? he hasn't done anything. it's the president who's embarrassing himself going after him like this. even if you're a president trump fan right now, i'm not sure you could say, yep, he'sing to the right thing, to roll your eyes from front of an audience about your own attorney general, jeff sessions looks like a hero right now. >> jeff sessions is taking forward his '90s-style vision of the criminal justice system very hard on drugs and the sort of cartel, crossing the border, hard on immigration. >> which is what trump wanted him to do. >> this is a '90s-style law and order, very different from some conservative view points when we look at criminal sentencings, this is his vision. in fact, it's the vision he's had his entire political career. don't expect him to want to give that up without a fight. he thinks he's reforming our criminal justice system. guess what?
he is. no one is seeing that because we're so focused on the other stuff. that is another huge factor and this is what sessions is actually doing. >> isn't that's what's so demented about this? jay, you're saying i don't agree with the guy but he shouldn't step down. things have gotten so warped that knowing jeff sessions' views, knowing what he's doing in terms of criminal justice reform, you're still telling him, sit back, beauregard, hang tight? >> i think because trump is confusing what real ideology is versus his own personal issues. jeff sessions is a real ideolog ideologue. he'll fight against that horrible america, those devastated cities that donald trump says is a problem and he's not going to get caught up in the fact that trump is in in his own trouble. like you mentioned, he's waited his whole life to make these people suffer. he won't paz up this opportunity. my sources i spoke to said rips has already all but said we'd really like you to resign, and jeff said you'll have to fire
me. that's what i heerd from one of my sources yesterday. >> maybe they'll get a twofer. i would love for all of you to stick arnoound. we haven't covered the boy scouts. senator john mccain comes back to washington today to cast an important vote on health care. even if today's vote passes, is it dwoigoing to make it to the president's desk? we know he has a pen ready. and we'll look at the relationship between president trump and his new communications director, the mooch, anthony scaramucci. the "daily show" found some uncanny similarities in terms of casting. certainly looks like the president found what he was looking for. ♪ i wanted to know who i am and where i came from. i did my ancestrydna and i couldn't wait to get my pie chart. the most shocking result was that i'm 26% native american.
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welcome back to msnbc. i'm stephanie ruhle. later today republicans vote to kick-start the debate on repealing obamacare if they can get at least 50 senators to agree. one big guess is john mccain. his return to the senate less than a week after being diagnosed with brain cancer could help push the bill over the finish line. this morning president trump tweeted his thanks to mccain calling him a hero. trump also challenged senate republicans saying they've got to step up to the plate. he also indicated it doesn't matter if the bill replaces obamacare or just repeals it.
kasie hunt is nbc's capitol hill correspondent. kasie, i couldn't help but notice your tweet this morning where you said today will be one of those days where you get a front-row seat to history. what do you mean? >> reporter: well, steph, this is going to be a historic day on capitol hill. we very rarely go into really any vote on the senate floor let alone one as potentially far reaching in impact as repealing the health care law without knowing what's going to happen. and right now we just don't know where the votes are going to come out and obviously you have the added drama of john mccain, a bona fide war hero, coming back to the hill right after starting this battle with brain cancer, so we are waiting of course for him to get up here. and potentially cast the deciding vote to start debate on this repeal. this really is do or die for republicans and a campaign promise they've been making for
seven-plus years. it's going to stay a lot about mitch mcconnell. he has so much on the line today. he has a reputation as being a legislative mastermind. we'll see if it turns out that way. but the reality, too, is that we don't know what the bill will look like if they do actually start to debate it. we don't know if it will be straight repeal, repeal and replace, some variation of that, and neither do the senators who are voting on it. our team has talked to several of them over the last 12 to 24 hours and they just said, look, we have no idea what this is going to look like. and that has incredible ramifications for millions of people both those who are struggling with aspects of obamacare but also those who would stand to lose coverage under some of those replacement plans. so so much on the line today, steph, so much drama. we'll bring it all to you. >> juxtaposition, john mccain, a truly great american hero, facing brain cancer, swooping in to washington to vote on a health care repeal bill that
could possibly cost people's lives. jonathan swan, what is so different this week? last week it seemed like a hail mary pass. now back at the table? >> right. and this was interesting reporting on the weekend because i guess i went into the weekend assuming that this motion to proceed vote would fail and then started having conversations on saturday, sunday with some of the senate officers who are assumed -- were assumed to be no votes and i was getting sort of off the record signals that actual actually yes we probably will vote for this. that got me thinking, ha, maybe this isn't as dead as i thought it was. and i also got the signal that john mccain may come back the vote. those two factors led us to write on sunday afternoon that this thing was not necessarily dead. the mar gyp gin is tiny. susan collins is going to be impossible. we don't know where rand paul
is, so by no means a done deal but it looks possible. >> rand paul has to be nowhere near this thing if you don't know what it is. he clearly wants something else. megan, what's fallout if it fails? >> i think we're not yet there. i'm amazed how this has even resurrected that we've got on the point as jonathan was saying. the odd are tough and here's why. a straight repeal without a replace, that's 32 million people without insurance by 2026. >> a win for the president he wants a win. >> here's the issue. this bill is incredibly unpopular. that's why they lacked the leverage throughout. that's why mcconnell's legislative genius has in the shone through on this process. i'm watching rob portman. susan collins will be a straight no. rand paul, difficult to see where he stands. what we're looking at probably is a stripped-down version of this bill that goes through several amendments, but let's be clear here. this is unbelievable in so many aspects. as kasie was saying they are
going to a floor to vote on something they don't even know yet, we don't know yet a what they're voting on, on something that is, let's remind people, one-sixth of the u.s. economy. tens of millions of people who rely on this health care. an entire group system of insurance. premiums. how people actually pay for elderly care, care for sick children. the most disadvantaged people in our country on medicaid. this is no trivial matter. we are dealing with a situation truly unprecedented. sometimes i think in all the craziness we forget this. it's an economic issue, a moral issue. >> given how complicated it is, why is voting yes a win for republicans if so many people's lives could be at risk here? many americans don't care what you call their health care. they just want health care. >> because they want to feel like they're doing something, even if it's dangerous, even if it's problematic, even if it's stupid, even if it will hurt them long term. some of this is just about ego. look, i have to be honest pap lot of people were talking about how great it is for mccain to
come back. he's a tough guy, a war hero. those are all wonderful. >> i'm just glad the presiden s e's now acknowledging that. >> exactly. last time he said he was captured, it doesn't count. this is a guy who's benefiting from excellent health care now coming back to take health care away from people. jimmy carter had brain cancer, he came back to work for habitat for humanity, teach sunday school. this is not a knot the action of a hero. it's the action of an ideologue. this entire republican party should think strng strongly about what they're doing, who they'll make suffer. >> jimmy carter 90 years ago working for habitat for humanity a week ago, went to the hospital for dehydration and came back to the house they're building. we have to talk about the boy scouts for a moment. yesterday, last night, when the president was speaking at the boy scout jamboree, he had a few moments to talk health care and specifically hhs secretary tom price has someone he chose. listen to this. >> who the hell wants to speak about politics when i'm in front
of the boy scouts? right? you know, i go to washington, in fact, today i said we oug to change it from the word swamp to the word cesspool. fake news. fake media. do you remember that famous night on television november 8th? we could use some more loyalty, i will tell you that. did president obama ever come to a jamboree? >> president trump, president obama was a boy scout. boy scout who don't use the words hell or cesspool but who represent being trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient, cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean, and reverent. jonathan swan, what was the president doing here? how is anthony scaramucci spiping this one? scaramucci, who yesterday on twitter said that the daily beast owed the president an apology for the reprehensible things they said. how about what the president said to the boy scouts of
america? >> well, i think the daily beast does owe the president an apology. they called sarah huckabee sanders a drag queen or something. anyway, i thought that was reprehensible. >> yes. >> on the boy scout thing, i don't think donald trump is capable of adapting his rhetoric to a sort of -- >> should we laugh about that? at the end of the day -- >> i'm just saying -- >> respect couldn't be more respect in our culture. these are our children. >> i'm not making a defense of donald trump. i'm just saying we have seen, you know, in his two years in public life now no ability to moderate his rhetoric in front of any audience. and that's just been consistent for the whole time we've seen him. >> stephanie, let's take a little bit of a counterintuitive one on this up with. these are 24,000 kids who are boy scouts, still call them kids. in the media, we forget when we have our outrage, we say i can't believe he spoke like this, we forget the cheering. there are people who love the
attitude he takes and that he seems to care nothing for the norms that we apply to people in this position. and that is something that he shows on the campaign trail and the media was late to pick up on it. another example of how he seems to get people cheering just because they're so shocked and surprised as to what he does. that is provinging to be of all the madness that surrounds this administration -- >> excitement and madness are one thing. you have to set the bar for the kid of our country. >> i couldn't agree more but we forget it at our peril. >> he can talk to the boy scouts. can't talk to the naacp up the street the same week. >> i agree jonathan the president owes the boy scouts of america an apology for speaking that way to those young boys. any minute now, jared kushner will arrive on the hill to be interviewed by the house intelligence committee. a member of that committee joins us next.
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the conversation is expected to focus solely on the meeting he attended with donald trump jr. and the russian attorney last summer. senator john mccain a great american, making a dramatic return to capitol hill today to vote on health care. the 80-year-old lawmaker has been recovering at home doing some hiking in arizona after being diagnosed with an aggressive form of brain cancer. and the house is expected to pass a bill today to strengthen sanctions against russia while limiting the president's power in lifting those sanctions without congressional approval. it is not clear whether the president will sign the new legislation. a tenth person has died after being smuggled into the united states in the back of an 18-wheeler truck in texas over the weekend. the 60-year-old driver says he had no idea dozens of undocumented immigrants were in the back of his truck. if convicted, he could face the death penalty. and the last killer whale born in captivity at seaworld has died at only 3 months old.
kiara was suffering from an infection at seaworld's san antonio park. we'll take you back to breaking news. kasie hunt said it, this is a day you don't want to miss. i'm not talking health care. i'm talking jared kushner, round two pack in the ring set to be interviewed today under oath before the house intelligence committee one day after facing questions from senate intelligence committee staffers. earlier i spoke with denny heck of washington state, a member of the house intelligence committee. congressman, big day on the hill. are you going to be in this meeting with jared kushner when he's interviewed by the house intelligence committee? >> i am, stephanie. >> what do you want to know from him? you've seen his statement. you've heard about everything that happened yesterday. what do you want to know? >> i guess i'd like to know how he can look the american public in the eye and either through himself or throw his lawyers maintain there's in collusion given the fact pattern here, that he had four meetings he
failed to report with various russians including with the russian ambassador, including with the ceo of a sanctioned russian bank, including with a russian government lawyer and money launderer. i guess i'd like to know why he thinks he can keep changing his security application, the standard form 86, not once, not twice but according to sources three times. how often does he think he can do this? frankly i think he feels like he's on one of his father-in-law's golf courses and gets a mulligan on every single hole. >> you have said that the campaign's involvement with russia goes far beyond collusion. his 11-page statement yesterday means nothing to you? >> his lawyer's 11-page statement yesterday substantially less given the fact that it represents yet another change in the position that he has taken, the position his brother-in-law don junior has taken, the position his father-in-law, the president, has taken. it changes with weather. it changes more often than the republican health care bill and just like that bill it gets worse every single time. >> congressman, that is some
tough aggressive talk. is that the kind of language jared's going to face today? >> well, he certainly this face it from some people because the fact of the matter is naivete is not a defense, it's an excuse, and incompetence is not a defense, it's an excuse, and he's used both repeatedly. he's even thrown his own staff under the bus over this matter, but that shouldn't surprise me given his role model is his father-in-law. >> speaking of his father-in-law, president trump unleashed another scathing tweet against his own chosen attorney general jeff sessions this morning and it looks like the president is definitely in the market for a new attorney general. if president trump fires sessions or sessions resigns, what kind of impact is that going to have on the russia investigation? >> we will be very, very close to what i have predicted we were heading toward all along, and that's a constitutional crisis. even inst of that i want to
remind people there are parts of this great republic that are working. the fact that we are having these hearings, the fact we are having this investigation, seeking to get at the truth, is a positive element. in fact, if you stop just for a second and think about what do we know today that we did not know six months ago it's an incredible amount. and when you stop to think that today on the floor of the house we will enact by overwhelming majority increased sanctions on russia, the system is working. >> do you think jeff sessions should quit? >> i don't think jeff sessions should have ever been the attorney general, stephanie. >> well, you didn't want him to begin with, your next best bet could be rudy giuliani. the president is clearly bullying him, terrorizing him via twitter. what do you think he should do? what would you do if you were jeff sessions? >> so, first of all, stephanie, in what world does that management style of shaming and bullying your own people, the people whose job it is to help you be successful -- >> none. >> -- work? >> none. >> i've had the privilege to lead organizations, some of
which were pretty large. i never found i could get more out of the people that i worked with by shaming them than i could by encouraging them and rewarding when they did good work. so i suppose the question you're asking is better the devil we know than the devil we don't. the truth of our matter is it's out of our control in any event and the president will do what he will do. as we have seen repeatedly, he has an orwellian impulse to create freedom out of slavery, ignorance out of strength and war out of peace, and who knows what it is he will say or do as he pursues this course of action. >> this is the world we're living in. wasn't long ago we were talking to our kids about no bullying and now look at twitter. thanks, congressman. i appreciate your time this morning. >> you're welcome, stephanie. any second now we are expecting jared kushner to arrive on capitol hill. we'll bring that to you live. he'll be facing some tough questions. up next, my favorite part of the show. money, power, politics. the improbable rise of the much,
anthony scaramucci, and why he's cleaning house in the west wing. before we go, markets opened and there you have it, up 129 to start the day. that might be a record for the s&p. ountry i came across this house with water dripping from the ceiling. you never know when something like this will happen. so let the geico insurance agency help you with homeowners insurance and protect yourself from things like fire, theft, or in this case, water damage. cannonball! now if i had to guess, i'd say somewhere upstairs there's a broken pipe. let the geico insurance agency help you with homeowners insurance. call today to see how much you could save.
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team. according to politico, he's planning to fire assistant press secretary micah short. nbc news is working to confirm that. cnbc's andrew ross sorkin and "the new york times" financial columnist wrote about anthony scaramucci in a new article. you and i have both known anthony for quite some time. is he the right fit for this white house? >> i mean, he is -- he fots perfectly, to a t. he is the wall street version of donald trump. when you think about somebody who is willing to speak only behalf of the president to effectively an audience of one, he''s not really talking to all of us, he's talking to the president when he stands up there, and we'll see whether he end up standing up there, big question. in terms of operating this office on behalf of the president, who else can speak the -- i mean, i don't know, do you see the hilarious video that's gone viral, the way he speaks, the way he talks -- >> "daily show," we aired it. exactly the same as the president. >> exactly.
>> president trump loves casting characters and anthony fits to a t. i'm not saying what america wants but what the president wants. when you said you don't know if he'll stand at the podium, he's a financier, he's a media guy. he said in the past i think to you he would have gone into media if it wasn't for the financial needs. he loves the camera. >> loves it. initially that is not the brief, but he may end up there. but, no, he represents everything -- look, he's a comeback story. righting? which is sort of a trumpian story. throughout his whole career, you know, he's had all thee sort of setbacks which then he's found a way to resolve. nobody ever thought he was -- a week ago people thought -- and he said it to me yesterday in the paper. he said i was left for dead on the street, which was true, and now i'm headed towards air force one and he literally was walking to air force one yesterday afternoon. >> what does it say to anthony's credibility when he goes up there and says reince priebus, i offered him a job, he's like my brother, i love him? he was left dead on the street
at the hand of reince priebus. reince and sooef steve bannon were blocking anthony from getting in the building. can they work together? or is anthony there for reince's job? >> there will be an intramural -- more than a squabble, a battle. might even be "game of thrones." we'll see what ends up happening. i would never count anthony out. i would argue that anthony will ultimately win that story when it's all over. >> he is an extraordinary salesman. so much so that selling sky bridge to the chinese, there were ethics questions around it. >> there still are. it hasn't closed yet. it could get complicated. >> that is an industry we saw blow up in the last five years. people going, why are we going to pay you to invest in someone else? the deal hasn't closed. it's selling at two times the price most thought it would, somewhat reminiscent of trump selling a pooesm property for exorbitant price to the russians. is that deal going to trip him snum. >> i think there is this large overhang about why is h&a buying
this company and paying that price. and is there some kind of influence peddling? i actually happen to think that's not the case but i'm sure we'll be talking a lot about it and will it trip it up? i'm going to bet no. >> the much, is he going to be tough for the press corps? eventually, sean spicer, he became a bit of a punching bag, a pincushion. anthony won't. he's a tough guy. >> here's the conundrum. anybody who's in that job has two problems. one is the press is after them to begin with because that is our job. and it's even more complicated, if you will, because the president is going to say things that are not going to be what the much is saying. or that the much is not going to necessarily agree with. one of the things i thought was fascinating. in his honesty yesterday when i was on the phone with him, he said, look, i subordinate my views to the view of president. my views are irrelevant. what i think doesn't matter. and that's a very interesting approach because most people don't say that.
>> most people don't say that, but, i mean, he is there to serve his country and work for the president. anthony can accept he didn't get elected, the president did. sfa but most people don't say whatever i think doesn't matter. they want to have a view, a seat at the table. anyway, he's got his seat at the table and we'll see where it goes. >> andrew ross sorkin, most people aren't the much. >> most people are not. >> a very special individual. before we go, he could have taken ambassador, he was going to paris over the summer. why would he want to do this after he sees so many guys get their credibility hijacked by the president? >> because if you're an ambassador, it doesn't take you anywhere. this guy's still on the train. and not just on the trump train. we're going to be talking -- the much wants to be talked about in 2020 and beyond whether he becomes a politician, whether he becomes a media star. that's where this is all going. >> all right. i don't know. i think to be ambassador to italy, that would make for a nice summer. >> not dismissing i.
>> i want to go in this climate, i would go with ambassadorship. but you know what, i'm not the much. andrew, pleasure to see you. >> great to see you. >> we are waiting, you know who for, jared kushner, to arrive on capitol hill. he will be interviewed by the house intelligence committee arriving any second. stay with us. i was playing golf days ago... love golf. i used to love golf. wait, what, what happened? i was having a good round, and then my friend, sheila, right as i was stepping into the tee box mentioned a tip a pro gave her. no. yep.
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welcome back. i'm stephanie ruhle. we're just minutes away from jared kushner arriving on capitol hill. arriving on capitl today. he was here before the house intelligence committee. this time under oath, joining me now two ms nbc analysts, ned price and former chief spokesman for the justice department, ned miller. ned, to you first, this just in, the senate judiciary committee subpoenaed paul manafort what do they want from him? >> reporter: stephanie, i think they want to take a close look at his financial dealings, we we heard for months, he was doing business with a pro russia candidate in ukraine and he was indebted to the sum of some $17 million to this pro-russia party, the question is, was there a price compacted for that sum, if it was exacted manifest
it in itself for example changing the republican platform at the republican national committee last summer. >> what's your take on this step? matt, excuse me. >> on the subpoena for? >> manafort? >> i think there are a lot of questions they have to get to the cottom do. ned mentioned about his financial dealings, also, remember, manafort attended this meeting at trump tower last fall, jared kushner we assume was questioned about yesterday, it's a very important question for paul manafort as well, why was he there? what did he think was the follow-up afterwards? >> manafor. he has been in politics for decades, we all read jared kushner's statement, very well prepared. he answered some questions for you, what, did that leave any holes for members of congress today to asking questions? >> well, it certainly did, stephanie, there is an addage in this town, it's not the crime,
it's the cover-up. if jared kushner wants us to believe that there was no crime that this was a function of his naive they, inexperience, my question for him, the question i hope he is asked behind closed doors is, why is there a coverup? for months we we heard from the trump campaign and most recently the trump white house, no, no, no, there were no meetings with russians, this is fake news, this is our democratic opponents trying to bring us down only within recent months, weeks, in fact, to be told, sure, there were these meeting itself, it wasn't collusion, it wasn't criminal, it was the result of our inexperience, the two cannot be, cannot co-exist, that there was no crime, yesterday, there was a cover judgment. >> matt, was there a crime? the "wall street journal" says president trump if this hangs over you your presidency will go nowhere. is transparency the issue here? >>. >> reporter: it might be.
look, there is a reason, sned right, there is this old adage, it's not the crime, it's the coverup. a lot of reasons people cover things up. that's because getting it all out, being transparent would be fatal. look, if there are underlying crimes that donald trump knows about or things that are criminal acts, such gross abuse of power they would lead to his impeachment from office, he is everycoing it up,ed a bass as id looks as painful as it is is worse than the alternative. that's why these investigations have to go forward independently and why people on the hill and people elsewhere will be pushing back on the president's attempts to meddle with him. >> all right. from gross abuse of power to gross and abusive bebehavior. can you speak for a moment about the president tweet attacking, rolling his eyes, going after jeff sessions, what gives here? ned. >> reporter: well, what the president clearly is trying to do is to bully the attorney general into submission to try and make it so that he does not
have to fire him that jeff session will resign on his own volition. look, this may be unpopular, but i hope jeff sessions has strength and fortitude and does not resign, because we know this president will fire jeff sessions, we know he is incensed about his unavoidable ziegs i decision to recuse himself. i think the american people need to see the president fire the attorney general for the proper actions he has taken by recusing himself, that would be a powerful signal, much more powerful than the attorney general resigning in submission. >> is that the president's goal to get jeff sessions to resign, isn't he taking the absolute wrong approach? when someone bullies you in front of the entire world, taking it and then slinking away is the worst thing you can do. standing up to a bully gets you some respect. it's amazing, you hear people that fought against jeff sessions for months and months,
now telling the guy to hang too snit. >> you are absolutely right. since we seen since the bullying started last wednesday when the president held this interview with the "new york times," he has kind of slumping away, thursday and friday last week he held a press conference and gave a speech, he was honored to serve at president trump's direction and looked forward to continuing to do so as long as he could. look, what he needs to do is stand up for himself, more importantly, stand up for the department of justice, stand up for the mission the career men and women that work there. i think he would get a lot of respect from people at the department or across the isle, if he said, look, mr. president, i swore to the constitution, i said i would uphold the rule of law the rules requirely recuse mooifls myself, as long as i am the attorney general, butt out of our independent authority to decide who we investigate. it's none of your business. if he did that, he'd get a lot of respect. >> i don't know if i agree with you. i don't know if he slumping away, silence when the president
goes after sui deadly. surely the president likes a reaction. all right, guys, i know you will have a busy day watching jared kushner, we will take a break waiting for mr. kushner to arrive on capitol hill. stay with us. so that's the idea. what do you think? hate to play devil's advocate but... i kind of feel like it's a game changer. i wouldn't go that far. are you there? he's probably on mute. yeah... gary won't like it. why? because he's gary. (phone ringing) what? keep going! yeah... (laughs) (voice on phone) it's not millennial enough. there are a lot of ways to say no.
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senate side. he is headed again to go talk with house intelligence committee investigators, voluntarily and again a little bit different here, under oath this time as we expect to see him walk down this hallway any moment. kushner didn't say much over the last 24 hours, at least on capitol hill about this. although he did make those comments on the driveway of the white house as we see kushner here, i'm looking to see if it's his lawyer with him again, kushner saying he did not collude, definitive, standing in the west wing after that first discussion with senate intelligence committee staffers. we are watching him head in, casey hunt, pull up your audible, what will you be looking from kushner, potentially comments at the white house, we we heard from him yesterday, we will see if he answers shouted questions from reporters rovt. >> reporter: forgive me, i'm