if the last 12 hours is any indication, he may want to. he told "washington post" overnight no reason why any of his staffers past or present needs to talk to congress. that was followed by the new reporting on the right of your screen. something the president apparently doesn't want to talk about. potential election interference in 2020 with the chief of staff this morning pushing back hard. we have our team of reporters and analysts covering all of this from across the country. this story and many others we're covering in the next 60 minutes. let me start with my colleague kristen wellker ker, barbara mc and former u.s. attorney and a.b. stoddard and columnist for "real clear politics" and nancy cook white house reporter for politico. kristen, i'll start with you and this new reporting that kirstjen nielsen trying to get on the president's radar, but nick mulvaney said it wasn't a great

subject and should be kept below president trump's level and now mulvaney is responding, kristen. >> he is responding on the record, hallie. this is a swift response and to get something like this on the record so quickly doesn't happen every day. this is what he is saying this morning as he is pushing back. i don't recall anything along those lines happening in any meeting but unlike the obama administration who knew about russian actions in 2014 and did nothing, the trump administration will not tolerate foreign interference in our election and we've taken steps to prevent it. the former obama administration did take some steps and obama pushed putin directly and slapped sanctions on russia. the trump administration says they have had a robust response and interagency push to really shore up and strengthen the infrastructure of elections at the state and local levels. you know, president trump signed that executive order,

essentially threatening war sanctions against any country that attempts to meddle in future elections. but critics would argue, look, it doesn't go far enough and they want to hear president trump get tougher on this subject himself. now, as you point out, he's going to be departing within the hour, so, we're going to put all these questions to him, including, hallie, just how many meetings have there been as we're 18 months out from the election. >> i want to bring charlie in on this. i know you reported a lot in and around this topic. what is your reaction that you're hearing from the white house this morning? >> well, it's true that rank and file sort of career professional staff especially from department of homeland security have been trying earnestly to help state and local election officials and prove their cybersecurity and sort of be on track. i think that it's the political interest that people are saying, don't talk to trump about this,

he doesn't want to hear about it, et cetera. shows two years into this, these dynamics that have been so remarkable throughout this presidency continue. >> a.b., the reason the president doesn't want to uctaaboucta talk about this because he sees questions about his own legitimacy. >> right. that's the way it's discussed around the west week and the president. but if you look at the comments from rudy giuliani and jared kushner in the last few days they are literally all but welcoming from anyone who wants to get in the game because they're making clear, this is no big deal. it's just absolutely no big deal to the trump white house. it's not something this quote from nick mulvaney is the first one that we have heard of anyone really pushing back and saying we're making a robust effort to try to mitigate this threat in 2020 election. what we've been told is -- >> we didn't have that briefing last year with top officials and intelligence officials warned

about russian interference and administration. >> they have warned us about how potent the threat is and their active measures. they have not told us how robust their threat is. dhs is basically the walking dead around there. i can tell you right now simon rosenberg spear headed the effort for congressional democrats in the mid-term elections without any help from this government. he did it with social mead i aplatforms. no one from dhs was involved. >> nancy, dhs and doj will talk about how they worked on things on the state and local level to try to make sure those infrastructure pieces are shored up but to a.b.'s point here, the criticism is a lack of leadership from the top. that this starts at the top. the president is not doing enough. when you have this reporting that he has questions about his legitimacy which is a concern for him as it relates to russian interference, how do you see it building out as you cover this every day? >> what we see happening so often with this white house is

the president takes everything so personally and separate threats. he was concerned the russia investigation was actually a threat to his presidency, you know now that the mueller report is behind us, at least the release of it is, you would expect the white house and also the agencies to turn towards protecting the election in 2020. but the president sort of can't separate out what he views as a threat to his own presidency from sort of just a larger threat to the country. >> one of the things that he may see is a threat to his presidency are these investigations from congress. at the moment, staffers needs that see this as a political nuisance more than anything else. called up the friend of our show bob costa oe aa smartly asked him aand the president made the argument to "the post" hey, i cooperated plenty with robert mueller.

what do i have to cooperate with congress for? i was so transparent and his aides testified for so many hours and they have all that information that has been given. how are you seeing it playing out in the white house this morning? >> the white house increasingly defiant. we just spoke with kellyanne conway who just reiterated what you said from the president. to observe executive privilege over some of the requests, including a request for former white house counsel don mcgahn to testify on capitol hill. he indicated that had not been made yet. this is the president's tweet while we have been on the air. no collusion, . so what is he referencing? remember, the early legal strategy here at the white house and for the president's legal team was to turn over as many documents as mueller requested. and was to make his officials available to testify if that was

inessa necessary, as well. the president never answered questions for robert mueller and democrats feel there were a lot of unanswered questions in the mueller report. so, this continues to heat up. here's another tweet from the president, hallie. the mueller report written by trump haters and unlimited money behind it didn't land a glove on me. i did nothing wrong. if the partisan dems ever tried to impeach. big question mark there. how does the supreme court intervene in an impeachment hearing? not clear that that would actually happen. we're trying to drill down on there. no precedent for that happening, at least as far as we're aware. >> as far as civics. rudy giuliani is not involved in that piece of it, but he is giving his client some back up on what he's trying to do. here's what giuliani said this morning over on fox. >> i wouldn't give him a thing. i'd make him go to court and justify their investigation.

i don't think they can. >> barbara, is that a smart, legal strategy? put yourself in the shoes of the president's attorneys in and out of the white house. if you were representing the president, is this what you would do? >> well, you know, when you're representing the president, you have to think of it both from the legal perspective and from the political perspective. legally, i don't think it's a very sound argument at all. he is suggesting, i think, that he can stop the production of documents and stop the testimony of witnesses by asserting the executive privilege. but in many instances, that has already been waived by sharing information with robert mueller who has shared it with the public and all those matters are waived and courts are very loathe to allow the assertion of executive privilege for only parts of the conversation. the whole point of executive privilege is to encourage candor in conversations. so, once part of a subject is out in the public domain, you can't then come in selectively and say, we're okay with you knowing part of that conversation but not this part of the conversation. that doesn't go to the

underlying reason of protecting candor. it just looks like it's the executive using it as a shield to hide behind. so, i don't think it has much legal weight and i suppose politically other considerations about avoiding damaging disclosures. >> so, it's interesting, barbara, you're making a point that some in congress are making, including jerry nadler. the time for the white house to go and exert political privilege and it sound like there is some legitimacy to that argument there. >> absolutely. other matters for which they can exert executive privilege and you can't do it in a blanket way. you can't simply say don mcgahn won't come testify period. you have to do it on a question by question basis. anything in the public domain based on the mueller report is fair game and anything within the same subject matters is fair game. and if they want to ask other questions, they can. but then it's up to the president to affirmly assert executive privilege on a question by question basis. >> charlie, it sounds like one

of the people who has been subpoenaed. there is a whole list of things that the white house is stonewalling on here, if you will. the subpoena to don mcgahn, tbd perica per kellyanne conway this morning and they're now suing congress and the list goes on. it sounds like on the mcgahn piece, he doesn't want to testify. the washington post said he doesn't want to be in contempt of congress or his legal or ethic ethical. what to you think of that? >> he wants to fade into the sunset and not become the enemy of the trump white house. he has gotten out of the white house somewhat with his reputation in tact and especially as a hero to the right wing conservative legal movement for all putting all the conservative judges on the bench. and now he is in a tight spot. i agree with the earlier

analysis. the fact that trump waived executive privilege and attorney/client privilege to let him talk to mueller and then trump delegated that to barr for the purpose of deciding what to make public in the mueller report and barr basically put it all out there. so, it's going to be very hard for the white house to say that they have any hook here to keep him from testifying about stuff that the executive branch has made public already. hallie. >> while we've been on the air here, the president has tweeted. i don't know if he's watching our show or not, but i didn't call bob costa of "washington post." he called me and returned his call. he said just more fake news. so, mr. president, if you're watching, noted on that front although clearly somebody picked up the phone and called somebody else and it sound like you were a part of that. we'll leave it there. nancy and a.b., stick around. a lot more to come this morning, including the first democrat in that crowd of 2020 primary field. former congressman john delaney joining us on set with reaction to what we just talked about and

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so, with "new york times "reporting this morning that dhs secretary nielsen not bring up

with the president. so nielsen eventually gave up on her effort while intel community warned that 2020 election will be targeted. the president and some around him don't seem to be all that worried as you saw live with jared kushner on this show yesterday. >> i think the investigations and all of the speculation that happened for the last two years has had a much harsh, impact on democracy than a couple facebook ads. >> joining me on set now former democratic congressman and 2020 presidential candidate john delaney. congressman, thank you so much for being here. >> great to be here. >> let me start out with what you just heard. >> not fulfilling his responsibilities as commander in chief. keep the american people safe. how those threats are defined vary but, clearly, a cyberattack from a foreigned ed ed adversae

president is largely shrugging his shoulders and ignoring it. >> the administration talking about its efforts on dhs and the attack on russian troll and those are things that happened. >> and the tone at the top matters. so, if the president doesn't want this brought up in his presence because he views it in some sort of insecure way that it's questioning the validity of his election, that doesn't send the right tone at the top to the team that is supposed to be executing against protecting the united states of america against these threats. >> you are laying out a new policy proposal that would create a new agency. the department of cybersecurity. talk about why that's better than an inner agency solution. some critics say why create more red tape and layers here when you have agencies in place who are equipped to deal with this. >> we need a coordinated strategy. this is the difference between myself and the current president. he is acting like this is not an issue and i want to elevate this

threat to a cabinet level position and we're in the best position to deal with what everyone acknowledges is going to go a growing threat on our nation, our government and the private sector to some extent. a coordinated strategy will allow for best practices. >> creating a whole agency when you could put in place a cybersecurity czar to coordinate and oversee that? >> terrific when we had a specific issue that we needed intervention. ron was brought in and we responded well to that threat and it subsided. i don't think, unfortunately, this cyberthreat is going away. i think this is an enduring challenge for this country and when we need to make sure we're bringing our a-game to the table and the best way to do that as president is to have one of your most senior advisors in a permanent cabinet position there

in every discussion talking about what we should be doing. >> the president told "the washington post" no reason his current or former white house aides should talk to congress. how the president defies requests from house democrats. you served, you know this body. how far should house democrats take this? >> they should get the information they need. look, if there is one word that has defined this president from the beginning, in my judgment, lawless. he doesn't think the laws apply to him. and this is just another example in many ways, right. congress has subpoena power. they're going to use it and get the information, they believe they need to do as part of their oversight responsibilities and the president is, obviously, not going to comply. this will end up in court. >> you just described the president in your view as lawless, yet you have not joined your democratic competitors in calling for impeachment. you suggest it should be settled at the ballot box. political reasons because

congress' duty and do you worry there is a split, a disconnect between calling this president lawless and stopping short of impeachment. >> impeachment is a political process. when a significant majority of the american people want a president removed, the congress has the ability to do it. i'm all for the congress pursuing the investigations it needs to do to get to the truth. do i think the president committed impeachable offenses? yes. he's running a hotel where we know foreign governments are booking rooms. >> that is being worked out in court right now. >> i'm a plaintiff on that case. clearly, i believe he's committed or done actions that are impeachable. but whether it's the right thing to do or not is really up to the congress once they finish their investigations. so, that's kind of where i stand on that. >> let's talk about your campaign. the first democrat to enter the race. you now have a lot of friends in the field. >> i thought i would clear the field. >> let's talk about fund-raising. you did raise a lot of money. $12 million but that includes a

loan from yourself of 11.7. there is a lot less than any of the other candidates. 404,000. so, a couple questions on this. number one, democratic debates have a threshold of 75,000 unique donors. are you there? >> the way the debates work, that's right. we're working on getting to 65,000. but we've made it based on the polling. you know, we had a very big presence in iowa. i've done 26 trips to iowa and eight offices open and i've already been endorsed by four county chairs out of the 99 counties. no other candidate has any endorsement from any county chairs in iowa. we're doing well in the early states which has been our strategy from the beginning. >> are you worried about the big name jumping into the race tomorrow. how will he affect your can candidacy? >> i think we need a big debate about the right direction of the country. i believe i have the best ideas. i believe i'm the best person to

bring this terribly divided nation back together again and i believe, most importantly, i'm the best person to beat president trump. >> congressman john delaney, thank you for coming on the show. appreciate it. coming up next, his old boss saw record-breaking fund-raising numbers but can joe biden do the same when he gets to 2020? campaign cash machine ed rendell joins us next as we keep an eye on the white house. president trump getting ready to leave in just about 15, 20 minutes for atlanta. let's see if he has something to say on his way out the door. we'll show you live. you might take something for your heart... or joints. but do you take something for your brain. with an ingredient originally discovered in jellyfish, prevagen has been shown in clinical trials to improve short-term memory. prevagen. healthier brain. better life.

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>> today yet another democrat joins the race for president. this time it's senator joseph biden of delaware. >> that was then. 1988 and also now the former vice president joe biden hoping the third run is the charm the day before he makes it official. biden will announce his campaign with a rollout video tomorrow. then next week a rally in pennsylvania a visit followed by key early voting states and his entry means a familiar face will get fresh scrutiny, especially when it comes to his record over three decades in the senate. that includes his vote on a 1986 gun bill the nra called the law that saved gun rights in

america. it let dealers sell rifles, shotguns and ammunition through the mail and eventually the internet. biden will also face questions about his vote to authorize the iraq war and handling of the confirmation hearings for justice clearance thomas. in addition to issues that might work more in his favor in the primary. the support of violence against women act and support of same-sex marriage, too. joining me from philadelphia is the former mayor, ed rendell a a.b. stoddard and nancy cook with politico, as well. thank you for coming on. >> my pleasure. >> have you talked to joe biden recently? how is he feeling about tomorrow? what can you tell us? >> i think he's anxious to get started. he believes that the country desperately needs change and he believes he's the best person to not only defeat donald trump, but be president. the wealth of experience he has is unmatched.

30 plus years in the senate judiciary committee chair, foreign relations, vice president of the united states, perhaps the best training ground. working shoulder and shoulder with president obama. so, he's anxious to get started. >> let me talk to you a little bit about the strategy here of this rollout. video tomorrow and first rally is not until monday. what is up with that long weekend in between. are you wondered that might blunt some of the momentum he might get from making his big announcement? >> no, i think that's basically inside baseball. >> viewers like to hear it, i'm asking you. >> but when american voters go to the polls in february of next year the first caucus, no one is going to be thinking about a rollout. they're going to be thinking about what the person has done in their career, the level of experience, the qualities they have and the campaign that they've run. so, i don't think, i'm not on the inside. i don't know what the strategy was, but i do know that joe

biden is going to run a good campaign and he's got great credentials and the american people know he is a decent, honorable man in contrast to the president and they know he gets things done and work with republicans. that's exactly what we want. >> to get to february, as you're sort of talking about here, governor. the former vice president will, obviously, need money to play in this race. that's just sort of a fact of the case. i know you're helping to organize a fund-raiser for him and on the topic of fund-raising, "new york times" points out that joe biden reports at zero dollars and take his raising $100,000 every day to christmas just to match what senator bernie sanders had banked at the start of april. that is an uphill climb for you and others who are fund-raising for the former vp. do you see him able to catch up or is this going to be a concern for him? >> no, i think he'll catch up easily. on my way down to the studio today i got a call from someone who complained he didn't get an invitation to the fund-raiser. i have been raising money for 42 years and i never had somebody

complain they didn't get an invitation to a fund-raiser. a wealth of good will around the country. he will raise the money he needs. remember in that 16-person republican field, donald trump didn't raise a lot of money during the primaries. because the coverage is so intense, you don't need money like you do in other elections. joe will have every dollar he needs to get his message across. >> do you think he will have the coverage that he needs then talking about joe biden, is that what you're saying? >> oh, absolutely. you know, he's a known quantity to the american people and they know his strengths and his character and he is going to have more than enough resources to run a very vigorous campaign. >> let's talk policy, governor. the former vice president is, in effect, looking it seems to run as a kind of third term former president barack obama. he does have a more moderate stance than some of the more progressive people he is going up against and that is something that caught the attention of potential republican opponents and allies of president trump,

right? like rush limbaugh. i want to play for you what he said on his radio show about joe biden. watch. >> joe biden is probably the best chance they've got and he doesn't have a chance. they're probably, joe biden and crazy bernie and mayor pete. we get three white guys and that isn't going to sit well with the rest of this party which has gone so far left. >> should know here that limbaugh golfed with the president over the weekend. tbd whether joe biden came up or not. that is a reflection on what some on the right are saying. is that a concern on your part that biden is out of step of where his party is going in the primary? >> no. i think the polls show that the vast majority of democratic voters are still moderate, left or center which is where joe biden is. joe biden not considered a progressive. he was one of the first high-level public officials to

speak out in favor of gay marriage. legalizing gay marriage. his views are tough but he is moderate in the sense that he believes government has to work and has to be able to afford all the programs that we put on the table. and i think that is going to be tough. it's going to be tough for donald trump to call joe biden and the democratic party led by joe biden socialists. and donald trump's weapon is to take attention away from his future director and scare the american people that we're going to bring socialism to washington. he can do that maybe with some of our other candidates, but he sure as heck can't do it with joe biden. >> i want to let a.b. jump in here. >> if joe biden was the nominee the way they refer to him and the election was tomorrow, he would beat donald trump pretty handily. >> nancy? >> i think that biden has a huge record, which is an asset

because he can build himself on experience but also a lot of things that will be his position on guns and how he handled the anita hill hearings. a lot there and that will be drudged up. >> governor ed rendell, thank you for joining us. eagle season starts soon. so, thanks. who is not under investigation at the interior department with a bunch of high-ranking trump employees. it is your wednesday edition of swamp watch live from washington. rom washington like my bike, and my calves. liberty mutual customizes your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ when i needed to create a better visitor experience.

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so, any minute now president trump will be leaving this building, the white house. he's heading to atlanta. he's going to hop on marine one and head south to talk about the opioid epidemic. comes as a distributor of prescription drugs and its former executives are facing criminal drug trafficking charges. guys, these are charges that we usually see against street dealers and cartel king pins but this time larry doud the former ceo of one of the biggest distributors in the country let his company distribute opioid pain killers even though they were red flagged, being illegally distributed. it's a case that kelly o'donnell will watch, as well. she is in atlanta ahead of that opioid summit. what do we expect from the president and the first lady today? >> one of the things that is interesting, hallie. we will hear from the president and the first lady at this

event. they expect 3,000 to fill this ball room and some attendees are getting their seats behind us and part of where this issue is different in some of the typical trump white house era brings policy and to some degree politics. because this opioid addiction crisis hits a number of states that are always pivotal in presidential elections and also is a chance for the president to try to do some governing that is bipartisan in that this issue brings together sometimes unlikely political friends and allies. and it has been one of the issues that the first lady has attached herself to to try to deal with this issue. so they'll be talk about what they claim is the progress this administration has made for what is a very difficult, difficult problem. and, so, it will be unusual to see the two of them here addressing this crowd together. hallie. >> really interesting. the president and the first lady have talked a lot about opioid and one thing the president also

talks about as we talk about his plane air force wuns and getting ready to head down. lester holt had the first interview with kevin mcaleenan and made news on family separation saying the policy is not on the table and said this, kelly. watch. >> but in your view, did family separation work even if it was ugly publicly sph. >> it does have a consequence and does deter behavior, but it did not work if you lose the public trust. if you can't maintain an initiative from the enforcement perspect sk, it's not worth it. >> kelly, an interesting admission that that policy was not the most effective? >> very notable. if the opioid crisis brings people together, immigration is one that puts up a lot of barriers between parties and sets off a lot of emotions. this is important when you consider any sort of break from the president's kind of policy history here.

plus, kevin mcaleenan at some point. he points out the president says that he no longer wants this policy. kind of a confusing history here about whether the president thought that was strong enforcement at a time and whether it was the political pressure brought to bear on the president to end that policy. he now has the hot seat, kevin mcaleenan and one that kirstjen n n nielsen knew very well. >> we'll see what the president has to say on his way. kelly, thank you. also this morning, we are on swamp watch and today the interior department because the "washington post" reports six of president trump's appointees at the agency are under investigation. this is a new inquiry led by the department's office of the inspector general looking whether they violated federal ethics rules by engaging on department-related business. in other words, offering agency access to former employees or

lobbying client. let's bring in one of the reporters who broke that story for "washington post." thank you very much for being on with us. >> hallie, thanks for having meehan o. >> let's start with the six officials and the highest ranking official in the complaint is named doug domenech. >> he had been an employee at a texas-based conservative think tank before joining the trump administration. now, after he joined the trump administration, he had some conversations with his former employer about two lawsuits that the conservative think tank had filed against the federal government concerning endangered specaries and a property issue. that is a specific issue that according to the president trump's own ethics rules, he may have violated them by talking. >> right. >> yeah. >> no, you make a point.

the president signed the executive order that does require these appointees to recuse themselves from anything that involves their former employers or clients. what is the status of that order? is it still valid? what is yourert reporting tell you? >> that order is still in effect. one of president trump's first executive order when he entered office and what presidents put in place when they come in. what we're seeing here is six interior department officials potentially violating that order. it's going to be up to the watchdog agency within the interior department, the inspector general to really figure out whether or not these contacts that have been found in different calendars and other documents released really constitute a violation. but there is enough there for them to look into it. >> so, we, i know it is your first time on our show. we're so grateful. we often do swamp wamp atch and

was on the interior department and looking into secretary david burnhart it was open just five days after he was confirmed to that post by congress. tell us the status of that and whether you see something systemic happening or if this is something par for the course based on what you know you heard? >> well, the critics of the administration, including many environmental groups think this is a problem. as you know, president trump on the campaign trail promised over and over again to drain the swamp of special interests and what we see here is a number of former lobbyists have taken high-level positions within the department. as for the status of the probe into david burnhart that very top official at the department, that is still ongoing. it will probably take months to complete and for them to come to some sort of conclusion. >> dino of "washington post." thank you for coming on the

show. appreciate it. the new push on capitol hill to hold mark zuckerberg personally libel for violating your privacy. you're watching m, snbc. snbc what do you have there? p3 it's meat, cheese and nuts. i keep my protein interesting. oh yea, me too. i have cheese and uh these herbs. p3 snacks. the more interesting way to get your protein. you get the freedom of what a 7-day return policy.

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congress has to do its job and hold him accountable. please call them at this number. tell them to get going.

>> because our media is so dishonest, a lot of it, the main stream. a lot of it. they don't report the facts. >> i think that google and facebook and twitter, i think they treat conservatives and republicans very unfairly. twitter, right. the president's favorite platform and punching bag and its ceo got an earful when he sat down for a private oval office meeting. shared a picture where else but on twitter with jack dorsy. said he was looking forward to keeping an open dialogue. what are the details of that dialogue? the president's follower count, according to "washington post" reporting a significant portion of the meeting focused on the president's concerns that twitter quietly and deliberately has quietly removed some of his followers. developments and republicans in congress threaten to slap regulations on big social media

companies like twitter and facebook even though they have different reasons for doing so. tony ramos and msnbc technology contributor and a.b. stoddard and nancy cook are back with me. tony, you're writing about this meeting. what did jack dorsey say when the president said you're messing with my 6.5 million followers. >> trying to clean up its act. we should look at what trump accused twitter of doing here. he and a lot of conservatives have said for a long time that their follower counts tend to change. they tend to go down sometimes without any apparent reason as to why. president trump has repeatedly tweeted this accusation that twitter and its peers and social media are bias against xerveatixerve ati conservatives. but the message that jack brought up yesterday is this is because the company is trying to combat spam. a lot of bad accounts on twitter that are operated by shady actors. a lot of them are bots and automated and not real people.

when twitter takes action against those, follower counts change. jack said he has been affected by this. >> sent out this time, thank you for your time. the time. twitter is here to serve the entire public conversation and we intend to make it healthier and more civil. thanks for the discussion about that. that was dorsey's incentive to hold the meeting in the first place? it seems it hasn't sat well with some in silicon valley. >> dorsey was summoned by the president, himself, to have this meeting, according to twitter which said the meeting spanned more than just the president's tweets. they talked about things like the 2020 election and efforts to combat opioids. for twitter and some of its peers they have to engage this white house because of the things the president has said and the regulation he has threatened in response to these allegations that tech companies are biased against conservatives. we saw this play out on capitol hill just a few weeks ago when senator ted cruz held a hearing, specifically to grill tech companies on these allegations that they're biased against

conservatives. so the stakes are high. there might be criticism in san francisco for dorsey sitting down with the president, but they have to sit down, otherwise they could face regulation. >> let's talk about that regulation. you're also writing about facebook and that meeting, senate finance committee member ron widen sending a letter to the federal trade commissioning. he says, quote, given mark zuckerberg's deceptive statements, personal control over facebook and his role relating to key decisions with sharing data they must hold mr. zuckerberg personally responsible for these continued violations. that's interesting. any response from zuckerberg? have they shown any sign they'll come down harder on silicon valley here? >> there is a lot of pressure on the federal government to hold facebook accountable for its privacy mishaps over the last few years. the agency is actively investigating right now for some of the misdeeds and it could be a settlement with the company that forces it to pay billions

in fines sources have told us. there's been this desire to target zuckerberg directly, to look at him for the statements he made about privacy and potentially impose fines or other penalties on him in the future if facebook continues to err with respect to its privacy policies. >> nancy, where do you see this going? >> i think it makes sense. i think what tony said makes so much sense that they feel these tech executives feel like they have to sit down with the president. the president has shown he has very strong views on very specific policy issues like tariffs and immigration, but on others he is very idiosyncrasy logically flexible and he could really switch his mind on how he views the tech companies acting based on pressure from congress, pressure from the base. so it makes sense they would want to sit down with him. >> there are a few things at play here. one is that congress is very interested in some kind of privacy regulation and so is the industry. in fairness to them the social media platforms are trying to get into a conversation with congress in order to have a law

that makes sense and one they can cooperate on. they don't want the european laws to become standard or the one passed by the state in california. they want a federal blanket law. they're trying to be at the table for that. they face very fierce critics like the senator from minnesota, a lot of people coming down on them. they are trying to stay at the table. the problem is that facebook is separated out as another sort of bad actor because of the things we've found out they've done knowingly. so that's separate from the conversation about regulation, about your privacy and your data. as the experts always tell us, there is still this complete lack of awareness from the consumer. there's no voter passion on this because they still think they're getting stuff for free. they think they're the customer. they don't know that they're the product. >> tony, that's a good point, right? >> yes. we see this play out in the ways consumers have reacted to scandals on facebook and other social media sites over the past two years. there's not been this massive exodus from some of these sites. i mean, you're seeing users

maybe leaving facebook but using instagram, which is owned by facebook. >> right. >> which, perhaps, suggests that maybe they're not acting on some of the things that we're pointing out in our reporting about the ways companies are using data. it certainly is resonating on capitol hill. that's why you're seeing the push for regulation. >> thank you for your perspective. next hour, has the president ever told her not to cooperate with an investigation since leaving the administration?

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you are looking live at airforce one fueled up ready for the quick flight down to atlanta. president trump was to be at joint base andrews about ten minutes ago and is running a little behind. our team is assembled waiting to ask questions if he takes them whenever he steps outside. we'll keep you posted on that and what our sources are saying. a.b., let's start with you. what are you hearing from your sources? >> we've all been talking this morning about the fact the administration is not only not prioritizing election interference in the 2020 election, you're not allowed to bring it up to the president. if you think republicans are home on a congressional recess for easter trying to come up with a way to talk about this next week after mueller found systemic and sweeping attacks from the russians on our elections you would be wrong. they think this is a washington story, a media story, their voters don't care, and they

don't think this affects them politically. they'll come back and say if there is a bill, fine, but it didn't affect the election. let's move on. >> nancy, what are you working on? >> i've been following what is going to happen with the release of trump's tax returns and how treasury and the irs are going to respond. >> right. they missed the deadline yesterday just to catch viewers up. i believe secretary mnuchin asked until may 6th. >> right. my reporting shows this is just another delay tactic. they really have no intention of releasing the president's tax returns and it is sort of a two-prong strategy now. one is to sort of keep delaying the request and putting it off. again and again with the hope that it extends through 2020. the other is to call these attacks very partisan. we've seen trump do that as well with a bunch of the congressional oversight and to say they don't need to release his tax returns because the intent of the request is somehow political and that makes them exempt. >> nancy cook from politico, a.b. stoddard, thanks you to both. really appreciate it. that does it for us this hour of

msnbc live. for now, much more with my colleague craig melvin up in new york. >> hey, always good to see you, hallie jackson. craig melvin here msnbc headquarters in new york city. a busy day on the road for president trump and the democratic presidential candidates. president trump heading to atlanta any moment now for a summit on opioids. he leaves behind, though, a massive fight over subpoenas. we'll look at whether the president can thwart the will of house democrats to compel white house staff to testify. we're also live in new mexico, along the southern border. president trump went patrolling the area and now is promising to send more armed troops. and she the people. a brand new presidential forum for and by women of color it has now nabbed the biggest names in the democrat 2020 field. we'll talk about one of the hosts about what