retiring those people but as you can see, unfortunately, although 30 years have passed, they have got influence. the influence which they were building after 1989 where they assumed a new identity of an elite of a new state so this influence is still strong. this is what i can say. let me assure you of one thing that freedom of speech is absolutely respected in poland. poland absolutely respects all constitutional standards just as in the united states, the right to assemble, the right to the freedom of speech, there is free media in poland. there is everything that is functioning in a normal democracy. one can announce what they think, one can demonstrate, one can say what they think in poland, people are not attacked during demonstrations as it happens in other western european country. police do not use truncheons or tear gas against people. people can speak their mind. they can express that they're not pleased with something. this is their right in democracy. please ask polish journalist when was the last time, when was the last demonstration in poland when some kind of tension happened, no, it didn't because

in poland we respect the right to demonstrate and to express your concern because we believe that this is one of the foundations of democracy in pola poland. there is absolutely free and just elections, all the standards are respected, so please, ladies and gentlemen, come to poland and see poland with your own eyes. please do not repeat certain stereotypes that are repeated in the west. poland today has got quite a conservative government. that is true. and this government has got certain standards of action. nobody -- not everybody subscribes to those standards, especially people of more leftist views, but this is the nature of democracy, so once you have got one side of the political scene in power and then people make a different choice and another side of the political stage comes to power, there's nothing stroextraordina about that. when somebody wins the elections and they have the right to implement the program, which they announce before the elections. excuse me, however, realizing implementing the program which you presented in your election

campaign is not only the right but i think an obligation rests on a politician and this is exactly what is happening in poland. >> a question for both presidents. mr. president, you said just a moment ago that poland will join the visa waiver program soon. how soon? >> we think fairly soon. we're doing very well with it. it's a complex situation, as you know, but we're getting very close. we allow very few countries to join but poland is one that we're thinking about allowing in, so we'll be making that decision over the next probably 90 days. >> sir, will you hope or do you think that maybe when you are in poland, in september, you will make the announcement? >> i think it's a very good idea. thank you very much for giving me that idea. >> thank you, mr. president. >> translator: mr. president, the visa waiver program appeared on many occasions but then it did not come into practice.

how optimistic are we about the words uttered right now by president donald trump? >> translator: i'm looking at these words, optimistic, i'm optimistic about that because i think this is the first u.s. administration which has treated this problem in such a serious way and comprehensive way so both. when we talk with mr. president, the president expresses his deep care about that. also when i talk with the u.s. ambassador to warsaw, she looks at the problem all the time and i believe in accordance with the law biepding the united states because this is something that i want to stress very strongly, according to the law, binding in the united states, by all the actions which are necessary in this respect, such as today's signing of the agreement on preventing and combatting serious crimes, i believe that through all these sanctions this visa waiver program covering poles with visa waiver program is going to be possible soon anyway that it is going to be

possible before the end of the first term of president donald trump. >> thank you very much. thank you very much. thank you very much. thank you. all right, the presidents of poland and the united states addressing a crowd in the rose garden outside the white house after spending most of the day together. there's some news out of the conversations that were had today with poland. this news conference came after the president said earlier that he may move about 2,000 u.s. troops to poland from germany or elsewhere in europe. the president made an announcement that seemed to imply that a decision on that was near. >> the united states and poland continue to enhance our security cooperation. poland will still provide basing and infrastructure to support military presence of about 1,000 american troops. the polish government will build

these projects at no cost to the united states. the polish government will pay for this. >> just before the news conference, the two leaders watched an f-35 joint strike fighter fly over the white house in honor of poland's decision to buy more than 30 of these war planes. now, let's talk a little bit about why this is relevant. poland lies on nato's eastern edge and it plays an important role in the military alliance. i want to take a look at the military alliance. nato stands for the north atlantic treaty organization. it was created by the north atlantic treaty which was signed in washington on april 4, 1949. this alliance was designed to be a check on the former soviet union's expansion into europe. now, six years later, the soviet union, this is -- this was back then, the soviet union and its eastern european allies, established their own political and military alliance called the warsaw pact. after poland's capital where the treaty was created and signed. the alliance organized itself around a collective decision

making process, the soviet union controlled most of the decisions, and the soviets used it to crush dissent across eastern european nations, including hungary, the former czechoslovakia and poland. the warsaw pact disbanded in 1991. nato has grown significantly over the past 70 years from 12 member states originally to 29 member states today and recent additions include several former warsaw pact nations, including poland, and the former soviet states of estonia, latvia and lithuania which brings nato, which is in the yellow here, right up against russia and that's upset russian president vladimir putin who has long tried to divide and undermine the nato alliance. nato's main mission is the security and defense of its member nations. article 5 of the north atlantic treaty says an armed against one or more in europe or north america shall be considered an attack against them all. this triggers a joint defense by

all member nations. article 5 has only been invoked once. this is the interesting thing. it was after september 11, 2001, when nato sent troops to afghanistan to help the united states fight al qaeda. nato countries, nato member countries, treated 9/11 as if it were an attack on their own country and that contingent included polish troops. in recent years, president trump has referred to nato as obsolete and a drain on the united states. his main beef with the alliance is that member states in his opinion are not living up to their commitment to spend 2% of gross domestic product on defense each year. poland is one of just 8 nations that have actually met the 2% target. let's take a closer look at this. i want to bring in heather conley, the director of the europe program at the center for strategic and international studies. heather, thank you for being with us. what's the importance of the discussion that the president was having today and the announcements of troops moving into poland?

>> yes, i mean, this was an important meeting because it really, again, strengthens that eastern flank that you were describing. there are four nato battalions. one battalion each sitting in the three battltic states and t u.s. is in control of the battalion in poland. what today's announcement did was basically help streamline and solidify the u.s. per s persistence presence in poland. this would strengthen nato's resolve should russia make an unwise decision to challenge nato territorial integrity. it helps with the command and control element and it gives some long-term stability to that u.s. presence, so this was important but it's also important to know while this is a bilateral defense agreement, it is in support of nato, all 29

soon to be 30 members to strengthen nato's collective defense. >> let's talk about if russia were to get aggressive and do something. russia moved into ukraine, not a nato country, one that was thinking about strengthening its relations with the west, and for people in poland or in these former warsaw pact countries, that is the kind of thing that worries them, because they still have a memory that goes back to the cold war and world war ii in which russia was expansionist. >> absolutely right. so what we do by sending a strong message of deterrence and that's what a strong u.s. force presence, a nato force presence on nato's eastern border sends a clear message to the kremlin, don't even think about it. it will be met with overwhelming strength. we respect the territorial integrity of nato. that's the message that it sends so a strong deterrence is actually built to ensure stability. now, let's be clear. there may be a response by

russia. we may see an increase of russian forces in belarus, potentially, along the russian border with the baltic states, so we have to prepare ourselves that there may be a response to this but again, a strong message of nato strength and unity actually prevents any thought of the kremlin taking advantage of nato's weakness, potentially, so it is a strong message. >> heather, thank you for joining us, always a pleasure to talk to you. she's the director of the europe program at the center for strategic and international studies. the strongest i've ever been is exactly today. the president, we think, is referenci referencing polling today without actually saying what poll he's talking about or meeting the most basic standards of english language but a source tells nbc trump's allies are urging him, quote, to stick with the same policies, less craziness after new numbers in a 17-state internal poll were worrisome. the results showing donald trump

trailing joe biden in the vast majority of those states. but the president has been trying to convince the public that that's all fake news, just like all his other negative headlines. while sitting alongside poland's president, trump made sure to talk about this pressing issue. >> we have great internal polling. there were fake polls that were released by somebody that is -- it's ridiculous. no, we are winning in every single state that we've polled. >> if you didn't get his point then, trump tweeted before that, the fake, corrupt media is -- news media said they had a leak into polling done by my campaign which by the way despite are the best numbers we have ever had. they reported fake numbers that they made up and don't even exist. we will win again. on monday, "the new york times" reported that trump instructed his aides to say publicly that other data showed him doing well. nbc has not been able to confirm this reporting but a source with direct knowledge of the trump

campaign's internal polling tells nbc the president's been on a recent tear over the issue because, quote, he hates the narrative. but his campaign aides want him to stop focusing on biden and giving biden so-called free publicity. how did trump win in 2016? $1 billion in free media. joining me now from the white house is nbc's hans nichols. hans, what do we know about this? >> reporter: ali, there are public polls and private polls and it's unclear what the president is referencing when he's talking about the fake polls. what we do know is that their internal polling has 17 states and it's worrisome to the president. we also know where the president is traveling and where the president travels is usually an indication of where his internal polls show that he has some work to do. where has he been quite a bit? wisconsin, pennsylvania. where is he hosting the big kickoff to announce his reelection? down in florida. earlier today, as you mentioned, the president talked about this, our own kristen welker pressed him on this question. it was one of maybe about 26

questions i think welker got into the president today but let's listen to this exchange. >> we're winning in texas, very big. we're winning in ohio very big. we're winning in florida very big. they were fake polls that were either put out by the corrupt media, because much of the media in this country, unfortunately, is corrupt, i have to tell you that, mr. president. they're not advisors. it's fake news. you don't understand what i'm saying. those advisors don't exist. >> reporter: now what officials will tell you is that the only poll that really matters is the one on election day and in the past polls did not predict the president was going to win so in some cases the president is reverting back to what he talked about a lot during the 2016 campaign and that is that polls don't matter. at the same time, polls do create a perception, that's why the campaigns use them so much and they want to know where they are and where to deploy resources and i think we just need to watch if the president can be denying the veracity of polls we need to watch where he's going and what he's saying.

yesterday he was in iowa which he won handy and what did he say? he said, sleepy joe biden, attacked joe biden in that state that he won handily. >> we have very few viewers who are as loyal as you and when i was talking about nato, you pointed something out when i put up the map of the warsaw pact. i want to ask that -- we've got all of germany as part of the warsaw pact. that wasn't actually the case because most people will remember that berlin wasn't in there. west germany was not part of the warsaw pact. >> kudos to you for correcting this. take a look at that map of germany. basically that map would be accurate if the eastern half of germany were from red and the western half were in green but maps are difficult, they're challenging. i love that map, you show the four countries -- four countries or four or five countries that are touching russia in the -- and i am going to ask you to name them. three baltics, two others. kind of a trick question. >> i know poland is one of them. we got latvia, lithuania, est e

estonia, poland. >> norway up top. it's a trick question. i knew we could play geography game. >> i've been to that border, actually. that's the funny part. i've seen it. you're right. thank you, my friend. >> and marines train up there. they take that very seriously. this is one of the dynamics of the white house under the trump administration is that the pentagon is very concerned about russia and we hear different rhetoric from the president. although today, the president's rhetoric is matching up with the pentagon and they are sending more troops to the eastern part of the nato. >> thank you, my friend. i appreciate that. one of the things when you look at a map these days is you don't see germany as two parts. when you click the button to color germany, you get one choice just like canada or the united states. despite calling himself the most transparent president, donald trump's escalating his feud against congressional oversight. trump asserted executive privilege to block information requested by the house oversight committee on the administration's decision to add a citizenship question to the

2020 census. that comes just as the chairman of that committee prepares to hold a vote to declare attorney general william barr and commerce secretary wilbur ross in contempt of congress for withholding the subpoenaed documents sometime in the next hour, probably. in a letter to chairman couplings, the justice department wrote, by proceeding with today's vote, you have abandoned the accommodation process with respect to your requests and subpoenas for documents rather than allowing the department to complete its document production, you have chosen to go forward with an unnecessary and premature contempt vote. this is just the latest example of this administration's broad resistance to any congressional requests for any information. >> the white house has not turned over one single shred of paper in response to any of our requests. the hurricanes in puerto rico,

the white house has produced nothing. security clearance abuses, the white house has produced nothing. efforts to transfer nuclear technology to saudi arabia, the white house has produced nothing. hush money payments, the white house has produced nothing. and this begs the question, what are they hiding? what are they hiding? >> joining me from capitol hill, kelly o'donnell. the president has made clear through the rejection of subpoenas having to do with the mueller investigation or the investigation -- anything to do with mueller or the election of 2016, but this isn't that. this is about the census. what's this all about? why is the white house not allowing these documents to be provided? >> reporter: well, in some ways, one is connected to the other. by taking an aggressive position about congressional oversight and putting the brakes on a lot of things and william barr, the

attorney general, is a part of this along with the commerce secretary, a question about the census, a citizenship question that was asked, and so the administration is refusing to provide information like emails that would reveal some conversations behind the scenes when the decision to add that question was put in place so that's what this is about. you were doing a geography quiz with hans. i can do one for you here in the hallway. this is the oversight committee and right here is the judiciary committee. really, this particular lane and this building, rayburn for the house side of capitol hill is where a lot of these fights are being waged so democrats here expect in the next hour to move forward for the committee to consider a vote of contempt against those two members of the administration and while you're right this doesn't directly have to do with the mueller investigation, it is about trying to protect information that the white house does not want congressional investigators and members of the congress to have access to, to look for

things to challenge the administration about. and so, saying no in one area would make it perhaps arguably more difficult to say yes in another so that's what's playing out here today. >> that makes sense. kelly, thank you very much as always. kelly o'donnell on capitol hill. howard schultz not in the 2020 race but considering a run as an independent has just announced he's taking a break until labor day as he recovers from back surgery. we're two weeks away from the first presidential democratic debate here on msnbc and we now know who of the crowded field has made the final cut and will be on the debate stage. in a monmouth university poll out today, former vice president joe biden is the front runner among likely democratic voters in nevada and senator elizabeth warren having gained momentum in the last two weeks leads senator bernie sanders by six points. this is a nevada caucus goer poll but it does -- it's one of

the very few showing elizabeth warren having made gains into a place where he's she's now ahead of bernie sanders. montana governor steve bull lock who reached 1% in two other polls and seth moulton failed to meet the democratic party's 1% in 3 national polls criteria for qualifying. another new poll, this one among african-american voters, shows former vice president joe biden with a big advantage, 76% of african-american voters surveyed said they're enthusiastic about biden. senator bernie sanders trails behind biden with 64%, both lead african-american 2020 contender senator kamala harris and cory booker. the survey found that black voters feel they're facing significant economic challenges to improving work, wages, and wealth in the black community. the biggest concerns being work discrimination, not enough good-paying jobs, and the wage gap between white and black americans. now to address these concerns, the black economic alliance, a

nonpartisan group, founded by black executives and business leaders who funded this polling will host a presidential forum in south carolina this saturday. four contenders will be there, cory booker, elizabeth warren, beto o'rourke and pete buttigieg. joining me now is the co-chairman of the black economic alliance. great to see you. talk to me about -- you and i last talked when it was around the midterms and you had endorsed certain candidates. you don't endorse candidates necessarily because they're black or not, it's about whether their policies will be useful to african-americans. >> that's exactly right. we are a nonpartisan group because we believe that the best ideas don't have an "r" or a "d" behind them. they can come from anywhere so we'll support candidates of any race or ethnic origin who really care about making progress for african-americans and the economic issues they are confronting. >> and for what it's worth, most of these democratic candidates have identified that they need to succeed with an

african-american audience and african-american voters. what have you heard that stands out in terms of policy prescriptives that will really move the needle on the issues you're most concerned about. >> let's talk about where we can actually be pragmatic and gain traction. one of the things we know is that many black americans are underemployed. while we've got historic unemployment rates, that is, historically low unemployment rates, black americans are still unemployed at twice the rate of white americans and at the highest rate of any other ethnic group. >> that gap hardly ever seems to budge. >> no, it doesn't. >> black americans always have a higher unemployment rate than the general population. >> that's right. and when they are employed, they're underemployed, they're not in a high-paying, high skill jobs. so one of the things we think about is the future of work, for instance. thinking about the new economy jobs that are tech in orientation or automation in orientation, how is it that we can actually develop workforce development or training programs to prepare black americans for

those roles so we can put them in a different income category. we know that historically african-americans are paid disproportionately low so we want to close the gap and train african-americans to do these kind of jobs that will form and drive economic growth for them. >> tony, economic issues that are faced by african-americans are not usually exclusive to african-americans, they're just exaggerated for african-americans. lower wages or not having the right skills for jobs. do the prescriptives and solutions look like things that are designed for african-americans or designed for workers across the board who do not have adequate skills or do not have technological training or who are underemployed or who are not in schools where they're getting enough education? >> it's probably a little bit of both, ali. if you think a little bit about, let's just take the workforce development topic as an opportunity and how we're going to train them. one of the interesting ideas that's floating out there right now which we like is this conversion of pell grants, the

major way that the federal government supports low income individuals, and using those pell grants for skills training rather than degreed programs traditionally. now, there's a lot of conversation but this would allow more individuals to take advantage. we do believe that a rising tide floats all boats so that what will be good for black americans will be good for white rural americans and others. >> the reason i ask is because there are some things that a lot of these candidates are saying which we'll probably hear again in south carolina that are specifically designed to address the valid grievances of black americans and a new op-ed today in the charleston chronicle, pete buttigieg, who's going to be speaking on saturday, is calling for a new marshall plan that he calls the doug lass plan that will create 3 million jobs, $660 billion in new wealth for black communities, increase the number of successful small businesses in black communities by 50%, increase federal contracting with minority and women owned firms from 5% to 25% and reform credit scoring.

interesting, highly specific stuff. does it pass muster with you? >> it does because one of the ore things that we're really interested in is the access to capital for black americans. typically black americans pay high interest rates for loans, they've been blocked from home ownership which is one of the chief ways of wealth creation in this country so if we can shift resources, shift the opportunity to move capital into the communities, they'll have the opportunity to grow. this would be especially important for people who want to start businesses. there's a lot of entrepreneurship in the black community but there aren't available funds for small business loans or grants so there's some really interesting ideas here and if we can stimulate entrepreneurship opportunities, provide access to capital, we think we can actually move the needle on these issues. >> lots to discuss here, we'll have this discussion a lot, i hope. we're just 14 days away from the first presidential debate of the 2020 election cycle. june 26th and 27th in miami,

moderated by lester holt, chuck todd and rachel maddow, the primetime events will be broadcast live across nbc news, msnbc and will be streamed on nbc news digital properties. coming up next, a startling warning from two former fbi spy hunters about the threat of russian interference in the 2020 election and how russia's ongoing efforts are only going to ramp up as the mueller report clearly pointed out. you are watching msnbc. iand i don't add up the years. but what i do count on... is staying happy and healthy. so, i add protein, vitamins and minerals to my diet with boost®. boost® high protein nutritional drink has 20 grams of protein, along with 26 essential vitamins and minerals your body needs. all with guaranteed great taste.

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[ dogs howling ] seriously? embrace the mischief. say "get pets tickets" into your x1 voice remote to see it in theaters. this morning, two former fbi officials who specialized in counterintelligence and cybersecurity testified to the house intelligence committee on russia's interference into the 2016 election and intensifying threat to 2020 as outlined in volume one of special counsel robert mueller's report. >> when it comes to russia and the svr, gru or fsb, their number one, number two and number three priority is this country. it doesn't surprise me at all that the russian government launched sophisticated cyber operations against our country during the times when we located in the report. they're some of the best in the world at this, quite frankly. >> how could the russians use what they knew about paul manafort to their advantage?

>> well, i think they did it very effectively. one of the ways they did it that it's immediately apparent is they actually tasked him and that tell -- that's one of the initial tests when you are developing an asset for intelligence collection. >> can you elaborate on that? you just said that the russians tasked the campaign chairman of donald trump's campaign. can you just elaborate on how the russianed tasked him? >> they asked him to provide polling data. and like you said, i mean, polling data isn't the keys to the kingdom, right? but it is a small step that illustrates his willingness to provide information to someone he knows he's beholden to, financially, and i think that is a great illustration of how the russians work. deception makes the person vulnerable. it's not even the act. the fact that somebody has a multimillion dollar business in russia doesn't compromise them. the fact that they're trying to

hide it or be deceptive about the extent of their relationship could possibly make them vulnerable. and just like the case with mike flynn, it's not the fact that he had that conversation. whether it was appropriate or not appropriate. it's the fact that he -- he chose to be deceptive about it. that could make him vulnerable. >> this is all part of the democrats' latest strategy to try and move forward with their investigations and bring to light the troubling details on the president's alleged misconduct also laid out clearly in the special counsel's report. that effort began monday with former nixon white house counsel john dean testifying in front of the house judiciary committee. dean emphasized the importance these committees play in educating the public on presidential misconduct. >> special counsel mueller has provided this committee with a road map. this committee does have a role and it is adding something that the special counsel could not, and that's public education.

this report has not been widely read in the united states. it's not even been widely read in the congress. and i think it's a very important function that the committee is serving by bringing these matters to public attention. >> joining me now, frank, former fbi assistant director for counterintelligence and an msnbc contributor. i thought what stephanie douglas said was interesting. obviously it's known to people like you, but it's important for people to understand that the act of deception causes you to be vulnerable to the sort of thing that we saw, the compromised by it, by another government. >> i think a lot of americans are hearing about the report and they're thinking, well, there was no smoking gun, there's no criminal conspiracy, what do we need to worry about, and what we heard today was how counterintelligence really works, how compromising someone really works and that is that it's enough to just have the leverage over somebody, the possibility, the inference drawn

that you've got something on me that you can pull out of your pocket at any time. that's enough power and leverage to actually compromise someone and make them more vulnerable and ali, that's why it's so important that the intel committee, not only get experts like this testifying but get their hands on the latest updates on the bureau's counterintelligence. >> which hasn't happened. >> what did we also -- >> that hasn't happened. >> exactly. we heard it today. we heard from chairman schiff that he's been asking for an update on perhaps the most historically important counterintelligence investigation in the history of the country, and he hasn't gotten it. and that goes to the heart of the question of whether this president or people in the administration are indeed compromised through deception, through vulnerability and the fact that they haven't gotten that briefing yet tells me that the department of justice is not permitting the fbi to give that briefing. >> so for people like me who just think that these are our elected officials, they're on the intel committee, regardless

of what political party you're of or they're of, they are supposed to be getting that information. that's how regular folks think this works. now we're hearing from adam schiff, it hasn't happened and we have the same question we have about kind of everything else that's going on with this white house. who fixes that? who can you go to complain about what you're saying that the intelligence committee that has got to make decisions that protect our next election is not getting the necessary information from the fbi. >> well, there are reports that subpoenas are going to be issued even from the house intel committee for this very information and to this could likely end up in court. but people should know, your viewers should know, this is not normal. when i was assistant director of counterintelligence, i traipsed up to the hill countless times to brief them on significant counterintelligence cases and the updates to those cases. i always get permission and concurrence from my bosses at the department of justice. my guess is it's not happening and my guess is it's not happening because there's something in that counterintelligence case that they don't want to go to the

hill. >> all right, we're going to have to figure out what that is. frank, thank you very much. a former fbi assistant director for counterintelligence and an msnbc contributor. for over a year, educators and their advocates have been fighting for better pay and improved benefits, participating in walkouts across the nation and drawing the attention of leaders and lawmakers on both local and national levels. they've also gotten the attention of the 2020 democratic candidates, several of whom have released their plans to bump up low teacher salaries. the latest is kamala harris. harry smith had a chance to sit down with harris to talk big ideas and her plan for shrinking the teacher pay gap. >> what's your big idea? >> my big idea is to raise teacher pay. >> kamala harris is just the second african-american woman and first south asian-american elected to the u.s. senate. >> just last week, i got an email from my middle schoolteacher, mrs. wayne. >> we caught up with harris in west columbia, south carolina.

she was in town to talk with and about teachers. >> there are two groups of people who are raising our children, parents often with the assistance of grandparents and aunts and uncles, and our teachers and we are not paying them their value. >> reporter: harris says recent teacher demonstrations across the country are proof a plan like hers is needed. she claims teachers on average make 11% less than other comparably educated professionals, so she wants to give them a $13,500 raise. what's the price tag? >> the price tag is $315 billion over the course of 10 years. we will pay for it by increasing the estate tax. >> reporter: the teachers union, massive, millions of people. let's give them $13,000 each. is this just a play to that crowd? >> absolutely not. i will tell you my entire career and frankly my entire life i've been focused on education. my first grade teacher, mrs. frances wilson, god rest her soul, attended my law school

graduation. we are a society that pretends to care about education but not so much the education of other people's children. >> reporter: giving teachers a raise, that's kamala harris's big idea. harry smith, nbc news, west columbia, south carolina. >> joining me now is someone with vast experience on this issue, chief of the educational opportunity section of the civil rights department at the department of justice under president obama. good to see you again. >> good to see you too. >> let's talk about what she said. we are a society which has -- which pretends to care about what teachers earn or the well being of teachers. stephanie and i had this conversation today. we vote for people who determine what teachers earn. is it not a priority for us? is it because it's only a priority to people who have kids going through an educational system? what teachers get paid. >> i think there is -- has been a national conversation, there's been a state and local conversation around valuing teachers and we've seen it get to a fever pitch in part because

that conversation doesn't necessarily translate into actual pay, and pay that reflects the kinds of challenges that teachers are experiencing and also the importance of teachers, particularly in low income, urban, and rural areas in supporting our children. >> and that actually is a bigger issue, right? that's where you start to see a civil rights issue because we know -- i just had a conversation about african-americans, for instance, not earning what the rest of the population earns but if you're starting with a substandard education or underfunded schools or teachers, we've talked to so many teachers who have to spend $3,000 or $4,000 out of their own pockets because funding has been cut. you then push that problem and do not just teachers earning not enough money but people not getting a good education. >> right. and part of it is also that we see really high teacher turnover when you have salaries -- starting salaries to be as low as they have been, particularly in those -- undersupported, underresourced areas, and so in order to make sure that we have children who have stable,

diverse, it's incredibly important that we have teachers of color teaching our students, both black and white students and latino students and so in all of those cases, we see a mismatch between the kind of ways in which we're supporting teachers and what children really need. >> can this be fixed by presidential candidates? this is essentially a state problem. >> so, there's two things. one is the fact that only about 10% of federal education funding across the country is really federal funding and so really what we want to think about is how the federal government can incentivize state and local governments to really support teacher compensation. the second is that we see a really wide variance between states in terms of how they look at teacher pay and so not only in terms of how much teachers receive but also there are some states, seven, that have minimal, you know, minimal amounts that teachers are to be paid. there are 17 states in which we see sort of pay scales for teachers and there are others that actually have it be determined by collective

bargaining agreement and so when you see that kind of variance it's hard to figure how the it is that the federal government is going to be able to really impact the state pay across the board. some of those possibilities may be looking at tax incentives for teachers in terms of -- especially those who are starting outs and how they look at student loans, some of the presidential candidates have talked about that. others are really trying to figure out how you could actual supplement what teachers are receiving in states kroacross t country. >> good to see you again. former chief of education opportunities at the civil rights division at the department of justice under president obama. up next, senator bernie sanders delivers his big address on democratic socialism. we're going to take a closer look at what exactly that means and how it works. you're watching msnbc. how it wos you're watching msnbc.

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it was funny because when we would call another insurance company, hey would say "oh we can't beat usaa" we're the webber family. we're the tenney's we're the hayles, and we're usaa members for life. ♪ get your usaa auto insurance quote today. bernie sanders just delivered what he billed as a major address on democratic socialism. sanders stressed the importance of carrying out to completion what he said is the unfinished business of president franklin d. roosevelt's new deal. part of that includes sanders demanding economic freedom for all americans and warning against what he says is growing authoritarianism and oligarchy.

sanders delivered a speech in an effort to get ahead of republican attacks on his brand of democratic socialism. >> it is no exaggeration to state that not only did fdr's agenda improve the lives of millions of americans, but if new deal was enormously popular politically and helped defeat far right extremism. but now, we must take the next step forward and guarantee every man, woman, and child in our country basic economic rights, the right to quality healthcare. the right to as much education as one needs to succeed in our society. >> democratic socialism is a label that's caused a lot of division among democrats, so nbc

"news stream"ing service, nbc news now sent foreign correspondent matt bradley to denmark, a notable example for a look at how that system works. >> reporter: so, recently, socialism or at least democratic socialism has almost become an article of faith for some on the left. its high priest? democratic presidential candidate, bernie sanders. >> when i talk about democratic socialism, i'm not looking at venezuela. i'm not looking at cuba. i'm looking at countries like denmark and sweden. ♪ >> reporter: humble denmark, a nation of 5.6 million people and apparently a socialist utopia. or is it? here in the capital, copenhagen, people are a little puzzled. >> i think it's great that denmark is being discussed but i think that it's being portrayed a little wrong because denmark is being portrayed as socialist country and denmark isn't a socialist country.

>> reporter: denmark is envied around the world for its free, high quality education and medical services and generous welfare system but denmark is actually a capitalist economy and according to forbes it's easier to do business here than in the u.s. there's no minimum wage, little bureaucracy, and a commitment to free trade. still, even some danes describe their country as socialist. when bernie sanders says this is a socialist country, do you agree? >> yes. yes. it is a socialistic country. we call it a socialistic democracy. >> reporter: so what's so social democracy? and how does it differ from democratic socialism, plain old socialism, and communism? in part it depends on who you ask but the general idea behind socialism is to reduce inequality and spread wealth more fairly. social democracies like denmark do this with a strong welfare state and strong labor unions but based on a capitalist economy. democratic socialism is similar but argues for more state control of the economy like a minimum wage, for example. pure socialists don't just want

more control, they want state ownership of the means of production and distribution of goods, factories, banks, transport, water, power, you name it. communists want the same thing but they believe it can never be achieved through elections and traditional democracy. >> our education was for free. if we need the hospital services, for free. when monica had to give birth to our kids, it's not a question of money or to pay or something. we just go there. >> reporter: but danish state generosity isn't free. taxes are sky high compared to the u.s., and around $100 to fill up the family car the cost of living isn't cheap either. that's prompting some danes to question their economic model. i sat down with two activists on opposite sides of the political spectrum. >> what we have right now in denmark is a government that subsidized everybody, not only the poor ones but we all have to pay high taxes so we can get benefits from the government even though we don't need them. every student in denmark can get

support from the government even though they have rich parents, for example. and i don't think that is fair. i don't think it's fair to tax people that heavily as we do in denmark. >> i didn't grow up poor but i've never seen anyone in my denmark. >> i've never grew up poor, because it's free in denmark, i took that work instead of going directly to working, that's good for society. matt bradley reporting from denmark for us. up next a city on edge. thousands of demonstrators are taking to the street to protest an extradition bill that many worry could undercut the city's legal system. this is hong kong. you're watching msnbc. l system this is hong kong. you're watching msnbc. when you shop for your home at wayfair,

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president trump weighed in on the violent protests in hong kong over a controversial extradition bill during a meeting with poland's president. >> when you look at this democr demonstration, they said it was a million people. that was as big a demonstration as i've ever seen. i understand the reason for the demonstrati demonstration. i'm sure they'll be able to work it out. >> this came hours after police clashed with protesters in the former british colony. demonstrators through rocks and bottles at officers. the violence forced lawmakers to delay the debate but the city's chief executive vowed to press ahead with the legislation. since hong kong's legislature is

dominated by probeijing legislation, it should pass. it would allow suspects accused of crime such as murder and rape, hong kong has extradition already with some 20 countries. the courts will have the final say on whether to grant such requests and people accused of religious and political crimes will not be extradited. but protesters worry that china will exploit the rule to get activists. they say it also goes against the one country two systems policy that was put in place when british handed it back to china in 1997. it was known as the basic law which protects democratic institutions until the year 2047. and guarantees that china cannot

stifle dissent in hong kong like it does across the mainland. it's why many chose hong kong to host their business meetings. joining us now to take a closer look at this is mark hannah, a senior fellow as the awe raisa group. what is china trying to achieve here? >> china is trying to consolidate its power and move hong kong, a region that came back from british rule in 1997 under the domain of its political power. it's unclear, though, that even -- that this is a directive right from president xi jingping coming out of beijing, the chief executive of hong kong is -- this is being done at her initiative at the initiative of the hong kong legislature. so i think a lot of protesters

see the invisible hand of the chinese communist party behind it. >> by 2047 they're going to do whatever they want to do, the chinese can do that legally by law. if you're in hong kong now you have to know it's coming. >> you do, but you enjoy a certain degree of human rights, independence from china. so they're seeing this acceleration of the integration as threatening to that independence. i think we in the united states should be cheering on any kind of protesters making a case for democracy, for independence. the chinese -- the mainland chinese courts aren't all that independent. we found actually the mainland chinese, we recently did a study called from democracy promotion to democracy detraction we looked at public opinion in many countries, including mainland china and they're supportive of the american form of government -- >> the question is would you

like to see your system of government more or less like the u.s. in 20 years. 45% say somewhat more and 29% much more. so more than half. >> yes. they want china to become more like the u.s. not less like the u.s. and that's mainland china. >> i'm sure the numbers are more in hong kong. >> absolutely. we didn't poll hong kong but i think that would be the case. in hong kong people are voicing their opinions . that's how democracies work. i think mainland china, beijing is being caught off guard to some extent because they're not used to this. >> any chance these protests are going to influence china on this? >> it's unclear, unlikely because of what you said in the set up. the legislature in hong kong is pro-beijing, pro-chinese

communist party. so this looks somewhat inevitable. president trump said they hope they're going to work it out. i don't know what he's thinking necessarily. but it doesn't look clear there's a natural sort of accord on the horizon. >> by the way, american companies, western companies many of which have their headquarters in hong kong, some of them are reconsidering that, going to singapore, where they have more predictability about how things are going to go. >> that is what could potentially actually get beijing to maybe even intervene here and say, hey, hong kong, hey, why don't we do this more gradually because we don't want to shock and alienate international finance that has made hong kong what it is. >> mark, always good to see you, thank you for your research on this. that wraps up this hour for me. you can find me on social media.

thank you for watching, "deadline: white house" with nicole wallace begins now. hi, everyone. it's 4:00 in new york. donald trump described in today's washington post as possessing a fascination with the possibility of his own impeachment, is executing his deflect, distract and lie strategy of governing by calling the polls that call him behind in key states fake and blocking access to more documents to congress. the white house claiming executive privilege over census documents subpoenaed by the oversight committee. now the oversight committee is set to vote on contempt charges. that has vote is happening any minute and that committee's chairman, elijah cummings has had always he can take of the white hous