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tv   Politics Nation  MSNBC  February 20, 2021 2:00pm-3:00pm PST

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group of aviation investigators, accident investigators. they are very methodical to work with this and put all the pieces of the puzzle together. there will be a team of investigators assembled and parties to the investigation who will be part of that review. >> katherine, we're going to continue this coverage. i do have to hand it over to reverend al sharpton. he's going to take this breaking news coverage from here. so i appreciate you standing by for us. i imagine we're going to be talking to you a lot more as this all develops. i'll be back here tomorrow at 3 p.m. the rev picks up our coverage right now. good evening and welcome to "politicsnation." before we get started tonight, we want to update you on the scary situation out of denver at this hour where passenger plane experiencing engine trouble dropped large pieces of debris
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on suburban neighborhoods before landing safely at denver international airport. police are working to find all of the debris and no injuries have been reported. we'll have updates throughout the hour as more information becomes available. but tonight's lead, gaining momentum. four full weeks into joe biden's america and it looks like a mandate is forming under our feet, a mandate but not from the white house, other than defeating the covid pandemic is not what i'm referring to. with breaking news that president biden has declared the winter storm in texas to be a major disaster, what we're seeing is a mandate issued by the nation itself. our systems, our networks, our infrastructure. right now the people of our nation's second largest state
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are still in collective cold shock, restoing themselves at the extreme and fatal winter weather. but also waiting for their electrical grids to be functional again and supply lines of various kinds. and that leads become to covid and the 2.6 million texans suffered from the virus, unable to get vaccinated due to the chaos or worse. joining the nearly half a million americans that have died during this pandemic. but whether it's texas or dozens of other states, black and brown americans, vastly behind in vaccinations anyway. and tonight we continue to look at the reasons why, as well as how communities are closing the gap. if there is a lesson to be learned from this year of perfect storms, it's that we
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can't keep kicking cans down the road that may be running out or freezing over. the overall response from the biden administration has been heartening, both in texas this week and in general over the last month, a stark change from his predecessor, the dust of which is still being vacuumed out of our government. more on draining the swamp later, but first we start tonight with the new secretary of transportation, pete buttigieg. just with your brief reaction where a passenger plane with engine trouble dropped large pieces of debris over neighborhoods before landing safely. >> it's very concerning. weefr pleased to see the
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airplane has landed safely at the airport. impact as well with this debris out there. i know ntsb is already mobilizing so an independent agency can provide right away information as they piece together what has happened and eventually make recommendations about anything that we need to do in response. >> so you will be monitoring this because clearly this gives a lot of concern to those families, those in that community that has the debris, but also the people that use airlines often, as i do, to travel in. >> absolutely. and, you know, america's reputation for excellent air safety is not something that just happened. it happened because of close regulation of understanding whenever an incident happens why it happens and ensuring that we have the highest standards in this country. so as secretary of transportation, especially knowing that the aviation sector
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has been through a lot and is working to get back on its feet, we want to make sure we respond to this and understand any lessons learned in a way that will maximize the sense of safety every time we get on a plane as you and i so often have. >> let me ask this as transportation secretary, former mayor and former presidential contender, you're one of the best guests we could ask for tonight. in your view, what went wrong this week in texas? not in terms of weather, which i want to get to, but in terms of infrastructure, our ability to have vital, basic services that work for us, especially during historic emergencies like this. >> look, this country's got some decisions to make. you don't just get to be the greatest country on earth if you're not investing. and the reality is we have systematically disinvested in infrastructure as a country for more than a generation now.
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we're still learning some of the specific details that went into this situation, although i can tell you what it was not. it was not because of renewable energy. a year and change ago as you remember, i was campaigning in iowa and was passing through in subzero temperatures a lot of wind farms. this is about something much deeper to do with our grid and our willingness to invest and modernize. infrastructure isn't glamorous, roads, pipes, power grids, but when they aren't in excellent condition, nothing else works. and the good news is we have an opportunity right now, enormous will among the american people to make those invesments. and this time to make them equitably. we know that hadn't always happened in our history. if we get it right, america will be able to lead the world. if we don't, we'll see thing we didn't think were possible in the united states of america, people burning furniture for
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warmth in the united states of america, that is just not supposed to happen. >> now the situation in texas right now isn't specifically related to transportation and yet it's clear you are deeply engaged and ready to help, which leads me to a question about senator ted cruz, who also is not directly responsible for what's happening and yet his decision to leave the state in the middle of a crisis struck a enough with many americans. what lessons can we learn with senator cruz's behavior as we move ahead? >> i can't speak to his decisions, but what i can say is if he and the people of texas need anything, he or any texas official is welcome to reach out to the department of transportation. we're in touch with fema, doing anything we can to be part of the solution. this is one of those moments that requires all hands on deck
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to be there to help. >> from conversations we've had over the years, you've understood that racial inequalities are real. they're systemic and they affect nearly everything in america. and apparently that includes covid vaccine distribution because several assessments have found that black and latinex populations are vastly behind in vaccinations in most states and among the reasons suggested is a lack of access to public transportation in urban and rural areas. this week even people of color who could get on a bus still couldn't get to a vaccination site because of extreme winter weather and as we get into spring and summer, it could be extreme flooding or extreme heat next time. so as transportation secretary, what can be done at the federal level to fill this particular gap? >> well, this is one of many
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reasons why it's so important to pass the president's american rescue plan that congress has before it right now. this is about things like getting vaccines to sites and getting shots in arms but it's also got things like making sure we have dollars to keep our transit systems running. a lot of the transit systems around the country are already running at reduced capacity. they've had to cut their routes or frequency, leaving some americans at risk of being left behind. and even keeping that you reduced rate might not be possible if we don't get them aid in a hurry. it does no good to have vaccines available if people can't get to them. as you said correctly, we know that black and brown neighborhoods are more likely to have been left out and have residents who are more likely to be at risk. it's not that the virus itself discrimination by race, it's that our health system and our civic systems so often have and that's one of the reasons we see these disparities in why some
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americans disproportionately black and brown americans are more vulnerable to serious illness and even losing their lives because of covid. it's why we have got to as a matter of basic justice, as well as a matter of public health, do everything we can to get those shots in arms and our part in it in the department of transportation is to make sure people can get to where they need to be. >> now, this administration is combatting not just climate chang but the effects of four years where science was literally thrown out of the white house window. and that by its predecessor. i presume you're playing catchup while racing against the clock. what can you do in the next four years, mr. secretary? >> i think we can do a whole lot. as you said, science is back in the white house and the president's executive orders and actions have may that clear whether we talking about climate, public health or any situation where telling the truth, discovering the truth and
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reporting the truth can help save american lives and make america stronger. specifically for the department of transportation, some of what that means is getting ahead of the climate challenge, being real about what we can and should do, getting more electric vehicles on the road and giving people an option besides being in a car. america should be leading, not catching up but americans have been asked to settle for less. we've got a chance to change that. as we do this time around, we got a chance to do it equitably. there are many neighborhoods that have been left behind. we've heard about true deserts, neighborhoods where people don't have access to safe and healthy food. there's also such a thing as a transportation desert, low income or haven't had the political clout to get investment in their areas. other times investment has come no neighborhoods but in the wrong way, like in the form
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of a highway dividing a neighborhood in two. we have to make sure every investment is done in an equitable way and delivers better economic and racial justice in this country. >> i know you've been asked this repeatedly over the last month of press, but diversity is one of my keen interests and specialties as you know. you are the first openly gay cabinet member to serve a sitting u.s. president. regrettably late but historic nonetheless. i'd be curious to know if you thought at all about younger lgbtq americans looking at you a as a role model and a ceiling breaker. >> you know, my hoped is younger lgbtq americans by the time they're old enough to be in a position like this will find that it's not even a big deal. but we got a long way to go from here to there. and i couldn't help but think
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when i was being sworn in not just about the things that have changed in my lifetime like the repeal of don't ask, don't tell, but others who can remember things like the so-called lavender scare of the 1950s when people lost their jobs not as a cabinet officer or soldier but just as a bookkeeper or astronomer simply because of who they loved. that he history is recent and is with us and we are changing it right now in the biden/harris administration. >> i assume you would be voicing against the lack of diversity and inclusion in all departments of government and your own department in terms of diversity in employment and in contrast on the railroad of people about their investments working with black contractors and all.
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we look to be continuing our conversation. transportation secretary pete buttigieg, thank you for being here tonight. >> thanks for having me. >> switching topics, one week removed from the end of the impeachment trial of former president donald trump, now the ncaa is suing trump, his lawyer rudy giuliani and two far right groups, proud boys and oath keepers saying they conspired to incite the events on capitol hill on january 6th. leading that lawsuit is congressman bennie thompson, chairman of the homeland security committee and he joins me now. congressman, thank you for being with us this evening and let me go right to it. you compared modern day extremist groups like the proud boys and oath keepers to the ku
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klux klan, claiming the groups morphed out of the klan connection. please explain. >> well, as you know, that law was passed back in 1871 because the ku klux klan were preventing newly elected officials from the south coming to washington and doing their jobs. we saw members of congress doing their constitutional duties and reaffirming the election of november. and so in the midst of members of congress doing their job, these renegades, these terrorists, these right wingers broke into the united states capitol and stopped members of congress from doing their constitutional job. so it's clear in my mind there's no difference between the ku klux klan of 1871 and the proud
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boys and oath keepers of 2021. >> now, some breaking news from last night, the department of justice has brought charges against six suspected members of the right-wing militia group the oath keepers for their role in the capitol insurrection. these new charges may be the most significant evidence so far that the attack on the capitol was preplanned. your reaction? >> well, it just confirms what we've known for quite a while. when donald trump invited people to come to washington on january 6th and in that irritation, he said "it's going to be wild." well, that is a signal to that right-wing element in this country that if you come, we're going to make sure that they know we're here and we're going to do some things. well, none of us in the beginning thought in our wildest
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imagination that donald trump would sic that group on members of congress and the vice president on that day. but up heard him say in that speech up need to march to the capitol and let them know you are not satisfied with what's going on. that was his dog whistle to that group to come to the heel, break in the capitol, stop congress from certifying the election because he felt it had been stolen. and as a sore loser, donald trump did one awful thing to this country, rev. he hurt our democracy big time. in america, as you know, and you and i have been on the losing end of a lot of events, a lot of elections, but we didn't tear the place up. we said we'll see you at the
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next election, see you at the next march, see you at the next rout. but for whatever reason, donald trump being the sore loser that he is could not take it and those individuals, proud boys, oath keepers and others, came banishing rebel flags, came banishing swords, came banishing shields and everything and broke into the capitol and put a lot of us at risk. as you know, we were there doing what we had taken an oath to do, but as you can tell, waving trump banners and all of that and somehow, this right wing element in the country, they're trying to convince us it was the left-leaning organizations that broke into the capitol. we saw this with our own eyes, rev. and because this nation saw it, i sat through the impeachment
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proceedings, i saw the impeachment managers do one heck of a job in their presentation, but it was a political decision the senator made by not convicting donald trump. and after that derek johnson with the naacp and their attorneys, we talked about it and we said in america we can't let this happen. weep heard mitch mcconnell give that speech that said if you're not satisfied with the results of this impeachment proceeding, then you can go to court. so we modified our complaint to include mitch mcconnell's comments to say you're absolutely right and we found law applicable to us going to court and, yes, we will have our day in court. >> now, looking forward the acting chief of the capitol police will speak more about the department's actions on that day of january 6th during hearings on capitol hill next week. until then, how safe is the
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capitol and the members of congress like yourself that serve in the wake of this insurrection? >> well, there's no question, rev, it's altogether different. the security protocols have been enhanced. members of congress are met at the departing airport, as well as the arriving airport. the perimeter around the capitol is several blocks beyond what it normally is. no visitors can come see members of congress. no visitors can come and visit the capitol. the national guard is the secondary security system for us right now. we've been told by a house administrative committee to look at what kind of hardening we can do in our respective offices in our district. so we're on a heightened alert.
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and i compliment those capital policemen, they did an incredible job despite the insurmountable job they did on that day. we have some 145 who have been hurt because of that and three who have lost their lives. i'm expecting my government not to just protect the members of congress but protect this democracy of ours because if in america, if every time we disagree with the decision we attack the instrument of that decision, can you imagine? we would become a tin horn authoritarian dictatorship and that's what we are trying to do in filing this lawsuit to prevent that from occurring and what is and i hope forever will be the greatest democracy in the
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world. >> all right, congressman bennie thompson, thank you for your time. >> coming up, the fight against the pandemic is far from over. why we must rise up to help our communities and each other. but first, my colleague richard lui with the other top stories. >> some of the stories we're watching this hour for you, the latest on that united flight out of denver that made a may day call. it dropped large pieces of what appeared to be engine debris on neighborhoods below after experiencing engine failure. the plane headed to honolulu, turning around for an emergency landing back at denver international. the cause is unknown. no injuries reported. >> president biden left the white house late this afternoon to visit former kansas senator and republican presidential candidate bob dole who is 97 years old, just announcing he was diagnosed with stage four lung cancer. he will begin treatment next
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for today's rise up, i want to talk about covid-19 vaccination efforts and how we can each do our part to protect our community. as the current occupants of the white house are discovering, the trump administration left office with virtually no plans to vaccinate americans against a pandemic that killed over
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400,000 of us in less than a year. so when joe biden's team took over, they started essentially from scratch. and with an ambitious goal, to get 150 million shots into the arms in the first 100 days. so far that goal appears to be in reach. but as so often is the case, some of the most vulnerable among us are being left behind. all over the country black and brown folks who are disproportionately at risk from coronavirus are lagging behind our white counterparts in vaccination rates. there are two major reasons for this disparity. the first is the obvious matter of excess. there are fewer vaccinations sites in black neighborhoods and black and brown folks are disproportionately more likely to live in household without internet access, thus making it harder for us to navigate the
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notoriously frustrating appointment system. the second is an historical distrust for the medical establishment among being black and brown americans due to travesties like the tuskegee experiment. the black and hispanic churches across america are banding together, providing sites, accessible to minority communities. so what can you do to help? first and most importantly sign up and get vaccinated as soon as you're eligible. then spread the word within our own community being vaccinated yourself will allow to you more safely assist others in the process, depending on where you live, that might mean transporting elderly or disabled neighbors to their own vaccine appointments. or even helping them navigate
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the often confusing appointment process. joining me now to discuss even more ways to get involved is the reverend w. franklin richardson, author of identify witness to grace, a testimony of favor." dr. richardson, you also head the conference churches. you are involved in efforts there. there are efforts also like healthy life that i'm involved in, along with you. tell us what churches are doing and what you're hearing as you reach out and have other faith leaders in the black and brown community reach out, what are you hearing from people and what can be done more effectively? >> first of all, the entire faith community, white and blacks, are concerned and available. we've begun to have
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conversations with the -- across the aisle. but directly the conference of national black churches is engaged. many of our churches, fortunately in new york, there is progress not going on in other states, but the conference of national black churches has made a partnership with cdc and we have now put together an initiative that will take vaccines into various parts. we have some 20 states, rural community cvss assisting us, where churches are becoming vaccine centers. churches are the perfect place because when you go to a church, you're going home, that's where we marry, where we take our babies. the problem is that in our
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community there is a sociology that you mentioned earlier that obstructs us taking the vaccines. consequently it serves us negative. we have to separate the tuskegee experiment. this is not an experiment. this is an opportunity to stop this vicious virus from destroying us. >> what i have found working with you and other groups and action network is people don't understand the tuskegee experiment would not give them what they needed. they let them sit there with syphilis. they were holding the vaccine away, not giving them something. while just over 5% of vaccinations in the first month went to black folks' arms, the rate has ticked up slightly. do you have think this church initiative go in the right
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direction? >> without question. there's trusted voices and spaces at the church. and the increase in acceptance is directly related to many pastors and church leaders are sharing with their congregations that they need to take the virus. for instance, i've had both of my shots and i've shared with my congregation, the pastors are sharing that they are taking it, encouraging it. people against us in the community, they don't want us to take a shot. they're not fighting to get african-americans to take a shot. and we also know that the health system is biased against us. we know that by the statistic. the statistics say that no matter what the measure of life is, it's always the lowest where black people are concerned. take any measure you want, obesity, aids, infant mortality, education, economics, all of us. we are always at the bottom. so this issue of the vaccine is merely an insight into the reality of what african-americans are facing in this country.
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>> i have to ask you this because i'm out of time. i've also noticed on your book tour a witness to grace you've been pushing this. does your book also help people encourage going through their trials, including what we're doing with the pandemic? >> without question. the book is intended to try to help us to be positive in the midst of very negative circumstances. it is my own witness to that. it is also my declaring how it has worked in my life. i encourage those listening to read it, i think you'll find it inspirational and instructive and an insight into african-american culture. >> thank you for being with us. when we come back, breaking news this afternoon. we learned that former president donald trump will deliver his first post-presidential speech next week. what will be his message to republicans he believes that are
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not sufficiently loyal to him? be right back. o him? be right back.
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it has only been a week since the end of donald trump's impeachment trial and rather than laying low after somehow escaping conviction for inciting a capitol hill riot and insurrection, the former president is picking new political fights. in breaking news this afternoon, we learned trump will deliver his first post-presidential speech as the headliner for cpac in orlando next weekend. he will no doubt have some choice words for republicans he believes are not sufficiently loyal to him, including senate minority leader mitch mcconnell, who voted to acquit trump but dared to criticize his behavior. but to launch a political comeback, trump must keep himself out of jail.
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manhattan's d.a. has hired former federal prosecutor who brought down john gotti jr. to assist in their probe of trump. and the former president is also under criminal investigation in georgia. joining me now is democratic strategist maya rocky moore cummings and republican strategist rina shaw. rina, ten republicans in the house and seven in the senate voted against trump in the impeachment. all of them have received backlash from their voters. some have been censored by their state parties. illinois representative adam kinzinger says his own family publicly admonished him. do republican elected officials have no choice but to stay loyal to trump to hold on to their seats? >> they certainly have a choice and that loyalty doesn't have to
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remain with the former office holder of the 45th president of the united states. this guy, the former guy, as we now know him, he is a person that is going to make noise for as long as we let him and what we are lucky for now is that we had these patriots stand up in congress and do what was hard, do what was not politically convenient and put country over party. so i admire these individuals. i hope that americans as well as republicans of all stripes will try to see the good in what these people did, that they will see that it was not an easy decision for them and they were looking at the facts and the facts told them that trump was no good for them. what they made the calculation based on was that more republicans would wake up to the reality of who are the former president. we know him to be anti-democracy. he does not care about american democracy. and we can do the right thing as
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republicans, moving forward and saying we want none of this. the problem, though, rev is with the state parties. that's what we're going to hear from trump when he goes to cpac. he's going to say the state parties are with me, they're doing my work, activists want me, not the established republicans. he's going to make a case against the elite and republicans. >> many republicans remain conservative on policy issues. how far should democrats go in reaching across the aisle to these lawmakers? >> i think it's important to realize that the republicans stood by donald trump throughout the entirety of his presidency, when he was passing islamophobic, racist, classist, sexist policies. so the fact that they stand for these anti-human rights values means that, you know, we have one of our major political
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parties in the united states that is seriously compromised in terms of certainly its foundational values and ideology. democrats who seek to align themselves with republicans who actually voted for the big lie to support donald trump and give him another chance to run for office and to actually have a political afterlife need to be very careful. i think that it's important that they don't lend legitimacy to certainly the big lie or to the trump administration's policy agenda. and so i would encourage democrats to look to those few republicans who stood up for the truth, who stood up for our democracy and who are standing for, you know, certainly a future that's trumpless. >> rina, briefly we mentioned the investigations against former president donald trump. could these criminal probes offer republicans yet another opportunity to break with trump
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or will any of them actually do it? >> i think it could. and i think that was what was always really the value proposition was that in private life this president could really be seen for what he has out there, the foreign entanglements, what do those really mean? did he have our best interests in mind? we may learn a lot through these private cases now that he's no longer in office and i think that's what a lot of people count on. does it change the mind of the really die hard republicans that stack these parties, that fancy themselves to be kingmakers and in the past have not been but in the era of trump things have really changed. what we see in the state parties is the whole win at all costs. let's just find a way to win. >> that is a real problem. i'm out of time but, maya, i want to ask you briefly, west virginia senator joe manchin said this week he would oppose biden's pick for finance chief.
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manchin voted to confirm sessions and cavanaugh. are democrats wise to keep someone like manchin in the tent or should they be demanding the same kind of loyalty that republicans do for their caucus? >> you know, senator manchin has always been extremely conservative. i think that he felt like he had to be given the demographics of his state. that being said, there are some democrats that have been, you know, luke warm towards the confirmation. i wouldn't be surprised if manchin didn't feel he had some level. sport on both sides of the aisle with regard to his stance. that being said, it will be interesting to see if the biden administration uses any of its political capital to try to get the votes necessary in order to
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get neera into position. it certainly looks bad. >> stay tuned. we'll be watching the vote as it comes down. thank you both. coming up, a home run this black history month. i'll speak to the first black woman to coach a pro baseball team ever after the break. r the. if you have risk factors like heart disease, diabetes and raised triglycerides,... ...vascepa can give you something to celebrate.
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named kim ing their general manager, the first woman to serve in this control for any of the 30 major league teams. hired bianca smith as a minor league coach, making her the first black woman coach in all professional baseball history. and bianca smith joins me now. thank you for being with me. let me ask you, bianca, what does it mean for you to be the first black woman coach in professional baseball and to break that glass ceiling with this team specifically? >> thank you for having me on. it means a lot. and when i first took this job, it wasn't really a thought to me, but the more i see that it inspires so many people, the more it means to me. that's the important part to me, is that being the first was not
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my goal, but getting to see how many people are inspired by this story is pretty cool. >> now, the besides being the first female manager, are you hoping one day to be a general manager yourself? >> i'm hoping to be a manager. i want to stay on the field as long as i can. >> and why is that, you enjoy managing, you enjoy the work you're doing? >> i love it. i love working with athletes. i love being on the field and helping players develop not just on the field but also off the field. any chance i get to talk baseball or just talk life with players, that's what i love bringing. and yeah, i just want to do it for as long as i can. >> now, the pandemic has turned everything upside down, including professional sports. what is it like to be prepping for the season right now? >> right now my prep for the season, i'm prepping the same way i would prep for a college season.
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i'm actually still coaching up until i head to florida, i'll still be coaching here at carroll university. that's kind of my own prep, i keep doing what i've been doing the last six, seven years. >> do you think your life experiences helps you to help them with not only their game but whatever issues you might talk to them about, about their lives? you said you talk to them about life and about the sport. >> i believe i can certainly help. i admit there might be situations, yeah, i won't be able to help. but i can certainly help them find somebody who can, because that's part it too. i have to know when i don't know something. if i don't, i have to go out and find it or find somebody who can help them. that's my i don't know. but i do believe my life experiences, and i've had a lot, can definitely correlate to issues that might happen off the field and even just playing on
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the field. >> you might not have intended to be the first, but you are, and a lot of people are looking at that. bianca smith, thank you for being with us. up next, my final thoughts. stay with us. oughts stay with us (noise of fridge opening) guy fieri!
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there have been reports this week about the uptick of hate crimes, some violent, against asian-americans. in many ways, many feel because of the former president using all kinds of language like calling the covid-19 "kung flu." but asian-american leaders should not have to stand alone, which is why this morning at national action network, i and other african-american activists stood with state senator john lu of new york and other asian-american leaders denouncing these attacks. and tomorrow we will stand
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together with the family of christian hall, an asian-american killed by police, unarmed, in pennsylvania. you see, in celebrating black history month as we just talked about the first black woman to be a coach in a baseball team, or we look at our first black woman vice president, and we look at barack obama, the fact that we're celebrating firsts only shows not only how happy we are but how long we've had to fight and continue to fight systemic racism. we shouldn't be happy that in 2021, we're still celebrating the first black, the first latinx, the first asian-american. we should have been doing that a long time ago. but if we don't keep fighting and standing together for everyone, we will not continue on this road toward progress.
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you can't fight for yourself if you're not fighting for everyone. so we stand with the victims of hate in the asian-american community because we know what hate feels like. and we don't want to be part of being silent while others face some of what we face, because others were not silent when we faced it ourselves. celebrating black history is celebrating triumph over discrimination. and we must spread that message in all communities as we continue to advance in our own. that does it for me. thanks for watching. i'll see you back here next weekend and tomorrow at 5:00 p.m. eastern. my colleague alicia menendez picks up our news coverage right now. i'm alicia melendez.
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a flight experienced engine failure this morning, the boeing 777 dropping large debris in the neighborhoods of broomfield, colorado. we're told the plane landed safely at denver international airport. at this hour no injuries reported on the ground or among the passengers or crew. now to the deep thaw in the heart of texas, the lonestar state digging itself out of one of the worst winter storms it's seen. with clearer skies comes a clearer picture of how snow was able to trigger such a massive crisis in the state. not only has the storm been deadly, forcing millions to live in the cold, but it's hampered the fight against covid-19, creating a massive backlog in the vaccination process which will have ripples nationwide. first, the cold, hard tth